Viking Supporters Co-operative
Viking Chat => Viking Chat => Topic started by: Spike on October 20, 2011, 11:31:18 pm
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Willie McKay is going to make a bundle from this. Where will it leave us?
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-2051618/What-agent-Willie-McKay-doing-Doncaster-Rovers.html
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You can take one of two views really.
1. This is an innovative and groundbreaking initiative which saves us from the ultimate reality which is that we don't have enough supporters to provide a manager with resources to compete in the fifth strongest league in Europe. The last few seasons in the Championship have shown that the admirable Rovers freak show has slowly ground to a halt and natural balance has been restored with our piddling gates dragging the club down. JR should be commended for his foresight.
2. McKay is a complete chancer and we are going to hell in a handcart. JR has taken complete leave of his senses to let this bizarre arrangement come within a million miles of the club. We will shortly be in a worse state of affairs than the 97/98 season.
Take your pick guys.
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Call me naive, but we've been heading for relegation. This is a gamble. It might pay off and we'll do well. It might not, and we end up where we would all have been expecting a month ago. It doesn't cause me concern at all.
There are some cracking players at the French clubs mentioned in that article. Christian Gourcuff at Lorient (my second team) rebuilds his squad every year with loanees and short term contracts and, yet, he keeps a team that was part time as recently as the mid-90s in the top flight on crowds of no more than 12,000 before the last 2 seasons. St Etienne have former players in the Premier League. I certainly wouldn't turn down the likes of Robert and Monsoreau. If we finish 4th from bottom then it's worked and was worthwhile.
The real question is...how much of that article is correct? If half of those named players are coming, then exciting times may well lie ahead.
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I suppose my immediate reaction (and anyone else around in the early 90s) is that this does smack a little of the snakeoil salesman that Richardson soon turned out to be. Clearly McKay is NOT running the club in any way, but we do seem to have placed all our hope of survival in the hands of a football agent.
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f**k sake.
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If true, then this is an almighty gamble. I don't trust McKay at all, something about him rubs me up the wrong way, but if his plan gets you guys a few of the players that it promises to, then he may well save your season.
Not only that, but providing you have someone signing players that are of use to Donny, it could secure you survival in the league. Though with this comes a big issue of team morale i'd imagine.
Not so much the Donny players that're there on permanent contracts, though being usurped every other month by a new player may be annoying. Rather, if things are going badly and the foreign loan players lose interest. Relying on players who know they're leaving within 6 months is always a very big risk and comes down to different personalities I guess.
You'd have to be very careful about who you bring in, basically. There are alot of issues with this system, but if it saves your season and brings in revenue, it seems worth a go.
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I see your point regarding issuse this may bring such as team morale etc, etc
But you would hope that the loanee players will perform as they are putting themselves in the shop window
After all that is the reason they will be here, if they perform poorly it may do their careers more harm than good?
The current position we find ourselves in leaves little choice in this, so i think it is worth a shot, fingers crossed
RTID
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If true, then this is an almighty gamble. I don't trust McKay at all, something about him rubs me up the wrong way, but if his plan gets you guys a few of the players that it promises to, then he may well save your season.
Not only that, but providing you have someone signing players that are of use to Donny, it could secure you survival in the league. Though with this comes a big issue of team morale i'd imagine.
Not so much the Donny players that're there on permanent contracts, though being usurped every other month by a new player may be annoying. Rather, if things are going badly and the foreign loan players lose interest. Relying on players who know they're leaving within 6 months is always a very big risk and comes down to different personalities I guess.
You'd have to be very careful about who you bring in, basically. There are alot of issues with this system, but if it saves your season and brings in revenue, it seems worth a go.
You don't sound like much of a Rover fan...
Sooo the question remains... Why are you looking at this forum at 5 in the morning?!
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It explains a lot, not least the departure of SO'D. Can't see him buying in to that kind of plan.
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From what I've been told SOD knew nothing about it, he was just told he was being put on gardening leave. Explains why that happened so quickly though. 'I can do this if you give my mate a job'.
Also raises question of how much did JR know what was going on as would he have been so public in support of SOD in days beforehand if knew this was on its way? The more and more I hear about this the less confident I am JR is pulling strings anymore.
Before I get shouted down for being a happy-clapping SOD lover, this isnt about SOD so much as it is this interview is the first time in a month that anyone at the club has been honest about what is going on. There has been so much speculation and conspiracy on here because people have heard different things but everything that has come out of the club has all been puff.
Am I happy SOD's gone? No but that's football. I can live with that. Am I inclined to believe a word that comes out of the football club anymore? No also and that is what bothers me the most.
This plan may be successful, and if it is that will be incredible. If it isn't and we end up getting relegated, as we would have also done at some point under SOD, will we be in a better or worse position to recover and come straight back up?
For now I'm going to be positive and hope for the best. But I've lost faith a bit and I never thought I'd say that.
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My view for what its worth is
1forget the morals . We know football is corrupt. We were hardly corinthians before.
2. Does it matter if mckay is makibg a packet ? If its not in his pocket it would be in players pockets or bigger clubs than us in terms of loan fees etc. A win win situation is possible.
3. I want to see british players but at least we are getting the finished article. I am fed up with watching kids like mason etc make their mistakes with us no matter how talented they are.
4. its a gamble but we were slowly dieing. At least its worth making the 250 mile round trip now.
5. Worried how our saleable assets billy,m woods,bennet,friend will react form wise.
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From what I've been told SOD knew nothing about it, he was just told he was being put on gardening leave. Explains why that happened so quickly though. 'I can do this if you give my mate a job'. Also raises question of how much did JR know what was going on as would he have been so public in support of SOD in days beforehand if knew this was on its way? The more and more I hear about this the less confident I am JR is pulling strings anymore.
We've been through this numerous times, JR is still very much the driving force, he was the first to hear this plan, he convinced Dick Watson it was the right thing to do, they acted and told Terry Bramhall after the event who gave his support.
The meetings in question took place after JR gave his backing to Sean and he never expected to make such a move when he did the radio interview or prepared his notes for the Free Press.
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Berkshire read my edit.
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No disrespect Berkshire, but JR's hardly going to say to you 'All this was going on behind my back, I had it sprung on me and I was left with little choice but to go along with it' is he??????? Maybe I'm overly cyncial but I just don't believe a plan like this gets hatched overnight. I also don't believe that if JR knew anything about what was coming he would have said everything he did about SOD because there is no way he would have put himself in a position where he had to make that public U-turn. JR may have his story straight now and people will chose themselves whether to believe him or not but for me, it's going to take some time for the club to win back my trust.
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No disrespect Berkshire, but JR's hardly going to say to you 'All this was going on behind my back, I had it sprung on me and I was left with little choice but to go along with it' is he??????? Maybe I'm overly cyncial but I just don't believe a plan like this gets hatched overnight. I also don't believe that if JR knew anything about what was coming he would have said everything he did about SOD because there is no way he would have put himself in a position where he had to make that public U-turn. JR may have his story straight now and people will chose themselves whether to believe him or not but for me, it's going to take some time for the club to win back my trust.
SiBo,
I had the benefit of hearing it from JR first hand as did Gartom and Silent Majority, he convinced me.
He did say that he knew it. \"made me look a pillock\" , that making the decision to replace Sean was the hardest decision he had taken but he firmly believed it was in the best interests of the club.
Everyone can and will make their own minds up.
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The order it all happened is almost irrelevant. It is the fact that the club have come out with all these reasons why SOD was sacked when in truth it was because they wanted to put this plan in place and DS came as part of that package. That is what bothers me. They have not been honest, and in that respect they definitely have not been fair on SOD.
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players take time to gell into the team. When the seasons over and Rovers have gone through 70 players and \"are too good to go down \" we shall all see if its worked or not
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My concern is as to why it's taken the Mail to publish this and not the club.
I can't say I'm overly comfortable with our club essentially being used as a job centre, but results on the pitch will judge how successful it is. I wait for the \"why are we getting useless players in?\" and the \"board showed no ambition\" if either a player is crap or we can't keep him. I just hope it doesn't put at risk the opportunity to develop a proper, permanent squad alongside some of these players.
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Two further points, having had a bit more time to digest the article:
1. Does McKay stand to benefit from the sale of existing assets. I'm thinking mainly of Billy Sharp but also of Kyle Bennett, who could have a lot of interest from top clubs by the end of the season if his development continues?
2. What happens if we go down at the end of the season? Somehow this business plan seems to me to depend on us retaining Championship status, as I can't see League One being enough of a shop window.
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Another further point, if Ilunga is to move from West Ham for example for a fee, we get a percentage for putting him in the window. That actually doesn't sound that bad a deal. I think the key thing for me though is supplementing alongisde the likes of Stock, Woods, Friend, Sharp rather than replacing those key players.
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And finally the fog begins to clear...
Why do I feel like we're the gambler in the last chance saloon having one last roll of the dice?
Two-thirds of the board clearly lost patience, didn't have faith and bought the snake oil. 'The sick will be healed, the lame will walk and I will bring great luck!' Promised Soundbite.
If we go up then its fair play all round. We've hit the jackpot. If we don't then what have we got? Another gamble for next season. The conveyor belt of loans will go on forever? But will it be enough to hold on to our existing, ahem, 'stars'. And where is the development policy in all this? What about permanent contracts? Are they to be a secondary concern, glossed over with another soundbite?
What really matters, a contract player who can be developed and sold or a fly-by-night lost cause trying to revive a career. These guys are out of favour for a good reason, surely? There seems to be a big risk of buying into trouble with them although many will dismiss that as speculation.
But what if we go down, which right now looks ominously likely? These galacticos ain't going to come and play in the third division, are they? That's not being in the shop window with a chance of promotion to the Prem. Relegation means losing the loanees and more than likely every worthwhile contract player, too.
So what will be left? Nothing. No structure, no system, no development and no Soundbite, because he'll be off with his mate, too.
This is the biggest knee-jerk gamble that the club has ever made. What's it to be folks? Prem in 2 years or League 2? Bloody scary if you ask me.
My guess is the fire sale begins on Boxing Day.
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Good old Bob as positive as ever. You are wrong on so many counts I'm afraid.
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I really don't see the problem. There was a lot of truth in the article. As things stand we cannot afford to be a Championship club on the size of our support. A proposition was made to JR and a few home truths also, JR has acted accordingly (forget your conspiracy theories) McKay has been open about his motives but wants the club to benefit. We will be seeing players in a Rovers shirt we could only have on a FIFA football game and when they leave we will get a small slice of the pie. The wage bill will reduce as we offload players who are not good enough and the sell on fees will go toward the rest. Our top players will have the benefit of playing alongside better quality than they have which should only improve their game and if it keeps us in the Championship this season and possibly challenging for the Prem next then it has worked, if not and we get relegated we will still be better off as none of those players will cost us. Without this deal we will be relegated at least with it we have a chance.
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Tell him to do one! after reading that article about how he aims to get money from us and how he is going to do it has completley stripped my faith in the club and its because of him! At the end of the season if we are fighting for relegation and we have players coming and leaving how do we expect to build team spirit to fight to stay up, these 'quality' players whos careers have gone down the drain whos contracts run out at the end of season wont be fighting to keep us up they wont be botherd because they will probably have another club at the end of the season like Chimbonda has. Wrong move by JR imo.
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From what I've been told SOD knew nothing about it, he was just told he was being put on gardening leave. Explains why that happened so quickly though. 'I can do this if you give my mate a job'.
Also raises question of how much did JR know what was going on as would he have been so public in support of SOD in days beforehand if knew this was on its way? The more and more I hear about this the less confident I am JR is pulling strings anymore.
Before I get shouted down for being a happy-clapping SOD lover, this isnt about SOD so much as it is this interview is the first time in a month that anyone at the club has been honest about what is going on. There has been so much speculation and conspiracy on here because people have heard different things but everything that has come out of the club has all been puff.
Am I happy SOD's gone? No but that's football. I can live with that. Am I inclined to believe a word that comes out of the football club anymore? No also and that is what bothers me the most.
This plan may be successful, and if it is that will be incredible. If it isn't and we end up getting relegated, as we would have also done at some point under SOD, will we be in a better or worse position to recover and come straight back up?
For now I'm going to be positive and hope for the best. But I've lost faith a bit and I never thought I'd say that.
Agree with you mate 100%.
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Good old Bob as positive as ever. You are wrong on so many counts I'm afraid.
Not having a go at you mate but why is he wrong?
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It's very much wait and see. I suppose the concern over permanent players could be less cloudy when you think that Bennett and Sullivan have both been offered new contracts. Time will tell if this works over the coming months, we can only hope that it does. No doubt some will want this to fail but at the end of the day we want to win football games in whatever way possible. Anyone who doubts the effort of these players look at Ilunga and Chimbonda on Tuesday they looked more gutted than some of our permanent players. They're winners and if they have ambition they'll perform because at the end of the day if they don't perform they don't stay with us or get a better move. As Saunders has said some of them might enjoy it and decide to stay and enjoy their football. In reality given where we were heading it might be a better solution.
One thing's for sure no matter what it's bound to be exciting :D
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Good old Bob as positive as ever. You are wrong on so many counts I'm afraid.
Which points is he wrong on exactly?
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Ok, so a couple of things stand out.
The previous model was unsustainable, we needed to change.
To half the wage bill, without a similar plan would almost certainly resulted in relagation and a poorer player coming to the club.
We will now get to see top quality players at Rovers, at a sustainable cost.
These players are playing for there futures, no one will be interested in them if they do no perform, do not give there all, are part of a losing team or playing crap football.
The difficult part is gelling them together and getting results, we will see what happens, but we definitely had to try something.
Exciting and interesting times.
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Very interesting article...its definatley worth a read.
Key points it picks out are...
- Rovers will become the first bring-and-buy style football club with fans never getting to know the players as they will only be here for 3 months! But they will be the best players we've ever had. (team spirit?!)
- Rovers have a wage bill of £8m a year which they are trying to cut to £4m a year, due to us only having a 10,000 fan base it isn't sustainable.
- We will soon be signing; Fabien Robert, Sylvain Monsoreau, Lamine Kone and Sebastian Dubarbier with El-Hadji Diouf and Mahamadou Diarra still on the radar.
- We will sign them in a bid to re-kickstart their careers, and Willie McKay will get a cut of any transfers they get.
- Rovers will only pay £2,000 wages for any one player. For instance Chimbonda is only recieving £2,000 a week in total, and Rovers are subsidising Ilunga's £28,000 wages to the sum of £2,000.
- Rovers will not make any signing not approved by Willie McKay, an FA agreement states. Although it does say Saunders has the final say (Hmmmmm!)
[attachment=847]IMG_0955.jpg[/attachment]
...whats everybody's thoughts on this? :dry:
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Do you actually read the forum before posting you do this all the time :headbang:
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Lazy Journalism
\"10,000 loyal supporters\" he's obviously never been to the Keepmoat.
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just hope it is not a long term plan only till we are safe 4 next season
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To be fair he has taken trouble to put up picture of article..
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Do you actually read the forum before posting you do this all the time :headbang:
Haha :laugh: yeh but I thought I'd pick out the key points! :S
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Tell him to do one! after reading that article about how he aims to get money from us and how he is going to do it has completley stripped my faith in the club and its because of him! At the end of the season if we are fighting for relegation and we have players coming and leaving how do we expect to build team spirit to fight to stay up, these 'quality' players whos careers have gone down the drain whos contracts run out at the end of season wont be fighting to keep us up they wont be botherd because they will probably have another club at the end of the season like Chimbonda has. Wrong move by JR imo.
We havent got a great deal to lose! The main reason behind it seems to be lowering our wage bill from £8m to £4m. If that happens and we've got better players than we've started with...albeit for a limited period of time, we'll finish better than last season!:rtid:
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Do you actually read the forum before posting you do this all the time :headbang:
Haha :laugh: yeh but I thought I'd pick out the key points! :S
you missed out:
\"My valuation of Donny was nothing. They have no fanbase and everyone in Doncaster supports Leeds, Sheffield United or Sheffield Wednesday\" :pinch:
\"I’m doing this to prove it can be done and I’ve been honest enough to admit I’m only here for the money.\" - so we can put to bed any rumours of him actually liking the club :dry:
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I think this will turn out to be a good move.
We cut our wage bill down, off set that with potential transfer commission. Have quality playing staff albeit for a few months.
Worst comes to worst we get relegated but with a smaller wage bill it won't be a financial nightmare. The doncaster brand should be more attractive due to the history of players we might have had. Players will have heard of us.
We have first mover advantage here. Clubs will be copying our model soon I believe.
On the other hand it is a risk and change.....change is not good according to this board. I seem to think most posters would rather DRFC get relegated and their post prove correct than to admit they were wrong and support their team.
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The club can do no right in some people's eyes on here. Criticised when SOD was here for not getting the players in, now people moan when we try to get quality players in, albeit for a short time. Have to see how it goes but I for one am prepared to give it a chance before dismissing it as an awful idea.
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\"My valuation of Donny was nothing. They have no fanbase and everyone in Doncaster supports Leeds, Sheffield United or Sheffield Wednesday, who can all get 30,000 in their stadiums.\"
Seems afirst class Kitson in my opinion! A bit pointless in pushing for the Premiership if you're not willing to spend more than £4million a year on wages! Just MY opinion of course.
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we'll finish better than last season!:rtid:[/quote]
i would take that all day :woot:
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From what I've been told SOD knew nothing about it, he was just told he was being put on gardening leave. Explains why that happened so quickly though. 'I can do this if you give my mate a job'. Also raises question of how much did JR know what was going on as would he have been so public in support of SOD in days beforehand if knew this was on its way? The more and more I hear about this the less confident I am JR is pulling strings anymore.
We've been through this numerous times, JR is still very much the driving force, he was the first to hear this plan, he convinced Dick Watson it was the right thing to do, they acted and told Terry Bramhall after the event who gave his support.
The meetings in question took place after JR gave his backing to Sean and he never expected to make such a move when he did the radio interview or prepared his notes for the Free Press.
Of course it went like that .....are you serious as to the timetable of events in the full knowledge that all concerned at the top have known each other and been friends for some time ?
:saywhat: :laugh: :laugh:
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Do you actually read the forum before posting you do this all the time :headbang:
Haha :laugh: yeh but I thought I'd pick out the key points! :S
Could n`t you pick out the key points in the thread that was already started? we have 3 threads on this subject now, so i`m going to merge them all!
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My first reaction was \"Well, Rovers just lost my support.\"
But we were headed for relegation the way things were, and McKay's right, we can't sustain an £8 million a year wage bill with the fanbase we have.
My main concern is that we don't become a team completely made up of loanees. I don't mind three or four in the squad as a whole, but I still want to see a core squad and a youth set up bringing through new players.
Getting a cut of any loanee's transfer fee may well be a canny move in the long run though...
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Jim D - post of the day already. I almost sprayed coffee all over the screen! Very funny. :laugh:
Matty, I'm not sure where the playing staff wage bill has been cut. Willie claims we're only paying these players £2,000 a week but that's £50K a year per player on top of the current wage bill.
If we are going to become a shop window then the existing staff on permanent contracts will have to reduce dramatically, assuming the players are prepared to move on and other clubs show an interest in them.
If you have ever been employed where staff cuts have had to be made you'll appreciate it has a demoralising impact on ALL staff, not just those who ultimately leave. In my experience productivity drops. It's a hell of a task to manage in those circumstances. I'll refrain from quoting the Emotional Cycle Of Change other than to say it is not without pitfalls.
McKay talks of using the overseas loan player loophole, in other words fielding more than 5 non-contract players. Bloomin' heck, someone's going to be pretty busy soon. And of course, there will be a rapid turnover because other clubs ain't going to foot the shortfall above £2K a week for too long if the excersize is to sell the players based on performances. Methinks we'll be tied up into having to play them - good or bad.
Can a Harlem Globetrotters approach work? I bloody well hope so!
As for dear old Wellred. Great post. No content, no logic, no counter argument, no debate. No response to other posters. Obviously he's right on all counts then.
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The club can do no right in some people's eyes on here. Criticised when SOD was here for not getting the players in, now people moan when we try to get quality players in, albeit for a short time. Have to see how it goes but I for one am prepared to give it a chance before dismissing it as an awful idea.
Well said , seems like some people would rather moan at the club finding a cost effective way to stay in this league. We were and could well still go down with a unrealistic wage bill for the fan base we have & the club through getting DS in have hit upon a scheme that suits all parties. Why are we worried if WM makes money out of getting these players playing again then if they play well for us they get a move on more money we get to stay in this league. There are more players out there that haven't got clubs who think they should be playing in the Premiership & this is a way back for them if they perform for us. What have we to lose ?
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Practically everything if it goes wrong...
What's to stop other clubs doing it?
Why is no-one else doing it?
Makes me nervous as hell and I doin't mind admitting it.
Interesting how the gung ho comments on here are balanced by a million negative ones on Twitter...
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Practically everything if it goes wrong...
What's to stop other clubs doing it?
Why is no-one else doing it?
Makes me nervous as hell and I doin't mind admitting it.
It does me too. I'd rather accept the fact that we can't sustain Championship-level football on the crowds we get and cut our cloth accordingly at a level where we can survive and prosper.
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This is brillant vision it really is and honesty hurts is it no true we are town full of d**kheads that suppoort other teams .....???
Is it no true the players we have are not good enough?
Here you have the classic WIN WIN!!!
Hats off to JR and Watson with player of such ability we will hopefully be safe without them we would be relegated by xmas and backrupt cos the nobheads of donny dont support there local team!
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Just my opinion but....
If we want to reduce our wage bill by 4 million and we are doing this by getting short term loanees then.....
1. It means that we will be having a clearout in January or the end of the season, our current crop will have to up their game to earn the right to play for the club. This could be good and may get another 10% out of them.
2. To reduce the wage bill by that much where does that leave our best players, will they stay and the saving come from elsewhere or will they be sold?
3. Deano says that he wants to focus on the youth setup and get the reserve team started again. To do this the money has to come from somewhere.
Just playing devils advocate here but what if the plan is to cut the wage bill and invest some of that money into the structure of the club (reserve team, centre of excellence) and the short term loanees is just a method of keeping the team and bank balance ticking over until we bear the fruits of the youth setup??
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The arguament doesnt stack up re cutting the 4m from the budget. That could equate to an extra 20000 fans which added to the existing 10000 average means they are saying derby and leeds arent even viable or the directors want to take money out of the club. Statement needed from jr on this if u could get one gartom.
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You don't sound like much of a Rover fan...
Sooo the question remains... Why are you looking at this forum at 5 in the morning?!
Replying to a message after an off-chance of checking the forum. Plus i'd just seen this story after a friend linked me, thought i'd see what the general opinion was!
I'm intrigued is all.
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Read the article and I am really worried about the future.
No players and come or go for the next two years without Mckays say so?
I think we can kiss goodbye to any permanent transfers for the next few years, and the likes of Sharp will be gone in January.
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Do you actually read the forum before posting you do this all the time :headbang:
Haha :laugh: yeh but I thought I'd pick out the key points! :S
you missed out:
\"My valuation of Donny was nothing. They have no fanbase and everyone in Doncaster supports Leeds, Sheffield United or Sheffield Wednesday\" :pinch:
\"I’m doing this to prove it can be done and I’ve been honest enough to admit I’m only here for the money.\" - so we can put to bed any rumours of him actually liking the club :dry:
So , how do you lot, who do go to as many games as physically possible.. who turn out come wind and rain and shit results feel about being dismissed as nothing, because it made me so mad for you all.. I can't count myself amongst you in that, as I don't get to games (hense the you lot)....
My opinion, for what it's worth... Rovers has been sold for quick results to a devil who cares not a jot for our team or the Rovers name and ethos, SOD had to go, as this style of Del Boy shenanigans isn't his style either... McKay it seems doesn't want a manager with a mind, he wants a puppet.. a yes man who will just pump through his players for his own profit. I truly hope I'm wrong, and I know the mail is a bag of crap paper... But there is always a BUT... isn't there?
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You could look at it like this if we are lucky enough to gain promotion to the Premier league with this method then at least we could have some of these mentioned players in place to cope with the standard that the premier league requires. The current deal is only 2 years long gaining promotion would give us in excess of seventy million pound which will in turn set us up for the next 10 years. in theory it looks a good move but lets see what happens ?????
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Read the article and I am really worried about the future.
No players and come or go for the next two years without Mckays say so?
I think we can kiss goodbye to any permanent transfers for the next few years, and the likes of Sharp will be gone in January.
Frosty something needs to be done we have done the crowds to death and pissed around the subject I know loads of football fans that follow other teams so have to get real and it not our money either.
So we either accept we are a very small team and go down to a level we can mantain or totally be different!
I love watching quality players and the lads we have brought in have performed great so dont see problem?
Get rid of the shit and bring quality in and I tell you what with Deano in charge the man management side is taken care off!
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the likes of Sharp will be gone in January.
To be replaced by someone better on £2000 a week? Great work. There's not much loyalty in football anymore, most players are mercenaries.
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Do you actually read the forum before posting you do this all the time :headbang:
Haha :laugh: yeh but I thought I'd pick out the key points! :S
you missed out:
\"My valuation of Donny was nothing. They have no fanbase and everyone in Doncaster supports Leeds, Sheffield United or Sheffield Wednesday\" :pinch:
\"I’m doing this to prove it can be done and I’ve been honest enough to admit I’m only here for the money.\" - so we can put to bed any rumours of him actually liking the club :dry:
So , how do you lot, who do go to as many games as physically possible.. who turn out come wind and rain and shit results feel about being dismissed as nothing, because it made me so mad for you all.. I can't count myself amongst you in that, as I don't get to games (hense the you lot)....
My opinion, for what it's worth... Rovers has been sold for quick results to a devil who cares not a jot for our team or the Rovers name and ethos, SOD had to go, as this style of Del Boy shenanigans isn't his style either... McKay it seems doesn't want a manager with a mind, he wants a puppet.. a yes man who will just pump through his players for his own profit. I truly hope I'm wrong, and I know the mail is a bag of crap paper... But there is always a BUT... isn't there?
My thoughts entirely, this could go spectacularly right or spectacularly wrong, a massive, massive gamble with a chancer at the helm!
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the likes of Sharp will be gone in January.
To be replaced by someone better on £2000 a week? Great work. There's not much loyalty in football anymore, most players are mercenaries.
Replaced with someone who will be around for a few months?
No thanks.
If this goes tits up, I hope JR is read for the back lash.
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Read the article and I am really worried about the future.
No players and come or go for the next two years without Mckays say so?
I think we can kiss goodbye to any permanent transfers for the next few years, and the likes of Sharp will be gone in January.
Frosty something needs to be done we have done the crowds to death and pissed around the subject I know loads of football fans that follow other teams so have to get real and it not our money either.
So we either accept we are a very small team and go down to a level we can mantain or totally be different!
I love watching quality players and the lads we have brought in have performed great so dont see problem?
Get rid of the shit and bring quality in and I tell you what with Deano in charge the man management side is taken care off!
You base that comment on what?
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My sentiments entirely SiBo, whats happening to our club what about loyalty to our contracted players. RTID but worried.
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You don't sound like much of a Rover fan...
Sooo the question remains... Why are you looking at this forum at 5 in the morning?!
Replying to a message after an off-chance of checking the forum. Plus i'd just seen this story after a friend linked me, thought i'd see what the general opinion was!
I'm intrigued is all.
I'm intrigued as to why you have to come Trolling on here, did you have too much cheese for supper last night?
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One off the biggest problems in football is how much money agents are taking out of the game. What the board have done here is safeguard rovers from paying any of these fees other than £5k a year. All the money Willie stands to make is from other clubs, this will save us a fortune. If this comes off, it is a master stroke. If it doesn't, the club will have to live at a sustainable level under the previous structure, which is not the Championship. In simple terms be different and stand a chance of being a championship club or go down without a fight.
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Ok, so a couple of things stand out.
The previous model was unsustainable, we needed to change.
To half the wage bill, without a similar plan would almost certainly resulted in relagation and a poorer player coming to the club.
We will now get to see top quality players at Rovers, at a sustainable cost.
These players are playing for there futures, no one will be interested in them if they do no perform, do not give there all, are part of a losing team or playing crap football.
The difficult part is gelling them together and getting results, we will see what happens, but we definitely had to try something.
Exciting and interesting times.
Agree with your comments above, about time people looked on this with a positive slant rather than negative as usual from some posters on here.
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Read the article and I am really worried about the future.
No players and come or go for the next two years without Mckays say so?
I think we can kiss goodbye to any permanent transfers for the next few years, and the likes of Sharp will be gone in January.
Frosty something needs to be done we have done the crowds to death and pissed around the subject I know loads of football fans that follow other teams so have to get real and it not our money either.
So we either accept we are a very small team and go down to a level we can mantain or totally be different!
I love watching quality players and the lads we have brought in have performed great so dont see problem?
Get rid of the shit and bring quality in and I tell you what with Deano in charge the man management side is taken care off!
You base that comment on what?
Cos he is an extremely positive thinker and attitude who has given everyone at the club the chance to shine - people will like Hird grab their chance otherwise you can sulk like Copps and JOC .......
People dont like change but YOU HAVE TO GET ON WITH IT!
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After digesting all this I've also cone to the conclusion that it's a win win situation for us. Let's face it if things were to carry on as they had been, we would be in League 1 next season.
With this plan we should at least be able to maintain our current status.
The improvement we should see from having quality players on the pitch should generate interest in us and get more bums on seats.
If it goes tits up then so be it, but something had to be done and whatever people may think about McKay, he knows what he's no mug and clearly believes this will work.
Hold on tight guys we're in for some fun
if nowt else.
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One off the biggest problems in football is how much money agents are taking out of the game. What the board have done here is safeguard rovers from paying any of these fees other than £5k a year. All the money Willie stands to make is from other clubs, this will save us a fortune. If this comes off, it is a master stroke. If it doesn't, the club will have to live at a sustainable level under the previous structure, which is not the Championship. In simple terms be different and stand a chance of being a championship club or go down without a fight.:woot:
Having thought about this, you make a good point there, McKay is reportedly on a 2 year contract at £100 a week, If DRFC at any point thought that it was n`t working, then they could terminate his contract and the whole episode would cost £10400 to get rid of him, not a great financial gamble in football terms! I still think we`re dicing with the devil though
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Anyone who doubts the committment to retaining our own players needs to think of it this way. Friend, Copps etc all have new contracts. Bennett and Sullivan that we know of have been offered new deals THIS WEEK. That to me proves it's about having a core squad supplemented by shorter term players. I think it'll be the likes of Lockwood, Wilson, Keegan etc who should be worried. Those who are good enough should not be.
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Read the article and I am really worried about the future.
No players and come or go for the next two years without Mckays say so?
I think we can kiss goodbye to any permanent transfers for the next few years, and the likes of Sharp will be gone in January.
Frosty something needs to be done we have done the crowds to death and pissed around the subject I know loads of football fans that follow other teams so have to get real and it not our money either.
So we either accept we are a very small team and go down to a level we can mantain or totally be different!
I love watching quality players and the lads we have brought in have performed great so dont see problem?
Get rid of the shit and bring quality in and I tell you what with Deano in charge the man management side is taken care off!
You base that comment on what?
Cos he is an extremely positive thinker and attitude who has given everyone at the club the chance to shine - people will like Hird grab their chance otherwise you can sulk like Copps and JOC .......
People dont like change but YOU HAVE TO GET ON WITH IT!
Do you know him personally< you`re basing you`re assumptions on a bit of lip service on DROS and Radio Sheffield!
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Read the article and I am really worried about the future.
No players and come or go for the next two years without Mckays say so?
I think we can kiss goodbye to any permanent transfers for the next few years, and the likes of Sharp will be gone in January.
Frosty something needs to be done we have done the crowds to death and pissed around the subject I know loads of football fans that follow other teams so have to get real and it not our money either.
So we either accept we are a very small team and go down to a level we can mantain or totally be different!
I love watching quality players and the lads we have brought in have performed great so dont see problem?
Get rid of the shit and bring quality in and I tell you what with Deano in charge the man management side is taken care off!
You base that comment on what?
Cos he is an extremely positive thinker and attitude who has given everyone at the club the chance to shine - people will like Hird grab their chance otherwise you can sulk like Copps and JOC .......
People dont like change but YOU HAVE TO GET ON WITH IT!
Do you know him personally< you`re basing you`re assumptions on a bit of lip service on DROS and Radio Sheffield!
Very much a celebrated part of his character is it not but suggest he will stop at nothing to win which is also a good aspect......
I think media apsects are very important and SOD was dire at this and dont you often think .....\"Christ if he talks like this in the dressing room no wonder they are not up for it!\"
I dont know him but merely using this forum to air my opinion ....what your thoughts on him?
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I have no thoughts on him, he`s not been here long enough to gauge an opinion!
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Deano said it himself last night that he has the ear and respect of every Premier League manager. This is not something we had with SOD, lets all just get on with it and leave JR & Deano to it! JR will not sit back if he does not agree with something! Deano is the manager at the end of the day and the one picking the team not McKay! If we sign some of these players it does not mean we have to play them! To be fair though Ilunga & Chimbonda sounded like they were awesome against Blackpool so what we moaning at!!!!
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Only his uncanny resemblance to Steve Evans makes me uneasy. I think its a great opportunity to consolidate our position in this league. After 7 games of this season I was not optimistic for the remaining 39 games at all but this gives us hope. Who else (competitive players) could we seriously bring in with a normal transfer policy that would fit the business plan of reducing the wage bill from 8m per year to 4m?
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Although this does concern me a bit, I can see the positives.
Hopefully this technique will just be used to support our best players. I.e, keep Sharp, Copps, Bennett, Stock etc on board, and just fill the fringes of the squad with these players. If the intention is to have an entirely different squad from top to bottom every year, then it's a big worry.
Wait and see I suppose.
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not sure you can count copps at this moment he has got it in him though
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It would be interesting to know what the club are defining as 'success' now. Is staying in the division a success? Is getting into the play offs and not getting promoted (a la Cardiff and Forest)a success? McKay says he's here for two years, if we aren't in the Premier League by the end of that time, where will the finger be pointed? Would they / can they sack DS? Who would make that decision on whether it was felt DS was getting the best out of the players at his disposal? If we win every game and go racing to the top of the league no questions to answer. But with the likes of West Ham and Southampton to beat to the top two places, play-offs are the more realistic ambition. McKay says himself we're not a threat to West Ham. So many questions still not answered!
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think we should not be expecting promotion staying up would be a sucsess even more so if the wage budget is cut in half. also is there something in the lack of news about the mansfield game which woods played 70min mabe a lot of trialists and wanting 2 keep it under raps or more likley rubbis website
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My only concern about all this is what happens if other agents ( or same one ) get into bed with other clubs and do the same thing. Bristol City, Watford, well almost any championship club. The available player pool shrinks, those that are may well choose another club to \"Shopwindow\" themselves.
It appears to be a win win situation, but thats primerily because only DRFC are currently involved. I hope JR has patented the idea.
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WE currently have 39 players listed on the Rovers' web site including the loan stars. Let's just work with round numbers and call it 36. In simplistic terms we need to cut this in half, ie, down to 18 if we are to half the wage bill to £4M.
But it's not that simple, is it? Our better players earn far more than the youngsters so we could get rid of the top earners and keep a squad (admittedly a weak and inexperienced one) of 24 players or we could just keep the cream of the crop, keeping say a dozen players, supplimented by loanees.
39 does seem an awful lot when we don't have a reserve team, I'll admit. But which do we get rid of - the cream or the milk? And if it's the milk then will there really be a long queue of clubs out there demanding their services? January is normally a quieter market than the summer one and I cannot see many Championship clubs stepping in to help us.
I'm guessing our only activity in the January market will be as a selling club and mainly to the lower leagues. There's no way in the world we will be buying, surely?
AS for loaning out our own players, can you imagine the response we're likely to get from clubs. Well mate, if you're only paying Tevez £2K a week there's no way we're paying more than ten bob for Sharp... :blush:
I'd say the fire sale starts in January, one way or another. Everything must go?
Hold on to your seats folks because this ride hasn't even begun yet.
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You don't sound like much of a Rover fan...
Sooo the question remains... Why are you looking at this forum at 5 in the morning?!
Replying to a message after an off-chance of checking the forum. Plus i'd just seen this story after a friend linked me, thought i'd see what the general opinion was!
I'm intrigued is all.
I'm intrigued as to why you have to come Trolling on here, did you have too much cheese for supper last night?
What part of my post was trolling? I'm a sports writer by trade, I was interested. It's a novel idea, just added my opinion is all.
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39? I make it 28 plus 4 loans (including Kirkland). Of those 28 two are out on loan.
The 28:
Neil SULLIVAN
Gary WOODS
James O'CONNOR
George FRIEND
Shelton MARTIS
Richard NAYLOR
Sam HIRD
Mustapha DUMBUYA
Rachid BOUHENNA
Pascal CHIMBONDA
Brian STOCK
Mark WILSON
John OSTER
Simon GILLETT
James BAXENDALE
James COPPINGER
Giles BARNES
Kyle BENNETT
Billy SHARP
James HAYTER
James CHAMBERS
Martin WOODS
Chris BROWN
Adam LOCKWOOD
Tommy SPURR
Paul KEEGAN
Oscar RADFORD
Dean SHIELS
I'm not counting youth players like Ball, Wilding, Lucas or Maxted.
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Do apologise if I'm wrong. I took the number from the club's official web site players' profile page:
Link (http://www.doncasterroversfc.co.uk/page/ProfilesDetail/0,,10329,00.html)
Scroll down the players list and you'll see Pascal Chimbonda is player number 39.
Surely the club's web site wouldn't get it wrong?
Well, then again... :S
If you wish to ignore certain players on the list then it all gets a lot easier. Just decide which £4M worth of what's left you'd like to get rid of. Top third or bottom two thirds? Pretty much adds up to the same I guess.
I suspect offloading £4M off the wage bill in double quick time will be a mammoth task, even if you cancel the contracts and give the players away. Can it really be that easy?
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Do apologise if I'm wrong. I took the number from the club's official web site players' profile page:
Link (http://www.doncasterroversfc.co.uk/page/ProfilesDetail/0,,10329,00.html)
Scroll down the players list and you'll see Pascal Chimbonda is player number 39.
Surely the club's web site wouldn't get it wrong?
Well, then again... :S
If you wish to ignore certain players on the list then it all gets a lot easier. Just decide which £4M worth of what's left you'd like to get rid of. Top third or bottom two thirds? Pretty much adds up to the same I guess.
I suspect offloading £4M off the wage bill in double quick time will be a mammoth task, even if you cancel the contracts and give the players away. Can it really be that easy?
Have you counted the players? Just because Chimbonda is number 39, doesn't mean we have 39 players in the squad. There are gaps if you actually look!
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Donnbob, no it won't be easy. We are left with an £8m problem from the old strategy / regime we cannot afford. The fact is we need to start addressing the issue and you have to start some time, like now. I am sure WMs remit will be outs as well as ins.
Relagation with a fixed £8m wage bill would be a disaster, relagation under the new strategy although not ideal, would not put the long term future of the club in danger.
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Do apologise if I'm wrong. I took the number from the club's official web site players' profile page:
Link (http://www.doncasterroversfc.co.uk/page/ProfilesDetail/0,,10329,00.html)
Scroll down the players list and you'll see Pascal Chimbonda is player number 39.
Surely the club's web site wouldn't get it wrong?
Well, then again... :S
If you wish to ignore certain players on the list then it all gets a lot easier. Just decide which £4M worth of what's left you'd like to get rid of. Top third or bottom two thirds? Pretty much adds up to the same I guess.
I suspect offloading £4M off the wage bill in double quick time will be a mammoth task, even if you cancel the contracts and give the players away. Can it really be that easy?
Haven't you noticed that nobody has numbers 27, 28, 32, 34, 35, 36, 37 or 38? :facepalm:
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Agree with that Riggall, but it's not an unfair question to ask 'how?'
No-one will queue up to take the injured. No-one wants the kids. Does anyone want to sign a player who can't get in the first team of a club in the relegation zone.
However, folk have made offers for Sharp, Coppinger and Stock in the past year. If an agent's job is to reduce the wage bill by half then that's his easiest route to market. If he spends three months trying to shift the deadbeats then he won't be spending that time recruiting galacticos.
I'm 100 per cent behind cutting the wage bill in half. I'm 100% behind having a reserve team and a youth team and a tea lady. But I can see how these ideas make as much financial sense as when my missus decides to cut back the money she spends on buying shoes.
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The wage bill includes coaching and other staff. Deano has stated that there are too many of these and already has made changes.
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How do Barnsley survive at this level?
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How do Barnsley survive at this level?
By having a crook for a chairman and by doing deals with agents that we wouldn't have done in the past. Our new way of doing things is out in the open, other Clubs will be doing far dodgier things than what we are proposing but aren't as open.
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How do Barnsley survive at this level?
They had a couple of Cup runs and Cryne helped em with loans but I think they are struggling this year hence having to sell Shackle.
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How do Barnsley survive at this level?
By having a crook for a chairman and by doing deals with agents that we wouldn't have done in the past. Our new way of doing things is out in the open, other Clubs will be doing far dodgier things than what we are proposing but aren't as open.
Having open dealings with Willy McKay is something of a curate's egg no?
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Its going to be interesting, but if it fails, it could be an absolute disaster, and everything we have worked hard to build over the last 10 years or so will have all been in vain.
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So......who`s name do we put on our shirts this week?
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Its going to be interesting, but if it fails, it could be an absolute disaster, and everything we have worked hard to build over the last 10 years or so will have all been in vain.
I think the world superstars in Div One would piss it!Remember a 2 year deal!
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Would we rather have 'fringe' players sitting on 2 year deals or supplementing the first team squad with class shot term deals.
Deano's challenge is to balance key players on longer term deals and manage the turnover of players on short term deals/loans.
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Article about Rovers and our new Willy;
http://www.twohundredpercent.net/?p=15744
First of many I think!
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How do Barnsley survive at this level?
By having a crook for a chairman and by doing deals with agents that we wouldn't have done in the past. Our new way of doing things is out in the open, other Clubs will be doing far dodgier things than what we are proposing but aren't as open.
Having open dealings with Willy McKay is something of a curate's egg no?
Possibly, I'm defending the decision but it doesn't mean I like it. Loyalty in football only exists with the fans. Players couldn't care less in the main (I know there are exceptions but they are few) JR is a fan, he has never sold us down the river only given reality to what most of us could only dream about. We have come to a crossroads, we don't own the statium, our main investor has withdrawn his support, our previous manager (God love him) had lost it, we were not just going to get relegated but put into financial difficulties. No sign of new investment and no way out. Then a man with an unsavavoury reputation who has no love for the club but is a friend of JR's has a little chat, opens JR's eyes because let's face it he has been a litle niave (call it loyal) and gives him a way out, a chance to preserve the legacy and complete the dream, does it sit comfortably? No, am I going to raise hell and deny someone who has delivered more and fulfilled more sporting dreams than I'm entitled to a chance to finish what he started, DAMN NO, I trust JR now as I did in those early dark day's. He has never let us down and I don't for one second think he his doing so now. It may be an uncomfortable path for the purist who wishes to be loved by patronising fans of other clubs but I doubt SIR JOHN would undertake this venture if he thought for one second he would put his beloved club at risk.
Have your doubts, fine but show your support, it's about time our fans stopped whingeing about everything this club, Chairman, Manager and players(whoever they are)do.:rtid:
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Great post.
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seconded!
:rtid:
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Great post by DVR. When I read the article I was horrified BUT I've warmed to the idea. I think we simply have to trust JR on this one. He's brought us this far so why not further. There is little loyalty in football nowadays. The 'career at one club' players are few and far between nowadays. As long as the loanees complement the squad we already have and add quality to it, then I trust the management team and board with this.
It will be interesting. And there's no reason why we can't dream of being a club like Wigan is there? If we have the ground and get promoted, who's to say we won't have to extend the ground? It's good to have aspirations.
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it is good to have aspirations, better than playing in league one or two with no real ambition.
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it is good to have aspirations, better than playing in league one or two with no real ambition.
Should be applauded after all we are trying to stop in this league may as well just pack up listening to some of this crap....
The current set of players are not good enough simple as and thats why we lose week in and week out!
We owe them nothing as I keep saying they dont love this club they love football.....kissing the badge all b*llocks sadly.
The players play for us cos we pay them and like a hooker they will go to another who pays more money ....lets get flaming real!
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When I first read it I was glad that we was doing something so different. I thought all it takes is two players to come make big money moves after 3months playing for little old donny and then see how many more come knocking wanting their slice of the humble pie served by JR and co.
Typical leeds fan at work could only see the bad saying \"well what if you get a player who scores ten goals then gets sold then you will be stuck\" so I said \"we will get someone else\"
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Could only manage reading the first 4 pages of this thread. All I can say is I'll believe it when I'm sat it in.
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JR's sold the club's soul (or what was left of it) to a crooked chancer on the make.
Is this really what I protested for, invaded pitches for, handed out leaflets for, stuck up posters for to get rid of a crooked chairman? So we can be used to line the pockets of a wheeler dealer.
How much are tickets for Armthorpe Welfare?
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After all that's gone before I'm pretty disgusted by this approach. But there's no doubting that it sits well with the ethos of the modern game. McKay himself sums it up best when he says \"I’ve been honest enough to admit I’m only here for the money\".
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IMO i think you could say copps loves this club he has been here for years and could have gone in the summer if he wished to but he is staying for the rest of his career
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JR's sold the club's soul (or what was left of it) to a crooked chancer on the make.
Is this really what I protested for, invaded pitches for, handed out leaflets for, stuck up posters for to get rid of a crooked chairman? So we can be used to line the pockets of a wheeler dealer.
How much are tickets for Armthorpe Welfare?
You supposedly did all that protesting, invading pitches and handing out leaflets to stop supporting the club NOW?! You're a joke man!
This attitude is just unbelievable. Yes, many of us feel slightly uneasy with what's going on. I myself have a few reservations. But seriously, have some faith in JR. The man knows what he is doing.
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JR's sold the club's soul (or what was left of it) to a crooked chancer on the make.
Is this really what I protested for, invaded pitches for, handed out leaflets for, stuck up posters for to get rid of a crooked chairman? So we can be used to line the pockets of a wheeler dealer.
How much are tickets for Armthorpe Welfare?
Bye, enjoy your afternoons at Armthorpe.
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JR's sold the club's soul (or what was left of it) to a crooked chancer on the make.
Is this really what I protested for, invaded pitches for, handed out leaflets for, stuck up posters for to get rid of a crooked chairman? So we can be used to line the pockets of a wheeler dealer.
How much are tickets for Armthorpe Welfare?
You supposedly did all that protesting, invading pitches and handing out leaflets to stop supporting the club NOW?! You're a joke man!
This attitude is just unbelievable. Yes, many of us feel slightly uneasy with what's going on. I myself have a few reservations. But seriously, have some faith in JR. The man knows what he is doing.
Always said I'd probably jack it in when Rovers got to the circus of the Premiership.
Looks like the clowns are running the show but without the Premiership Big Top.
Faith in JR? The man who seemingly can't transfer his mighty business acumen to running a football club and changes his mind at the drop of a hat. Glad hed did what he did, when he did but he ain't the Messiah that many people think.
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Muttley me old marra what would you suggest?:
a) we do nothing - continue to lose, crowds dwindle, players flee in January, we sink
b) we wait for everyone to return from injury because that's the only thing that's stopping us from competing...get real
c) we reappoint SOD because he's SOD. The man himself said he could do no more
d) the Board throw kagillions at trying to compete with the likes of West Ham, Leicester, Southampton, Ipswich etc by playing a shed load of players on inflated wages...it's not going to happen. Would you be that dumb?
e) we hook up with an agent that can help us access players that otherwise would not even think about coming here but which will, at least, allow us to compete. Remember, we've just gone 19 games without being able to compete
Personally, I'd rather we do something than nothing. Having seen Chimbonda and Ilunga give the team a bit of a boost on Tuesday, there may be some merit in the madness after all.
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(a)
I'd rather we got relegated with some integrity intact, without turning the club into some sort of freak show for McKay's has-beens, never will-be's and misfits. Stand up tall and say we gave it a go, but we weren't good enough this year but we'll be back next time.
(Wasn't at Blackpool, but I thought Ilunga was complete bobbins v Leeds)
So what happens when we've sold all our contracted players (eg Sharp) then McKay runs out of overpaid, unfit drop-outs who want to come to a cultural backwater?
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Muttley me old marra what would you suggest?:
e) we hook up with an agent that can help us access players that otherwise would not even think about coming here but which will, at least, allow us to compete. Remember, we've just gone 19 games without being able to compete
Is this the only alternative?
How about you say, \"Sean, thanks for your efforts, but it's time to try someone else now\", and you give Paul Tisdale, or someone similar, a shot at working on limited resources at a higher level.
This idea that without McKay we were doomed is nonsense, and the idea that relegation was the end of the line is also nonsense. We have competed, and successfully, at this level before without the like of McKay and we could have done so again.
Sean could do no more, but the players we have certainly can. The majority of this squad were pushing for the playoffs in December last year.
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So basically the DRFC brand has been franchised to the business interest of Willie Mackay for the next 2 years.
Willie has executive control of all playing matters, by contract, subject to Saunders opinion, with a brief to deliver Championship standard at £4m per annum.
Conflict of interest raises its head here. How can he ensure the best option for his clients as a agent, whilst at the same time making the right decisions in the interest of DRFC?
No point bringing in players who cannot get exposure, so they need to play regardless of performances, team tactics etc. Saunders role as \"manager\" is effectively sidelined to that of assistant to the main man, who controls all the levers.
It looks like any benefits to DRFC are incidental to the business interest of WM. They may happen, but then again, what if they don't. Can DRFC end the deal before the 2 years, without any penalty?
If the FA think this is OK then they need to consider what happens when this mushrooms into the normal business practice of the football industry.
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I'll believe it when I am sat in it!! Or more succicently, if its in the Daily Mail then its probably b*******ks. So where are all these leading world stars queuing up to play for Donny Rovers then? 27th September this deal was signed and we have had what, a bloke who doesnt't have anything better to do for 2 months before he goes to Canada, an 'ordinary' loan from West Ham cos Big Sam is doing us a favour, some bloke from Blackburn who was sent back cos he was rubbish and a bloke with a bad back from Wigan who is not in McKay's pool anyway? The most high profile player we have been linked with has just signed for West Ham.
Wilie Mckay is a showman and out to make money for himself (as he admits) - if that helps Rovers by getting quality players in on loan, all well and good, but just because he says it is going to happen, doesnt mean it will - but he has the publicity and platform he wanted.
We live in interesting times
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Even in this league football is a squad game, and although the squad were pushing for promotion last december, we only have to look at how it panned out to realise that the squad was only just good enough.
Seriously, if you want small time league and no fans stuff and miss that then you can always go see Armthorpe and still support Rovers. If anyone just wants to watch a team for watching a teams sake and doesn't care if they win lose or draw then there's a lot of sunday league football around. I've supported Rovers since I was about 8 and have always wanted them to win, winning leads to where we are now (or may be if these world beaters turn up).
I really don't know what fans want, I just us to win games and score goals so I can jump around and act mental once a week without getting carted off to the asylum. It's just football FFS, don't read any more into it, yes it's a big money thing but if it stopped tomorrow we'd survive, I promise you.
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If the FA think this is OK then they need to consider what happens when this mushrooms into the normal business practice of the football industry.
Richardson did it, as did Barry Fry, that bloke at Hearts and probbaly a few more besides, the bloke who pays the players arranges the transfers, picks the team - somebody else just does at bit of coaching. Its a bit more normal on the continent as well I understand, the people who run the clubs decide who is playing for them. I personaly dont like it but nothing to do with the FA.
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ENGLISH FOOTBALL and Premiership GREED deserves this type of business initiative .and Donny Rovers is the perfect vehicle .We will be the Donny Globetrotters of football. Much more likely that the Keepmoat will be breaking even with this model than with West Lifers !
IF we stay in the Championbship this season we will have started a Fottball Revolution and copy cat schemes with mushroom throughout Europe amongst otherwise ever impoverishing clubs .
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The club has ceased to be Doncaster Rovers now, it is another Franchise FC club. Let's call it McKays All Stars and cease to think of it as a club that has fought it's way through three divisions to get where it stands now. We have a nominal Chairman, what else can he be if he is not consulted about how the club is run, about the money to buy and sell players? What should any of the present squad do now that the team sheet will be filled by journeymen coming and going over a few weeks such as Chimbonda? If they have any sense for their own careers they get out, as they will never have a settled place so long as they can be replaced by players who MUST play if they are to advertise themselves to make Mr.McKay money. DS has no control over any of this, and cannot pick the team, can he leave Chimbonda out of any game, no matter how badly he plays? Of course not. My Rovers died a couple of weeks ago.
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Get a grip FFS, you sound like your daughter just died. It's football in 2011, get used to it or go bowling.
Brian, you're dead right!
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Get a grip FFS, you sound like your daughter just died. It's football in 2011, get used to it or go bowling.
Brian, you're dead right!
Will has a propensity to exaggerate the situation, to try and idealise football these days would be as hard as sucking off that cow of yours VD. :laugh:
:rtid:
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Dunno, it wasn't that high above mi roof, I could have maybe caught it. No point though, usual case...
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It's football in 2011, get used to it or go bowling.
Pass me my bowling shoes.....cos football in 2011 is shite.
Suppose they'll do well in sales of replica shirts though - the kids'll need a new one every 3-6 months to get a new name emblazoned on the back.
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Yea, you'll probably still have to buy the shoes though, they won't come free. Or the aisles, or the entertainment.
Look, if people don't want to see football then why bother posting or even be bothered about football forums? I'm just not getting it. Crown green bowls is another sport where you don't have to worry about things, don't limit it to the Dome, cheaper too.
Who wants Rovers to win games, and who wants to PAY to see us lose games?
Interesting question eh lads?
It's football in 2011, get used to it or go bowling.
Pass me my bowling shoes.....cos football in 2011 is shite.
Suppose they'll do well in sales of replica shirts though - the kids'll need a new one every 3-6 months to get a new name emblazoned on the back.
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Donnbob, no it won't be easy. We are left with an £8m problem from the old strategy / regime we cannot afford. The fact is we need to start addressing the issue and you have to start some time, like now. I am sure WMs remit will be outs as well as ins.
Relagation with a fixed £8m wage bill would be a disaster, relagation under the new strategy although not ideal, would not put the long term future of the club in danger.
I'm not convinced at all that we have an £8million p/a wage bill, certainly not on playing staff alone anyway.
I agree that the new strategy should cut the wage bill, regardless of its starting point, assuming we offload conventionally contracted players. On that basis it should not put the financial future of the club in danger, however we could end up in a situation similar to the one when we were relegated to the Conference, with no players and basically having to start from scratch. The costs associated with that would be considerable. I'm not sure McKay or his strategy is aimed at bearing the risk (which exists) of League One.
There is no continuity from a footballing perspective and that's what worries me above all. I don't see this as a way of running a football club. I might be stuck in tradition but I want the manager to manage, to choose the players and to pick the players, not be dictated to by an agent whose solitary aim is to use our club as a vehicle to make money for himself - that is all he's interested in. Like you say, if it works he is hailed a genius, but I have massive concerns about it.
I don't believe we could just get rid of him for a pay off tied to his £100 a week wage. As described in the article, this contract will be \"watertight\" and we will be very much tied into McKay's plan for the next two years. I'm just not comfortable with the fact that no players can come in or out of the club in that time without his say so, it totally undermines the role of the manager. I don't trust McKay at all, neither as a football man or a businessman (at least not to the extent that he is acting to the benefit of his 'employer')
Interestingly, I wonder what the new contracts offered to the likes of Bennett entail? Presumably we couldn't sell him anyway without McKay's say so? He's definitely a saleable asset. I don't think he was signed up to McKay before, I wonder if he's being encouraged to change agents?
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The club has ceased to be Doncaster Rovers now, it is another Franchise FC club. Let's call it McKays All Stars and cease to think of it as a club that has fought it's way through three divisions to get where it stands now. We have a nominal Chairman, what else can he be if he is not consulted about how the club is run, about the money to buy and sell players? What should any of the present squad do now that the team sheet will be filled by journeymen coming and going over a few weeks such as Chimbonda? If they have any sense for their own careers they get out, as they will never have a settled place so long as they can be replaced by players who MUST play if they are to advertise themselves to make Mr.McKay money. DS has no control over any of this, and cannot pick the team, can he leave Chimbonda out of any game, no matter how badly he plays? Of course not. My Rovers died a couple of weeks ago.
Oh how times have changed. From being one of the happiest of clappers you have turned to number one cynic.
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The club has ceased to be Doncaster Rovers now, it is another Franchise FC club. Let's call it McKays All Stars and cease to think of it as a club that has fought it's way through three divisions to get where it stands now. We have a nominal Chairman, what else can he be if he is not consulted about how the club is run, about the money to buy and sell players? What should any of the present squad do now that the team sheet will be filled by journeymen coming and going over a few weeks such as Chimbonda? If they have any sense for their own careers they get out, as they will never have a settled place so long as they can be replaced by players who MUST play if they are to advertise themselves to make Mr.McKay money. DS has no control over any of this, and cannot pick the team, can he leave Chimbonda out of any game, no matter how badly he plays? Of course not. My Rovers died a couple of weeks ago.
Oh how times have changed. From being one of the happiest of clappers you have turned to number one cynic.
Just seems like you two have swapped chairs, that's all. :laugh:
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At this point in time Muttley I fully support your views. Just one point, when it comes to what Sean said at the meeting with JR, we only have one persons account of what was said and the implication of it's content. Sean is a very honourable man and will not contradict JR, perhaps he is now gagged with a written agreement to say nothing.
What if he actually said.
1. I am not interested in the youth set up because you have not invested in it in an effective way but we could get academy boys from other clubs more cost effectively.
2. I can't cope with the financial support the board are giving me I need more money to stay up or we go down
Etc etc.
I know it is supposition but we only have one side of the story.
You could say that Sean is the complete opposite of McKay and I know who I would trust to manage my club.
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I think we face a range of options for the future, none of which is particuarly palatable. In an ideal world we would be able to secure new investment (or at least someone else prepared to fund the losses), but I don't think that is very likely to happen. There are only so many Sheikh Mansoors and Abramovichs out there!
So the alternatives are accept the inevitability of relegation or try a different approach. If we go down, we might become a yo-yo club, like Scunny. More likely we will find our level in League One, with a reduced wage bill but also reduced income, a declining fanbase and a large stadium to try to fill. In other words, the same problem we have now but with smaller numbers.
I don't think Willie McKay is in this \"for the good of Doncaster Rovers\" (he's admitted as much himself) nor do I think his business model is without flaws. But I don't necessarily see the McKay-DRFC relationship as a \"zero-sum game\"- it is possible that both parties could benefit. In the absence of anything better, I will give it a try and judge the success or otherwise at the end of the season. At least McKay has a vested interest in us staying up- otherwise his shop window doesn't look very attractive!
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I think all of us would in an ideal world want the following to be our model in the long term: ownership of the KMS, Doncaster people owning/running the club, an astute manager playing good football and operating on a sensible budget, Doncaster people coming to watch their LOCAL club and not ones 20/40 miles away, and life as a solid Championship club with the odd attempt to trouble the play offs. I think most of us would be happy at that, right?
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I think all of us would in an ideal world want the following to be our model in the long term: ownership of the KMS, Doncaster people owning/running the club, an astute manager playing good football and operating on a sensible budget, Doncaster people coming to watch their LOCAL club and not ones 20/40 miles away, and life as a solid Championship club with the odd attempt to trouble the play offs. I think most of us would be happy at that, right?
Pretty much, although not too bothered about DRFC owning the Keepmoat - I'd prefer it to be a fully utilised facility for the whole community, now if you could do this in the way they do in Barcelona (I know, I know) with all the various sports teams (basketball, handball, hockey etc) under one umbrella organisation (Dons, Belles etc), that would be perfect for me.
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I think all of us would in an ideal world want the following to be our model in the long term: ownership of the KMS, Doncaster people owning/running the club, an astute manager playing good football and operating on a sensible budget, Doncaster people coming to watch their LOCAL club and not ones 20/40 miles away, and life as a solid Championship club with the odd attempt to trouble the play offs. I think most of us would be happy at that, right?
I agree with the above, but it is a Vision. How we achieve that Vision is the difficult part. We managed to achieve some of it, but without the other bits it doesn't really work long-term. I'd love to see us with a waiting list for season tickets, but the gates are going down, not up. Something has to give.
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Oh how SOME Rovers fans just want to be miserable & moan about anything the club does.
A football agent earns money from selling players , we get the in-cenavised Premiership players for relatively free we hopefully get an improved playing staff, if not they won't get there move! How is this doom & gloom ?
We have an agent who wants to earn money as surly we all do but we as a club benefit , i don't get the negativity , i bet if we do well quiet a lot of clubs will start doing the same.
The moaners seem quiet happy for the board to keep throwing there money away for OUR club whilst some won't pay £27 to watch the Rovers.
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Oh how SOME Rovers fans just want to be miserable & moan about anything the club does.
A football agent earns money from selling players , we get the in-cenavised Premiership players for relatively free we hopefully get an improved playing staff, if not they won't get there move! How is this doom & gloom ?
We have an agent who wants to earn money as surly we all do but we as a club benefit , i don't get the negativity , i bet if we do well quiet a lot of clubs will start doing the same.
The moaners seem quiet happy for the board to keep throwing there money away for OUR club whilst some won't pay £27 to watch the Rovers.
I'm quite happy to say I won't pay £27 to watch Rovers, or any other team for that matter. I don't expect JR and co to throw money at it. If we are a League 1 or 2 club due to fanbase then so be it. If they have a vision that they can make the Premier League by doing this then again so be it. It's not up to me.
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I'm really not sure if this is going to work or not. I realise we had to do something to stay in the championship,but I was rather hoping Saunders would be given chance to buy his own players & prove he can manage on what we all know is a small budget. One thing is for sure,Willie Mc Kay will do what is best for Willie McKay. Please JR don't insult fans intelligence by saying Mc Kay loves this club & wants to help us. That's b*llocks.
Where the McKay involvement ends worries me. How long before he's picking the team (a la Richardson era) or even getting involved in the ownership of the stadium.
Please JR tread very,very carefully when dealing with this guy.
I hope this is only a short-term measure to ensure our championship survival for the next two years.
Called me old fashioned but I prefer to have a stable squad that are owned by the club & can build a team spirit. It,s difficult to do this when players are changing every week.
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\"My Rovers died a couple of weeks ago.\"
I continually gasp in disbelieve at some of the comments on this forum!
The Rovers have died so many times in its history, and in my history watching them -- in 1902/03, and 1904/5, 1914/15, 1939/40, 1947/48, 1957/58. 1958/59, 1966/67, 1970/71, 1973/74, 1978/79, and in 1987/88 -- by the 1990s it was selling portions of its pitch to survive, just before Richardson's deconstruction.
Even JR pulled out of the club when Richardson took it over. It has been a long history of struggle and disappointment. Many on her remember our gates in the 1970s -- we proud fans called ourselves members of the 1500 club, because we could just scrape 1,500 fans together each home game playing Workington and Barrow. So many good players were sold or given away, and the club was repeatedly mismanaged, way before Richardson came on Board.
Of course we'd like to become a well run club playing 'our' players in the Championship on low wages in front of 8,000 faithful fans at the Keepmoat, occasionally swelled by 2/3,000.
away followers.
So many 'fans' balk at 27 quid for home matches! How else could the club even try to compete in the Championship on diminishing gates? JR could have thrown the towel in, and it would be back into D4, and we'd be a well liked, well run club -- everyone's second favorite club.
Screw that, let's pay and play these mercenaries, and let's annoy the shit out of Leeds, Barnsley, Owls and Blades fans.
Chimbonda and Co are loan players by another name, and it is irrelevant if they kiss their badges or not. No one complains about Mason, Parkin and co, nor about Billy when he was on loan!
McKay's players will have the red and white hoops on, and they will help fill the Keepmoat, and keep us in the Championship -- and JR knows that this will get us in the Premier League for a season or so, and fill our coffers so we can have some longer term investment.
What a bold, insightful move John Ryan! Well done. If it fails, it backs to Yeovil and Crewe, where we were headed anyway.
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What a bold, insightful move John Ryan!
Are you sure it is John Ryan's move?
Interetsting to see Dick Watson speaking out in the paper today to justify the new strategy. He's had to take a bit of a more prominent role explaining away a few things lately.
I'm sure John Ryan will still be the grinning face at the forefront of it, but I have my own opinion as to whether this is genuinely his move, or whether he's just been moved along with it.
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What a bold, insightful move John Ryan!
Are you sure it is John Ryan's move?
Interetsting to see Dick Watson speaking out in the paper today to justify the new strategy. He's had to take a bit of a more prominent role explaining away a few things lately.
I'm sure John Ryan will still be the grinning face at the forefront of it, but I have my own opinion as to whether this is genuinely his move, or whether he's just been moved along with it.
Working well this afternoon so far I see...watch us climb that table :unsure:
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So all this Agents contacts, the glut of \"disgruntled premiership standard footballers\", and we end up with........a left back whose parent club couldn't wait to get rid of him, a permenently injured goalkeeper, and a defender who is already lining up another move in a couple of months regardless of if he plays well here or not?!!
Not a business model I'd like to stick to.
I had hoped things would be better, instead Rovers will become a dumping ground for rejects with no obligation to play well while they are here. And behind it all, a man who has been suspected, although not proved, of inproper dealings within football.
Are the shark like money men taking the cheap and desperate way out of a relegation battle? And are they prostituting the club in the process?
Pretty shitty isn't it, when at the moment (0-1 to Portsmouth and second from the bottom) the only people benefitting are the players.....
I predict this could be the end of Rovers as we know it.
Edit - ps Jonathon, if you doubt the £8 million wage bill, take a look at the thread showing the Rovesr company acounts from 2009/10. It is quite clear that £8 million is a realistic figure.
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So all this Agents contacts, the glut of \"disgruntled premiership standard footballers\", and we end up with........a left back whose parent club couldn't wait to get rid of him, a permenently injured goalkeeper, and a defender who is already lining up another move in a couple of months regardless of if he plays well here or not?!!
Not a business model I'd like to stick to.
I had hoped things would be better, instead Rovers will become a dumping ground for rejects with no obligation to play well while they are here. And behind it all, a man who has been suspected, although not proved, of inproper dealings within football.
Are the shark like money men taking the cheap and desperate way out of a relegation battle? And are they prostituting the club in the process?
Pretty shitty isn't it, when at the moment (0-1 to Portsmouth and second from the bottom) the only people benefitting are the players.....
I predict this could be the end of Rovers as we know it.
Edit - ps Jonathon, if you doubt the £8 million wage bill, take a look at the thread showing the Rovesr company acounts from 2009/10. It is quite clear that £8 million is a realistic figure.
You know what...I agree with every word.
How ironic that for a Club that has always been careful with its dealings with agents...we have now sold our souls to one who could potentially be the death of us.
Nothing short of embarrassing this afternoon.
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But what can we do about it? The way i see it is we will go down this year. Some players are getting worse by the game. When these so called better players arrive then we could but a long way adrift. Then what? This is like a bad dream and i can't belive JR would of done this.
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The real Benaldo is back! I've missed him an' all!
That's the thing isn't it, what the hell can we do? If the results and performances continue like this, maybe Ryan and everyone else will wake up and smell the coffee - a coffee that has the distinct smell of failure, madness and the bogs at Huish Park where we will surely be finding ourselves at next season.
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Had an interesting chat with a respected former player tonight.
Some people will not be bothered whether our current players are on board with this plan or not - we can always bring in famous new ones afterall.
Unfortunately I'm gutted with what's going on and what's in the plan for January.
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After reading all the comments about how demoralised players will be because of the threat of new loan players and 'How do we expect them to play good football' because of the new situation, well maybe I'm over simplyfying it but surely if they played to the best of their ability, trained hard and gave it their all week in week out they wouldn't have to worry about their position in the squad, because DS would be happy to play them. Like a lot of people I'm on the verge of possible redundancy and I'm not sulking at work, or taking time off, or only doing a half job. I'm working damned hard to make sure I'm indespensible to my bosses, so I keep my job. Footballers are no different. :chair:
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After reading all the comments about how demoralised players will be because of the threat of new loan players and 'How do we expect them to play good football' because of the new situation, well maybe I'm over simplyfying it but surely if they played to the best of their ability, trained hard and gave it their all week in week out they wouldn't have to worry about their position in the squad, because DS would be happy to play them. Like a lot of people I'm on the verge of possible redundancy and I'm not sulking at work, or taking time off, or only doing a half job. I'm working damned hard to make sure I'm indespensible to my bosses, so I keep my job. Footballers are no different. :chair:
I think an awful lot of the whining male posters on this forum should take note of the above post and think good and hard about what drivel some of you are posting.
It seems the most sensible comment to date on the whole subject has come from a female.
I am not being patronising in any way but WELL DONE Donnylass.
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You're not patronising? Alright then...Donnylass undoubtedly makes a good point, but the fact that she's a woman and us \"whining male posters\" are indeed male really isn't relevant to anything, is it?
I don't think the issue is that the present players wouldn't play good enough football if new short-term deals were procured, it's more that a good team chemistry, togetherness and spirit can be fostered in a squad to great effect, sometimes making up for a few shortfalls in skill on the field. I think what some people are saying is that this may not be a possibility if half the squad is like a conveyor belt running through the French second division every three months, which is a fair point in my opinion.
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You're not patronising? Alright then...Donnylass undoubtedly makes a good point, but the fact that she's a woman and us \"whining male posters\" are indeed male really isn't relevant to anything, is it?
I don't think the issue is that the present players wouldn't play good enough football if new short-term deals were procured, it's more that a good team chemistry, togetherness and spirit can be fostered in a squad to great effect, sometimes making up for a few shortfalls in skill on the field. I think what some people are saying is that this may not be a possibility if half the squad is like a conveyor belt running through the French second division every three months, which is a fair point in my opinion.
Wellred is full of contradiction and...like you say it certainly reads patronising.
Of course, in his world his opinion is a hundred times more valid than yours and everything if rosy in the Doncaster Rovers garden...so keep it down? Ok? ;)
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You're not patronising? Alright then...Donnylass undoubtedly makes a good point, but the fact that she's a woman and us \"whining male posters\" are indeed male really isn't relevant to anything, is it?
I don't think the issue is that the present players wouldn't play good enough football if new short-term deals were procured, it's more that a good team chemistry, togetherness and spirit can be fostered in a squad to great effect, sometimes making up for a few shortfalls in skill on the field. I think what some people are saying is that this may not be a possibility if half the squad is like a conveyor belt running through the French second division every three months, which is a fair point in my opinion.
Wellred is full of contradiction and...like you say it certainly reads patronising.
Of course, in his world his opinion is a hundred times more valid than yours and everything if rosy in the Doncaster Rovers garden...so keep it down? Ok? ;)
I learnt everything about being patronising from you though.
I have never said everything in the garden is rosy. But on the other hand unlike some I have never intimated that the end is nigh!
I am prepared to give the new strategy a try in the hope that it works.
I am prepared to give the new manager a chance.
Can you say the same?
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You're not patronising? Alright then...Donnylass undoubtedly makes a good point, but the fact that she's a woman and us \"whining male posters\" are indeed male really isn't relevant to anything, is it?
I don't think the issue is that the present players wouldn't play good enough football if new short-term deals were procured, it's more that a good team chemistry, togetherness and spirit can be fostered in a squad to great effect, sometimes making up for a few shortfalls in skill on the field. I think what some people are saying is that this may not be a possibility if half the squad is like a conveyor belt running through the French second division every three months, which is a fair point in my opinion.
Wellred is full of contradiction and...like you say it certainly reads patronising.
Of course, in his world his opinion is a hundred times more valid than yours and everything if rosy in the Doncaster Rovers garden...so keep it down? Ok? ;)
Wellred is totally right .....change is needed and this could be one of the masterstrokes of all time!
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It could be Norfolk, yes. But if we have to sacrifice our identity and affinity with the club for it, I'd rather we just didn't bother, took our lumps and tried our best to stay up in the manner that we have conducted ourselves for the last god knows how many years. And if that leads to our relegation, so be it...because being relegated back to the third tier is definitely not the end of the world. We proved a decade ago that getting relegated out of the league altogether and into the Conference was not the end of the world, so why should we accept what JR says and suddenly believe that going back to League 1 would be?
I admire your faith and optimism in all of this Norfolk, but we learnt at this football club a long time ago to not just stick the blinkers on the sides of our faces and accept what the mighty powers-that-be were telling us.
Wellred, you're writing off those of us that have concerns just as much as you think we are writing off Saunders/McKay/the club. You are acting like anything me, Jonathan, ThinWhiteDuke and anyone else who shares our view say is not allowed to be voiced, as if it is all complete insanity and that the fact we dare question a dodgy football agent taking this role he has gotten for himself.
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The idea of players going out on loan to put them in the shop window has been going on for years, but this has now been cranked up to make it its own industry. It would interest me how much of the future transfer fees you are going to make from this venture, as this might mean it's only being used to raise funds for new players, making this idea only a temporary arrangement.
On one hand I think it's an interesting arrangement, on the other I'm glad it isn't us who are doing this, as like others say it really takes the soul out of the club.
The obvious danger to me is that the trail might at some point run dry and all the \"core\" players have already left.
Really do hope though that this helps you and gets you back up the table.
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It could be Norfolk, yes. But if we have to sacrifice our identity and affinity with the club for it, I'd rather we just didn't bother, took our lumps and tried our best to stay up in the manner that we have conducted ourselves for the last god knows how many years. And if that leads to our relegation, so be it...because being relegated back to the third tier is definitely not the end of the world. We proved a decade ago that getting relegated out of the league altogether and into the Conference was not the end of the world, so why should we accept what JR says and suddenly believe that going back to League 1 would be?
I admire your faith and optimism in all of this Norfolk, but we learnt at this football club a long time ago to not just stick the blinkers on the sides of our faces and accept what the mighty powers-that-be were telling us.
Wellred, you're writing off those of us that have concerns just as much as you think we are writing off Saunders/McKay/the club. You are acting like anything me, Jonathan, ThinWhiteDuke and anyone else who shares our view say is not allowed to be voiced, as if it is all complete insanity and that the fact we dare question a dodgy football agent taking this role he has gotten for himself.
You are wrong RoversAlias. I am not writing off those of you who do have concerns. I think we all have concerns.
I am not asking you to agree or disagree with me. I have my views you have yours and you are entitled to them.
All I am asking is that your views are based on truths and not on suppositions.
There have been so many scare mongering stories and statements which are a million miles from the truth and equally there are things that have happened and been told to people who were in attendance by the chairman of the club that some people have inferred him to be a liar.
Whilst I do not always agree with Jonathan's stance and to a lesser extent yours. I am sorry but the TWD just prints absolute b******s. as his 6 point post shows.
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I think we face a range of options for the future, none of which is particuarly palatable. In an ideal world we would be able to secure new investment (or at least someone else prepared to fund the losses), but I don't think that is very likely to happen. There are only so many Sheikh Mansoors and Abramovichs out there!
So the alternatives are accept the inevitability of relegation or try a different approach. If we go down, we might become a yo-yo club, like Scunny. More likely we will find our level in League One, with a reduced wage bill but also reduced income, a declining fanbase and a large stadium to try to fill. In other words, the same problem we have now but with smaller numbers.
I don't think Willie McKay is in this \"for the good of Doncaster Rovers\" (he's admitted as much himself) nor do I think his business model is without flaws. But I don't necessarily see the McKay-DRFC relationship as a \"zero-sum game\"- it is possible that both parties could benefit. In the absence of anything better, I will give it a try and judge the success or otherwise at the end of the season. At least McKay has a vested interest in us staying up- otherwise his shop window doesn't look very attractive!
That's pretty much how I see it.
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After reading all the comments about how demoralised players will be because of the threat of new loan players and 'How do we expect them to play good football' because of the new situation, well maybe I'm over simplyfying it but surely if they played to the best of their ability, trained hard and gave it their all week in week out they wouldn't have to worry about their position in the squad, because DS would be happy to play them. Like a lot of people I'm on the verge of possible redundancy and I'm not sulking at work, or taking time off, or only doing a half job. I'm working damned hard to make sure I'm indespensible to my bosses, so I keep my job. Footballers are no different. :chair:
Should you not be ironing or knitting or something ?
And i am being patronising , then again i am allowed :woot:
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After reading all the comments about how demoralised players will be because of the threat of new loan players and 'How do we expect them to play good football' because of the new situation, well maybe I'm over simplyfying it but surely if they played to the best of their ability, trained hard and gave it their all week in week out they wouldn't have to worry about their position in the squad, because DS would be happy to play them. Like a lot of people I'm on the verge of possible redundancy and I'm not sulking at work, or taking time off, or only doing a half job. I'm working damned hard to make sure I'm indespensible to my bosses, so I keep my job. Footballers are no different. :chair:
Should you not be ironing or knitting or something ?
And i am being patronising , then again i am allowed :woot:
That's fine I'll do those things, and you can cook your own dinner tonight :thumbsup:
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Regarding Mckay and his plans. What is this Twitter feed I am reading on this site about Victoria Beckham possibly designing something for us? He wants her to email him details or something.
Just how much influence is WM having.....and not just with bringing players in. I do hope I am reading this totally wrong!
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Regarding Mckay and his plans. What is this Twitter feed I am reading on this site about Victoria Beckham possibly designing something for us? He wants her to email him details or something.
Just how much influence is WM having.....and not just with bringing players in. I do hope I am reading this totally wrong!
Are you actually serious?
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I may have overreacted with that post, but how much control does he have at the club? I'm sure you can understand people's concerns with this new venture. I am happy to see how it goes, but don't want us to become a joke as no-one does.
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oh s**t I thought you was serious. :cry:
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There have been a few Willy(or should that be Wily) McKay's suddenly appear on Twitter. lol
When I started this thread I was worried, no, very worried about where these latest developments will be taking our club. After thinking about everything I have read on here, reading other articles in the news and on other forums, talking to other Rovers fans and scribbling down pro's and cons for all the arguments, I am coming round to thinking it could be the best option we have, to go with Willy Mckay's scheme. I can see problems happening but I am going to keep supporting JR, DS, every player that puts on the red and white hooped shirt even(begrudgingly) Willy McKay.
At the end of the day we will get the best out of it all if we all stick together and be supportive.
Bring on Coventry and 3pts.
Steve
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Although I've seen pictures of him everytime I read his name I can only see Richardson in my head.
And that is what worries me most...
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Although I've seen pictures of him everytime I read his name I can only see Richardson in my head.
And that is what worries me most...
Honestly I don't think we can draw parallels with the Richardson regime. It's always going to be the underlying basis of many of our fears where ownership and direction are concerned but we do still have John Ryan involved, and while he may not have the influence he once had, he unquestionably has the interests of the club at heart.
I don't trust McKay at all, I don't like the direction we're taking and I can't warm to it as a way of operating my club, but we're a long long way from being able to compare the running of the club between now and then.
Hopefully the Richardson days were a one off. I think the worries people have now are genuine and justified, but different.
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For those of us who were there in the Richardson era, who can blame us for being worried. While it may not be a similar situation, it just doesn't seem right. Halving the wage bill? That is a mammoth task for starters, and the fact that Mckay has the say on transfers in and out for the next two years just sounds absurd.
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Although I've seen pictures of him everytime I read his name I can only see Richardson in my head.
And that is what worries me most...
Yes I can see the slimey parrallels, but one very major difference, the worse we played and the worse we were as a club, the better it was for Richardson who was trying to destroy us - the better we play and the better we are as a team, the better it is for Mckay who is trying to use us to make money.
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Although I've seen pictures of him everytime I read his name I can only see Richardson in my head.
And that is what worries me most...
Honestly I don't think we can draw parallels with the Richardson regime. It's always going to be the underlying basis of many of our fears where ownership and direction are concerned but we do still have John Ryan involved, and while he may not have the influence he once had, he unquestionably has the interests of the club at heart.
I don't trust McKay at all, I don't like the direction we're taking and I can't warm to it as a way of operating my club, but we're a long long way from being able to compare the running of the club between now and then.
Hopefully the Richardson days were a one off. I think the worries people have now are genuine and justified, but different.
I have thought long and hard about the pros and cons about the current 'muddy' arrangement and can categorically state that I am totally and utterly against what is being proposed.
Quite simply it just won't work imo and I can only see the selling off of our'crown jewels' (admittedly there aren't alot) in the near future. Morale will and is simply ebbing away from the contracted players, there will no longer be a team an entity but a few passing strangers wearing the Hoops trying to get on the 'gravy train' again probably at the expense of our decent current players. They say there is no 'I' in team but Jeez we are about to see exactly tat from a few players passing through.
Bad bad move..............:( :(
Anyone see the likes of Peterborough/ Barnsley and the ilk struggling for the lack of having a rogue agent in charge of their affairs ?
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Although I've seen pictures of him everytime I read his name I can only see Richardson in my head.
And that is what worries me most...
Honestly I don't think we can draw parallels with the Richardson regime. It's always going to be the underlying basis of many of our fears where ownership and direction are concerned but we do still have John Ryan involved, and while he may not have the influence he once had, he unquestionably has the interests of the club at heart.
I don't trust McKay at all, I don't like the direction we're taking and I can't warm to it as a way of operating my club, but we're a long long way from being able to compare the running of the club between now and then.
Hopefully the Richardson days were a one off. I think the worries people have now are genuine and justified, but different.
I have thought long and hard about the pros and cons about the current 'muddy' arrangement and can categorically state that I am totally and utterly against what is being proposed.
Quite simply it just won't work imo and I can only see the selling off of our'crown jewels' (admittedly there aren't alot) in the near future. Morale will and is simply ebbing away from the contracted players, there will no longer be a team an entity but a few passing strangers wearing the Hoops trying to get on the 'gravy train' again probably at the expense of our decent current players. They say there is no 'I' in team but Jeez we are about to see exactly tat from a few players passing through.
Bad bad move..............:( :(
Can they do any worse? At least this way we are not getting into debt and touch wood we might win some games!
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the fact that Mckay has the say on transfers in and out for the next two years just sounds absurd.
EXACTLY. Thats the point that worries me. I could reluctantly go along with the rest of this unusual arrangement but this aspect of it is so wrong.
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the fact that Mckay has the say on transfers in and out for the next two years just sounds absurd.
EXACTLY. Thats the point that worries me. I could reluctantly go along with the rest of this unusual arrangement but this aspect of it is so wrong.
Saunders can veto any of transfers and no doubt contractually can be cancelled if all parties believe not working?
In practice I am sure it will be saunders that suggests the player and area that needs strengthening as any normal manager!
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Saunders can veto any of transfers and no doubt contractually can be cancelled if all parties believe not working?
Saunders will veto bugger all - he'll do what he's told by his master McKay.
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I'm against the whole idea of it, full stop. None of it makes sense, I've been running it through my head and after a couple of days to think about it I think I'm ready to have my say put across.
I'll start with the whole beginning of the arrangement; I cannot bear thinking that John Ryan has sold out SOD for this guy, but someone did post about SOD not liking Mckay as a person long ago (I think it was Silent Majority), if this is the case, and how this all started up then the actions by John Ryan in particular (due to the fact of publicly backing him) do really sicken me.
Now before we get onto McKay I don't see what logic has made the board think the wage bill needs cutting in half. Have they conceded relegation? Lets assume the staff get paid for 50 weeks I'm not sure if its more or lett, but a bit of simple maths
£4 million/50 (weekly wage bill) = £80000
I read Mckay is looking around wages of £2000 per week for players so
£80000/£2000 (no. of employees) = 40
40. 4T. Forty employees, this is to cover the players and coaching team (manager, assistant, Coaches, Physio etc.,) and Saunders wants a reserve team? Sounds like a nice little plan.
The character of Mckay aside, I doubt when this plan is fully under way will be a case of 5 players coming in on loan, then 3 months 5 differeny players replace them. But more like one or two in January till March, few more arrive in February till April and so on. Those that have defended Dean Saunders slow start have said things such as \"He doesn't know the squad yet, needs time to blend them\" and yet these people expect him to manage us onto great things with an ever changing squad every month? As much as Dean deserves time, is this really the right model for him to be the manager? Heck could any manager work with such a squad changing every other week?
2 years in charge of transfers, and then what? Will we continue like this? Or is this a relativley short term plan to try and make a profit?
These type of questions haven't been answered just yet, and no doubt most want these answers. But what happens if we get relegated? Will this still attract the players Mckay wants? or does the once big time players soon become West Brom reserve players turning up to play for us? How can we rely on the squad we have left when they are bieng shoved to the back of the locker for the sake of the club.
This brings us to the players, how do they feel? With such big names around them the current squad will see moral depleted by:
1) New short term players taking the limelight while they still remain property of DRFC
2) Under pressure to \"provide\" the service these great players deserve
3) Living in fear of someone better(known) taking their place
As for McKay, well I'll use a quote from a Harlan Coben character \"Man Plans; God Laughs\" except in this case we plan; McKay laughs, I don't blame SOD for not liking him as a person in all honesty, the man reeks of corruption (and probably reeks of the local chippy as well). He represents everything that has turned this wonderful game into the dissaray it has become today in this day and age. It dazzles me as to how John Ryan could let this man anywhere near the football club he built from scratch.
A clear sign from the board with lack of investment in the next few years; a policy of a constant changing squad with a manager who \"needs time to get the squad playing\" (from people who have defended him) and a corrupted agent only interested in lining his pockets is a recipe for disaster; how anyone on here can look at this proposed model and agree with it is beyond me. Each to their own and everything; but even if we do pull it off, an average wage of £2000 per player is not going to win us games at this division.
Corruptio optimi pessima!
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Think we all have opinions and there no doubt the strategy is risky and could quite clearly fail and all will depend on man management etc.
What I don’t accept is people are within their discussion points suggesting ;-
1) Club not being transparent
2) Club is deceiving the public/fans
3) Club is corrupt
Or am I getting the wrong end of the stick?
Are the doubters suggesting this? Come On Duke, Croft what are you actually saying here?
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Think we all have opinions and there no doubt the strategy is risky and could quite clearly fail and all will depend on man management etc.
What I don’t accept is people are within their discussion points suggesting ;-
1) Club not being transparent
2) Club is deceiving the public/fans
3) Club is corrupt
Or am I getting the wrong end of the stick?
Are the doubters suggesting this? Come On Duke, Croft what are you actually saying here?
I'm not accusing the club of any of these, I'm saying the club is heading to becoming all 3 for the sake of a few quid.
The club is desperatley searching for a turn around of fortunes and are trying something very radical which will have huge consequences if it fails, but I fail to see the advantages if it works. £4 million? What can honestly be achieved? Could we get the players for the same wages if we were promoted? We would demand a higher level of players and that demands a higher wage bill, and thats higher than the current £8 million.
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Think we all have opinions and there no doubt the strategy is risky and could quite clearly fail and all will depend on man management etc.
What I don’t accept is people are within their discussion points suggesting ;-
1) Club not being transparent
2) Club is deceiving the public/fans
3) Club is corrupt
Or am I getting the wrong end of the stick?
Are the doubters suggesting this? Come On Duke, Croft what are you actually saying here?
I'm not accusing the club of any of these, I'm saying the club is heading to becoming all 3 for the sake of a few quid.
The club is desperatley searching for a turn around of fortunes and are trying something very radical which will have huge consequences if it fails, but I fail to see the advantages if it works. £4 million? What can honestly be achieved? Could we get the players for the same wages if we were promoted? We would demand a higher level of players and that demands a higher wage bill, and thats higher than the current £8 million.
Right I will add weight to the agrument there are two business models that could work in our position our new one or the Dingles (recruiting from lower leagues).
My gut feeling is that the Dingle one will fail - working fine now but wait until the injuries take there toll and you are lose key players like Butterfield.
Then there ours and as above this could fail but alternatively if could be the best thing EVER!
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its similar to what blackpool did when they got promoted,that season they went thru about 20-24 loan players and it didnt do them any harm.
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Think we all have opinions and there no doubt the strategy is risky and could quite clearly fail and all will depend on man management etc.
What I don’t accept is people are within their discussion points suggesting ;-
1) Club not being transparent
2) Club is deceiving the public/fans
3) Club is corrupt
Or am I getting the wrong end of the stick?
Are the doubters suggesting this? Come On Duke, Croft what are you actually saying here?
I'm not accusing the club of any of these, I'm saying the club is heading to becoming all 3 for the sake of a few quid.
The club is desperatley searching for a turn around of fortunes and are trying something very radical which will have huge consequences if it fails, but I fail to see the advantages if it works. £4 million? What can honestly be achieved? Could we get the players for the same wages if we were promoted? We would demand a higher level of players and that demands a higher wage bill, and thats higher than the current £8 million.
Right I will add weight to the agrument there are two business models that could work in our position our new one or the Dingles (recruiting from lower leagues).
My gut feeling is that the Dingle one will fail - working fine now but wait until the injuries take there toll and you are lose key players like Butterfield.
Then there ours and as above this could fail but alternatively if could be the best thing EVER!
I have said in the past 2 posts reasons why it would be miserable if it fails.
Now can you point out how this \"could be the best thing EVER!\" ?
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Think we all have opinions and there no doubt the strategy is risky and could quite clearly fail and all will depend on man management etc.
What I don’t accept is people are within their discussion points suggesting ;-
1) Club not being transparent
2) Club is deceiving the public/fans
3) Club is corrupt
Or am I getting the wrong end of the stick?
Are the doubters suggesting this? Come On Duke, Croft what are you actually saying here?
I'm not accusing the club of any of these, I'm saying the club is heading to becoming all 3 for the sake of a few quid.
The club is desperatley searching for a turn around of fortunes and are trying something very radical which will have huge consequences if it fails, but I fail to see the advantages if it works. £4 million? What can honestly be achieved? Could we get the players for the same wages if we were promoted? We would demand a higher level of players and that demands a higher wage bill, and thats higher than the current £8 million.
Right I will add weight to the agrument there are two business models that could work in our position our new one or the Dingles (recruiting from lower leagues).
My gut feeling is that the Dingle one will fail - working fine now but wait until the injuries take there toll and you are lose key players like Butterfield.
Then there ours and as above this could fail but alternatively if could be the best thing EVER!
I have said in the past 2 posts reasons why it would be miserable if it fails.
Now can you point out how this \"could be the best thing EVER!\" ?
Cos we may get the pot of gold and bring Premiership football to the KM, you know dare to dream and all that and that which would ensure we are financially stable for next 10 years!!
You are not really suggesting any solution are you?
The current model is losing millions and we lose virtually every week!
SO obviously you must suggest going back down the leagues? Which is the only alternative is it not?
Some merit to this and could be that yo yo club but we could quite easily go all the way back to the non league.
The ground situation brings great pressure re crowds and I would suggest this could bring bankruptcy?
Or you expecting uncle John to help you again the very same person who has employed the \"DEVIL\"!!!
Sadly nothing in life is easy and I for one back the board in their brave new world!
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Think we all have opinions and there no doubt the strategy is risky and could quite clearly fail and all will depend on man management etc.
What I don’t accept is people are within their discussion points suggesting ;-
1) Club not being transparent
2) Club is deceiving the public/fans
3) Club is corrupt
Or am I getting the wrong end of the stick?
Are the doubters suggesting this? Come On Duke, Croft what are you actually saying here?
I'm not accusing the club of any of these, I'm saying the club is heading to becoming all 3 for the sake of a few quid.
The club is desperatley searching for a turn around of fortunes and are trying something very radical which will have huge consequences if it fails, but I fail to see the advantages if it works. £4 million? What can honestly be achieved? Could we get the players for the same wages if we were promoted? We would demand a higher level of players and that demands a higher wage bill, and thats higher than the current £8 million.
Right I will add weight to the agrument there are two business models that could work in our position our new one or the Dingles (recruiting from lower leagues).
My gut feeling is that the Dingle one will fail - working fine now but wait until the injuries take there toll and you are lose key players like Butterfield.
Then there ours and as above this could fail but alternatively if could be the best thing EVER!
I have said in the past 2 posts reasons why it would be miserable if it fails.
Now can you point out how this \"could be the best thing EVER!\" ?
Cos we may get the pot of gold and bring Premiership football to the KM, you know dare to dream and all that and that which would ensure we are financially stable for next 10 years!!
You are not really suggesting any solution are you?
The current model is losing millions and we lose virtually every week!
SO obviously you must suggest going back down the leagues? Which is the only alternative is it not?
Some merit to this and could be that yo yo club but we could quite easily go all the way back to the non league.
The ground situation brings great pressure re crowds and I would suggest this could bring bankruptcy?
Or you expecting uncle John to help you again the very same person who has employed the \"DEVIL\"!!!
Sadly nothing in life is easy and I for one back the board in their brave new world!
There is only one solution to sucess in football; investment, investment and more investment. Don't beleive me look at the team that was once 20,000 under capacity which now sell out their ground virtually every game and romped arguably one of the best teams in the world this afternoon.
When we was in the conference our attendance improved, the club wasn't winning every week, but why did more and more turn up? John Ryan put his hand in his pocket, it may not seem like much then, but it was huge amounts for conference level and the attendances rose. Attendances come with sucess, but heavy investment also help the situation. Clubs such as Leciester and Forest who invest millions into the squad see this rewarded with the fans turning out in numbers; people start talking of promotion and more bums on seats.
The club failed to back the (now previous manager) in pre season with the investment needed and ST sales dropped, the recent arrivals have shown slight increase in attendance (along with those vital 3 results). People will not go out and buy season tickets now because we are a quarter of the way through the season and for the price they are asking you can probably understand where they are coming from.
Wth the current squad and the failure to invest I would have rather seen us relegated with a stable platform to rebuild, rather than tearing down the current structure and buidling from scratch which would be a real struggle to recover from if we do go down.
Of course that is now the vital point in whether this is a sucess or not; if we stay up with games to spare and finish mid table then we may be moving in the right direction and I'll stand corrected; but the risk involved is too high and if anything I have learnt over the past decade JR and the relatively new board are not big gamblers; if so we would have seen more investment.
The money is there; we saw it when we wanted Sharp; but in truth it was the right investment at the wrong time; most felt a defender was more of a priority and you have to ask if we did have one would our season had been so badly last season which has had the knock on effect which has brought this about...
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Think we all have opinions and there no doubt the strategy is risky and could quite clearly fail and all will depend on man management etc.
What I don’t accept is people are within their discussion points suggesting ;-
1) Club not being transparent
2) Club is deceiving the public/fans
3) Club is corrupt
Or am I getting the wrong end of the stick?
Are the doubters suggesting this? Come On Duke, Croft what are you actually saying here?
I'm not accusing the club of any of these, I'm saying the club is heading to becoming all 3 for the sake of a few quid.
The club is desperatley searching for a turn around of fortunes and are trying something very radical which will have huge consequences if it fails, but I fail to see the advantages if it works. £4 million? What can honestly be achieved? Could we get the players for the same wages if we were promoted? We would demand a higher level of players and that demands a higher wage bill, and thats higher than the current £8 million.
Right I will add weight to the agrument there are two business models that could work in our position our new one or the Dingles (recruiting from lower leagues).
My gut feeling is that the Dingle one will fail - working fine now but wait until the injuries take there toll and you are lose key players like Butterfield.
Then there ours and as above this could fail but alternatively if could be the best thing EVER!
I have said in the past 2 posts reasons why it would be miserable if it fails.
Now can you point out how this \"could be the best thing EVER!\" ?
Cos we may get the pot of gold and bring Premiership football to the KM, you know dare to dream and all that and that which would ensure we are financially stable for next 10 years!!
You are not really suggesting any solution are you?
The current model is losing millions and we lose virtually every week!
SO obviously you must suggest going back down the leagues? Which is the only alternative is it not?
Some merit to this and could be that yo yo club but we could quite easily go all the way back to the non league.
The ground situation brings great pressure re crowds and I would suggest this could bring bankruptcy?
Or you expecting uncle John to help you again the very same person who has employed the \"DEVIL\"!!!
Sadly nothing in life is easy and I for one back the board in their brave new world!
There is only one solution to sucess in football; investment, investment and more investment. Don't beleive me look at the team that was once 20,000 under capacity which now sell out their ground virtually every game and romped arguably one of the best teams in the world this afternoon.
When we was in the conference our attendance improved, the club wasn't winning every week, but why did more and more turn up? John Ryan put his hand in his pocket, it may not seem like much then, but it was huge amounts for conference level and the attendances rose. Attendances come with sucess, but heavy investment also help the situation. Clubs such as Leciester and Forest who invest millions into the squad see this rewarded with the fans turning out in numbers; people start talking of promotion and more bums on seats.
The club failed to back the (now previous manager) in pre season with the investment needed and ST sales dropped, the recent arrivals have shown slight increase in attendance (along with those vital 3 results). People will not go out and buy season tickets now because we are a quarter of the way through the season and for the price they are asking you can probably understand where they are coming from.
Wth the current squad and the failure to invest I would have rather seen us relegated with a stable platform to rebuild, rather than tearing down the current structure and buidling from scratch which would be a real struggle to recover from if we do go down.
Of course that is now the vital point in whether this is a sucess or not; if we stay up with games to spare and finish mid table then we may be moving in the right direction and I'll stand corrected; but the risk involved is too high and if anything I have learnt over the past decade JR and the relatively new board are not big gamblers; if so we would have seen more investment.
The money is there; we saw it when we wanted Sharp; but in truth it was the right investment at the wrong time; most felt a defender was more of a priority and you have to ask if we did have one would our season had been so badly last season which has had the knock on effect which has brought this about...
Sadly JR is not a Billionaire and he has done enough he must have pumped between 5-10 million of his own money in over the years.
The reason we have to do this is the apathy of the general public simple as and adding the incredible quality like Diarra is an investment in my book!
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Sadly JR is not a Billionaire and he has done enough he must have pumped between 5-10 million of his own money in over the years.
The reason we have to do this is the apathy of the general public simple as and adding the incredible quality like Diarra is an investment in my book!
Yep £2000 a week; atrocious amount for a footballer.
Best hide my Chelsea shirt; we'll be playing em next year... :woot:
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Lee,
You can't possibly talk about investment providing success or otherwise. Its not investment, at our level its called throwing your money away.
You quote Forest as an example, their Chairman has thrown £65m at their problem and look what success its brought him! Leicester I guarantee are in a similar position. To quote somebody last week who said that every club had got the e-mail about sustainability this season, apart from Leicester, it seems they never got it!!
When you have shortfall in your accounts of about £4m a year there is no money for investment.
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Sadly JR is not a Billionaire and he has done enough he must have pumped between 5-10 million of his own money in over the years.
The reason we have to do this is the apathy of the general public simple as and adding the incredible quality like Diarra is an investment in my book!
Yep £2000 a week; atrocious amount for a footballer.
Best hide my Chelsea shirt; we'll be playing em next year... :woot:
Of course a £26 million footabller who played for one of the world greats a crock of shit!
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I always trusted JR and the Board to invest wisely in the past, and I could always see where they were coming from by putting little in the clubs in terms of investment due to covering the losses the club operates on.
But that said huge investments during off and pre-season relate to ST sales, how many more season tickets do you think we would have sold if the board plugged £8 million extra into the club? Surely that would be a wise investment for what is relativley loose change between the 3 'majority' shareholders?
In the premiership there are arguably two extremes for sucess for a football club; Everton who currently look the most effiecent with the board only paying wages and that looks about it, they may reach the Europa league next season and that will be that. Manchester City have invested boatloads and well if they aren't in with a shout of lifting the PL trophy come may I will be slightly surprised.
I always considered us to be more like Everton in relation to finances in past few seasons; its very rare we splash out, and if only we had mroe fans the loss wouldn't be as bad, except at Everton there is stability, can the same be said about Doncaster Rovers? I may not be an expert at proposing financial models for football clubs but if we lose our stability in the structure of this club what is left?
I know this post won't change anyone's opinions, and there seems to be a divide on the subject, so for now we'll have to agree to disagree
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But that said huge investments during off and pre-season relate to ST sales, how many more season tickets do you think we would have sold if the board plugged £8 million extra into the club? Surely that would be a wise investment for what is relativley loose change between the 3 'majority' shareholders?
This is a line often said leading up the signing of Sharp which was 4 times our previous record signing. Remind me how many extra season tickets that brought in? I don't tthink big name signings will make much of a difference, winning would make the difference though.