The Climate Crisis

[River Don]

As it is, this is a suicide pact.

They've got to do better than this, no matter how painful because failure to act will be worse. Obviously this still isn't fully understood yet.

It does highlight how vital coal is to India and China.

[Sprotyrover]

''Half world’s fossil fuel assets could become worthless by 2036 in net zero transition''

It's already happening.

https://www.theguardian.com/environment/ng-interactive/2021/nov/04/fossil-fuel-assets-worthless-2036-net-zero-transition

The government has known this has been coming for how long?

''Up to 80 workers at New South Wales' largest coal mine have been ordered by BHP to accept transfers to interstate mines or resign from their positions.

''MELBOURNE, April 30 (Reuters) - As BHP Group (BHP.AX) looks at options to spin off or sell its thermal coal assets, the miner is facing pressure from climate conscious investors who want divergent paths and that's even before getting to the tough task of finding a buyer.

The world’s largest miner has been in talks with stakeholders on its plans to divest the Mt. Arthur thermal coal mine, its stake in a steel-making coal project with Japan's Mitsui (8031.T) and a stake in a thermal coal mine in Colombia.

Some large shareholders are pushing the miner to exit immediately while other investors want a slower exit, to ensure the mine is wound down responsibly''

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2021-09-16/bhp-tells-miners-in-nsw-hunter-valley-move-interstate-or-resign/100460530

Very  god Sydders, this is why your adoptive  country has joined into a coaltion with  the likes of China ,India and U.S, so you Ausies can carry on export ing $90 Billion AUS every year for a further 30 years, Ya dirty polluter!

[River Don]

Not as newsworthy as a firestorm or a vast flood but the middle east from Turkey, through Jordan, Syria, Iraq and Afghanistan is currently suffering a drought of epic proportions.

This in a year of so many weather extremes.

https://www.al-monitor.com/originals/2021/11/camels-weep-their-young-perish-syrias-killer-drought#ixzz7C5SgG1rU

[SydneyRover]

''Half world’s fossil fuel assets could become worthless by 2036 in net zero transition''

It's already happening.

https://www.theguardian.com/environment/ng-interactive/2021/nov/04/fossil-fuel-assets-worthless-2036-net-zero-transition

The government has known this has been coming for how long?

''Up to 80 workers at New South Wales' largest coal mine have been ordered by BHP to accept transfers to interstate mines or resign from their positions.

''MELBOURNE, April 30 (Reuters) - As BHP Group (BHP.AX) looks at options to spin off or sell its thermal coal assets, the miner is facing pressure from climate conscious investors who want divergent paths and that's even before getting to the tough task of finding a buyer.

The world’s largest miner has been in talks with stakeholders on its plans to divest the Mt. Arthur thermal coal mine, its stake in a steel-making coal project with Japan's Mitsui (8031.T) and a stake in a thermal coal mine in Colombia.

Some large shareholders are pushing the miner to exit immediately while other investors want a slower exit, to ensure the mine is wound down responsibly''

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2021-09-16/bhp-tells-miners-in-nsw-hunter-valley-move-interstate-or-resign/100460530

Veru god Sydders, this is why your adoptive  country has joined into a coaltion with  the likes of China ,India and U.S, so you Ausies can carry on export ing $90 Billion AUS every year for a further 30 years, Ya dirty polluter!

Please understand sprot that I'm not a god and can't fix everything you tory voters support but I do my best which in many cases falls well short of the mark. I campaign against coal and gas and climate change and against governments that support the fossil fuel industries.

[SydneyRover]

What everyone can do which doesn't take a lot of effort is to email their pension fund, bank or whatever to ask them to only invest in ethical products and to disinvest in fossil fuels. Merely by asking will put these institutions on notice that the groundswell is building.

[normal rules]

The experts are predicting the reality of cop26 is that the world is going to suffer 2.4 degree raise in ave temp.
An utterly catastrophic legacy we leave for future generations.
And the crazy irony is that India is against phasing out coal. A country that is likely to be one of hardest hit.
Humanity will kill itself. And many other species while they are at it.
political bickering across the globe  will be futile in the coming years.
Survival will be the only thing we have left.
I never thought I would imagine this, or even consider it a reality, but I believe the world, the whole world, and every culture and society are heading for a dystopian future.

[SydneyRover]

The experts are predicting the reality of cop26 is that the world is going to suffer 2.4 degree raise in ave temp.
An utterly catastrophic legacy we leave for future generations.
And the crazy irony is that India is against phasing out coal. A country that is likely to be one of hardest hit.
Humanity will kill itself. And many other species while they are at it.
political bickering across the globe  will be futile in the coming years.
Survival will be the only thing we have left.
I never thought I would imagine this, or even consider it a reality, but I believe the world, the whole world, and every culture and society are heading for a dystopian future.

Angst is all well and good, what are you doing NR?

[Sprotyrover]

India a country with a bigger space programme than our own, can’t get itself out of the Dirty Coal addiction. I have to say it Maggie Thatcher was a true visionary! And years ahead of her time, we can look back now and thank her for breaking our dirty Coal Habit.

[SydneyRover]

India a country with a bigger space programme than our own, can’t get itself out of the Dirty Coal addiction. I have to say it Maggie Thatcher was a true visionary! And years ahead of her time, we can look back now and thank her for breaking our dirty Coal Habit.

the biggest of all is inside your head sprot

[River Don]

The experts are predicting the reality of cop26 is that the world is going to suffer 2.4 degree raise in ave temp.
An utterly catastrophic legacy we leave for future generations.
And the crazy irony is that India is against phasing out coal. A country that is likely to be one of hardest hit.
Humanity will kill itself. And many other species while they are at it.
political bickering across the globe  will be futile in the coming years.
Survival will be the only thing we have left.
I never thought I would imagine this, or even consider it a reality, but I believe the world, the whole world, and every culture and society are heading for a dystopian future.

There are a whole lot of tipping points, that are estimated to be reached in the 1.5-2.0 degree of warming range. They can't be sure where these tipping points might be met, it's possible we have already reached one with ice melt.

These tipping points combined might quickly lead to other catastrophic tipping points being met in a cascade effect. Go beyond 2.0 degrees of warming and there are serious risks. It could very rapidly spiral above 4.0 degrees and that's goodnight. Reach 2.4 degrees is unthinkable. 1.5 degrees is more than risky enough.

[big fat yorkshire pudding]

What everyone can do which doesn't take a lot of effort is to email their pension fund, bank or whatever to ask them to only invest in ethical products and to disinvest in fossil fuels. Merely by asking will put these institutions on notice that the groundswell is building.

Even less of an effort you could choose yourself what to invest your pension in, then you've full control.

[SydneyRover]

What everyone can do which doesn't take a lot of effort is to email their pension fund, bank or whatever to ask them to only invest in ethical products and to disinvest in fossil fuels. Merely by asking will put these institutions on notice that the groundswell is building.

Even less of an effort you could choose yourself what to invest your pension in, then you've full control.

This maybe true unless of course you are investing in shares, unit trusts or the like then you still have to check. The attractive part of pension funds I would think is that the average person (includes myself) does not have the facility to determine the risk of individual investments and therefore it is wise to spread it, which is why funds do well.

[normal rules]

The experts are predicting the reality of cop26 is that the world is going to suffer 2.4 degree raise in ave temp.
An utterly catastrophic legacy we leave for future generations.
And the crazy irony is that India is against phasing out coal. A country that is likely to be one of hardest hit.
Humanity will kill itself. And many other species while they are at it.
political bickering across the globe  will be futile in the coming years.
Survival will be the only thing we have left.
I never thought I would imagine this, or even consider it a reality, but I believe the world, the whole world, and every culture and society are heading for a dystopian future.

Angst is all well and good, what are you doing NR?

I work from home. Probably never going on a foreign holiday again.
Keep heating down to a minimum.
Travel less. Stay local. Buy local produce.
We already eat very little red meat,
Keep recycling .
What else is there?

[BillyStubbsTears]

If personal choices are all that can be done then we've got no chance. It helps but it's nowhere near enough. We need big strategic decisions on national and international levels to stop using hydrocarbons for power, heating and transport.

COP26 shows that the developing countries are (quite rightly) saying to us "But YOU built your economies and got rich using cheap oil and coal. If you're telling us we can't do that, put your hands in your pockets and spread the proceeds around. Otherwise we'll continue on the path to Hell that you laid out."

I can see Drax from the end of our road. For most of my life, every time I've out the lights on or boiled a kettle, that monster had been polluting the planet. Why should the next generation of Indian kids be deprived that cheap energy without expecting me to pay to help them get clean energy?

[River Don]

Unfortunately remaining on the path to hell is not going to improve living standards in Asia for very long. This must be understood.

It maybe unfair but I can't see that there is any alternative, the scale of cuts in emissions means  all are going to have to make sacrifices.

If it seems unfair on Asia, then it is really unfair on Africa and South America but we can't afford for these areas to develope with fossil fuels.

[Axholme Lion]

Maybe people in these countries could help by not having loads of kids. The number one problem in the world is overpopulation. End of.
Alleged climate change is just one more symptom of this illness.

[normal rules]

I mentioned India, but the Uk is directly in the firing line for sea level rises.
And the govt of the uk, current and future are in no way prepared for this.
Neither are the people.
In time, there are going to be millions displaced. And that’s just in the uk.

[River Don]

Kids in the developing world have a tiny carbon footprint.

It's westerners with big cars, central heating systems, air con and a penchant for red meat and foreign holidays who are the main culprits.

[normal rules]

I watched top gear last night. And who doesn’t love top gear?
This is a programme that is watched by tens of millions around the world in various languages.
They promote gas guzzling super cars amongst other things.
It glorifies petrol consumption. And they spend a lot of money doing this .
Speed, power, emissions, pollution.
Specials across the world where they tackle dangerous roads etc. And then ship their damaged cars back on planes at huge expense. Because they like them.
This programme is the very epitome of all that is wrong when we consider our fossil fuel use. For us to change, for us to really change , this programme, along with many like it has to alter its approach. Radically.
And right there is the very crux of how much, as a society, we must change, especially in developed countries to make a real difference to climate change.
I watched the repeat of the Nepal trip they did yesterday afternoon before the new series started.
They quite literally dragged three cars around the himalaya. One eventually being abandoned in the middle of no where after spewing half its engine of oil all over.
All in the name of entertainment?
They then got three super cars and ragged them around silverstone. Belching high levels of pollution no doubt. For fun. To see who was fastest. Why?
The carbon footprint of this programme over the years must be collosal.
Enjoyment over survival?
Travel over environment?
Money over climate poverty?

To many , a programme such as this would be sacrilege. Oh no , you can’t get rid of top gear I hear the cry. It won’t be the same without super cars.
And that, is where we fail.
Because our collective attitude to real change is that it is too much for us to bear.
We don’t like change. Especially when it affects our very own lives.

[River Don]

NR, I watched Top Gear with much the same feelings. I used to enjoy it, back when the Clarkson and Co were younger. This group don't have the opinions or wit to keep it interesting.

But the overriding impression I got watching last night was one of excess and needless waste. I had to turn it off half way through.

[normal rules]

RD. I suspect, sadly you will be in the minority.

[normal rules]

It’s only a matter of time before the bbc come under pressure form climate change groups to change tack on their programme.

[River Don]

RD. I suspect, sadly you will be in the minority.

The number of massive SUVs we see on the road suggests so.

[ravenrover]

RD. I suspect, sadly you will be in the minority.

link=topic=280465.msg1104356#msg1104356 date=1636985412]
RD. I suspect, sadly you will be in the minority.

[/quote]
Count me in with the minority, I have never watched the programme even from back in the days of Raymond Baxter!

[Axholme Lion]

I mentioned India, but the Uk is directly in the firing line for sea level rises.
And the govt of the uk, current and future are in no way prepared for this.
Neither are the people.
In time, there are going to be millions displaced. And that’s just in the uk.

It's not a problem, the government will give the displaced Brits a four bed house to live in somewhere nice. I believe that's the usual procedure for refugees.

[i_ateallthepies]

The global decision-makers are the money men, they probably see Climate change as a massive opportunity for a double whammy.  Keep milking the fossil fuels and driving climate change until the natural disasters are so frequent and severe that nations across the globe are willing to pay whatever it takes for technology to reverse the calamity...  and the money men are quids in... again.

[normal rules]

But what do the money men do when it is so hot they cannot breathe?
What do the money men do when the sea is lapping at their door?
What do the money men do when their inner city mansions are surrounded by water?
What do the money men do when their people are literally fighting each other for food, space and water.
What do money men do when all they have left is money. And nothing to spend it on.because there is nothing left to buy?
The only asset left will be life itself.
Survival.

[normal rules]

I have been watching Universe. Which is fascinating.
My wife refuses to watch it , simply because she cannot get her head around some of the things that are talked about On this programme.
I tried explaining to her that some of the twinkling lights in the night sky is light that is 4000 yrs old . The light originated when the Egyptians walked the earth 2000 yrs bc. And this is just the youngest stars.

I get the distinct impression, many of this world population see climate change the same way. They simply cannot comprehend what is happening. What has happened. What is fact. What is real. What exists. Because we only see what is In Front of us in our generation. In our 70-90 yrs ish.
we have no concept of the universe being billions of years old. We fail to recognise the big picture.
Our time here is limited.
Humanities time on earth is limited too.
We just don’t see it.
And we won’t.
Until it is too late.
I believe it already is.
My dad, age 74,  god bless him, sums up the general mood. “I won’t be around for it to bother me “

[SydneyRover]

We have just got our first quote in for solar panel, around $7k for a 6.6kw system (with govt rebates) but we will probably have to pay a couple of grand more for optimisers as we have shade issues.

When we have selected the system we want we will look to change from gas storage to an electric hws and then from gas cooking to electric (induction) a conventional electric oven won't make a great deal of diff' but if anyone cooks with an induction top please post your experiences.

[BillyStubbsTears]

Induction hobs are superb. Had one for 5 years and I wouldn't dream of changing. Lightning fast, efficient, easy to clean. Cheap enough to buy too. It's a no brainer.

Similarly a boiling water tap. No more boiling a litre of water for a cuppa. And the hot water available instantly.