Viking Supporters Co-operative
Viking Chat => Off Topic => Topic started by: SydneyRover on November 13, 2020, 04:49:38 am
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GONE
''Boris Johnson's top aide Dominic Cummings quits''
https://www.smh.com.au/world/europe/boris-johnson-s-top-aide-dominic-cummings-quits-20201113-p56edj.html
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Should never have had the luxury of resignation. Barnard Castle should and would have done for him in any previous Government I have lived through
I wonder if that has been his ultimate undoing because there are still half the population who bring it up whenever the Students celebrate going into lockdown by having a late night gathering for instance. Those watching on (53 per cent or more I would guess) will still say something like "well if Cummings could do that" why would they not think that was wrong ?
So I just wonder if he is putting his foot down / reading the riot act etc and MP's who after all WERE elected by the people have been muttering similar things under their breath but gradually getting braver ? I dont know and I dont suppose anyone will unless someone blows the lid on it (or some of you see it surface in 30 years time via Cabinet papers)
Might be a crock of s**t as well and so wont appear anywhere but here LOL
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Personally I think things are getting a bit too uncomfortable and he is taking this opportunity to absolve himself from the UK covid disaster.
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Probably nearer to the truth - ironic given their stance on "truth" but I bet he will be rewriring blogs a la 1984 to make it LOOK like he had this exit strategy all along
Liar Johnson should have fired him post Barnard Castle but as a little boy lost he darent
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I just hope that this leads to better government from No10 they are there for another 3 years so they may as well have a go and do it properly.
Just kidding johnson doesn't know how to govern.
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Underwhelming , spinning and outright lying by the Minister of 3 names Grant Shapps / Michael Green / Sebastian Fox on Sky 233 at the moment
FFS do they THINK not one of us can think for ourselves and see right through their horse s**t
Watch it back if you can - "advisors come and go but the PM DECIDES" amongst his most laughable comments however DONT hold anything in your hand if you might throw it at your TV
Remember who this bloke is as well. Suing a Constituent for Libel and getting him to apologise for having the nerve to say Shapps had 2 jobs (against the rules for an MP then) and was pretending to be Michael Green, In the end the Constituent was proven right but is still way out of pocket years later SO dont believe anything Shapps might say (Google the story - and if you are a 57% er it will make your p**s boil)
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I forgot the best bit - when exposed as a TOTAL LIAR Shapps apologised with that brilliant phrase (how COULD I have forgotten it" ..... yes I was guilty of "over firmly" denying the allefation FFS
This is the piece of s**t he really is
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2015/mar/21/grant-shapps-dean-archer-legal-action-michael-green
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love your posts wolfie
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Thanks - but like my Tweets @Canals1de they fall metaphorically on deaf ears, they are supposed to be cathartic but in truth are just the opposite
I rant and rave to nobody because most people have their own unchangeable views anyway - and I doubt even one person has looked at any Tweet or post on here and think "that bloke has a point" and I have changed my view of the Government beacuse of him
Some of them SHOULD (again imo) change their view of that Liar Shapps after they read the above link and ask how he was allowed to cling on by Cameron after such wrongdoing and survive till now to lord it over us AND expects to be believed when he comes on and gives us the latest Govt spiel
Shapps Green or Fox you are a disgrace and should be nowhere near a Government ffs
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There are very few MPs on either side of the H of C who are worth urinating on if they were on fire. Hardly any of them have ever had a proper job and have no interest in the welfare of the British people.
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Does anyone else think that the timing of Cummings’ departure is deliberate to deflect from the very likely prospect of no deal with brexit.?
So he buggers off rather than staying around to take responsibility and accountability for the mess he has left.
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That and other things IDM they are a bunch of cowards
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Well we all know this hasn't got anything to do with the Blond Bullshiter. It just shows the state of this government when it takes the mother of one of the PM's kids to get rid of Cummings
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To me this is the Tories reigning in Number 10 and getting their seat back at the table .
What the feck its got to do with the women who lives above the shop with Johnson is anybody's guess .
In my opinion this leaves Johnson now massively exposed and he won't last too much in to the new year .
Yet more evidence of a corrupt government totally out of its depth at the very time you need leadership and competence .
I expect Gove to be making his move before too long .
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I have to admit, this has fallen apart faster than I expected, but this was bound to happen sooner or later.
But now what?
For all his unpleasantness and his arrogance, at least Cummings had an intellectual vision of where the Govt should be leading the country.
What have we got left now? The PM who became PM through the carnage wrought by Brexit can give us Brexit. And then what? What vision does Johnson have for where the country should go?
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The less grip the Vote Leave grifter gang has over the country, the better in my opinion.
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Where are the swivel eyed tory apologists when you want a rock solid explanation of what's happening in government?
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Cummings was always going to leave once the brexit case was resolved.
Now that it is imminent, he can leave Coco and the cabinet of no talent to drown in the shitstorm to come early next year.
Brexit fallout and the Covid cock-ups should do for Johnson with the Tory Mp's, and I expect Gove will stab the buffoon in the back once he is mired.
Coco was always a disposable frontman for the Leave lobby.
Cummings the delivery man, because Coco is not up to it when it comes to anything serious.
Doris was set up to fail once the election hurdle was crossed. The takeover of the Tory Party by the extreme right needed him as temporary cover.
Keep your eye on the arse zit Gove, that is where the danger lies!
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They are already spinning it to praise Johnson - as in - he has heard and seen enough infighting and has put his foot down and got rid of the protagonists
99 % of other people commenting though say - what the hell will he do now - which is probably a good question
Best Cartoon showed him throwing away his crutches (Cain under one arm and that "thing" under his other) he then throws them away to one side and is next seen falling flat on his face and finally face down with blood pouring from his head
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Trouble with these characters is that they are very good at campaigning , capturing the mood and picking fights but haven't the stomach for governing the country which they find boring .
Saying that the Tories have an incredible ability to replace someone who is even worse .
You thought Cameron was the worst PM ever until May came along ..... followed by Johnson !!! .
We may have seen nowt yet .
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It is worthwhile to keep an eye on the networks of influence, helpfully set out here;
https://twitter.com/davies_will/status/1327193925854121984/photo/1
Think of it as a medieval court, with rival interests manipulating to gain favour.
I cannot see Cummings choosing to go as anything other than a strategic move, designed to offer a longer term gain in the changes to come.
You have to start from the assumption that all the runners and riders have no ethical base.
The only core belief shared is in the pursuit of power for its own sake.
They are deeply disturbed.
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Left Downing Street with immediate effect
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Gone!
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Over a year late too..
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You're giving him too much credit Albie.
He has draped himself in the reputation of being a strategic genius. He isn't. He's an egomaniac who has had some successes, but who cannot face being told he's not in charge. He'd been put in his box in a palace power struggle and he's not accepting that. There's no strategy in this, he's just flounced out in a hissy fit.
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Who will replace him? Will they be any better, worse????
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Difficult to see how you do replace him. There's never been a role quite like it. We've never had a de facto, unelected Prime Minister before.
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I have a picture in my head of Johnson wandering aimlessly around No. 10 wondering how he’s going to do the job of PM now
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https://images.app.goo.gl/ZExfbqq2Xkfy4eoZ6 (https://images.app.goo.gl/ZExfbqq2Xkfy4eoZ6)
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A spiteful little weasel to the last. Making sure to leave no10 by the front door with a box in hand for the photos, like a bad sitcom. He knows what he's doing there. One last middle finger, to who, I'm not sure.
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This was the pic..
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... AND a beauty
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BST,
It has been an open secret that DC was likely to leave in January.
All that has happened is that the internal wrangles have moved it forwards. Being a spoilt brat, he does not like that!
I think you are wrong if you believe that there is no strategy behind these changes. Not a plan set out in small detail, but a willingness to use opportunities as they arise to move forwards.
As I said, keep a beady on Gove.
He is the Murdoch choice!
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Cummings was never going to go in January.
Why did he create the 'NASA style' command centre in Whitehall, have all the special advisors report to him, have a numbe rof senior civil servants removed in his plan to 'revolutionise it' and begin reviewing Defence Spending himself (including touring MOD bases) with a view to 'modernise' that, if he didn't plan to be there to oversee all this long term?
I am afraid I am of the 'there is no plan and Johnson is making it up as he goes along' party.
All Johnson is concerned about is himself and being popular. This week is due to Labour leading in the polls and Biden's election.
Little Trump has lost his leader and whatever plan he had to do that trade deal. They don't know what to do (with the EU trade deal, covid, the economy post-Brexit) his MP's are getting mutinous and this is the result.
Bluffers, liers and chancers the lot of them - with Johnson the worst of the lot.
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Quite agree wilts all the same these mps
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It makes me sick all these Tory MP’s now coming out saying good riddance now he’s gone, where were their b*llocks when he was in the job, self serving bas**rds the lot of them!
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Yep!
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''On Friday night backbench MPs said a full reset was now needed to get a handle on the government operation, which has been left in tatters less than a year after Johnson won a resounding victory in the general election''
Tatters R US, it's always tatters wherever johson is, except tatters poorly describes it.
Shambles-tatters-shatters
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Quite agree wilts all the same these mps
I’ve been saying it for years bpool.
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The lie that all MPs are the same is the reason why people like Boris are elected.
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Donny so when people call the Tory party the nasty party and say there not interested in your average person that would be a lie to? A poster further up can’t remember who said they were chancers and liars the lot of them would you agree with that about the Tory mps?
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Hound.
Know your history.
The first person I can find on record using the term "nasty party" about the Tories was Theresa May in her conference speech in 2002.
She said, "In recent years a number of politicians have behaved disgracefully and then com pounded their offences by trying to evade responsibility. We all know who they are. Let's face it, some of them have stood on this platform."
She went on to castigate Tory colleagues for "making political capital out of demonising minorities."
Ironic, I'll grant you, as she then went onto a career that was built in making political capital out of demonising minorities when she was Home Secretary, but there you go. I'll admit, I've got a personal revulsion for the woman as it was her Home Office that refused my British born and raised brother-in-law's perfectly valid claim for British citizenship when he wanted to join the RAF, on the basis that he couldn't provide suitable evidence that his Italian father had legally resided in Britain for 30 years until he died when his son was 8.
But there you go. Shameless hypocrite or not, it was her who first used the term in public as far as I can see.
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Hound.
Know your history.
The first person I can find on record using the term "nasty party" about the Tories was Theresa May in her conference speech in 2002.
She said, "In recent years a number of politicians have behaved disgracefully and then com pounded their offences by trying to evade responsibility. We all know who they are. Let's face it, some of them have stood on this platform."
She went on to castigate Tory colleagues for "making political capital out of demonising minorities."
Ironic, I'll grant you, as she then went onto a career that was built in making political capital out of demonising minorities when she was Home Secretary, but there you go. I'll admit, I've got a personal revulsion for the woman as it was her Home Office that refused my British born and raised brother-in-law's perfectly valid claim for British citizenship when he wanted to join the RAF, on the basis that he couldn't provide suitable evidence that his Italian father had legally resided in Britain for 30 years until he died when his son was 8.
But there you go. Shameless hypocrite or not, it was her who first used the term in public as far as I can see.
When they are out of government as they were in 2002 Billy , lets at least put the record straight.
Different story when this vermin are in power .
Has much as myself and Blair weren't on the same page entirely to say the least he really should have buried these feckers for ever .
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Reply to Wilts #33 above as I cant "quote" yet
Nobody will be surprised that I agree with this extract. Its what I would have written had I have been awake LOL
I am afraid I am of the 'there is no plan and Johnson is making it up as he goes along' party.
All Johnson is concerned about is himself and being popular. This week is due to Labour leading in the polls and Biden's election.
Little Trump has lost his leader and whatever plan he had to do that trade deal. They don't know what to do (with the EU trade deal, covid, the economy post-Brexit) his MP's are getting mutinous and this is the result.
Bluffers, liers and chancers the lot of them - with Johnson the worst of the lot. :that: dw
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Hound.
Know your history.
The first person I can find on record using the term "nasty party" about the Tories was Theresa May in her conference speech in 2002.
She said, "In recent years a number of politicians have behaved disgracefully and then com pounded their offences by trying to evade responsibility. We all know who they are. Let's face it, some of them have stood on this platform."
She went on to castigate Tory colleagues for "making political capital out of demonising minorities."
Ironic, I'll grant you, as she then went onto a career that was built in making political capital out of demonising minorities when she was Home Secretary, but there you go. I'll admit, I've got a personal revulsion for the woman as it was her Home Office that refused my British born and raised brother-in-law's perfectly valid claim for British citizenship when he wanted to join the RAF, on the basis that he couldn't provide suitable evidence that his Italian father had legally resided in Britain for 30 years until he died when his son was 8.
But there you go. Shameless hypocrite or not, it was her who first used the term in public as far as I can see.
Was history a link wolfie ................ asking for a friend
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Hound.
Know your history.
The first person I can find on record using the term "nasty party" about the Tories was Theresa May in her conference speech in 2002.
She said, "In recent years a number of politicians have behaved disgracefully and then com pounded their offences by trying to evade responsibility. We all know who they are. Let's face it, some of them have stood on this platform."
She went on to castigate Tory colleagues for "making political capital out of demonising minorities."
Ironic, I'll grant you, as she then went onto a career that was built in making political capital out of demonising minorities when she was Home Secretary, but there you go. I'll admit, I've got a personal revulsion for the woman as it was her Home Office that refused my British born and raised brother-in-law's perfectly valid claim for British citizenship when he wanted to join the RAF, on the basis that he couldn't provide suitable evidence that his Italian father had legally resided in Britain for 30 years until he died when his son was 8.
But there you go. Shameless hypocrite or not, it was her who first used the term in public as far as I can see.
BST, get your facts right.
You are suggesting that it was me who mentioned the nasty party.
Look again, it wasn’t me.
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Hi SR (#44 above)
Sorry dont understand the question ? I didnt post that anyway
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It was just a poke at those that don't read links wolfie, sorry to confuse
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Maybe it has just dawned johnson that he was sold a pup too.
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If Dominic Cummings was sacked - as has been reported - why was he allowed to go out of the front door where photographers (and Robert Peston) were gathered?
Asked if Mr Cummings was gone for good after his ostentatious cardboard box exit, one Number 10 source said: "F*** knows. This could all be an elaborate plot to make journalists look foolish."
https://www.mirror.co.uk/news/politics/what-really-happened-boris-johnsons-23008426
These people run the country, we are in the middle of a pandemic with the economy in crises and business still with no clue if or how they will be able to trade in Europe in 49 days time, btw.
But they are 'all the same'....
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Yes he should have been marched out like he did to the woman that has just won 5 figure damages - because he did not have the authority to do so I think it said
They settled out of Court this week as "they" did not want the emails exposed that were at the root of the problem
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So...
Flout the lock down rules, break various laws, undermine the government and do whatever the hell you and the Prime Minister will back you to the hilt and move heaven and earth to keep you in post.
But call his girlfriend Princess Nut Nuts and you're out so fast your feet won't touch the ground!
Good to know Boris has got his priorities right.
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Perhaps Carrie is now the defacto PM now
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Apologies Hound. My mistake. It was late...
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Blackpool - No I wouldn't suggest all Tory members are chancers or liars. Theresa May could have been a better leader but she wasn't a chancer or liar IMO.
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Wilts,
In reply to me, you said;
"Cummings was never going to go in January.
Why did he create the 'NASA style' command centre in Whitehall, have all the special advisors report to him, have a numbe rof senior civil servants removed in his plan to 'revolutionise it' and begin reviewing Defence Spending himself (including touring MOD bases) with a view to 'modernise' that, if he didn't plan to be there to oversee all this long term?"
In fact Cummings wrote in his blog last January of his intention to leave at the end of 2020.
He said;
"We want to improve performance, and make me much less important-and within a year, largely redundant".
He repeated this in May to anyone who would listen, but the media mob were on another theme.
I think his aim was to set up ARPA and other internal changes in order to step back, not to control it himself. The point (for him) was to ensure resilient system design, so that it would persist outside of his controlling influence.
As a non-Tory, Cummings was well aware of his limited lifespan in Downing Street. The baseline was to secure as much structural reform as could be achieved in the window available.
The running story is that Cummings knows where some of the bodies are buried. He can choose to detonate under Coco any time he likes....I believe he will, in order to promote a leadership coup in favour of Gove.
There is still some mileage in allowing Boris and his catchfart cabinet to dither further with Covid and a shambolic Brexit before replacing the clown.
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Albie
I have a couple of questions arising from your piece above
In fact Cummings wrote in his blog last January of his intention to leave at the end of 2020.
He said;
"We want to improve performance, and make me much less important-and within a year, largely redundant".
Did you actually see this as of last January. I only ask because he has a track record (proven) for altering his Blogs and so I thought yesterday - I wondered if he has altered that (a la 1984)
Secondly and again I thought this yesterday when I heard it he intended to make himself largely redundant. Now to me that is not the same as saying he was going to get out / leave / get redundancy to me it means I will have a hierarchy who do all the work and I will supervise them. If he had not used the word largely it would have a whole different meaning I think
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Wolf,
I was aware of Cummings position for quite a while, but I can't remember when I saw the piece in his blog.
You are right that he has changed things in the past, but I have not heard anyone claim that this entry has been revised.
If you know different, post a link.
He was repeating it during the May furore;
https://metro.co.uk/2020/05/28/dominic-cummings-considering-quitting-six-months-time-12773727/
Many media outlets did not focus on this aspect.
On your second point, Cummings thinks he does not have to be in Downing Street to make his systems work.
If the leave project still has staff in the building, and the system is resolute, maybe he believes that he can continue to exert influence?
I don't really know is the truth!
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Albie.
You're ignoring all the caveats in his previous comments about his position.
He was reported as saying in May that he'd leave at Xmas IF his plans to reorganise Govt were completed. (I will pass over the obvious fact that never once in any discussion before the election were plans to give an unelected egomaniac unfettered power to reorganise the way we govern ourselves...)
The point is, those plans HAVEN'T been completed. In fact, he has lost the battle to even structure the No10 Office that he was in control of.
So I don't see how you can say that his mission is complete and he's leaving on his terms. I'd argue that my interpretation is the more accurate one. He's just lost a power struggle and his ego doesn't allow him to do anything else but flounce out. He's gone off like a hand grenade every time anyone has tried to put him in a box and this is just another example of it.
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We may not have seen the last of him yet. He was Gove's advisor before Johnson's. Once Gove replaces Coco I wouldn't bet against Gove bringing Cunnings back.
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BST,
I am NOT saying "his mission is complete and he is leaving on his terms"...at all!
My view is that he knew that his period of influence was time limited, and so worked on the basis of getting as much done, as quickly, as circumstances allow. You are right that it is incomplete, but I reckon it was always going to be.
It is about creating a benchmark for a post Boris renewal under Gove, in my view,
You say that he has lost a power struggle, but I think he was aware that he would need to prepare for his own exit. Because that exit has come earlier does not mean he was not prepared for it when it came.
I would not over focus on the melodrama, or the media optics.
The long game is about what happens down the road, and lets see how team Gove play the clusterf**k to derail Coco.
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Pies, didn't Gove sack him?
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I don't know, ravenrover. I was really just thinking out loud with my glass half-empty head on.
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Gove was told to sack him by Cameron who called Cummings a "career psychopath". So at least Cameron got some judgements right.
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Apart from the one thing he HAD to get right
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Reply to ravenrovers point #61
I dont know either if Pies is right but it is poliyical expediancy
Cos after all Gove came out after backing Johnson to say he was simply not the man to be PM - and (surprise surprise) saying in his opinion HE Gove was the man for the job.
Out and out backstabbing (though he was proved right) - treachery of the highest order and yet Johnson still gve him a job
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‘For all his unpleasantness and his arrogance, at least Cummings had an intellectual vision of where the Govt should be leading the country.’
I agree with you Billy - let’s get him back!
‘Gove was told to sack him by Cameron who called Cummings a "career psychopath". So at least Cameron got some judgements right.’
I agree with you, Billy - don’t let that psychopath anywhere near the government!
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It was just a poke at those that don't read links wolfie, sorry to confuse
Good to know your post wasn’t aimed at me then.
I do read some of the links that are posted.
I suppose it was a WUM post really.
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I'd never aim anything at you hound knowing how sensitive you are.
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I'd never aim anything at you hound knowing how sensitive you are.
Mind the gap.
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It's so reassuring to know the country is in a good pair of hands
''The prime minister’s official spokesman insisted Johnson was not being distracted by the row and was “focused … on taking every possible step to get this country through the coronavirus pandemic”''
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It's hard to think of an appropriate comment for this
''Insiders said there was visible upset among the prime minister’s team as the fallout continued, with aides desperately ringing around to make sure there would not be further resignations. “This is bloody even by Westminster standards,” said one Whitehall figure. “It’s almost embarrassing. The person who suffers is the prime minister, who’s a good man trying to do very difficult things. This is a huge distraction.”''
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Have you got a link for that statement.
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I have - I just googled the first sentence and its here - in this right at the bottom. To read it I had to press Remind me later or similar
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2020/nov/14/attacks-by-pms-ousted-aide-left-new-press-chief-in-tears
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thanks wolfie, I was going to suggest it was the missing link but I won't have to now
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Well well well, maybe there's going to be some Karma after all....
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2020/dec/04/durham-police-dominic-cummings-nazir-ifzal-dossier
Perverting the Course of Justice, if proven, is a very serious offence.
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I suspect it will go the same way as the investigation into him building a house without planning permission, then failing to pay £30k of Council Tax on it.
Guilty as charged. Naughty boy. Don't do it again. Let's say no more about it. Case closed.
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Ah, but now he doesn't have the protection of Bojo and his chums.
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Why not?
He's got the dirt on them
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Why not?
He's got the dirt on them
Good point, well made. :(
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Well well well, maybe there's going to be some Karma after all....
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2020/dec/04/durham-police-dominic-cummings-nazir-ifzal-dossier
Perverting the Course of Justice, if proven, is a very serious offence.
It shows what we all knew to be true, that Durham police's decision was subject to outside influence, which surely in itself is a criminal offence.
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Well well well, maybe there's going to be some Karma after all....
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2020/dec/04/durham-police-dominic-cummings-nazir-ifzal-dossier
Perverting the Course of Justice, if proven, is a very serious offence.
It shows what we all knew to be true, that Durham police's decision was subject to outside influence, which surely in itself is a criminal offence.
That was my first thought, has Johnson leant on him
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Well well well, maybe there's going to be some Karma after all....
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2020/dec/04/durham-police-dominic-cummings-nazir-ifzal-dossier
Perverting the Course of Justice, if proven, is a very serious offence.
It shows what we all knew to be true, that Durham police's decision was subject to outside influence, which surely in itself is a criminal offence.
That was my first thought, has Johnson leant on him
I don't think you'd need to look any further than the 'non-bully' who happens to be Home Secretary and therefore has more direct influence on the police.
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Well well well, maybe there's going to be some Karma after all....
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2020/dec/04/durham-police-dominic-cummings-nazir-ifzal-dossier
Perverting the Course of Justice, if proven, is a very serious offence.
It shows what we all knew to be true, that Durham police's decision was subject to outside influence, which surely in itself is a criminal offence.
That was my first thought, has Johnson leant on him
I don't think you'd need to look any further than the 'non-bully' who happens to be Home Secretary and therefore has more direct influence on the police.
Good shout, maybe she unintentionally leant on him