JR interview

[BillyStubbsTears]

Savvy.

No, I wasn't there. And whilst I fully accept that we're turning on some shockers at the moment, we're still not remotely at the level of consistent underachievement that we saw in 2007, when the (then) most expensive squad in the club's history (primarily funded by Watson and Bramall) managed to pick up 45 points in 38 depressingly one-dimensional matches.

And note. We didn't sack the manager, despite a run of results vs expectation that was FAR worse than anything we've seen under Dickov. I'll admit again that I was screaming for him to go because I couldn't see a plan. All I could see was sterile, punchless, pointless (literally most weeks) football.

Fat lot I knew.

Fat lot most people know when they start giving opinions on managers' performances.

[GazLaz]

Some of the games that season were the worst football matches I've ever seen.

[Sheepskin Stu]

Swansea away was the most toothless performance from Rovers I've ever seen. The closest we got to scoring was a blocked Mark Wilson shot, thirty yards out.

[silent majority]

It amazes me how when things go wrong some people always try and put a good spin on Bramhall.  My thoughts only

You're missing the point, quite deliberately no doubt, that the people who are to blame for the mistakes should shoulder the blame. If Bramall is at fault then he should accept that. But certain supporters seem to think the Demi-God can't do anything wrong and will do their level best to absolve him.

[Wellred]

It amazes me how when things go wrong some people always try and put a good spin on Bramhall.  My thoughts only

You're missing the point, quite deliberately no doubt, that the people who are to blame for the mistakes should shoulder the blame. If Bramall is at fault then he should accept that. But certain supporters seem to think the Demi-God can't do anything wrong and will do their level best to absolve him.

But on the other side of the coin there are those who also think the present day "saint" can't do anything wrong either and will do their level best to absolve him. 

[silent majority]

It amazes me how when things go wrong some people always try and put a good spin on Bramhall.  My thoughts only

You're missing the point, quite deliberately no doubt, that the people who are to blame for the mistakes should shoulder the blame. If Bramall is at fault then he should accept that. But certain supporters seem to think the Demi-God can't do anything wrong and will do their level best to absolve him.

But on the other side of the coin there are those who also think the present day "saint" can't do anything wrong either and will do their level best to absolve him. 

No, if you actually read my post you will see that I did suggest that if the current Saint (as you call him) has done wrong then he should shoulder that responsibility. I suppose spending £14m on our football club doesn't give him any credibility in your eyes.

[Wellred]

It amazes me how when things go wrong some people always try and put a good spin on Bramhall.  My thoughts only

You're missing the point, quite deliberately no doubt, that the people who are to blame for the mistakes should shoulder the blame. If Bramall is at fault then he should accept that. But certain supporters seem to think the Demi-God can't do anything wrong and will do their level best to absolve him.

But on the other side of the coin there are those who also think the present day "saint" can't do anything wrong either and will do their level best to absolve him. 

No, if you actually read my post you will see that I did suggest that if the current Saint (as you call him) has done wrong then he should shoulder that responsibility. I suppose spending £14m on our football club doesn't give him any credibility in your eyes.

So its ok for you to refer to someone as the "demi god" and when I refer to someone as "the saint"I am wrong? In your eyes one is a good guy and the other someone to be vilified?

I am not suggesting that someone who has spent £14 on our club has no credibility, I am suggesting he has no ambition. There is a huge difference.
The "demi god" also put a substantial amount of his money into DRFC. A much smaller percentage of his money as well and he had ambition. That is the difference.

[BillyStubbsTears]

Wellred

See, I've never understood this ambition issue.

Bramall and Watson put money into the club to get us to the Championship in 08 and to help keep us there for 4 years. When we were relegated, they put money in to allow Saunders to build a title-winning side. Then, in the Championship, they provided funds to allow Dickov to sign Khumalo, Forrester, Sharp, Macheda, Turnbull, Johnstone, Wellens, Meite, Tamas and others.

I've never yet heard ANYONE who complains about Bramall's lack of ambition explain clearly and simply in absolute terms what they think he should put into the club.

All I hear is, whatever he does put in, he should put in more. As I've said before, that's the logic of the spoilt 6 year old brat.

[silent majority]

Wellred,

I don't say you were wrong to call him the Saint, I just said that you did, a statement of fact I think you'll agree?

Also there is nowhere in your post that you stated that TB has no ambition and that was your gripe with him, so how am I supposed to know what your post meant? I can't be a mind reader!

Thirdly, the fact that JR puts substantial (proportionally) sums of money into the club was never even mentioned, which essentially means your argument has no merit.

[Iberian Red]

It amazes me how when things go wrong some people always try and put a good spin on Bramhall.  My thoughts only

You're missing the point, quite deliberately no doubt, that the people who are to blame for the mistakes should shoulder the blame. If Bramall is at fault then he should accept that. But certain supporters seem to think the Demi-God can't do anything wrong and will do their level best to absolve him.

But on the other side of the coin there are those who also think the present day "saint" can't do anything wrong either and will do their level best to absolve him. 

No, if you actually read my post you will see that I did suggest that if the current Saint (as you call him) has done wrong then he should shoulder that responsibility. I suppose spending £14m on our football club doesn't give him any credibility in your eyes.

So its ok for you to refer to someone as the "demi god" and when I refer to someone as "the saint"I am wrong? In your eyes one is a good guy and the other someone to be vilified?

I am not suggesting that someone who has spent £14 on our club has no credibility, I am suggesting he has no ambition. There is a huge difference.
The "demi god" also put a substantial amount of his money into DRFC. A much smaller percentage of his money as well and he had ambition. That is the difference.

What are you suggesting? Just to clarify.

[Wellred]

It amazes me how when things go wrong some people always try and put a good spin on Bramhall.  My thoughts only

You're missing the point, quite deliberately no doubt, that the people who are to blame for the mistakes should shoulder the blame. If Bramall is at fault then he should accept that. But certain supporters seem to think the Demi-God can't do anything wrong and will do their level best to absolve him.

But on the other side of the coin there are those who also think the present day "saint" can't do anything wrong either and will do their level best to absolve him. 

No, if you actually read my post you will see that I did suggest that if the current Saint (as you call him) has done wrong then he should shoulder that responsibility. I suppose spending £14m on our football club doesn't give him any credibility in your eyes.

So its ok for you to refer to someone as the "demi god" and when I refer to someone as "the saint"I am wrong? In your eyes one is a good guy and the other someone to be vilified?

I am not suggesting that someone who has spent £14 on our club has no credibility, I am suggesting he has no ambition. There is a huge difference.
The "demi god" also put a substantial amount of his money into DRFC. A much smaller percentage of his money as well and he had ambition. That is the difference.

What are you suggesting? Just to clarify.

Which part do you wish me to spell out for you?

[Iberian Red]

 

[Savvy]

or

Savvy.

No, I wasn't there. And whilst I fully accept that we're turning on some shockers at the moment, we're still not remotely at the level of consistent underachievement that we saw in 2007, when the (then) most expensive squad in the club's history (primarily funded by Watson and Bramall) managed to pick up 45 points in 38 depressingly one-dimensional matches.

And note. We didn't sack the manager, despite a run of results vs expectation that was FAR worse than anything we've seen under Dickov. I'll admit again that I was screaming for him to go because I couldn't see a plan. All I could see was sterile, punchless, pointless (literally most weeks) football.

Fat lot I knew.

Fat lot most people know when they start giving opinions on managers' performances.

Billy do you know for a fact that the squad was primarily funded by Bramall and Watson or is it a sweeping generalisation?

[BillyStubbsTears]

Savvy

I assume you've looked at the company accounts? If you haven't, it's probably best to stay out of the discussion. Personally, I haven't got the time or energy to have this argument yet again with people who have made up their minds and can't be arsed to address established facts.

[Savvy]

No and neither have I, to listen to people who just make sweeping generalisations that they know they cannot substantiate, and then try and wrap it up in spin. You might fool some of the people on here, but I'm not one of them!

[Bentley Bullet]

BST. Those players you mention above seem like a fabulous collection of footballers that we had playing for us last season, especially now when you look at our present squad. However, that line-up would not have impressed many other clubs' supporters in the Championship. The squad's target was survival, and such a plan was always likely to mean the team would be hanging around the bottom of the table.

I think TB/DW's ambitions should have been set higher.

[BillyStubbsTears]

BB

You make my point for me.

Bramall and Watson paid for a squad that damn-nearly kept us in the Championship.

Why did they do that if they have no ambition?

Why not buy a bunch of Esdailles and Cunninghams?

You say that their ambitions should have been higher.

Don't you get it? You have just said PRECISELY what I am complaining about. When it's time to leave the park and not have another ice cream on the way home, my 6 and 7 year old chuck big tantrums. What they mean is that my ambitions for their fun should be higher.

What you are doing is saying: Whatever our benefactors give us, I think they should give us more, more, f***ING MORE. 

[bpoolrover]

While I agree with you billy that last season more so in January they did back dickov,but I think the issue is this season you can't say the same,we lost some very good players at this level and have replaced them with far inferior players

[Boomstick]

Wasn't just the KM 2's money, it was JR's too. Now JR isnt involved the KM2 seem reluctant to invest in tge club, and seem content to mothball it.
The future looks pretty dull under the KM2, and I expect we will stagnate in league 1 at best.

It's no good having vast wealth with no ambition.

[big fat yorkshire pudding]

So your opinion then is that the players we have are not good enough, that's the crux of what you are saying?

[Filo]

Wasn't just the KM 2's money, it was JR's too. Now JR isnt involved the KM2 seem reluctant to invest in tge club, and seem content to mothball it.
The future looks pretty dull under the KM2, and I expect we will stagnate in league 1 at best.

It's no good having vast wealth with no ambition.

JR is still a share holder, as a share holder don't you think he has an obligation to keep the club going, maybe TB and DW are still putting in the same amount as before whilst JR is putting in nothing, hence the reason why the budget is lower

[Bentley Bullet]

BST

Richie Wellens said that during our first stint in the Championship we reached a stage when the team was just one striker short of a play off place, and had we had Billy Sharp at that time we would have the final piece of the jigsaw. I completely agree with him. We were lacking what all the other teams seemed to have, a danger man up front who scared the life out of opponents. Such a player for us would have been the icing on the cake, the cherry on the top.

To use your comparison we were all in the park eating our ice creams, but all the other kids had a flake in theirs.

I'm not suggesting that TB and DW should have broken the bank and spent their entire life savings on a top rated striker. I'm suggesting they should have invested about a million quid, which was about the going rate for a striker who normally would be sat on the bench at most Championship clubs.

Now it seems their ambitions for the club involve even less financial investment, and that will indeed result in a bunch of  Esdailles and Cunninghams playing for us.

Their ambition was to put something back into Doncaster, but it seems their choice of Doncaster Rovers was a more costly challenge than what they were prepared to put back in.

[BillyStubbsTears]

BB

As I say. Whatever they spend, you want more. You're confirming it with every post.

[Wild Rover]

I personally do wonder about TB/DW monetary input, SM said earlier TB had "Put in" 14million, but from personal wealth of 500 million that's a mere 2.8%. That being spread over what, 8 years. That would be the equivalent of your average supporter ( like me ) putting in £2800 over a  8 year period.
Its when you see other local clubs "Owners" putting in fairly decent amounts for "Transfers" that irks most supporters.
Don't get me wrong, I am appreciative of what the "Owners" have done in the past, but cant help thinking the pot is too "Dry" now.

Just my opinion of course, and if I had the 500 million as opposed to TB, then 1/5 of that would be "Investment Marked",( similar to his "Terry and Liz" fund ), then all supporters be happy.

[Bentley Bullet]

BST

Yes I do want more. I am being honest.

If Rovers re-signed Chris Brown would you be delighted? If the answer to that is yes, and I'm sure it is, then that is proof in itself that you also would like more.

Now you can sit back and be happy with the way things are going, that's your choice. It isn't mine.

[BillyStubbsTears]

BB

Also (although irrelevant for this discussion) I haven't got a clue what you're on about with your chronology.

We HAD Billy Sharp for 2.5 of the four years that we were in the Championship. Of the other 1.5 years, 6 months was Ryan's crackpot experiment, 6 months was the start of 2008-09 when we were barely even competitive, never mind promotion candidates and the other 6 months was the second half of 08/09, when we had a striker with the second highest goals-to-games ratio in the division.
What precisely is the point you're trying to make?

[Bentley Bullet]

I personally do wonder about TB/DW monetary input, SM said earlier TB had "Put in" 14million, but from personal wealth of 500 million that's a mere 0.028%. That being spread over what, 8 years. That would be the equivalent of your average supporter ( like me ) putting in £280 a year, for same 8 year period.
Its when you see other local clubs "Owners" putting in fairly decent amounts for "Transfers" that irks most supporters.
Don't get me wrong, I am appreciative of what the "Owners" have done in the past, but cant help thinking the pot is too "Dry" now.

Just my opinion of course, and if I had the 500 million as opposed to TB, then 1/5 of that would be "Investment Marked",( similar to his "Terry and Liz" fund ), then all supporters be happy.

Wild Rover, I take my hat off to you.

[BillyStubbsTears]

BB

I'm grateful to have a Board that has consistently put in far, far more money into the club than the club can generate itself, and more than anyone else appears willing to put in.

Yes it would be grand if they'd put in even more and give us all a free copy of Razzle every week. But I'm not going to moan if they choose not to do.

[big fat yorkshire pudding]

I think it boils back to the old thing of people wanting to spend someone else's money.  In essence what I don't hear is any alternatives.  If some get their wish and they go what do we get?  We could get JR, though he is putting in even less money than them and from what I've seen there is nobody else.  Plus everyone else who came forward had nothing to offer.

So, to those who are crticising, what are the alternatives.

I'll then go back to my original point, budget etc is mooted, yet we've been beaten recently by Oldham, Port Vale and Walsall, all who have owners who don't put money in and budgets substantially less than ours.  Yet apparently it isn't the manager that is the issue, but the budget.  Getting beat by teams with smaller budgets suggests to me that actually it isn't the budget that is the issue, but how the budget has been employed.

[DonnyBazR0ver]

So, once again you assume Dick and Terry have pots of cash sloshing about. It seems it's ok for JR to have money tied up in assetts but it's beyond your reckoning that the same might apply to TB and DW.