No Brexit Extension

[Not Now Kato]

  Well I will give you that one, but isn't he a young un likely to have voted to remain dumpling.

   But sadly, the young un's who would have voted remain, (and they're the ones who's future will be badly affected because of it), were denied the vote by those with nothing at all to gain who voted leave!

[selby]

  That is why I voted remain Kato, knowing that we would fudge it if the result was leave.
  The difference is I have accepted I lost and have not spent four years moaning and bitching about it, and have accepted the result of a democratic vote, and I might add  the house of commons voting to verify it, and the results of the following two general elections with Brexit the main bone of contention, nor have I insulted others until insulted myself first.
  Nor do the insults bother me one iota, although I will respond, and it helps to know it obviously gets under their skin doing so. It's quite funny really.

[IDM]

The vast majority who voted remain accept the result.  The challenge is in implementing it in the best interests of the country, something which the government isn’t doing particularly well, is it.?

[BillyStubbsTears]

The vast majority who voted remain accept the result.  The challenge is in implementing it in the best interests of the country, something which the government isn’t doing particularly well, is it.?

This. In spades.

Back in 2018, a poll found that nearly 80% of the country, including the majority of Remain voters, would have been prepared to accept a Norway-type deal. The sort of deal that was pushed by the Leave side in 2016 as something to aspire to.

What we are actually careering into is something far, far more of a break with the EU than was ever discussed in 2016.

And people like Selby say that folk who aren't happy with this are some sort of disgrace to democracy!

Talk about being through the looking glass.

[wilts rover]

Barnier responds to Mark Francois letter about the EU's unreasonable demands:

...if they are so unreasonable why did Johnson sign up to them and why you vote for them when you passed the Withdrawal Agreement...

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/brexit-michel-barnier-mark-francois-eu-trade-demands-a9611921.html

[BillyStubbsTears]

That letter from Barnier is one of the most brutal put downs I have ever read.

It screams out from every paragraph, "You are either utterly unprincipled or as thick as a bucket of monkey spunk."

There is a beautifully subtle, elegant, unspoken slap in it too.

Barnier, a man whose first language is French, was sent a letter by Francois written in English (appalling grammar, but there you go...). Barnier would have been perfectly within his rights to reply in French. But he's a bigger person than that. Instead, he did Francois the honour of replying in English. AMERICAN English. The unspoken put down there is quite masterful.

Cue the usual suspects ignoring the substantive points of this post and screaming the "whose side are you on?" mantra.

[Not Now Kato]

  That is why I voted remain Kato, knowing that we would fudge it if the result was leave.
  The difference is I have accepted I lost and have not spent four years moaning and bitching about it, and have accepted the result of a democratic vote, and I might add  the house of commons voting to verify it, and the results of the following two general elections with Brexit the main bone of contention, nor have I insulted others until insulted myself first.
  Nor do the insults bother me one iota, although I will respond, and it helps to know it obviously gets under their skin doing so. It's quite funny really.

It's one thing to accept the result - we all have had to do that as we can't change it.  It's something else to look to the delivery of what was promised and it's right to complain when what was promised is far from being delivered. I'm still waiting for what I asked for from leavers very early in this process - just one way in which we, as a country, will be better off outside the EU than within. To date, not one leaver has come forward with a single way in which we will be better off.  You may find that acceptable, (part of accepting that we lost?), I don't - to me it seems that the 'winners' have lost, but unfortunately they are taking us down with themselves!
 
As to insults. I hope that you don't see my meme's as insults, rather they are meant to poke fun and lighten the mood in a time which is a serious issue for us all. We are all losers here, the winners are those, (like Mogg), with assets abroad who will stand to gain at the expense of the ordinary man in the street.  Though I was being serious when I said you should take a rest - you have to admit your outburst was quite something of a meltdown, and that isn't good for you.
 
Stay safe mate.

[tyke1962]

  Well I will give you that one, but isn't he a young un likely to have voted to remain dumpling.

No I'll tell you who that bloke in the video is Selby , that's me 18 months ago after getting made redundant going to Wombwell Library to sign up for some god forbidden agency and the three minimum wage jobs that they were kindly offering on the bull shyte temp to perm gig they like to dangle .

12 of us turn up of which it becomes apparent that apart from myself and another kid 10 are eastern European .

I fill in the forms and have the interview and despite the fact I've done practically to same job for 25 years and can offer you references to back that up the interview is about as far as I get .

Don't even get me started on this shyte and on this particular  EU point because Tony Blair can go feck himself along with the rest of the EU cheap labour people traffickers that they are in Brussels .

There's little point people in well furnished offices looking through the window on this fine , green and pleasant land and preaching to me about reality or this and that until you've walked in those shoes .

And it's hardly the first time either for me personally .

I couldn't actually give a shyte how much poverty there is in Romania because it's enough to be going on with how much there is around these parts which includes my own daughter if we didn't help them out .

If it bothers you that much and puts you out bugga off over the channel then , nobody's stopping you .

Rant over .

[wilts rover]

If it bothers you that much and puts you out bugga off over the channel then , nobody's stopping you .

Errr, hate to break it to you but thats exactly what you voted to stop.

From 31st January this year, neither you nor I or anyone with a British passport has the freedom to go and live and work 'across the channel'.

Anyone who voted for Brexit voted to abolish freedom of movement for BRITISH people - whether they understood that or not.

You won. Get over it.

[Not Now Kato]

Here you go Tyke, this is what you voted for -  irrespective of the results of any negotiations....
 
https://yorkshirebylines.co.uk/eu-launches-its-own-shock-and-awe-campaign-early/?fbclid=IwAR1l8266ECUKNQosho_4J3Byk-Bx8uMBF_wn-WPihSdIhE7Sx4O2RvdhzFM
 
Now in what way is any of that helping your daughter?

[Glyn_Wigley]

  Well I will give you that one, but isn't he a young un likely to have voted to remain dumpling.

No I'll tell you who that bloke in the video is Selby , that's me 18 months ago after getting made redundant going to Wombwell Library to sign up for some god forbidden agency and the three minimum wage jobs that they were kindly offering on the bull shyte temp to perm gig they like to dangle .

12 of us turn up of which it becomes apparent that apart from myself and another kid 10 are eastern European .

I fill in the forms and have the interview and despite the fact I've done practically to same job for 25 years and can offer you references to back that up the interview is about as far as I get .

Don't even get me started on this shyte and on this particular  EU point because Tony Blair can go feck himself along with the rest of the EU cheap labour people traffickers that they are in Brussels .

There's little point people in well furnished offices looking through the window on this fine , green and pleasant land and preaching to me about reality or this and that until you've walked in those shoes .

And it's hardly the first time either for me personally .

I couldn't actually give a shyte how much poverty there is in Romania because it's enough to be going on with how much there is around these parts which includes my own daughter if we didn't help them out .

If it bothers you that much and puts you out bugga off over the channel then , nobody's stopping you .

Rant over .

Why blame Tony Blair? Freedom Of Movement happened five years before he became PM.

Do you live in Wombwell? I lived there for fifteen years myself.

[Glyn_Wigley]

Here you go Tyke, this is what you voted for -  irrespective of the results of any negotiations....
 
https://yorkshirebylines.co.uk/eu-launches-its-own-shock-and-awe-campaign-early/?fbclid=IwAR1l8266ECUKNQosho_4J3Byk-Bx8uMBF_wn-WPihSdIhE7Sx4O2RvdhzFM
 
Now in what way is any of that helping your daughter?

Customs formalities on goods

Customs rules required under EU law will apply to all goods entering the customs territory of the EU from the United Kingdom, or leaving that customs territory to the United Kingdom. Even if an ambitious free trade area is established with the EU, providing for zero tariffs and zero quotas on goods with customs and regulatory cooperation, all the regulatory non-tariff barriers, usually far more costly in extra paperwork and delays than any tariff, will still apply.

Rules of origin

Again, if we agree a trade deal with zero tariffs, goods traded will have to be shown (with evidence if necessary) to have a minimum percentage of UK content in order for them to be entitled to preferential zero-tariff-zero-quota treatment. It’s worth bearing in mind that most cars manufactured in the UK do not meet the minimum percentage set out in the EU- Korean FTA, for example, which is 55 per cent.

Exactly what I've been saying for the past five years. But then, how could I possibly know what would happen, eh?

[Not Now Kato]

Here you go Tyke, this is what you voted for -  irrespective of the results of any negotiations....
 
https://yorkshirebylines.co.uk/eu-launches-its-own-shock-and-awe-campaign-early/?fbclid=IwAR1l8266ECUKNQosho_4J3Byk-Bx8uMBF_wn-WPihSdIhE7Sx4O2RvdhzFM
 
Now in what way is any of that helping your daughter?

Customs formalities on goods

Customs rules required under EU law will apply to all goods entering the customs territory of the EU from the United Kingdom, or leaving that customs territory to the United Kingdom. Even if an ambitious free trade area is established with the EU, providing for zero tariffs and zero quotas on goods with customs and regulatory cooperation, all the regulatory non-tariff barriers, usually far more costly in extra paperwork and delays than any tariff, will still apply.

Rules of origin

Again, if we agree a trade deal with zero tariffs, goods traded will have to be shown (with evidence if necessary) to have a minimum percentage of UK content in order for them to be entitled to preferential zero-tariff-zero-quota treatment. It’s worth bearing in mind that most cars manufactured in the UK do not meet the minimum percentage set out in the EU- Korean FTA, for example, which is 55 per cent.

Exactly what I've been saying for the past five years. But then, how could I possibly know what would happen, eh?

I think a fair few of us knew Glyn, it's just that others would rather believe the lies they read in the Daily Mail, Express etc!

[selby]

  While you believe the lies in the Guardian

[BillyStubbsTears]

There we go. My side lies, I know it and I don't care. Therefore your side must also be lying and you must know it and not care.

Doesn't matter that you have proof that my side is lying and I have none that yours is. I'll just wrap myself up in this safe space where I don't have to address stuff that challenges me.

[selby]

your sounding like your hero the boy Jones now Billy.

[Glyn_Wigley]

  While you believe the lies in the Guardian

Who do you mean? I don't read the Guardian, never have.

[selby]

  I bet they didn't even sell it in Wombwell Glyn, The Morning Star perhaps?

[Glyn_Wigley]

  I bet they didn't even sell it in Wombwell Glyn, The Morning Star perhaps?

Why would it matter if they didn't sell it in Wombwell?

And no, never read the Morning Star either, it's about as accurate as you are.

[selby]

Go on let out the secret, it's the Mail isn't it.

[Glyn_Wigley]

Go on let out the secret, it's the Mail isn't it.

You tell me, you want us to think you know everything. It's very holier than thou.

Oh, and still wanting to know what you think Wombwell has to do with anything.

[BillyStubbsTears]

Anyone remember the Leave side in 2016 saying, "Vote Leave on the clear understanding it will lead to a No Deal and job losses"?

https://mobile.twitter.com/Haggis_UK/status/1281879602995048451

I know it's hard to admit when you've been duped, but surely now?

[Not Now Kato]

Courtesy of Jon Danzig.

Brexit is based on blatant mistruths and lies. You may not believe this now, but we will all believe it next year, when Brexit finally arrives, cold, clammy and callous, naked and exposed.

Every reason given to leave was a stinking falsification. When, one day, there is a public inquiry into how our country was conned, there will be gasps into how conniving, cunning politicians managed to get away with it.
Lies, lies and more lies. That’s how Leave won.

In summary:

▪ MORE SOVEREIGNTY? Nonsense. We’ll get less. In the EU, we gained a share of sovereignty of our continent. Outside the EU, we’ll still live on a planet and have to obey thousands of international laws and treaties.
We share sovereignty with NATO, for example. Is that a reason to leave it?

▪ FEWER MIGRANTS? Really? Just think about it. Most EU migrants in Britain have been in gainful employment, doing jobs that we simply don’t have enough Britons to do, and making a massive NET contribution to our Treasury and economy.
Migrants come here for jobs – and if there are no jobs, they mostly don’t come, or don’t stay.

▪ MORE HOUSES, SCHOOLS AND HOSPITALS? Think again. Britain has a chronic shortage of skilled workers. Without EU migrants, we’ll have fewer builders, teachers, doctors and nurses.

Migrants are not the cause of our problems. Blaming them just excuses successive UK governments from investing sufficiently in our country.
▪ GET OUR COUNTRY BACK? We never lost it. If being in the EU means losing your country, why aren’t the 27 other EU member states planning to leave?
(Really, none of them are: support for the EU is the highest it’s been in 35 years).

▪ OUR OWN LAWS? The vast majority of laws in the UK are our laws and passed by our Parliament in Westminster, otherwise it would have nothing to do.
But in the EU, we benefit from laws and regulations for our continent that no single country alone could ever achieve.
Could our UK government have got mobile phone companies to scrap exorbitant roaming charges across the entire EU? To take Google to task for “abusive practices”? To ensure generous compensation for delayed flights across our continent? Of course not.
It took the might of 28 EU countries working together to achieve that, and so much more.

▪ THE EU IS RUN BY FACELESS BUREAUCRATS? Another lie. The EU is a democracy, run and ruled by its members, the 27 countries of the EU, along with its democratically elected European Parliament.
The European Commission is the servant of the EU, not its master, and the European Parliament has the power to choose, and dismiss, the entire Commission.

THE CASE FOR BRETURN

Before Brexit, no member state had ever left the EU. And no other member state is planning to leave now.
That’s hardly surprising. All the reasons to be an EU member are based on true, tangible and tested benefits over many decades.
In summary:

▪ PROFITABLE: EU membership is profitable – in real terms it cost Britain nothing to belong to the EU. On the contrary, we got back many times the cost of the annual membership fee. Being in the EU made us better off.
The CBI has calculated that EU membership was worth around £3,000 a year to every British family — a return of nearly £10 for each £1 we paid in.
[Source: CBI Report: Our Global Future, page 11:]

▪ PEACE: It’s the structure of the EU that has helped to ensure that no shots have ever been fired between member states. That’s an enormous achievement for a continent that was previously used to violence, wars and subjugation as the way to ‘settle’ issues.
In 2012, by a unanimous decision of the Norwegian Nobel Committee, the EU won the Nobel Peace Prize for advancing the causes of peace, democracy and human rights in Europe for over 60 years.

▪ FREEDOMS: The EU gives members freedom across much of our continent.
EU citizens enjoy the right to live, work, study or retire in any EU and EEA country – including access to state healthcare and education when working in those countries. That’s a precious right, that took decades to achieve.
The EU also gives members the right to free AND frictionless trade between member states, which has helped to maintain Europe as the planet’s richest continent.
The loss of these freedoms will be increasingly devastating for Britain and Britons.
Almost half of ALL our exports, and just over half of ALL our imports, go to and come from the EU. Nowhere else in the world comes even close.
The EU has an iron tariff wall against non-members. Outside of the EU, we are on the wrong side of that wall.
Even non-European countries that have negotiated ‘free trade’ agreements with the EU don’t enjoy full free trade access to Europe’s internal market, as Britain did as an EU member.

▪ DEMOCRACY: EU members have a democratic say, votes and vetoes on the running and future direction of our continent.
Outside the EU, Britain can only look on as those decisions are made without us – even though those decisions will affect us just as much, whether we’re in the EU or not.
Leaving means losing sovereignty, not gaining it.

▪ POWER: The EU is the world’s largest and most successful trading bloc, and the world’s biggest exporter and importer of manufactured goods and services.
The EU is one of the world’s top three economies, alongside the USA and China.
The Euro, in record time, has become the world’s most traded and trusted currency, alongside the US dollar.
All that gives the EU huge power, reach and muscle – enabling it to negotiate the best free trade agreements with other countries on behalf of its members.
Outside the EU, Britain is unlikely to get trade deals as good as, let alone better than, the free trade agreements we had as an EU member covering over 70 countries.
In any event, it will take years, maybe decades to find out.

▪ PROTECTION: EU laws protecting the rights of workers, consumers and travellers across our continent are probably among the most important EU membership benefits.
For example, 4-weeks paid holiday a year; the 48-hour working week; anti-discrimination law; guaranteed rights for agency workers; guaranteed worker consultation – all of these protections largely exist because of the EU.
No single national government can assure safety and protection across our continent. It needs the reach of a pan-European intergovernmental organisation to achieve that (albeit with the democratic consensus of member states).
Britain enjoys cleaner beaches as a direct result of EU directives on protecting the environment. Before those directives, successive British governments were not interested in cleaning up our beaches.
In addition, the EU is leading the world in tackling climate change – something that individual countries alone simply can’t undertake.
The government’s post-Brexit plan is to take away the rights of British citizens to sue them over issues such as workers’ rights, environmental policy and business regulation. This right to sue our government on these issues was something we only enjoyed under EU law.
There will be many other rights lost as a direct result of Brexit.

▪ STRENGTH: In a world dominated by the USA, China and Russia, Britain is dwarfed on its own. Being part of the EU gives us a bigger say and more strength on the global stage than as a small country out-at-sea and going-it-alone.
We could instead become closer to the USA – but is that what we really want?

I know you voted Remain selby, but the above should make you, (and others), think about what you're now supporting.

[Not Now Kato]

And if the above doesn't make you stop and think then....
 

 
 
 
It's not about you, it's about our future generations.

[SydneyRover]

I'll be OK though because despite the truth of what the UK will be despite the hardships the job losses the poverty and that the rich will live in enclaves where the hoi polloi will only go to clean, cook and tend the garden because I'm going to live in ................................

 Selbyland where everyone is treated equally, where fruit and veg grows all year round and picks itself where if you need a job there is one and the world beats a path to our door and generously gives us more we would ever need and the NHS is filled with happy smiling faces in lovely brand new buildings and there are no queues.

Selbyland don't forget to register 

[Glyn_Wigley]

I think a fair few of us knew Glyn, it's just that others would rather believe the lies they read in the Daily Mail, Express etc!

The latest one being the front of today's Sunday Express, where they're spouting that we're 'taking back control of our borders' by beefing up border posts, and that by doing so it's the Government threatening the EU with No Deal. What complete bullshit. We have to set up proper border controls anyway, whether we get a Deal or not because every movement of goods between the UK and the EU is suddenly on Jan 1st going to have to have a Customs Declaration and undergo Clearance procedures, in both directions. And yet there are those who swallow this kind of crap without a squeak and regurgitate it in these forums - and expect others to take them seriously.

[Not Now Kato]

I think a fair few of us knew Glyn, it's just that others would rather believe the lies they read in the Daily Mail, Express etc!

The latest one being the front of today's Sunday Express, where they're spouting that we're 'taking back control of our borders' by beefing up border posts, and that by doing so it's the Government threatening the RU with No Deal. What complete bullshit. We have to set up proper border controls anyway, whether we get a Deal or not because every movement of goods between the UK and the EU is suddenly on Jan 1st going to have to have a Customs Declaration and undergo Clearance procedures, in both directions. And yet there are those who swallow this kind of crap without a squeak and regurgitate it in these forums - and expect others to take them seriously.

Yep, and according to the BBC this morning our border control systems won't be ready until July 2021 - The first week of January 2021 is going to be very interesting indeed.
 
Meanwhile, what's already happening in Selbyland....
 
https://bylinetimes.com/2020/07/07/a-very-british-coup-former-royal-navy-trident-submarine-commander-assesses/?mc_cid=705c2a256f&mc_eid=7c350f1cab&fbclid=IwAR1rhXNdGW6ejLnPSB5owgCpcI1tyPHEBUc3x6Z4p1EO00YqKmSWPKfd3yA

[SydneyRover]

Who the hell knows what went on or what is going on Kato? One thing is for sure these guys are pulling everyines plonka.

''Revealed: Dominic Cummings firm paid Vote Leave's AI firm £260,000

Boris Johnson’s chief adviser declines to explain reason for payments to Faculty''

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2020/jul/12/revealed-dominic-cummings-firm-paid-vote-leaves-ai-firm-260000

[Not Now Kato]

Who the hell knows what went on or what is going on Kato? One thing is for sure these guys are pulling everyines plonka.

''Revealed: Dominic Cummings firm paid Vote Leave's AI firm £260,000

Boris Johnson’s chief adviser declines to explain reason for payments to Faculty''

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2020/jul/12/revealed-dominic-cummings-firm-paid-vote-leaves-ai-firm-260000

At any other time there'd be resignations over things like this.  But with this government, and Cummings at the wheel, no chance - they just don't care about being caught out!

[Not Now Kato]

And to ad to post #656 above....
 

Michael Gove, cabinet office minister, has announced a £705m package of measures to strengthen Britain’s borders, claiming it would help the UK “seize the opportunities” of Brexit.


Mr Gove has had to delay by six months the full implementation of border controls from January 1 — when the Brexit transition period ends — after he claimed Covid-19 had held up preparations.


That has led to tensions with Liz Truss, trade secretary, who said the porous border could lead to smuggling and breach Britain’s obligations under the World Trade Organization to carry out checks.


Mr Gove’s plans include new border control posts and 500 extra Border Force staff, with proposals to set up checks away from ports that do not have the space to expand customs controls.


The money will include £470m for port and inland infrastructure and £235m for IT systems and staffing, while there will also be more cash for HM Revenue & Customs to reduce the burden on traders who will face new paperwork when trading with the EU.

Source.... https://www.ft.com/content/3e47ef0f-a33c-4c82-a956-a338d37cfc95
 
Wasn't one of the benefit of getting out of the EU supposed to be reducing bureaucracy and red tape?