Viking Supporters Co-operative
Viking Chat => Viking Chat => Topic started by: Campsall rover on October 21, 2018, 09:39:50 am
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What I can’t figure out is why our average gates are lower this season than last. It doesn’t make any sense.
Does any one know how many season tickets we have sold this season in comparison to last.
What do we need to do to wake up the Doncaster public.
Barnsley are averaging 4,500 more than us.
Population of DMBC 305,000
.. BMBC 234,000
Yes I know they have been in the Premier league and yes I know there is nothing else to do in Barnsley on a Saturday afternoon or at any other time in all probability.
But a 4,500 difference in ave gates. Something is wrong
WAKE UP DONCASTER we have a team worth watching.
GET OFF YOUR BACKSIDES and GET DOWN TO THE KEEPMOAT.
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Too many floating fans with Leeds sympathies in Doncaster, and Leeds are doing at least as well as us in a league above. We need Leeds to hit a slump (they usually do!)
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Let's hope some of the kids with the free tickets enjoyed the game and start coming more often
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I think dingles season tickets are cheaper than ours
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The numbers mean nowt nowadays all inflated or treated differently. I would say visually it seems more full.
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Too many Doncaster folk quick to to slag their own town off, I hear it on a daily basis in my job
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What I can’t figure out is why our average gates are lower this season than last. It doesn’t make any sense.
Does any one know how many season tickets we have sold this season in comparison to last.
What do we need to do to wake up the Doncaster public.
Barnsley are averaging 4,500 more than us.
Population of DMBC 305,000
.. BMBC 234,000
Yes I know they have been in the Premier league and yes I know there is nothing else to do in Barnsley on a Saturday afternoon or at any other time in all probability.
But a 4,500 difference in ave gates. Something is wrong
WAKE UP DONCASTER we have a team worth watching.
GET OFF YOUR BACKSIDES and GET DOWN TO THE KEEPMOAT.
It’s not just Leeds I found a Young lads driving license yesterday outside the valley, the address on it says Skellow Doncaster.
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Dingle, you have got to make an exception in that case, he was dropped on his head when a bairn in arms.
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Or his family moved their caravan from Barnsley to Skellow
Out of interest who have Barnsley played at home
I think they do have a bigger fan base but 4500 difference seems high
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Oxford, Wimbledon, Gillingham, Walsall, Plymouth, Luton.
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Two games a week does not help, and the attractive one seems to be the midweek game on a regular basis.
Plus they now clash with European matches televised.
Just another thing the football authorities get wrong, why could we play home away as the norm in the past and not now, they are like the police nowadays, they have a job they don't want to do if it gets hard.
In one recent season we went nearly a month without a home fixture, the budgeting must have been horrendous, and no need for it, just a little thought, which does not seem to be that common nowadays.
But the biggest difference to last season is starting the season with a good cup run to get some interest from the part timers,and have we still got the ticket outlets in town for games we gave publicity to as I remember last season.
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Is the 10th Nov, fa cup round one ?
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Our opponents haven't brought many this season yet, that must be a factor. Wycombe, Gillingham, Shrewsbury in midweek, Luton, Portsmouth. These are all a long old trek and some aren't that well supported to begin with. Fleetwood hardly got any fans either.
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Plus the fact a family ticket at Barnsley gets half the population in.
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Plus the fact a family ticket at Barnsley gets half the population in.
Hey I think you’ve solved it. Only Joking Dingle. One thing I will say given you are massive rivals, is that Barnsley fans are much more hospitable ( if that’s the right word ) than Rotherham ones.
Generalising of course. But much more of a friendly rivalry whereas at Rotherham last season it felt as if we were at war.
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Brainwashed public who are fans of premier league teams that they are spoon fed from motd and other media outlets
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Brainwashed public who are fans of premier league teams that they are spoon fed from motd and other media outlets
Agreed but the question also was why are Barnsley getting ave gates of 4,500 MORE THAN US.
They have just been relegated as well.
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There’s nothing to promote games, or incentives, the marketing department are a shambles, last season gates were given as 8k etc but it was clear there was nearer 6k and other posters agreed, it’s odd but a shake up in the marketing department needs doing...
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Barnsley have kept most of last season's Championship side together, so why wouldn't they want to come and watch them?
At the same time, we were a mid-table 'ish L1 side last season and subsequently lost our manager and didn't make any earth shattering signings. 2 of our loans have turned out to be great, but the missing few need to come back and see for themselves before making longer term commitments. It's all about convincing people (again) to make the initial effort.
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Don't think last season helped with the floating fans but the entertainment we're seeing now should bring some back and more you'd think. Maybe theres something in it that Barnsley were expected to have a really good season and we the opposite after the last manager making it seem that way
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There’s nothing to promote games, or incentives, the marketing department are a shambles, last season gates were given as 8k etc but it was clear there was nearer 6k and other posters agreed, it’s odd but a shake up in the marketing department needs doing...
... but to be fair yesterday there were Loads of Kids there with their School being given Tickets to let them in free with a paying adult AND it was also WATG (Women at the Game) promotion.
I noticed both of those on Facebook Twitter and on Official Site this week so they (The Club / Marketing Team) certainly got their message through to me - although I was not involved in either - I noticed !
The Kids offer looked to be well received from where I was sat in the West - and I presume the Ladies one was well patronised so praise to the Club for both
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Don't think last season helped with the floating fans but the entertainment we're seeing now should bring some back and more you'd think. Maybe theres something in it that Barnsley were expected to have a really good season and we the opposite after the last manager making it seem that way
Yes we were not expected by many to be a promotion contender but although it is still early days we are now in late October and we haven’t been out of the top 6
So the question is When are these ‘floating’ fans going to turn up.
And yes as someone from a sales background I do think the marketing dept need to do more.
How many listeners do Trax FM and Sine FM have? Those stations represent the Doncaster catchment and maybe that’s one avenue that needs exploring further.
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Last season Virgin bought 1500 season tickets I believe. That artificially inflated the attendances.
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I also heard the same as gazlaz . Take 1500 from last season's be around the same this season .
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raggy tash ...have you visited the Doncaster Foundation site .It paints a very different picture of the club's Marketing to the one you describe in this thread.
Envoyé de mon EVA-L09 en utilisant Tapatalk
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Last season Virgin bought 1500 season tickets I believe. That artificially inflated the attendances.
No they didn't. That was just a stupid rumour.
ST sales are higher this year than last.
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What about 'attendances' though, SM?
Genuine query as I havn't a scooby, but my gut feel is that they seem slightly lower.
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To be fair if you drove or walked around Doncaster you wouldn’t even know there was a football club, there’s no identity at all.... they should do a massive push or promotion.... people won’t just turn up
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So far our official ave is 7,300 ish
Last season over all 23 league games around 8,100.
So it seems very odd that we can be doing so much better both in the quality of the football being served up and the league position we have occupied since the start of the season and lose 7/800 fans.
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Last season Virgin bought 1500 season tickets I believe. That artificially inflated the attendances.
No they didn't. That was just a stupid rumour.
ST sales are higher this year than last.
Well something was fishy last season then. Attendances were definitely announced higher than they were. And it can’t have been season ticket holders not turning up either. I’ve been in that stadium so many times I can tell the attendance by just looking around and estimating the empty seats in every block.
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SM. Do they count season ticket holders in attendance even if they don't turn up?
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So far our official ave is 7,300 ish
Last season over all 23 league games around 8,100.
So it seems very odd that we can be doing so much better both in the quality of the football being served up and the league position we have occupied since the start of the season and lose 7/800 fans.
7346 I make it including away Fans
6707 Av when you "ignore" the Away Fans
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There’s a good word for the rovers fans, it’s called “apathetic” and I’ve no idea why.
We’ve been collecting for the foodbanks for nearly year now, I’ve been there at the same place at every collection and people blank us and walk on by.
We do have the regular reliable generous donors that stop by for a chat with a smile and their carrier bags of goodies and it’s wrong to expect them to keep giving at every game.
One fella asked me how much do I get paid from the club to stand there, I was quite flabbergasted by that question.
If we are an embarrassment for the supporters then just let us know, the foodbank collection points will soon be a part of the fans experience at every ground, other fans are enthusiastic to help at their grounds but somehow, the rovers fans are “apathetic”
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Have you considered that some of the people who blank you and walk on by may be a bit strapped for cash themselves and not in a position to be able to make donations to you.
Perhaps they could be embarrassed about that and therefore don’t want to engage in conversation with you.
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We had this same debate not long ago. Barnsley have a better historical football league record than we do and relatively speaking, perhaps they have a closer knit community. Cue the six fingered jokes!
Doesn't bother me, I don't think the club can do much more to magic another 1000 fans every week. But come Tuesday, you can bank on extra numbers turning up which shows there's still some potential from existing occasional fans!
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I know the Keepmoat has been full a few times in the past but in hindsight it might have been better for us to have had a smaller stadium so it didn't feel so empty. The amount of it that has been closed off, and the distance of the average set of away fans from home fans isn't conducive to a decent atmosphere.
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I think it is a great idea - very commendable - to collect Food to distribute to those less fortunate than the average Rovers Fan
Practically though I find it easier to chuck a few quid in now and again than to lug a load of Cans etc from where I park AND by giving money it means (I hope) that you and SM can buy a balanced "basket" of what is needed rather than loads of people turning up all with the same stuff.
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Drfchound, yes, I certainly appreciate that some rovers fans are strapped for cash and I also appreciate what people like Donnywolf does too.
But considering the amount of supporters that attend then I am disappointed by the amount that we collect in comparison with other fans for foodbanks.
We attended the national conference fans for foodbanks at Liverpool last Friday and we heard of lots of good inspirational stories of what other clubs fans are doing, hence the reason I quoted “apathetic”
Apologies about my rant.
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Drfchound, yes, I certainly appreciate that some rovers fans are strapped for cash and I also appreciate what people like Donnywolf does too.
But considering the amount of supporters that attend then I am disappointed by the amount that we collect in comparison with other fans for foodbanks.
We attended the national conference fans for foodbanks at Liverpool last Friday and we heard of lots of good inspirational stories of what other clubs fans are doing, hence the reason I quoted “apathetic”
Apologies about my rant.
Is there anything in the "inspirational stories" that you can share / advertise that might encourage more "awareness - giving" ?
You will remember I "sold" my Season Ticket Scarf / Poster to a fellow VSC Member for £10. I did not want it but the other guy did - so I handed it over to the Foodbank who took a donation of a Tenner and the bloke got the Scarf etc
I reckon other people must have stuff they dont want which they could donate - and there will be many potential Customers wanting to buy some of the stuff that is donated.
I realise that involves a bit more than just standing collecting - and there may be issues given the Club Shop will still want to sell Scarves Shirts and other similar stuff but perhaps you can ask for extra hands ?
Just thoughts and may be crap / unworkable ?
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What about 'attendances' though, SM?
Genuine query as I havn't a scooby, but my gut feel is that they seem slightly lower.
I don't have the information on attendances (I can ask though). ST sales have been a topic at Supporter Board meetings though and the reports so far are that the club have met their targets as part of the budget for this season.
I thought it was common knowledge that football clubs report on ticket sales rather than actual attendance? That's certainly the case at the Keepmoat which is what confuses.
Here's an article published recently about this very subject;
http://www.fsf.org.uk/latest-news/view/bbc-research-casts-doubt-over-reported-attendances
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The point about the stadium size is probably right. We only really needed 12,000. Could have had a better design then as well with the money saved. Can’t change it though so the club need to continue to work hard to build the fan base
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Have you considered that some of the people who blank you and walk on by may be a bit strapped for cash themselves and not in a position to be able to make donations to you.
Perhaps they could be embarrassed about that and therefore don’t want to engage in conversation with you.
I'm sure a 30p tin of beans every now and then isn't going to break the bank.
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Have you considered that some of the people who blank you and walk on by may be a bit strapped for cash themselves and not in a position to be able to make donations to you.
Perhaps they could be embarrassed about that and therefore don’t want to engage in conversation with you.
I'm sure a 30p tin of beans every now and then isn't going to break the bank.
Why not spread the cost and get HP?
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Interesting article, SM, and it does, at least show one thing, that of the Clubs sampled, the vast majority over estimate their figures. So there is some consistency there.
I can understand season ticket holders seats being empty, but still 'counted' as said sth has already effectively paid for that seat for every home league game.
The thing that's really puzzling me is the fact that despite us (generally) putting on better home displays so far this season, we still appear to be missing about 1,000'ish supporters. I know we had the manager upheaval in the summer, but by now, I would have thought there would have been a slow upturn in attendances!
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To be fair if you drove or walked around Doncaster you wouldn’t even know there was a football club, there’s no identity at all.... they should do a massive push or promotion.... people won’t just turn up
There are hundreds out there who have been to matches before. They know full well where the ground is and how to get a ticket should they wish to.
Rovers fans are no more, no less apathetic than any other football clubs.
Barnsley are better supported than we are. Simple as.
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Well said DBR.!
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I think it's seen as acceptable to support another club.
I think as fans we needs to ridicule and embarrass fans of other clubs, into supporting rovers.
Having said that, the marketing and branding by the club is dire and has been for years
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To be fair if you drove or walked around Doncaster you wouldn’t even know there was a football club, there’s no identity at all.... they should do a massive push or promotion.... people won’t just turn up
There are hundreds out there who have been to matches before. They know full well where the ground is and how to get a ticket should they wish to.
Rovers fans are no more, no less apathetic than any other football clubs.
Barnsley are better supported than we are. Simple as.
Sorry can’t accept that. Yes they always have been better supported but not to the tune of 4,500 when both clubs are at the same level and doing equally as well as each other. If you check history you would expect there to be 1,500 difference MAX
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Yes I think they are more apathetic in Doncaster than most towns.
Yes I know there is a history problem especially in the 60’s when huge numbers started following Leeds offspring have followed on.
But the fact is Doncaster MBC is a big population 305,000
Bigger than Wolverhampton, Middlesbrough, Blackburn, Huddersfield,
Norwich, Ipswich and I could go on & on.
I have friends who think I am obsessed with attendances but I find it a source of huge disappointment that we are not better supported.
If we are in the Championship we should be filling the Moat on a fairly regular basis. As we are it should not be asking too much for 8,500 to 9,000 home fans to be turning up.
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Yes before someone says it I know both Norwich and Ipswich have huge catchment areas.
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Look at the true population of those towns ( not the whole district MB) and you will see that most have larger populations town for town.
lovemytown.co.uk/Populations/TownsTable1.asp
Ok its 2011 census but Doncaster has not doubled (or more) in population since then.
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The point about the stadium size is probably right. We only really needed 12,000. Could have had a better design then as well with the money saved. Can’t change it though so the club need to continue to work hard to build the fan base
The stadium don't forget has been able to stage other events due to it's size which is good for additional income.
It also gives us the flexibility for ebb and flow, including large away followings which is also good for income.
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Be better if like most modern grounds you were closer to the pitch
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I know many different people (mainly from my age group) who can no longer go or be as regular as they once were for a variety of different reasons and it's mainly due to lifestyle changes, family commitments, funding kids university places, work, no work etc but certainly things that are not unique to DRFC.
Sometimes, it's a breakdown in the groups, families, mates etc where folk won't go on their own.
Once out of the habit, it's difficult to tip the balance the other way. Good news is that I've got 4 extra going tomorrow and who knows, they may become more frequent.
The future alss, is probably not from my age spectrum but from the younger element.
Taking all those things into account there isn't a one size fits all solution. I'm sure if there's a magic wand that could be waved then the club would snap your hand off.
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Look at the true population of those towns ( not the whole district MB) and you will see that most have larger populations town for town.
lovemytown.co.uk/Populations/TownsTable1.asp
Ok its 2011 census but Doncaster has not doubled (or more) in population since then.
So what are you saying then? Bawtry, Conisborough, Askern area and Thorne are not part of Doncaster.
Doncaster is well spread Geographically.
What is Doncaster then, are you saying Armthorpe, Bentley, and Sprotborugh are not part of Doncaster.
The make up of Doncaster is a considerable number of Villages and some small towns.
It is very different to somewhere like Norwich.
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Have you considered that some of the people who blank you and walk on by may be a bit strapped for cash themselves and not in a position to be able to make donations to you.
Perhaps they could be embarrassed about that and therefore don’t want to engage in conversation with you.
I'm sure a 30p tin of beans every now and then isn't going to break the bank.
Yep, I am sure you are right.
However, I bet that thousands of the people who sit through the children in need show every year don’t ring in with a donation, even though they could probably afford to.
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Look at the true population of those towns ( not the whole district MB) and you will see that most have larger populations town for town.
lovemytown.co.uk/Populations/TownsTable1.asp
Ok its 2011 census but Doncaster has not doubled (or more) in population since then.
So what are you saying then? Bawtry, Conisborough, Askern area and Thorne are not part of Doncaster.
Doncaster is well spread Geographically.
What is Doncaster then, are you saying Armthorpe, Bentley, and Sprotborugh are not part of Doncaster.
The make up of Doncaster is a considerable number of Villages and some small towns.
It is very different to somewhere like Norwich.
What I am saying is you can't compare the respective "Town populations" with "Borough populations" which is what you implied quoting Wolverhampton etc. Yes Doncaster has a large "Borough population" but folk from villages don't necessarily form an affinity with DRFC. I lived many years in an area of Doncaster, it seemed to me that vey few actually supported DRFC from that area ( 1 knew of less than 10 regulars), in fact, even though I now live outside DMB ( still a Donny postcode though) there are as many folk here who watch DRFC on a regular basis.
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I've supported the Rovers all my life but never lived in Doncaster or it's borough so as an outsider looking in the one thing I can say is that Doncaster folk appear to have little love for Doncaster. I hear it time and again and if you have little love of where you live that will transfer itself to everything in the place such as supporting the local football team. I'm sure to be shot down in flames now but it's an observation and a probable reason. We need the folk of Donny to take pride in and start to love the place they live.
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11/12 years ago I was in a group of 4 ST holders, now there’s only me getting to 11/12 games a year..
The difference is changing family circumstances.. it happens..
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I've supported the Rovers all my life but never lived in Doncaster or it's borough so as an outsider looking in the one thing I can say is that Doncaster folk appear to have little love for Doncaster. I hear it time and again and if you have little love of where you live that will transfer itself to everything in the place such as supporting the local football team. I'm sure to be shot down in flames now but it's an observation and a probable reason. We need the folk of Donny to take pride in and start to love the place they live.
Agreed. The amount of my friends that thought it was a shit hole and couldn't get away fast enough when we finished school was kind of upsetting, I like it here. It's got its shit hole areas like Bentley and I wouldn't want to be caught out in Balby after dark without protection but it's no worse than any other northern town.
I mean, f**king Oldham, now THERE's a depressing little shit hole that'll suck the life out of you. Yet they don't hate their town the way we seem to.
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Most of the lads I was friends with left aswell, as did I though I came back a few years ago.
I still to this day am yet to get a job in Doncaster but have worked everywhere else in bloody Yorkshire. That is a problem, there aren't that many decent jobs in some industries.
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Where do you live RedJ?
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Anyone know how many tickets are available for home fans nowadays at the keepmoat
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Where do you live RedJ?
:laugh: was waiting for you to bite at that ;)
I grew up in Moorends but after the mines were closed and it turned into basically the drug capital of the world. Wouldn't change where I grew up though, had its nice bits and had some nice people. And the best Chinese in the area. :laugh:
Live in Wheatley these days via Huddersfield and Scotland.
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Where do you live RedJ?
Obviously somewhere much better than Bentley.... The Helmand Province.
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Where do you live RedJ?
:laugh: was waiting for you to bite at that ;)
I grew up in Moorends but after the mines were closed and it turned into basically the drug capital of the world. Wouldn't change where I grew up though, had its nice bits and had some nice people. And the best Chinese in the area. :laugh:
Live in Wheatley these days via Huddersfield and Scotland.
Moorends and nice bits, just don’t go together 😂😂😂😂😂
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Bentley is better than it used to be in the days when the Don was a river of shit - A polluted stretch of water separating the North of Doncaster from the South.
Bentley folk may have been a bit rough back then, but it was the Southside that had diving boards.
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Most of the lads I was friends with left aswell, as did I though I came back a few years ago.
I still to this day am yet to get a job in Doncaster but have worked everywhere else in bloody Yorkshire. That is a problem, there aren't that many decent jobs in some industries.
Aye, I have trouble finding finance positions in Doncaster as I'm currently looking to move on, f**king shite loads of them in Leeds but I really don't want to have to f**k about travelling every day.
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Last season's attendance figures do need explaining, doesn't make sense from what appeared to be in the ground as well as how figures have changed over the years.
The important thing is not what Barnsley or Leeds are doing, but how we are progressing as a club.
If we ignore last season, then you can see this season's figures aren't too bad so far and will look a lot better after tonight. Our recent tier 3 figures are:
Season - Ave Att - Proportion of league average (for some context)
2018/19 - 7,347 - 0.89
2017/18 - 8,213 - 1.05
2015/16 - 6,500 - 0.92
2014/15 - 6,884 - 0.98
2012/13 - 7,239 - 0.89
2007/08 - 7,978 - 1.00
2006/07 - 7,746 - 1.03
2005/06 - 6,167 - 0.81
2004/05 - 6,886 - 0.89
1987/88 - 1,893 - 0.44
1986/87 - 2,402 - 0.53
1985/86 - 2,822 - 0.58
1984/85 - 4,147 - 0.83
1982/83 - 3,517 - 0.69
1981/82 - 5,232 - 0.80