Vaccine passport

[Ldr]

The responsibility for the safety of which lies with each and every one individually and no one else.

[BillyStubbsTears]

That is fundamentalist nonsense.

That means I have no responsibility to maintain my house. If a ridge tile falls off and kills a passer-by, it's their fault for not having taken into account my lack of maintenance when they were planning their route.

[Ldr]

In your opinion, you have a very black and white way of looking at things

[ColinDouglasHandshake]

If you consider wearing a mask to be a severe curtailment of someone's freedom, I guess I am.

Difference is, what I'm suggesting will lead to fewer people dying. What you are suggesting will lead to more.

I've yet to see concrete evidence of this throughout the whole pandemic.

[SydneyRover]

You are probably not expecting one, but it's very difficult to have a conversation with someone opposed to the accepted norms and expectations of the greater majority.

Before the 1800s it’s was the accepted norm and expectation of the greater majority that slavery was acceptable, before the 1900s it was accepted that women shouldn’t vote, before the 60s (50s?) it was accepted that homosexuality was punishable under the law. Don’t use the expectation of the majority as your bellwether (or if you do then stop whinging about brexit lol)

Luckily most of us have moved on since the 1800s Ldr. Don't use the standards of people 230 years ago to justify your argument.

[Bentley Bullet]

That is fundamentalist nonsense.

That means I have no responsibility to maintain my house. If a ridge tile falls off and kills a passer-by, it's their fault for not having taken into account my lack of maintenance when they were planning their route.

irresponsible people like that must have a slate loose.

[BillyStubbsTears]

Wey-hey.

[Ldr]

You are probably not expecting one, but it's very difficult to have a conversation with someone opposed to the accepted norms and expectations of the greater majority.

Before the 1800s it’s was the accepted norm and expectation of the greater majority that slavery was acceptable, before the 1900s it was accepted that women shouldn’t vote, before the 60s (50s?) it was accepted that homosexuality was punishable under the law. Don’t use the expectation of the majority as your bellwether (or if you do then stop whinging about brexit lol)

Luckily most of us have moved on since the 1800s Ldr. Don't use the standards of people 230 years ago to justify your argument.

Syd that’s the entire point. Just because it’s the majority accepted view doesn’t make it right

[SydneyRover]

You are probably not expecting one, but it's very difficult to have a conversation with someone opposed to the accepted norms and expectations of the greater majority.

Before the 1800s it’s was the accepted norm and expectation of the greater majority that slavery was acceptable, before the 1900s it was accepted that women shouldn’t vote, before the 60s (50s?) it was accepted that homosexuality was punishable under the law. Don’t use the expectation of the majority as your bellwether (or if you do then stop whinging about brexit lol)

Luckily most of us have moved on since the 1800s Ldr. Don't use the standards of people 230 years ago to justify your argument.

Syd that’s the entire point. Just because it’s the majority accepted view doesn’t make it right

You're wildly out of step with those that wish ensure that people can go about their everyday lives safely, and for what, the inconvenience of wearing a mask? and a government that is desperate to make political.

[Ldr]

You’re sidestepping my point

[SydneyRover]

You’re sidestepping my point

too many conversations on the go, why? I'm addressing the thrust of the debate which is why should people suffer unnecessary death or injury for the few that choose not to adhere what is a very small inconvenience.

[Ldr]

Then address the debate without quoting my posts. If you quote my posts address my point that history proves being in the majority does not always equal been correct

[ColinDouglasHandshake]

Because that would mean people wearing masks until the end of time. Distancing until the end of time. Testing until the end of time etc etc. Which is clearly ludicrous and historically unprecedented.

[SydneyRover]

Then address the debate without quoting my posts. If you quote my posts address my point that history proves being in the majority does not always equal been correct

I'll concede that point, but similarly I would think the the majority in the presence of common sense would be mostly correct. (Trump and johnson does not come close to common sense)

[Ldr]

It’s all to do with the paradigm at the time my friend. I would wholeheartedly agree with your last sentence

[drfchound]

Because that would mean people wearing masks until the end of time. Distancing until the end of time. Testing until the end of time etc etc. Which is clearly ludicrous and historically unprecedented.

TBF I think the coming years might bring the need to do things we haven’t done before, things that are historically unprecedented.

[ColinDouglasHandshake]

Then address the debate without quoting my posts. If you quote my posts address my point that history proves being in the majority does not always equal been correct

I think Schopenhauer said that if you are in a minority, you are most probably right.

He also said this:

'All truth passes through three stages. First it is ridiculed, second it is violently opposed. Third it is accepted as being self evident.'

Quite apt for the mass hysteria across the world that has led to an obsessional preoccupation with a minor virus.

[SydneyRover]

shopping hour destroys the senses

[ColinDouglasHandshake]

shopping hour destroys the senses

You do actually realize that this is not funny or even mildly amusing don't you and just makes you come across as a bit of a wet blanket.

[SydneyRover]

shopping hour destroys the senses

You do actually realize that this is not funny or even mildly amusing don't you and just makes you come across as a bit of a wet blanket.

Your continual rants don't help either but I take you point.

[normal rules]

Some have said we are fighting an invisible war with covid.
The first rule of war, other than perhaps avoid them in the first place, is not to become a casualty yourself.
During the world wars, that would mean keeping in your trench. Avoiding the bullets where possible.
With covid, if you class yourself as vulnerable, then you must do what you need to do to stay safe. That means isolate if necessary. Avoid large groups of people .
It’s a simple as that.
Looking at the ticket sales for this sat, I suspect a lot of people are still doing exactly that .
People said that the world after covid will never be the same . A bit like post 9/11. And I think they are right.
Some people have had it with covid and don’t care about it. That’s their prerogative.
Some people are still very very scared of it . And I get that too.
Covid has become like brexit. Devisive.

[BillyStubbsTears]

"During the world wars, that would mean keeping in your trench. Avoiding the bullets where possible."

I disagree. It would have meant having tactics and strategies more sophisticated than just telling men to walk towards machine guns and hope for the best.

[ColinDouglasHandshake]

shopping hour destroys the senses

You do actually realize that this is not funny or even mildly amusing don't you and just makes you come across as a bit of a wet blanket.

Your continual rants don't help either but I take you point.

I rant. You post unfunny quips. Maybe we're quits and have to accept each other?

[ColinDouglasHandshake]

"During the world wars, that would mean keeping in your trench. Avoiding the bullets where possible."

I disagree. It would have meant having tactics and strategies more sophisticated than just telling men to walk towards machine guns and hope for the best.

If any person young or old, healthy or ill walk towards machine guns then the probability of ending up dead is very high.

If any person young or old, healthy or ill contract Covid then the probability of ending up dead is negligible.

[normal rules]

"During the world wars, that would mean keeping in your trench. Avoiding the bullets where possible."

I disagree. It would have meant having tactics and strategies more sophisticated than just telling men to walk towards machine guns and hope for the best.

Our initial response (eventually) to the pandemic was to batten down the hatches. Avoid the bullets. Isolate.
We have a strategy and tactics now. Vaccines. Boosters. Mask wearing . Avoiding crowds. Cleaning hands . Making space.  Immunity (perhaps) But the bullets are still coming . The bullets might not kill you , but they are still there. For those that have already been shot, you may still get shot again.
There are no more strategies or tactics left. It’s now down to personal choice.
I’m fully vaccinated as is my own family. Yet my own father, sister and brother, are all dead against it despite my protestations. I know others who are anti vax too.
Pre covid, did the general populous of the world get itself into a lather over flu? No. Because we have learned over years to live with it.
Covid is slowly getting like that know. Wether we like it or not.
I know many people who have not had it, who are now saying, it’s only a matter of time, I could just doing with getting it and be done with it.
That is a huge departure from where we were two years ago already.

[ColinDouglasHandshake]

We also had flu bullets every year previously but most people weren't too bothered about getting hit by one of those oddly enough.

What a great idea. Let's adopt a totally different response to Covid as we did flu even though both are potentially deadly viruses with similar mortality rates and age vulnerabilities. Genius idea lol.

It is called MASS HYSTERIA ON AN INDUSTRIAL GLOBAL SCALE.

[BillyStubbsTears]

"During the world wars, that would mean keeping in your trench. Avoiding the bullets where possible."

I disagree. It would have meant having tactics and strategies more sophisticated than just telling men to walk towards machine guns and hope for the best.

If any person young or old, healthy or ill walk towards machine guns then the probability of ending up dead is very high.

If any person young or old, healthy or ill contract Covid then the probability of ending up dead is negligible.

Apart from the pushing 200,000 who have already died of it, and the pushing 200 a day who are still dying from it? Yeah, if we ignore them, the chances of dying from this are negligible.

Don't know how old you are, but at my age, an unvaccinated person has a 1-in-100 chance of dying if they catch COVID.

Here's a thought experiment for you. Imagine there's a trainline where an express comes along once an hour. Would you be happy to be blindfolded and have your ears bunged up, then lay your head on the track for a random 36 seconds? Would you be  happy to suggest to several million people that they follow your lead?

[Ldr]

So you are getting your knickers in a twist over a 1% chance?

[BillyStubbsTears]

Wold you expect to die one day in 100? Or more to the point, would you take serious precautions if you were told your chances of dying crossing the road were 1 in 100?

[Ldr]

When it’s my time it’s my time, nothing I can do about it, the universe will make it happen. Stop worrying about everything and enjoy your life mate. You’ll be happier for it