Ryan backs call to drop referees

[YEP Digital]

Rovers chairman John Ryan has waded into the debate about refereeing standards – and has backed Tony Pulis' call to relegate under-performing whistle-blowers.

\"I think we're the Stoke of the Championship. We're a small team at this level and, going to places like Reading, we do get a rough ride with the officials.

\"They (officials) favour the big clubs because they think it's a better career path for them. It's a case of: 'We better not upset Manchester United or Chelsea, but we don't mind upsetting Doncaster Rovers!'

Click on the link for full interview: http://www.yorkshireeveningpost.co.uk/sport/Doncaster-Rovers-Ryan-backs-call.6635156.jp


 B) B)  B)  B)  B)  B)

[Keenstonian]

Methinks a call from the FA to Sir John will be forthcoming.

[Alan Southstand]

There's one thing for sure, it's not going to improve their decision making (at our games) in the short term.

[DonnyNoel]

Each to his own but it's something I disagree with strongly.

If referees favour big clubs how did it take us 5 years to get out the conference?

Which huge calls went in our favour in L1? Were any bigger than the stonewall penalty that two time European champions Nottm Forest were denied at little Doncaster last year? Did Newcastle not have a man sent off against us last year when the referee could have bottled a yellow?

Relegating referees for continued low performance happens and has always happened.

If

Some of these are referees who should know better

then it goes to show how hard the job is. Football is a highly fluid, low-scoring, low-chances game in which the referee makes dozens of calls a match so he will always (sadly) have the potential to incorrectly influence a game. You can't get rid of this with the game set up as it is.

And who's to say relegating a referee means he's replaced with a better one?

[The Red Baron]

Keenstonian wrote:

Methinks a call from the FA to Sir John will be forthcoming.

As Pulis didn't get charged over his comments, I doubt JR will either.

Not that I think it is the answer. In any case, we'd hardly benefit as we'd get those refs reckoned not to be good enough for the Premier League.

A bit of a moan about refs might not do too much harm though. Stoke were feeling hard done by a week or so ago and on Saturday got the benefit of a highly dubious penalty decision at West Brom. So long as we don't go to the lengths of Neil Lennon and his chairman, of course!

[PDX_Rover]

It seems to me there's a contentious decision every week nowadays, although really, are there that many more bad decisions than there ever were? Maybe. Maybe not.

One thing that could lead to a higher # of bad decisions is is that players are fitter and faster - the game is also faster.  Referees I imagine find it harder to keep up with play.  Also, the number of cameras covering the majority of games in the modern era, the mistakes are magnified.  In the good old days - a mistake was made, it's not filmed so it's not dissected.  I'm sure us who went to OBV back in the 1970s and 80s saw some howlers by refs that were forgotten about the next day....

Having said that, there have been some absolutely awful decisions - Clattenburg's missing the Old Trafford goal, Lampard's goal against Germany in the World Cup... Ridiculous really.

I'm totally in favour of adopting video technology than can be reviewed by a fourth official upon request who can make the call and relay to the lino or ref.  That could, in my view, be achieved quicker and more efficiently than the time it takes players to surround the ref/other officials and seek to influence or contest a decision.  

It would be interesting to watch a televised game and see just how much time is spent sorting out decisions, players complaining to the ref and so on....

[Snods Shinpad 2]

PDX_Rover wrote:

It seems to me there's a contentious decision every week nowadays, although really, are there that many more bad decisions than there ever were? Maybe. Maybe not.

Watching Match of the Day or the FL programme is getting very tedious. Managers and pundits are constantly moaning about refereeing, and subtly hinting that the ref discriminates against their club deliberately. It's just boring to hear about, over and over again. Refs are human, errors are made. That's footy.

As for JR's rants, r.e the Reading ball out of play dispute, if you freeze the picture (which I posted in another thread) and look, it appears that the whole of the ball COULD have crossed the line, but it wasn't clear if it had, and if it's not 100% sure when you look at a still frame for five minutes from directly above the incident, then what chance does a linesman have? In that incident the linesmans call was correct. It was not 100% certain it had crossed the line, so he was spot on letting play continue.

As for the Burnley penalties, well Burnley had a stone cold pen turned away in the first minute. And as for Shiels being ball to hand, well that is questionable too. Put it this way, if those decisions had gone against us at home, there would have been a ten page thread moaning about it on here the day after.

[Superspy]

Snods Shinpad 2 wrote:

PDX_Rover wrote:

As for JR's rants, r.e the Reading ball out of play dispute, if you freeze the picture (which I posted in another thread) and look, it appears that the whole of the ball COULD have crossed the line, but it wasn't clear if it had, and if it's not 100% sure when you look at a still frame for five minutes from directly above the incident, then what chance does a linesman have? In that incident the linesmans call was correct. It was not 100% certain it had crossed the line, so he was spot on letting play continue.

the problem with that particular decision snod, is that if the lineo had sited the reason you just gave, im sure JR, SOD, everyone else who saw it would have been a little more satisfied, but seeing as the linesman said \"i wasn't looking\" when asked about the situation, it makes it difficult to swallow.

[BillyStubbsTears]

PDX_Rover wrote:

It seems to me there's a contentious decision every week nowadays, although really, are there that many more bad decisions than there ever were? Maybe. Maybe not.

One thing that could lead to a higher # of bad decisions is is that players are fitter and faster - the game is also faster.  Referees I imagine find it harder to keep up with play.  Also, the number of cameras covering the majority of games in the modern era, the mistakes are magnified.  In the good old days - a mistake was made, it's not filmed so it's not dissected.  I'm sure us who went to OBV back in the 1970s and 80s saw some howlers by refs that were forgotten about the next day....

Having said that, there have been some absolutely awful decisions - Clattenburg's missing the Old Trafford goal, Lampard's goal against Germany in the World Cup... Ridiculous really.

I'm totally in favour of adopting video technology than can be reviewed by a fourth official upon request who can make the call and relay to the lino or ref.  That could, in my view, be achieved quicker and more efficiently than the time it takes players to surround the ref/other officials and seek to influence or contest a decision.  

It would be interesting to watch a televised game and see just how much time is spent sorting out decisions, players complaining to the ref and so on....

There have ALWAYS been refereeing mistakes. It's part of the game. Like bad team selections, missed open nets, keepers dropping crosses and Carl Alford being a fat get. It's ALWAYS been like that.

These capricious events are what makes football fascinating. The throw of the dice makes it THE most exciting game in the world.

The difference now is two-fold:
1) We have an entire industry of gobshite toss-pots on the box, earning their crust by analysing every single decision in Super-Slo-Mo.
2)Managers and chairmen can use video evidence of refs' mistakes as \"evidence\" that they are not getting a fair deal, and thereby take pressure off themselves.

f**k the lot of them, ours included. I'm sick to the back teeth with the bleating. Refs, at least in this country, are NOT bent. Refs are hard working professionals who make mistakes just like Jamie Coppinger made a mistake on Saturday by not finishing the game off. It happens.

[i_ateallthepies]

Jamie Coppinger didn't make a mistake though did he, he hit the ball well and hit the target.  Did his job, no mistake, but so did the keeper.  It happens.

[Barmby Rover]

We grumble about refs, but be careful, as they are demonstrating in Scotland, without them you don't have a game!

[PDX_Rover]

@BST - So, everyone needs to stop bleating and just get on with it, which would be great but is never going to happen is it?  So.... given that mistakes are highlighted, pundits talk about them, shouldn't the game try to address it by moving with the times?

[DonnyBazR0ver]

First of all we could take the time keeping off them. That is to say the ref signals to 4th official when there is a stoppage. The match clock stops (visible to all). The game ends when 90 mins has elapsed.

We talk about other forms of technology but we can't even get time keeping right yet !

[tommy toes]

Aye. I've often thought we should take a leaf out of basketballs book and make the game 30 mins each way but have a timekeeper  who stops the clock when the ball's not in play. It would stop all the timewasting and general fcking about when the away team's 1-0 up.

[Wellred]

We could make a start by the FA actually giving referees some backing.
Players especially in the premiership treat referees like something they have trodden in.
We have had the respect campaign running for a couple of seasons now and it is an absolute joke. Lets start by players respecting the referee. Let the referees punish dissent with a yellow card.
Week in week out we see players cheating referees by diving and feigning fouls and then their managers have the nerve to complain when decisions don't go their way.
You can't have it all your own way..............unless of course you are Sir Alex

[Filo]

The refs are just as bad in the Champions League, Arsenal have just been denied a stonewall penalty and instead Vela was booked for Diving!

[BillyStubbsTears]

PDX_Rover wrote:

@BST - So, everyone needs to stop bleating and just get on with it, which would be great but is never going to happen is it?  So.... given that mistakes are highlighted, pundits talk about them, shouldn't the game try to address it by moving with the times?

No, no NO!

Because it's a sure-fire way to ruin the game.

Like I've asid before, it's the capricious uncertainty that is the beauty of the game. It's what makes it so fascinating. Refereeing fallibility os a part of that. AND, it evens out over time. That's the aspect that makes men out of football supporters. You learn to live with it.

As with so much else in society over the last 20 years, we've become a society of babbying fannies. Grow-f**king-up and take the knocks on the chin and love the uncertainty of the game.

Or, if you want a game where 95% of the uncertainty is squeezed out (and, as a consequence the better team pretty much always wins) go watch Rugby Union.

[BillyStubbsTears]

Filo wrote:

The refs are just as bad in the Champions League, Arsenal have just been denied a stonewall penalty and instead Vela was booked for Diving!

I've got a sure fire way to end this problem of refs getting it wrong on diving issues.

Managers tell the players to stop f**king well diving and drop them if they do.

Problem vanishes overnight. If a player goes down in the area, it will not be because he has dived, so there's no reason for the refs to get it wrong.

It's farcical. Players have become consumate cheats. Managers connive it it with their \"No, Ah did not see zat\" comments, and the acceptance of players practicing cheating on the training ground. THEN the managers, players and chairmen whine like babbies when the refs get decisions wrong.

I wonder where the blame lies?

[bobjimwilly]

Wellred wrote:

We could make a start by the FA actually giving referees some backing.
Players especially in the premiership treat referees like something they have trodden in.
We have had the respect campaign running for a couple of seasons now and it is an absolute joke. Lets start by players respecting the referee. Let the referees punish dissent with a yellow card.
Week in week out we see players cheating referees by diving and feigning fouls and then their managers have the nerve to complain when decisions don't go their way.
You can't have it all your own way..............unless of course you are Sir Alex

Totally agree with you wellred. Just look at Rugby Union and the respect shown to referees!
When I played Rugby back in the day it was drilled into you from an early age to do everything the referee said. And even if you simply swore, even if not at the ref, your team was penalised 10 yards, and again if you complained. I tell thee, players soon shut up when they realised complaining got you sent back towards your own try line! Also, the only people allowed to speak to the ref was the captain. Anyone else tried speaking or complaining to him, again the team is penalised.

Imagaine how Rooney would react if a free kick was given against him for swearing? He'd moan like a little bitch  

[BobG]

BillyStubbsTears wrote:

As with so much else in society over the last 20 years, we've become a society of babbying fannies. Grow-fcuking-up and take the knocks on the chin and love the uncertainty of the game.

How exceedingly, extremely true Billy! Yes, yes yes! It's yet another symptom of the 'I want it now and I want it all' selfishness engendered and encouraged over the last 30 years. Christ on a bike! This nation has legislated away risk, judgement, experience, growth and maturity. Now we have folk wanting to legislate away mistakes too. When was the last time anyone heard the phrase 'it was an accident' used in relation to just about anything? It's always some other buggers' fault. It can't be just one of those things can it? Why do we insist these days on someone, anyone (except ourselves of course) always having to be 'responsible'?

BobG