Brexit Negotiations

[Axholme Lion]

I voted leave for the long term benefit of my country, unlike I suspect most remainers who voted for short term perceived benefit in their wallets. True patriots eh?

[bobjimwilly]

Well, at least we'll be able to buy more cheap steel etc from China and put more British workers out of work without fear of the dastardly EU looking after the interest of it's member states...

Are they the sort of long term benefits you mean? Because there are certainly going to be no long-term economic benefits?

[Axholme Lion]

Like the EU helped the British motor industry when BMW screwed over Rover?

[Sprotyrover]

Like the EU helped the British motor industry when BMW screwed over Rover?
[/quot

Oh you mean like when Bayer bought out ICI and then shut all is factories down making us reliant on German produced Medication!

[Sprotyrover]

Like the EU helped the British motor industry when BMW screwed over Rover?

Or when Germany moved the production of Bendicks mint chocolates from Winchester to zer fatterland!

[DonnyOsmond]

I voted leave for the long term benefit of my country, unlike I suspect most remainers who voted for short term perceived benefit in their wallets. True patriots eh?

Our country or London? The EU supports farmers, the EU gives funding to areas like ours so we can have developments like Cast. The British government gives us austerity, in turn shit load of homeless people on our streets, the British government gives us the shambles that is Northern Rail.

[BillyStubbsTears]

Like the EU helped the British motor industry when BMW screwed over Rover?
[/quot

Oh you mean like when Bayer bought out ICI and then shut all is factories down making us reliant on German produced Medication!

Remind me when that happened.

[BillyStubbsTears]

And of course, when we have our Glorious Hard Brexit and sign free-trade agreements with the USA, there'll be no way that hostile takeovers will occur with American companies buying out British institutions and then  immediately closing down factories that they had promised to keep open.

Like....


...errrr...


Kraft taking over Cadbury's for example.

It's business.
It happens.
Unless you want to out machine guns on the South coast and become Fortress Britain, you accept that there are international mergers and takeovers.

Perhaps if our industries were a bit better run, we might be in a position to takeover a few in Germany.

[Boomstick]

Boomstick

You really haven't got a clue have you? I don't know where you get this comic book concept of what people on the Left believe, but it is infantile in the extreme.

And a weak economic argument? You reckon the projected loss of £150bn economic output every single year is a weak case? You reckon it won't affect South Yorkshire? You are away with the fairies man. South Yorkshire and the post-industrial North will be the first regions to be hit and will be hit harder and for longer than anywhere else. Just as we have been in every economic slump in living memory.

Where do you think our jobs and our livings come from? Why do you think they would be protected from the sort of economic hit that usually only comes from losing a major war?

Nothing you ranted on about there has any substance whatsoever, the more you rant won't win you the argument.

Are you saying we should remain in order to protect big business, as they are what creates the jobs?
Surely as a lefty, that is the opposite of your ideoligy, scooby doo was less confused than you.

[wilts rover]

Like the EU helped the British motor industry when BMW screwed over Rover?
[/quot

Oh you mean like when Bayer bought out ICI and then shut all is factories down making us reliant on German produced Medication!

Or when the EU closed our coal mines, railway works and steel works because they could buy cheaper from abroad - oh hang on....

Capitalists don't like the effects of capitalism shock!

[BillyStubbsTears]

Boomstick. You really need to get over these infant school stereotypes. Meet some real people. Talk to them. Listen to them. There's a complex world out there.

[SydneyRover]

''Brexiteers are subverting language to obscure the truth, Trump-style''

Nothing new there then?

“A lie can travel halfway around the world while the truth is still putting on its shoes,” Mark Twain is said to have warned. In this era of social media, let’s make that all the way round the world while the truth is still looking for its socks''

''During the recent febrile weeks in London, Brussels bureaucracy has been superseded by “Brussels bullying” and “Brussels blackmail”, two fictional creations invented with a view to dismissing the reasonable compromise negotiated by Theresa May''

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2018/nov/20/brexiteers-trump-language-fake-news

[Boomstick]

Boomstick. You really need to get over these infant school stereotypes. Meet some real people. Talk to them. Listen to them. There's a complex world out there.

Is that all you can come up with? Pretty sure I've offered to buy you a drink recently ?

[SydneyRover]

Wow it just gets worse-if that's possible!

''The UK will be “frozen out” of EU decisions on no fewer than 182 new rules in the months after Brexit, a new analysis says, including over budget spending, road signs and drinking water.

The full scale of fresh regulations in the pipeline – during Theresa May’s planned 21-month transition period – exposes the blunder of making Britain “a rule-taker, not a rule-maker”, it warns''

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/brexit-news-theresa-may-transition-period-deal-rules-meps-eu-council-parliament-a8643461.html

[Axholme Lion]

I voted leave for the long term benefit of my country, unlike I suspect most remainers who voted for short term perceived benefit in their wallets. True patriots eh?

Our country or London? The EU supports farmers, the EU gives funding to areas like ours so we can have developments like Cast. The British government gives us austerity, in turn shit load of homeless people on our streets, the British government gives us the shambles that is Northern Rail.

Most farmers are greedy, tight fisted 'people' who would rather pay peanuts to Romanians to live ten to a caravan after working all hours, rather than pay a decent wage to our own. I have no sympathy for them.

[Axholme Lion]

Unless you want to out machine guns on the South coast and become Fortress Britain, you accept that there are international mergers and takeovers.

At last you speak some sense. That would do nicely.

[Axholme Lion]

Perhaps if our industries were a bit better run, we might be in a position to takeover a few in Germany.
[/quote]

Are these the same businesses that we are all supposed to listen to and bow down to because they know best about what Brexit deal we should have?

[SydneyRover]

Surprise!

Brexit - live: Senior Tories leave door open to new referendum as Theresa May heads to Brussels for last-ditch talks

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/brexit-live-latest-update-pmqs-theresa-may-deal-jeremy-corbyn-eu-second-referendum-a8644116.html

[Not Now Kato]

Perhaps if our industries were a bit better run, we might be in a position to takeover a few in Germany.

Are these the same businesses that we are all supposed to listen to and bow down to because they know best about what Brexit deal we should have?

Perhaps you should read this and understand why our industries lag behind France and Germany etc....   http://www.bbc.co.uk/history/british/modern/marshall_01.shtml
 

[Axholme Lion]

https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/221747

Get signed up for this.

[Not Now Kato]

https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/221747

Get signed up for this.

Only the brain dead would sign that.  Seems there's at least 44,526 brain dead people already!

[Axholme Lion]

https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/221747

Get signed up for this.

Only the brain dead would sign that.  Seems there's at least 44,526 brain dead people already!

Are you?

It makes me laugh that you remainiacs seem to believe that your views are held by the majority in the country, when they are clearly not. You have had your EU love in for the past forty odd years, but even that is not enough. you want to inflict even more decades of pain on us.

[Not Now Kato]

https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/221747

Get signed up for this.

Only the brain dead would sign that.  Seems there's at least 44,526 brain dead people already!

Are you?
 
It makes me laugh that you remainiacs seem to believe that your views are held by the majority in the country, when they are clearly not. You have had your EU love in for the past forty odd years, but even that is not enough. you want to inflict even more decades of pain on us.

Have you got the first clue as to what would happen to the UK if we simply walked away right now?

[Glyn_Wigley]

Here is a question for our resident specialist political posters.
I keep hearing that we have three options available to us, one being a new referendum.
If it did go to another vote and somehow turned out to still be “leave” what would the situation be then.
Obviously we would still proceed with leave but what would then happen about a deal or no deal.
Would it be any different from the position it is currently.

The question wouldn't be just 'Leave' though. It'd be for a specific version of 'Leave'.

Glyn, isn’t that where we are now though.
We currently have leave and various groups are trying to argue their case for a specific version of leave.
No difference as far as I can see.
So back to my question, what would be the difference if a second vote still came up with leave.

Glyn to respond please.

The difference is that the public would be able to say which of the versions of Leave being argued about (or otherwise) they want. Because the question would the different and therefore it isn't the same referendum being run.

Ok, thanks.
However, if the politicians themselves can’t agree on which is the best option how can the less well informed public make a decision on which is best.

Ignorance of the electorate is no objection to the validity of the 2016 vote though, is it?

No of course not, but I see that you are avoiding answering the questions.

Are you indeed a politician.

The answer to your question is obvious - the result (whatever it is) of any new vote would supercede the previous vote. Just like votes in any other election or even votes in Parliament.

[Glyn_Wigley]

One benefit would be to sit back and watch serious harm come to the German car industry.

Yeah, they'll really get hit hard when the British car industry is more competitive than them in the UK. Perhaps the knowledge that they'll also be more competitive than the British car industry in 27 other countries might help them dry their tears. Some benefit, eh?

[Bentley Bullet]

If there are no BMW's in the UK what will all the t**ts drive?

[Glyn_Wigley]

If there are no BMW's in the UK what will all the t**ts drive?

The car in front me, as usual.

[Herbert Anchovy]

Only a maniac would believe that there’s no risks to leaving the EU. However I really hoped that, as a country, we would be brave enough and show the endeavour required to make it a success. But we’re not, nowhere near.

Here’s a tangible example

Around a year ago I was doing some work for a SME organisation in the West Midlands and the M.D. of that organisation was telling me how they’re continually being undercut by cheaper rivals in the EU. He was incredibly frustrated that he was unable to substantially extend his market outside of Europe, particularly into the US due to EU competition & trade rules. His opinion was the EU isn’t a level playing field so saw real opportunities once we left.

Unfortunately, it seems that what could have been a fantastic opportunity for UK organisations such as this one, we’re making such a hash of it that nobody is going to benefit! Consequently, if this is the best that our government can do then we’re better off in.

Instead, all we’re getting are two groups of people shouting “I’m right” at each other.

[SydneyRover]

Only a maniac would believe that there’s no risks to leaving the EU. However I really hoped that, as a country, we would be brave enough and show the endeavour required to make it a success. But we’re not, nowhere near.

Here’s a tangible example

Around a year ago I was doing some work for a SME organisation in the West Midlands and the M.D. of that organisation was telling me how they’re continually being undercut by cheaper rivals in the EU. He was incredibly frustrated that he was unable to substantially extend his market outside of Europe, particularly into the US due to EU competition & trade rules. His opinion was the EU isn’t a level playing field so saw real opportunities once we left.

Unfortunately, it seems that what could have been a fantastic opportunity for UK organisations such as this one, we’re making such a hash of it that nobody is going to benefit! Consequently, if this is the best that our government can do then we’re better off in.

Instead, all we’re getting are two groups of people shouting “I’m right” at each other.

''Only a maniac would believe that there’s no risks to leaving the EU. However I really hoped that, as a country, we would be brave enough and show the endeavour required to make it a success. But we’re not, nowhere near''

Surely by now HA you understand that any successes gained in leaving (your only one example other this this anecdotal one is about re-nationalising rail, of which most could be achieved now without leaving) would be dwarfed by the benefits of staying.

''Around a year ago I was doing some work for a SME organisation in the West Midlands and the M.D. of that organisation was telling me how they’re continually being undercut by cheaper rivals in the EU. He was incredibly frustrated that he was unable to substantially extend his market outside of Europe, particularly into the US due to EU competition & trade rules. His opinion was the EU isn’t a level playing field so saw real opportunities once we left''

Why if this SME is being undercut by a company within the EU wouldn't it be undercut outside the EU also, is the EU the only place to make theses ''widgets''?

[SydneyRover]

Perhaps if our industries were a bit better run, we might be in a position to takeover a few in Germany.

Are these the same businesses that we are all supposed to listen to and bow down to because they know best about what Brexit deal we should have?

Perhaps you should read this and understand why our industries lag behind France and Germany etc....   http://www.bbc.co.uk/history/british/modern/marshall_01.shtml

Thanks NNK, very interesting read.