Viking Supporters Co-operative
Viking Chat => Off Topic => Topic started by: roverstillidie91 on December 30, 2012, 11:55:53 am
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From someone i heard on one of the work programmes said at a4e
Stated cos he has been on drugs and this applies to alcoholics, get £25 a week for being on a methedone ( think thats how you spell it ) programme and someone down my street was a drug usr yet gets £91 a week or something which constitutes to incapacity benefit and never had to do anything
Yet law abiding citizens such as myself get no extra financial help with anything such as driving lessons and training courses that aren't fully funded by the colleges
Total joke honestly
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All benefits should be paid in vouchers NOT cash/ bank transfer.
Vouchers for food
Vouchers for Clothes
Vouchers for kids toys
Vouchers for Electric/ Gas
Vouchers for essentials
Nothing for Booze.
Nothing for Cigs.
Nothing for a smartphone/ monthly smatphone tarrif.
Simple as that.
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I like the idea of putting it on a prepaid card and having certain things banned from it.
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All benefits should be paid in vouchers NOT cash/ bank transfer.
Vouchers for food
Vouchers for Clothes
Vouchers for kids toys
Vouchers for Electric/ Gas
Vouchers for essentials
Nothing for Booze.
Nothing for Cigs.
Nothing for a smartphone/ monthly smatphone tarrif.
Simple as that.
This is/was done for asylum seekers but a lot of the time they are sold on for cash.
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Basic ESA is paid at a rate of £56.26 for a person under 25 and £71.00 for one over 25 for the first 13 weeks. This is the assesment phase..After that the claimant is called in to see the charming folk at their nearest ATOS center....
The assesment is nothing short of stupid, people with mental health issues are asked to raise their hands over their heads and a multitude of other totally irrelevent questions.
If you are lucky enough to have a support worker they will take you more seriously, otherwise you are marked fit even tho you might be dying. These assesments are not necessarily done by a doctor, it is the luck of the draw who you get.
The whole thing is done on a points system, from 15 down to 0 over 15 and you will be placed in the support group, lower and it's either the work related activity group or nothing. If this happens it's back to JSA.
So, I would think the lad you were talking to has been through this system and is in the wra group. Depending on his age his money will have risen to £99.15, depending of course n his circumstances.. For instance if he is a householder with non dependants..Money will be deducted if that is the case..
This money will be given on condition, I would think in the case of the Heroin addict, the placment on a methadone course. I have read that alcoholics have to attend compulsory AA to avoid being sanctioned.
Oh and altho the Daily Mail does like to foster the view that every person claiming esa/jsa is a dope/fag smoking, boozing, 52' tv toting social misfit that simply isnt the case.
One piece of bad luck healthwise, one accident could leave anyone in the position of having to leave their dignity at ATOS's front door..
Do they really then have to go through the indignity of vouchers too?
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Basic ESA is paid at a rate of £56.26 for a person under 25 and £71.00 for one over 25 for the first 13 weeks. This is the assesment phase..After that the claimant is called in to see the charming folk at their nearest ATOS center....
The assesment is nothing short of stupid, people with mental health issues are asked to raise their hands over their heads and a multitude of other totally irrelevent questions.
If you are lucky enough to have a support worker they will take you more seriously, otherwise you are marked fit even tho you might be dying. These assesments are not necessarily done by a doctor, it is the luck of the draw who you get.
The whole thing is done on a points system, from 15 down to 0 over 15 and you will be placed in the support group, lower and it's either the work related activity group or nothing. If this happens it's back to JSA.
So, I would think the lad you were talking to has been through this system and is in the wra group. Depending on his age his money will have risen to £99.15, depending of course n his circumstances.. For instance if he is a householder with non dependants..Money will be deducted if that is the case..
This money will be given on condition, I would think in the case of the Heroin addict, the placment on a methadone course. I have read that alcoholics have to attend compulsory AA to avoid being sanctioned.
Oh and altho the Daily Mail does like to foster the view that every person claiming esa/jsa is a dope/fag smoking, boozing, 52' tv toting social misfit that simply isnt the case.
One piece of bad luck healthwise, one accident could leave anyone in the position of having to leave their dignity at ATOS's front door..
Do they really then have to go through the indignity of vouchers too?
My Dad got killed down Pit when I was ten,I used to get free school meals, that entailed standing in a separate queue to the kids whose parents could afford to pay
It was humiliating and degrading,having said that I did it because I new I was helping my mum out, if i'd kicked off about it she would have stumped up the cash from her pitance. I dont think its fair on families on benefits to make em have to use vouchers it stigmatizes the kids,speaking from experience.
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All benefits should be paid in vouchers NOT cash/ bank transfer.
Vouchers for food
Vouchers for Clothes
Vouchers for kids toys
Vouchers for Electric/ Gas
Vouchers for essentials
Nothing for Booze.
Nothing for Cigs.
Nothing for a smartphone/ monthly smatphone tarrif.
Simple as that.
Question is, im guessing your in work. Would you agree to that if you was unemployed
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.....and sure I read recently, that., 60% of housing benefit is paid to people in work. That is truly mind boggling. So in effect the government are subsidising companies to employ, rather than the companies paying a living wage
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Yes Redwine. Housing Benefit is plain crackers. We, the tax payer, are subsidising, through our taxes and the payment of HB, the profits of corporations, companies and other probably right wing groups rather than ensuring a wage is paid commensurate with both the job and the cost of living. I know the argument about competitiveness - but ultimately, I have been led to question just who's benefit society is for these days? Even more stupidly, for the last couple of years or so, HB is paid direct to claimants. So any landlord who don't get his rent cos the poor sap receiving he benefit has either blown it or used it to pay other bills is then forced to evict the tenant and so make him an even greater expense on the local Council... It's madness. Utter madness.
BobG
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Wait till next year when the universal credit is rolled out nationwide. If you think things in the private rental sector are bad now you will see it can get a hundred times worse. How many on low income are going to be made homeless by this latest bit of tomfoolery? Landlords aren't going to reduce rents, they wont have any need to. People chasing houses to rent are going to increase massively. Already we are reading of landlords evicting tennants on HB. They know that when universal credit comes in and people are losing even more of their benefits that in a choice between food on the table and paying the rent that 9 times out of 10 food will win. Not having enough food to feed your children is the worst of all feelings.
Round here the average private let is between £450 & £650 pcm. a family with two children can expect to get £119 per week rent rebate, any rent above that has to be found from what ever money comes into the house. ALso if it is considered that you are in a house that is too big, ie with a spare bedroom the council can refuse to issue housing benefit at all. Come april if you have a spare bedroom they will be deducting money off your hb. Round here it will be a tight squeeze, I can only imagine that in areas where the rents are almost monopoly money figures that it will be a case of the poor being squashed like bugs. Afterall, as Glyn has pointed out, the majority of hb claimants are working for crap wages. It isn't just people on esa and jsa that this is going to hit its the little people who keep this country ticking .
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Yes Redwine. Housing Benefit is plain crackers. We, the tax payer, are subsidising, through our taxes and the payment of HB, the profits of corporations, companies and other probably right wing groups
BobG
and there Bob, is the hammer hitting the nail on the head, we are all in it together unless you have a string of rental properties etc etc etc. The ordinary worker in the street is in it, end of....................queue Madmick :thumbsup:
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It doesn't help that the papers spout their familiar mantra of the mythical average wage of £26k a year..
I'd love to know what part of utopia these average workers come from because I would have had to work my 35 hour week for three years to earn that..
Now we have IDS's latest gem, that workers on tax credits are also spongers..suddenly if you are on the minimum wage you can't do right for trying.
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I'd love to know where this "average" apears from, Its a bit like our attendance at Preston last Saturday......fiction
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Trouble is middle aged, middle english torys believe it.. the same as they believe there are tens of thousands of families with 50 kids and even bigger t.vs.
There is a story in the Mail today about the homeless addicts sleeping in tombs in a Cambridge graveyard..Any decent person would think oh god, poor souls to be forced to find such meagre shelter from the cold...
Not the creatures that sit so smug at their keyboards in their nice warm homes, to them the homeless are vermin and isn't it a disgrace that the graves are violated...
I read the mail so I can always see how foul some in this country are...then in bed i read the Guardian , that way I sleep at night.
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All benefits should be paid in vouchers NOT cash/ bank transfer.
Vouchers for food
Vouchers for Clothes
Vouchers for kids toys
Vouchers for Electric/ Gas
Vouchers for essentials
Nothing for Booze.
Nothing for Cigs.
Nothing for a smartphone/ monthly smatphone tarrif.
Simple as that.
You did a U turn with your opinion of the Tories when you realised that you were going to be affected, I`m sure you`d do a quicker U turn on those opinions if you were to become unemployed!
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and there Bob, is the hammer hitting the nail on the head, we are all in it together unless you have a string of rental properties etc etc etc. The ordinary worker in the street is in it, end of....................queue mjdgreg
Anybody can have a string of rental properties just like me. They weren't given to me. The difference with me and all you lot is that I've worked hard and saved all my working life and not spent every penny I've ever earned (or borrowed to subsidise a lifestyle I couldn't afford). I've gone without the flash car and the fancy holidays abroad. I am now reaping the benefits of my thrift.
It's a good job there are people like me about keeping a roof over Polish workers heads. I'm housing the people that do the work that the lazy English benefits scroungers won't do.
By the way, that should be 'cue' not 'queue'.
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No Mick. You own properties that you have worked for and you are entitled to do that. I own 14 properties that I have worked for. I am entitled to that. But you also own opinions that are illogical, unsubstantiated, selfish, immoral and harmful. I recognise that I may make money one day on those properties - and that others are paying the mortgages for me. But I don't glory in it. I see at least some of the weaknesses and stupidities of the system. I am tolerant of people who can't/won't/don't pay the rent when they are pressured from too many directions at once. I let it go. Do you?
BobG
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By the way, that should be 'cue' not 'queue'.
I know :P
and just for the record I was more refering to large companies etc and those that play the system as opposed to the likes of Bob and Mick who actually worked for their properties and presumably play fair with it,
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I play more than fair. All my tenants pay below the market rate. I have never evicted anyone. I am constantly asked if I've got any more houses as I am viewed as a model landlord. My tenants bring me back presents if they go on holiday etc.
There seems to be a view among most lefties that all landlords are evil. I'd remind you that most of you live in council houses.
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I'm with TWD. My sister often tells me of the kids at the school she works at not having enough school uniform and I often see people not giving kids dinner money. Yet the parents rock up in £125 a pair jeans - madness. I also know of a friend who's never had a job and her other half doesn't either. They have a nice house (at £500 a month rent), plenty of cash, nice big TV etc. They bring in far more money than me, yet never work, there's still something wrong there.
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I'm with TWD. My sister often tells me of the kids at the school she works at not having enough school uniform and I often see people not giving kids dinner money. Yet the parents rock up in £125 a pair jeans - madness. I also know of a friend who's never had a job and her other half doesn't either. They have a nice house (at £500 a month rent), plenty of cash, nice big TV etc. They bring in far more money than me, yet never work, there's still something wrong there.
The thing is bfyp, the media, and politicians focus on the very small minority like these people, but the huge majority who genuinely need help are being persecuted and labelled by people that it does n`t affect, it would do some of these high and mighty`s like TWD to experience the true hardships of unemployment, I`m absolutely positive that he`d change his mind pretty sharpish!
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I also know of a friend who's never had a job and her other half doesn't either. They have a nice house (at £500 a month rent), plenty of cash, nice big TV etc. They bring in far more money than me, yet never work, there's still something wrong there.
If you think they're getting all that from benefits then you're an idiot. They're up to something illegal to get that.
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I also know of a friend who's never had a job and her other half doesn't either. They have a nice house (at £500 a month rent), plenty of cash, nice big TV etc. They bring in far more money than me, yet never work, there's still something wrong there.
If you think they're getting all that from benefits then you're an idiot. They're up to something illegal to get that.
Yeah popping kids out every 5 minutes.
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Or on the rob, or dealing drugs...
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No that isn't correct at all.. for one thing on income based jsa/income support the children would be entitled to free meals.
"Free school meals are offered to children of families who are on low income in receipt of Employment and Support Allowance (Income Related), Income Support, Job Seekers Allowance (Income based) or Guaranteed Element of State Pension Credit. They are also offered to children of families who are in receipt of Child Tax Credit only, but who are not entitled to Working Tax Credit, and whose annual income (as assessed by the Inland Revenue) does not exceed £16,190.00. If you are in receipt of Child Tax Credit, you will need to attend one of the Council's Customer Service Centre’s and present your Child Tax Credit award notice."
I always think it is extremely disengenious to lump in the housing benefit as this goes to the landlord, I would hope we are not yet living in a country where the poor are seen as having no right to a roof over their heads.
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Trouble is Jucy, Housing Benefit doesn't go to the landlord any more. It goes to the claimant. whether or not he/she then pays it to the landlord is in the lap of the Gods. Hence my point above about this wonderful new system encouraging landlords to evict people to become an even greater charge on the state.
BobG
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I know Bob, this is one of the things that worries me greatly. It is a social disaster in the making. The government really has no idea just what it is like having to choose between food and rent because there isn't enough to pay for both. At least when the money went straight to the landlord there was hopefully some protection now that is to be stripped away.
I've seen it happen first hand these past couple of months. My Adam has finally found a nice girl (you all know about the trouble we have with his foul skanky ex) She too is divorced with a little girl same age as tyler, so are now a perfect family unit. They have been together nearly two years now. Anyway, her rent has always gone into a seperate account and then by standing order out again without her seeing it to the vile little shyster calling himself a landlord.. A man so foul that two weeks after his wife blew her brains out with a shotgun last year imported his Spanish girlfreind over barely two weeks after,.... anyway because They told the rent and benefits agencies that they were moving in together the rebate stopped instantly, taking six weeks or more for it to be sorted.. In that six weeks knowing full well it would be sorted the little bas**rd evicted them. Six days before christmas. To add insult to injury Marie had looked after the mans father till he died saving him a fortune in nursing home fees. Thank god they managed to find something else by the skin of their teeth, but its out if the village and they have no transport so it isn't the best solution.
All the council could say was if they hadn't managed to find anything all they could offer was a hostel in Kings Lynn. My nephew is in it at the moment since the breakdown of his relationship, he has been robbed twice since he has been there, once at knifepoint.
I honestly don't understand how this government can demonise families the way it does, making the very exception look like the norm in the press so that the intolerant masses have no sympathy for little children only resentment that they have been born.
As for people on the fiddle, well as far as I can see from all that Adam has gone through, honesty only leads to suffering. I don't in any way condone it but more than ever now I understand why people do it.
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and there Bob, is the hammer hitting the nail on the head, we are all in it together unless you have a string of rental properties etc etc etc. The ordinary worker in the street is in it, end of....................queue mjdgreg
Anybody can have a string of rental properties just like me. They weren't given to me. The difference with me and all you lot is that I've worked hard and saved all my working life and not spent every penny I've ever earned (or borrowed to subsidise a lifestyle I couldn't afford). I've gone without the flash car and the fancy holidays abroad. I am now reaping the benefits of my thrift.
It's a good job there are people like me about keeping a roof over Polish workers heads. I'm housing the people that do the work that the lazy English benefits scroungers won't do.
By the way, that should be 'cue' not 'queue'.
What a load of b*llocks.
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What a load of b*llocks.
Only if you have the mindset of a leftie loser. Anyone can own properties if they've got an ounce of intelligence and get up and go. It's very easy to do and is a much better investment option than a private pension.
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Anyone who rents needs their heads looking at (I accept that renting does suit certain people but the vast majority would be better off buying their own property). We live in a part of the world where house prices are cheap and owning a house is a very realistic proposition for the vast bulk of people.
For example a two bed terraced would typically be £400 per month in rent whereas a mortgage on the same property would only be £175 and would eventually be paid off. The mortgage would get easier to pay due to the ravages of inflation whereas the rent will go up in line with or higher than inflation. It's a no-brainer.
Why are renters so stupid?
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Ok I do have my own house. But if you are paying rent of 400 and you say a mortgage would be only 175 so where do you get this deposit to pay this? Move back in with mum and dad
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Anyone who rents needs their heads looking at (I accept that renting does suit certain people but the vast majority would be better off buying their own property). We live in a part of the world where house prices are cheap and owning a house is a very realistic proposition for the vast bulk of people.
For example a two bed terraced would typically be £400 per month in rent whereas a mortgage on the same property would only be £175 and would eventually be paid off. The mortgage would get easier to pay due to the ravages of inflation whereas the rent will go up in line with or higher than inflation. It's a no-brainer.
Why are renters so stupid?
Care to give me the money for a deposit? I have no choice but to rent. I've never been in a position to purchase a house, never mind own a string of them, so well done that life has been so kind to you that you have managed to do it, there is no need to patronise those of us who cannot get on the property ladder.
And for the record, I wouldn't rent a house off you if you gave it me for nowt if that is your attitude to renters.
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What a load of b*llocks.
Only if you have the mindset of a leftie loser. Anyone can own properties if they've got an ounce of intelligence and get up and go. It's very easy to do and is a much better investment option than a private pension.
So i'm a leftie loser? You know nothing about me, or my life. Keyboard warrior - that's all you are. A nobody.
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Mr frost is right and apart from that....
Perhaps you should have some respect for these 'stupid' renters..After all aren't they paying for your string of houses?.
You really are a,.............. well, I'm sure there are plenty on here fond enough of you to fill in the blanks.
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Ok I do have my own house. But if you are paying rent of 400 and you say a mortgage would be only 175 so where do you get this deposit to pay this? Move back in with mum and dad
That old chestnut. Look, it's very easy. You SAVE UP for a deposit. How hard is it to understand that? You prioritise your life. For example you don't have 2 holidays abroad every year. You don't wear designer clothes. You do without a car etc. You don't spend every penny you earn. You live within your means. You don't live your life on credit.
I stand by what I say. Renting for most people is absolute stupidity. All it takes is a bit of self discipline to save for a deposit and in the long run you will be far better off financially. Anyone that can't understand that deserves to be classed as stupid.
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Care to give me the money for a deposit? I have no choice but to rent. I've never been in a position to purchase a house, never mind own a string of them, so well done that life has been so kind to you that you have managed to do it, there is no need to patronise those of us who cannot get on the property ladder.
And for the record, I wouldn't rent a house off you if you gave it me for nowt if that is your attitude to renters.
I simply don't believe that you have never been in a position to buy a house. Doncaster has just about the cheapest houses in the country. It's not so long ago that you could get a 100% mortgage. You've obviously always spent all your money and lived day to day with no thought of the future. This is a very stupid way to carry on. If you can afford to pay rent then you can afford to buy a house. No question.
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Care to give me the money for a deposit? I have no choice but to rent. I've never been in a position to purchase a house, never mind own a string of them, so well done that life has been so kind to you that you have managed to do it, there is no need to patronise those of us who cannot get on the property ladder.
And for the record, I wouldn't rent a house off you if you gave it me for nowt if that is your attitude to renters.
I simply don't believe that you have never been in a position to buy a house. Doncaster has just about the cheapest houses in the country. It's not so long ago that you could get a 100% mortgage. You've obviously always spent all your money and lived day to day with no thought of the future. This is a very stupid way to carry on. If you can afford to pay rent then you can afford to buy a house. No question.
You know nothing about me. Who do you think you are calling me stupid? Why not come from behind your keyboard and say these things to me on a match day?
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Question to all you renters. Why when 100% mortgages were available did you rent instead of buy when it is so obviously much better to buy than rent from a financial point of view?
Unless you can give me a good answer then I'm afraid I will not withdraw my statement that it is stupid to rent for the vast majority of renters in Doncaster.
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Question to all you renters. Why when 100% mortgages were available did you rent instead of buy when it is so obviously much better to buy than rent from a financial point of view?
Unless you can give me a good answer then I'm afraid I will not withdraw my statement that it is stupid to rent for the vast majority of renters in Doncaster.
Question to all you renters. Why when 100% mortgages were available did you rent instead of buy when it is so obviously much better to buy than rent from a financial point of view?
Unless you can give me a good answer then I'm afraid I will not withdraw my statement that it is stupid to rent for the vast majority of renters in Doncaster.
Question to all you renters. Why when 100% mortgages were available did you rent instead of buy when it is so obviously much better to buy than rent from a financial point of view?
Unless you can give me a good answer then I'm afraid I will not withdraw my statement that it is stupid to rent for the vast majority of renters in Doncaster.
Not earning enough for the banks to lend
Poor or no credit history to be able to get a mortgage.
A sales job where a lot of your income is from commission - most lenders won't take it in to account.
Someone's life situation at that point. Not everything is as black and white as you make it.
For the record - I'm 30 years old now. When these 100% mortgages were available I wasn't in a position work wise to buy a house. Now I have a decent income, I have no savings to put down for a deposit. And before you go on about that's my own fault - you know nothing about me or why I have no savings.
So what. I rent a house. It doesn't make me stupid at all. I'm able to live a decent life and provide for my son. Just because I don't own a pile of bricks and mortar doesn't make me any less of a man than you.
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Here's an example for all you renters that should make you sit up and take notice.
Currently it is possible to buy a house in Doncaster for only £35,000. These days you'd more than likely need to put down a deposit of 10% which is only £3,500. This would then leave you with a mortgage of £31,500. Assuming a repayment mortgage over 25 years you would then have monthly payments of only £166, assuming an interest rate of 4.00% (cheaper rates than this are available).
Typically, renters will be paying £400 or more a month. Rent will rise over the years with inflation. Mortgages will be eroded over the years with inflation and after 25 years or sooner you will have a roof over your head without having to pay rent or a mortgage.
I don't care what anybody says, anyone can save £3,500 if they put their mind to it. I have conclusively proved it is stupid to rent for the vast majority of renters in Doncaster.
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Not earning enough for the banks to lend
Poor or no credit history to be able to get a mortgage.
A sales job where a lot of your income is from commission - most lenders won't take it in to account.
Someone's life situation at that point. Not everything is as black and white as you make it.
For the record - I'm 30 years old now. When these 100% mortgages were available I wasn't in a position work wise to buy a house. Now I have a decent income, I have no savings to put down for a deposit. And before you go on about that's my own fault - you know nothing about me or why I have no savings.
So what. I rent a house. It doesn't make me stupid at all. I'm able to live a decent life and provide for my son. Just because I don't own a pile of bricks and mortar doesn't make me any less of a man than you.
Reading between the lines you sound like you are now in a position to buy a house. It sounds like you are enjoying your 'decent' life and don't want to save for a deposit as this will impact on your 'decent' life. That is your choice. No pain, no gain. It is people like you that keep us landlords in business.
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Not earning enough for the banks to lend
Poor or no credit history to be able to get a mortgage.
A sales job where a lot of your income is from commission - most lenders won't take it in to account.
Someone's life situation at that point. Not everything is as black and white as you make it.
For the record - I'm 30 years old now. When these 100% mortgages were available I wasn't in a position work wise to buy a house. Now I have a decent income, I have no savings to put down for a deposit. And before you go on about that's my own fault - you know nothing about me or why I have no savings.
So what. I rent a house. It doesn't make me stupid at all. I'm able to live a decent life and provide for my son. Just because I don't own a pile of bricks and mortar doesn't make me any less of a man than you.
Reading between the lines you sound like you are now in a position to buy a house. It sounds like you are enjoying your 'decent' life and don't want to save for a deposit as this will impact on your 'decent' life. That is your choice. No pain, no gain. It is people like you that keep us landlords in business.
I never said I wasn't saving. Although I would doubt a bank would give me a mortgage as I have very little credit history - thus giving me a low credit score.
Yes it might be possible to buy a house for £35k. I'd like to see the condition of the house at that value.
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Yes it might be possible to buy a house for £35k. I'd like to see the condition of the house at that value.
You might not want to see the neighbourhood it's in though.
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So then, I guess that is Mick's admission that he is a slum landlord..Thought as much..
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Our very own Sheriff Fatman is madmichael.
Speaking of houses and renting......I heard St Leger Homes (I think via a new gov't proposal) are now charging tenants for having empty bedrooms. I suppose the idea is to stop single parent mums with 1 kid having 3 bedroom houses. Is there sense in this? I'll let you folks decide.
For you non Donny lot SLH are the local council housing team ie council houses
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It's a terrible idea, one of the many that this lot have thought out whilst having their expense fueled luncheons.
This will hit people who can least afford to lose, people already being hit by caps. they are targeting people on HB, expecting them to either take the hit or move.. Of course in their monied world removals are but pennies, but for those on next to nothing it would cost more than perhaps they have.
the worst thing is like so many of these knee jerk proposals they don't seem to be thought through properly, there is going to be total carnage in this country come April onwards...
They are incapable of organising a pissup in a brewery yet we are expected to believe that people aren't going to go hungry whilst waiting for an ill eqqipped system to crank into gear?
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Yes it might be possible to buy a house for £35k. I'd like to see the condition of the house at that value.
There's no possible about it. Here's a lovely example of a 3 bed house that only needs a bit of decorating:
http://www.rightmove.co.uk/property-for-sale/property-39835571.html
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never said I wasn't saving. Although I would doubt a bank would give me a mortgage as I have very little credit history - thus giving me a low credit score.
Excuses, excuses. What kind of credit rating do first time buyers have? Stop looking for lame excuses and get on with sorting your life out.
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never said I wasn't saving. Although I would doubt a bank would give me a mortgage as I have very little credit history - thus giving me a low credit score.
Excuses, excuses. What kind of credit rating do first time buyers have? Stop looking for lame excuses and get on with sorting your life out.
Maybe he doesn't feel he needs his life sorting out? After all, it IS his money and as I'd imagine you'd agree to a great extent it means he can do what he wants with it.
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never said I wasn't saving. Although I would doubt a bank would give me a mortgage as I have very little credit history - thus giving me a low credit score.
Excuses, excuses. What kind of credit rating do first time buyers have? Stop looking for lame excuses and get on with sorting your life out.
My life is fine thank you you patronising moron.
First time buyers may have an excellent credit rating depending on credit cards/loans etc they have paid back. I've never took out credit so I don't have that kind of history.
Seriously, I bet you wouldn't dare give out your pearls of wisdom to any of us if you met us face to face. In fact, your life, in my opinion must be absolutely awful, and the only way you get any enjoyment is to think you are above everyone else.
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My life is fine thank you you patronising moron.
First time buyers may have an excellent credit rating depending on credit cards/loans etc they have paid back. I've never took out credit so I don't have that kind of history.
Seriously, I bet you wouldn't dare give out your pearls of wisdom to any of us if you met us face to face. In fact, your life, in my opinion must be absolutely awful, and the only way you get any enjoyment is to think you are above everyone else.
You're the one that is patronising me and being very abusive! All I am doing is giving out excellent advice to you renters! I can't think of anything that is guaranteed to make someone's life absolutely awful than the prospect of paying ever increasing rent when there is so obviously a much better solution. If only people could live within their means and cop themselves on.
Money worries are a big part of relationship breakdowns. Deciding to be a renter is guaranteed to cause money worries. What on earth is going to happen if you lose your job in the future and haven't paid for a roof over your head? The government are increasingly less likely to bail you out (quite right too). You are stupid to live with that kind of unnecessary stress.
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Maybe he doesn't feel he needs his life sorting out? After all, it IS his money and as I'd imagine you'd agree to a great extent it means he can do what he wants with it.
The only problem I have with your statement is that it is fine for him to do what he wants with his money as long as he doesn't expect me and all the other taxpayers to pay his rent for him if he ever loses his job. He should take responsibility and buy a house and stop being a risk to the taxpayer. The same goes for all you other renters that can afford to buy a house.
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Maybe he doesn't feel he needs his life sorting out? After all, it IS his money and as I'd imagine you'd agree to a great extent it means he can do what he wants with it.
The only problem I have with your statement is that it is fine for him to do what he wants with his money as long as he doesn't expect me and all the other taxpayers to pay his rent for him if he ever loses his job. He should take responsibility and buy a house and stop being a risk to the taxpayer. The same goes for all you other renters that can afford to buy a house.
So far as I can see he's made no statement to suggest such expectations, and as he says he's very unlikely to get a mortgage due to personal factors so he can't exactly "take responsibility and buy a house".
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So then, I guess that is mjdgreg's admission that he is a slum landlord..Thought as much..
The exact opposite is the truth. I am adored by my renters. I spent thousands last year improving my properties and no I didn't put the rent up.
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My life is fine thank you you patronising moron.
First time buyers may have an excellent credit rating depending on credit cards/loans etc they have paid back. I've never took out credit so I don't have that kind of history.
Seriously, I bet you wouldn't dare give out your pearls of wisdom to any of us if you met us face to face. In fact, your life, in my opinion must be absolutely awful, and the only way you get any enjoyment is to think you are above everyone else.
You're the one that is patronising me and being very abusive! All I am doing is giving out excellent advice to you renters! I can't think of anything that is guaranteed to make someone's life absolutely awful than the prospect of paying ever increasing rent when there is so obviously a much better solution. If only people could live within their means and cop themselves on.
Money worries are a big part of relationship breakdowns. Deciding to be a renter is guaranteed to cause money worries. What on earth is going to happen if you lose your job in the future and haven't paid for a roof over your head? The government are increasingly less likely to bail you out (quite right too). You are stupid to live with that kind of unnecessary stress.
As I said, you know nothing about me, and do not have to justify how I live my life. I haven't been in a position buy a house, and still am not, but i'm saving, and hopefully one day I will have a chance to buy my own home. Point the me in the direction of a bank who will lend me some money to buy one, because I have enquired many times to be told no.
But you calling the majority of people who rent as stupid is non founded and patronising.
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So far as I can see he's made no statement to suggest such expectations, and as he says he's very unlikely to get a mortgage due to personal factors so he can't exactly "take responsibility and buy a house".
How does he know he won't get a mortgage? Sounds like he's never even tried. I bet he'd soon bang a HB claim in if he lost his job.
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So far as I can see he's made no statement to suggest such expectations, and as he says he's very unlikely to get a mortgage due to personal factors so he can't exactly "take responsibility and buy a house".
How does he know he won't get a mortgage? Sounds like he's never even tried. I bet he'd soon bang a HB claim in if he lost his job.
As he's just explained above, he's been turned down several times.
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So far as I can see he's made no statement to suggest such expectations, and as he says he's very unlikely to get a mortgage due to personal factors so he can't exactly "take responsibility and buy a house".
How does he know he won't get a mortgage? Sounds like he's never even tried. I bet he'd soon bang a HB claim in if he lost his job.
Seriously, who the f**k do you think you are. And if I did lose my job and claim housing benefit, what concern of yours would it be. Last time I checked it wasn't illegal.
And if you read my previous posts which you clearly haven't, you will see I have enquired about a mortgaged before to be told no.
To be honest, I reckon you're a complete WUM, who probably has none of what you claim, but try to believe you are more than what you are.
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As he's just explained above, he's been turned down several times.
The question is why? He must be a bad credit risk. Why not hook up with someone who has a good credit history? Why not save a bigger deposit? Why not try a mortgage broker?
Unfortunately if you have a leftie mindset then all you can ever see is problems. You then expect the government (other taxpayers) to sort them out for you. I am a solutions sort of person. Give me a problem and I will find a solution without relying on other taxpayers.
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And if I did lose my job and claim housing benefit, what concern of yours would it be.
It would be a concern of mine because I and other taxpayers would be left to pick up your rent bill. Do the decent thing and buy a house and get the mortgage paid off ASAP and stop being a risk to us taxpayers.
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As he's just explained above, he's been turned down several times.
The question is why? He must be a bad credit risk. Why not hook up with someone who has a good credit history? Why not save a bigger deposit? Why not try a mortgage broker?
Unfortunately if you have a leftie mindset then all you can ever see is problems. You then expect the government (other taxpayers) to sort them out for you. I am a solutions sort of person. Give me a problem and I will find a solution without relying on other taxpayers.
Hook up with someone who has a good credit history? In what way?
I've already explained the situation to you, if you bothered to read it, which you clearly didn't.
Just who am I expecting to sort the situation out? I haven't complained about renting. I'm not moaning that I can't by a house. My point is that you have no right to belittle those who can't, for whatever reason get on the property ladder.
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And if I did lose my job and claim housing benefit, what concern of yours would it be.
It would be a concern of mine because I and other taxpayers would be left to pick up your rent bill. Do the decent thing and buy a house and get the mortgage paid off ASAP and stop being a risk to us taxpayers.
You're showing yourself up now.
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You're right Frosty, WUM of the highest order though we must give him that.
What part of this:
I would doubt a bank would give me a mortgage as I have very little credit history - thus giving me a low credit score.
and this: you will see I have enquired about a mortgaged before to be told no.
are you struggling to understand?
He can't "do the decent thing" if banks won't give him money and he hasn't got enough saved yet, now can he? What else is he meant to do?
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Speaking of houses and renting......I heard St Leger Homes (I think via a new gov't proposal) are now charging tenants for having empty bedrooms. I suppose the idea is to stop single parent mums with 1 kid having 3 bedroom houses. Is there sense in this?
Of course tenants should be charged for empty rooms. How on earth can it be right for one person to have a 3 bedroomed house when there are families on an ever increasing waiting list?
A point you don't make is that they only get this charge if they are relying on benefits to pay the rent. If you pay the full rent out of your wages you are not affected.
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You're right Frosty, WUM of the highest order though we must give him that.
What part of this:
Quote from: MrFrost on Today at 11:48:05 AM
I would doubt a bank would give me a mortgage as I have very little credit history - thus giving me a low credit score.
and this:
Quote from: MrFrost on Today at 06:51:29 PM
you will see I have enquired about a mortgaged before to be told no.
are you struggling to understand?
He can't "do the decent thing" if banks won't give him money and he hasn't got enough saved yet, now can he? What else is he meant to do?
I'm certain that if I was in the same position I would soon have the problem sorted. There are many ways around this problem. My advice would be 'must try harder'.
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You're right Frosty, WUM of the highest order though we must give him that.
What part of this:
Quote from: MrFrost on Today at 11:48:05 AM
I would doubt a bank would give me a mortgage as I have very little credit history - thus giving me a low credit score.
and this:
Quote from: MrFrost on Today at 06:51:29 PM
you will see I have enquired about a mortgaged before to be told no.
are you struggling to understand?
He can't "do the decent thing" if banks won't give him money and he hasn't got enough saved yet, now can he? What else is he meant to do?
I'm certain that if I was in the same position I would soon have the problem sorted. There are many ways around this problem. My advice would be 'must try harder'.
Ok. So how do you get round the problem of the bank saying no?
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How would you get around the problem of only being able to earn a certain amount of money per year, per month even after the expenses of living, and yet still quickly be able to "do the decent thing" and buy a house then?
Bearing in mind starting your own business (as I'm sure you'll suggest) will cost and will more often than not take even longer to get you the money you need, and changing career is far from a guaranteed option.
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Ok. So how do you get round the problem of the bank saying no?
A mortgage broker is the obvious answer. If you've never used credit in the past and don't have a history of bad debts then you would soon get sorted out.
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How would you get around the problem of only being able to earn a certain amount of money per year, per month even after the expenses of living, and yet still quickly be able to "do the decent thing" and buy a house then?
Bearing in mind starting your own business (as I'm sure you'll suggest) will cost and will more often than not take even longer to get you the money you need, and changing career is far from a guaranteed option.
I'd need to know what a person's top line is before I could give excellent advice. There are plenty of businesses that cost hardly anything to start up. Usually I find that renters tend to spend every penny they get and don't think further than tomorrow. Big mistake.
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How would you get around the problem of only being able to earn a certain amount of money per year, per month even after the expenses of living, and yet still quickly be able to "do the decent thing" and buy a house then?
Bearing in mind starting your own business (as I'm sure you'll suggest) will cost and will more often than not take even longer to get you the money you need, and changing career is far from a guaranteed option.
I'd need to know what a person's top line is before I could give excellent advice. There are plenty of businesses that cost hardly anything to start up. Usually I find that renters tend to spend every penny they get and don't think further than tomorrow. Big mistake.
Wrong. Your stereotypical views of people are well off the mark.
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How would you get around the problem of only being able to earn a certain amount of money per year, per month even after the expenses of living, and yet still quickly be able to "do the decent thing" and buy a house then?
Bearing in mind starting your own business (as I'm sure you'll suggest) will cost and will more often than not take even longer to get you the money you need, and changing career is far from a guaranteed option.
I'd need to know what a person's top line is before I could give excellent advice. There are plenty of businesses that cost hardly anything to start up. Usually I find that renters tend to spend every penny they get and don't think further than tomorrow. Big mistake.
Even if they cost nothing to set up, doesn't mean for a second that it'll make the kind of money you need, and if you need to lend money and the business struggles and then it struggles to pay it back, you're f**ked either way really.
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Wrong. Your stereotypical views of people are well off the mark.
One fifth of people are still paying for Christmas 2011 on credit. 50% of people have paid for Christmas 2012 on credit. The vast bulk of these people are renters. Say no more.
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Even if they cost nothing to set up, doesn't mean for a second that it'll make the kind of money you need, and if you need to lend money and the business struggles and then it struggles to pay it back, you're f***ed either way really.
You'll never be a successful businessman with such a negative leftie outlook on life. Be positive! Become a right winger! Look after yourself instead of waiting for the government to look after you. You'll never look back
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Wrong. Your stereotypical views of people are well off the mark.
One fifth of people are still paying for Christmas 2011 on credit. 50% of people have paid for Christmas 2012 on credit. The vast bulk of these people are renters. Say no more.
Can you provide me with some evidence of where the vast bulk of these are renters?
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Even if they cost nothing to set up, doesn't mean for a second that it'll make the kind of money you need, and if you need to lend money and the business struggles and then it struggles to pay it back, you're f***ed either way really.
You'll never be a successful businessman with such a negative leftie outlook on life. Be positive! Become a right winger! Look after yourself instead of waiting for the government to look after you. You'll never look back
Answer my question.
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Wrong. Your stereotypical views of people are well off the mark.
One fifth of people are still paying for Christmas 2011 on credit. 50% of people have paid for Christmas 2012 on credit. The vast bulk of these people are renters. Say no more.
Can you provide me with some evidence of where the vast bulk of these are renters?
I was just about to ask the same thing. I was also going to ask for evidence of the average wage and how many of these people were in full-time employment too?
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Unless KLWN council is different to Doncaster council they won't be paying housing benefit in homes that have more bedrooms than tennants anyway and that is before this new restriction comes in. Children up to the age of ten are required to share a bedroom same gender or otherwise. Same sex children until the age of sixteen.
They pay a set amount towards the rent, as I have said before, for a two bedroom property it is £119.00 a week.. anything over that the tennant has to find from their benefits...So, just imagine you are already paying out of that to top up the rent, you are then hit by the universal credit AND the so called bedroom tax at a rate of £14 a week PER bedroom.. the way it is going benefits will be at a minus rate per week..
http://www.housing.org.uk/policy/welfare_reform/%e2%80%98under-occupation%e2%80%99_penalty.aspx
I would think you would already know this being a property magnate Mick.
As to the claptrap about being more secure as a homeowner, well.. Tell that to the Comet workers, the JJB sports workers, Clintons workers and the hundreds of others , mortgaged to the hilt who are now facing an uncertain future and possible loss of their homes.
At least for those 'stupid' enough to rent there is a little more help...for now.
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How would you get around the problem of only being able to earn a certain amount of money per year, per month even after the expenses of living, and yet still quickly be able to "do the decent thing" and buy a house then?
Bearing in mind starting your own business (as I'm sure you'll suggest) will cost and will more often than not take even longer to get you the money you need, and changing career is far from a guaranteed option.
I'd need to know what a person's top line is before I could give excellent advice. There are plenty of businesses that cost hardly anything to start up. Usually I find that renters tend to spend every penny they get and don't think further than tomorrow. Big mistake.
Yep send your other half out on a Betterware round and invest the profit in Goldmines :thumbsup:
Get in the real world Mick, circumstances are individual whats works for me won't always work for you or anybody else
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£119 per week is plenty for a two bedroomed house. My tenants don't get charged anywhere near that amount. If that doesn't cover the rent then move somewhere where it does. There are plenty of houses that are available.
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Even if they cost nothing to set up, doesn't mean for a second that it'll make the kind of money you need, and if you need to lend money and the business struggles and then it struggles to pay it back, you're f***ed either way really.
You'll never be a successful businessman with such a negative leftie outlook on life. Be positive! Become a right winger! Look after yourself instead of waiting for the government to look after you. You'll never look back
Answer my question
[/b].
I'd answer your question if you'd asked one. All you've done is make a statement.
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Point taken, I used the wrong phrase there, but I did make a statement warranting a response, which I now want.
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There aren't many houses costing 35k on the coast in Norfolk Mick... it's a highly desirable area to live aparently......People flock here for the sea, green fields and peace, we haven't much call for back to backs....
Unfortunately that comes at a cost.
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As to the claptrap about being more secure as a homeowner, well.. Tell that to the Comet workers, the JJB sports workers, Clintons workers and the hundreds of others , mortgaged to the hilt who are now facing an uncertain future and possible loss of their homes.
At least for those 'stupid' enough to rent there is a little more help...for now.
Home-owners also get help with mortgage interest. Why do you assume that all the Comet, JJB, Clintons and the hundreds of others are mortgaged to the hilt and are facing the possible loss of their homes? Talk about exaggerating. I'll bet most of these will soon have another job and living in Doncaster their mortgages will be easily affordable due to the low cost of housing.
In my previous example the mortgage was only £116 per month. Hardly mortgaged to the hilt.
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Point taken, I used the wrong phrase there, but I did make a statement warranting a response, which I now want.
Ask a question and I will reply.
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There aren't many houses costing 35k on the coast in Norfolk mjdgreg... it's a highly desirable area to live aparently......People flock here for the sea, green fields and peace, we haven't much call for back to backs....
Unfortunately that comes at a cost.
You missed a bit off your last sentence. It should have read 'Unfortunately that comes at a cost to the taxpayer'.
I know it's a bit harsh, but if you can't afford to live in an area then you have to move to one that you can afford to live in. It's not right to expect the taxpayer to make up the difference in living costs just because you can't earn enough to live in a desirable area.
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How would you get around the problem of only being able to earn a certain amount of money per year, per month even after the expenses of living, and yet still quickly be able to "do the decent thing" and buy a house then?
Bearing in mind starting your own business (as I'm sure you'll suggest) will cost and will more often than not take even longer to get you the money you need, and changing career is far from a guaranteed option.
I'd need to know what a person's top line is before I could give excellent advice. There are plenty of businesses that cost hardly anything to start up. Usually I find that renters tend to spend every penny they get and don't think further than tomorrow. Big mistake.
Even if they cost nothing to set up, doesn't mean for a second that it'll make the kind of money you need, and if you need to lend money and the business struggles and then it struggles to pay it back, you're f**ked either way really.
In this case, what do you do?
There - question. Answer?
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There aren't many houses costing 35k on the coast in Norfolk mjdgreg... it's a highly desirable area to live aparently......People flock here for the sea, green fields and peace, we haven't much call for back to backs....
Unfortunately that comes at a cost.
You missed a bit off your last sentence. It should have read 'Unfortunately that comes at a cost to the taxpayer'.
I know it's a bit harsh, but if you can't afford to live in an area then you have to move to one that you can afford to live in. It's not right to expect the taxpayer to make up the difference in living costs just because you can't earn enough to live in a desirable area.
You really are a total idiot
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Yep send your other half out on a Betterware round and invest the profit in Goldmines
Get in the real world mjdgreg, circumstances are individual whats works for me won't always work for you or anybody else
What's wrong with having a Betterware round? I'd rather have a Betterware round than be a drain on the taxpayer. Goldmines are only one small part of my investment portfolio. Don't put all your eggs in one basket. Trust me. I know what I'm talking about.
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You really are a total idiot
I beg to differ. Do you really think that people should just live wherever they want to and expect the taxpayer to make this possible for them? I think we all know who the real idiot is.
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Yep send your other half out on a Betterware round and invest the profit in Goldmines
Get in the real world mjdgreg, circumstances are individual whats works for me won't always work for you or anybody else
What's wrong with having a Betterware round? I'd rather have a Betterware round than be a drain on the taxpayer. Goldmines are only one small part of my investment portfolio. Don't put all your eggs in one basket. Trust me. I know what I'm talking about.
Nowt wrong with it for a bit of pin money unless of course you are covering the whole of the Metropolitan Borough of Doncaster
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You really are a total idiot
I beg to differ. Do you really think that people should just live wherever they want to and expect the taxpayer to make this possible for them? I think we all know who the real idiot is.
Locals ....................lets turn everywhere into holiday homes
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In this case, what do you do?
There - question. Answer?
You dust yourself down and have another go. Many successful businessmen failed at first (not me of course).
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Locals ....................lets turn everywhere into holiday homes
Holiday homes is a problem, but subsidising locals with taxpayer's money is not the solution.
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and before you start, as Frosty says you know nothing about me or my lifestyle suffice to say I do not rent, I do not have a mortgage, I didn't inherit, I didn't win the lottery and I don't do drugs or rob or rely on the taxpayer but its always possible through circumstances beyond my control one day I might.
But I could slanted to the Left :whistle:
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Yep send your other half out on a Betterware round and invest the profit in Goldmines
Get in the real world mjdgreg, circumstances are individual whats works for me won't always work for you or anybody else
What's wrong with having a Betterware round? I'd rather have a Betterware round than be a drain on the taxpayer. Goldmines are only one small part of my investment portfolio. Don't put all your eggs in one basket. Trust me. I know what I'm talking about.
Goldmines. I've heard it all now.
Mick - give me the name of one of your businesses.
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Yep send your other half out on a Betterware round and invest the profit in Goldmines
Get in the real world mjdgreg, circumstances are individual whats works for me won't always work for you or anybody else
What's wrong with having a Betterware round? I'd rather have a Betterware round than be a drain on the taxpayer. Goldmines are only one small part of my investment portfolio. Don't put all your eggs in one basket. Trust me. I know what I'm talking about.
Goldmines. I've heard it all now.
Mick - give me the name of one of your businesses.
He announced that one a couple of months ago, too much Discovery channel
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In this case, what do you do?
There - question. Answer?
You dust yourself down and have another go. Many successful businessmen failed at first (not me of course).
Didn't think you would have somehow.
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Ah sorry Mick, you don't get me with that one, I'm no incomer My mother's family have lived here since the 1770's aparently.
I don't choose to live here, it is where my family have lived for generations.
There is a big world outside of Doncaster you know, for such a high hitting entrepreneur your imagination seems to be tethered to a very small part of the world...
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Goldmines. I've heard it all now.
mjdgreg - give me the name of one of your businesses.
Regarding goldmines, that is not a business. It's just part of my investment portfolio. I have many thousands invested (modesty prevents me from saying how much) in the BlackRock Gold and Accumulation fund which has doubled in value over the last 5 years.
One of my businesses is known as Bookie Basher.
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Didn't think you would have somehow.
Well done for not saying 'would of'. My campaign is starting to show signs of success.
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hmnnn this one
http://www.bookiebashers.co.uk/account-bet-results.html
23/11/12 - 30/11/12 +3.76 pts profit
01/12/12 - 07/12/12 -1.48 pts loss
08/12/12 - 14/12/12 -3.24 pts loss
15/12/12 - 21/12/12 -1.17pts loss
and I won't comment about the home page
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Ah sorry mjdgreg, you don't get me with that one, I'm no incomer My mother's family have lived here since the 1770's aparently.
I don't choose to live here, it is where my family have lived for generations.
There is a big world outside of Doncaster you know, for such a high hitting entrepreneur your imagination seems to be tethered to a very small part of the world...
I never assumed you were an incomer. It still doesn't make it right that you should expect to live in an area you can't afford and expect the taxpayer to make up the difference for you.
I am from a family of immigrants. Both of my parents didn't just move town, they moved country because they couldn't afford to live where they were brought up any more.
Do you seriously think it is reasonable for the taxpayer to subsidise your cost of living? That's a very selfish outlook on life if you don't mind me saying.
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and I won't comment about the home page
That's not me. There are many businesses with a similar name. You won't find mine on the internet. I do it purely for myself and don't share the business model with anyone else. I like to stay under the radar.
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Didn't think you would have somehow.
Well done for not saying 'would of'. My campaign is starting to show signs of success.
Not particularly, since I've never said that and hate it myself, so you're kind of preaching to the choir.
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and before you start, as Frosty says you know nothing about me or my lifestyle suffice to say I do not rent, I do not have a mortgage, I didn't inherit, I didn't win the lottery and I don't do drugs or rob or rely on the taxpayer but its always possible through circumstances beyond my control one day I might.
But I could slanted to the Left
You sound a lot like me. In your case as you have been sensible so far in your life I wouldn't begrudge you a bit of taxpayer support if you fell on hard times. I only have a problem with people that think they have a divine right to taxpayer's money and don't spare a second's thought for the poor buggers like me and you that have to provide it.
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and I won't comment about the home page
That's not me. There are many businesses with a similar name. You won't find mine on the internet. I do it purely for myself and don't share the business model with anyone else. I like to stay under the radar.
Stop it. My sides are hurting.
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and before you start, as Frosty says you know nothing about me or my lifestyle suffice to say I do not rent, I do not have a mortgage, I didn't inherit, I didn't win the lottery and I don't do drugs or rob or rely on the taxpayer but its always possible through circumstances beyond my control one day I might.
But I could slanted to the Left
You sound a lot like me. In your case as you have been sensible so far in your life I wouldn't begrudge you a bit of taxpayer support if you fell on hard times. I only have a problem with people that think they have a divine right to taxpayer's money and don't spare a second's thought for the poor buggers like me and you that have to provide it.
Trouble is Mick you seem to presume everybody on here or who is a lefty is a scrounger.
The bulk of people are not contrary to what various papers and tory governments say.
I'm sure for every scrounger the Daily Mail finds in a town or you know there are 10 honest people whether they live on a council estate or not
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Mick I have always paid my rent, I've always supported myself..
Life isn't always perfect and whilst I am ill yes I am now getting help. That will however stop once I am well again.
You really need to not fixate and stop and look at the much wider picture. No one begrudges you any success you might have, you could well be a nice chap away from the keyboard but you do yourself no favours on here at times.
I can understand tenacity, we I think are very much alike in wanting to get the last word in at all times, the difference is I don't spout a blinkered rhetoric angled deliberately to inflame peoples tempers.
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Trouble is mjdgreg you seem to presume everybody on here or who is a lefty is a scrounger.
The bulk of people are not contrary to what various papers and tory governments say.
I'm sure for every scrounger the Daily Mail finds in a town or you know there are 10 honest people whether they live on a council estate or not
I've never said that everyone on here and all lefties are scroungers. I disagree vehemently with the leftie point of view but feel sorry for them as in my opinion they are very deluded. They let their hearts rule there heads and tend not to be able to see the wood for the trees.
I do feel that most lefties do feel a sense of entitlement to benefits and don't care too much where it comes from as long as they get it. I blame Labour for creating that sort of attitude, which of course they did in an effort to buy votes.
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I am also passionately interested in the benefit system and how it affects the most vunerable in society especially in the area of mental health, an area that is really struggling at the moment with the government cuts to local funding..
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mjdgreg I have always paid my rent, I've always supported myself..
Life isn't always perfect and whilst I am ill yes I am now getting help. That will however stop once I am well again.
You really need to not fixate and stop and look at the much wider picture. No one begrudges you any success you might have, you could well be a nice chap away from the keyboard but you do yourself no favours on here at times.
I can understand tenacity, we I think are very much alike in wanting to get the last word in at all times, the difference is I don't sprout a blinkered rhetoric angled deliberately to inflame peoples tempers.
I am a big picture sort of person. I hope you get well soon and don't begrudge you support while you are ill. I don't intentionally try to inflame people's tempers, I just put my view across and if lefties don't like it then tough. I dislike people that beat about the bush and don't say what they really think for fear of offending others. If only there were more people like me in the world.
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I am also passionately interested in the benefit system and how it affects the most vunerable in society especially in the area of mental health, an area that is really struggling at the moment with the government cuts to local funding..
You sound like a very nice person (just like me). I too would spend more on the needy in society. Unfortunately because so much money is wasted on benefits that are not really needed by many people, and there isn't a bottomless pit of money, it is people like the mentally ill that suffer the consequences. Local government should cut some of the layers of management instead of front-line services.
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Ah sorry mjdgreg, you don't get me with that one, I'm no incomer My mother's family have lived here since the 1770's aparently.
I don't choose to live here, it is where my family have lived for generations.
There is a big world outside of Doncaster you know, for such a high hitting entrepreneur your imagination seems to be tethered to a very small part of the world...
I never assumed you were an incomer. It still doesn't make it right that you should expect to live in an area you can't afford and expect the taxpayer to make up the difference for you.
I am from a family of immigrants. Both of my parents didn't just move town, they moved country because they couldn't afford to live where they were brought up any more.
Do you seriously think it is reasonable for the taxpayer to subsidise your cost of living? That's a very selfish outlook on life if you don't mind me saying.
In one of your many other wind up threads, you slated the left for letting too many immigrants into this Country!
But then again, does Ireland really count? ;)
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A charming vintage poster circa 1938 comissioned by another party that went out of it's way to turn a nation against the vunerable...
A lesson perhaps for the resentful on this island.
https://twitter.com/suephoenix58/status/286360798777974785/photo/1.
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He's another Michael Portillo. Family comes here. Presumes on our generosity in even giving them breathing space. Use our air. And then has the effrontery to tell us all how we should be living our lives.
Big picture sort of fellow? I don't think so. No bigoted windbag who repeatedly displays the callousness and shallow, unthinking regurgitation that you do can ever claim to see any picture except his own narrow furrow. It's people like you that make me feel physically sick you know. I don't mind someone demonstrating with the odd fact and the odd logical argument that my views are shallow or plain wrong. But someone who just shouts louder and louder, ignores all requests to back up his wild statements with even a tiny jot of evidence and who is utterly impervious to even well argued and evidenced alternative interpretations deserves nothing but total contempt.
You have my contempt in Spades Mick.
Cheers
BobG
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So all you lefties think it's OK for the taxpayer to make up the difference for all those on benefits who are living in areas they can't afford to if the taxpayer didn't step in? Very thoughtful of you to pass on these kind of debts to future generations.
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Why do you never post on football related threads? Are you on the wrong forum and haven't quite grasped it yet?
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Why do you never post on football related threads? Are you on the wrong forum and haven't quite grasped it yet?
Because all my threads get locked for no good reason. There, I've answered your question. Will you answer mine?
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Why do you never post on football related threads? Are you on the wrong forum and haven't quite grasped it yet?
Because all my threads get locked for no good reason. There, I've answered your question. Will you answer mine?
You didn't ask me a question.
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You didn't ask me a question.
Here it is again.
So all you lefties think it's OK for the taxpayer to make up the difference for all those on benefits who are living in areas they can't afford to if the taxpayer didn't step in? Very thoughtful of you to pass on these kind of debts to future generations.
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As you well know an extremely high percentage of those entitled to benefits are working.. A question for you Mick.. If you so despise those who need help what do you do if any of your tennants fall on hard times and need to claim? I can only assume as you take such a hard line that you don't accept anyone who needs housing benefit to live in one of your properties..
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As you well know an extremely high percentage of those entitled to benefits are working..
That's a rubbish answer. I'm not taking a hard line. I'm just asking an obvious question that no-one seems to want to give an answer to. So I'll ask again. Is it right for the taxpayer to subsidise the living costs of those that are living in areas that they wouldn't be able to afford to live in without taxpayer support? It doesn't matter if they're working or not.
I don't think it is right for me to live in say Bessacarr if I can't afford the rent or the cost of buying a house. Why on earth should the taxpayer be obliged to pay my rent or mortgage interest just because I choose to live beyond my means?
Cue the usual leftie nonsense that I'm a heartless right winger.
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A question for you mjdgreg.. If you so despise those who need help what do you do if any of your tennants fall on hard times and need to claim? I can only assume as you take such a hard line that you don't accept anyone who needs housing benefit to live in one of your properties..
You ask a question and you will get a proper answer (not the usual drivel I get when I ask a question). I don't despise those who need help. I despise those who get help that don't need it or shouldn't be getting because they are living beyond their means.
I have experience of one of my tenants falling on hard times and I stopped taking rent off them until they were back on their feet again. I didn't ask them to make up the lost revenue. I am a 'big society' sort of person. I have no problem housing someone who is on housing benefit if they are a genuine case. All my tenants pay below the market rate and I have never evicted anyone (I'm not a greedy person).
Right, anyone, please try and give me a proper answer to my question and stop burying your heads in the sand and being evasive.
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Still waiting.
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Still waiting.
Not took the hint yet?
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Not took the hint yet?
Not got an answer yet?
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yeah I have, I just can't be arsed with having a bore off with you.
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yeah I have, I just can't be arsed with having a bore off with you.
Just give your answer (if you've got one) and I promise not to have a bore off with you. Please try to give me a proper answer and not the evasive drivel that Jucyberry came up with. I'm not holding my breath.
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As you well know an extremely high percentage of those entitled to benefits are working..
That's a rubbish answer. I'm not taking a hard line. I'm just asking an obvious question that no-one seems to want to give an answer to. So I'll ask again. Is it right for the taxpayer to subsidise the living costs of those that are living in areas that they wouldn't be able to afford to live in without taxpayer support? It doesn't matter if they're working or not.
I don't think it is right for me to live in say Bessacarr if I can't afford the rent or the cost of buying a house. Why on earth should the taxpayer be obliged to pay my rent or mortgage interest just because I choose to live beyond my means?
Cue the usual leftie nonsense that I'm a heartless right winger.
OK, yes because
a)as a taxpayer living in this country you have no say in what the government decides is best for the whole of society other than the ballot box every five years - its called a democracy. Why for instance as a healthy, single, cycling pacifist, should my taxes be spent on hospitals, schools, roads, railways and military? Because that is the decision of the government to do so for the benefit of more than myself.
b) to argue otherwise is to argue for ghettoisation - to say that certain people should only live in certain areas - we are all entitled to a decent standard of living - its up to government policies to give opportunities for this.
apologies for the grammar/spelling, i'm busy doing something else and need to be quick as you are not worth spending much time on
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and another cracking Tory idea
http://news.uk.msn.com/uk/tory-manifesto-%e2%80%98blueprint%e2%80%99-lower-benefits-for-north-980372
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Goldmines. I've heard it all now.
mjdgreg - give me the name of one of your businesses.
One of my businesses is known as Bookie Basher.
Todger basher is more like it !!!!
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Frankly I would put more blame on landlords who fix their rent impossibly high all the time knowing that the system would pay. That and the fact that so much 'social' housing stock has been sold off.
Nothing is ever said about the fact that these houses in London..( it's always London after all for the media the world stops at the Watford gap) with their monopoly money rents should never be offered in the first place.
I can think of very few, if not anyone who if finding themselves in need of a home would say sorry all I deserve in life is a hovel.
I'll turn it round again for you.. You advocate a form of (un) social cleansing moving anyone in need of help with their rent to places more fitting for them, (being just base scroungers) no matter how long their connection or roots in the communities they live in at the moment.......
So, as an area financial depression where many are already struggling and jobs are not exacty plentiful, how would you feel about a mass migration of homeless people shunted your way by a government who just wants the poor to fall by the wayside and rot in a ditch?
This country is struggling, I cannot for the life of me see how moving people around like counters in one of those little puzzles we used to play with as kids will help...
All it will do is create massive resentment from the locals who see any affordable housing being taken by incomers, and their communities being drained of resources that they have already paid for in their taxes...
So, as I have said before.. What is the governments next step? A poster campain similar to the nazi parties in 1938...........?
Oh silly me, don't we already have that with their charming skivers v strivers campaign?
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Lmao @ Mick.. I'm noticing a bit of a pattern here, when you can't counter an argument you decry it as drivel....Isn't that rather like taking your toys home prematurely?
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OK, yes because
a)as a taxpayer living in this country you have no say in what the government decides is best for the whole of society other than the ballot box every five years - its called a democracy. Why for instance as a healthy, single, cycling pacifist, should my taxes be spent on hospitals, schools, roads, railways and military? Because that is the decision of the government to do so for the benefit of more than myself.
b) to argue otherwise is to argue for ghettoisation - to say that certain people should only live in certain areas - we are all entitled to a decent standard of living - its up to government policies to give opportunities for this.
apologies for the grammar/spelling, i'm busy doing something else and need to be quick as you are not worth spending much time on
I seem to remember you using the poor grammer/spelling/need to be quick excuse before to pass off your incomprehensible twaddle as reasoned debate. Typical leftie. It's all the government's responsibility. Try taking responsibility for your own life for a change and stop burdening us taxpayers with your demands.
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Frankly I would put more blame on landlords who fix their rent impossibly high all the time knowing that the system would pay. That and the fact that so much 'social' housing stock has been sold off.
Obviously as a leftie, you don't understand the laws of supply and demand. If people moved to areas they could afford, then rents would drop as there would be less demand for housing in the higher priced areas. It is the system that is to blame for artificially higher rents as government intervention distorts the market (not the landlords). Selling off social housing is a good thing. It is much better to own your own house than to be a burden on the taxpayer.
Nothing is ever said about the fact that these houses in London..( it's always London after all for the media the world stops at the Watford gap) with their monopoly money rents should never be offered in the first place.
I'm afraid I've been unable to decipher your drivel so can't make a comment.
I can think of very few, if not anyone who if finding themselves in need of a home would say sorry all I deserve in life is a hovel.
And your point is? Who said anything about moving into a hovel? Just because rents are cheaper in certain parts of the country doesn't mean that these houses are hovels. My houses are certainly not hovels.
I'll turn it round again for you.. You advocate a form of (un) social cleansing moving anyone in need of help with their rent to places more fitting for them, (being just base scroungers) no matter how long their connection or roots in the communities they live in at the moment.......
No, I'm advocating people living where they can afford to live, that's all. It would be nice if we could all live where we wanted to but I'm afraid that is just not how real life works. Only in a leftie fantasy land can you always live wherever you want because you expect the taxpayer to always bail you out.
So, as an area financial depression where many are already struggling and jobs are not exacty plentiful, how would you feel about a mass migration of homeless people shunted your way by a government who just wants the poor to fall by the wayside and rot in a ditch?
You do talk some cobblers. Why would there be a mass migration to places like Doncaster when we don't have the jobs? Who has ever said they want the poor to rot in a ditch? Unbelievable.
This country is struggling, I cannot for the life of me see how moving people around like counters in one of those little puzzles we used to play with as kids will help...
Part of the reason the country is struggling is because the taxpayer has to pay too much housing benefit.
All it will do is create massive resentment from the locals who see any affordable housing being taken by incomers, and their communities being drained of resources that they have already paid for in their taxes...
The local businesses will welcome rich incomers. Benefit claimants are hardly likely to spend and create a thriving economy. It's because of them that resources are over stretched.
So, as I have said before.. What is the governments next step? A poster campain similar to the nazi parties in 1938...........?
There you go again using inflammatory language. Just shows how devoid you are of sensible reasoning.
Oh silly me.
At least I agree with you on that point.
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Mick, Mick, Mick..Get with the programme, didn't you know that councils in the south are planning on driving the poor north and west of the southern counties?... Last time I looked Donny like most of the north is thought of as being a cheaper option than the south to live in..Heck even the government is thinking of cutting benefits ooop north because it is supposed to be so 'cheap'.........
So, by that thinking I would guess that it wouldn't be too long before the influx would find it's way to Donny..
Now, I must say i'm a tad disappointed with you too Mick, I thought we had come to some sort of understanding the other day, now you are back to being all defensive and obnoxious again... fickle little f**ker aren't you. :whistle:
ooooooooooo and one more thing, they are hardly going to be rich incomers are they, they are moving because they can't pay their rent... :headbang: :facepalm:
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Dear oh dear, mickey boy.
Your powers of deduction are well below par if you think Jucy is a "leftie". I have first hand knowledge that she uses her right hand :)
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Ok Mick lets all move to where we can afford to live, shame most jobs aren't transferable to another region.
Lets all move up north cos its cheaper ....... oops everybodys on Benefits but not much cos the coalition is suggesting cutting them "up north" cos its cheaper "up north" cos theres no living wage jobs only part time pin money and government invented training type jobs .....oops all the well paid jobs are in London (what a surprise) ....oops thats where the demand for housing is......... oops lots of demand for housing so landlords rip off and play the system so nobody can afford to buy.
To be honest Mick I don't know the answer neither do you and this flipping coalition certainly don't
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Dear oh dear, mickey boy.
Your powers of deduction are well below par if you think Jucy is a "leftie". I have first hand knowledge that she uses her right hand :)
:laugh:
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mjdgre, mjdgreg, mjdgreg..Get with the programme, didn't you know that councils in the south are planning on driving the poor north and west of the southern counties?...
In your warped view of reality. I defy you to provide evidence of that ludicrous statement. I'll tell you what will happen as you don't have a clue about supply and demand. When housing benefit falls guess what will happen. Because there won't be as much money sloshing around, rents will fall. Housing will become more affordable. Cutting housing benefit is a win win situation. Eventually you might be able to move back to where you prefer to live as it will be more affordable. Government handing out as much housing benefit as landlords want is what is driving rents up. Obvious really unless you are a leftie who isn't bothered about taxpayers money and only cares if the taxpayer is subsidising their cost of living at all costs.
Last time I looked Donny like most of the north is thought of as being a cheaper option than the south to live in..Heck even the government is thinking of cutting benefits ooop north because it is supposed to be so 'cheap'.........
Donny is super cheap. There is no excuse for the vast majority of people in Donny not buying their own house. There should be hardly any need for housing benefit in Donny. Unfortunately the bulk of the population are lefties that are quite happy for the taxpayer to finance their housing costs.
So, by that thinking I would guess that it wouldn't be too long before the influx would find it's way to Donny..
If any of them do come I reckon they will buy their own home when they realise how cheap it is. I'm sure they will be gobsmacked to realise that we have so many renters when it is so obviously cheaper to buy.
Now, I must say i'm a tad disappointed with you too mjdgreg, I thought we had come to some sort of understanding the other day, now you are back to being all defensive and obnoxious again... fickle little f***er aren't you.
The last thing I can ever be accused of is being defensive. I'm an 'all out attack' sort of person.
ooooooooooo and one more thing, they are hardly going to be rich incomers are they, they are moving because they can't pay their rent...
I assumed you were talking of incomers to where you live. Sounds like you need to be rich to live where you live. Anyway, I'd bet any incomers from the South to Doncaster would feel quite rich when they saw just how cheap things are around here. I'm sure they'd be of the opinion that we didn't realise how lucky we were to have such cheap housing.
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Ok mjdgreg lets all move to where we can afford to live, shame most jobs aren't transferable to another region.
Most jobs are transferable. The BBC is a classic example.
Lets all move up north cos its cheaper ....... oops everybodys on Benefits but not much cos the coalition is suggesting cutting them "up north" cos its cheaper "up north" cos theres no living wage jobs only part time pin money and government invented training type jobs .....oops all the well paid jobs are in London (what a surprise) ....oops thats where the demand for housing is......... oops lots of demand for housing so landlords rip off and play the system so nobody can afford to buy.
To be honest mjdgreg I don't know the answer neither do you and this flipping coalition certainly don't
I do know the answer. Remove all housing benefit. You would then see a dramatic fall in rents and house prices and people would be forced to move to where they could find work in an area they could afford to live in. Failing that they would have to emigrate or set up their own businesses. People would also be forced to stop spending every penny they earned and living on credit. Sorted.
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Chaps. I was going to say that I'd give pretty good odds that good old Mick has never had the benefit of any higher education, let alone university. It's an obvious conclusion to jump to from his inability to construct any logical argument or to offer evidence in support of it, but, but, he has got one rather well practised talent which he might have picked up. He's brilliant at avoiding the issue when he hasn't got an answer. If you read this, and plenty of other threads back through, just count the number of times he changes his position and the number of times he either simply ignores a well argued and evidenced point, or, ridicules it. Both traits, and they are ceaselessly employed I promise you, provide all the evidence anyone will ever need of the shallowness of his thinking, of the lack of knowledge in his bonce and his basic unfitness to argue anything at all.
Mick: it's not rocket science. If you care to look back, you will see that Billy for one has changed my view on things. It's a question of logic, rationality and evidence. Did you ever see and use the acronym QED when you were at school? It stands for 'quod erat demonstrandum'. Look it up.
You are valueless Mick. Totally and utterly.
BobG
PS Oh, and Billy. I'm sorry. Your msg was right. I was wrong.
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Ok mjdgreg lets all move to where we can afford to live, shame most jobs aren't transferable to another region.
Most jobs are transferable. The BBC is a classic example.
Lets all move up north cos its cheaper ....... oops everybodys on Benefits but not much cos the coalition is suggesting cutting them "up north" cos its cheaper "up north" cos theres no living wage jobs only part time pin money and government invented training type jobs .....oops all the well paid jobs are in London (what a surprise) ....oops thats where the demand for housing is......... oops lots of demand for housing so landlords rip off and play the system so nobody can afford to buy.
To be honest mjdgreg I don't know the answer neither do you and this flipping coalition certainly don't
I do know the answer. Remove all housing benefit. You would then see a dramatic fall in rents and house prices and people would be forced to move to where they could find work in an area they could afford to live in. Failing that they would have to emigrate or set up their own businesses. People would also be forced to stop spending every penny they earned and living on credit. Sorted.
What a load of shite.
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Bob.
I did warn you...
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This thread is a classic example of where I have again won the debate hands down. I have provided numerous reasons why the housing benefits system is a joke. I have also come up with the solution to the problem.
What have you lot come up with? The only argument I can see is from jucyberry who feels that because her family have lived in an area since the 1770's then it is fine and dandy for her to carry on living in the area even if she can't afford to. She is quite happy for the taxpayer to subsidise her cost of living if needed. What a total joke.
If I can't afford to live somewhere I don't expect the taxpayer to make it affordable for me. I get off my arse and I set up some new businesses to make it affordable or I live somewhere I can afford.
That is the difference between me and most of you lot. You expect the taxpayer to look after you from cradle to grave. I expect nothing from the taxpayer and expect everything from myself. I know which is the more honourable position.
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Mick you haven't won.. funnily enough this isn't a competition.
You will never see the other side of your percieved arguments because you are one dimentional in your thinking. You challenge the irrefutable,because you can't even step aside let alone step back.
There is a very thin line between tenacity and sheer bull headed ignorance, and you tread it constantly..
Oh and I have paid my taxes and as I said the other day and you grudgingly acknowledged when I am well I will do so again so don't come that old chestnut...
You say people should uproot and move as if it is as easy as just packing a handbag. when you have next to nothing financially how are you supposed to pay for removals? Not everyone has a friendly van driver you know.
You are also as I have said before extremely disengenious You know very well I was talking about Donny not Heacham.
If your gold mines, gambling thing and all your other little ventures ever fold I have a suggestion for you..Best you toddle over to Westminster and offer your services to Dave, he will need a decent spin doctor before long.....(and that isn't a compliment)
There is plenty of proof both in the news papers and on tv about what the government and councils are doing at the moment, if you don't believe the evidence of your own eyes then search a little further, you will find doccuments on line.. To be honest it is amazing what you can find when you dig a little.
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July
I strongly suggest you read The Road to Wigan Pier. You'd find there's always been clever-clever t**ts knowing exactly how those on the bottom through no fault of their own should harden up. And there have always been nearly little swine ready to stick the boot into those at the bottom.
Orwell gives an example from 1935 Wigan. A 30 year old bloke with a wife and three kids brought up before the Beak for fiddling the Dole. Working a night shift delivering firewood on a horse-drawn trolley. The evidence was provided by a neighbour who saw him and grassed him up to the Magistrate. Turns out the bloke was doing a night-time flit from one slum house to another. The "firewood" was his few scraps of furniture. Mostly fruit boxes.
Orwell also gives numerous examples of middle class and well-off working class people spitting their bile at the unemployed who "preferred life on the Dole and wouldn't work if a job was offered to them." Plus ca change eh?
Of course, these bone idle scroungers were the same ones who put in 60 hour weeks in the pita and the steel works to make the weapons that won the War, once the Govt pulled its thumbs out of its arse and kick started the economy with deficit-led spending to save our very existence. THAT's how feckless and idle they were.
But you'll still get people today who know less than shit about our history being convinced that THEY know what the solution is today.
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My Dad got killed down Pit when I was ten,I used to get free school meals, that entailed standing in a separate queue to the kids whose parents could afford to pay
It was humiliating and degrading,having said that I did it because I new I was helping my mum out, if i'd kicked off about it she would have stumped up the cash from her pitance. I dont think its fair on families on benefits to make em have to use vouchers it stigmatizes the kids,speaking from experience.
[/quote]
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I used to have to queue up for free dinner tickets in a different queue to paying kids.
Then I used to sell the ticket , at a discount to the paying kids , and go to the chippy followed by a blueberry slush puppy. F**k the system!
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You say people should uproot and move as if it is as easy as just packing a handbag. when you have next to nothing financially how are you supposed to pay for removals?
Excuses, excuses. Lets just keep on paying housing benefit to greedy landlords because:
a) Your family have always lived in the area.
b) You don't have the money to pay the removals man.
c) You like living in a nice area.
Lets ignore the fact that the country is bankrupt and is having to borrow money to pay this benefit. No, lets all live in leftie fantasy land and just keep on expecting benefits to be paid regardless of whether we can afford them or not.
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There is plenty of proof both in the news papers and on tv about what the government and councils are doing at the moment, if you don't believe the evidence of your own eyes then search a little further, you will find doccuments on line.. To be honest it is amazing what you can find when you dig a little.
In that case could you provide a link please to back up your outlandish claims. Shouldn't be too difficult. There are people on this forum who won't take you seriously if you don't produce evidence you know.
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Good grief, it's my belief that all the posters on this thread are quite intelligent people , can't you see he's totally reeled you in? It's just sport to the numpty. He hasn't got a property empire, he just gets off on upsetting folk like yourselves. The only good that comes from it is that at least while he's winding you up, he's not digging badgers from their beds or shining a torch in a deer's eyes while his dogs rip their necks out.
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Oh we've all known for ages that he's a liar of the first order Nice One. It's fairly easy to deduce what he really is.
BobG
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While we're talking about being economical with the truth over benefits, it's worth having a look at what has happened to benefits over the last few decades. Osborne has made a huge issue of the fact that benefits have gone up relative to wages during the recent recessions. That's true. They have. Because they have been index linked to inflation for several decades.
The point is that over the last 30 years, wages went up FAR faster than inflation. So benefits came down massively as a ratio of average wages. The evidence is here, from the National Institute of Economic & Social Research, the UK's leading, politically neutral macroeconomic research body
(http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-Oag_7Oi-mtA/UOrxlNVy_BI/AAAAAAAAAMU/uj7V2sFkRGA/s1600/jsa2.jpg)
So, Osborne's approach is that he's happy for benefits to go up in line with inflation so long as inflation is rising less rapidly than wages. But benefits must go up by less than inflation if wages are rising slowly. Either way, benefits are driven down. In other words, those on the dole as a result of the great crash and double dip recession bear the brunt of the cutbacks, whilst those earning £1million get a £50k giveaway from the reduction in the top rate of tax.
Tories eh? Leopards and spots.
Final point. There will be the usual cries that benefits went through the roof under Labour. Not according to NIESR.
(http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-SEJ9VrcS_HE/UOryBhvhH6I/AAAAAAAAAMc/8U47jRk4JMY/s1600/benefit+spend.jpg)
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And then of course there is the other really big issue. Our economy is desperately in need of a demand stimulus to get us growing again. The best way to do that is to get money circulating round the economy. Get people spending and buying and thereby driving up demand for goods.
It is well established that the very poorest are the most efficient at doing this. Give a poor person an extra quid and typically they will spend it, because they are living on such a tight budget that they have little scope for saving. Give a millionaire a quid and they will typically put it into a pension pot. There will be no quick recirculation of that money.
So a policy that removes money from the poorest and gives money to the richest is both morally and theoretically stupid.
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Lets also conveniently forget that the 'evil' tories have cut child benefit for those earning over £50k per annum. Who are these people? Yes they are the typical 'rich' tory voter. Good on them for doing the right thing even though it affects people who typically vote for them. That puts a lie to the myth that the tories are only for the rich. More lefty claptrap.
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Unless you are a couple earning £49500 each
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Unless you are a couple earning £49500 each
Like I say. Lets conveniently forget they are hitting their own voters where it hurts. Something you lefties can't admit to yourselves because it doesn't fit with your warped view of reality.
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There is plenty of proof both in the news papers and on tv about what the government and councils are doing at the moment, if you don't believe the evidence of your own eyes then search a little further, you will find doccuments on line.. To be honest it is amazing what you can find when you dig a little.
I see you have still been unable to provide this proof. Why can't everyone be like me and back up every thing they say. Here's another example of me backing up my point of view:
Grant Shapps, the housing minister, said councils would not be allowed to "export their poor".
He said that rules his department would issue would make "locality a principal linkage". He added: "If somebody is working or has children at school we will not allow councils to send people out of the area."
Is that clear enough for you?
You must have been reading about Newham council (Labour controlled) who were on about exporting the poor to the North when there was no need as there are thousands of houses within 5 miles of Newham that fall within the cap.
Typical leftie council trying to make political gain when there is none to be had.
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There is plenty of proof both in the news papers and on tv about what the government and councils are doing at the moment, if you don't believe the evidence of your own eyes then search a little further, you will find doccuments on line.. To be honest it is amazing what you can find when you dig a little.
Still waiting for you to dig a little to provide your proof.