Marquis pays for himself

[selby]

  By getting Portsmouth to a Wembley Final with a last minute goal, his thirteenth of the season.
  The money Portsmouth will make from another Wembley Final in this so called tin pot cup will pay the transfer fee roughly that John cost them to buy from us, and doesn't seem to have made any difference, indeed it has helped them to have a very consistent run of fixtures after an indifferent start to the season, to their league performances.
   It is time we looked seriously at our approach to cup football, and the benefits to the clubs finances success, and picking strong sides are part of that approach can bring to the club, instead of turning up to an early round cup game, walking into the ground, and wondering why we have picked that side.

[steve@dcfd]

That’s if our strong side at the time of the cup would be good enough we did not the striker or goal scorers to get us forward.

[pib]

I don't think you can start banking on cup results. Sounds like a dangerous game. You can be the better team and play your strongest XI in a game of football but something like a sending off or an injury can derail you and lose you the game.

What is/would be a more sensible approach is identifying players that you can sign for X, develop, and sell for >X - Marquis being a prime example of how DRFC have done this recently.

[selby]

  It is not just this season we have deceived the few travelling fans that have gone to watch continually weakened sides put out in cup games. While teams like Shrewsbury, Lincoln, Oxford have all built their league success starting out having a real go at doing well in cup football, and have built up a sizeable increase in their crowd following by doing so, and don't discount the considerable amount those clubs have raised in prize money, even Wimbledon and Newport have probably saved their club financially over the last few seasons, and have improved their league standing while doing well in cups and having TV exposure, while we have treated cup football as a side show.
   Finish this season with poor results, and the club might find out the result of interest being over with a couple of months of the season left, when it comes to renewing season tickets.

[sha66y]

Not sure what your point is Selby..Nothing is guaranteed in football, and whatever team we put out could be eliminated at the first hurdle.....it’s just a lottery...

However I do see the long term benefits of playing the youngsters and fringe players in these competitions....

[RoversAlias]

I'm not sure why you keep banging this drum about cups Selby. Last season we got to the FA Cup 5th Round and the year before played Arsenal in the League Cup. It isn't as if we don't take the cups seriously and haven't had good runs in recent years.

Also, I'm not sure how you figure Portsmouth are going to make upwards of £2m from the EFL Trophy Final. Them against Newport or Salford is hardly going to be a blockbuster Wembley sell-out either. The Marquis transfer money was "paid for" before they ever signed him by the money they earned from selling Clarke and Lowe.

[selby]

 Sha66y, I will  let you make the long list of players we have blooded for first team football in cup games over the last five or six years that are in our first team at the moment.
   Some of the players we had on show at Grimsby and Rotherham this season have already left the building, and no doubt others will at the end of the season.
  It has done the club no good whatsoever other than confirm that most of the players playing the odd game in cups over the last five seasons have not been good enough to cement a career at this club as a first team player, quite a few not now having a football league career at all and in non league.
  I will be interested and await your long list in anticipation.  No doubt some of you will be posting on here, and wondering why in August the season ticket sales are down on this season if they are, I hope not, but fear the worse.

[steve@dcfd]

Not sure what your point is Selby..Nothing is guaranteed in football, and whatever team we put out could be eliminated at the first hurdle.....it’s just a lottery...

However I do see the long term benefits of playing the youngsters and fringe players in these competitions....

We have blooded youngsters, who has stepped up to the first team? who are good enough to step up? At this moment there are none you could play regularly in the first team if you want to progress. The best need more time but will they get contracts to continue.
If you compare them with the loanees who are the same age or younger there is no comparison.

[selby]

 Sha66y, As far as I can see there have been no benefits to the club at all, other than a loss of much needed finances continually thrown away, if you can call that a benefit that is.

[VivaRovers]

No doubt some of you will be posting on here, and wondering why in August the season ticket sales are down on this season if they are, I hope not, but fear the worse.

I can't see how our performance in Cups will greatly affect season ticket sales given that they're matches not included in season tickets.

[selby]

  Viva, combined with a poor finish to this season they will, obviously I am hoping for a good set of results to finish the season with.
  But to be out of the race for a top six finish, if indeed we are in a couple of weeks, and out of all cup competitions before Christmas will not help to attract new custom, and never has.

[sha66y]

Sha66y, I will  let you make the long list of players we have blooded for first team football in cup games over the last five or six years that are in our first team at the moment.
   Some of the players we had on show at Grimsby and Rotherham this season have already left the building, and no doubt others will at the end of the season.
  It has done the club no good whatsoever other than confirm that most of the players playing the odd game in cups over the last five seasons have not been good enough to cement a career at this club as a first team player, quite a few not now having a football league career at all and in non league.
  I will be interested and await your long list in anticipation.  No doubt some of you will be posting on here, and wondering why in August the season ticket sales are down on this season if they are, I hope not, but fear the worse.

I’ve actually only seen Watters play for a few minutes in the first team, and read on here that Amos is biting at the reins...
If our youth policy is not reaping rewards then we need to address this sharpish ... we are a team that needs to develop diamonds for sale to generate funds for more development..

If they are not going to get introduced to “competitive” football until a big arrow drops from the sky and says “ READY” ...then we might as well get rid , save the money and buy/loan other teams young guns to develop instead...

At some point we have to give them a go....see how they react!
There are a few under 19s spattered throughout the Premiership and championship that have been given the opportunity to shine...and as our expectations would be a lot lower, some of them might come good...

[selby]

  Sha66y, I hope you are right, and one or two of the current crop push through, as for Amos I would pick him to start this weekend myself, whether he will be I have no idea, even when we win a game it is now no pointer to the team that will play the next game, and is more likely to have at least a couple of changes, rather than pick the same team.
   Introducing the odd one, not overplaying them used to be the norm at most clubs with young players, the problem I have in our cup sides especially, is that we have tried to do it with too many included in a team that has done the players no good, and weakened the side to be noncompetitive against teams like Notts County and Grimsby when they were  poor sides in a division below us. And disappointed the few away fans that have bothered to travel and support the team, of which I have been one, and am starting to think if they are not going to give it a go why should I bother.

[VivaRovers]

  Viva, combined with a poor finish to this season they will, obviously I am hoping for a good set of results to finish the season with.
  But to be out of the race for a top six finish, if indeed we are in a couple of weeks, and out of all cup competitions before Christmas will not help to attract new custom, and never has.

Of course having a successful team helps bring in fans. That goes without saying.

But does Cup progress really make an impact on season ticket sales? Last year we had our longest ever FA Cup run, but I'd be surprised if that made a tangible difference to the number of season tickets sold for this season. And on a similar tread, I can't see anyone not choosing to buy a season ticket because Rovers didn't take whatever the Football League Trophy is called now, seriously. I think it's a huge leap to suggest that.

[andysly]

I suppose there's always the chance that the odd few might make a trip to the KM for a biggish cup game and fancy going on a more regular basis

[5 on Tour]

I suppose there's always the chance that the odd few might make a trip to the KM for a biggish cup game and fancy going on a more regular basis

Or more likely they turn up for the cup game, act like they’re die hards while behaving like kitsons, annoy the actual fans and then disappear never to be seen again.

[VivaRovers]

Yes, I get that reasoning andy... They might come to another game, but how many would go straight in with a full-on season ticket, off the back of one or two big FA Cup games? I'd be surprised if it's any.

[andysly]

As I said Glen "a chance"

[selby]

  The results from now until the end of the season will determine whether we LOSE season ticket holders.
   Let this season peter out and to the average fan it will have been a poor season with very few highlights, the longest consistent run of results being the poor run before Christmas that included our exit from cup competitions, and left us with the only hope left of a top six finish.
  Our fixture list from now until the end of the season looks as though it can conspire  to make that very difficult, and with so many away games people will get out of the habit of attending games, and find other things to do with their weekends, unless they are one of our few committed away following.
  Because of the management problems at the start of the season, at the time I would have been happy for a mid table finish, and against all hope a cup run of sorts. After seeing the team play every game this season, and our recruitment gradually build up at least a mid table finish should be obtained, we now have a good side, the management's job is now to get some consistency in results which to my mind would come with consistency of selection, as we enter a very important period for the club , in an end to the current season, and a hopefully planned and in management terms a much quieter pre -season without the disruptions to the management team of the last two seasons.

[ravenrover]

Aren't the majority of season ticket holders the more die hard fans who stick with club through thick and thin?

[selby]

  RR, of course they are, but there is a natural drop off every season, illness, moving location, financial, many reasons, and these at least need replacing with new customers just to stand still that have to be attracted to the club. Results and success being the main attractions.
  The next couple of months will be as important to the club as any for quite a while.

[ravenrover]

So really we are talking about nothing  vastly different to this season than any other. I got the impression you were inferring that there would be a dramatic loss of STH  if the season wasn't classed as succesfull, yes?

[auckleyflyer]

Judge at the season end if Portsmouth run out of steam and have to spend another year in L1 they'll be ruing the Cup runs?
It's a balancing act

[selby]

  RR, I suppose you could look at it that way, and conveniently forget that last season we did have a good cup run, and finished the season well.

[ravenrover]

But isn't that all part of the swings and roundabouts year after year?
Are you suggesting that there could be a reduction in the playing budget due to any such reduction in STH for next season?

[selby]

  No not at all, the budget fortunately is more or less set in stone due to our great benefactors who don't get the recognition they deserve, also the playing budget is not in any way a subject that I bother about at all.
  I expect any manager we have to work with the tools that we provide for them, improve the players we have with good coaching, and like any other worker in the country get another job if they are not happy.
  Why people like you are infatuated with the budget is a mystery to me, every season a club in every division, through good management and a scouting network that looks for players of value do well, budgets come into play when bigger clubs just cherry pick those players, a position this club will never be in, so is of no concern whatsoever to me.
  My concern is that we have now got a playing staff good enough to do well in this division, but it is our bad luck to have a fixture list to the end of the season that will do us no favours at all with home advantage, with few home games compared with away fixtures few and far between. So our support could lose interest if we don't do well  in results to the end of the season, and I think it could impact on season ticket renewals, I obviously hope not, and I am confident we are good enough to do well, but if you and others are unaware of the danger I think you are a little short sighted.
  I am hoping that the lack of interest in the Shrewsbury game this weekend, both here on this forum, and the slower and smaller ticket sales for the game, plus the first signs of "I am not paying that price for a ticket at Lincoln", is not the first pointers to what I am alluding to.

[ravenrover]

Where on earth do you get the ideaI am infatuated with budget? That was a question asked of you!
I fully apreciate the amount of money our owners put into the club, without them where would we be!

[selby]

  You brought the budget up, I don't ever bother about it.

[SydneyRover]

  RR, of course they are, but there is a natural drop off every season, illness, moving location, financial, many reasons, and these at least need replacing with new customers just to stand still that have to be attracted to the club. Results and success being the main attractions.
  The next couple of months will be as important to the club as any for quite a while.

I was under the impression that season tickets were good this season from SM?

[selby]

  For this season Sydney they were up slightly on the season before, I sincerely hope that that is the case for next season, but results to the end of this season could have a big bearing on whether the sales are sustained, after our dismal run of cup results and the possibility of the league results petering out to the end of the season.
  Obviously I hope that this does not happen.