Viking Supporters Co-operative
Viking Chat => Off Topic => Topic started by: bpoolrover on August 08, 2018, 01:57:56 pm
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After his comments about the burka should he say sorry?
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Of course not, he’s mocking a ridiculous, inappropriate outfit. The comments were taken out of context, he was asked whether he thought the garment should be banned and he said it should not. Perhaps he should not have added the letterbox remarks though.
One could very well object to the wearing of a burka however on the grounds of personal health and safety, not to mention the visual restrictions it imposes on anyone driving a motor vehicle!
How many of these burka wearing women do so by compulsion or by personal choice, I might ask?
Boris Johnson attracts plenty of ridicule anyway and always seems to brush it off, he’s just got himself noticed once again.
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It should be banned like they did in France
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"We think that it's disgusting that women are told by their men that they have to wear what they're told to, so we're going to stop that by us telling them what to wear instead."
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No, I think he is a fírst rate prick, but in this instance, he's right and entitled to his opinion, the pc brigade will no doubt play the race card
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"We think that it's disgusting that women are told by their men that they have to wear what they're told to, so we're going to stop that by us telling them what to wear instead."
If that’s what it takes, to bring em out of the Dark ages, female Genital mutilation et al it’s got to be a good thing.
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Anyone who thinks Johnson gives a f**k about burkas or the rights of women has never really stopped and thought about him.
He cares about one thing.
Boris Johnson.
He will say anything and do anything that he thinks will further his career.
This is a very serious, sensitive and important issue. For what it’s worth, I think the subjugation of women by a patriarchal attitude in Islam is disgraceful and unacceptable. Just like similar attitudes in the Irish Catholic community that I come from we’re in previous generations.
But Johnson is not interested in engaging in that serious discussion. Instead he makes childish jokes and wisecracks. Because he knows there is a section of society that will lap it up.
The man is a f**king disgrace to the country. He’s happy to use dog-whistle racism to further his own ambition. And the fact that May is unable to smack him down speaks volumes on how useless she is.
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"If there is one thing worse than being talked about it is not being talked about."
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Farage has resurfaced on the back of this backing Boris for Pm, playing to the crowd again. Scary times
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Of course Farage will lap this up. Those two are working a tag team operation.
And watch what Farage is doing. It’s very clever.
He’s now saying that critics of Johnson are wanting to shut down debate on the burka.
Which is not the case at all. Critics of Johnson are criticising the fact that he takes a very important and sensitive subject and makes crass, childish jokes about it which are designed, deliberately to whip up anger.
It’s classic rabble-rousing tactics. It relies on the fact that people won’t keep their eye on the ball and will be cleverly guided into the place that Johnson and Farage want them to be.
The two of them are a pair of immoral, evil bas**rds, playing with fire for their own political ends.
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BST, whilst I agree that "the subjugation of women by a patriarchal attitude in Islam is disgraceful and unacceptable", you also have to accept that a lot of women actually choose to wear such of their own free will.
This has to be respected, or we become as bad as those who would force women to wear them.
However, I fully agree with your view as to why BJ said what he did, and TM has gone down a further notch in my estimation for not taking him to task on it. A rudderless party taking this country to the brink on so many fronts!
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I've not read the article but has this letterbox thing been extracted in isolation from a tongue in cheek article? For what it's worth I think that Boris is a very "clever" buffoon
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The thing is he's again just saying what many others think and say.
I don't like them, I don't like the sight of them and believe they shouldn't be allowed.
However, be a bit more sensitive and grown up in that role Boris.
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NNK
I agree about Muslim women “choosing” to wear the burka.
People buy into social conformity. Because that gets you acceptance in your peer group.
Two generations ago in Denaby it was expected that the women would stay at home and look after the kids and put a meal in the table and not complain when the husband went off to the Club after tea. And the women bought into that. To the extent that ones who jibbed against it were gossiped about and ostracised.
That culture changed. Slowly. By more progressive attitudes slowly changing the accepted norms. Not by Kitsons from Eton making wisecracks about it.
If people REALLY want Muslim women to be freed up, they would engage with and support progressives in the Muslim community. Not snigger about letter-box faces.
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BFYP
Asking Johnson to be sensitive and grown up is equivalent to asking an egotistical t**t to stop being an egotistical t**t.
It’s pointless. And, even worse, it entirely misses the point.
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I too don't like them, but then, nor do I like hoodies for the way they are used as a disguise by yoofs up to no good. I expect it would meet with resistance if anybody suggested hoodies should be banned because folk like me don't like them.
There is a good case to be made though for banning the burka in court and other situations where the face needs to be seen.
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I too don't like them, but then, nor do I like hoodies for the way they are used as a disguise by yoofs up to no good. I expect it would meet with resistance if anybody suggested hoodies should be banned because folk like me don't like them.
There is a good case to be made though for banning the burka in court and other situations where the face needs to be seen.
..........and airport officials when they go through passport control unchecked.
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I too don't like them, but then, nor do I like hoodies for the way they are used as a disguise by yoofs up to no good. I expect it would meet with resistance if anybody suggested hoodies should be banned because folk like me don't like them.
There is a good case to be made though for banning the burka in court and other situations where the face needs to be seen.
..........and airport officials when they go through passport control unchecked.
#fakenews
https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/guidance-on-how-to-treat-women-wearing-clothing-that-covers-their-face
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I too don't like them, but then, nor do I like hoodies for the way they are used as a disguise by yoofs up to no good. I expect it would meet with resistance if anybody suggested hoodies should be banned because folk like me don't like them.
There is a good case to be made though for banning the burka in court and other situations where the face needs to be seen.
..........and airport officials when they go through passport control unchecked.
#fakenews
https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/guidance-on-how-to-treat-women-wearing-clothing-that-covers-their-face
#realnews
Wilts, I have seen them go through unchecked.
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In answer to OP yes
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"We think that it's disgusting that women are told by their men that they have to wear what they're told to, so we're going to stop that by us telling them what to wear instead."
What are we telling them to wear?
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I too don't like them, but then, nor do I like hoodies for the way they are used as a disguise by yoofs up to no good. I expect it would meet with resistance if anybody suggested hoodies should be banned because folk like me don't like them.
There is a good case to be made though for banning the burka in court and other situations where the face needs to be seen.
..........and airport officials when they go through passport control unchecked.
#fakenews
https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/guidance-on-how-to-treat-women-wearing-clothing-that-covers-their-face
#realnews
Wilts, I have seen them go through unchecked.
I can't say you are wrong hound because I wasn't there. All I can do is point you to the official government regulations that says everyone has to be checked, if not at the barriers then with a female member of staff in a private room away from the public. Thems the rules, everyone has to be checked.
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"We think that it's disgusting that women are told by their men that they have to wear what they're told to, so we're going to stop that by us telling them what to wear instead."
What are we telling them to wear?
Something else.
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Yes he should apologise for his words..
Having a debate about how certain cultures behave or dress is one thing, and is perfectly ok in our society..
However imposing cultural change on demand is a different matter..
It isn’t Boris’ opinions he needs to apologise for, more how he expressed them.. using terms like bank robbers and mail boxes is more likely to drive opinions further apart and help promote extremism on any side of such debate..
Stupid t**t.!
If I had a work colleague who wore those clothes and I made the same comments in the office I could be disciplined and possibly even sacked..
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It's one thing to tell jokes like that down the pub, it's quite another when you're arguably the most influential politician in the country who's angling for the PM's job, and are writing in a national paper. Of course he should apologise. He won't as long as he thinks staying silent gets him closer to number 10 though.
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No, I think he is a fírst rate prick, but in this instance, he's right and entitled to his opinion, the pc brigade will no doubt play the race card
Agree with the fist part of your post but this has nothing to do with race , differing opinions within parts of a serious following yes but definitely not race.
You made the same mistake - you've somehow lumped them altogether !
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Anyone who thinks Johnson gives a f**k about burkas or the rights of women has never really stopped and thought about him.
He cares about one thing.
Boris Johnson.
He will say anything and do anything that he thinks will further his career.
This is a very serious, sensitive and important issue. For what it’s worth, I think the subjugation of women by a patriarchal attitude in Islam is disgraceful and unacceptable. Just like similar attitudes in the Irish Catholic community that I come from we’re in previous generations.
But Johnson is not interested in engaging in that serious discussion. Instead he makes childish jokes and wisecracks. Because he knows there is a section of society that will lap it up.
The man is a f**king disgrace to the country. He’s happy to use dog-whistle racism to further his own ambition. And the fact that May is unable to smack him down speaks volumes on how useless she is.
You're spot on about BJ only caring about one thing, BST.
I saw him at close quarters a few years ago when the company I was working for hired him as a speaker at a new product launch. He turned up with no time to spare, said 'what do you want me to talk about' and then delivered a superb, highly relevant twenty minute talk. Irrespective of your political preferences, you couldn't help but be impressed and amused.
Now, in this little ramble of his he made an apparently clumsy off the cuff remark that was widely quoted in the next day's papers. Talking to a colleague who sat next to BJ, he told me that this spur-of-the-moment comment had been the only thing BJ had written in front of him when he stood to speak. He'd obviously turned up intent on crowbarring this little gem into his talk come hell or highwater. He knew damn well it'd ruffle feathers yet made it look like a clumsy faux pas. The buffoon act is just that; an act. I was assured by someone who had been involved in a property purchase with BJ that he was an absolute b***** of the highest order who had behaved abominably throughout the whole process.
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Facing an internal inquiry apparently.
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''Now, in this little ramble of his he made an apparently clumsy off the cuff remark that was widely quoted in the next day's papers. Talking to a colleague who sat next to BJ, he told me that this spur-of-the-moment comment had been the only thing BJ had written in front of him when he stood to speak.''
Except Bollinger, it wasn't an off the cuff remark in a little ramble it was a column in the Telegraph,
''Mr Johnson has rejected calls to apologise for his remarks, in a Daily Telegraph column in which he also argued against a ban on full-face veils.''
https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-politics-45130532
The guy is a complete dick and should be made to remain in the conservative party to assist in Mays downfall, following a full and frank apology to all muslims that is.
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No, I think he is a fírst rate prick, but in this instance, he's right and entitled to his opinion, the pc brigade will no doubt play the race card
Agree with the fist part of your post but this has nothing to do with race , differing opinions within parts of a serious following yes but definitely not race.
You made the same mistake - you've somehow lumped them altogether !
Read my post, I never said it had anything to do with race, I commented on how the pc brigade would spin it
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Who are the PC brigade Filo and how have they spun it?
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Bollinger.
Fascinating story. I’ve never had the misfortune of meeting him but your story is precisely what I’d expect. Everything he does is calculated.
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''Now, in this little ramble of his he made an apparently clumsy off the cuff remark that was widely quoted in the next day's papers. Talking to a colleague who sat next to BJ, he told me that this spur-of-the-moment comment had been the only thing BJ had written in front of him when he stood to speak.''
Except Bollinger, it wasn't an off the cuff remark in a little ramble it was a column in the Telegraph,
''Mr Johnson has rejected calls to apologise for his remarks, in a Daily Telegraph column in which he also argued against a ban on full-face veils.''
https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-politics-45130532
The guy is a complete dick and should be made to remain in the conservative party to assist in Mays downfall, following a full and frank apology to all muslims that is.
why should he say sorry to all muslims? There are many muslims that think the burka should not be worn
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Bpool
Once again. Because he’s NOT engaging in a sensible grown-up debate about the burka. He’s deliberately making fun of it and turning it into a joke.
There’s a debate to be had here. That Kitson is not having it. He’s publicising Boris Inc. to people who think it’s clever to make smart-arse jokes about this.
That’s why he SHOULD apologise. But of course there’s more chance of Trump being honest and faithful to his wife that there is of Boris apologising.
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https://www.thejc.com/news/uk-news/emily-thornberry-said-she-would-not-want-her-elderly-mum-looked-after-by-someone-wearing-a-burka-1.468119 Should she say sorry? Is there's any difference to a woman wearing a burka and looking after your child than someone who does not? What boris has said is nothing more than most people have said, saying that I think he was stupid writing it in the paper
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My question about saying sorry to all Muslim stands as millions of muslims will not be offended by what he said
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Who are the PC brigade Filo and how have they spun it?
I can't speak for Filo, but I use the term informally to categorise certain people who patronise to the point of being condescending. You know the sort, the holier than thou, namby-pamby, do-gooders who bore everybody shitless.
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''Now, in this little ramble of his he made an apparently clumsy off the cuff remark that was widely quoted in the next day's papers. Talking to a colleague who sat next to BJ, he told me that this spur-of-the-moment comment had been the only thing BJ had written in front of him when he stood to speak.''
Except Bollinger, it wasn't an off the cuff remark in a little ramble it was a column in the Telegraph,
''Mr Johnson has rejected calls to apologise for his remarks, in a Daily Telegraph column in which he also argued against a ban on full-face veils.''
https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-politics-45130532
The guy is a complete dick and should be made to remain in the conservative party to assist in Mays downfall, following a full and frank apology to all muslims that is.
That's the point I was making SR. Nothing he does is 'off the cuff'. He knew exactly what he was doing that day I saw him, in the same way he knew what he was doing when he wrote in the Telegraph.
I'm neither defending him nor attacking him, just pointing out that on the one occasion I ever got close to the bloke i saw enough premeditation to see him in a different light.
As an aside, I'd also have expected for his big fat fee for 20 minutes work he might have actually read the brief and written something beforehand instead of turning up with a blank sheet of paper with a one-liner on it. We could have had Sandi Toksvig...
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I wonder if Johnson and Farage are thinking about setting up a new political party and this is what is behind the Telegraph article? I can't see this furore makes Johnson more likely to be the next Conservative leader. If anything it will harden the opposition to him within the Parliamentary party - and remember he has to get through them in order to go before the membership.
If Johnson was going to become leader it was surely when Cameron stepped down. However there was a "stop Boris" campaign and he withdrew rather than suffer the humiliation of being rejected by MPs.
However, I now think it unlikely the Conservative Party will survive in its present form. Might Johnson and Farage be looking to form a new party on the Right, attracting UKIP supporters and disillusioned Tories? I wonder...
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A new party like that would be worth voting for because all the alternatives at the moment are shit.
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Who are the PC brigade Filo and how have they spun it?
You know the type, do gooders, and I said no doubt, not they have
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A new party like that would be worth voting for because all the alternatives at the moment are shit.
I must admit, I thought if a new party was to emerge it would be in the centre, with both "main" parties having moved left and right respectively. And it is still a possibility.
I guess whatever the end game of Brexit is there are going to be a lot of unhappy people around and the established political parties may well be a target of their ire.
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https://www.thejc.com/news/uk-news/emily-thornberry-said-she-would-not-want-her-elderly-mum-looked-after-by-someone-wearing-a-burka-1.468119 Should she say sorry? Is there's any difference to a woman wearing a burka and looking after your child than someone who does not? What boris has said is nothing more than most people have said, saying that I think he was stupid writing it in the paper
Most people.??
Count me out..
As I said earlier, debating the issue is one thing. Using silly language is divisive and ill advised and does nothing to help progress a genuine debate.
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I quite agree idm
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I still think Johnson is a Dick in a suit and a waste of space in parliament. He is also a gutless t*at and I certainly wouldnt want his representation where I lived because when you most need him he runs away. He has also wasted millions of public money without an apology for that either.
Love the idea of a channel bridge dont you?.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-5886271/Boris-Johnson-slammed-sides-skipping-Heathrow-vote-flying-Afghanistan.html
https://www.newstatesman.com/politics/2014/09/boris-johnson-owes-londoners-apology-wasting-public-money-over-airport-folly
https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2017/aug/22/boris-johnson-940-million-system-to-blame
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2018/jan/19/boris-johnson-slams-uks-infrastructure-record-then-proposes-channel-bridge
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There are many politicians who have wasted public money, it’s not really about him saying sorry for everything he has done, as I posted above the labour mp has said that she wouldn’t have a women in a burka looking after her child, should she say sorry 2? Is she less of a good parent because of what she wears that must be very offensive to all Muslims no?
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There are many politicians who have wasted public money, it’s not really about him saying sorry for everything he has done, as I posted above the labour mp has said that she wouldn’t have a women in a burka looking after her child, should she say sorry 2? Is she less of a good parent because of what she wears that must be very offensive to all Muslims no?
This does not make the case any less so for Boris he totally incompetent too.
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No I agree, but surely if you going to call for 1 to say sorry to all Muslims you should call for the other to do the same?
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No I agree, but surely if you going to call for 1 to say sorry to all Muslims you should call for the other to do the same?
Why not?
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There are many politicians who have wasted public money, it’s not really about him saying sorry for everything he has done, as I posted above the labour mp has said that she wouldn’t have a women in a burka looking after her child, should she say sorry 2? Is she less of a good parent because of what she wears that must be very offensive to all Muslims no?
I can see I’m going to be accused of being a condescending t**t again here but you’re consistently missing the point Bpool.
One is giving an opinion in an important debate. The other is making stupid, childish wisecracks.
Is it SO hard to see the difference?
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I’m not missing the point bst as I agree he should not have said it, it was very childish and was obviously going to cause outrage, what the labour mp said was she would not let or want a woman in a burka look after her child or mother,that is not debating that is stating that she has a issue! It’s the words that come out of your mouth that are a issue not if your debating it, sorry if I sound condescending but I think your missing the point if the roles were reversed and you were not such a labour man you may see that
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Who are the PC brigade Filo and how have they spun it?
You know the type, do gooders,
What? The people who want to do some good in the world?
Make it a better place for us all to live in?
People who want to to silence the hate speech?
Show compassion and emathy for their fellow man?
Have concern for the environment and what the human race is doing to destroy it?
I know which team I would rather be on!
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I’m not missing the point bst as I agree he should not have said it, it was very childish and was obviously going to cause outrage, what the labour mp said was she would not let or want a woman in a burka look after her child or mother,that is not debating that is stating that she has a issue! It’s the words that come out of your mouth that are a issue not if your debating it, sorry if I sound condescending but I think your missing the point if the roles were reversed and you were not such a labour man you may see that
Stating she has an issue with it is not the same thing as making a derogatory joke about it. So yes, you are missing the point.
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Who are the PC brigade Filo and how have they spun it?
I can't speak for Filo, but I use the term informally to categorise certain people who patronise to the point of being condescending. You know the sort, the holier than thou, namby-pamby, do-gooders who bore everybody shitless.
Damn I had all 4 of you on my list too - beaten to the punch again. Still I'm far happier being in my tag team .
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My daughter is a primary school teacher. She says that it is important for young children to see all of a persons face so they can see a smile and facial expressions. Only seeing someone's eyes doesn't let them know just by looking a person's mood or disposition.
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No I agree, but surely if you going to call for 1 to say sorry to all Muslims you should call for the other to do the same?
Did she say they look like letterboxes and bank robbers?
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If you want to take the comments that seriously how can a letterbox rob a f**king bank?
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Boris has done what he always does, calculated that the number of ignorant, stupid and racially prejudiced who will like what he says and give him their support exceeds the number of those who can see what a gratuitous knob he is.
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Boris has done what he always does, calculated that the number of ignorant, stupid and racially prejudiced who will like what he says and give him their support exceeds the number of those who can see what a gratuitous knob he is.
And thus, as predicted, the race card is played
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Who are the PC brigade Filo and how have they spun it?
You know the type, do gooders,
What? The people who want to do some good in the world?
Make it a better place for us all to live in?
People who want to to silence the hate speech?
Show compassion and emathy for their fellow man?
Have concern for the environment and what the human race is doing to destroy it?
I know which team I would rather be on!
AKA interfering busybodies who want to control what normal people think, do and say.
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Boris has done what he always does, calculated that the number of ignorant, stupid and racially prejudiced who will like what he says and give him their support exceeds the number of those who can see what a gratuitous knob he is.
And thus, as predicted, the race card is played
Yeah, Boris Isn't a racist! He just talks like one.
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Boris has done what he always does, calculated that the number of ignorant, stupid and racially prejudiced who will like what he says and give him their support exceeds the number of those who can see what a gratuitous knob he is.
And thus, as predicted, the race card is played
Yeah, Boris Isn't a racist! He just talks like one.
Did I mention Boris?
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Boris has done what he always does, calculated that the number of ignorant, stupid and racially prejudiced who will like what he says and give him their support exceeds the number of those who can see what a gratuitous knob he is.
And thus, as predicted, the race card is played
Yeah, Boris Isn't a racist! He just talks like one.
Did I mention Boris?
You replied to a quote that did. In a thread all about him.
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Boris has done what he always does, calculated that the number of ignorant, stupid and racially prejudiced who will like what he says and give him their support exceeds the number of those who can see what a gratuitous knob he is.
And thus, as predicted, the race card is played
Yeah, Boris Isn't a racist! He just talks like one.
Did I mention Boris?
You replied to a quote that did. In a thread all about him.
I replied to the title of the thread, I never once said wether I thought he was a racist or not, you need to read the posts properly, not read what you would like the post to say
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Politically correct.
Or, as we used to say, not being an obnoxious Kitson.
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Can't take anyone seriously who uses the term "PC brigade" to complain about people not liking bigoted nonsense being spouted.
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If you want to take the comments that seriously how can a letterbox rob a f**king bank?
As New Model Army sang in the 80s,"Don't ask anymore stupid questions...."
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Politically correct.
Or, as we used to say, not being an obnoxious Kitson.
Who's 'we'? The PC brigade? The trouble with you lot is your PCness only applies to those f**king disgraceful evil bas**rd kitsons who don't share your political views.
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Thing is BB.
In the days before what you call “PC” and what I call “not being an obnoxious Kitson”, we had:
Prime time family comedy programmes where the audience howled with laughter at black people being called “nig-nog”, “sambo”, “nigger”, “chocolate drop”, “darkie” etc.
Football fans making monkey chants and chucking bananas at players who represented England, and chanting “there ain’t no black in the Union Jack.”
Fascist organisations calling for forceable repatriation and being supported by leading politicians.
Stop and have a think.
Do you reckon none of that happens today because those people looked into their souls and decided it wasn’t right?
Or do you think it stopped because what you call the “PC brigade” forcefully pointed out that that behaviour was what obnoxious Kitsons do, and slowly made it unacceptable for people to act like that?
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Now make your mind up BST. One minute you're suggesting PC is a figment of the imagination of the non PC 'racists' that doesn't exist, the next you're explaining what it means!
Of course those topics of the 70's and 80's can now be looked upon as outrageous, and their disappearence can be applauded, but that wasn't down to the PC brigade of today. The PC generation of today clutch at straws and troll for excuses of the most trivial preportions to call anyone racist or sexist etc in the absense of those racist and sexist field days.
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BB
Stop and have a think.
How do you think people felt in the 1970s when they were told that saying “nigger” and rolling in the aisles at Bernard Manning or at Jim “Chalky White” Davison was unacceptable?
Do you reckon they put their hands up and said, “Yeah. Fair cop.”?
Or do you reckon they whinged about the shoulder than thou mob?
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BST, you stop and have a think. Do you think that it is right that as an alternative to those days of blatant non PC racism it is right nowadays to have everything you say scrutinised for any potential racist intent, especially for political points scoring?
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Of course any racist intent should be scrutinised. What a stupid statement.
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I meant scrutinised to be used as racial intent, just like you scrutinised every word I just wrote. I knew it was only a matter of time!
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Equality watchdog attacks Boris Johnson's 'inflammatory' remarks.
Here is an intelligent woman that holds an independent position has no axe to grind and this is what she thinks about Boris' remarks.
What she says.
Rebecca Hilsenrath, the commission’s chief executive, said: “Boris Johnson’s use of language in this instance, which risks dehumanising and vilifying Muslim women, is inflammatory and divisive. Political figures should lead by example, conducting debates in a responsible manner, and language such as this can inhibit legitimate dialogue.”
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BB
I’ve no idea. I don’t know anyone who does that. You must be very unlucky in bumping into idiots like that.
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BST, you stop and have a think. Do you think that it is right that as an alternative to those days of blatant non PC racism it is right nowadays to have everything you say scrutinised for any potential racist intent, especially for political points scoring?
If someone has a history of making comments that people have interpreted as rascist, has been filmed on camera being admonished by a senior diplomat for making comments that could be interpreted as rascist and then decides to publish a newspaper article only two weeks after newspapers highlighted a four-fold increase in hate crimes, why is it a surprise that it was scrutinised?
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Equality watchdog attacks Boris Johnson's 'inflammatory' remarks.
Here is an intelligent woman that holds an independent position has no axe to grind and this is what she thinks about Boris' remarks.
What she says.
Rebecca Hilsenrath, the commission’s chief executive, said: “Boris Johnson’s use of language in this instance, which risks dehumanising and vilifying Muslim women, is inflammatory and divisive. Political figures should lead by example, conducting debates in a responsible manner, and language such as this can inhibit legitimate dialogue.”
I think that about covers it . To me it's not about being PC or not PC - it's about leading by example in much the same way that we abhor the actions of the Joey Barton's of the football world then we should hope that leading movers and shakers completely avoid using daft and dangerous language that they personally realise can be used by sections of society to legitimise racial or religious tensions. The debate even within the Muslim world appears toxic enough as it is .
As for my personal opinion , I share that of most if not all posters on here in that I don't like any form of unnecessary attire or mutilation designed to demean or restrict women or men for that matter.
I believe there are strong reasons for society to debate this but not to parody it. Silly statements dressed up as jokes only serve to embolden Far Right groups / Parties.
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Make the goalposts wider and there will be goals scored that would have been wide of the mark before.
Goals scored by calling Thomas the tank engine and Snow White racist, for instance, increase the racist figures but don't reflect a true increase in racism.
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Equality watchdog attacks Boris Johnson's 'inflammatory' remarks.
Here is an intelligent woman that holds an independent position has no axe to grind and this is what she thinks about Boris' remarks.
What she says.
Rebecca Hilsenrath, the commission’s chief executive, said: “Boris Johnson’s use of language in this instance, which risks dehumanising and vilifying Muslim women, is inflammatory and divisive. Political figures should lead by example, conducting debates in a responsible manner, and language such as this can inhibit legitimate dialogue.”
Anyone who works for an organisation called the 'equality watchdog' has clearly made a career of being a busybody PC zealot.
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Make the goalposts wider and there will be goals scored that would have been wide of the mark before.
Goals scored by calling Thomas the tank engine and Snow White racist, for instance, increase the racist figures but don't reflect a true increase in racism.
Interesting you bring up Thomas the Tank. One of the storybooks in that series still had the word “nigger” in it, in the early 70s.. I remember it and the context in which it was used - naughty boys getting blasted in soot and “running away as black as niggers”..
The story now says “... as black as coal”..
That’s in a kids book FFS, meaning kids like me aged 5 in the early 70s would have seen such a word as normal..
However these days we are much more aware of other cultures and beliefs and behaviours, so Boris’ choice of words are about 30-40 years out of date..
As a senior politician writing in a serious newspaper he should know better not to use such words, even as a joke..
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Equality watchdog attacks Boris Johnson's 'inflammatory' remarks.
Here is an intelligent woman that holds an independent position has no axe to grind and this is what she thinks about Boris' remarks.
What she says.
Rebecca Hilsenrath, the commission’s chief executive, said: “Boris Johnson’s use of language in this instance, which risks dehumanising and vilifying Muslim women, is inflammatory and divisive. Political figures should lead by example, conducting debates in a responsible manner, and language such as this can inhibit legitimate dialogue.”
Anyone who works for an organisation called the 'equality watchdog' has clearly made a career of being a busybody PC zealot.
Anyone? Is that fair?
Is it fair if I said anyone strongly opposing such agencies is a bigot? Probably not..
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Make the goalposts wider and there will be goals scored that would have been wide of the mark before.
Goals scored by calling Thomas the tank engine and Snow White racist, for instance, increase the racist figures but don't reflect a true increase in racism.
When has calling Thomas the tank engine and Snow White racist increased racist figures?
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Equality watchdog attacks Boris Johnson's 'inflammatory' remarks.
Here is an intelligent woman that holds an independent position has no axe to grind and this is what she thinks about Boris' remarks.
What she says.
Rebecca Hilsenrath, the commission’s chief executive, said: “Boris Johnson’s use of language in this instance, which risks dehumanising and vilifying Muslim women, is inflammatory and divisive. Political figures should lead by example, conducting debates in a responsible manner, and language such as this can inhibit legitimate dialogue.”
Anyone who works for an organisation called the 'equality watchdog' has clearly made a career of being a busybody PC zealot.
Anyone? Is that fair?
Is it fair if I said anyone strongly opposing such agencies is a bigot? Probably not..
Well why else would you want to work for such an organisation?
It's like saying you were a member of the SS but weren't really a Nazi.
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Equality watchdog attacks Boris Johnson's 'inflammatory' remarks.
Here is an intelligent woman that holds an independent position has no axe to grind and this is what she thinks about Boris' remarks.
What she says.
Rebecca Hilsenrath, the commission’s chief executive, said: “Boris Johnson’s use of language in this instance, which risks dehumanising and vilifying Muslim women, is inflammatory and divisive. Political figures should lead by example, conducting debates in a responsible manner, and language such as this can inhibit legitimate dialogue.”
Anyone who works for an organisation called the 'equality watchdog' has clearly made a career of being a busybody PC zealot.
Anyone? Is that fair?
Is it fair if I said anyone strongly opposing such agencies is a bigot? Probably not..
Well why else would you want to work for such an organisation?
It's like saying you were a member of the SS but weren't really a Nazi.
Why would someone want to work for such an organisation? Because they want to promote equality! As you seem to like analogies, to label everybody who works for such an organisation would be like labelling every Millwall supporter a thug.
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Equality watchdog attacks Boris Johnson's 'inflammatory' remarks.
Here is an intelligent woman that holds an independent position has no axe to grind and this is what she thinks about Boris' remarks.
What she says.
Rebecca Hilsenrath, the commission’s chief executive, said: “Boris Johnson’s use of language in this instance, which risks dehumanising and vilifying Muslim women, is inflammatory and divisive. Political figures should lead by example, conducting debates in a responsible manner, and language such as this can inhibit legitimate dialogue.”
Anyone who works for an organisation called the 'equality watchdog' has clearly made a career of being a busybody PC zealot.
Anyone? Is that fair?
Is it fair if I said anyone strongly opposing such agencies is a bigot? Probably not..
Well why else would you want to work for such an organisation?
It's like saying you were a member of the SS but weren't really a Nazi.
Or if you work for the police you're likely to be racist ?
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2018/04/22/police-still-institutionally-racist-25-years-stephen-lawrence/
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Make the goalposts wider and there will be goals scored that would have been wide of the mark before.
Goals scored by calling Thomas the tank engine and Snow White racist, for instance, increase the racist figures but don't reflect a true increase in racism.
When has calling Thomas the tank engine and Snow White racist increased racist figures?
Since the PC brigade decided to use them as examples of racism.
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Make the goalposts wider and there will be goals scored that would have been wide of the mark before.
Goals scored by calling Thomas the tank engine and Snow White racist, for instance, increase the racist figures but don't reflect a true increase in racism.
Yep and dwaaarfist- look at the demeaning names that some of them have and how she makes them work. Hi-ho suppose that's life really never felt strongly about either but I'm sure some could make a case for it
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Them sanctimonious, holier than thou PC busybodies, eh? Complaining about a kids’ book having the word “nigger” in it and demanding that it should be removed.
See, here’s a thing. These stories about the interfering PC mob tend to fall into two classes.
1) Turns out there WAS a serious issue that DID require someone to raise it and get it sorted out (e.g. the word “nigger” in kids’ books).
2) Turns our the story never actually happened (e.g. these stories about the PC mob stopping people celebrating Xmas or waving the St George flag, which everyone KNOWS has happened, but no-one can ever show any evidence for).
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Them sanctimonious, holier than thou PC busybodies, eh? Complaining about a kids’ book having the word “nigger” in it and demanding that it should be removed.
See, here’s a thing. These stories about the interfering PC mob tend to fall into two classes.
1) Turns out there WAS a serious issue that DID require someone to raise it and get it sorted out (e.g. the word “nigger” in kids’ books).
2) Turns our the story never actually happened (e.g. these stories about the PC mob stopping people celebrating Xmas or waving the St George flag, which everyone KNOWS has happened, but no-one can ever show any evidence for).
The 2) one being used by sensationalist Right Wing rags to demonstrate how the EU " stops " us doing things is particularly annoying.
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Make the goalposts wider and there will be goals scored that would have been wide of the mark before.
Goals scored by calling Thomas the tank engine and Snow White racist, for instance, increase the racist figures but don't reflect a true increase in racism.
When has calling Thomas the tank engine and Snow White racist increased racist figures?
Since the PC brigade decided to use them as examples of racism.
Which figures have they increased?
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https://www.express.co.uk/comment/expresscomment/771425/stephen-pollard-pc-brigade-trevor-phillips-political-correctness-channel-4
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BB
Like I say. You get these claims that “Political Correctness” is rampant, with no evidence if actual examples. That link you posted illustrates my point perfectly.
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BST, there's enough evidence on this forum. The attempts at herding people into a racist corner is rife. It's seems that it's used as a tactic to deter people from stating an opposing opinion, and just like in the real world it works.
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It's a different tactic than making wild claims and then refusing to evidence them I suppose.
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What's the point in providing evidence when it is simply disregarded by the people who it is aimed at? I suggest you stay happy in your sad little world of self-righteousness and ignore what's really going on.
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That’s a truly bizarre accusation BB.
Try providing some evidence, rather than unsubstantiated opinions. You might be surprised at the reaction you get.
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Just a quick one to start with depicting how PC'ness gets out of hand.
http://www.drfc-vsc.co.uk/index.php?topic=266298.60
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I’m stumped BB.
Which bit of that was PC?
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Yes...BJ should apologise for his lies, leading us into Brexit oblivion and being a grade a ASS
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I’m stumped BB.
Which bit of that was PC?
Probably just your bit, BST.
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I once used to work with a bloke who used to flip out about PC and PC culture. He also once flipped out about a feel-good news piece on the telly where an Indian family living in Britain would celebrate Christmas with a traditional Christmas dinner, except with curried sprouts. He kicked off because they "weren't respecting the culture". Funny how that seems to work.
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Surprised any of the (what I’m now going to call) Stuck-in-the-1970s brigade are posting on here. Thought they’d be too busy getting purple in the face with rage that Sky Sports have got a female pundit on :crying:
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I once used to work with a bloke who used to flip out about PC and PC culture. He also once flipped out about a feel-good news piece on the telly where an Indian family living in Britain would celebrate Christmas with a traditional Christmas dinner, except with curried sprouts. He kicked off because they "weren't respecting the culture". Funny how that seems to work.
That's just a typical EU PC issue, arguing about Brussels.
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No. I’m still struggling to get this definition of yours BB, on what you mean by PC.
Was it the bit where I gently ribbed someone for using a term for black people that was old fashionedly objectionable a generation ago?
Or was it the bit where I responded to someone who had said something stupid about things we’re not allowed to say by stating the bleeding obvious (that using terms about people which the recipient finds offensive is, by definition, offensive, whereas using terms which the recipient doesn’t find offensive isn’t)?
Good joke about Brussels by the way. I chuckled at that one.
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Those that try to ridicule political correctness hide behind the term because they can't offer real arguments concerning gross injustice, hatefullness to minorities and language that is likely to whip up feelings against religions and any thoughts couter to their own.
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Geoff
I actually don’t agree with that. I think there’s a generation that was absolutely not deliberately obnoxious or hurtful, but who haven’t twigged to the fact that other people genuinely take offence at certain terms and attitudes. And in a world that is changing rapidly, they feel a little lost and disorientated and they wish for a simpler time when they didn’t have to deal with these complexities.
Of course there are some folk who are nasty, racists t**ts but I think they are relatively rare. And tarring everyone with that brush helps no-one.
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What's the point in providing evidence when it is simply disregarded by the people who it is aimed at? I suggest you stay happy in your sad little world of self-righteousness and ignore what's really going on.
I suppose you have to look at who said what and why, in the case of Johnson you would look at what has happened around him, his history of provocative statements and absolute blunders. He's a mixture of Enoch Powell and Billy Bunter with a severe case of attention deficit disorder thrown in. There is absolutely no doubt in my mind that this recent incident was designed to put the focus back on himself with a large slice of dog-whistling and he doesn't care who he hurts or offends in the process.
https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2017/nov/11/jeremy-corbyn-boris-johnson-iran
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2017/sep/30/boris-johnson-caught-on-camera-reciting-kipling-in-myanmar-temple
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This.
This is nail on head in the issue that Johnson has started.
Don’t harrumph and say “Guardian. Don’t believe it.”
Read it and ask yourself which side of this issue you are on.
https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2018/aug/12/boris-johnson-moment-more-decisive-rivers-of-blood
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https://www.drfc-vsc.co.uk/index.php?topic=260795.0
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:kiss:
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Equality watchdog attacks Boris Johnson's 'inflammatory' remarks.
Here is an intelligent woman that holds an independent position has no axe to grind and this is what she thinks about Boris' remarks.
What she says.
Rebecca Hilsenrath, the commission’s chief executive, said: “Boris Johnson’s use of language in this instance, which risks dehumanising and vilifying Muslim women, is inflammatory and divisive. Political figures should lead by example, conducting debates in a responsible manner, and language such as this can inhibit legitimate dialogue.”
Anyone who works for an organisation called the 'equality watchdog' has clearly made a career of being a busybody PC zealot.
Anyone? Is that fair?
Is it fair if I said anyone strongly opposing such agencies is a bigot? Probably not..
Well why else would you want to work for such an organisation?
It's like saying you were a member of the SS but weren't really a Nazi.
Why would someone want to work for such an organisation? Because they want to promote equality! As you seem to like analogies, to label everybody who works for such an organisation would be like labelling every Millwall supporter a thug.
In the words of the song: No one likes us, we don't care.
We're not cry babies who make it our mission in life to take offence.
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Equality watchdog attacks Boris Johnson's 'inflammatory' remarks.
Here is an intelligent woman that holds an independent position has no axe to grind and this is what she thinks about Boris' remarks.
What she says.
Rebecca Hilsenrath, the commission’s chief executive, said: “Boris Johnson’s use of language in this instance, which risks dehumanising and vilifying Muslim women, is inflammatory and divisive. Political figures should lead by example, conducting debates in a responsible manner, and language such as this can inhibit legitimate dialogue.”
Anyone who works for an organisation called the 'equality watchdog' has clearly made a career of being a busybody PC zealot.
Anyone? Is that fair?
Is it fair if I said anyone strongly opposing such agencies is a bigot? Probably not..
Well why else would you want to work for such an organisation?
It's like saying you were a member of the SS but weren't really a Nazi.
Why would someone want to work for such an organisation? Because they want to promote equality! As you seem to like analogies, to label everybody who works for such an organisation would be like labelling every Millwall supporter a thug.
In the words of the song: No one likes us, we don't care.
We're not cry babies who make it our mission in life to take offence.
Yeah what would Rebecca Hilsenrath know about anything right?.
Rebecca Hilsenrath (Chief Executive)
Rebecca Hilsenrath was appointed Chief Legal Officer to the Equality and Human Rights Commission in March 2014.
Prior to that, she was for five years CEO of LawWorks (the Solicitors Pro Bono Group), a national charity facilitating free legal advice to community groups and individuals in need.
After graduating from Cambridge, Rebecca trained and practiced at Linklaters, and then moved to the Government Legal Service, where she held roles in the then Department for Education and Skills and in the Attorney General’s Office.
Rebecca has also established two schools, set up the National Pro Bono Centre in Chancery Lane and has sat on the boards of a number of charities and advice agencies, including the Bar Pro Bono Unit and the Mary Ward Legal Centre.
In 2012, she was listed by the Times among the 100 most influential lawyers in the country.
She has four sons and a foster daughter and her hobbies include renovating a listed cottage in Snowdonia and writing e-novels.
https://www.equalityhumanrights.com/en/who-we-are/our-commissioners-committees-and-governance/about-our-commissioners
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Back to the header.
Given this morning's news, it looks like he ought to apologise to his wife and kids.
In fact he should make a double apology to the daughter he named Lara Lettice.
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Back to the header.
Given this morning's news, it looks like he ought to apologise to his wife and kids.
In fact he should make a double apology to the daughter he named Lara Lettice.
Marina should understand what the rules were especially as Boris left his fist wife for her.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-6142517/Boris-Johnsons-catalogue-infidelity-colourful-love-life.html
And this is from the experts in this type of journalism!
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I'm amazed that so many women have let him bounce about on top of them 😂😂😂😂
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James O'Brien got it spot on today.
He assumes it's only a matter of time before Rees-Mogg announces that Johnson is unfit to be PM. Rees-Mogg makes a point about how he rejects homosexuality and abortion because of his Catholicism. Presumably he'll have the same moral outrage about a serial adulterer?
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James O'Brien got it spot on today.
He assumes it's only a matter of time before Rees-Mogg announces that Johnson is unfit to be PM. Rees-Mogg makes a point about how he rejects homosexuality and abortion because of his Catholicism. Presumably he'll have the same moral outrage about a serial adulterer?
Someone ought to ask him what he thinks about the non-blame divorce law proposals!