Viking Supporters Co-operative
Viking Chat => Viking Chat => Topic started by: Copps is Magic on February 24, 2018, 12:10:44 pm
-
It seems reports are emerging approximately 100 of our fans have been sent home on order of the SY Police.
-
I may add, there's been no trouble reported as of yet, this seems to be pre-emptive.
-
5% of the away end empty. Stand where you wanna.
-
Walk ‘home’ to Bentley and get on there
-
I may add, there's been no trouble reported as of yet, this seems to be pre-emptive.
If thats the case it stinks, SYP failed to do that in our home fixture
-
The fact that police can just send football fans home without question is disgraceful I think. It will have been because of what they were wearing and due to the fact they were making a bit of noise no doubt.
-
https://www.thestar.co.uk/news/group-of-70-doncaster-rovers-fans-moved-out-of-rotherham-town-centre-by-police-1-9034172 (https://www.thestar.co.uk/news/group-of-70-doncaster-rovers-fans-moved-out-of-rotherham-town-centre-by-police-1-9034172)
-
https://www.thestar.co.uk/news/group-of-70-doncaster-rovers-fans-moved-out-of-rotherham-town-centre-by-police-1-9034172 (https://www.thestar.co.uk/news/group-of-70-doncaster-rovers-fans-moved-out-of-rotherham-town-centre-by-police-1-9034172)
The match commander is from the Doncaster area
-
https://www.thestar.co.uk/news/group-of-70-doncaster-rovers-fans-moved-out-of-rotherham-town-centre-by-police-1-9034172 (https://www.thestar.co.uk/news/group-of-70-doncaster-rovers-fans-moved-out-of-rotherham-town-centre-by-police-1-9034172)
Prevention is better than cure
-
That’s the end of that then their big day after 11 years ended with 5 minutes in the Sheffield postcode
-
5% of the away end empty. Stand where you wanna.
Not selfish are you Padge. Does’nt matter a jot about anyone else. What a considerate person yo are.
NOT. :headbang:
-
He's from stainy originally
-
He's from stainy originally
Correct
-
Any 1 want a ticket I’m at macdonalds in donny £20
-
The Anti-Social Behaviour Act 2003 gives the police powers in designated areas to disperse groups of two or more where their presence or behaviour has resulted, or is likely to result, in a member of the public being harassed, intimidated, alarmed or distressed. The powers are controversial due to the discretion they accord to police and the infringements of individual's rights they entail.
In theory, then, if they 'disperse' they can go back to the game - bus/train/car.
-
Very poor form that. I'd love to know the criteria they've used to decide who gets sent home and who isn't. There will be plenty causing no trouble that are in the wrong place at the wrong time.
-
It absolutely stinks it really does
-
Very poor form that. I'd love to know the criteria they've used to decide who gets sent home and who isn't. There will be plenty causing no trouble that are in the wrong place at the wrong time.
There won't be any criteria, if you're in the wrong place at the wrong time then you'll get roped in, the Police are using a policy of guilty without trial
-
Iv been sent home and made to sign a piece of paper that says if I return to Roth before 6 today I get £2500 fine or 3 months in nic , just for been in a pub before 10 o’clock was the excuse they gave me never been in trouble for fighting at football in my life gutted was looking forward to the game
-
Iv been sent home and made to sign a piece of paper that says if I return to Roth before 6 today I get £2500 fine or 3 months in nic , just for been in a pub before 10 o’clock was the excuse they gave me never been in trouble for fighting at football in my life gutted was looking forward to the game
Sound disgusting mate. What did they threaten you with if you didn't sign?
-
Iv been sent home and made to sign a piece of paper that says if I return to Roth before 6 today I get £2500 fine or 3 months in nic , just for been in a pub before 10 o’clock was the excuse they gave me never been in trouble for fighting at football in my life gutted was looking forward to the game
I should contact the FSF if I were you, if the pub was open at that time you have every right to enter it. What would they have done if you refused to sign the paper?
-
Iv been sent home and made to sign a piece of paper that says if I return to Roth before 6 today I get £2500 fine or 3 months in nic , just for been in a pub before 10 o’clock was the excuse they gave me never been in trouble for fighting at football in my life gutted was looking forward to the game
Did it kick off at all??
-
Prob get locked up of £500 fine I’m discussed and will be complaining to South Yorkshire police
-
Are our fans being disproportionately targeted? It seems whenever a big following comes to Donny they have the run of the town but when we take a big following they close down entire towns (Mansfield, Rotherham)
-
They said there was a scuffle earlier reported so just sent every one in the weatherspoons home and now they moved on to the bridge (an away pub and sent them home ) ???
-
Prob get locked up of £500 fine I’m discussed and will be complaining to South Yorkshire police
If you refused to sign the paper what could they lock you up for?
What would they charge you with?
-
I think you should be contacting me with all the info you have. Send me a pm with contact details.
-
I think you should be contacting me with all the info you have. Send me a pm with contact details.
Well you have the match commabers name in that link to pass on to the FSF
-
Surely they can’t just walk into a pub and send everyone home....
-
Silent Iv thrown the paper work away but they took my name and address etc and gave me a disorder clearence out of town
-
Silent Iv thrown the paper work away but they took my name and address etc and gave me a disorder clearence out of town
Surely there are people you are with that still have the paperwork to follow this up
-
There will be loads with the paper work as there is about 100 given them not all from same group
-
So there was no trouble which led to this?
-
Silent Iv thrown the paper work away but they took my name and address etc and gave me a disorder clearence out of town
Can you get somebody else with the paperwork? Make sure everybody holds on to what they have, individual assesments have to be carried out
They can't treat everybody the same as one group.
-
Failure to comply with the direction to leave is a criminal offence. Failure to surrender items is also a criminal offence.
The Court of Appeal in Carter v CPS [2009] EWHC 2197 (Admin) considered the conduct of proceedings involving the breach of directions given under a dispersal order. The effect of the judgment is that all relevant documents should be made available to the court at the first hearing to enable it to ascertain whether the authorisation was admitted by the defence.
At the first hearing, the court will ask whether or not the validity of the authorisation is admitted. If it is not admitted, the case should be put back for a short time on the same day to enable the defendant to consider the relevant documents. If the defence seeks to challenge the authorisation, the question will arise whether the validity of the authorisation is a matter to be determined by the magistrates or by challenge to the High Court. The Divisional Court in Carter v CPS [2009] EWHC 2197 (Admin) did not give guidance on the factors to consider in making this determination.
The Crown must prove all elements of the offence:
The authorisation was in effect and was valid
The officer was in uniform
The direction was given inside the relevant locality
The defendant knew that he was being given a direction under the authorisation
The direction given was lawful
The defendant failed to comply with the direction.
It is essential that a copy of the authorisation and the written notice are submitted to the CPS as part of the initial file provided by the police. The CPS must have these documents in order to prove the validity as an element of the offence.
In order to prove that the officer acted lawfully, the validity of the authorisation must be proved. It is suggested that the officer of the rank of inspector or above who gave the authorisation makes a s9 Criminal Justice Act 1967 (CJA) statement at the time he signs the authorisation confirming that he made it, setting out the brief grounds for his decisions and exhibiting the authorisation. A copy of this statement can be used in all subsequent prosecutions.
A police officer seeking to give a direction pursuant to the authorisation and written notice should ensure that the terms of the direction are clear, for example, when the person must leave the area and the manner in which the person must do so (including the route).
The word 'disperse' is not defined in the Act. The dictionary definition is 'to scatter, to go or drive or send in different directions'. It is submitted that when an officer tells a group to disperse, this means they should all leave the area.
Sentencing
A person given a direction under s35 who fails without reasonable excuse to comply with it commits an offence and is liable on summary conviction -
(a) To imprisonment for a period not exceeding 3 months, or
(b) To a fine not exceeding level 4 on the standard scale.
A person given a direction under s37 who fails without reasonable excuse to comply with it commits an offence. A person guilty of an offence under s37(3) is liable on summary conviction to a fine not exceeding level 2 on the standard scale.
-
Is there a process if these disorder clearances are false to claim compensation from the Police? If there is I hope every single one of them claims even though it still won't make up for the loss of the day.
-
Stinks! Why does it being a free country go out the window when it comes to football fans?
I was once sent home from Scunthorpe train station with 2 of my kids just for being in a train station when other fans started chanting.
-
The copper in charge sounds a right t**t.... I think it would be a good idea if syp had the football intelligence officer at meet the owners meetings.... how can you justify a 41 year old and 2 daughters getting a dispersal order?? Absolutely disgusting especially when you think back Rotherham walked around town .....
-
The Anti-Social Behaviour Act 2003 gives the police powers in designated areas to disperse groups of two or more where their presence or behaviour has resulted, or is likely to result, in a member of the public being harassed, intimidated, alarmed or distressed. The powers are controversial due to the discretion they accord to police and the infringements of individual's rights they entail.
In theory, then, if they 'disperse' they can go back to the game - bus/train/car.
a dispersal order will usually encompass a town centre and lasts for 24hrs. This would mean going to the game would be a breach of the order and therefore liable to arrest.
-
I'm with Martin now.
If anyone has the dispersal order notice please keep hold of it. We will put up more info later today. The notices have to be individually served upon you and have a reason why they have been served. It is not acceptable to issue "block" dispersal notices.
To answer the question regarding whether you can refuse to sign one, the answer is no you can't. You have to comply and then deal with it later through a different process.
-
5% of the away end empty. Stand where you wanna.
Not selfish are you Padge. Does’nt matter a jot about anyone else. What a considerate person yo are.
NOT. :headbang:
Where’s your - ? Poor from a vsc regular poster.
-
I think the other 70 kicked a few kids in knew they’d get threw out of Rotherham when the real misters arrived and claimed a victory
-
I'm with Martin now.
If anyone has the dispersal order notice please keep hold of it. We will put up more info later today. The notices have to be individually served upon you and have a reason why they have been served. It is not acceptable to issue "block" dispersal notices.
To answer the question regarding whether you can refuse to sign one, the answer is no you can't. You have to comply and then deal with it later through a different process.
For any on here that use the FB group, it would be useful to post this up there, this is not about VSC v FB group or individual disagreements, it's about infringing the rights of football fans in general
-
I've asked Crofty to do it as I'm not in the group anymore.
-
Going off the facebook group it seems a good percentage of those dispersed have been successful in selling their tickets.
-
its disgusting they can do this. I'm sure there were many innocent fans in that pub at the time who had no intention of causing trouble or even any history of doing so.
-
Going off the facebook group it seems a good percentage of those dispersed have been successful in selling their tickets.
Hopefully not to Rotherham fans
-
I’d love to hear the reason why Rotherham fans can casually go to donny market areas with no escort or problem but donny youth mob yes I agree 70 plus is stopped straight away and sent back? Donny police are a bunch of fkg jobsworths and are shite at there job.
-
I’d love to hear the reason why Rotherham fans can casually go to donny market areas with no escort or problem but donny youth mob yes I agree 70 plus is stopped straight away and sent back? Donny police are a bunch of fkg jobsworths and are shite at there job.
I suppose you think that Donny police should have indiscriminately chucked dispersal orders about left, right and centre too in order to have made you think they were doing their job properly then.
-
There has to be legal recourse to this for fans with tickets. Appalling.
-
Tell me one fan fan who got one then???? Either side???
-
Think the problem is Rotherham is such a poxy little place the town centre just can't accommodate big numbers. The police were useless letting Rotherham fans up above us spit on us while hitting my mate with a baton who is registered disabled.
-
South Yorkshire police are terrible at everything
-
Disgraceful policing today.
All the focus was on the Donny fans with Rotherham fans left to do largely as they like.
Why on earth were all the police on the lower level leaving the ground looking for Donny fans to breathe out of turn while the Rotherham fans above us were not policed and free to hurl abuse and spit at us.
-
Going to be very difficult for South Yorkshire Police to take the mantle for Worst Derby Day Policing from reigning heavyweight champions 'Humberside' Police.
-
Not just me who was spat on then disgusting
-
The underpant gang.
-
To be fair, this is rapidly becoming a SY Police tactic when policing derby games. They did the same thing to large numbers of Scunthorpe fans when we played them at the Keepmoat just prior to Christmas.
On that occasion we couldn't get any Scunthorpe fans to allow us to pursue legal action on their behalf, I'm hoping that there will be some DRFC fans who won't mind being the subject of a legal case. Whilst ever football supporters allow this to happen it will continue.
The cynic in me would suggest that SY Police are using this as an argument to pursue financial gain from SY football clubs.
-
I got spit on and my elder father was punched and I got a head but on he way to the car !
-
Disgraceful policing today.
All the focus was on the Donny fans with Rotherham fans left to do largely as they like.
Why on earth were all the police on the lower level leaving the ground looking for Donny fans to breathe out of turn while the Rotherham fans above us were not policed and free to hurl abuse and spit at us.
... and whose bright idea was Parking the Coaches there thus making the road even narrower - and most people having to clamber over a wall due to being "pushed off the road"
-
Not just me who was spat on then disgusting
There was a bottle thrown down onto us at one point as we left the ground, near where the coaches were parked.
-
Rotherham fans hurling abuse down at the Rovers fans walking on the lower path. Cops in riot gear walking with the Rovers fans said precisely nothing at all.
SY police overtime bill?
-
Rotherham fans hurling abuse down at the Rovers fans walking on the lower path. Cops in riot gear walking with the Rovers fans said precisely nothing at all.
SY police overtime bill?
What a legend protecting his fans, probs why he had to be subbed before the whistle.
-
Lol
-
I was absolutely gutted to be sent home yesterday and was going to complain to syp police today but might send them a thank you letter now instead after a collapse like that 😂
-
donny youth mob
That probably gives the game away tbh. You turn up, wearing all the clobber, at 9am, calling yourself a “mob” and you are playing into the Police’s hands. They monitor social media in advance of fixtures like this you know?
It would appear that brighter, more savvy, elements of Rover’s support, turned up early and avoided the SYP dragnet. It’s not hard and often involves nothing more scientific than choosing a different pub to the Hoi Polloi.
-
All the above is the very reason I decided not to go.
-
Was a bit hairy at the end, starting in the stadium when their fan ran in front goading. Loads of our chavs went piling down the steps with no regard for anyone else, including a mum and her young daughter who were in the way when trying to make an orderly exit. Had she have not been pulled to safety, the idiots would have just trodden over the top of her and her daughter.
Then outside, you could see it coming. Some banter but also over the top abuse from a few fans on both sides leads to the inevitable when a minority lose perspective and their heads. There's always innocent bystanders getting caught up in it.
I can understand why folk are put off going although when you go to away games, you accept there's some risk and thankfully most will minimise the risk by behaving respectfully.
A minority won't.
The exit from the stadium is nearly as bad as death alley at Millmoor.
-
The egress from the away end at Rotherham is built for trouble, they've shoe horned a stadium into a site without adequate infrustructure to serve the stadium
-
donny youth mob
That probably gives the game away tbh. You turn up, wearing all the clobber, at 9am, calling yourself a “mob” and you are playing into the Police’s hands. They monitor social media in advance of fixtures like this you know?
It would appear that brighter, more savvy, elements of Rover’s support, turned up early and avoided the SYP dragnet. It’s not hard and often involves nothing more scientific than choosing a different pub to the Hoi Polloi.
Like Wetherspoons. Bouncer " Are you home fans" to me and mate
Me "Home Fans for what - Football ?"
Bouncer "Yes"
Me "No sorry - Beer Fan only"
Bouncer "OK Mate in you go"
Place packed with Millers Fans - no trouble. My mate even drank "Mighty Millers" Bitter from Chantry which was better than most of the rest of the day !
-
The egress from the away end at Rotherham is built for trouble, they've shoe horned a stadium into a site without adequate infrustructure to serve the stadium
It will be adequate for most games they play and perhaps not even deployed v Shrewsbury Bury et al
However you are right - its inadeaquate when they do use it. Everything about it is worng except the "idea" of segregation.
Ideally the away fans should go Anti Clockwise leaving "them" the reat of the exits. It matters little cos after being abused from above (that would vanish) and herded through a gap too narrow for the Crown (that would vanish) - we ended up within 2 minutes running into "them" coming to get their Cars just by the Station AND at the Station it was a scrum of opposing Fans anyway
Bizarre