Coronavirus

[idler]

My daughter's school had parents complaining the work was too hard for them to help even at year one level.
Trying to get them learning was a nightmare. It won't get much easier when they go back. Any child with siblings will leave their lesson at the same time as the earliest finishes. That means some kids leaving at 14:40 instead of 15:10, losing 30mins a day of lesson time. There is no easy way despite what some politicians believe.

[BillyStubbsTears]

Every child (with internet access) in our school got a daily learning plan uploaded to the website each morning. Those without internet access got a weekly hard copy.

The teachers created class video centre pages on the website with learning activities and updated a daily class blog.

They also spoke to each child and their parent/guardian weekly - not just on learning but also on things like online safety and mental well being.

Those who could not be contacted, and those who are on the safeguarding, list the head/deputy head visited personally.

I have no idea whether this was normal or just exceptional for our school, but that what they did.

Pretty much what happened at my kids' school

[Janso]

My daughter's school had parents complaining the work was too hard for them to help even at year one level.

Jesus. What hope have you got if the parents can't even do the work of a bloody 7 year old (or whatever age it is!).

[idler]

She was preparing work for pupils who were basically recapping lessons already covered and parents just said it was too hard for the kids and themselves. Her school's catchment area isn't one of the best in Bradford though.

[ravenrover]

My daughter's school had parents complaining the work was too hard for them to help even at year one level.

Jesus. What hope have you got if the parents can't even do the work of a bloody 7 year old (or whatever age it is!).

Did YOU do phonics at school?

[Janso]

My daughter's school had parents complaining the work was too hard for them to help even at year one level.

Jesus. What hope have you got if the parents can't even do the work of a bloody 7 year old (or whatever age it is!).

Did YOU do phonics at school?

Yes, actually, if phonics is what I think it is.

[belton rover]

It’s not as simple as not knowing what to do. Teaching methods change continuously, sometimes for the best, sometimes not, but change they do.
Often, too much parental input can be detrimental to a child’s learning.

[wilts rover]

When our new head started we were discussing Ofsted, school improvement and the like and I asked him what the single biggest thing was that we could implement to assist the children's learning.

Get parent's to assist them with their homework.

Apparently it is very noticable how far ahead the children are whose parent's help them as to the one's whose parent's dont.

[belton rover]

‘Helping’ is the key. And it also depends on which key stage it is. From a secondary point of view, I think the help from parents should be more about encouragement and creating a positive environment.

[ravenrover]

My daughter's school had parents complaining the work was too hard for them to help even at year one level.

Jesus. What hope have you got if the parents can't even do the work of a bloody 7 year old (or whatever age it is!).

Did YOU do phonics at school?

Yes, actually, if phonics is what I think it is.

Well I certsinly didn't so trying to teach a 5 year old phonics is a tad difficult if you haven't got a clue in the 1st place

[BillyStubbsTears]

Getting a bit embarrassing now isn't it?

This morning: Alok Sharma wheeled out on R4 to say that the Govt is following the science by not requiring kids in schools to wear masks.

This lunchtime, Johnson says of course that may change if the scientific advice changes.

This evening...
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/education-53907035


This isn't Government. This is responding to whatever is in the f**king headlines.

How many times now, in just 8 months, has the Government insisted it is doing the correct thing, then changed 180degrees in a few days or hours?

Herd immunity. We weren't going to have a big lockdown. Until we did.

No customs checks between GB and NI.

Health cover for foreign key workers.

Reopening primary schools in June

World leading TTI by 1 June

Free school meals over the summer.

Exam results

Masks in school.

And those are just the ones off the top of my head. That's more big u-turns in 3-4 months than you'd expect from an entire Govt term.


 It's shambolic. And it's more than just appearances. It comes from desperately wanting to appear strong and resolute, but not actually getting the policies right at the start. So how do you now trust anything this Govt firmly announces when you know it's a 50/50 shot that they'll flip to the exact opposite in a day or two?

[Donnywolf]

Simply out I DONT

Here's the latest 8 U Turns courtesy of BBC some of which you have already

https://www.politico.eu/article/8-u-turns-in-8-months-from-boris-johnsons-government/

[belton rover]

It is IMPOSSIBLE to get it all correct. I would rather have a government who were prepared to reverse decisions that needed reversing, than one that refused to budge through sheer stubbornness.
Of course they are making mistakes during this time (as, no doubt, is every single government in the world), but all these ‘lists as long as your arm‘ supposedly highlighting how shambolically things have been handled are unhelpful in these continuously changing times.

Whenever I have doubts about how Boris and his government are handling things, I play the ‘imagine Corbyn in charge right now’ game.

Then I feel better again.

[Filo]

It is IMPOSSIBLE to get it all correct. I would rather have a government who were prepared to reverse decisions that needed reversing, than one that refused to budge through sheer stubbornness.
Of course they are making mistakes during this time (as, no doubt, is every single government in the world), but all these ‘lists as long as your arm‘ supposedly highlighting how shambolically things have been handled are unhelpful in these continuously changing times.

Whenever I have doubts about how Boris and his government are handling things, I play the ‘imagine Corbyn in charge right now’ game.

Then I feel better again.

A good Government would get most decisions correct at the first time of asking, but this one seems to just do its own thing and wait for the reaction to put it right, there seems to be no thought at all into decision making

[belton rover]

It is IMPOSSIBLE to get it all correct. I would rather have a government who were prepared to reverse decisions that needed reversing, than one that refused to budge through sheer stubbornness.
Of course they are making mistakes during this time (as, no doubt, is every single government in the world), but all these ‘lists as long as your arm‘ supposedly highlighting how shambolically things have been handled are unhelpful in these continuously changing times.

Whenever I have doubts about how Boris and his government are handling things, I play the ‘imagine Corbyn in charge right now’ game.

Then I feel better again.

A good Government would get most decisions correct at the first time of asking, but this one seems to just do its own thing and wait for the reaction to put it right, there seems to be no thought at all into decision making

Of course, Filo, in ‘normal’ circumstances. The vast majority of ‘u-turns’ have been situations that none of us would have considered pre Covid.

We are in uncharted waters. I’d be much more worried if there were no u-turns.

[BillyStubbsTears]

I'm truly amazed by how many people are prepared to give a pass to the Govt on the Herd Immunity issue. This isn't a hindsight thing. We KNEW by 9-10 March what was happening in Italy and how rapidly things were deteriorating in  France and Spain. Those were the first three countries in Europe to be hit with the virus and everyone else had a chance to learn from them.

Most European countries did. Germany, Norway, Denmark, Portugal, Austria, Greece, Ireland, Poland and several other locked down much earlier in their epidemic timescale than those three countries did, and the result was that their outbreaks were far less damaging.

Only the UK failed to take that opportunity. We were still officially going for HI as late as 16-17 March and even after that, it took us a week to properly lockdown. Given that the cases and deaths were doubling every 3-4 days at that time, that two week delay has cost well over 30,000 lives and extended the duration of our outbreak, increasing the lockdown time and leading to worse economic damage.

That was a policy choice of the UK Govt. Shockingly, disastrously wrong. And this isn't hindsight talking. We on this very Forum were saying by mid-March that we couldn't believe we weren't in lock down. I had in-laws from Italy on the phone in mid-March incredulous that we were still going about business as normal, when (to quote them) "can't you see what this thing is doing to us?"

It's fascinating that a UK Govt can get a policy so spectacularly wrong that it leads to the avoidable deaths of 30,000 UK citizens over a month, and perhaps a £200bn cost to the economy, and people will just shrug their shoulders and move one. If that is the case, I truly cannot begin to imagine what a UK Govt would have to do to be criticised by that sort of person.

[belton rover]

I'm truly amazed by how many people are prepared to give a pass to the Govt on the Herd Immunity issue. This isn't a hindsight thing. We KNEW by 9-10 March what was happening in Italy and how rapidly things were deteriorating in  France and Spain. Those were the first three countries in Europe to be hit with the virus and everyone else had a chance to learn from them.

Most European countries did. Germany, Norway, Denmark, Portugal, Austria, Greece, Ireland, Poland and several other locked down much earlier in their epidemic timescale than those three countries did, and the result was that their outbreaks were far less damaging.

Only the UK failed to take that opportunity. We were still officially going for HI as late as 16-17 March and even after that, it took us a week to properly lockdown. Given that the cases and deaths were doubling every 3-4 days at that time, that two week delay has cost well over 30,000 lives and extended the duration of our outbreak, increasing the lockdown time and leading to worse economic damage.

That was a policy choice of the UK Govt. Shockingly, disastrously wrong. And this isn't hindsight talking. We on this very Forum were saying by mid-March that we couldn't believe we weren't in lock down. I had in-laws from Italy on the phone in mid-March incredulous that we were still going about business as normal, when (to quote them) "can't you see what this thing is doing to us?"

It's fascinating that a UK Govt can get a policy so spectacularly wrong that it leads to the avoidable deaths of 30,000 UK citizens over a month, and perhaps a £200bn cost to the economy, and people will just shrug their shoulders and move one. If that is the case, I truly cannot begin to imagine what a UK Govt would have to do to be criticised by that sort of person.

Who are the ‘sort of people’ giving them a pass?

I don’t know anyone.

[BillyStubbsTears]

Belton.

Have a look over these threads and see the number of people who think criticising this Govt is a sign that you are biassed.

Or the people who criticise people who criticise the Govt because these are special times where we need to pull together.

[belton rover]

Billy, you appear misunderstand the question. The ‘free pass’ part was quite important.

I know you don’t want to engage in discussion with me anymore, but I can’t help thinking that, in your opinion, I am one of ‘that sort of people’, so what do you mean about giving them a free pass?
I know what a free pass is, just not really in the context you offer.

And we do need to pull together. Not blindly, of course, but generally. Absolutely we do.

If I’m not one of ‘that sort of people’ you refer to, I apologise.

[BillyStubbsTears]

Belton.

As you say, I don't really want to get into a long exchange because I don't really see the point of doing so when key points I make get entirely misconstrued.

Regarding whether you are giving the Govt a free pass, the fact is that, the Govt chose to delay our lockdown at a time when people on here were already pointing out the rate at which deaths were mounting. That delay has led directly to 30,000+ preventable deaths. And that is not hindsight. Many, many people were saying it at the time. Including me, while desperately hoping I was wrong.

Or, if you, understandably, prefer the opinion of someone a bit more important than me, try the editor of The Lancet medical journal.
https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2020/mar/18/coronavirus-uk-expert-advice-wrong

It is clear that criticisms of the Govt's policy on Herd Immunity, THE most critical failure of Govt policy since Munich, cannot be dismissed as just hindsight.

Your take a couple of weeks ago, at a time that I was trying to make this point was:

"What I do genuinely think, is that this current government has done a relatively good job in 2020. That doesn’t mean they haven’t made mistakes, some pretty big ones, but mistakes that have only been realised with hindsight. "

You decide whether you're giving them a free pass.

[belton rover]

Billy
Expert advice from China. Really? You trust the Chinese rather than our own government?

I need a lie down.

[wilts rover]

Billy
Expert advice from China. Really? You trust the Chinese rather than our own government?

I need a lie down.

You have hit the nail exactly on the head there Belton. We should trust this government because they are our government.

Not because they have provided consistent, accurate and fully attributed scientific advise since they have been in power?

And don't trust anything them foreigners say. Despite them having several years experience in dealing with coronoviruses.

Just one thing I would like clearing up though. Do I trust the first thing they say - even when it is clearly bonkers - i.e., you can shake hands with coronovirus patients and testing is only for poor countries - or only when they have changed it?

I prefer to trust politicians because I believe they are speaking as truthfully and honestly as they know the situation to be at the time. But if you trust them because of where they are born...fair enough.

[BillyStubbsTears]

Belton.

You simply can't stop yourself misrepresenting stuff can you?

The sub-headline (written by the Editor of The Lancet by the way, so I assume he knows a thing or two about medical issues) clearly says "The warnings from China and Italy were loud and clear..."

You simply will not engage with stuff that goes against what you want to believe to be true. So I'm totally done now. Life's too short for this sort of interaction.

[belton rover]

Billy.
You lecture me on misconstruing points?

Not one mention of the Chinese experts your link suggests we should have listened to in January.

But it’s okay, I’ll still talk to you.

Despite the fact that you are now indirectly accusing me of racism.

How many people, apart from you, obviously, were saying in January that we should look to the Chinese and listen to what they tell us about the virus?

Next you’ll be telling us that the official Corona death toll in China is accurate.

[Janso]

My God, you love deliberately missing the point don't you?

[BillyStubbsTears]

He has it down to a fine art Janso.

This is an article by a leading figure in the medical.world who has contacts throughout the profession. I'd take his opinion on what the medical profession knew about COVID and when over a bigotted response in here.

And you've done it yet again Belton. Misrepresented yet another thing I wrote. I haven't said anything about China or January in this exchange.

Your insistence on putting words into my mouth to make the points you want to make is starting to worry me to be honest. It is utterly bizarre behaviour.

[belton rover]

My God, you love deliberately missing the point don't you?

I know Janso, he’s doing my head in!

[belton rover]

He has it down to a fine art Janso.

This is an article by a leading figure in the medical.world who has contacts throughout the profession. I'd take his opinion on what the medical profession knew about COVID and when over a bigotted response in here.

And you've done it yet again Belton. Misrepresented yet another thing I wrote. I haven't said anything about China or January in this exchange.

Your insistence on putting words into my mouth to make the points you want to make is starting to worry me to be honest. It is utterly bizarre behaviour.

But your link does.
You told me a while ago I had to read the links if I wanted to be taken seriously in your debates (or words to that effect).

[BillyStubbsTears]

A word of friendly advice Belton. You need a rest from this. It's not healthy.

[belton rover]

Thanks for the advice, Billy.
If I could reciprocate it:

I think you actually do the Labour party more harm than good. Your rants and games you play on here if anybody, in any way, dare question your motives, are shocking.

You told me you had no interest in discussion with me because I didn’t agree that I was misrepresenting you. But here you are like a rabid dog with a bone. You simply cannot leave something without the last word.

It’s not a good look for you or the Labour party. Isn’t there a Labour forum full of likeminded individuals where you can spout your shit and be told how right you all are, where you don’t have to worry about other opinions?

If there isn’t, you should create one.

You are right about one thing: You do sway me towards arguing against you sometimes. But that is because of your antagonistic methods of debate.

This too is not healthy. You need a rest.