How Rovers are perceived nowadays

[Barmby Rover]

This headline surprised me a bit, are Rovers a "big club" now? Maybe we have advanced a bit. Maybe TLOD is now just our construct! https://www.crewealex.net/news/2021/march/another-big-club-arriving-in-doncaster/

[Donnybob]

If you accept that the Sunderland and Ipswiches, Pompey, too, are just on holiday at this level, as were Leeds, Wednesday, United and others with a top level pedigree to look back on, then among the perennial inhabitants of this parish we are a big club, but specifically at this level.

We have a superb stadium, generate decent income streams and attract some top class loanees. We are easily capable of attracting higher than average attendances providing you rule out the aforementioned refugees.

[Campsall rover]

This headline surprised me a bit, are Rovers a "big club" now? Maybe we have advanced a bit. Maybe TLOD is now just our construct! https://www.crewealex.net/news/2021/march/another-big-club-arriving-in-doncaster/

Behind Sunderland, Charlton, Portsmouth and Ipswich we are as big or bigger than anyone else in our League.

Wigan have had a spell in the Premier League recently but please do not tell me they are a bigger club than us as they were batting well above their station when they achieved that. It was only Whelans millions that got them there. They are now in a mess.
Blackpool were a biggish club and have flirted with the top league recently but you have to go back to the fifties and  sixties to call them a big club. I would regard us as an equal to them now definitely.

So yes if you look at the history of clubs in the last 15/ 20 years and ave attendances then in this league we are a biggish club.
We have not been TLOD since we left the Conference in all reality have we?  Not imo.

I missed out Hull but they do not count as they have a viper as
Manager.

[Dutch Uncle]

It is certainly a different perspective from Crewe's point of view from 2002-03, when we were on our way to winning promotion via the Conference playoffs. In that season we went to Gresty Road in the AMC (maybe called DAF/Leyland Trophy in those days) and we lost 0-8 with a teen-aged Dean Ashton scoring a hattrick.

[Stocksbridge Owl]

Until very recently I’d not given Donny Rovers much thought for the past 30 odd years. I used to occasionally watch Donny with a Rovers supporting mate in the 80’s. You had a pretty good team then. The Snodins, Colin Douglas, Ernie Moss were playing for you at the time and I believe you were promoted this particular season as I recall? Although you were promoted and had a very good side, I seem to remember that attendances were around 3-4 thousand?

Jump forward 30 years or so and you’re now getting considerably more fans in the ‘gate’, you’ve a much, much better stadium and I’m sure, a much better team. I’d say that Donny have grown from being one of the smaller clubs in the old Div 3, to one of the bigger clubs in League 1. Back then, I’d put Donny in the same bracket as Scunny, York City, Chesterfield etc.. Now, I’d say you’re in a similar bracket as Hull, Barnsley, and Rotherham.

What does a ‘big club’ mean though? From my experience people who claim they support a bigger club generally mean that they used to be good! You could argue that Wednesdays are a bigger club than Donny, however on the pitch I think I could say with a large degree of confidence that you would give us a footballing lesson right now.

[DonnyOsmond]

In terms of League One we are well established and are regularly fighting for the play off places. We're similar to Peterborough, were both nowadays bigger clubs at this level. If we go up there will be 20+ teams bigger than us though.

[RoversAlias]

It's all relative isn't it? To Crewe we are perhaps a bigger club for this level, and I do think our size ranks probably as around 45-55th biggest in England, which is about right for us being a top half League One side. Chorley and FC United will have thought we were massive clubs for instance, but Championship regulars not so much.

[Campsall rover]

In terms of League One we are well established and are regularly fighting for the play off places. We're similar to Peterborough, were both nowadays bigger clubs at this level. If we go up there will be 20+ teams bigger than us though.

We consistently get better gates than Peterborough. Even when on the  VERY FEW  occasions they are above us in the league we still get better gates. Their pricing structure could be a factor but In all honesty i still think we are a bigger club than them even though McAnthony may think otherwise.

Opinions Opinions. What is the definition of a big club of course or a bigger one than someone else.
We have had this debate many times.

[i_ateallthepies]

I'm with you on this, Campsall.  TLO Wigan were traditionally no bigger than us until they had the Whelan millions that put them in a false position in the football pyramid.  For me though club size isn't simply about how high in the pyramid a team is playing but is about the size of their following.  Size of the club membership effectively.

Admittedly, sustained success in terms of league position will increase the size of the following but by just how much will be determined by factors such as the size of the town they're from and how many (and how big) other clubs are in the locality... something the Rovers have always struggled to overcome.

So, TLO Sheff' Wednesday are a bigger club than us because of the size of their following mostly due to the size of the town (City) they draw their following from and because of their historical success.

[scawsby steve]

I'm with you on this, Campsall.  TLO Wigan were traditionally no bigger than us until they had the Whelan millions that put them in a false position in the football pyramid.  For me though club size isn't simply about how high in the pyramid a team is playing but is about the size of their following.  Size of the club membership effectively.

Admittedly, sustained success in terms of league position will increase the size of the following but by just how much will be determined by factors such as the size of the town they're from and how many (and how big) other clubs are in the locality... something the Rovers have always struggled to overcome.

So, TLO Sheff' Wednesday are a bigger club than us because of the size of their following mostly due to the size of the town (City) they draw their following from and because of their historical success.

Totally agree with all that, which is why it's such a mystery to me that smaller towns than us, such as Barnsley, Burnley, and Blackburn, should have bigger, better supported clubs than us.

[Branton Rover]

None of the others had an arsonist in charge

[Bentley Bullet]

They have bigger support because, like the lyric from the old song "Friggin in the riggin", there's f**k all else to do.

[Campsall rover]

Burnley were a top tier 1 side in the early 60s and have been in the top league at various times since. Although a town of only 80.000 population they draw support from quite a large catchment including Skipton and Keighley areas in Yorkshire.

Blackburn have spent 95% of their time in the top 2 tiers. So hence their support.

Well Barnsley as BB said, what on earth else is there to do in Barnsley.
No offence Tyke.

[Bentley Bullet]

Barnsley folk don't ask for much. As long as they have enough money for chips and beer and footy, and a few bob put by for their annual weeks holiday in Donny, they're content with their lot in life.

[Branton Rover]

We suffered with zero ambition in the 80’s selling any half decent player for next to nowt Snodin brothers, Deane, Redfearn etc the assets we did sell had no sell on clauses meaning we missed out twice - we were basically bankrupt as the 90’s rolled round and we went on another selling spree Rankine, Brevett, Raven, Limber etc the latter sold to stave off a winding up order from the revenue - add to this feeling of general malaise and decline we had Belle Vue which was on its last legs in the 80’s but would ultimately limp on into the new century - then came our disastrous association with the arsonist - it wasn’t until we’d lost our league spot and JR came in we had any ambition but the damage of neglect from the previous 20 years showed as we had to establish a whole new fan base as local youngsters migrated to other clubs Wednesday - Leeds etc.

[Bentley Bullet]

I think I'm right in saying that back in the 60's Rovers' home attendances in the 4th division were highest in that division and higher than any club in the third division, and about half-way highest in the second division.

[DMnumber4]

Rovers are a top ten L1 side and that's probably where they belong on the balance of history.

Mixing it with the likes of Sunderland and Pompey, in particular, in trying to get in to the top six is great. Throw in a third round tie - League or FA Cup - per season and I'm sure everyone would be suitably satisfied.

Sure beats being the whipping boys of the Championship.

[Getridorit]

Always makes me cringe the TLOD thing.

Kinda worked in the first season back in tier 2, but that's it.

Calling ourselves TLOD is almost holding us back, and doing ourselves a disservice.
we've moved on from all the "going for it" and "destination championship" nonsense.

We are one of the big clubs below championship level.
Lets recognise that!

[DMnumber4]

Always makes me cringe the TLOD thing.

Kinda worked in the first season back in tier 2, but that's it.

Calling ourselves TLOD is almost holding us back, and doing ourselves a disservice.
we've moved on from all the "going for it" and "destination championship" nonsense.

We are one of the big clubs below championship level.
Lets recognise that!

You'd hope other teams fear coming to the Keepmoat where, since the start of the 18/19 season, Rovers have lost just 10 league games out of 59.

[Bentley Bullet]

I also don't like the TLOD slogan. It makes us sound like we're trying to prove a point with a big chip on our shoulders.

[Branton Rover]

Don’t think we were ever the whipping boys of the Championship - we were ultra competitive under SOD & if we’d had a more experienced manager than Dickov we’d have stayed up 2014 - Dickov used to play every game to win and had he been more pragmatic like SOD who used to say every point gained in the Championship was a good point - we’d have stayed up comfortably.

[Dutch Uncle]

I think I'm right in saying that back in the 60's Rovers' home attendances in the 4th division were highest in that division and higher than any club in the third division, and about half-way highest in the second division.

You are right in that compared with other clubs we were relatively well supported in those days, but not by quite as much as you say, BB.

In our two title winning seasons of 1965-66 and 1968-69 we averaged about 10400 and 10200 (sources vary slightly) and these were our highest seasonal averages.

I still have have the Playfair annuals from those seasons and in 1965-66 and according to average home attendances we were the best supported club in Division 4, there were only 4 higher averages in Division 3 (Hull best with nearly 23000), and we were higher than 3 in Division 2 (Rotherham, Bury and Leyton Orient).

In 1968-69 it was nearly the same. We were second best supported team in Division 4 very closely behind Southend, there were 5 higher averages in Division 3 (Swindon best with nearly 18000) and again there were three lower averages in Division 2 (Huddersfiled, Carlisle, Bury).

   

[moses]

Puts tin hat on...

Comparing us Wigan
Are we not in a ‘false’ position due to the millions our owners have poured in?

[Bentley Bullet]

I think I'm right in saying that back in the 60's Rovers' home attendances in the 4th division were highest in that division and higher than any club in the third division, and about half-way highest in the second division.

You are right in that compared with other clubs we were relatively well supported in those days, but not by quite as much as you say, BB.

In our two title winning seasons of 1965-66 and 1968-69 we averaged about 10400 and 10200 (sources vary slightly) and these were our highest seasonal averages.

I still have have the Playfair annuals from those seasons and in 1965-66 and according to average home attendances we were the best supported club in Division 4, there were only 4 higher averages in Division 3 (Hull best with nearly 23000), and we were higher than 3 in Division 2 (Rotherham, Bury and Leyton Orient).

In 1968-69 it was nearly the same. We were second best supported team in Division 4 very closely behind Southend, there were 5 higher averages in Division 3 (Swindon best with nearly 18000) and again there were three lower averages in Division 2 (Huddersfiled, Carlisle, Bury).

   

Thanks for the info Dutch.

[River Don]

I havent stopped to think about it lately.

To me Rovers natural position is firmly Div 4. Crumbling terraces, Satdi Santa singing 'The leagues the wrong way up! " Ken Avis reminding people not to smoke in the main stand. The main event after the black terrace humour, which was a joy to listen to, was the pie and peas which were very good.

Nowadays though, all that is actually becoming a distant memory.

[Campsall rover]

It is certainly a different perspective from Crewe's point of view from 2002-03, when we were on our way to winning promotion via the Conference playoffs. In that season we went to Gresty Road in the AMC (maybe called DAF/Leyland Trophy in those days) and we lost 0-8 with a teen-aged Dean Ashton scoring a hattrick.

Remember it well Dutch as I was there.  Score should have been 10-6 really. We missed a bag full of sitters.
Crazy game it was. Like pin ball on a football pitch. Crewe took their chance and we didn’t.
8-0 made us look as if we were hammered which I suppose we were, but the score line wasn’t a reflection of the game.

[Getridorit]

I havent stopped to think about it lately.

To me Rovers natural position is firmly Div 4. Crumbling terraces, Satdi Santa singing 'The leagues the wrong way up! " Ken Avis reminding people not to smoke in the main stand. The main event after the black terrace humour, which was a joy to listen to, was the pie and peas which were very good.

Nowadays though, all that is actually becoming a distant memory.

Great memories but
Nowadays our natural position, is top half league 1.

[BobG]

I'm with you River Don. During my lifetime, Rovers have been predominantly  a Division 4 team with Div 4 attendances and Div 4 players. There has been the occasional exception of course but this current stay in Division 3 needs to go on longer yet before it overhadows what went before.

Cheers

BobG

[Campsall rover]

I'm with you River Don. During my lifetime, Rovers have been predominantly  a Division 4 team with Div 4 attendances and Div 4 players. There has been the occasional exception of course but this current stay in Division 3 needs to go on longer yet before it overhadows what went before.

Cheers

BobG

Of the last 18 seasons Bob we have had 5 in the Championship 12 in League 1 and 1 in league 2

Bottom tier days are a distant memory and long may it continue. The one season recent blip should never have happened.

[Barmby Rover]

I agree Bob, Rovers were always Div 4 a lot of the time when I was a kid, then after the excursion to the Conference we had big ambitions. These were born out, and we have been lucky to be where we are now as an aftermath of the JR era. Short memories make us a "big club" to teams like Crewe now, pity they didn't lay down and die for us on Tuesday though!