Child Abuse In Rotherham

[Boomstick]

Oslo

Your suggestion that the police treat Asians more lightly because of some pinko PC fear is, frankly, b*llocks.

The Office for National Statistics has figures on police stop-and-search, arrests and prosecutions.

in 2011/12 (the last year that I have seen numbers for), in South Yorkshire, Asians were about 60% more likely to be stopped and searched than white British. Blacks were 150% more likely to be stopped and searched. It's a similar story all over the country. In the whole of England and Wales, blacks were 5times more likely to be stopped and searched than whites and Asians about 50% more likely. In some places, the figures were extraordinary.

And the police have got tougher on minorities. Between 2007-08 and 2011-12, the number of whites stopped and searched fell by half. The number of blacks went up by 75% and the number of Asians doubled. Similar story with arrests after stop and search. Whites fell by 68%, blacks went up by 30%, Asians went up by 43%.

The whole story about the police going easy on ethnic minorities is demonstrable bullshit. There MAY have been problems in Rotherham. Again, we only have anecdotal evidence in a poorly written report to go on. But to draw from that a conclusion that we live in a country (well you don't, obviously) where the police take it easy on ethnic minorities because they are terrified of lefties calling them names is bullshit. I don't know why you're so keen to peddle that story.

Stop talking rubbish, this issue has nothing to do with stop and search. It's to do with methodical, and predatorial Asian men, who targeted young white girls over many years. They got away scot free because of council workers fright of being labeled racist for confronting the issue.
The issue being a solely Asian problem, how do you tackle it without some lefty bed wetter accusing you of being a racist?

[BillyStubbsTears]

RD

We know that there have been systematic problems within SY Police for decades. They have Hillsborough, Orgreave and plenty of other things that demonstrate the historical incompetence (or worse) in the force. What I am saying is that there is no evidence whatsoever that there has been or still is a systematic policy of going easy on ethnic minorities.

It certainly appears that the SY Police have been appallingly lax in not following up these cases. (Although I refer you to the comments I posted from a child protection copper who knows only too well the difficulties in investigating and charging in such areas - whatever the race of the victim and perpetrator.) The thing is there is no evidence that this is due to racially motivated reasons. People are rushing to throw their own prejudices onto the bonfire. The logic that Oslo is setting out goes like this.
1) Police handled things very, very badly
2) Asians were involved
3) Conclusion: The Police are going easy on Asians and this must have come from an order from the top because of political correctness.

Interestingly (and again, not reported by the media) the Jay report noted that the SY Police's handling of child sexual exploitation had improved markedly in the last few years. Whilst Wright has been Commissioner.

[River Don]

Boomstick

Saying it's an Asian problem isn't being fair to Hindu, Sikh and Buddhist members of the Asian community.

[Iberian Red]

I didn't know Jimmy Saville, Stuart Hall, Max Clifford etc were Asian.

[River Don]

I didn't know Jimmy Saville, Stuart Hall, Max Clifford etc were Asian.

Or the last mayor of Rotherham for that matter.

It's missing the point though, no one is suggesting there aren't sex abusers in other sectors of society.

[Iberian Red]

I didn't know Jimmy Saville, Stuart Hall, Max Clifford etc were Asian.

Or the last mayor

It's missing the point though, no one is suggesting there aren't sex abusers in other sectors of society.

Wrong. Boomstick is.

[BillyStubbsTears]

Boomstick

We were talking specifically about whether the police had systematically and deliberately turned a blind eye to crimes by Asians. The evidence is that they don't

I gave Stop and Search figures, because they are the ones that immediately give an impression of who the police are targeting.

If you want data on sexual crime figures, those are easy enough to find. In fact, so easy, that anyone who wants to contribute to this discussion should go and familiarise themselves with the numbers before regaling us all with their opinions.

In 2011, the percentage of people in the UK who were from a Asian (not including Chinese) ethnic group was about 6%. In the period 2007-2012, the same Asian group consistently made up 8-9% of the total number of arrests in the UK for sexual offences. (ONS figures:
https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/257054/suspects-table.xls Sheet 3.09).

Now, that may well suggest that the Asian community has a bigger than average problem with sexual deviancy. That wouldn't surprise me - it comes with the territory with repressed sexual behaviour. But it certainly gives the lie to the claim that the police are turning a blind eye to this sort of criminality by Asians. The police regularly arrest 3-3,500 Asians every year from sexual offences.

The problem with SY Police appears to be a cack-handed attitude to the girls themselves. An attitude that the girls were troublemakers or thrill seekers who were bringing it upon themselves. I'll state once again. There is no evidence whatsoever of a systematic approach by SY Police that turned a blind eye to this criminality BECAUSE the perpetrators were Asian. If you have any, show it to me.

[Boomstick]

Boomstick

Saying it's an Asian problem isn't being fair to Hindu, Sikh and Buddhist members of the Asian community.

Boomstick

Saying it's an Asian problem isn't being fair to Hindu, Sikh and Buddhist members of the Asian community.

Oh come off it, it's a Pakistani Muslim problem,
Is that better?
Jesus wept

[Boomstick]

I didn't know Jimmy Saville, Stuart Hall, Max Clifford etc were Asian.

Or the last mayor

It's missing the point though, no one is suggesting there aren't sex abusers in other sectors of society.

Wrong. Boomstick is.

No I'm not, it's just in this circumstance it was Pakistani Muslims, and no one wanted to investigate them fully, for fear if being labeled a racist by the left wing establishment,
Your twisting my words for your own political addenda, because your backs to the wall and you don't have a real argument.

[Boomstick]

Boomstick

We were talking specifically about whether the police had systematically and deliberately turned a blind eye to crimes by Asians. The evidence is that they don't

I gave Stop and Search figures, because they are the ones that immediately give an impression of who the police are targeting.

If you want data on sexual crime figures, those are easy enough to find. In fact, so easy, that anyone who wants to contribute to this discussion should go and familiarise themselves with the numbers before regaling us all with their opinions.

In 2011, the percentage of people in the UK who were from a Asian (not including Chinese) ethnic group was about 6%. In the period 2007-2012, the same Asian group consistently made up 8-9% of the total number of arrests in the UK for sexual offences. (ONS figures:
https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/257054/suspects-table.xls Sheet 3.09).

Now, that may well suggest that the Asian community has a bigger than average problem with sexual deviancy. That wouldn't surprise me - it comes with the territory with repressed sexual behaviour. But it certainly gives the lie to the claim that the police are turning a blind eye to this sort of criminality by Asians. The police regularly arrest 3-3,500 Asians every year from sexual offences.

The problem with SY Police appears to be a cack-handed attitude to the girls themselves. An attitude that the girls were troublemakers or thrill seekers who were bringing it upon themselves. I'll state once again. There is no evidence whatsoever of a systematic approach by SY Police that turned a blind eye to this criminality BECAUSE the perpetrators were Asian. If you have any, show it to me.

So do you admit that the Asian community commit a greater proportion of sexual crimes?

And are you suggesting that that's ok be caused they are sexually repressed , and they can rape as many white girls as they want.

Do you admit that 9% figure could be larger if the police/councils weren't afraid to prosecute them for being labelled racist by the left wing establishment?

[BillyStubbsTears]

Boomstick

I don;t know whether Asian people commit a a greater proportion of sexual crimes. I don;t know what the numbers are. Tell you what, instead of ME being the one who always goes and looks for evidence, why don't YOU have a look round instead?

I said that it wouldn't surprise me. I think their approach to repressing sexual behaviour is reprehensible and counter-productive. Just like it has been in the Catholic Church. It is likely to breed sexual deviancy.

I am NOT saying that it is "OK" for them to rape as many white girls as they want. It is utterly repellent and obscene behaviour and I do not condone that sort of criminality by ANYONE. It is a disgusting thing to suggest that I might. It is deeply indicative of your mindset that you can even begin to believe that people with a different take to you have that sort of belief. And I'll tell you now, if you accused me to my face of believing that, I would f***ing belt you.

I repeat. Once again. There is no evidence whatsoever, none at all, that Police systematically turn a blind eye to sexual crimes or child exploitation by Asians, BECAUSE they are Asians. There is no evidence whatsoever that police are failing to prosecute Asians for fear of being labelled racist by the Asian community (not sure why you mention councils - they don't prosecute anyone, and my original comments were addressed to Oslo who was specifically talking about the Police approach).

I'll repeat again, if you have evidence to the contrary, tell us what it is.

[IC1967]

BST you are talking a load of b*llocks and are skirting around the main issues in this case to deflect attention away from the FACT that the leftie Labour council put political correctness i.e. the protection of Pakistani Muslim paedophiles above the well being of young children. They put the Muslim vote above concern for children. They were more bothered about so called 'community cohesion' than young children being sexually abused. There has been more than enough evidence in the media over the past few days for anyone that isn't an unreconstructed leftie that will defend his leftie mates now matter how heinous the crime perpetrated to come to the same view as me.

The police have been utterly pathetic in the way they have handled these cases as well. The evidence that they have been piss poor is easy to see. Ask yourself how many prosecutions have been brought when the crimes that were committed were on an industrial scale. Nowhere near enough. It is totally obvious that they have been found seriously lacking.

Take it from me as there aren't many on this forum that will tell it to you straight, you are making yourself look like a complete and utter idiot (and that is saying it politely) defending the indefensible.

Make an abject apology immediately and stop trying to defend your leftie friends. Admit that these horrific cases have come about because of the left wing politically correct ideology prevalent at Rotherham council. If you do this with good grace you may salvage a small part of your totally trashed reputation.

[River Don]

Boomstick

Saying it's an Asian problem isn't being fair to Hindu, Sikh and Buddhist members of the Asian community.

Boomstick

Saying it's an Asian problem isn't being fair to Hindu, Sikh and Buddhist members of the Asian community.

Oh come off it, it's a Pakistani Muslim problem,
Is that better?
Jesus wept

Yes, it's better.

I make the distinction because there appears to be this significant minority of young Muslim men who hold non Muslims and women in utter disdain.

I see an echo of this in the way IS/ISIS/ISIL have enslaved the women of minority groups in Northern Iraq to be sex slaves. It's the same outlook that they are subhuman trash.

[Boomstick]

Boomstick

Saying it's an Asian problem isn't being fair to Hindu, Sikh and Buddhist members of the Asian community.

Boomstick

Saying it's an Asian problem isn't being fair to Hindu, Sikh and Buddhist members of the Asian community.

Oh come off it, it's a Pakistani Muslim problem,
Is that better?
Jesus wept

Yes, it's better.

I make the distinction because there appears to be this significant minority of young Muslim men who hold non Muslims and women in utter disdain.

I see an echo of this in the way IS/ISIS/ISIL have enslaved the women of minority groups in Northern Iraq to be sex slaves. It's the same outlook that they are subhuman trash.

Fair enough RD

[IC1967]

I repeat. Once again. There is no evidence whatsoever, none at all, that Police systematically turn a blind eye to sexual crimes or child exploitation by Asians, BECAUSE they are Asians. There is no evidence whatsoever that police are failing to prosecute Asians for fear of being labelled racist by the Asian community (not sure why you mention councils - they don't prosecute anyone, and my original comments were addressed to Oslo who was specifically talking about the Police approach).

I'll repeat again, if you have evidence to the contrary, tell us what it is.

The number of successful prosecutions by South Yorkshire police has been pitifully low. For example in 2012 there were none. In Lancashire there were 100. Is that good enough for you? it is obvious to anyone with half a brain that part of the reason South Yorkshire police is so pathetic is because they are afraid of upsetting the Muslims. When the vast majority of perpetrators of this crime are Pakistanis it doesn't take a genius to work out that the police are letting them get away with it.

No way would they let white men get away with the same crime if they were doing it to young Asian children. The logic of your argument is that they would. Again, anyone with half a brain knows this would not be the case.

So if you still think that the police are not afraid to go after Pakistanis then you need to explain why the prosecution level is so disgracefully low. I've explained it. Now you need to explain where I'm going wrong.

For the record I do not believe all police forces are scared of going after Asians because of fear of being racist. I've done my research and have incontrovertible evidence that this is the case. I definitely believe the South Yorkshire force is though.

[coventryrover]

I cant believe the usuals are making political capital of this situation.   This is a vile scenario where a certain percentage of a minority group do not give a f''k about women (whether white, black, brown etc).  I hope justice is served.  There should be hell to pay if it isn't

[IC1967]

I can't believe someone is quite happy to ignore the political element to all this. It's very simple. If the left wing politically correct Labour council wasn't so ideologically driven then this abuse would have been far less and would have been tackled more appropriately. 

I'm a believer in sorting out the root cause of the problem instead of just treating the symptoms. The root cause is the Labour council.

[coventryrover]

Mick.

You are unbelievably predictable and always turn things to a political slant.  Inept is inept, whether right or left wing

[IC1967]

I think you'll find that political correctness is a problem that finds it's roots in leftie ideology. You need to educate yourself in the subject matter before spouting off. May I suggest you read the excellent blog by Dan Hannan. It's in a link I've posted earlier in the thread. This will help you fill in the huge gaps in your knowledge.

[IC1967]

Some good may have come out of the sex scandal in Rotherham. It would appear that stories like this have convinced the vast majority of the population that multiculturalism has not worked. Politicians take note (especially leftie socialists).

http://www.breitbart.com/Breitbart-London/2014/08/31/95-percent-of-BBC-viewers-think-multiculturalism-has-failed

[The Red Baron]

Some good may have come out of the sex scandal in Rotherham. It would appear that stories like this have convinced the vast majority of the population that multiculturalism has not worked. Politicians take note (especially leftie socialists).

http://www.breitbart.com/Breitbart-London/2014/08/31/95-percent-of-BBC-viewers-think-multiculturalism-has-failed

I don't know whether it is the Rotherham scandal that is driving those views or the question of British-born Jihadists. The latter is probably the greater indictment of the failure of multiculturalism. I have to say it is a policy I always believed was doomed to failure.

When I was training to be a teacher back in the late 80s, multiculturalism was regarded as an almost quasi-religion. To question the orthodoxy was to be branded a racist. At the time I believed it would create ghettoes. Only very recently has that orthodoxy been questioned and by now the damage has been done.

[BillyStubbsTears]

TRB

To put the whole issue of British born Jihadis down the multiculturalism is stretching a point a bit. For what it's worth, I strongly disagree with the more fundamentalist aspects of multiculturalism and I do think it fosters separateness.

But that is only one part of the equation. Poor aspirations and achievement is another.

But none of these would turn people into terrorists if there wasn't a crusade (sic) for them to be drawn to. The appeal of radicalisation is based in the fact that people can plausibly make a case that the West has f***ed about with the Middle East ever since oil was found there and the Jews decided that they were having Palestine. We have put people through traumas for generations. We've tacitly accepted Israel's racism against the Palestinians. We've supported brutal dictators when it suited us. We've overthrown Governments and installed puppets when it suited us. And f*** me, we ARMED the fundamentalist Jihadis when they were fighting against Russia.

Yes, lack of integration at home doesn't help. But that would not turn hundreds of people into terrorists without the last 80 years of history in the Middle East that we Westerners are responsible for. And integration would not prevent all the angry fringe from turning to violence.

[IC1967]

Anyone that watched Panorama tonight can be left in no doubt that the scandal took place due to political correctness gone mad. Nothing was done because of fear of causing upset in the Asian community.

[The Red Baron]

BST

I think you have a point in regard to the UK's special relationship with the USA. The uncritical support given to Dubya by Blair being a glaring, but by no means unique, example. It might make Muslims think that the UK was on the side of their opponents rather than theirs.

However, other European countries don't seem to have the same problems with home-grown Jihadists that we do, and I am bound to conclude that our "liberal" attitude to multicultutalism is to blame. It has fostered and encourged isolation among ethnic minority communities and has allowed the growth of radical Islam, unchallenged by the authorities (until now, when it is far too late.)

[BillyStubbsTears]

TRB

France
http://m.france24.com/en/20130919-france-130-citizens-residents-fighting-syria-valls-assad/

Germany
http://www.haaretz.com/mobile/1.576543

Spain
http://m.us.wsj.com/articles/eight-suspected-jihadists-arrested-by-spanish-police-1402903932?mobile=y

Belgium
http://www.channel4.com/news/little-belgium-is-europes-largest-exporter-of-jihadis

Netherlands
http://www.gatestoneinstitute.org/4308/dutch-jihadists-syria

Italy
http://m.thelocal.com/20140825/50-italians-join-isis-in-iraq-and-syria

You can find plenty more information about Denmark, Austria, Sweden etc, etc but I think I've made my point.

[IC1967]

The chief exec is to stand down. About time. At last the penny has dropped. No doubt he'll be getting a big fat payoff and will still get his exorbitant final salary pension. A lot more heads need to roll and we need some of them putting behind bars.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-29109918

[IC1967]

Looks like the useless politically correct Labour councillors are finally getting their comeuppance. What an absolute disgrace the lot of them are. Let's hope some of them get jailed.

Let's also hope the electorate finally stop voting for any useless idiot just because they are from the Labour Party. Let's hope UKIP wipe them out at the next election.