Brexit deal

[BillyStubbsTears]

So go on then BB. The list of questions you're avoiding is building up and I know you set great weight on the importance of answering questions. Do YOU think that May's deal would have resulted in us leaving in the way that the people who voted Leave in 2016 intended?

[Bentley Bullet]

No, I don't.

Now then owd lad, seeing as your such a stickler for answering questions, go back to the start of this thread and the other political threads and answer all my questions that you've 'missed'. I'm not so demanding that you have to answer all of them at once, just one at a time will suffice.

[BillyStubbsTears]

Go on. You list them for me. I'm happy enough to list the ones that you ignore.

The latest one was asking you how exactly the EU had jumped on a bandwagon of betraying our democratic vote to leave?

[Bentley Bullet]

OK, when I've got time I'll put them on, sporadically like, when I've got nowt better to do.

[BillyStubbsTears]

I won't hold my breath. For either a sensible list from you, or answers to support the guff you write in here.

[Bentley Bullet]

BST's unanswered questions. Number 1:

Don't you want any sort of control on immigration?

[BillyStubbsTears]

Well you really are determined to make a tit of yourself aren't you?

https://www.drfc-vsc.co.uk/index.php?topic=268078.msg868041#msg868041

I'd have thought my take was bleeding obvious from that answer, but since you have spent the past 6 months in this mode where you insist on everything being spelled out for you (and then ignore it anyway) I'll spell it out for you.

My opinion is that the benefits that we get from free movement of people far outweighs the problems. But then I would think that, since I'm from an immigrant family and my kids' maternal grandfather came to England from Italy.

I don't see immigrants as a threat. I understand that others do, and I guess that's where the main fault line in the country is now.

[Bentley Bullet]

Is that supposed to be an answer?

[BillyStubbsTears]

What part of "EU free movement of people is not an issue you can consider in isolation: you have to judge it in the light of the overall economic benefits and my take is that free movement is worth it because of the economic benefits we get, while in addition, I have very personal reasons for welcoming immigration" are you struggling to understand today?

[Bentley Bullet]

First question = First failure to answer.

[BillyStubbsTears]

I think we need a whip round to buy you a cat to kick. And a copy of Self Esteem for Dummies.

[Bentley Bullet]

It's a simple enough question. Don't you want any sort of control on immigration?

[BillyStubbsTears]

From the EU no because we get benefits that outweigh perceived problems.
From the wider world yes, because the situation is different and we don't get those benefits.

[Bentley Bullet]

I'm sure there are very few people who don't welcome genuine, hard-working, useful, law-abiding immigrants from anywhere in the world who will be of benefit to the country. Of course for this to be implemented there has to be immigration control, otherwise, we end up getting the deadwood from other countries that are only too pleased to see the back of them.

Don't you think that would massively reduce the current immigration problems and in fact reduce racism?

[BillyStubbsTears]

Whoa.

There's a whole list for you to answer now.

Starting with the question I asked you earlier.

[Bentley Bullet]

Don't you think that immigration controls would massively reduce the current immigration problems and in fact reduce racism?

[Bentley Bullet]

Go on. You list them for me. I'm happy enough to list the ones that you ignore.

The latest one was asking you how exactly the EU had jumped on a bandwagon of betraying our democratic vote to leave?

Because it was far easier for the EU to pacify half of the country than all of it.

[BillyStubbsTears]

No I don't believe that abrogating the agreement on free movement of people would reduce racism. Because it will also mean us having severely worse economic performance over the short and long term. One of the key drivers of racism is NOT how many people from different countries there are in your area. It's how you, personally, are doing economically. That's been the case throughout history. People get f**ked off by working harder and not getting on, and mendacious bas**rds tell them it is the fault of that f**king foreigner over there. So, if we choose an immigration policy that makes us significantly poorer, that will not reduce racism.

Now, onto your answer. I asked you to explain HOW the EU had jumped on a bandwagon. Not your opinion of WHY they did.

I'll make it simpler because you're struggling. What exactly did the EU do, to stymie our Brexit?

[Bentley Bullet]

How on earth would refusing entry to unsuitable immigrants be detrimental to our economy?

[BillyStubbsTears]

Because free movement of workers is integral to being in the Single Market. Every person in the EU has the right to move to other EU countries to work and set up residence. Abrogating that right automatically puts you outside the SM and would badly damage our economy.

We CAN refuse entry to people who are legally undesirable or are moving with no intention of working.

By the way, both Norway and Switzerland buy into free movement rules because of the economic advantages that accrue from the resultant tie ins with the EU economy.

[Bentley Bullet]

"What exactly did the EU do, to stymie our Brexit?"

They didn't have to do much at all, about half of our nation did that for them, and probably they thought more than half if they listened to the BBC's propaganda. It certainly wouldn't have made them feel the need to give more in negotiations.

[Bentley Bullet]

Because free movement of workers is integral to being in the Single Market. Every person in the EU has the right to move to other EU countries to work and set up residence. Abrogating that right automatically puts you outside the SM and would badly damage our economy.

We CAN refuse entry to people who are legally undesirable or are moving with no intention of working.

By the way, both Norway and Switzerland buy into free movement rules because of the economic advantages that accrue from the resultant tie ins with the EU economy.

But when we voted to leave the EU we voted to leave the single market.

[BillyStubbsTears]

Because free movement of workers is integral to being in the Single Market. Every person in the EU has the right to move to other EU countries to work and set up residence. Abrogating that right automatically puts you outside the SM and would badly damage our economy.

We CAN refuse entry to people who are legally undesirable or are moving with no intention of working.

By the way, both Norway and Switzerland buy into free movement rules because of the economic advantages that accrue from the resultant tie ins with the EU economy.

But when we voted to leave the EU we voted to leave the single market.

If that's your end point, why the f**k did you ask me that question in the first place?

It's almost as if you're not really interested in discussing things like a grown up and just prefer dicking about.

[BillyStubbsTears]

"What exactly did the EU do, to stymie our Brexit?"

They didn't have to do much at all, about half of our nation did that for them, and probably they thought more than half if they listened to the BBC's propaganda. It certainly wouldn't have made them feel the need to give more in negotiations.

So when you said "the EU has jumped on the bandwagon of support from some of our politicians who have betrayed our democratic vote to leave" you didn't really mean that the EU had done much at all on any practical effect? Is that right?

[Bentley Bullet]

Like I said owd lad, they only had to jump on the bandwagon, and join forces with the undemocratic politicians and their supporters.

[wilts rover]

No Wilts, Those who voted against it didn't consider it to be leaving in the way intended. That doesn't mean they want to betray the democratic vote to leave.

Sorry, again thanks for correcting me BB.

So the Labour and Lib Dem MP's who voted with the ERG against May's deal because they didn't think it was what people had voted for in the referendum are upholding the democratic vote. Whilst the people who voted for May's deal to leave have betrayed it.

Got it now. So our new PM and most of his cabinet, Rees-Mogg, Javid, Rabb, Patel are all betrayers. Who knew.

[BillyStubbsTears]

Like I said owd lad, they only had to jump on the bandwagon, and join forces with the undemocratic politicians and their supporters.

Ok. So you accept that the EU has not done anything practically to stop Brexit. That's good. We're getting somewhere. Finally.

[Bentley Bullet]

Because free movement of workers is integral to being in the Single Market. Every person in the EU has the right to move to other EU countries to work and set up residence. Abrogating that right automatically puts you outside the SM and would badly damage our economy.

We CAN refuse entry to people who are legally undesirable or are moving with no intention of working.

By the way, both Norway and Switzerland buy into free movement rules because of the economic advantages that accrue from the resultant tie ins with the EU economy.

But when we voted to leave the EU we voted to leave the single market.

If that's your end point, why the f**k did you ask me that question in the first place?

It's almost as if you're not really interested in discussing things like a grown up and just prefer dicking about.

What I meant to add was it was because free movement of workers is integral to being in the Single Market why we voted to leave.

[Bentley Bullet]

No Wilts, Those who voted against it didn't consider it to be leaving in the way intended. That doesn't mean they want to betray the democratic vote to leave.

Sorry, again thanks for correcting me BB.

You're welcome.

[Bentley Bullet]

Like I said owd lad, they only had to jump on the bandwagon, and join forces with the undemocratic politicians and their supporters.

Ok. So you accept that the EU has not done anything practically to stop Brexit. That's good. We're getting somewhere. Finally.

How can they stop Brexit? We voted to leave! They might have tried a bit harder to strike a better deal for both parties if they were up against a country that didn't appear to have half of its population on their side.