0 Members and 22 Guests are viewing this topic.
There'll be the grieving families of 100,000 dead Russian soldiers who won't be swallowing that crap.There are many 'younger' Russians who have travelled or lived abroad, they won't be buying into such rhetoric either.I suspect Putin wishes he could turn the clock back.
Quote from: BillyStubbsTears on December 21, 2022, 08:21:29 pmMy mistake.200,000 on both sides. 100,000 each.The main point still holds. This is by far the most destructive conflict that Russia has been involved in since 1945. And there is no way on God's earth Putin would have sunk into this if he'd known what was coming. This seems to be a reasonable, and detailed assessment of casualties.https://youtu.be/Bfj2c5racUY
My mistake.200,000 on both sides. 100,000 each.The main point still holds. This is by far the most destructive conflict that Russia has been involved in since 1945. And there is no way on God's earth Putin would have sunk into this if he'd known what was coming.
Quote from: Bristol Red Rover on December 22, 2022, 04:05:52 pmQuote from: BillyStubbsTears on December 21, 2022, 08:21:29 pmMy mistake.200,000 on both sides. 100,000 each.The main point still holds. This is by far the most destructive conflict that Russia has been involved in since 1945. And there is no way on God's earth Putin would have sunk into this if he'd known what was coming. This seems to be a reasonable, and detailed assessment of casualties.https://youtu.be/Bfj2c5racUYYou truly are away with the fairies! I'm assuming this is some bizarre joke, no?
I got as far as him talking about the attack:defence casualty ratios in Iraq as though they had something to tell us about those in Ukraine and gave up. That's not in any way a serious analysis, for reasons that would be too condescending to list. I'm sure you can figure it out.
If you really don't get it, there's not much point in me trying to explain it.By the way, I've never said Russian had 100,000 fatalities. If you're going to insist on an argument, at least check what you are arguing about.
So you're saying Russian forces, in a war started by Putin when he had every opportunity not to do so, have killed and mutilated half a million opponents? At a rate of 4-5x their own losses?Remind me how that squares with the Russian forces getting out of Kherson and Kupyiansk as fast as they could in the Autumn?Oh no! Of course! Silly me! Those were strategic withdrawals weren't they? I remember now.
So you're saying Russian forces, in a war started by Putin when he had every opportunity not to do so, have killed and mutilated half a million opponents? At a rate of 4-5x their own losses.
And I'll say once again. If you REALLY don't get why the relative death tolls of the Americans and Iraqis say nothing of any worth about what's going on in Ukraine, you're truly a lost cause. Stop posting your diatribes for a moment and think. It's not hard!
And...you have successfully derailed the discussion that was going on. About this being a war the like of which Russia hasn't been involved in since 1945. It's on a far, far bigger scale than their invasion of Afghanistan. And Putin had assumed it would be closer to the Hungarian put down of 1956.Even if we suspend disbelief and accept your bullshit figures on Ukranian losses, that doesn't change the fact that Russia hasn't known losses like the ones it is experiencing now since the days of the drive to Berlin.And this is 100% self-inflicted.
And...you have successfully derailed the discussion that was going on. About this being a war the like of which Russia hasn't been involved in since 1945. It's on a far, far bigger scale than their invasion of Afghanistan. And Putin had assumed it would be closer to the Hungarian put down of 1956.
I think I can safely say (bare in mind here, ‘tis the season’ etc. ,) this will be Putin’s last Christmas.As for the Russia he leaves behind? Wind back
Quote from: BillyStubbsTears on December 22, 2022, 10:24:10 pmSo you're saying Russian forces, in a war started by Putin when he had every opportunity not to do so, have killed and mutilated half a million opponents? At a rate of 4-5x their own losses?Remind me how that squares with the Russian forces getting out of Kherson and Kupyiansk as fast as they could in the Autumn?Oh no! Of course! Silly me! Those were strategic withdrawals weren't they? I remember now.Kharkiv Russia very heavily outnumbered, so yes withdraw, guessing Billy General would be stood behind the lines shooting the runners of his own side in the rear end?Kherson - too unreliable to keep supplies up to where needed, plus troops better employed elsewhere and Russia bogged down the Ukraine's, especially their armour, in that region for a week or two with missile and drone strikes on infastructure.But you have other explanations?
Quote from: BillyStubbsTears on December 22, 2022, 10:37:40 pmAnd...you have successfully derailed the discussion that was going on. About this being a war the like of which Russia hasn't been involved in since 1945. It's on a far, far bigger scale than their invasion of Afghanistan. And Putin had assumed it would be closer to the Hungarian put down of 1956.I discussed that. You simply had a rant about how bad it is for Russia using figures direct from the US which is heavily invested financially and politically. And whose figures don't match what the EU stated before being censored. Bit of the bleeding obvious going on there don't ya think?
Quote from: Colin C No.3 on December 22, 2022, 11:16:14 pmI think I can safely say (bare in mind here, ‘tis the season’ etc. ,) this will be Putin’s last Christmas.As for the Russia he leaves behind? Wind backToo much Baileys? Makes sense
Quote from: Bristol Red Rover on December 22, 2022, 11:41:28 pmQuote from: BillyStubbsTears on December 22, 2022, 10:24:10 pmSo you're saying Russian forces, in a war started by Putin when he had every opportunity not to do so, have killed and mutilated half a million opponents? At a rate of 4-5x their own losses?Remind me how that squares with the Russian forces getting out of Kherson and Kupyiansk as fast as they could in the Autumn?Oh no! Of course! Silly me! Those were strategic withdrawals weren't they? I remember now.Kharkiv Russia very heavily outnumbered, so yes withdraw, guessing Billy General would be stood behind the lines shooting the runners of his own side in the rear end?Kherson - too unreliable to keep supplies up to where needed, plus troops better employed elsewhere and Russia bogged down the Ukraine's, especially their armour, in that region for a week or two with missile and drone strikes on infastructure.But you have other explanations? If you're going to spout Russian propaganda, at least get with the correct line.Every Russian military and political commentator on Russian state TV called the losses in Kharkiv and Kherson as disastrous losses. You are not remotely up to speed. You're telling yourself what you want to believe.
Don't worry Turnbull. Apparently it's all the fault of the west. BobG
Militarily they were the right moves because their forces were being smashed by the Ukrainian army.The Russians didn't just choose to retreat you fool. They were forced into it because they'd suffered a crushing defeat on the battlefields. The Russians didn't even try to cover that up in the way that you do. You're truly off the scale.
I'm all in favour of balanced disputation and discussion based on verifiable facts. Sadly, one element of this thread, going back months, has suffered from HawHaw esque blindness from day 1. It seems to represent the school of 'If I shout loud enough for long enough some fools will believe me'. BobG