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Quote from: wilts rover on May 07, 2021, 12:51:03 pmQuote from: Ldr on May 07, 2021, 12:29:19 pmBST this is what you are up against and is a widespread thought in my experience. Nicked from a friends fbI’ve always voted Labour and couldn’t stomach voting Tory because of the memory of my late grandad who was a proper Labour man - however this present lot have lost the working class completely in this country they represent nothing but a very narrow metropolitan elite who sneer at ordinary working people - it’s a crime really that despite everything we’ve only got an opposition in name only And yet the working class are prepared to vote for the party of the proper elite who certainly sneer at ordinary working people - indeed have written books and newspaper articles on how lazy and overpaid they are!!Thats the conundrum. People seem to think that 'Labour' sneer at the working class -when they actually dont and the vast majority of their membership are working class - you wanna see my bricklaying certificates - but that the Tories dont - when they properly despise them.Labour need a postive agenda/policies - but they also need better media management to get that positive message over. Can Starmer do that, well...But well done Boris, big win, everybody should be gracious enough to accept that.Whilst the opinion of the likes of Johnson towards the working class may be that of a “sneering” type, you cannot dispute the fact that this govt has helped pay the wages of millions of people over the last year. I wonder what a Labour govt would have done?
Quote from: Ldr on May 07, 2021, 12:29:19 pmBST this is what you are up against and is a widespread thought in my experience. Nicked from a friends fbI’ve always voted Labour and couldn’t stomach voting Tory because of the memory of my late grandad who was a proper Labour man - however this present lot have lost the working class completely in this country they represent nothing but a very narrow metropolitan elite who sneer at ordinary working people - it’s a crime really that despite everything we’ve only got an opposition in name only And yet the working class are prepared to vote for the party of the proper elite who certainly sneer at ordinary working people - indeed have written books and newspaper articles on how lazy and overpaid they are!!Thats the conundrum. People seem to think that 'Labour' sneer at the working class -when they actually dont and the vast majority of their membership are working class - you wanna see my bricklaying certificates - but that the Tories dont - when they properly despise them.Labour need a postive agenda/policies - but they also need better media management to get that positive message over. Can Starmer do that, well...But well done Boris, big win, everybody should be gracious enough to accept that.
BST this is what you are up against and is a widespread thought in my experience. Nicked from a friends fbI’ve always voted Labour and couldn’t stomach voting Tory because of the memory of my late grandad who was a proper Labour man - however this present lot have lost the working class completely in this country they represent nothing but a very narrow metropolitan elite who sneer at ordinary working people - it’s a crime really that despite everything we’ve only got an opposition in name only
Quote from: normal rules on May 07, 2021, 12:56:50 pmQuote from: wilts rover on May 07, 2021, 12:51:03 pmQuote from: Ldr on May 07, 2021, 12:29:19 pmBST this is what you are up against and is a widespread thought in my experience. Nicked from a friends fbI’ve always voted Labour and couldn’t stomach voting Tory because of the memory of my late grandad who was a proper Labour man - however this present lot have lost the working class completely in this country they represent nothing but a very narrow metropolitan elite who sneer at ordinary working people - it’s a crime really that despite everything we’ve only got an opposition in name only And yet the working class are prepared to vote for the party of the proper elite who certainly sneer at ordinary working people - indeed have written books and newspaper articles on how lazy and overpaid they are!!Thats the conundrum. People seem to think that 'Labour' sneer at the working class -when they actually dont and the vast majority of their membership are working class - you wanna see my bricklaying certificates - but that the Tories dont - when they properly despise them.Labour need a postive agenda/policies - but they also need better media management to get that positive message over. Can Starmer do that, well...But well done Boris, big win, everybody should be gracious enough to accept that.Whilst the opinion of the likes of Johnson towards the working class may be that of a “sneering” type, you cannot dispute the fact that this govt has helped pay the wages of millions of people over the last year. I wonder what a Labour govt would have done?You do realise that it’s not free money that the Government have been handing out don’t you? It’s got to be paid back at some point and there 2 possible ways this will happen:- 1. Increase taxes on the well off 2. Cut public services for the less well off Which one do you think the Tories will do?
Quote from: wilts rover on May 07, 2021, 12:51:03 pmQuote from: Ldr on May 07, 2021, 12:29:19 pmBST this is what you are up against and is a widespread thought in my experience. Nicked from a friends fbI’ve always voted Labour and couldn’t stomach voting Tory because of the memory of my late grandad who was a proper Labour man - however this present lot have lost the working class completely in this country they represent nothing but a very narrow metropolitan elite who sneer at ordinary working people - it’s a crime really that despite everything we’ve only got an opposition in name only And yet the working class are prepared to vote for the party of the proper elite who certainly sneer at ordinary working people - indeed have written books and newspaper articles on how lazy and overpaid they are!!Thats the conundrum. People seem to think that 'Labour' sneer at the working class -when they actually dont and the vast majority of their membership are working class - you wanna see my bricklaying certificates - but that the Tories dont - when they properly despise them.Labour need a postive agenda/policies - but they also need better media management to get that positive message over. Can Starmer do that, well...But well done Boris, big win, everybody should be gracious enough to accept that.Whilst the opinion of the likes of Johnson towards the working class may be that of a “sneering” type, you cannot dispute the fact that this govt has helped pay the wages of millions of people over the last year. I wonder what a Labour govt would have done?
Quote from: Ldr on May 07, 2021, 12:29:19 pmBST this is what you are up against and is a widespread thought in my experience. Nicked from a friends fbI’ve always voted Labour and couldn’t stomach voting Tory because of the memory of my late grandad who was a proper Labour man - however this present lot have lost the working class completely in this country they represent nothing but a very narrow metropolitan elite who sneer at ordinary working people - it’s a crime really that despite everything we’ve only got an opposition in name only And yet the working class are prepared to vote for the party of the proper elite who certainly sneer at ordinary working people - indeed have written books and newspaper articles on how lazy and overpaid they are!!Thats the conundrum. People seem to think that 'Labour' sneer at the working class -when they actually dont and the vast majority of their membership are working class - you wanna see my bricklaying certificates - but that the Tories dont - when they properly despise them.Labour need a postive agenda/policies - but they also need better media management to get that positive message over. Can Starmer do that, well...But well done Boris, big win, everybody should be gracious enough to accept that.
Quote from: Herbert Anchovy on May 07, 2021, 01:15:04 pmQuote from: normal rules on May 07, 2021, 12:56:50 pmQuote from: wilts rover on May 07, 2021, 12:51:03 pmQuote from: Ldr on May 07, 2021, 12:29:19 pmBST this is what you are up against and is a widespread thought in my experience. Nicked from a friends fbI’ve always voted Labour and couldn’t stomach voting Tory because of the memory of my late grandad who was a proper Labour man - however this present lot have lost the working class completely in this country they represent nothing but a very narrow metropolitan elite who sneer at ordinary working people - it’s a crime really that despite everything we’ve only got an opposition in name only And yet the working class are prepared to vote for the party of the proper elite who certainly sneer at ordinary working people - indeed have written books and newspaper articles on how lazy and overpaid they are!!Thats the conundrum. People seem to think that 'Labour' sneer at the working class -when they actually dont and the vast majority of their membership are working class - you wanna see my bricklaying certificates - but that the Tories dont - when they properly despise them.Labour need a postive agenda/policies - but they also need better media management to get that positive message over. Can Starmer do that, well...But well done Boris, big win, everybody should be gracious enough to accept that.Whilst the opinion of the likes of Johnson towards the working class may be that of a “sneering” type, you cannot dispute the fact that this govt has helped pay the wages of millions of people over the last year. I wonder what a Labour govt would have done?You do realise that it’s not free money that the Government have been handing out don’t you? It’s got to be paid back at some point and there 2 possible ways this will happen:- 1. Increase taxes on the well off 2. Cut public services for the less well off Which one do you think the Tories will do? HA, one of our prominent posters told us not long ago that neither of those options were the way to “pay off” the inevitable debt that COVID has thrust upon us and other nations around the World.
Quote from: drfchound on May 07, 2021, 01:19:31 pmQuote from: Herbert Anchovy on May 07, 2021, 01:15:04 pmQuote from: normal rules on May 07, 2021, 12:56:50 pmQuote from: wilts rover on May 07, 2021, 12:51:03 pmQuote from: Ldr on May 07, 2021, 12:29:19 pmBST this is what you are up against and is a widespread thought in my experience. Nicked from a friends fbI’ve always voted Labour and couldn’t stomach voting Tory because of the memory of my late grandad who was a proper Labour man - however this present lot have lost the working class completely in this country they represent nothing but a very narrow metropolitan elite who sneer at ordinary working people - it’s a crime really that despite everything we’ve only got an opposition in name only And yet the working class are prepared to vote for the party of the proper elite who certainly sneer at ordinary working people - indeed have written books and newspaper articles on how lazy and overpaid they are!!Thats the conundrum. People seem to think that 'Labour' sneer at the working class -when they actually dont and the vast majority of their membership are working class - you wanna see my bricklaying certificates - but that the Tories dont - when they properly despise them.Labour need a postive agenda/policies - but they also need better media management to get that positive message over. Can Starmer do that, well...But well done Boris, big win, everybody should be gracious enough to accept that.Whilst the opinion of the likes of Johnson towards the working class may be that of a “sneering” type, you cannot dispute the fact that this govt has helped pay the wages of millions of people over the last year. I wonder what a Labour govt would have done?You do realise that it’s not free money that the Government have been handing out don’t you? It’s got to be paid back at some point and there 2 possible ways this will happen:- 1. Increase taxes on the well off 2. Cut public services for the less well off Which one do you think the Tories will do? HA, one of our prominent posters told us not long ago that neither of those options were the way to “pay off” the inevitable debt that COVID has thrust upon us and other nations around the World.Maybe so Hound, but based on history I’d bet my bottom dollar that one of those 2 options will be used.
Labour politicians and to an extend some activists and members are finding out that implying the electorate are thick xenophobic racists may not be the best way to get their votes
Stainforth and Barnaby Dun Ward now have a conservative ward member of
What an embarrassment and total f*cking disgrace. Sitting governments rarely win by-elections, so for a Tory government beset by sleaze allegations to win a seat that has been Labour for nearly 50 years, by a staggering 7000 votes is beyond abysmal; and who were the clowns responsible for putting a pro-EU Remainer up in a seat in an area that voted 70% for Brexit?It's now clear that the current Labour Party are representative of the liberalist middle classes of London and the South East, and are totally unable to connect to the working class people of the North and North-East.This is a major problem that desperately needs sorting out, or 2024 will become another humiliation.
How can they sort it Steve, for five years they have been telling us the same thing, even the different people they have put in front of us have come up with the same clap trap, publically said people don't know what they are doing, putting forward the clap trap that is put forward by the woke agenda, telling people that the way they live their lives is not right, and basically most of the population especially the older end are uneducated racist bigots. Now the in words are we have to listen and change, change what? the way they think or the words that come out of their mouths just to try and get support, but mean very little. They are finished buddy, its even more down hill from here just like in Scotland.
Quote from: turnbull for england on May 07, 2021, 05:49:48 pmStainforth and Barnaby Dun Ward now have a conservative ward member ofAlways knew Filo was a closet Tory, he will be delighted.The labour councillors won in my area, reduced majority but deserved. Party politics in government shouldn't force good local councillors out.
Quote from: scawsby steve on May 07, 2021, 06:02:34 pmWhat an embarrassment and total f*cking disgrace. Sitting governments rarely win by-elections, so for a Tory government beset by sleaze allegations to win a seat that has been Labour for nearly 50 years, by a staggering 7000 votes is beyond abysmal; and who were the clowns responsible for putting a pro-EU Remainer up in a seat in an area that voted 70% for Brexit?It's now clear that the current Labour Party are representative of the liberalist middle classes of London and the South East, and are totally unable to connect to the working class people of the North and North-East.This is a major problem that desperately needs sorting out, or 2024 will become another humiliation. But again this doesn't make any sense.The party that won the Hartlepool by-election is led by an Old Etonian public schoolboy, who is an ex-Fleet Street newspaper journalist, son of an MEP and EU diplomat, who was brought up in North London. He couldn't be any more metropolitan if he had it tatooed on him. His two chancellors have been City bankers and hedge fund managers - both of whom played a significant part in causing the banking crises!Keir Starmer is the son of a toolmaker and an NHS nurse - and his Mrs works in the NHS!But somehow the Tories (the actual party of the liberal elite, in fact the actual party of the neo-liberal global elite) have convinced you that they are the party of the working class - whilst the party that is funded by the trade unions and its members, the actual working class - isn't. Labour need a better message to, from and in the media. How they do that when its stacked against them - well...
Who would have chosen the Labour candidate for Hartlepool.
Quote from: drfchound on May 07, 2021, 08:07:05 pmWho would have chosen the Labour candidate for Hartlepool.Hound,The local Labour Party should choose, from a shortlist they have selected following due process.Anyone who thinks the London HQ should parachute a candidate in, like they did before with the dreadful Mandelson, has not understood the importance of local democracy.
I mean that's just shameless playing to the gallery from that labour mp. The minute anyone uses the word "woke" these days you can basically guarantee they're talking absolute shite. Mr Mahmood has one eye on his own seat, you feel.Labour's issues go back to when Blair was in power. The current leadership's strategy to fix that seems to just be to call the last bloke a racist and offer tepid slogans about jobs and flags.I mean, look at the process for Hartlepool. Party HQ selected a candidate from a shortlist of 1. The candidate had just been voted out of a nearby constituency, was an arch remainer and had a questionable track record with the Saudis. He's possibly the worst candidate they could have chosen for a highly contested election. That has nothing to do with being "woke". It's just stupidity. And arrogance.
Quote from: wilts rover on May 07, 2021, 07:04:38 pmQuote from: scawsby steve on May 07, 2021, 06:02:34 pmWhat an embarrassment and total f*cking disgrace. Sitting governments rarely win by-elections, so for a Tory government beset by sleaze allegations to win a seat that has been Labour for nearly 50 years, by a staggering 7000 votes is beyond abysmal; and who were the clowns responsible for putting a pro-EU Remainer up in a seat in an area that voted 70% for Brexit?It's now clear that the current Labour Party are representative of the liberalist middle classes of London and the South East, and are totally unable to connect to the working class people of the North and North-East.This is a major problem that desperately needs sorting out, or 2024 will become another humiliation. But again this doesn't make any sense.The party that won the Hartlepool by-election is led by an Old Etonian public schoolboy, who is an ex-Fleet Street newspaper journalist, son of an MEP and EU diplomat, who was brought up in North London. He couldn't be any more metropolitan if he had it tatooed on him. His two chancellors have been City bankers and hedge fund managers - both of whom played a significant part in causing the banking crises!Keir Starmer is the son of a toolmaker and an NHS nurse - and his Mrs works in the NHS!But somehow the Tories (the actual party of the liberal elite, in fact the actual party of the neo-liberal global elite) have convinced you that they are the party of the working class - whilst the party that is funded by the trade unions and its members, the actual working class - isn't. Labour need a better message to, from and in the media. How they do that when its stacked against them - well...The electorate of Hartlepool are entitled to be represented politically by whoever they choose under a democratic process .They've chosen a Tory .That's who they feel best represents them culturally .My last sentence is possibly key as to why Labour lost so heavily .
Apparently Hartlepool is the 10th most deprived area in England after 10 years of a Tory government. I am genuinely baffled about what the people of Hartlepool feel that the government does for them! Could a Labour Government really do worse for towns like Hartlepool when you’re still classed as a deprived area after 10 years under the Tories? Surely they’d have realised by now that nothing is going to get better? Or maybe I’m completely missing something else?