Viking Supporters Co-operative
Viking Chat => Off Topic => Topic started by: glosterred on August 25, 2019, 04:30:34 pm
-
Wow just WOW
stand up Sir Ben
-
I haven't felt like this after a test match since 1981!
-
That was sport at its most gripping.
-
Best innings from an English test batsmen ever, imo. Stokes, what a genius with a bat!
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
-
Not sure it beats Botham in 81 to be honest.
-
Not sure it beats Botham in 81 to be honest.
That is a fair point, I’ll rephrase to best this century!
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
-
Not sure it beats Botham in 81 to be honest.
I don't think Botham's was under as much pressure or had as much riding on it. It still needed the real matchwinner - Bob Willis - to perform his heroics.
-
I was supposed to pick my son up at the Keepmoat after a footy tournament.
Left him waiting for an hour. Couldn't tek me eyes off it.
Absolutely amazing stuff.
Thank God that useless Trevor Kettle like umpire dint give him out near the end.
-
Botham had just failed as Captain and was being ridiculed in the country. In those circumstances, his innings was utterly magnificent.
Not to take anything away from Stokes mind.
-
Aye, but Botham didn't win the match, he just stopped England from losing it as quickly by getting the total the Aussies needed to win to 130.
Willis won the match.
-
I wasn’t born in 1981 so can’t really compare, but surely this innings must run Botham’s close?
It was a masterclass. Defensive at first but well paced and ultimately spectacular when needed. The pressure was enormous - when Leach arrived at the crease 75 were still needed. Leach did a terrific job but it was all on Stokes’ shoulders. Not only was the innings needed to save the match, it was needed to save the Ashes. I don’t think it’s hyperbole to say I’ve never seen a better innings.
All that in itself is remarkable, but this came off the back of a tremendous effort with the ball. Stokes isn’t generally a bowler who bowls long spells, but when the game was drifting away from England on Friday night he demanded the ball and bowled something like 9 overs in a row, and followed it up with another 9 unchanged on Saturday morning. I was there (picked the wrong day!) and he was charging in like a man possessed, consistently at around 85 miles an hour. A phenomenal all round effort physically, mentally and technically.
-
On reflection, given the context of Stokes's innings, where every shot could have meant the loss of the Ashes, I think this probably does just top Botham's.
Botham's was a more destructive, sustained aggressive attack, but Stokes' was probably a better-judged innings.
-
Flipping again.
Stokes was building on a relatively strong foundation in the rest of the innings. He only took full control when the tail collapsed.
Botham came into bat for a side that was about to be defeated by an innings and he turned the game on its head.
A privilege to have seen both any road.
-
That was up there with the best i have ever seen and i was at Headingley in 81.
Said to someone at the Rovers match yesterday i will give you 1000-1 on England winning.
Pleased he didn’t take me up on it !!!
Just shows nothing is impossible in sport and records are there to be broken.
Take a bow Ben Stokes that was magnificent under that pressure with so much at stake on the result.
-
Flipping again.
Stokes was building on a relatively strong foundation in the rest of the innings. He only took full control when the tail collapsed.
Botham came into bat for a side that was about to be defeated by an innings and he turned the game on its head.
A privilege to have seen both any road.
We had a similar debate in the club earlier on the merits of both innings. I'm just Stokes although I remember the 81 innings of Botham well. I think the latter was more of a nothing to lose, I'm just going to swing from the hip. Stokes played with real control to get a last wicket partnership of 73 where Leach finished 1 not out, shows how well he marshalled the strike.
I've just seen the innings again and I' d forgotten about the missed run opportunity with Leach out and the catch that didn't quite carry into the deep. Brilliant that the Aussies wasted a review that was clearly pitching outside leg, which had they not they would have won the game.
It was, as BST said, sport at its best.
-
We all thought the World Cup final couldn't be bettered in terms of drama, and then we got that today.
I always thought Botham was the best England all rounder I'd ever seen, but this kid takes the biscuit. Absolutely incredible.
I went to both the Headingly and Old Trafford tests in 81; how I wish I'd been there today.
-
77 to win with 1 wicket left. To let Leach only face 19 balls was amazing. Best match winning innings I've ever seen
-
77 to win with 1 wicket left. To let Leach only face 19 balls was amazing. Best match winning innings I've ever seen
73 but what’s 4 runs between friends. :thumbsup:
-
Think leachs contribution can’t be ignored either as a pair they were fantastic thought we had thrown it away long before they took a stand
-
Amen to all of the above - and anyone also feel two faced after presumablty slagging England off for that 67 (in the same Match). Yep me too
However that was simply a magnificent Innings from Stokes - every single ball could have seen him gone but he had the control and in certain cases luck - he farmed the bowling well and "took it to them"
The pundits said it was the greatest innings in Test Cricket and I will go with them. BST was agonising whether this beat Botham in 81 and I think it did because of the context (that 67 for one)
Like Tommy toes I was rivetted watching - and I like to thank the Umpire AND the Aussies themselves for the desperation in using their last appeal
Oh JOY to the power of a billion - and a bit more as well !
-
Specsavers have offered Leach free glasses for life. :laugh:
What a man Ben Stokes is. Amazing stuff. Boring sport though, eh? :silly:
-
Just watched the highlights again and it was full of incidents - and the Aussies had chances that they normally take routinely - which we always expect them to do routinely
Bob Willis says on The Debate that this is better than 81 and Willis says Beefy was eclipsed by Stokes so thats good enough for me
I also have never cheered a single as much before - when Leach turned it round the corner for his 1 I exploded because it meant we COULDNT lose
What make this so great is that at any time - the 2 dropped catches - the early LBW - the LBW when they had no reviews left - and the missed Run out by Lyon - the 6s that just made it over the fielders - ALL ALL of them could have left us saying :
oh god how close did we come - gallant failure - brilliant effort - shouldnt have got just 67 etc etc BUT none of the above happened and WE GOT OVER THE LINE - in the best sporting "thing" I have experienced EVER.
FULL STOP !
-
Saw this and they made me smile
-
And this
-
I bought a ticket for my old man (and me) in the Emerald stand yesterday. I actually bought it last year as his Christmas gift... I watched the progress at the Keepmoat on Saturday and was preparing to cancel the day if things went badly wrong or we were 6 or 7 down at the end of the 3rd day. I'm so glad we didn't and it is something that I (and my eighty year old Dad) shall never forget.... :thumbsup:
In fact, I am thinking of getting my Dad tickets for the Old Trafford game as he seems to something of a lucky charm. The last match I took him to was in June 2018 when England played the Aussies in a one dayer at Trent Bridge. During that game England scored a world record 481-6 and recorded a 242-run victory.....
My only issue with yesterday was that some pricks in the upper tier decided to soak a bunch of Aussies (in the lower tier) in beer when the winning runs were scored...... sometimes people let themselves (and their county) down... :thumbdown:
-
Its moments like yesterday and our day in the sun at Brentford why we all watch sport.
-
Saw this and they made me smile
Should have gone to Specsavers - but glad he didnt !
-
My only issue with yesterday was that some pricks in the upper tier decided to soak a bunch of Aussies (in the lower tier) in beer when the winning runs were scored...... sometimes people let themselves (and their county) down... :thumbdown:
As usual a mindless minority spoil it for the others. What ever happened to magnanimous in victory
Freddie Flintoff with Brett Lee ? Yesterday the Aussies to a man went to Stokes and Leach and despite their "humiliation" as it will be seen by their Fans and congratulated them
Most Aussies will be pig sick - and that is good enough for me - and it doesnt didnt need the beer slinging over their Fans. Good humoured banter would have been better "Like 67 and you f*****d it up"
-
Looking at the pictures of the Western Terrace area as Stokes hit the winning run, there are a lot of English fans getting a drenching in beer as well
-
My only issue with yesterday was that some pricks in the upper tier decided to soak a bunch of Aussies (in the lower tier) in beer when the winning runs were scored...... sometimes people let themselves (and their county) down... :thumbdown:
As usual a mindless minority spoil it for the others. What ever happened to magnanimous in victory
Freddie Flintoff with Brett Lee ? Yesterday the Aussies to a man went to Stokes and Leach and despite their "humiliation" as it will be seen by their Fans and congratulated them
Most Aussies will be pig sick - and that is good enough for me - and it doesnt didnt need the beer slinging over their Fans. Good humoured banter would have been better "Like 67 and you f*****d it up"
Totally agree - I made a point of shaking every Aussies hand that I could and took the time to speak to them and gee them up for the up-coming games.....
Trouble is, you can't teach pork........... etc etc
-
Looking at the pictures of the Western Terrace area as Stokes hit the winning run, there are a lot of English fans getting a drenching in beer as well
Agreed - there seems to be this mentality that the best way to celebrate is to chuck your beer in the air...... now I'm from Yorkshire, and I ain't wasting a pint for nobody..... :huh:
The Aussie's that I mentioned were targeted - it wasn't an accident.... :thumbdown:
-
Got to give the Aussies credit in the way they congratulated Stokes at the end
-
That is how sport should be. A hard fought game and mutual respect at the end.
-
I've been getting grief about this...Me and my mates always have a day out at the cricket every year for test matches..Back in September when we were planning this years.Day 4 at Leeds was the favourite..Until I said that we've been to Ashes cricket before and this year might be our only chance to see World Cup cricket instead..So we plumped for a group game instead...
It was a great day out that everybody loved.However it didn't take anyone long to give me grief after a day like that...
-
I was climbing Scaffel Pike all day Sunday so I was without coverage for most of the day. Saw we needed 80 with 4 wickets or so remaining, got giddy but didn't see anything for a short while. Came back & saw 50 remaining with 1 wicket left, saw Stokes was in so knew there'd be half a chance. On my way back down from the summit saw a notification of Stokes winning it for us.
Think I would have been heard from Ben Nevis when I saw the score.
Got tickets for the Sunday at Old Trafford so i'm looking forward to that!
-
Seems the Aussies can’t take it, Fatty Warne is upset as Matt Prior and Chris Adams have taken the Micky out of Lyons for his fumble. Must be thin skinned these Aussies
-
I hate the Stump mike with a passion.
Paine is literally a pain shouting well done Gaz - ooh nice one Gazza - youve got him mate etc - when the ball was clearly not troubling anybody BUT I would have loved to have had a listen when the GOAT missed that extremely easy looking Run out.
Come on England - finish the job
-
Seems the Aussies can’t take it, Fatty Warne is upset as Matt Prior and Chris Adams have taken the Micky out of Lyons for his fumble. Must be thin skinned these Aussies
Can’t really understand Warne’s criticisms. Their players were dignified after the result, but it’s not like our current players are dishing it out (at least as far as I’m aware) and he’s conveniently forgetting about players from his generation (or just after) talking about breaking arms, ending careers and mocking mental illness. The fact that one of their biggest wind up merchants was at fault means they were always going to get some back.
Now the dust is settling it’ll be interesting to see how we approach the game next week. Roy, Buttler & Woakes must seriously be under threat but I could see Roy and Buttler getting another chance (unfairly in my eyes, I’d hope that Stokes’ heroics don’t gloss over the fact that there are weaknesses that need addressing).
-
Never could there be a better, more emphatic response to Josh Hazelwood's sneering remark after he bowled the ball that smashed Stokes' helmet. I love it, just love it!!!
-
Ashes are gone. We need to sort out our batting it is very brittle.
Ballance back in for Jason Roy. Just simply no question which one is a better long form of the game player.
My Oval team:
1 Burns
2 Denly
3 Root C
4 Ballance
5 Bairstow ( back in at his best position as a Batsman only )
6 Stokes
7 Foakes W.K.
8 Overton/Woakes/Curren
9 Archer
10 Broad
11 Leach
If Ballance is not considered to be good enough to get into this team then it is a shambles.
I watch a lot of county cricket and if there is a better candidate at the moment then i have missed him.
Roy is not a test batsman. Jury still out on Burns and Denly but both deserved to be persevered with.
Sibley at Warwickshire is a very solid opener and i would take him on our winter tours along with Kholer-Cadmore as a back up middle order batsman. I would also take Ben Coad if Anderson isn’t fit as a back up fast bowler. But am biased of course although I do know a good player when i see one.
Touring party.
Root c
Burns
Denly
Sibley
Ballance
Kholer-Cadmore
Bairstow
Stokes
Foakes
Ali
Curran
Woakes
Archer
Broad
Anderson/Coad
Leach
Yes I have left out Butler. He is not really worth his place as a batsman only batting at no 7 and not good enough at test level to bat higher.
So bring in Foakes who is the country’s best keeper and let Jonny Bairstow concentrate on being a front line batsman. He won’t be happy with that as he is now a very good keeper but it is in his best interests and the teams imo.
-
Burns has had a good series against the best bowling attack in the world
-
Ballance isn’t good enough for test cricket and has had more than enough chances, picking him again would be a regression.
For me we need 3 changes - Roy should be dropped, Buttler has had a poor series and should be as well and I don’t see Overton as being test quality. Pope should definitely get a game, he looked a decent enough player last year, and I’d also bring in Sam Curran at his home ground. I’d also bring in Sibley and open with him - Denly has done enough I reckon to keep his place but he’s not a long term solution at opener so I’d prefer to give Sibley a go. Denly should bat at 3 and Root where he feels most comfortable, at 4.
I’d also like Root to stand down as captain - he hasn’t really impressed me or improved since he’s had the job, and his batting has really gone downhill.
-
Can't anyone see what a weak cluess captain Joe Root is -- hopeless at field placings yesterday I noticed Stokes controlled the huddle.. Their can only be one Captain and that is Stokes
years ago we had Mike Brearley who was a brilliant Test captain and a substandard test batsman and averaged about 27
on checking his test average was even worse than that
22.88 39 matches only 1442 runs
https://www.google.com/search?client=firefox-b-d&q=mile+brearleys+test+average
i can't believe the poster above has realised the same fact about Root
-
I've listened to every test on TMS and both English and Australian commentators have been openly critical of Root's captaincy.
-
Ballance isn’t good enough for test cricket and has had more than enough chances, picking him again would be a regression.
For me we need 3 changes - Roy should be dropped, Buttler has had a poor series and should be as well and I don’t see Overton as being test quality. Pope should definitely get a game, he looked a decent enough player last year, and I’d also bring in Sam Curran at his home ground. I’d also bring in Sibley and open with him - Denly has done enough I reckon to keep his place but he’s not a long term solution at opener so I’d prefer to give Sibley a go. Denly should bat at 3 and Root where he feels most comfortable, at 4.
I’d also like Root to stand down as captain - he hasn’t really impressed me or improved since he’s had the job, and his batting has really gone downhill.
Wouldn’t disagree with most of that. Except Ballance. He was the fastest player to get 1000 test runs for England ever, batting at no 5. They then moved him to no 3 where he struggled. He was shafted big time. He has improved his technique and should walk into this test team. Bat him at no 4 or 5
If Root wants to go back to 4 then he goes in no 3 where he has now been batting for Yorkshire for 2 seasons. If Burns, Sibley & Denly are first 3 then he would be first spare batsman, as Root 4, Bairstow no 5 and Stokes 6, Foakes 7.
Pope has not scored volume of runs to justify being ahead of Ballance at the moment.
I have watched County cricket in volume and GB is a class act. Sorry he was shafted by the selectors big time pushing him up to no 3 at a time when Ian Bell should have put his hand up and taken responsibility and batted no 3.
My opinion of course, but there are a heck of a lot of knowledgable cricket people who agree with me.
-
Yes i agree, don’t think Joe is a great captain.
Making our top all rounder Stokes captain could be a massive error as it may be a serious distraction to his game.
It didn’t work with Beefy or Flintoff.
Not sure who is captain material. Broad could do it on a short term basis but he is nearer to the end of his test career than the start.
A lot nearer to the end.
Long term I could see Tom Kholer-Cadmore assuming he establishes himself as a regular test player. Has the potential to imo.
He is almost certainly going to be Yorkshire’s next captain after Patto relinquishes the post, or is relieved of it.
Other than him no idea. Any suggestions anybody.
-
Ballance isn’t good enough for test cricket and has had more than enough chances, picking him again would be a regression.
For me we need 3 changes - Roy should be dropped, Buttler has had a poor series and should be as well and I don’t see Overton as being test quality. Pope should definitely get a game, he looked a decent enough player last year, and I’d also bring in Sam Curran at his home ground. I’d also bring in Sibley and open with him - Denly has done enough I reckon to keep his place but he’s not a long term solution at opener so I’d prefer to give Sibley a go. Denly should bat at 3 and Root where he feels most comfortable, at 4.
I’d also like Root to stand down as captain - he hasn’t really impressed me or improved since he’s had the job, and his batting has really gone downhill.
Wouldn’t disagree with most of that. Except Ballance. He was the fastest player to get 1000 test runs for England ever, batting at no 5. They then moved him to no 3 where he struggled. He was shafted big time. He has improved his technique and should walk into this test team. Bat him at no 4 or 5
If Root wants to go back to 4 then he goes in no 3 where he has now been batting for Yorkshire for 2 seasons. If Burns, Sibley & Denly are first 3 then he would be first spare batsman, as Root 4, Bairstow no 5 and Stokes 6, Foakes 7.
Pope has not scored volume of runs to justify being ahead of Ballance at the moment.
I have watched County cricket in volume and GB is a class act. Sorry he was shafted by the selectors big time pushing him up to no 3 at a time when Ian Bell should have put his hand up and taken responsibility and batted no 3.
My opinion of course, but there are a heck of a lot of knowledgable cricket people who agree with me.
You’re obviously a big fan of his but there’s a bit of revisionism there...Ballance made his Test debut batting at 5 (scoring only a few runs) but in his second game he moved to 3 and that’s where he scored all those runs early on. I remember being surprised how successful he was as he’d always batted down the order at 5 or 6 for Yorkshire. I’ve no idea how you come to the conclusion that he has been shafted. He’s been dropped and recalled several times over the past few years and his technique has always let him down when standing so deep in his crease - I don’t watch country cricket so will have to take your word for it that it has improved.
I just don’t see the point in recalling someone who has had several chances and never recaptured anything like his original form and would prefer us to give a chance to someone younger.
-
Got to take issue with you on where GB batted getting most of those 1000 runs. He batted at no 5 for quite some time for England.
He was clearly not a no 3 and should never have been moved there.
He bats at 3 for Yorks now but would prefer him at 4. For England 4/5 would imo suit him best. England tried to turn him into something he wasn’t. He is a natural stroke player and at 3 he was almost an opener on many occasions. His technique has improved, he is not back in his crease so much now.
It’s all about opinions Nick and as much as i disagree with you, of course i respect your opinion.
-
You’re wrong I’m afraid. Debut down under in the Ashes 2013 series, scoring only 25 runs batting at 5, followed by:
Batting at 3 vs Sri Lanka:
https://www.espncricinfo.com/series/11718/scorecard/667901/england-vs-sri-lanka-2nd-investec-test-sri-lanka-tour-of-england-and-ireland-2014
Batting at 3 vs India
http://www.espncricinfo.com/england-v-india-2014/engine/series/667693.html
Batting at 3 vs West Indies
http://www.espncricinfo.com/west-indies-v-england-2015/engine/series/766903.html
And he kept batting at 3 after that. Whether he deserves a recall now is a matter of opinion, but the fact that virtually his entire England career is at 3 is impossible to argue with. Painting him as some sort of victim who was messed about is simply not true.
-
You’re wrong I’m afraid. Debut down under in the Ashes 2013 series, scoring only 25 runs batting at 5, followed by:
Batting at 3 vs Sri Lanka:
https://www.espncricinfo.com/series/11718/scorecard/667901/england-vs-sri-lanka-2nd-investec-test-sri-lanka-tour-of-england-and-ireland-2014
Batting at 3 vs India
http://www.espncricinfo.com/england-v-india-2014/engine/series/667693.html
Batting at 3 vs West Indies
http://www.espncricinfo.com/west-indies-v-england-2015/engine/series/766903.html
And he kept batting at 3 after that. Whether he deserves a recall now is a matter of opinion, but the fact that virtually his entire England career is at 3 is impossible to argue with. Painting him as some sort of victim who was messed about is simply not true.
Well I can’t argue with facts. My memory is playing tricks.
I could have sworn he batted at 5 in nearly all those tests.
I was at the Sri Lanka test at Headingley in summer of 2014. Had 2 days there.
My apologies Nick.
Still don’t think he was given a fair crack with England. His test ave is 37.45 which ain’t bad at all.
1475 runs in 23 tests. 4 centuries and 7 fifties.
If that’s droppable then most of the present lot should be in fear of their places. That is for sure.
The point is he is a better player now than he was 5 years ago.
He is considerably a better test player than Denly, Roy, Vince, Malan, & Westley who have all played in the last 3 years. Pope is untried so is an unknown quantity.
The statistics back me up.
Who would you say is better right now and should play.
Pope, Kholer-Cadmore and one or two other younger players are the only alternative.
We need some experience in the middle order for our tour of South Africa this winter.
Gary Ballance did very well indeed last series we played there.
-
I was there yesterday. Brilliant atmosphere. Ozzies bowling attack is something impressive to witness live.
At 11AM I didn't expect us to be an hour away from a draw.
Great day out despite the result.
-
I was there yesterday. Brilliant atmosphere. Ozzies bowling attack is something impressive to witness live.
At 11AM I didn't expect us to be an hour away from a draw.
Great day out despite the result.
That's how sport should be, enjoy the day as much as possible however it ends up.