Viking Supporters Co-operative
Viking Chat => Off Topic => Topic started by: bpoolrover on July 04, 2017, 05:08:53 pm
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Having been reading up abit on university fees as my daughter is trying to decide which 1 to go to, I can't really see what the problem is with the way they charge people at the minute, am I missing something that makes them so bad?
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People are upset with uni fees because they prefer to get something for nothing!
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University fees are only part of the debt a normal student would rack up - there are accomodation, meals, books, etc. I don't know the latest official average figures, but running up 50K debt in 3 years is not uncommon. Some courses can be significantly longer.
In addition my daughter had to sign a form declaring she would not take any paid employment during term time, and no more than I think 6 weeks total employment over the whole year - so the possibility of offsetting costs was minimal.
Graduates then have little chance of saving a deposit for a house.
The students grants of 50 years ago were clearly too generous, but the pendulum has swung too much the other way IMHO.
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Is about £9000 a term now I think after government slapped a increase from £6000 a term or something like that .
Wonder how many end up not paying full outstanding balance back.
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The problem it seems is nowadays is if any Tom, Dick or harry from any background can go to a university.
Thats not a bad thing if the kid is a bright star but I do think a lot of the current students seem to go there for a lifestyle choice rather than because theyre very bright academically.
So with more students going up pops more uni's with nonsense courses and little chances of it actually leading to a job in whatever field it is.
Less universities courses and the very brightest kids of our society going to them and not any old thick ones which make up the numbers,, would be better for the country.
And I think it should be free for students but only when its the best ones going to them and university is seen as something good and to be proud of again like it was in the 80s.
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University fees are only part of the debt a normal student would rack up - there are accomodation, meals, books, etc. I don't know the latest official average figures, but running up 50K debt in 3 years is not uncommon. Some courses can be significantly longer.
In addition my daughter had to sign a form declaring she would not take any paid employment during term time, and no more than I think 6 weeks total employment over the whole year - so the possibility of offsetting costs was minimal.
Graduates then have little chance of saving a deposit for a house.
The students grants of 50 years ago were clearly too generous, but the pendulum has swung too much the other way IMHO.
I just can't find fault with it, if you earn 21k a year you pay 90quid a year back, 31k 900quid a year back, most at a guess will pay none or very little back, I agree they might not be able to save for a house but getting rid of fees won't change any of that
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The Uni fees I don't see as being a problem it's the accommodation fees that's the struggle. £138 a week for a room with a shower, toilet bed and desk.
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Why not rent off campus? I've never been so wouldn't no what most people do
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When my son went to uni he had three of his four years renting off campus and saved money by doing that.
He also had a job being a lifeguard at the swimming baths and worked on the bar there on a couple nights a week.
On top of that he did computer upgrades for people to earn a bit of extra cash.
It didn't affect his results as he qualified with a Masters.
He finished uni with no debt.
A mate of mine has two kids at uni who don't do any additional work and come home every weekend from York.
Their debts are building.
Someone earlier asked how many students ever pay back their student loans in full.
My bet is that hardly any do so.
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Why not rent off campus? I've never been so wouldn't no what most people do
Not always available. More students than rooms on campus.
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When my son went to uni he had three of his four years renting off campus and saved money by doing that.
He also had a job being a lifeguard at the swimming baths and worked on the bar there on a couple nights a week.
On top of that he did computer upgrades for people to earn a bit of extra cash.
It didn't affect his results as he qualified with a Masters.
He finished uni with no debt.
A mate of mine has two kids at uni who don't do any additional work and come home every weekend from York.
Their debts are building.
Someone earlier asked how many students ever pay back their student loans in full.
My bet is that hardly any do so.
Not all Universities are the same. As I said earlier, my daughter had to sign that she would not take any paid employemt termtime, and no more than 6 weeks in the summer. She was expected to be working at her studies all that time. She was a very serious and motivated student at a top (their words) university, and who did well and gained full funding for a Ph.D.
I agree with a comment above that probably too many people go to University these days. So much so that a degree is no longer a guarrantee to employment. IMHO much more funding and effort ought to be put into vocational training courses and apprenticeships for school leavers.
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Why not rent off campus? I've never been so wouldn't no what most people do
Not always available. More students than rooms on campus.
Bpool you will find that places with Universities have exorbitant rental fees, Sheffield being a good example, most Unie let the Kids stay in halls for the first year then they are booted out, my lad was at Preston and it was £1300 a month for their 4 bed house. As he came home a lot it wasn't good value.
What degree is little bpool going to do ?.
Some are a complete waste of time and money,gone are the days when students walked out of Uni into a well paid Career, sports science and out to do with law or Criminology are a waste of time,if you do the homework you can pick a degree that guarantees a job,My daughter in law did that and now she is laughing.
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She wants to be a doctor so will be studying for awhile lol,Sproty your lad should have rented in Blackpool and got the train, he would have got a mansion for 1300 quid lol
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Well we will always need Doctors, good luck to her. Does she know she will get her very own pickled human corpse to play with foot 4 years 😵😵😵🤒
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The total amount of student loan debt was just over £100billion last month - with the average per student at £32200. Of course the richer students wont have any debt so the actual debt that some individual students have is said to be over £60000.
How is someone starting off in their working life going to contribute to the economy with that sort of debt hanging over them? Will they ever be able to get a mortgage for instance?
And will they ever pay it back? You have to earn so much before you start paying and will there be well paid jobs to go into? If they dont pay it back within 30 years then it gets written off - by the taxpayer.
So its no so much the tuition fees themselves that are the problem - it is the level of debt this is bringing to students and the consequences to the country of this debt.
I have no idea how many students do or dont have debts Hound - I would guess very few. I didnt but then again I went as a mature student with some savings - and did some building work for mates and one of my landlords during my time there.
Hope your daughter does well bpoolrover.
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The total amount of student loan debt was just over £100billion last month - with the average per student at £32200. Of course the richer students wont have any debt so the actual debt that some individual students have is said to be over £60000.
How is someone starting off in their working life going to contribute to the economy with that sort of debt hanging over them? Will they ever be able to get a mortgage for instance?
And will they ever pay it back? You have to earn so much before you start paying and will there be well paid jobs to go into? If they dont pay it back within 30 years then it gets written off - by the taxpayer.
So its no so much the tuition fees themselves that are the problem - it is the level of debt this is bringing to students and the consequences to the country of this debt.
I have no idea how many students do or dont have debts Hound - I would guess very few. I didnt but then again I went as a mature student with some savings - and did some building work for mates and one of my landlords during my time there.
Hope your daughter does well bpoolrover.
For the first time were singing from the same hymn sheet but I do think theres too many university offering to many courses for too many students and we need to cut that with tuition fees to.
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The total amount of student loan debt was just over £100billion last month - with the average per student at £32200. Of course the richer students wont have any debt so the actual debt that some individual students have is said to be over £60000.
How is someone starting off in their working life going to contribute to the economy with that sort of debt hanging over them? Will they ever be able to get a mortgage for instance?
And will they ever pay it back? You have to earn so much before you start paying and will there be well paid jobs to go into? If they dont pay it back within 30 years then it gets written off - by the taxpayer.
So its no so much the tuition fees themselves that are the problem - it is the level of debt this is bringing to students and the consequences to the country of this debt.
I have no idea how many students do or dont have debts Hound - I would guess very few. I didnt but then again I went as a mature student with some savings - and did some building work for mates and one of my landlords during my time there.
Hope your daughter does well bpoolrover.
It makes no difference to your credit rating or ability to get a mortgage. Granted though had I not lived cheeply with parents for a few years I wouldn't have gotten my house deposit.
It'll take me a long long time to pay my loan off but the only issues I have are below.
Fees high and universities still make you buy textbooks, pay to print etc.
Student housing often very expensive.
Interest rate on the loan. IT should be lower than it is.
But does the fee mean people can't afford university? No it doesn't and despite my loan costs coming out my salary each month and it is a lot of money, I still earn far more than I probably would have without it and I enjoyed it.
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See, the thing about student debt (as far as tuition fees go at least) is it isn't "proper" debt. Like BFYP says, it makes no difference to your credit rating, and it comes out of your pay packet when you reach a certain salary as a tax anyway so you'll never even know you had the money to "lose" it.
I don't know about any of the maintenance money or how that's repaid if any of it is but there's a lot of misconceptions when it comes to tuition fees. I don't think they should be as high as they are - and it's a bit pointless anyway as the majority of people will never pay them back - but they don't put you in "real" debt. You're just paying a minute amount back into a pot out of your salary.
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You know nothing about it RedJ SO WHY DO YOU POST YOU IDIOT !
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Thank you all for the replies, so I'm not getting political but instead of offering free uni courses, they would be better subsiding housing and books ect. and tories the same?
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You know nothing about it RedJ SO WHY DO YOU POST YOU IDIOT !
...well I do.
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University fees are only part of the debt a normal student would rack up - there are accomodation, meals, books, etc. I don't know the latest official average figures, but running up 50K debt in 3 years is not uncommon. Some courses can be significantly longer.
In addition my daughter had to sign a form declaring she would not take any paid employment during term time, and no more than I think 6 weeks total employment over the whole year - so the possibility of offsetting costs was minimal.
Graduates then have little chance of saving a deposit for a house.
The students grants of 50 years ago were clearly too generous, but the pendulum has swung too much the other way IMHO.
I agree it does need re-setting . My daughter is currently at Leeds Uni and whilst neither she nor her mates incidentally begrudge repaying their Tuition fees ( at a max of £ 9000 ) , they do resent paying back their Maintenance Loans.
If alternatively they were on the dole , they would not be expected to pay that money back from any future earnings .
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University fees are only part of the debt a normal student would rack up - there are accomodation, meals, books, etc. I don't know the latest official average figures, but running up 50K debt in 3 years is not uncommon. Some courses can be significantly longer.
In addition my daughter had to sign a form declaring she would not take any paid employment during term time, and no more than I think 6 weeks total employment over the whole year - so the possibility of offsetting costs was minimal.
Graduates then have little chance of saving a deposit for a house.
The students grants of 50 years ago were clearly too generous, but the pendulum has swung too much the other way IMHO.
I just can't find fault with it, if you earn 21k a year you pay 90quid a year back, 31k 900quid a year back, most at a guess will pay none or very little back, I agree they might not be able to save for a house but getting rid of fees won't change any of that
Strange how everyone found fault with it when it was the Lib/Dems whilst in the Coalition compromised on this if the Tories put these thresholds higher thus reducing the students chances of repaying the full debt back .
They were vilified for this even though Tuition Fees were introduced by the previous Labour Govt. and the Tories insisted on this structure.
Most will pay little back but that did not stop the other Parties from making political capital out of it and almost wiping out the Lib/Dems which lead to all this Brexit shite that eventually followed their demise and Cameron's subsequent caving in to the Tory Far Right and of course the self- destructive Brexit about to happen.
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Seems my 50K estimate was close:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/education-40493658
Mind you 6.1% interest is scandalous and exploitative given current interest levels - on average students will run up GBP 5800 in interest just while studying - ouch. And those from poorer backgrounds run up the biggest debts.
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Seems my 50K estimate was close:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/education-40493658
Mind you 6.1% interest is scandalous and exploitative given current interest levels - on average students will run up GBP 5800 in interest just while studying - ouch. And those from poorer backgrounds run up the biggest debts.
And this is exactly why fees should be scrapped! It's all well and good saying you only pay it back once you've got a good job, but the point is you still have to pay it back! And interest is piled on no matter when you start paying it back - it IS a proper loan. If you come from a wealthy family you pay far less in fees than someone from a poorer family - how is that fair? And these fees are putting people off going into higher education - for that reason alone they should be scrapped!
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I'm not opposed to the system in general - it allows those who otherwise wouldn't be able to afford to go to university a means of doing so, and being able to pay back when they can afford it. The interest rates now do seem very high though, and with the size of the loans these days that must be a worry.
From a personal perspective I've had no issues. I started working properly in 2009 after graduating in 2007, in a financial job in London. The repayments were small at first as I was on a grad salary, but they rose gradually. I paid it off two years ago at the start of the tax year on a salary about 140% higher than what I started on, so took me about 6 years. I never really noticed the repayments as they've always been there, but my loan was only for tuition so I came out with about £10k of debt. Realise that it's a different kettle of fish for people these days with debt 5 times that, though.