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Quote from: Bentley Bullet on September 30, 2014, 12:48:49 pmQuote from: swintonrover on September 30, 2014, 12:23:35 pmAbility should be the first call, not race, gender, sexuality, nationality, whatever.Ability should be paramount DESPITE any of the above differences. We have to be careful though that it is not judged in favour of them BECAUSE of it.BB.Again, just to clarify (because facts have a habit of getting obscured on emotive topics like this) no-one is suggesting that weak black coaches should be given jobs over strong white coaches. No-one.The point is that there is a wealth of evidence that, given equal credentials, black people don't even get shortlisted as often as white people, across a range of different jobs. Rooney's Rule is all about making sure that art least one black candidate gets a hearing. Nothing more, nothing less. In simple terms, if you are white, you ALREADY have an unfair advantage. This is trying to redress the balance.
Quote from: swintonrover on September 30, 2014, 12:23:35 pmAbility should be the first call, not race, gender, sexuality, nationality, whatever.Ability should be paramount DESPITE any of the above differences. We have to be careful though that it is not judged in favour of them BECAUSE of it.
Ability should be the first call, not race, gender, sexuality, nationality, whatever.
So, 25% are NON WHITE, that's to say Black, Brown, Yellow. The majority I assume are indeed BLACK. Although there are some "Arab" ( Brown ) players around, and the odd Japanese/Korean or similar origin. Lets say 20% Black.192 Pro licence holders, 14 Black. (15%)92 League clubs, 5 Black mangers (was ) tad over 5%If 20% of clubs had Black Managers, that would be 19.DO THEY APPLY for the posts, or are they waiting for a call.
Quote from: Wild Rover on September 30, 2014, 02:39:34 pmSo, 25% are NON WHITE, that's to say Black, Brown, Yellow. The majority I assume are indeed BLACK. Although there are some "Arab" ( Brown ) players around, and the odd Japanese/Korean or similar origin. Lets say 20% Black.192 Pro licence holders, 14 Black. (15%)92 League clubs, 5 Black mangers (was ) tad over 5%If 20% of clubs had Black Managers, that would be 19.DO THEY APPLY for the posts, or are they waiting for a call.WR,192 Pro licence holders and 92 league clubs. Whatever the maths at least 50% would be unemployed anyway.So, taking the 14 with pro licences, removing the unemployed would mean 7 should be in employment. We had 5, which is significantly higher than the figure most are using.
Black badge holders? Can they park on double yellow lines?
Quote from: Donny Viking on September 30, 2014, 12:31:32 pm1. But those countries don't have lots of home grown white football players over the last 30 years.If you accept that most good managers are ex-professional footballers then surely the number of managers should reflect the number of players of any particular colour? you state 'More availability of 'non black' - but that is the point, because of the number of black footballers we have we should expect to see more black managers and coaches - if not, why not? Personally I think the issue is more deep rooted than just management - to be a good manager you need to serve your time as a coach - and we don't have enough black coaches.2. International football is dominated by the rich European leagues (expect for a couple south american teams - but even thier best players soon come to Europe), the best managers are perceived to come from the bigger clubs (more experience etc) and these are white dominated.Ok then. IF 25% of footballers are of "Black" roots, you say 25%( of the 25% ) so 1/16 ( 6 in number )of managers pro rata should be the same.That always assumes that for any vacant post 25% of applicants are black.I wonder in the past, when a managerial vacancy has arisen at DRFC, how many applicants were black, or come to think of it, how many applicants at any club , for any managerial post were black/Brown/Yellow. How can you say "International football" in places like Nigeria, BF, Senegal, etc are dominated by European leagues. That is not correct at all. Of course the best players will inevitably end up in Europe, as the pay is infinitely greater, but it still does not answer as to why there are no ( or few ) Black coaches or managers in predominantly black countries.
1. But those countries don't have lots of home grown white football players over the last 30 years.If you accept that most good managers are ex-professional footballers then surely the number of managers should reflect the number of players of any particular colour? you state 'More availability of 'non black' - but that is the point, because of the number of black footballers we have we should expect to see more black managers and coaches - if not, why not? Personally I think the issue is more deep rooted than just management - to be a good manager you need to serve your time as a coach - and we don't have enough black coaches.2. International football is dominated by the rich European leagues (expect for a couple south american teams - but even thier best players soon come to Europe), the best managers are perceived to come from the bigger clubs (more experience etc) and these are white dominated.
Quote from: Wild Rover on September 30, 2014, 01:00:22 pmQuote from: Donny Viking on September 30, 2014, 12:31:32 pm1. But those countries don't have lots of home grown white football players over the last 30 years.If you accept that most good managers are ex-professional footballers then surely the number of managers should reflect the number of players of any particular colour? you state 'More availability of 'non black' - but that is the point, because of the number of black footballers we have we should expect to see more black managers and coaches - if not, why not? Personally I think the issue is more deep rooted than just management - to be a good manager you need to serve your time as a coach - and we don't have enough black coaches.2. International football is dominated by the rich European leagues (expect for a couple south american teams - but even thier best players soon come to Europe), the best managers are perceived to come from the bigger clubs (more experience etc) and these are white dominated.Ok then. IF 25% of footballers are of "Black" roots, you say 25%( of the 25% ) so 1/16 ( 6 in number )of managers pro rata should be the same.That always assumes that for any vacant post 25% of applicants are black.I wonder in the past, when a managerial vacancy has arisen at DRFC, how many applicants were black, or come to think of it, how many applicants at any club , for any managerial post were black/Brown/Yellow. How can you say "International football" in places like Nigeria, BF, Senegal, etc are dominated by European leagues. That is not correct at all. Of course the best players will inevitably end up in Europe, as the pay is infinitely greater, but it still does not answer as to why there are no ( or few ) Black coaches or managers in predominantly black countries.You've ruined my nights entertainment, I was going to watch Mind Your Language followed by Till Death Us Do Part, but don't feel the necessity now.
Just to confuse things more . I wonder what % of ENGLISH managers run our top teams given the prevalence of foreign managers in the game ?This is not to deflect from the question that the OP raises and I personally agree that whichever way you play with the percentages ; there are definitely NOT enough black managers on the game.Some can make as many false stats as they like but your eyes can never deceive you.
Quote from: hoolahoop on October 02, 2014, 07:31:32 amJust to confuse things more . I wonder what % of ENGLISH managers run our top teams given the prevalence of foreign managers in the game ?This is not to deflect from the question that the OP raises and I personally agree that whichever way you play with the percentages ; there are definitely NOT enough black managers on the game.Some can make as many false stats as they like but your eyes can never deceive you.Black managers ON the game ? That's linking to an even more spurious claim.... 😉