Ukraine

[SydneyRover]

                                                    .

[normal rules]

I really don’t like this recent response from Putin.
There is already outside interference in Ukraine on a massive scale. So why is there no response now?
I wonder what he speaks of? Where in gods name is his head at the moment? Up his own arse I reckon.

The Sarmat 2 ICBM is the stuff of nightmares.
One missile and that’s the uk gone. Everything. Everyone. All living things. No where to run or hide. And to be frank, why would you want to survive such a thing?
I never thought I would hear this shit again in my lifetime.
It seems very real.
I hope it isn’t.

[SydneyRover]

''A former head of the Polish army has accused Boris Johnson of “tempting evil” by revealing that Ukrainian soldiers were being trained in Poland in how to use British anti-aircraft missiles before returning with them to Ukraine.

Gen Waldemar Skrzypczak, also a former junior defence minister, complained that a loose-lipped prime minister had revealed too much to the Russians and that his remarks risked the safety of the soldiers involved.

Speaking to Polish tabloid Fakt, Skrzypczak said that Johnson had revealed “a military secret” and that “bad words are on the lips” when he gave details of the Ukrainian training plan on a trip to India last week.

“Military training is a matter of the army, in such a situation secret. Let a man restrain himself and think before he says such things,” said the former general to the newspaper, which described his tone as irritated in an article from Friday.''

from the Guardian. (ownership held by the Scott trust)

Johnson has a history of shooting from the lip as Zaghari-Ratcliffe and family found to their cost,

[big fat yorkshire pudding]

Did he criticise Biden too? He talked about it a month ago.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.cnn.com/cnn/2022/03/29/politics/us-troops-poland-ukraine/index.html

[SydneyRover]

I don't know did he?

[normal rules]

Let’s face it. We are at war with Russia in all but name.
If Russia’s land Army continues to be depleted like it is, at the hands of western supplied weapons, and putins oil empire crumbles around him, I’d say that would be an existential threat to Russia.
And Putin has made it very clear from the outset what will happen at that point.
Ben Wallace writing this off as distraction tactics by Russia is either a very calculated, brave or very, very stupid conception, which could risk the lives of all of us.

Sitting back and watching Russia invade Ukraine would have been a difficult thing to do, but as this conflict wears on with its obvious growing threat to the wider world, I’m beginning to think that may have been a better option.

Ask yourself this. If Russia drops bombs in Poland along the supply route for western weapons. What then?
The combined forces of NATO will crumple what is left of Russia’s land Army.
Then Russia would definitely be in existential threat territory.
Dumb ass soldiers sat in deep underground bunkers that, without question, will start pressing buttons with pre determined targets, and no amount of diplomacy will stop it.
Those living in The UK have around 20 minutes to make good what would be left of their lives.

[Filo]

Let’s face it. We are at war with Russia in all but name.
If Russia’s land Army continues to be depleted like it is, at the hands of western supplied weapons, and putins oil empire crumbles around him, I’d say that would be an existential threat to Russia.
And Putin has made it very clear from the outset what will happen at that point.
Ben Wallace writing this off as distraction tactics by Russia is either a very calculated, brave or very, very stupid conception, which could risk the lives of all of us.

Sitting back and watching Russia invade Ukraine would have been a difficult thing to do, but as this conflict wears on with its obvious growing threat to the wider world, I’m beginning to think that may have been a better option.

Ask yourself this. If Russia drops bombs in Poland along the supply route for western weapons. What then?
The combined forces of NATO will crumple what is left of Russia’s land Army.
Then Russia would definitely be in existential threat territory.
Dumb ass soldiers sat in deep underground bunkers that, without question, will start pressing buttons with pre determined targets, and no amount of diplomacy will stop it.
Those living in The UK have around 20 minutes to make good what would be left of their lives.

It would also be a stupid move by Russia, knowing that somewhere under sea not far from Moscow there will be UK, and US Submarines lurking with nuclear weapons already trained on Moscow and other major City’s, it would also see the end of Russia

[SydneyRover]

'Sitting back and watching' has a flaw in it, what happens when the next bully comes along?

[normal rules]

'Sitting back and watching' has a flaw in it, what happens when the next bully comes along?

It’s a difficult one.
Then the school bully sets fire to the whole school, with everyone in it .

[ravenrover]

I see MissTrusst is stoking the fires, we must be strong Russia must be cleared from ALL of Ukraine
Is this the start of her leadership campaign?

[River Don]

Putin's oil empire isn't crumbling yet. Since the invasion and sky high energy prices, he's actually been coining it in.

[normal rules]

Russia’s state owned Rosneft failed to find enough buyers to fill a fleet of oil tankers last week. 38 million barrels of oil unsold.

[Stocksbridge Owl]

It’s a high risk game played by both sides. However, one thing that we seem to know about Putin is that he respects strength and deplores weakness in any shape. That’s why I suspect that NATO are gradually increasing the rhetoric and flexing its muscles. Putin, and his generals will understand that a war with NATO is a war that they cannot win (both conventional and nuclear) therefore they’re gradually removing this option for him by playing him at his own game; of making existential threats to enemies.

The main problem Putin now has is that this terrible war has shown the world that Russian armed forces are not the ‘superpower’ that many thought it was. Against huge odds the Ukraine has shone a light on their very significant weaknesses. This plays right into the hands of NATO. I think that we are approaching the end of finding a ‘get out’ card for Putin to withdraw whilst saving face and are now entering a new phase where there’s actually a chance that Ukraine will win with backing from other nations.

The moment that we begin to hear Russian leaders talking about ‘negotiated ends to the conflict’ is the moment they realise that they can’t win…and will become a closed state.

[River Don]

Russia’s state owned Rosneft failed to find enough buyers to fill a fleet of oil tankers last week. 38 million barrels of oil unsold.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2022/apr/27/russia-doubles-fossil-fuel-revenues-since-invasion-of-ukraine-began

[River Don]

There are suggestions this may descend into a protracted war, as many wars do.

That is likely to mean continued high energy prices, a dramatic fall  in living standards in the West, famine and migration from the developing world, recession in China. And Russians would continue struggling with sanctions which will only bite harder as time progresses.

At least though, there would be time for Putin to fall one way or another.

And I suppose there would be a real hard impetus for the world to find real affordable alternatives to fossil fuels.

It would be grim but we might at least avoid Armageddon.

[Filo]

I don’t get why the whole world couldn’t see the the flaw in reliance on Russian gas, while Putin was in charge there, he’s worked on this situation for years

[River Don]

Russian fossil fuels were the path of least resistance.

The known technology we have long used. And we told ourselves that because Russia was trading and opening up to the world, it would change and become westernised.

[Filo]

Russian fossil fuels were the path of least resistance.

The known technology we have long used. And we told ourselves that because Russia was trading and opening up to the world, it would change and become westernised.

Not a chance while a former KGB agent is in charge, he’s played the West big time

[SydneyRover]

I see MissTrusst is stoking the fires, we must be strong Russia must be cleared from ALL of Ukraine
Is this the start of her leadership campaign?

Yes, there's a khaki election on at the moment here.

[SydneyRover]

Oz ABC reporter in Georgia reporting that 10s of thousands of Russians have fled there and are protesting about Putin.

[normal rules]

Russia’s state owned Rosneft failed to find enough buyers to fill a fleet of oil tankers last week. 38 million barrels of oil unsold.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2022/apr/27/russia-doubles-fossil-fuel-revenues-since-invasion-of-ukraine-began

Panic buying by those eu states still willing to do business with Gazprom.
It won’t last.

[Bristol Red Rover]

Let’s face it. We are at war with Russia in all but name.
If Russia’s land Army continues to be depleted like it is, at the hands of western supplied weapons....

Ukraine is using mainly non western weapons, but its a nice bit of propaganda to suggest otherwise.

Also, what proportopn of Ukraines forces have been killed/injured? Fact is we don't know the losses on either side, but we do know that both sides are killing each other. How weak are the Ukraine front lines becoming? I say this and oould go on, not to big up Russia but to make it clear that there's a lot of misinformation out there about the successes of the Ukraines. It's blatent propaganda.

[BillyStubbsTears]

And this is what happens when people consume so much propaganda that they deny the concept of Objective Truth.

BRR.

Do you accept:
1) Russia attempted to occupy Kiev and were totally defeated, leading to an absolute withdrawal?
2) Elsewhere, after 9 weeks of horrific fighting, Russian forces have advanced no more than a few 10s of miles from their pre-Feb positions?
3) Meanwhile Russia has unleashed massive artillery barrages against civillian areas?
4) Russia has lost over 500 front line tanks and over 3000 military vehicles in total?

Those are all unarguable facts. I assume you don't deny any of them?

[normal rules]

Another fact. 80% of Russia’s land army are conscripts.

Many of them very young men with little training.
Ukraine’s army is much different. Better trained. Much more resolute. Better organised.
Added to this is a defensive force is always harder to defeat than an offensive one. Think Rourkes Drift. In eastern Ukraine there are troops that have been dug in for the last 8 years.
Add morale to all this. Many Russian troops have been hoodwinked into this whole saga. Being told they would be welcomed by Ukrainians with open arms. Psychologically that’s going to hurt. Many of them will be defeated before they even get started.

But I’m not niaive enough to know that superior firepower and sheer numbers will win this conflict. It’s just what the exact winning will look like for Ukraine.

[normal rules]

Here is an interesting strategic overview by the Hudson Institute.
He predicts the Dneiper River could become Ukraine’s Berlin Wall with Ukraine effectively split into West and East. With Russia controlling the East. And what’s left of Ukraine constantly fighting for independance. Perhaps this is Putins long term strategy?

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=&ved=2ahUKEwic09fc4Lj3AhVOPcAKHe1-A5EQFnoECAYQAQ&url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.hudson.org%2Fresearch%2F17637-a-winning-strategy-in-ukraine&usg=AOvVaw2mRcqat92N9O8AY7oGCuFY

[River Don]

Let’s face it. We are at war with Russia in all but name.
If Russia’s land Army continues to be depleted like it is, at the hands of western supplied weapons....

Ukraine is using mainly non western weapons, but its a nice bit of propaganda to suggest otherwise.

Also, what proportopn of Ukraines forces have been killed/injured? Fact is we don't know the losses on either side, but we do know that both sides are killing each other. How weak are the Ukraine front lines becoming? I say this and oould go on, not to big up Russia but to make it clear that there's a lot of misinformation out there about the successes of the Ukraines. It's blatent propaganda.

MoD intelligence was claiming approximately for every 3 Russian losses the Ukrainians were losing 1.

Mind you I saw that stat weeks ago

[River Don]

Another fact. 80% of Russia’s land army are conscripts.

Many of them very young men with little training.
Ukraine’s army is much different. Better trained. Much more resolute. Better organised.
Added to this is a defensive force is always harder to defeat than an offensive one. Think Rourkes Drift. In eastern Ukraine there are troops that have been dug in for the last 8 years.
Add morale to all this. Many Russian troops have been hoodwinked into this whole saga. Being told they would be welcomed by Ukrainians with open arms. Psychologically that’s going to hurt. Many of them will be defeated before they even get started.

Add in the fact that no doubt Ukraine will be recieving all the latest western intelligence and strategic advice.

[normal rules]

Gotta love the daily express.
They are running a story online about the consequences of a sarmat 2 nuclear strike on the uk. They are saying, and I quote, “it would do serious damage”
Ffs. What planet are they on. There are no expletives that would cover such an event.
They go on to say that we have no protection against it. This is true. But then say that top government officials could hide in bunkers under Whitehall. Jesus Christ.
What use would a PM or govt be when there is nothing left to govern?
The uk laid barren to a nuclear wasteland.

Closely followed by Large parts of Russia and then Europe. Then The USA.

Rwanda seems like an attractive proposition at the moment. As Africa is left largely unscathed during any nuclear war modelling.

[River Don]

Gotta love the daily express.
They are running a story online about the consequences of a sarmat 2 nuclear strike on the uk. They are saying, and I quote, “it would do serious damage”
Ffs. What planet are they on. There are no expletives that would cover such an event.
They go on to say that we have no protection against it. This is true. But then say that top government officials could hide in bunkers under Whitehall. Jesus Christ.
What use would a PM or govt be when there is nothing left to govern?
The uk laid barren to a nuclear wasteland.

Closely followed by Large parts of Russia and then Europe. Then The USA.

Rwanda seems like an attractive proposition at the moment. As Africa is left largely unscathed during any nuclear war modelling.

In Rwanda you would slowly die of radiation sickness and/or starvation in the nuclear winter.

Better to pop off quickly I think.

[glosterred]

Gotta love the daily express.
They are running a story online about the consequences of a sarmat 2 nuclear strike on the uk. They are saying, and I quote, “it would do serious damage”
Ffs. What planet are they on. There are no expletives that would cover such an event.
They go on to say that we have no protection against it. This is true. But then say that top government officials could hide in bunkers under Whitehall. Jesus Christ.
What use would a PM or govt be when there is nothing left to govern?
The uk laid barren to a nuclear wasteland.

Closely followed by Large parts of Russia and then Europe. Then The USA.

Rwanda seems like an attractive proposition at the moment. As Africa is left largely unscathed during any nuclear war modelling.

But if it landed on Barnsley it could do untold good