If SOD does go who would replace him?

[Akinfenwa]

If somebody is a manager and has a successful record then we know that they're are a good manager. If somebody is a player we haven't a clue if they are any good or not. I'm not saying that experience makes a difference in terms of management ability, it just means it is less of a risk to appoint someone who has some sort of experience of success. That's what I think anyway. I would be more comfortable if we went for someone with experience of success at a lower level than no experience at all. Hughes and Bruce are irrelevent. You made out that anyone can be taught how to continue Sean's success, for each Bruce, their is an Ince or a D Ferguson. Wilson could be good or shite, its a bigger risk than going for someone who we know to be a good manager.

[VikingJames]

Viking Don wrote:

BTW Most players under Fergie didn't become successful managers because they were already rich! But Mark Hughes and Steve Bruce aren't doing badly, did you conveniently forget those two PREMIERSHIP managers?

You were the one who said ANY player could pick up his skills and be a successful manager.

Viking Don wrote:

BTW James, thanks for explaining what skill means, I really had no idea...

That was quite obvious from your harebrained Pele comment...  

[Viking Don]

VikingJames wrote:

Viking Don wrote:

Well I can only bow to your superior knowledge of the game. I don't think I ever said ANY player could be a successful manager or even a good player. So fook off with that one, and don't f**king moan about swearing you great big pussy.  

Honestly you really think experience makes a difference?

Give me an example in our recent history please.

It's not about that. It's about risk.

If you appoint a manager who has already been a successful manager, it is less of a risk than appointing someone who has never even been in coaching, let alone management. That is quite obvious.

Well who's talking out of their arse now?

Wow, that's why the job of manager is so fragile. It matters not how fcuking much experience you have got, it matters what you do now. Haven't you got that yet? Every club appoints a new manager who has experience don't they (almost). And they all go on to win the fcuking league don't they James.

You're talking about risk. Yes it would be risky to appoint you or me. I think Wilson is clever enough to know what's what.

[Akinfenwa]

Viking Don wrote:

You're talking about risk. Yes it would be risky to appoint you or me. I think Wilson is clever enough to know what's what.

Fair enough if you think that but appointing someone who you think could be good is more risky than appointing someone we know to be good from a chairman's point of view. We can't afford to take big risks in this league IMO.

[Viking Don]

And that's where we can agree.

Whoever takes over on that dim and hopefully distant day will have been vetted by JR over many months if not years.

So all is well in planet Donny.

PS Probably be MW though  

[VikingJames]

Viking Don wrote:

VikingJames wrote:

Viking Don wrote:

Well I can only bow to your superior knowledge of the game.

Honestly you really think experience makes a difference?

Give me an example in our recent history please.

It's not about that. It's about risk.

If you appoint a manager who has already been a successful manager, it is less of a risk than appointing someone who has never even been in coaching, let alone management. That is quite obvious.

Well who's talking out of their arse now?

Wow, that's why the job of manager is so fragile. It matters not how fcuking much experience you have got, it matters what you do now. Haven't you got that yet? Every club appoints a new manager who has experience don't they (almost). And they all go on to win the fcuking league don't they James.

You're talking about risk. Yes it would be risky to appoint you or me. I think Wilson is clever enough to know what's what.

You're the one struggling and thus trying to over-compensate by punctuating every other word by swearing.

Like how you disregarded the rest of the paragraph that I wrote. You're going off on a tangent. My point is, we're in a position where we can't spend millions and millions on our squad, and therefore naturally we won't have as strong a squad as other teams in the division. Therefore I feel WE (not talking about any other club) would be better going with a manager who has a bit of experience at getting the best out of limited resources. If you think that appointing somebody with NO experience of this presents less of/equal a risk then fair enough... I happen to disagree.

And what do you mean \"It doesn't matter what experience you've got, it matters what you do now. Haven't you got that yet?\" .... I wasn't aware that was a cold hard fact rather than your opinion. I dare say I should bow to your superior knowledge of the game on that count.  

[Akinfenwa]

Viking Don wrote:

And that's where we can agree.

Whoever takes over on that dim and hopefully distant day will have been vetted by JR over many months if not years.

So all is well in planet Donny.

PS Probably be MW though  

If John Ryan thinks that Willo will be the right man for DRFC then fine, I trust he will make the right choice. If it were ME though as a fan on this forum right now, I don't know anything of Willo's management capabilities at all and feel it less of a risk to appoint a decent L1 manager with success and a good reputation to show for himself rather than a player who may or may not be a good manager. I'm just trying to justify my opinion here.

[Viking Don]

James I agree with you 100%. Is that OK?
Apart from

And what do you mean \"It doesn't matter what experience you've got, it matters what you do now. Haven't you got that yet?\" .... I wasn't aware that was a cold hard fact rather than your opinion. I dare say I should bow to your superior knowledge of the game on that count. '

Yes you should. It is a cold hard fact, not opinion. Do you want examples? Tan man has loads of experience, should we get him? I can of think many others. You name them.

[VikingJames]

Viking Don wrote:

James mate, I didn't say EVERY player could become a successful manager just because they have played under a successful manager, that was your implication! I said they CAN. I've given examples, so it's possible.

As for the hairbrained Pele comment - well I just think skill is something you display on a football field (in the context of a football forum).

Yep, they might well be able to do. But it doesn't mean it wouldn't be a risk appointing Wilson. We are surviving in this league on tight margins, and one thing I believe could sway that could be the loss of a manager with the experience and skills of getting the best out of cheap players, and replacing him with someone who has never coached (let alone managed) who we have no idea of whether he'd be able to recreate that or not. We're going round in circles. I've explained my point enough times.

Skill is something you display on a football field. But to dismiss the term \"managerial skills\" I found a bit daft. And to say \"what does he need skill for, he doesn't play\" just came across as splitting hairs with the terminology rather than actually making a point.

[Viking Don]

Akinfenwa wrote:

Viking Don wrote:

And that's where we can agree.

Whoever takes over on that dim and hopefully distant day will have been vetted by JR over many months if not years.

So all is well in planet Donny.

PS Probably be MW though  

If John Ryan thinks that Willo will be the right man for DRFC then fine, I trust he will make the right choice. If it were ME though as a fan on this forum right now, I don't know anything of Willo's management capabilities at all and feel it less of a risk to appoint a decent L1 manager with success and a good reputation to show for himself rather than a player who may or may not be a good manager. I'm just trying to justify my opinion here.

Your opinion is already justified mate, that's what the forum is about, we are not always going to agree. I don't think we are disagreeing actually, we are both trusting JR to appoint a manager. It's just our job to get behind whoever the next one will be (whenever that will be).

[Viking Don]

PEACE

DELETE DELETE DELETE  


But at the end of day, do you want a complete outsider coming in and ordering you around, or do you want to keep the Status Quo and continue in the same vein, when THAT is what you you've been taught, player power. And of course it is a risk whoever is appointed, there are no guarantees, however much experience they may have. It's already a risk with SoD FFS. We should be down already with the injuries etc.

[bedale rover]

any way back to the thread

my choice would be gareth southgate

DD on the other hand made a good suggestion (for a change he good on pubs though) keith hill from rochdale laboured away successfully with our former contempories rochdale B)

[Wellred]

Hang on a minute. Wasn't our last Manager totally inexperienced? He didn't too bad a job did he?

[Savvy]

Viking Don wrote:

The players have got Sean's style, he's passed on his knowledge. That's why I would look at someone from within first. Football is a game, all the new bloke needs to do is try and play it the same way as we already do. And have big shoulders.

We're not the type of side to go and get someone with experience when we already have that potential within the squad. e.g. DP anyone? (Not you Nudga).

Dave Penney would do fine for me, and no not for sentimental reasons! He had us playing some brilliant football, in fact pound for pound the best I've seen in my time watching the lads! There is no evidence to suggest that he couldn't have achieved what Sean has given the opportunity but I guess it would hinge on whether or not JR and DP could settle their differences and leave the past in the past!

Personally, I don't see O'Driscoll leaving for a team thats no better than where he's at, never mind what the blunts say! The Middlesboro job was one that I thought he'd have been a good candidate for!

[DaveDRFC]

Speaking of the Dave Penney era, noticed in the paper that Coventry are letting McIndoe leave on a free transfer in January.

I know this has been done to death but...

Worth a punt?  

[Wellred]

No to both.
They did ok for us when they were at the club but we have moved on to a higher level.
Neither DP or MM have.

[Savvy]

Wellred wrote:

No to both.
They did ok for us when they were at the club but we have moved on to a higher level.
Neither DP or MM have.

 

\"They did ok for us\" quote of the week!!!  

[Rios]

No to Penney for me.  The man will always be a hero here, but it's a retrograde step and his man management skills are not upto it (and that's from his Oldham days, not just ours!)

Surprised no-one has mentioned Sullivan.  Not sure he'd be my choice but he's been around played under many managers so I wonder if he'd be interested/considered.  Also wonder if ROK could finally be convinced to break those ties and step out of the shadows to take a managerial role?

For me it'd be ROK, Howe, then Tisdale, then John Still (Dagenham) in that order.

I think we've been spoilt with not only the football but also the whole ethos that SOD and has brought to the club, so JR would have to be very careful about the next appointment.  To be fair to him, he's done pretty well at chosing the last two manager (we'll pretend Steve Wignall didn't happen shall we?) so I'm pretty confident he'll make the right choice regardless of compensation we'd have to stump up to get the right candidate to take us forward.

[Savvy]

Why would it be a retrograde step? Didn't he finish each season higher than the one before? As for his man management skills, what was the problem? If people stepped out of line he dealt with it, isn't that what he is supposed to do?

Always spoke his mind and said what he thought which I think is a refreshing quality rather than a weakness.

The only barrier for me would be wether or not JR and Penney could reconcile former differences, if that could be done I think he'd be a perfect choice!

[CusworthRovers]

Speaking of ROK, can we all remember when the Mariners job was available and he was linked with that. I still recall Sean saying he would allow ROK to go if he wanted too. In all honesty it was another honourable Sean type interview scenario of doing the right thing and the said person having the opportunity to do the right thing. Well that's how he portrays it on TV/Radio/Press.

[Rios]

Savvy wrote:

Why would it be a retrograde step? Didn't he finish each season higher than the one before? As for his man management skills, what was the problem? If people stepped out of line he dealt with it, isn't that what he is supposed to do?

Always spoke his mind and said what he thought which I think is a refreshing quality rather than a weakness.

The only barrier for me would be wether or not JR and Penney could reconcile former differences, if that could be done I think he'd be a perfect choice!

Because he didn't deal with it.  Some people need stamping on, Foster for example who rightly deserved to be booted out of the club for his antics.  Others needed a cuddle and encouragement to get the best out of them.  Always speaking your mind whilst a Yorkshire tradition does not always get you where you need to be.  Sometimes biting your tounge and keeping your trap shut is the better part of valour. It's no coincidence that SOD has managed to get the best out of some pretty wayward souls none of whom turn up drunk for training!

And am I the only one who remembers the lack of Plan B with Penney?  Or that he fell out with half the playing squad?  Or that he did so poorly at Oldham where he had a modest wage budget which would be similiary relative to the one he'd have here in the Championship?  Or that the Oldham fans hate him for his terrible negative tactics and his arrogance towards them?

It was good while it lasted, but I don't think JR owns a pair of rose tinted specs.

[Savvy]

Rios wrote:

Savvy wrote:

Why would it be a retrograde step? Didn't he finish each season higher than the one before? As for his man management skills, what was the problem? If people stepped out of line he dealt with it, isn't that what he is supposed to do?

Always spoke his mind and said what he thought which I think is a refreshing quality rather than a weakness.

The only barrier for me would be wether or not JR and Penney could reconcile former differences, if that could be done I think he'd be a perfect choice!

Because he didn't deal with it.  Some people need stamping on, Foster for example who rightly deserved to be booted out of the club for his antics.  Others needed a cuddle and encouragement to get the best out of them.  Always speaking your mind whilst a Yorkshire tradition does not always get you where you need to be.  Sometimes biting your tounge and keeping your trap shut is the better part of valour. It's no coincidence that SOD has managed to get the best out of some pretty wayward souls none of whom turn up drunk for training!

And am I the only one who remembers the lack of Plan B with Penney?  Or that he fell out with half the playing squad?  Or that he did so poorly at Oldham where he had a modest wage budget which would be similiary relative to the one he'd have here in the Championship?  Or that the Oldham fans hate him for his terrible negative tactics and his arrogance towards them?

It was good while it lasted, but I don't think JR owns a pair of rose tinted specs.

No plan B and negative tactics, thats all subjective isn't it? Cold hard facts are he improved the position of this club season upon season, how you manage to involve what he did at other clubs as part of your arguement is beyond me, neither of us know the circumstances in which he was working so again that would be pure conjecture!

Take it thats the same Steve Foster that joined him at Darlington he had so much of a falling out with?

JR doesn't need rose tinted specs, just hard nosed business sense!

[RTID75]

I've always been impressed with what Nigel Adkins did at Scunny with little money - a little like SOD with both Bournemouth and us. I don't think we'd stand much chance of landing him now though.

[wabtec]

when o dysmall goes I would go for dave penney he knows the club knows the players and is a good manager,penney would nt feel sorry for middlesbro when donny had just beaten them he would be pleased for donny rovers and glad of the 3 points,

[grayx]

Wellred wrote:

If SOD does go I would expect JR to go for.........................................................................wait for it.






Mark Wilson

Correct. Nailed on.

[northern soul]

Might not be popular, but what about


Schteve



He's not from too far away, and by the time, we've lot our man, and had a caretaker in for a couple of games, he'll be gone from Wolfsburg. Might be out of our price range, but might fancy a challenge in England again. Working in holland will have helped him tactically, and we do kind of play a Dutch type(ish) football.

Be nice to dream, an Ex-england manager at the rovers! Go away Sven.

[VikingJames]

Absolutely massive NO to Penney for me.

Good manager in the lower leagues, but we've moved on since then, and I think he's too limited tactically for the Championship, and he'd probably get found out against the more tactically aware managers in this division.

Some people have short memories if you ask me. Yes, Penney did brilliantly here overall, but we watched some absolute dross towards the end, and some of his signings were poor to say the least. Think how much SOD has done to move us on (especially off the pitch) from what we were when DP was here. Getting Penney in would be a step backwards I'm afraid.

[grayx]

VikingJames wrote:

Absolutely massive NO to Penney for me.

Good manager in the lower leagues, but we've moved on since then, and I think he's too limited tactically for the Championship, and he'd probably get found out against the more tactically aware managers in this division.

Some people have short memories if you ask me. Yes, Penney did brilliantly here overall, but we watched some absolute dross towards the end, and some of his signings were poor to say the least. Think how much SOD has done to move us on (especially off the pitch) from what we were when DP was here. Getting Penney in would be a step backwards I'm afraid.

Agreed. Would be a big, backward step.

[george-friend]

Kevin Blackwell.


And yes that is a serious post.

[GM-MarkB]

wabtec wrote:

when o dysmall goes I would go for dave penney he knows the club knows the players and is a good manager,penney would nt feel sorry for middlesbro when donny had just beaten them he would be pleased for donny rovers and glad of the 3 points,

Ermmm..ok, i'll give you a starter for 10, then you can name the rest of the players that Penney 'knows'....ready...

Copps

And for what it's worth, i'd probably give Wilson a shot at managing the club