Viking Supporters Co-operative
Viking Chat => Off Topic => Topic started by: wilts rover on September 24, 2022, 09:18:37 am
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So some proper scrutiny on Kwarteng and Truss' 'fiscal event' yesterday - and you can see why they wouldn't let any be published at the time.
95% of people will be worse of due to the changes. Only the top 5% will benefit with the top 2% benefitting most. As these people live in London and the South-East that area will benefit 3x more than the North-East or Yorkshire.
And you were already poorer at 5.00pm yesterday than you were at 9.00am due to the fall in the pound. We buy our fuel and energy supplies off the international market in dollars - so they immediately cost more.
Still the financial speculators will have made a killling betting on the fall in the pound. And they get to keep more of their taxes and an unlimited bonus for it - paid in dollars of course.
Vote Tory.
https://twitter.com/resfoundation/status/1573570495546540033
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Brexiters Rejoice! Truss is betting everything on your ideas. The new government’s programme is a shocking dismissal of Conservative belief in sound public finances:
'While intended as an investment in growth, it is more certainly a down payment on spending cuts'
https://www.ft.com/content/40cb7430-065d-4bdb-b479-60318d21d361
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More brown stuff on sale, get it while it's still steaming!
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The apology from Steve Baker to Ireland and the EU is not universally accepted then?
''ECJ must have no role in Northern Ireland protocol, David Frost says
Ex-Brexit minister’s comments suggest the European court of justice remains divisive among Tories''
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2022/oct/11/ecj-must-have-no-role-in-northern-ireland-protocol-david-frost-says
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This sort of fantasy politics is typical of governing parties who have been in power too long. Remember the dying days of the Callaghan goverment, of John Major's? I have a devoutly Conservative friend, a stalwart member of the often Conservative led Milton Keynes Council. Yet despite his almost fanatical toryism he believes no governing party should be in power for more than 10 years. He can see the groupthink that envelopes parties who stay too long. It's a shame some people on here cannot do the same.
BobG
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David Frost talking about the NI Protocol is like listening to a dog explain quantum physics.
1) He doesn't understand it.
2) Even if he did, whenever he communicates his ideas, it just sounds like content-free noise.
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24 hour musak. The inevitable result of rolling 24 hour news.
BobG
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This sort of fantasy politics is typical of governing parties who have been in power too long. Remember the dying days of the Callaghan goverment, of John Major's? I have a devoutly Conservative friend, a stalwart member of the often Conservative led Milton Keynes Council. Yet despite his almost fanatical toryism he believes no governing party should be in power for more than 10 years. He can see the groupthink that envelopes parties who stay too long. It's a shame some people on here cannot do the same.
BobG
Sounds like a wise man
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Despite his political views he is a fantastic guy. Really intelligent and cares about people. Lol. And he's both my bridge partner and he's just bought my R8 off me!
BobG
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This sort of fantasy politics is typical of governing parties who have been in power too long. Remember the dying days of the Callaghan goverment, of John Major's? I have a devoutly Conservative friend, a stalwart member of the often Conservative led Milton Keynes Council. Yet despite his almost fanatical toryism he believes no governing party should be in power for more than 10 years. He can see the groupthink that envelopes parties who stay too long. It's a shame some people on here cannot do the same.
BobG
So after 10 years of Tory rule, your devout Tory would vote for another party?
Or would voting be abolished?
We could get Sepp Blatter involved to ensure everyone gets a fair chance to have a bash at ruling.
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Grow up Belton. If you can't see the serious point here this sort of conversation isn't for you.
BobG
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Grow up Belton. If you can't see the serious point here this sort of conversation isn't for you.
BobG
The point is, Bobby Gee, that your friend’s 10 year rule is an absolute impossibility, so hardly worthy of grown up conversation.
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And the deeper point is that you are blind to the bleedin' obvious. Subtlety passes you by doesn't it...
BobG
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This sort of fantasy politics is typical of governing parties who have been in power too long. Remember the dying days of the Callaghan goverment, of John Major's? I have a devoutly Conservative friend, a stalwart member of the often Conservative led Milton Keynes Council. Yet despite his almost fanatical toryism he believes no governing party should be in power for more than 10 years. He can see the groupthink that envelopes parties who stay too long. It's a shame some people on here cannot do the same.
BobG
I'd never agree with having a term limit like this, but there are all sorts of reasons why few Governments last long beyond ten years.
1) Sometimes they run out of new ideas. The zeal that they came to power with fades over time, due to dealing with day to day issues sapping the energy. And also because the world moves on and the ideas that brought them to power no longer apply. So it's natural that Governing parties need stints in Opposition to regain their energy and re-work their ideas.
2) Sometimes they get cocky and stop engaging with the country. When a party has been in power for a decade, it starts to think it is bound to stay in power and it forgets it has to constantly re-sell itself to the electorate.
3) Sometimes they shoot themselves in the foot with something really stupid. The longer you are in power, the more likely this becomes, just by the laws of chance.
4) Sometimes something unlucky happens in the outside world.
5) Sometimes your underpinning political aims drive you to policies that are wrong and make the country worse - doesn't always finish you off immediately, but it can do after a while.
Of the long-run Govts we've ad since the War, I'd say the Tories (51-64) suffered badly from 1) by the end. They looked like a bunch of knackered old men with no new ideas. And they had a dose of 3 with the Profumo Affair.
The Tories (79-97) almost did themselves in after 10 years with the Poll Tax, a combination of 2) & 3), but they were smart enough to ditch Thatcher and have a fresh start under Major. But then black Wednesday and 5 years of tearing themselves apart over Europe did for them - a combination of 5) & 2).
Labour (97-2010) suffered massively from Blair's Iraq War which was him in "I'm the Messiah and I'm listening to nobody" mode. Classic 2) & 3). They dealt with that by Blair standing down and Brown seemed like a fresh start. But he was poleaxed by the unforeseen GFC - a perfect example of 4).
The current Tories (10-24) are unique in that they have ticked every single box.
1) They have no workable new politico-economic ideas.
2) The arrogance of Johnson's COVID behaviour, then Truss chucking money at the rich is on a scale that we've never seen before and could almost have been designed to say to the Electorate "we don't actually care about you."
3) They had a chance of a fresh start after Johnson's stupid handling of the Pincher case finished him off, but they fluffed it massively by electing someone so manifestly unsuitable to be PM as Truss. Sunak would have given them a chance of at least looking in control.
4) Of course, they've been hit hard by outside events - COVID and Putin's War.
5) The Truss-Kwarteng Budget will go down in history as THE most stupid self-inflicted political wound since Suez. And of course, it has been this Govt's choice to go for a hard Brexit, that is no deeply unpopular.
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And the deeper point is that you are blind to the bleedin' obvious. Subtlety passes you by doesn't it...
BobG
That’s the Bobby Gee I know: your point, thoughts, ideas will always be the deepest.
Crack on.
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The façade is crumbling.
Here's the Economics Editor of The Telegraph admiring that the Brexit that he supported has been a disaster.
https://twitter.com/JeremyWarnerUK/status/1581330560571801602?s=20&t=f7UhpAAd0zh-Az9yH561hg
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All those poor Brexiteers who were once rejoicing that your vision/unicorn had been delivered now overturned by Jeremy Hunt. I feel your pain*
*sorry no I don't, I'm fibbing. You believe liars - you get lied to. Enjoy the consequences - we have to.
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I seem to remember £350 million a week getting a huge amount of airtime. Has anyone seen it yet?
BobG
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Yes Bob. The Tory grandees.
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The Financial Times tells it as it is....
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wO2lWmgEK1Y&ab_channel=FinancialTimes
Anyone got a torch, the sunlit uplands are looking rather dark?
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Thank you Kato. That is well worth watching. The FT must be that paragon we've all been seeking. A news media without an agenda.
BobG
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(https://i.imgur.com/YRfF1Lr.jpg)
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Cracking Kato! I've sent that on to quite a lot of people :) Thank you.
BobG
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Great piece by the always watchable Ros Atkins.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/av/uk-63426412
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So glad everything is going fine and dandy across the channel .
https://youtu.be/J_h73BkLPK4
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So glad everything is going fine and dandy across the channel .
https://youtu.be/J_h73BkLPK4
Quite right Tyke - I see EU car production has dropped 26% since 2019.
And UK car production has dropped 47% in the same period.
https://twitter.com/DavidHenigUK/status/1586419450496143361
Still at least the City of London where the Brexiteers believe future economic success will come from is doing well - they have only lost £1.3 TRILLON in investor sell offs.
https://twitter.com/The_ChrisShaw/status/1586667371216965632
But yeah - in Europe where we aren't....
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So glad everything is going fine and dandy across the channel .
https://youtu.be/J_h73BkLPK4
The French love a good protest. Before criticising their Government they should look towards Italy and Germany where things are even worse! As should we when considering the UK position.
Latest inflation rates: France 6.2%; Euro Area 9.9%; UK 10.1%; Germany 10.4%; Italy 11.9%
Latest (pre inflation) wage growth rates: UK 6%; Euro Area 4.1%; France 3.1%; Germany 2.9%; Italy 1.1%
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Brexit was the most stupid thing the country could do. Isolationism never ends well. Costing the country in billions of pounds in unnecessary EU red tape, because the Brexit loonies persuaded enough of the country to vote us out of the Bloc.
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Brexit was the most stupid thing the country could do. Isolationism never ends well. Costing the country in billions of pounds in unnecessary EU red tape, because the Brexit loonies persuaded enough of the country to vote us out of the Bloc.
Indeed they did. By a whole series of lies and false promises which too many people fell for....
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XbNvA5PtUzk
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who in their right mind would vote for that again, maybe better not to ask
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who in their right mind would vote for that again, maybe better not to ask
Well, being as you asked....
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CSWF8oiWIG4
Is that BB on the phone?
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I didn't vote for Brexit.
I await an apology.