Brexit Negotiations

[hoolahoop]

You wiĺl be waiting for a long time to get just one coherent argument or one selective set of stats that a leaver can find from Leaver Central to back up their position.
Excellent post Macho Madness by the way .

[hoolahoop]

Apologies. I mis-read your post. Out of interest, are there examples of rapists being allowed into the country?

Don't be silly there are thousands of them and murderers and loads more committing the most heinous of crimes.

[Glyn_Wigley]

Apologies. I mis-read your post. Out of interest, are there examples of rapists being allowed into the country?

Don't be silly there are thousands of them and murderers and loads more committing the most heinous of crimes.

What...taking away jobs from our good honest home-grown rapists and murderers? bas**rds!

[Bentley Bullet]

Our rapists and murderers shouldn't have jobs to give away, should they?

[Sprotyrover]

Apologies. I mis-read your post. Out of interest, are there examples of rapists being allowed into the country?

Yes we have let dozens an dozens in , mainly hardened criminals from the Baltic states.

[BillyStubbsTears]

Do you have a source for that Sproty?

[Sprotyrover]

Approx 5 years ago an English girl got rapped and murdered by a EEC citizen from the Baltic, it transpired he had 2 previous rape convictions in his own country.
As a result we now have a system whereby every Foreigner arrested in the uk is checked with immigration service who have an information sharing agreement under Shengen with all EEC countries. If it transpires they have convictions they are deported there are several hundred awaiting deportation at the moment.
There ar probably 20/30,000 of them still here at the moment.

[Sprotyrover]

Billy it was the case of Victor Domboskis in 2006.

[hoolahoop]

Billy it was the case of Victor Domboskis in 2006.

Sproty there are upwards of 3,000,000 of these furriners here at any one time and you have as your statistic 1 child rapist from Lithuania. Whilst this man and his crimes were horrendous are you seriously saying there are hundreds more in the country already ? Not doubting your sincerity and fear about this but who says that there are " 20/30,000 " hardened criminals awaiting return " ? If so why the f**k haven't we been doing our jobs here. 
That's a serious amount of bad boys and girls !

[Sprotyrover]

Billy it was the case of Victor Domboskis in 2006.

Sproty there are upwards of 3,000,000 of these furriners here at any one time and you have as your statistic 1 child rapist from Lithuania. Whilst this man and his crimes were horrendous are you seriously saying there are hundreds more in the country already ? Not doubting your sincerity and fear about this but who says that there are " 20/30,000 " hardened criminals awaiting return " ? If so why the f**k haven't we been doing our jobs here. 
That's a serious amount of bad boys and girls !

You're right Hoola all of those foreigners are here and until they get arrested we haven't got a clue as to their antecedents.
And prior to the case of Dombodkis we were doing nothing about checking up on them.
In fact we had peeps turning up on the motorway hard shoulder, being taken to a Police station fingerprinted and then being released and told to make their own way to Liverpool to register.
Hardly a satisfactory state of affairs isn't it, oh and by the way when Have I ever belittled you in a Post?

[Sprotyrover]

Source interview with Queen Margareth of Denmark re her book, she showed a Saxo instituent i.e. Distinct change in attitude towards the immigrants in Denmark who now make up 8% of the population, example 11% of Somali males have acquired a criminal conviction since their arrival in Denmark, compared to the national average conviction rate for Danish men which is 1.29% figure provide by the Danish ministry for intergration,
If I were you Hoola I would be very worried about my vulnerable daughter going to live in Denmark!

[Sprotyrover]

Since I have taken heed of Billy der grafts quest for sources I have been looking at a few, and boy it's all going tits up in Hoola Utopian state of Denmark,a bit like Sweden really.
10 % of the population now immigrants, half of them mainly male from you know where, 3 times more likely to commit crime, the crimes they commit are far more violent in nature. And they are a major drain on the Danish economy .
Happy days ahead for Denmark.

The sooner we leave the better.!

[BillyStubbsTears]

You didn’t actually give a source for anything you’ve written so far Sproty. I’m not saying it’s wrong. I’m sure there are some examples. But Google throws nowt up for Victor Domboskis.

[DonnyOsmond]

Source interview with Queen Margareth of Denmark re her book, she showed a Saxo instituent i.e. Distinct change in attitude towards the immigrants in Denmark who now make up 8% of the population, example 11% of Somali males have acquired a criminal conviction since their arrival in Denmark, compared to the national average conviction rate for Danish men which is 1.29% figure provide by the Danish ministry for intergration,
If I were you Hoola I would be very worried about my vulnerable daughter going to live in Denmark!

Ahhh that brilliant EU country that is Somalia. Denmark should have their own Brexit then they'll not have anymore of those dodgy Somalians.

[hoolahoop]

Billy it was the case of Victor Domboskis in 2006.

Sproty there are upwards of 3,000,000 of these furriners here at any one time and you have as your statistic 1 child rapist from Lithuania. Whilst this man and his crimes were horrendous are you seriously saying there are hundreds more in the country already ? Not doubting your sincerity and fear about this but who says that there are " 20/30,000 " hardened criminals awaiting return " ? If so why the f**k haven't we been doing our jobs here. 
That's a serious amount of bad boys and girls !

You're right Hoola all of those foreigners are here and until they get arrested we haven't got a clue as to their antecedents.
And prior to the case of Dombodkis we were doing nothing about checking up on them.
In fact we had peeps turning up on the motorway hard shoulder, being taken to a Police station fingerprinted and then being released and told to make their own way to Liverpool to register.
Hardly a satisfactory state of affairs isn't it, oh and by the way when Have I ever belittled you in a Post?

Why do you feel you were belittled . The current prison population in the UK is only 85, 000 but you want us to believe that whilst EU immigrants only represent some 4-5 % of the general population ; they would represent 25- 40 % of our current prison population given your 20-30k figure.

That's why I challenged your figures - what you are in essence suggesting is that Europeans are 6 or even 8 times as likely to be serious criminals than us Brits . Basically that sort of figure came from where ....The Daily Express ?

[hoolahoop]

You didn’t actually give a source for anything you’ve written so far Sproty. I’m not saying it’s wrong. I’m sure there are some examples. But Google throws nowt up for Victor Domboskis.

He is a Lithuanian immigrant that was convicted in 2012 of raping children I think presume that's similar to paedophilia only much more violent . Basically relevant checks weren't done on him. We had one we exported that we only know half the tale of and that was Gary Glitter in Thailand.

[hoolahoop]

" If I were you Hoola I would be very worried about my vulnerable daughter going to live in Denmark! "


Thank you for that Sproty , it's worrying enough for a father to see his teenager living and working abroad only for you to feel the necessity to write that . You have sown seeds of doubt in my mind now ....feel better about supposedly being belittled now ? Pretty shit thing you felt that you had to write eh !

[hoolahoop]

Source interview with Queen Margareth of Denmark re her book, she showed a Saxo instituent i.e. Distinct change in attitude towards the immigrants in Denmark who now make up 8% of the population, example 11% of Somali males have acquired a criminal conviction since their arrival in Denmark, compared to the national average conviction rate for Danish men which is 1.29% figure provide by the Danish ministry for intergration,
If I were you Hoola I would be very worried about my vulnerable daughter going to live in Denmark!

Prison figures per 100,000 :-

Denmark -   61
UK            - 146

On that basis seems she would be safer there notwithstanding the higher % of immigrants compared to Danish people getting into serious problems. Offending is always higher in an underclass that is a) poor in general terms and b) is adjusting to western society's mores.

[wilts rover]

Since I have taken heed of Billy der grafts quest for sources I have been looking at a few, and boy it's all going tits up in Hoola Utopian state of Denmark,a bit like Sweden really.
10 % of the population now immigrants, half of them mainly male from you know where, 3 times more likely to commit crime, the crimes they commit are far more violent in nature. And they are a major drain on the Danish economy .
Happy days ahead for Denmark.

The sooner we leave the better.!

People from Somalia wont have any more or less right to enter this country after Brexit as they have now!

In fact revise that. If the negotiations with India are anything to go by, revising our trade deals with the rest of the world after Brexit will see a condition from that being countries asking for a relaxation of visa conditions for their nationals to enter the UK.

[Bentley Bullet]

But surely there will be fewer wanting to come to a country that's on its knees in poverty after Brexit?

[wilts rover]

But we dont know what is going to happen after Brexit?

[Bentley Bullet]

No wilts, I don't, but you do don't you?

[BillyStubbsTears]

Bentley

Just reflect on this for a moment. Have you ever, at any time before or after the Brexit vote heard anyone from the Remain side say pour scorn on the consensus of opinion from expert economists about what the likely outcome will be?

Then have a think about how many times you’ve heard Brexit supporters claim that we can’t hope to predict what will happen.

Then ask yourself why the two sides have these very different approaches to expert analysis.

[Bentley Bullet]

Bentley

Just reflect on this for a moment. Have you ever, at any time before or after the Brexit vote heard anyone from the Remain side say pour scorn on the consensus of opinion from expert economists about what the likely outcome will be?

Yes, me, for one.

Then have a think about how many times you’ve heard Brexit supporters claim that we can’t hope to predict what will happen.

Then ask yourself why the two sides have these very different approaches to expert analysis.

Some people don't believe there's such a thing as 'expert' analysis of something that has never happened before. Some do.

Now I've answered you, Billy, perhaps you can answer my question to Wilts which was;  surely there will be fewer wanting to come to a country that's on its knees in poverty after Brexit?

[Not Now Kato]

Bentley

Just reflect on this for a moment. Have you ever, at any time before or after the Brexit vote heard anyone from the Remain side say pour scorn on the consensus of opinion from expert economists about what the likely outcome will be?

Yes, me, for one.

Then have a think about how many times you’ve heard Brexit supporters claim that we can’t hope to predict what will happen.

Then ask yourself why the two sides have these very different approaches to expert analysis.

Some people don't believe there's such a thing as 'expert' analysis of something that has never happened before. Some do.

Now I've answered you, Billy, perhaps you can answer my question to Wilts which was;  surely there will be fewer wanting to come to a country that's on its knees in poverty after Brexit?

Depends on the difference between how much worse off they are staying where they are than coming here.
 
Having been to India I am hardly surprised that a key condition of any trade deal with them has to include some form of freedom of movement.

[Bentley Bullet]

Even so, surely they will consider the alternative of relocating to one of the remaining thriving countries still in the EU?

[DevilMayCry]

[BillyStubbsTears]

Bentley.

All other things being equal, it’s pretty much nailed on that we will be a less attractive country for migrants if our economy performs less well than the rest of Europe. What was your point?

[Bentley Bullet]

My point is that Wilts' claim that leaving the EU won't affect the rights of foreigners entering the country is hypothetical, based on the assumption that they won't want to come to a country on its knees in poverty.

What do you think, Billy?

[BillyStubbsTears]

I think your obtuseness and insistence on arguing for the sake of arguing with no real interest in finding a sensible conclusion is very wearing and depressing. But I’m sure you get something out of it.