Ukraine

[BillyStubbsTears]

Ahh. The Establishment! Had to come up in this discussion sometime.

[Bristol Red Rover]

Ahh. The Establishment! Had to come up in this discussion sometime.

What would you call it? Your investment opportunity?

[BillyStubbsTears]

Ahh. The Establishment! Had to come up in this discussion sometime.

What would you call it? Your investment opportunity?

I think any prospect of a sensible discussion with you in this topic has departed on the last bus out of town.

Have fun.

[Bristol Red Rover]

Ahh. The Establishment! Had to come up in this discussion sometime.

What would you call it? Your investment opportunity?

I think any prospect of a sensible discussion with you in this topic has departed on the last bus out of town.

Have fun.

Hey, you've had a personal dig at me many a time. You fail to answer many questions, notably here. I just don't get how you are so pro establishment on the one hand and anti establishment on the other. Why?

[danumdon]

I see today the Dombass separatists have paraded two Englishmen fighting in the Ukrainian army as guilty of "terrorism" in show trials, Looks like these two signed up before the war started and were captured during the surrender in Mariupol,in effect just normal soldiers. The fact that he Russians have allowed this to take place demonstrates the contempt they hold for universal rights in a theater of war.

But then what did we really expect from this loathsome regime who act like they want to revert back to the dark ages, looks like they may get their wish very soon.

[drfchound]

The outcome of this trial will have been decided by Putin himself before it even began.

[danumdon]

The outcome of this trial will have been decided by Putin himself before it even began.

True, but that's the bit i don't get, Putin of old was a very canny individual, he analysed every outcome and answer to an issues countless times to see that he got the most mileage out of it, this version just looks and sounds like a clueless version of himself. Stalin and Brezhnev will be turning in their mausoleum.

He must have worse ailments than we are led to believe.

[Bristol Red Rover]

The outcome of this trial will have been decided by Putin himself before it even began.

True, but that's the bit i don't get, Putin of old was a very canny individual, he analysed every outcome and answer to an issues countless times to see that he got the most mileage out of it, this version just looks and sounds like a clueless version of himself. Stalin and Brezhnev will be turning in their mausoleum.

He must have worse ailments than we are led to believe.

Depends what you're reading about him and his actions - presumably the usual?

As for the two Brits, they went over there to fight in the Donbass, so not before the war.

Mercenaries they are. And then Russia apparently has a cohort of mercenaries. I've no problem with mercenaries getting bumped off if captured or whatever, nasty little arseholes in general, lowest of the low. Shame the leaders don't get the same treatment but such is the mess of society in general, always the poorest get shafted.

[Filo]

The outcome of this trial will have been decided by Putin himself before it even began.

True, but that's the bit i don't get, Putin of old was a very canny individual, he analysed every outcome and answer to an issues countless times to see that he got the most mileage out of it, this version just looks and sounds like a clueless version of himself. Stalin and Brezhnev will be turning in their mausoleum.

He must have worse ailments than we are led to believe.

Depends what you're reading about him and his actions - presumably the usual?

As for the two Brits, they went over there to fight in the Donbass, so not before the war.

Mercenaries they are. And then Russia apparently has a cohort of mercenaries. I've no problem with mercenaries getting bumped off if captured or whatever, nasty little arseholes in general, lowest of the low. Shame the leaders don't get the same treatment but such is the mess of society in general, always the poorest get shafted.

They both live in Ukraine, one is married to a Ukrainian, not sure about the other, they signed up with the Ukraine army!

[danumdon]

Seems like the revolting Russian regime are going to be using these prisoners of war for propaganda reasons and will draw it out for as long as possible, hoping that whist the world is talking about this they will not be noticing the blatant disregard for human life and following basic genuine regard for their opposition, (Geneva convention, ect)

But what did we expect when they basically have no regard for their own population and service personnel.

[BobG]

I guess irrespective of the eventual outcome of the fighting, Putin has succesfully achieved two vastly important results:

1) He has fundamentally changed the politico-military- economic landscape in which he, and his succesors will have to operate, and,
2) He has made Russia and everything Riussian pariahs for a generation

I haven't knowingly bought anything Russian for 3 months now. If that is typical behaviour, then Russi and the Russians will feel its impact. The current oil boom will end, and what will they have left then?

BobG

[Bristol Red Rover]

I don't buy that it's Putin that has caused that. And the adverse effects are far from being A Russian problem.

The situation has caused, and will cause more, hunger and poverty around the whole world. With that and the economic slump, mainly caused by covid management, that benefits the pariahs that feed off economic downturns - yep, the ever vampyric rich again.

 It's also caused more money to flow into the pockets of those invested in the arms trade. Those able to milk the aid channelled to the Ukraine will be making billions.

China are more likely to take over Taiwan.

Loads more. You have to wonder why people are invested in all this? Or maybe it's glaringly obvious.

[SydneyRover]

Get yourself a new neighbour BRR he's selling you bum information.

[BillyStubbsTears]

Ukraine war? I blame the Chinese for inventing gunpowder a thousand years ago. Putin is just an unfortunate, trapped by the inevitable consequences. And NATO.

You don't need to read any more analysis from the Far Left/Right. It's all summed up in the above.

[Ldr]

I don't buy that it's Putin that has caused that. And the adverse effects are far from being A Russian problem.

The situation has caused, and will cause more, hunger and poverty around the whole world. With that and the economic slump, mainly caused by covid management, that benefits the pariahs that feed off economic downturns - yep, the ever vampyric rich again.

BRR so literally you are saying poverty and hunger have caused a sovereign nation to invade another?

 It's also caused more money to flow into the pockets of those invested in the arms trade. Those able to milk the aid channelled to the Ukraine will be making billions.

China are more likely to take over Taiwan.

Loads more. You have to wonder why people are invested in all this? Or maybe it's glaringly obvious.

[wilts rover]

I don't buy that it's Putin that has caused that. And the adverse effects are far from being A Russian problem.

The situation has caused, and will cause more, hunger and poverty around the whole world. With that and the economic slump, mainly caused by covid management, that benefits the pariahs that feed off economic downturns - yep, the ever vampyric rich again.

 It's also caused more money to flow into the pockets of those invested in the arms trade. Those able to milk the aid channelled to the Ukraine will be making billions.

China are more likely to take over Taiwan.

Loads more. You have to wonder why people are invested in all this? Or maybe it's glaringly obvious.

Russia did not cause this, they will have also have adverse effects and it will only serve to benefit the vampyric rich.

Whilst the true extent of his wealth is not know it is widely estimated that the richest of these word vampyric rich is one Valdamir Putin - reputedly the world's richest man with a fortune of c$200 billion - mostly stolen from the Russian people as detailed in his books by Bill Browder.

Russia certainly caused a worldwide social and economic disaster - soley to benefit the wealth acquisition & fascist domination policies of Mr Putin. No more - no less.

https://fortune.com/2022/03/02/vladimir-putin-net-worth-2022/

[SydneyRover]

putin peter I think

[Bristol Red Rover]

Ukraine war? I blame the Chinese for inventing gunpowder a thousand years ago. Putin is just an unfortunate, trapped by the inevitable consequences. And NATO.

You don't need to read any more analysis from the Far Left/Right. It's all summed up in the above.

More Billy Bullshit and "far" side confusion.

[Bristol Red Rover]

Get yourself a new neighbour BRR he's selling you bum information.

She, not he, ya dinasaur.

[SydneyRover]

Dorothy's a dinosaur

[Bristol Red Rover]

I don't buy that it's Putin that has caused that. And the adverse effects are far from being A Russian problem.

The situation has caused, and will cause more, hunger and poverty around the whole world. With that and the economic slump, mainly caused by covid management, that benefits the pariahs that feed off economic downturns - yep, the ever vampyric rich again.

 It's also caused more money to flow into the pockets of those invested in the arms trade. Those able to milk the aid channelled to the Ukraine will be making billions.

China are more likely to take over Taiwan.

Loads more. You have to wonder why people are invested in all this? Or maybe it's glaringly obvious.

Russia did not cause this, they will have also have adverse effects and it will only serve to benefit the vampyric rich.

Whilst the true extent of his wealth is not know it is widely estimated that the richest of these word vampyric rich is one Valdamir Putin - reputedly the world's richest man with a fortune of c$200 billion - mostly stolen from the Russian people as detailed in his books by Bill Browder.

Russia certainly caused a worldwide social and economic disaster - soley to benefit the wealth acquisition & fascist domination policies of Mr Putin. No more - no less.

https://fortune.com/2022/03/02/vladimir-putin-net-worth-2022/

Putin may well be the richest, though I see there's a lot of hearsay in that. But yep, someone who has almost certainly sucked up the wealth of the poor and not so poor. I'm not sure how that absolves the other greedy ones, the one's pulling the strings of the US and UK and almost all other nations, and via that the EU and NATO. They are all evil in my mind, maybe not in yours? Why is that?

[Bristol Red Rover]

BRR so literally you are saying poverty and hunger have caused a sovereign nation to invade another?

No, I'm saying that the invasion, and those involved in bringing the invasion to occur, have caused poverty worldwide most of which we are yet to see. Deaths from hunger, poverty suicide and poverty ill health, including here in the UK. It suits them to do so for obvious reasons. They even make fortunes from the simple use of arms in the war. They will make more in the reconstruction of Ukraine, whichever way things fall. They are spinning all kinds of stories to justify and so prolong the war - Russians and the West, with the Ukraine stuffed as pawns between that, except for the western backed Ukraine oligarchs who will be regaining their power, whilst licking the boots of their international backers.

[Nudga]

Ordo Ad Chao

[drfchound]

Ordo Ad Chao

Nice to meet you. 

[danumdon]

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2022/jun/14/pope-francis-ukraine-war-provoked-russian-troops

Looks like the Pope has now got himself involved, apparently a head of state who is “a wise man who speaks little, a very wise man indeed" told him that "Nato were barking at the gates of Russia"

This could of been anyone as most heads of state are gobs on sticks so that rules them out, it could quite easily have been Putin himself.

Not sure it helps the pontiff getting involved, he need to be be careful when suggesting the conflict was "provoked" as he has a sizable flock in Ukraine unlike Russia.

[wilts rover]

Ukraine has recieved only 10% of the weapons it has requested, according to the Defence Minister today:

https://twitter.com/olgatokariuk/status/1536763124774322176

[wilts rover]

Ukraine is 'an existential threat to Russia, the Russian people, the Russian language' and should be 'put an end to once and for all' - one of Putin's top aides:

https://twitter.com/olgatokariuk/status/1536763124774322176

#butbothsides

[Bristol Red Rover]

....Nato were barking at the gates of Russia....

I realise your point was primarily about the pope having an opinion, but within that are you suggesting NATO are not barking at the gates of Russia?

[BillyStubbsTears]

Who wouldn't want a guard dog if they had Putin as a neighbour?

[Bristol Red Rover]

This is interesting to hear. Such a variety of perspectives expressing so much, mainly that they just want to get on with life.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Hhk8r7noUQw&t=858s