Viking Supporters Co-operative
Viking Chat => Viking Chat => Topic started by: silent majority on December 18, 2023, 04:17:33 pm
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As detailed here;
https://www.doncasterroversfc.co.uk/news/2023/december/statement/
TB stepping up!!
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So has Blunt simply stepped down and left the club or is a coup? :-]]
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Interested to see what this means for the club. Will he be more visible, proactive etc?
And what has driven the change? I suspect it wasn't sudden given the last few years.
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Hopefully a qualified Director of Football or equivalent is next in.
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Didn’t expect the 0-5 to have this much impact!
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Think this was mooted as far back as the summer, can only see this as a positive move
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Surprised he's stepped up at his age, although will it have much impact anyway?
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Does he come with a ‘treasure chest’?
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Surprised he's stepped up at his age, although will it have much impact anyway?
I wouldn't underestimate him.
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From his statement in the summer and this one, it sounds like TB has got the bit between his teeth with the club. Let's hope it leads to the progress we all want.
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Interesting move. All very curt and professional in the statement, doesn't give too much away, but reading between the lines it does sound performance related.
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Best news all year, maybe now we can move forward without the club having one arm behind its back..
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This raises a few questions, SM, but I’ll simply ask - why now?
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Interested to see what this means for the club. Will he be more visible, proactive etc?
And what has driven the change? I suspect it wasn't sudden given the last few years.
I do know he's extremely enthusiastic about the club and he'd like to be more involved, so I would say yes he'll be much more visible.
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This raises a few questions, SM, but I’ll simply ask - why now?
Well I don't want to point fingers but we are not where we expected to be.
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Appreciate that, but can the circumstances be put at Blunt’s door? I agree with everyone, he’s been a poor Chairman. But the injury situation is not his fault, for example?
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If he is stepping back up, I would start Terry at back against Bradford. Would outjump Tom and Olowu, and more positional awareness.
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Personally I see this as a positive move. Me like others have never really warmed to Blunt. A large part of his tenure has seen him oversee a catastrophic fall from where we were 3 years ago.
The cynics however will no doubt say titanic and deckchairs.
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Surely this can be nothing but great news. Well done TB.
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Brilliant news
.. Best news for years. His track record as Chairman was awful. Hopefully as Chair Bramall will support our manager further in January as a result.
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The acknowledgment that we aren’t where we expected to be might calm a few down on here that have somehow seen this season as ‘improvement’. Clearly there is still a lot of issues at the core of the club. Hopefully this is one step closer to rectifying those.
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There's been a strength of feeling amongst posters on this forum that Blunt has been culpable in holding the club back, a view I share. Perhaps that penny has now dropped at the club too.
I should add that this gives me confidence that things will start to improve at last.
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I think this is a welcome change.
Let’s hope TB can get the club buzzing because whether David Blunt has run the finances prudently or not, the fact is he has no charisma.
He maybe a very decent person but unfortunately he comes across in the Meet the owners sessions as very arrogant and impersonal.
We need the leadership of the club to get the fans on side. Made to be feel important and to seriously believe that the board is ambitious to get this club to be successful again
Now what success is to one person can be different to another of course.
I think most of us want to see the club strive to be in the play off mix in league 1 as a minimum which give a fair opportunity of obtaining 2nd tier status again in the next few years.
This has to be positive news and I hope most of our fans see it as a positive step.
There are some that will never be happy of course.
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It’s brilliant news only downside is Terrys age, wish he was 25 years younger with the enthusiasm he seems to have developed of late, he seems to have really gripped the bull by the horns.
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Surprised he's stepped up at his age, although will it have much impact anyway?
Only if he plays
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Terry has to be an improvement on David, even if it’s just for the fact that it will create slightly more harmony behind the scenes.
We are still left with a structure that isn’t working. We made a step forward appointing a HoF, if it was completely the wrong man for the job, then two steps back ripping up the good work. I’m not sure we even have a recruitment department do we? This appears to be another positive small step forward but how do we build on this??
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Terry has to be an improvement on David, even if it’s just for the fact that it will create slightly more harmony behind the scenes.
We are still left with a structure that isn’t working. We made a step forward appointing a HoF, if it was completely the wrong man for the job, then two steps back ripping up the good work. I’m not sure we even have a recruitment department do we? This appears to be another positive small step forward but how do we build on this??
I think Lee Glover is involved with recruitment. What exactly Copps is doing I am not sure.
Is he still doing some coaching?
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Still a major shareholder, so not so good news as some may think, it would have been better if it was announced he’d cut all ties with the club.
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Terrific news !
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I love the way our club ploughs its own furrow... We don't replace the manager after a shocking result (nor should we), replace the Chairman.
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The acknowledgment that we aren’t where we expected to be might calm a few down on here that have somehow seen this season as ‘improvement’. Clearly there is still a lot of issues at the core of the club. Hopefully this is one step closer to rectifying those.
Colin, with respect, I’m not sure that many will have seen the overall situation this season as an improvement but have seen an improvement in the entertainment offered.
Generally, in my opinion, we have been miles better to watch than we were last year, and the year before that too, even if the results haven’t been as good as we like them to be.
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Completely agree with that, Hound. There was far too much wrong on the football front for it all to be remedied at once.
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The majority of us wanted Blunt to step down, he’s stepped down, be happy
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The majority of us wanted Blunt to step down, he’s stepped down, be happy
100% Filo.
There are some that won’t be happy until our entire board leave and we are bankrupt in National league North same as South Shields apparently are right now.
Oh wait I have just realised they will be moaning at that also. Not much they won’t. :that:
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Terry has to be an improvement on David, even if it’s just for the fact that it will create slightly more harmony behind the scenes.
We are still left with a structure that isn’t working. We made a step forward appointing a HoF, if it was completely the wrong man for the job, then two steps back ripping up the good work. I’m not sure we even have a recruitment department do we? This appears to be another positive small step forward but how do we build on this??
I think Lee Glover is involved with recruitment. What exactly Copps is doing I am not sure.
Is he still doing some coaching?
James Coppinger is Head of Recruitment.
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I think a new money man is coming in and it's not Eco power, can't say anymore at the moment
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I think a new money man is coming in and it's not Eco power, can't say anymore at the moment
You’re wrong.
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Still a major shareholder, so not so good news as some may think, it would have been better if it was announced he’d cut all ties with the club.
Sweet Jesus...
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This is fantastic news. It's obvious now that the board haven't seen the progression they wanted to see, with the team in a worse position than it was at this time last season.
Whether Terry will want to launch a big recruitment drive in January, or leave it until next summer is now up to him.
One thing's for sure, he's a shrewd bloke, and will do everything he can to retain ST sales for next season.
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As long as McCann stays and Baldwin stays, we should be good.
I don't think Bramall is one to tinker too much.
I've said before (and been previously lambasted for it!) that the issues appeared to stem from Mr Blunt. Proof will be in the pudding I guess.
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I love the way our club ploughs its own furrow... We don't replace the manager after a shocking result (nor should we), replace the Chairman.
Aye its at least 3 seasons too late. Should have gone when we got beat 0-5 to Rotherham at home a few seasons ago at latest..
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As long as McCann stays and Baldwin stays, we should be good.
I don't think Bramall is one to tinker too much.
I've said before (and been previously lambasted for it!) that the issues appeared to stem from Mr Blunt. Proof will be in the pudding I guess.
Everyone's said the same, you're not the oracle.
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Possibly a return for Andrew Watson hopefully
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As long as McCann stays and Baldwin stays, we should be good.
I don't think Bramall is one to tinker too much.
I've said before (and been previously lambasted for it!) that the issues appeared to stem from Mr Blunt. Proof will be in the pudding I guess.
Everyone's said the same, you're not the oracle.
They haven't! Lots of vocal support for Blunt in past
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I think a new money man is coming in and it's not Eco power, can't say anymore at the moment
You wouldnt put 'i think'
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Terry Bramall is the guy who has bankrolled us and now at last will be the one in direct relationship with Gavin and Grant.It will make a big difference I think .
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Must admit I can’t remember anyone supporting Blunt on here, quite the opposite. Maybe there has been support for him elsewhere.
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So will blunt still own 33% of the club? It seems a positive move on the face of things, I know we won’t, but would be great for TB to come out and give us some hope with a plan going forward for this year and next
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Its got to be nothing but positive that a man like TB has in effect staked his reputation on getting to the nub of what ails out great club.
WE all know TB as not the most demonstrative of individuals which when you're in the selling business is slightly restricting.
Could a call to a certain ex Chair who was a subject expert be something worth considering?
Every little helps, and boy, do we need it.
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SM - what does this mean for shareholdings and the make up of the board? If Blunt remains a shareholder but is no longer on the board, does that mean it’s just the 2 of them - Bramall and Baldwin? Might make for some shorter board meetings but feels a bit light for broader thinking and proper governance.
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IMO got to be a good move for the club. Blunt was not popular and it shows Bramall is committed to the club and not wanting to slide away into retirement. It can’t be bad having the owner more involved at a hands-on level. Presumably saves on Blunt’s salary right now and I don't see it has to have any effect on the shareholding.
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Its got to be nothing but positive that a man like TB has in effect staked his reputation on getting to the nub of what ails out great club.
WE all know TB as not the most demonstrative of individuals which when you're in the selling business is slightly restricting.
Could a call to a certain ex Chair who was a subject expert be something worth considering?
Every little helps, and boy, do we need it.
Not a chance.
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It's like Theoden getting rid of Wormtongue :woohoo:
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Its got to be nothing but positive that a man like TB has in effect staked his reputation on getting to the nub of what ails out great club.
WE all know TB as not the most demonstrative of individuals which when you're in the selling business is slightly restricting.
Could a call to a certain ex Chair who was a subject expert be something worth considering?
Every little helps, and boy, do we need it.
Not a chance.
I don’t think TB needs anybody else to spend his money for him!
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What actually does a Chairman do please.
Has the last say on everything.
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Blunt is leaving. Bramall is the one with cash. Look up Terry Bramall on Wiki.
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The 30% shares once owned by John Ryan and Dick Watson are effectively in the hands of Gavin Baldwin and David Blunt. Blunt no longer being chairman does not have any effect on his shares and he still retains 30% control of the club.
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Where in the statement does it say that Blunt is leaving?
Stepping down as chairman yes, but doesn't say he's resigned from the Board.
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Surely Bramall, Blunt and Baldwin still remain as the board as they all have 30% shareholding, but Blunt will no longer have the same day to day control over the direction and decisions in the club.
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Has this been in the pipeline a while, or has something happened and come to a head?
Only the other day GM was looking forward to presenting his targets to the board, this sounds like great timing if DB has been nothing to do with those discussions.
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This is good news but won’t turn our season around. I don’t see what Blunt has had to do with our recruitment/ injuries/lack of ability to defend. Maybe I’m missing something.
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We need a driving force at the top, giving direction, leadership…and a fair amount of enthusiasm to drive success.
If this is it …………….then I’m in…
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This is good news but won’t turn our season around. I don’t see what Blunt has had to do with our recruitment/ injuries/lack of ability to defend. Maybe I’m missing something.
Maybe the purse strings will be loosened a little.
Blunt had got them in a strangle hold it would seem.
TB knows you have to speculate to accumulate and in GM I think he will be prepared to give him a budget that gets us moving in the right direction.
Promotion really will be the target next season and I am sure our playing budget will reflect that.
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Just like to see and hear some uuummmph from the top.
The players represent the club on the pitch, it’s currently wishy washy.
Direction, leadership, attitude and desire come from the top, (of any organisation)
And that reflects in performance
So here’s hoping
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This is good news but won’t turn our season around. I don’t see what Blunt has had to do with our recruitment/ injuries/lack of ability to defend. Maybe I’m missing something.
All transfers have to be signed off by the chairman. It wouldn't surprise me if good players wanted by the manager have been knocked back by Blunt because of their wage demands.
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Great news. Everyone who’s had anything to do with football operations over the last few seasons needs to go.
We’ve got the manager I think we just need the team around him and we’ll get there.
Frustrating for Terry obviously a lot of work went into getting the club self sufficient only for the people he trusted to run it to be totally useless. Then he’s thrown away a decent wedge this season and it’s returned nothing in terms of league position. No surprised he’s wanting to take more control.
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As we all know, there has been no leadership for sometime.
Strange how you could feel the terrible atmosphere walking into the ground on Tuesday and the players play like that.
We as supporters need to pick back up again too and support as loud as we can, at the beginning of the season it was great, we have not had what we thought we would get from this season so far.
We can use this change of leadership as a catalyst for us all.
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This is good news but won’t turn our season around. I don’t see what Blunt has had to do with our recruitment/ injuries/lack of ability to defend. Maybe I’m missing something.
Maybe the purse strings will be loosened a little.
Blunt had got them in a strangle hold it would seem.
TB knows you have to speculate to accumulate and in GM I think he will be prepared to give him a budget that gets us moving in the right direction.
Promotion really will be the target next season and I am sure our playing budget will reflect that.
That has to be the reason for this announcement….surely.
You lose this manager & where do you go?
Back him, back him then back him again & you might just end up with Championship Football.
The alternative does not bare thinking of.
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Its got to be nothing but positive that a man like TB has in effect staked his reputation on getting to the nub of what ails out great club.
WE all know TB as not the most demonstrative of individuals which when you're in the selling business is slightly restricting.
Could a call to a certain ex Chair who was a subject expert be something worth considering?
Every little helps, and boy, do we need it.
That 2nd paragraph I find slightly strange, nobody on here will know really know TB, and I tend to think he can manage his assets rather well given the amount of money he is worth
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Its got to be nothing but positive that a man like TB has in effect staked his reputation on getting to the nub of what ails out great club.
WE all know TB as not the most demonstrative of individuals which when you're in the selling business is slightly restricting.
Could a call to a certain ex Chair who was a subject expert be something worth considering?
Every little helps, and boy, do we need it.
That 2nd paragraph I find slightly strange, nobody on here will know really know TB, and I tend to think he can manage his assets rather well given the amount of money he is worth
I got to know him reasonably well when I was in business.
I went on a few trips abroad in his company courtesy of Polypipe too.
He is a really likeable man but also is no one’s fool.
I imagine that if there was something he couldn’t do he would have employed someone to do it for him.
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Terry is the 5th wealthiest man in Yorkshire. Incredible the amount of wealth we had in the club between him, Dick and John at that time.
The amount of money TB must be making now interest rates have gone up must be ridiculous. Extra income for him one of the reasons he’s been willing to increase his contributions recently?
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Surprised he's stepped up at his age, although will it have much impact anyway?
I wouldn't underestimate him.
I agree a very shrewd man let’s get behind him.
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TB made a significant statement, including the commitment to additional funds, sometime ago now.
Not only was the additional funding significant, but the fact he made that statement, which was unusual for him to communicate directly with fans outside of the 'Meet the Owners' platform and specifically say those funds were to go directly to the football operation.
Once those funds are committed, it's not just a one off because contracts have to be honoured beyond 12 months (with exceptions of course), so TB had already raised the funding bar.
I think it's fair to say this has been on the cards ever since, or before, he made that statement earlier this year however, I don't know about the timing whether it is significant or not. Maybe DB has served his 'notice' so to speak.
It's unlikely TB will change and try to be something he's not, so I wouldn't expect him to be courting the media and press too often. I think he would rather actions and results on the pitch be the way to communicate and excite people to come through the door However, let's hope this is confirmation he is indeed taking a more direct responsibility to make sure we get value for his money.
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Its got to be nothing but positive that a man like TB has in effect staked his reputation on getting to the nub of what ails out great club.
WE all know TB as not the most demonstrative of individuals which when you're in the selling business is slightly restricting.
Could a call to a certain ex Chair who was a subject expert be something worth considering?
Every little helps, and boy, do we need it.
That 2nd paragraph I find slightly strange, nobody on here will know really know TB, and I tend to think he can manage his assets rather well given the amount of money he is worth
I got to know him reasonably well when I was in business.
I went on a few trips abroad in his company courtesy of Polypipe too.
He is a really likeable man but also is no one’s fool.
I imagine that if there was something he couldn’t do he would have employed someone to do it for him.
And therein lies my point,
I know we're not going to go over old ground and bring anyone back but is not unnoticeable that we have been rudderless in the promotion and selling of the club to a wider Doncaster audience.
We need some expertise in this field, TB for all his strengths is not the individual who is going to do this for us and like mentioned above we need to get someone in who can and will promote the club to its best advantage.
We may all have our opinions on the merits of JR but he put his heart and sole into the promotion of the club regardless of how things eventually closed out that chapter.
We now start a new chapter and as a club we need to ensure its done correctly, i don't want to see TB's money going to waste.
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Wonder if Blunt will now pass his share in the club to his son(s)?
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The immediate problem is, of course, nothing can change until, initially, January. We have a number of difficult games prior to the window opening, and an ever decreasing squad due to the catastrophic injury situation. The chances are we’ll be worse off, points wise, when the window opens and we shouldn’t be shocked or surprised if that is the case.
January is going to be a very important month for us and we desperately need it to go well.
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The immediate problem is, of course, nothing can change until, initially, January. We have a number of difficult games prior to the window opening, and an ever decreasing squad due to the catastrophic injury situation. The chances are we’ll be worse off, points wise, when the window opens and we shouldn’t be shocked or surprised if that is the case.
January is going to be a very important month for us and we desperately need it to go well.
We need some points on the board in January Alan. That’s a must. Some winnable games on paper but the game isn’t played on paper.
I am not expecting a lot to happen in January in terms of recruitment.
Hopefully we can get Faal signed on for the rest of the season and get another striker signed maybe on loan.
I don’t want us to have 1/2/3 yr contracts given out to players who are not going to improve our team long term.
Most players that will be available in January are players other clubs don’t want simply because they are surplus to requirements, in other words not good enough.
Yes there will be the odd gem out there but they are few and far between and we won’t be the only club after them.
The fact we are languishing in the lower reaches of the table as we speak makes us less attractive to ambitious players who want to be playing in League 1 next season.
The summer will be the time when we can really go out and show some serious ambition. The market will be so much bigger with out of contract players looking to move their careers and wage packets in an upward direction.
I think a little patience is needed and we really should not get too excited about recruitment in January.
I am sure GM will have some targets though.
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There’s no correlation between success in business and success running a football club is there by the way. Many good businessmen have failed in the past.
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Camps, if we sit on our hands in January, and those below us are more pro-active, things could get very damaging indeed.
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Camps, if we sit on our hands in January, and those below us are more pro-active, things could get very damaging indeed.
No one is saying sit on our hands.
The market in January is very limited that’s all I am saying. We don’t want a January like the last 2 January’s do we.
Players under contract that will not get us out of this league and not be good enough for League 1.
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Camps, if we sit on our hands in January, and those below us are more pro-active, things could get very damaging indeed.
No one is saying sit on our hands.
The market in January is very limited that’s all I am saying. We don’t want a January like the last 2 January’s do we.
Players under contract that will not get us out of this league and not be good enough for League 1.
I’m sure there will be players out there in January that would be good replacements for some of our well below par players, who are been overpaid and are not worthy of playing in the EFL and putting on a DRFC shirt
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We will see if I am wrong SM in due course,
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Great that Blunt has gone, he's been a failure as chairman for far too long.
Presumably this is an interim move until we can get someone younger in? The elephant in the room with this appointment is he's 81. The same age as Joe Biden...
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Get Bramall in the physio room.
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Padge I put I think because no i's dotted or t's crossed and may well fall through, but watch this space
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The acknowledgment that we aren’t where we expected to be might calm a few down on here that have somehow seen this season as ‘improvement’. Clearly there is still a lot of issues at the core of the club. Hopefully this is one step closer to rectifying those.
Colin, with respect, I’m not sure that many will have seen the overall situation this season as an improvement but have seen an improvement in the entertainment offered.
Generally, in my opinion, we have been miles better to watch than we were last year, and the year before that too, even if the results haven’t been as good as we like them to be.
Agree 100% Hound
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A couple of good young hungry ones Alan, and keep the ammunition dry for a proper preseason and more recruits of better quality.
I know that a lot of effort and time is going into player recognition and some good players have been identified. Rest assured Grant and his team are not sitting on their hands letting things jog along.
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Camps, if we sit on our hands in January, and those below us are more pro-active, things could get very damaging indeed.
No one is saying sit on our hands.
The market in January is very limited that’s all I am saying. We don’t want a January like the last 2 January’s do we.
Players under contract that will not get us out of this league and not be good enough for League 1.
I’m sure there will be players out there in January that would be good replacements for some of our well below par players, who are been overpaid and are not worthy of playing in the EFL and putting on a DRFC shirt
Indeed. McCann has already said they've got their targets so nobody intends sitting on their hands Alan.
He said, they want to make sure they're ready to 'go' on 1st January.
However, as Camps said, they will be accutely aware of the pitfalls of not getting the balance right, which also includes acting swiftly when appropriate, or moving on if players want to play hard ball. So, again, it'll be evolution rather than revolution.
I wouldn't be surprised if GB and subsequently McCann, have been influential in the direction TB wants to go and the way we're more likely to achieve it.
It won't be achieved by just throwing money at it. We know TB, particularly with his statement about 'community', expects and hopes the fans play their part too however, he seems to be doing his best to get things moving in the right direction.
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I am guessing here but this does smack of Terry realising that he does not want his legacy with the club to be us scratching around around bottom of League Two, getting hammered at home by the likes of Salford and Morecambe.
You could see him setting himself a project of a few years to get us at last back to being competitive in top end of League One before handing reigns over to someone either as owner or steward on a more sustainable basis. He’s not a young man but might feel he has a few years in him yet to turn this around and leave us on a high.
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I imagine that Blunt filtered requests for support from Grant .Now they talk directly to the sole financial benefactor .Morever he has just reiterated his ambition for the club .The activity in the transfer market over the next month will to a great extent both define our season and provide Grant with the reassurance he must be seeking about financial support for squad strengthening
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The point about competing the championship is key. That costs a lot of money which he must be willing to provide.
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The point about competing the championship is key. That costs a lot of money which he must be willing to provide.
The wage bill would have to increase 6 fold, minimum, to even have a chance of challenging to get promoted to the championship.
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The point about competing the championship is key. That costs a lot of money which he must be willing to provide.
The wage bill would have to increase 6 fold, minimum, to even have a chance of challenging to get promoted to the championship.
To get promoted from League One?
What is the budget roughly now and what do you think it needs to be to have a chance?
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The point about competing the championship is key. That costs a lot of money which he must be willing to provide.
The wage bill would have to increase 6 fold, minimum, to even have a chance of challenging to get promoted to the championship.
Disagree. Not that much. 4 times what it is now I would suggest to have a chance of being very competitive in the Championship.
Our current wage bill will be around 2 million I estimate. That’s not factual just my take on it after doing some maths.
There is no way this club would pay anyone more than £6.000 per week even in the Championship.
To pay all our players that amount we would need gates of 15.000 every home game & a cash injection from TB
With a good manager it would though be possible to be competitive with a wage bill of 6 million + a year.
What we need is a massive sales drive from the club to fill our stadium when we next get to that level.
With the right marketing we can get 12.000 home fans in the Championship.
I can hear people saying we can’t already. Well with that attitude we won’t. But believe me we can. 100% we can.
SoD did it for a few years on less than that. But that was 12 + yrs ago.
But as Rotherham are finding out it’s not possible to sustain 2nd tier football on a wage bill that is well below those of any other club.
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It will if you have to buy promotion Gaz, but even now it should be possible to build a side with astute signings and bringing players through the academy.
For that to happen things need to be done on the team management side, the manager has to have a clear understanding of the job in front of him and what pieces he has to put in place to achieve his goals.
There must be no outside influences and interference in his remit to build a side, and time given to them to again achieve the cubs goal.
The transfer market must be played correctly, and knowledge of who would replace a player we sold before that situation arises ( if successful we would be a selling club) bigger clubs would be attracted to our players and that could be a self acting money income for the club to go forward if played correctly.
As I see it that is our only hope of getting as you say to the Championship and is a long way off, but if managers here put a team together off and on the field of play, and are not interfered with they should have every chance of improving the clubs standing, and the confidence to get on with their job without the threat of being run out of town at the first sight of things going wrong.
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The point about competing the championship is key. That costs a lot of money which he must be willing to provide.
I think the biggest mistake that everybody makes is that they keep assuming that TB doesn't like football and doesn't enjoy his time at the club. I can assure everybody that he does.
He also sees the clubs place in the local community as well, and knows how much it means to the community to have a successful club that they can support. They go hand in hand.
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The point about competing the championship is key. That costs a lot of money which he must be willing to provide.
The wage bill would have to increase 6 fold, minimum, to even have a chance of challenging to get promoted to the championship.
I understand what you are saying but I'd be astonished if Stevenage were paying 6 times our wage bill.
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The point about competing the championship is key. That costs a lot of money which he must be willing to provide.
The wage bill would have to increase 6 fold, minimum, to even have a chance of challenging to get promoted to the championship.
I understand what you are saying but I'd be astonished if Stevenage were paying 6 times our wage bill.
That was a typo actually, it was meant to be 4. ~£1.5m (best guess btw, no inside knowledge there) now to £6m ish to challenge realistically. Thats factoring in the value we have had out of our budget in recent years. We won’t get the same value for out £ as Brentford would for example.
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The point about competing the championship is key. That costs a lot of money which he must be willing to provide.
The wage bill would have to increase 6 fold, minimum, to even have a chance of challenging to get promoted to the championship.
Disagree. Not that much. 4 times what it is now I would suggest to have a chance of being very competitive in the Championship.
Our current wage bill will be around 2 million I estimate. That’s not factual just my take on it after doing some maths.
There is no way this club would pay anyone more than £6.000 per week even in the Championship.
To pay all our players that amount we would need gates of 15.000 every home game & a cash injection from TB
With a good manager it would though be possible to be competitive with a wage bill of 6 million + a year.
What we need is a massive sales drive from the club to fill our stadium when we next get to that level.
With the right marketing we can get 12.000 home fans in the Championship.
I can hear people saying we can’t already. Well with that attitude we won’t. But believe me we can. 100% we can.
SoD did it for a few years on less than that. But that was 12 + yrs ago.
But as Rotherham are finding out it’s not possible to sustain 2nd tier football on a wage bill that is well below those of any other club.
£10m isn’t enough in the championship these days.
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I’m not particularly thinking in terms of the Championship at all, as we’re a million miles away from it right now. There is still much work to do, even though we’ve supposedly had ‘root and branch’ reviews, etc.
For example, we’ve had an ongoing injury crisis every season for the last 3 or 4 years or more and we’ve not got anywhere near getting to the bottom of it. Maybe the latest addition to the medical team was brought in for that very reason?
As for recruitment, well, let’s be kind and say that it’s been far from where it should have been over the last 2 or 3 seasons. We simply do not pick up quality players anymore and we’re paying the price for that. Even GM, with his splurge in the summer, hasn’t brought many quality lads in, maybe Ironside has been there and done it. Something needs to change and quickly if we’re to be more competitive, even in this league!
With Blunt going (thankfully imho) that must surely leave room for someone to come in and help the remaining 2. Let’s see.
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To think about championship we need a reliable stream of players develop, like Whiteman or Marquis, and sell for big money. Use that wisely instead of whatever we did after selling them and then it can help take some of the financial pressure on funding a higher budget off the owners.
Ok won’t always work and might not help push further than been a yo yo club but without this we are just hoping Terry fancies throwing away some money.
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The point about competing the championship is key. That costs a lot of money which he must be willing to provide.
The wage bill would have to increase 6 fold, minimum, to even have a chance of challenging to get promoted to the championship.
I understand what you are saying but I'd be astonished if Stevenage were paying 6 times our wage bill.
Absolutely. Stevenage's attendances are abysmal for League 1.
Either someone is pumping millions into the club, which is doubtful, or Fatty Evans is a managerial genius.
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The point about competing the championship is key. That costs a lot of money which he must be willing to provide.
The wage bill would have to increase 6 fold, minimum, to even have a chance of challenging to get promoted to the championship.
Disagree. Not that much. 4 times what it is now I would suggest to have a chance of being very competitive in the Championship.
Our current wage bill will be around 2 million I estimate. That’s not factual just my take on it after doing some maths.
There is no way this club would pay anyone more than £6.000 per week even in the Championship.
To pay all our players that amount we would need gates of 15.000 every home game & a cash injection from TB
With a good manager it would though be possible to be competitive with a wage bill of 6 million + a year.
What we need is a massive sales drive from the club to fill our stadium when we next get to that level.
With the right marketing we can get 12.000 home fans in the Championship.
I can hear people saying we can’t already. Well with that attitude we won’t. But believe me we can. 100% we can.
SoD did it for a few years on less than that. But that was 12 + yrs ago.
But as Rotherham are finding out it’s not possible to sustain 2nd tier football on a wage bill that is well below those of any other club.
£10m isn’t enough in the championship these days.
Our last wage bill in the championship was £14.2m , to finish rock bottom .
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The point about competing the championship is key. That costs a lot of money which he must be willing to provide.
The wage bill would have to increase 6 fold, minimum, to even have a chance of challenging to get promoted to the championship.
Disagree. Not that much. 4 times what it is now I would suggest to have a chance of being very competitive in the Championship.
Our current wage bill will be around 2 million I estimate. That’s not factual just my take on it after doing some maths.
There is no way this club would pay anyone more than £6.000 per week even in the Championship.
To pay all our players that amount we would need gates of 15.000 every home game & a cash injection from TB
With a good manager it would though be possible to be competitive with a wage bill of 6 million + a year.
What we need is a massive sales drive from the club to fill our stadium when we next get to that level.
With the right marketing we can get 12.000 home fans in the Championship.
I can hear people saying we can’t already. Well with that attitude we won’t. But believe me we can. 100% we can.
SoD did it for a few years on less than that. But that was 12 + yrs ago.
But as Rotherham are finding out it’s not possible to sustain 2nd tier football on a wage bill that is well below those of any other club.
£10m isn’t enough in the championship these days.
Our last wage bill in the championship was £14.2m , to finish rock bottom .
That is quite simply frightening,Rovers would need to be producing a consistent stream of young players and selling one or two a year for a few millions - bloody hard is that.
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The income received from EFL rises by approx another £6m I believe before even kicking a ball.
Seems JR's behind the move and has posted another rallying call...
"NEED 10K THERE ON FRIDAY SUPPORT TERRY GAVIN GRANT RTID"
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The point about competing the championship is key. That costs a lot of money which he must be willing to provide.
The wage bill would have to increase 6 fold, minimum, to even have a chance of challenging to get promoted to the championship.
Disagree. Not that much. 4 times what it is now I would suggest to have a chance of being very competitive in the Championship.
Our current wage bill will be around 2 million I estimate. That’s not factual just my take on it after doing some maths.
There is no way this club would pay anyone more than £6.000 per week even in the Championship.
To pay all our players that amount we would need gates of 15.000 every home game & a cash injection from TB
With a good manager it would though be possible to be competitive with a wage bill of 6 million + a year.
What we need is a massive sales drive from the club to fill our stadium when we next get to that level.
With the right marketing we can get 12.000 home fans in the Championship.
I can hear people saying we can’t already. Well with that attitude we won’t. But believe me we can. 100% we can.
SoD did it for a few years on less than that. But that was 12 + yrs ago.
But as Rotherham are finding out it’s not possible to sustain 2nd tier football on a wage bill that is well below those of any other club.
£10m isn’t enough in the championship these days.
Our last wage bill in the championship was £14.2m , to finish rock bottom .
That is quite simply frightening,Rovers would need to be producing a consistent stream of young players and selling one or two a year for a few millions - bloody hard is that.
The Brentford formula seems to be working well....
https://www.skysports.com/football/news/11748/12379041/brentford-how-thomas-franks-bees-completed-a-remarkable-rise-to-the-premier-league
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We could not have hoped for better news than this in our present position.
Assuming that it is generally agreed that McCann is accepted as the man to manage us onwards and upwards, it is time to examine how the entire football enterprise needs to change and be funded for such a change. Not getting fit players out week in week out has been a failure and it cannot all be bad luck. Until we have the infrastructure in place to maintain the fitness, morale and general health of the playing staff we cannot compete and fully and effectively deploy the resources that we possess. Anyone on the backroom staff who is not up to the mark (and there must have been lots who have come and gone or still be there and not even good enough for League 2 support) needs to be replaced. You might wonder whether having played for the club has been a factor in choosing such people in the past.
The shortcomings of the players we have need to be ruthlessly addressed. To be outclassed by Morecambe is a severe humiliation and I am tired of hearing the "perspective" argument. For some people the perspective is constantly adjusted downwards and insults fly in the direction of those who are "negative". We are entitled to blame the defence and the goalkeeper when in their disorganisation they let in 5 goals, every one of which passed within a foot or two of defenders and the current goalkeeper who is nowhere near EFL standard and has cost us so many points this season.
A club that has had 3 heads of recruitment in around the same number of years is not getting the right people in and it seems that the outgoing Chairman failed to realise this or to do something about getting someone better.
Funds would be well spent paying off those players who have no prospect of reaching even decent League 2 standard and there are a good few of those. If we are to get loanees we must get people who are worth a place in the first team. We used to get good loan players, but barring two obvious ones, most of the current lot are a waste of money and another failure in recruitment. Again, quality is obviously more expensive, but paying a bit less for someone who is not worth a place in the team is a total waste of money.
Basically people do not seem prepared to face the fact that this is a relatively new set of players who are failing - chosen from the best of last season and fresh people signed up in the summer. At the same stage of last season we had 31 points and spent the majority of the season in the top half of the table.
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We cannot afford to compete in the championship without someone paying for it. 5 or 6 times our wage bill, absolutely no chance we generate the same difference in revenue being in the championship v now.
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The point about competing the championship is key. That costs a lot of money which he must be willing to provide.
The wage bill would have to increase 6 fold, minimum, to even have a chance of challenging to get promoted to the championship.
Disagree. Not that much. 4 times what it is now I would suggest to have a chance of being very competitive in the Championship.
Our current wage bill will be around 2 million I estimate. That’s not factual just my take on it after doing some maths.
There is no way this club would pay anyone more than £6.000 per week even in the Championship.
To pay all our players that amount we would need gates of 15.000 every home game & a cash injection from TB
With a good manager it would though be possible to be competitive with a wage bill of 6 million + a year.
What we need is a massive sales drive from the club to fill our stadium when we next get to that level.
With the right marketing we can get 12.000 home fans in the Championship.
I can hear people saying we can’t already. Well with that attitude we won’t. But believe me we can. 100% we can.
SoD did it for a few years on less than that. But that was 12 + yrs ago.
But as Rotherham are finding out it’s not possible to sustain 2nd tier football on a wage bill that is well below those of any other club.
£10m isn’t enough in the championship these days.
Our last wage bill in the championship was £14.2m , to finish rock bottom .
That is quite simply frightening,Rovers would need to be producing a consistent stream of young players and selling one or two a year for a few millions - bloody hard is that.
The Brentford formula seems to be working well....
https://www.skysports.com/football/news/11748/12379041/brentford-how-thomas-franks-bees-completed-a-remarkable-rise-to-the-premier-league
Don't be fooled into thinking making profit on player trading has got them to where they are.
They may still be called Brentford but it's a completely different club now.
Whilst there is plenty to admire, the risks are huge. Here's some further facts and figures to make your eyes water. They only generate 19% of their own overall income according to this, and that's wven taking into account their additional income since moving rom Griifin Park.
https://theathletic.com/4359991/2023/03/29/brentford-accounts-record-turnover/
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The point about competing the championship is key. That costs a lot of money which he must be willing to provide.
The wage bill would have to increase 6 fold, minimum, to even have a chance of challenging to get promoted to the championship.
Disagree. Not that much. 4 times what it is now I would suggest to have a chance of being very competitive in the Championship.
Our current wage bill will be around 2 million I estimate. That’s not factual just my take on it after doing some maths.
There is no way this club would pay anyone more than £6.000 per week even in the Championship.
To pay all our players that amount we would need gates of 15.000 every home game & a cash injection from TB
With a good manager it would though be possible to be competitive with a wage bill of 6 million + a year.
What we need is a massive sales drive from the club to fill our stadium when we next get to that level.
With the right marketing we can get 12.000 home fans in the Championship.
I can hear people saying we can’t already. Well with that attitude we won’t. But believe me we can. 100% we can.
SoD did it for a few years on less than that. But that was 12 + yrs ago.
But as Rotherham are finding out it’s not possible to sustain 2nd tier football on a wage bill that is well below those of any other club.
£10m isn’t enough in the championship these days.
Our last wage bill in the championship was £14.2m , to finish rock bottom .
That is quite simply frightening,Rovers would need to be producing a consistent stream of young players and selling one or two a year for a few millions - bloody hard is that.
The Brentford formula seems to be working well....
https://www.skysports.com/football/news/11748/12379041/brentford-how-thomas-franks-bees-completed-a-remarkable-rise-to-the-premier-league
Don't be fooled into thinking making profit on player trading has got them to where they are.
They may still be called Brentford but it's a completely different club now.
Whilst there is plenty to admire, the risks are huge. Here's some further facts and figures to make your eyes water. They only generate 19% of their own overall income according to this, and that's wven taking into account their additional income since moving rom Griifin Park.
https://theathletic.com/4359991/2023/03/29/brentford-accounts-record-turnover/
Matthew Benham is one of the smartest men to ever have any interest in football. He put money in knowing he would get it back and then some in the future. He had a model that had been trialed successfully with football clubs in other countries and a system that won him 100s of million betting. Same as Tony Bloom at Brighton, essentially use maths to win football matches. Thats where the value comes from running a football club in 2023, academia, not ex players.
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Terry supposedly put money in preseason and we are still struggling, we do get good gates at home but still not enough to build on sustainably . So my question is , is the lack of decent results after putting money in , is this all that’s is required , or do we have to overhaul our recruitment and sign prospects and develop them over time or just pay bigger and bigger wages until the right type of players come along !
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The point about competing the championship is key. That costs a lot of money which he must be willing to provide.
The wage bill would have to increase 6 fold, minimum, to even have a chance of challenging to get promoted to the championship.
Disagree. Not that much. 4 times what it is now I would suggest to have a chance of being very competitive in the Championship.
Our current wage bill will be around 2 million I estimate. That’s not factual just my take on it after doing some maths.
There is no way this club would pay anyone more than £6.000 per week even in the Championship.
To pay all our players that amount we would need gates of 15.000 every home game & a cash injection from TB
With a good manager it would though be possible to be competitive with a wage bill of 6 million + a year.
What we need is a massive sales drive from the club to fill our stadium when we next get to that level.
With the right marketing we can get 12.000 home fans in the Championship.
I can hear people saying we can’t already. Well with that attitude we won’t. But believe me we can. 100% we can.
SoD did it for a few years on less than that. But that was 12 + yrs ago.
But as Rotherham are finding out it’s not possible to sustain 2nd tier football on a wage bill that is well below those of any other club.
£10m isn’t enough in the championship these days.
Our last wage bill in the championship was £14.2m , to finish rock bottom .
That is quite simply frightening,Rovers would need to be producing a consistent stream of young players and selling one or two a year for a few millions - bloody hard is that.
The Brentford formula seems to be working well....
https://www.skysports.com/football/news/11748/12379041/brentford-how-thomas-franks-bees-completed-a-remarkable-rise-to-the-premier-league
Don't be fooled into thinking making profit on player trading has got them to where they are.
They may still be called Brentford but it's a completely different club now.
Whilst there is plenty to admire, the risks are huge. Here's some further facts and figures to make your eyes water. They only generate 19% of their own overall income according to this, and that's wven taking into account their additional income since moving rom Griifin Park.
https://theathletic.com/4359991/2023/03/29/brentford-accounts-record-turnover/
Of course, there's a risk. As Tyke said, Barnsley forked out over £14m in wages to finish bottom of the Championship. but I'm sure TB was aware of the cost involved in Championship football when he said we can rebuild the club and have those (Championship) aspirations again.
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You seem to have overlooked the injuries
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The point about competing the championship is key. That costs a lot of money which he must be willing to provide.
The wage bill would have to increase 6 fold, minimum, to even have a chance of challenging to get promoted to the championship.
I understand what you are saying but I'd be astonished if Stevenage were paying 6 times our wage bill.
That was a typo actually, it was meant to be 4. ~£1.5m (best guess btw, no inside knowledge there) now to £6m ish to challenge realistically. Thats factoring in the value we have had out of our budget in recent years. We won’t get the same value for out £ as Brentford would for example.
£6m feels like a really decent budget in League One but it is interesting that the last time we made it out (upwards!) of League One, our wage bill was more - £6.3m in 2012/13. In a decade that would be something if the wage budget at that point hasn’t increased.
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The point about competing the championship is key. That costs a lot of money which he must be willing to provide.
The wage bill would have to increase 6 fold, minimum, to even have a chance of challenging to get promoted to the championship.
Disagree. Not that much. 4 times what it is now I would suggest to have a chance of being very competitive in the Championship.
Our current wage bill will be around 2 million I estimate. That’s not factual just my take on it after doing some maths.
There is no way this club would pay anyone more than £6.000 per week even in the Championship.
To pay all our players that amount we would need gates of 15.000 every home game & a cash injection from TB
With a good manager it would though be possible to be competitive with a wage bill of 6 million + a year.
What we need is a massive sales drive from the club to fill our stadium when we next get to that level.
With the right marketing we can get 12.000 home fans in the Championship.
I can hear people saying we can’t already. Well with that attitude we won’t. But believe me we can. 100% we can.
SoD did it for a few years on less than that. But that was 12 + yrs ago.
But as Rotherham are finding out it’s not possible to sustain 2nd tier football on a wage bill that is well below those of any other club.
£10m isn’t enough in the championship these days.
Our last wage bill in the championship was £14.2m , to finish rock bottom .
That is quite simply frightening,Rovers would need to be producing a consistent stream of young players and selling one or two a year for a few millions - bloody hard is that.
The Brentford formula seems to be working well....
https://www.skysports.com/football/news/11748/12379041/brentford-how-thomas-franks-bees-completed-a-remarkable-rise-to-the-premier-league
Don't be fooled into thinking making profit on player trading has got them to where they are.
They may still be called Brentford but it's a completely different club now.
Whilst there is plenty to admire, the risks are huge. Here's some further facts and figures to make your eyes water. They only generate 19% of their own overall income according to this, and that's wven taking into account their additional income since moving rom Griifin Park.
https://theathletic.com/4359991/2023/03/29/brentford-accounts-record-turnover/
Matthew Benham is one of the smartest men to ever have any interest in football. He put money in knowing he would get it back and then some in the future. He had a model that had been trialed successfully with football clubs in other countries and a system that won him 100s of million betting. Same as Tony Bloom at Brighton, essentially use maths to win football matches. Thats where the value comes from running a football club in 2023, academia, not ex players.
Brighton achievement is incredible. As you say Bloom is a very smart man and one who has accumulated astronomical wealth through gambling.
"Tony Bloom, who has invested the best part of half a billion pounds into the Seagulls since becoming chairman in 2009"
As said, as well as being smart, you have to be able to afford to take huge financial risks.
How many clubs can follow the examples of Bloom and Benham? Several have tried and failed and have/are paying the price.
We won't be following their 'models' any time soon.
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Southern club also. None of those lads they sign would come if it were Carlisle or Hull.
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The point about competing the championship is key. That costs a lot of money which he must be willing to provide.
I think the biggest mistake that everybody makes is that they keep assuming that TB doesn't like football and doesn't enjoy his time at the club. I can assure everybody that he does.
He also sees the clubs place in the local community as well, and knows how much it means to the community to have a successful club that they can support. They go hand in hand.
This.
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The point about competing the championship is key. That costs a lot of money which he must be willing to provide.
The wage bill would have to increase 6 fold, minimum, to even have a chance of challenging to get promoted to the championship.
Disagree. Not that much. 4 times what it is now I would suggest to have a chance of being very competitive in the Championship.
Our current wage bill will be around 2 million I estimate. That’s not factual just my take on it after doing some maths.
There is no way this club would pay anyone more than £6.000 per week even in the Championship.
To pay all our players that amount we would need gates of 15.000 every home game & a cash injection from TB
With a good manager it would though be possible to be competitive with a wage bill of 6 million + a year.
What we need is a massive sales drive from the club to fill our stadium when we next get to that level.
With the right marketing we can get 12.000 home fans in the Championship.
I can hear people saying we can’t already. Well with that attitude we won’t. But believe me we can. 100% we can.
SoD did it for a few years on less than that. But that was 12 + yrs ago.
But as Rotherham are finding out it’s not possible to sustain 2nd tier football on a wage bill that is well below those of any other club.
£10m isn’t enough in the championship these days.
Our last wage bill in the championship was £14.2m , to finish rock bottom .
That’s crazy Tyke.
How many millions are Barnsley now in debt because of that wage bill?
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The point about competing the championship is key. That costs a lot of money which he must be willing to provide.
The wage bill would have to increase 6 fold, minimum, to even have a chance of challenging to get promoted to the championship.
I understand what you are saying but I'd be astonished if Stevenage were paying 6 times our wage bill.
That was a typo actually, it was meant to be 4. ~£1.5m (best guess btw, no inside knowledge there) now to £6m ish to challenge realistically. Thats factoring in the value we have had out of our budget in recent years. We won’t get the same value for out £ as Brentford would for example.
£6m feels like a really decent budget in League One but it is interesting that the last time we made it out (upwards!) of League One, our wage bill was more - £6.3m in 2012/13. In a decade that would be something if the wage budget at that point hasn’t increased.
Where do you get that 6.3 million from CBcb
I don’t think our wage bill was much over 4 million in 2012/13.
Do you have any evidence for that figure?
Suggest we ask JR as he will know.
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IMO got to be a good move for the club. Blunt was not popular and it shows Bramall is committed to the club and not wanting to slide away into retirement. It can’t be bad having the owner more involved at a hands-on level. Presumably saves on Blunt’s salary right now and I don't see it has to have any effect on the shareholding.
Blunt won’t have had a salary at DRFC.
He was not a full time employee. In fact I don’t think he was even part time !!! ;)
Gavin Baldwin is a full time employee and a shareholder and as CEO is on a salary.
He is in effect the man that runs our football club & Club Doncaster.
What Blunt did? Well I am still trying to find out what he did. Apart from the obvious. Look at where we are in the pyramid compared to where we were 9 yrs ago.
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Blunt ran the club like a business instead of a football club, every decision made would have been made to minimise any losses, thats probably why Keepmoat was the success that it was, but Football Clubs are different
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I think if you asked most Rovers fans, they wouldn't actually expect to be a regular fixture in the Championship.
However, I think the modern day Rovers (and I'm not talking about the 80s and 90s rattling around the 4th tier at Belle Vue) has a certain standard that it would be par to attain, given the fanbase, stadium, resources and facilities the club has, and that to me is at least mid-table League One.
Obviously there would be seasons where we might do better than that, and some where we might do worse, but to be a hair's breadth away from the very worst sides in the entire EFL clearly isn't satisfactory these days. TB obviously thinks so or I don't think he would've pivoted from the previous strategy in the summer and dispensed with a chairman who he has a long-standing working relationship with.
It would be lovely to have Championship ambitions again, but let's get back to L1 first and be competitive there, as even that feels a million miles away at the moment. I think we can all feel OK about ourselves again then if we can achieve that.
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The point about competing the championship is key. That costs a lot of money which he must be willing to provide.
The wage bill would have to increase 6 fold, minimum, to even have a chance of challenging to get promoted to the championship.
I understand what you are saying but I'd be astonished if Stevenage were paying 6 times our wage bill.
That was a typo actually, it was meant to be 4. ~£1.5m (best guess btw, no inside knowledge there) now to £6m ish to challenge realistically. Thats factoring in the value we have had out of our budget in recent years. We won’t get the same value for out £ as Brentford would for example.
£6m feels like a really decent budget in League One but it is interesting that the last time we made it out (upwards!) of League One, our wage bill was more - £6.3m in 2012/13. In a decade that would be something if the wage budget at that point hasn’t increased.
Where do you get that 6.3 million from CBcb
I don’t think our wage bill was much over 4 million in 2012/13.
Do you have any evidence for that figure?
Suggest we ask JR as he will know.
It was included in our statutory accounts for the trading year ending June 2013.
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I think if you asked most Rovers fans, they wouldn't actually expect to be a regular fixture in the Championship.
However, I think the modern day Rovers (and I'm not talking about the 80s and 90s rattling around the 4th tier at Belle Vue) has a certain standard that it would be par to attain, given the fanbase, stadium, resources and facilities the club has, and that to me is at least mid-table League One.
Obviously there would be seasons where we might do better than that, and some where we might do worse, but to be a hair's breadth away from the very worst sides in the entire EFL clearly isn't satisfactory these days. TB obviously thinks so or I don't think he would've pivoted from the previous strategy in the summer and dispensed with a chairman who he has a long-standing working relationship with.
It would be lovely to have Championship ambitions again, but let's get back to L1 first and be competitive there, as even that feels a million miles away at the moment. I think we can all feel OK about ourselves again then if we can achieve that.
100% this.
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Hopefully we'll hear from Terry directly about his plans soon
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League One is a very good level. Always some big clubs down there. Usually Barnsley and Rotherham. Decent away grounds. Maybe a tilt at play offs every few seasons. That’s a decent result for us and we should aim to get back there. Perhaps even making it to Championship at some point, although unlikely to remain long. If Terry can deliver us back into top half of League One I think most would consider that a job well done.
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Ah, but once you’ve tasted Championship Football……
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We've just got to make the initial breakthrough. Break the chain of the same cycle we've seen with the last few managers.
TB may have already put things in place to break the chain but we have yet to see a full severing of the links to a losing, hard luck victim mentality that seems to manifest post January.
Whilst we are generally so pragmatic about January transfer windows, it would be great to be surprised with what McCann does pull out of the bag to break that mould and get us excited again.
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I'm sure Grant knows by now, if he didn't already, that the squad re-shaping efforts done in the summer are probably only 1/3 to 1/2 of what is required. We need better/more robust (delete as appropriate) players in place of Anderson, Wood, Miller, Rowe, Taylor, the goalkeepers, Biggins, Long, Lavery, and possibly Molyneux as well. There's a very decent chunk of budget there I would imagine.
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I think if you asked most Rovers fans, they wouldn't actually expect to be a regular fixture in the Championship.
However, I think the modern day Rovers (and I'm not talking about the 80s and 90s rattling around the 4th tier at Belle Vue) has a certain standard that it would be par to attain, given the fanbase, stadium, resources and facilities the club has, and that to me is at least mid-table League One.
Obviously there would be seasons where we might do better than that, and some where we might do worse, but to be a hair's breadth away from the very worst sides in the entire EFL clearly isn't satisfactory these days. TB obviously thinks so or I don't think he would've pivoted from the previous strategy in the summer and dispensed with a chairman who he has a long-standing working relationship with.
It would be lovely to have Championship ambitions again, but let's get back to L1 first and be competitive there, as even that feels a million miles away at the moment. I think we can all feel OK about ourselves again then if we can achieve that.
100% this.
Seconded
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I'm sure Grant knows by now, if he didn't already, that the squad re-shaping efforts done in the summer are probably only 1/3 to 1/2 of what is required. We need better/more robust (delete as appropriate) players in place of Anderson, Wood, Miller, Rowe, Taylor, the goalkeepers, Biggins, Long, Lavery, and possibly Molyneux as well. There's a very decent chunk of budget there I would imagine.
Didn't he say in an interview that it would take another 1 or 2 years to sort the Club out?
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The point about competing the championship is key. That costs a lot of money which he must be willing to provide.
The wage bill would have to increase 6 fold, minimum, to even have a chance of challenging to get promoted to the championship.
Disagree. Not that much. 4 times what it is now I would suggest to have a chance of being very competitive in the Championship.
Our current wage bill will be around 2 million I estimate. That’s not factual just my take on it after doing some maths.
There is no way this club would pay anyone more than £6.000 per week even in the Championship.
To pay all our players that amount we would need gates of 15.000 every home game & a cash injection from TB
With a good manager it would though be possible to be competitive with a wage bill of 6 million + a year.
What we need is a massive sales drive from the club to fill our stadium when we next get to that level.
With the right marketing we can get 12.000 home fans in the Championship.
I can hear people saying we can’t already. Well with that attitude we won’t. But believe me we can. 100% we can.
SoD did it for a few years on less than that. But that was 12 + yrs ago.
But as Rotherham are finding out it’s not possible to sustain 2nd tier football on a wage bill that is well below those of any other club.
I would imagine a mid-range Championship club will be paying double your £6m estimate Campsall.
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The point about competing the championship is key. That costs a lot of money which he must be willing to provide.
The wage bill would have to increase 6 fold, minimum, to even have a chance of challenging to get promoted to the championship.
I understand what you are saying but I'd be astonished if Stevenage were paying 6 times our wage bill.
That was a typo actually, it was meant to be 4. ~£1.5m (best guess btw, no inside knowledge there) now to £6m ish to challenge realistically. Thats factoring in the value we have had out of our budget in recent years. We won’t get the same value for out £ as Brentford would for example.
£6m feels like a really decent budget in League One but it is interesting that the last time we made it out (upwards!) of League One, our wage bill was more - £6.3m in 2012/13. In a decade that would be something if the wage budget at that point hasn’t increased.
Where do you get that 6.3 million from CBcb
I don’t think our wage bill was much over 4 million in 2012/13.
Do you have any evidence for that figure?
Suggest we ask JR as he will know.
It was included in our statutory accounts for the trading year ending June 2013.
Yeah ok but ......
Campsall - where do you get your £4m figure from? Do you have any evidence for that?
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I'm sure Grant knows by now, if he didn't already, that the squad re-shaping efforts done in the summer are probably only 1/3 to 1/2 of what is required. We need better/more robust (delete as appropriate) players in place of Anderson, Wood, Miller, Rowe, Taylor, the goalkeepers, Biggins, Long, Lavery, and possibly Molyneux as well. There's a very decent chunk of budget there I would imagine.
Didn't he say in an interview that it would take another 1 or 2 years to sort the Club out?
I don't know about that, but he said in an early interview that the play-offs were the aim this season.
He knows now, as we all do, that we've underachieved terribly so far this season. Let's hope Terry sorts it all out.
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The point about competing the championship is key. That costs a lot of money which he must be willing to provide.
The wage bill would have to increase 6 fold, minimum, to even have a chance of challenging to get promoted to the championship.
Disagree. Not that much. 4 times what it is now I would suggest to have a chance of being very competitive in the Championship.
Our current wage bill will be around 2 million I estimate. That’s not factual just my take on it after doing some maths.
There is no way this club would pay anyone more than £6.000 per week even in the Championship.
To pay all our players that amount we would need gates of 15.000 every home game & a cash injection from TB
With a good manager it would though be possible to be competitive with a wage bill of 6 million + a year.
What we need is a massive sales drive from the club to fill our stadium when we next get to that level.
With the right marketing we can get 12.000 home fans in the Championship.
I can hear people saying we can’t already. Well with that attitude we won’t. But believe me we can. 100% we can.
SoD did it for a few years on less than that. But that was 12 + yrs ago.
But as Rotherham are finding out it’s not possible to sustain 2nd tier football on a wage bill that is well below those of any other club.
I would imagine a mid-range Championship club will be paying double your £6m estimate Campsall.
The owner of Preston has to pump in £12m a year just to stand still. Football has become totally unrealistic, so the sooner the Independent Regulator kicks in the better.
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The point about competing the championship is key. That costs a lot of money which he must be willing to provide.
The wage bill would have to increase 6 fold, minimum, to even have a chance of challenging to get promoted to the championship.
Disagree. Not that much. 4 times what it is now I would suggest to have a chance of being very competitive in the Championship.
Our current wage bill will be around 2 million I estimate. That’s not factual just my take on it after doing some maths.
There is no way this club would pay anyone more than £6.000 per week even in the Championship.
To pay all our players that amount we would need gates of 15.000 every home game & a cash injection from TB
With a good manager it would though be possible to be competitive with a wage bill of 6 million + a year.
What we need is a massive sales drive from the club to fill our stadium when we next get to that level.
With the right marketing we can get 12.000 home fans in the Championship.
I can hear people saying we can’t already. Well with that attitude we won’t. But believe me we can. 100% we can.
SoD did it for a few years on less than that. But that was 12 + yrs ago.
But as Rotherham are finding out it’s not possible to sustain 2nd tier football on a wage bill that is well below those of any other club.
I would imagine a mid-range Championship club will be paying double your £6m estimate Campsall.
The owner of Preston has to pump in £12m a year just to stand still. Football has become totally unrealistic, so the sooner the Independent Regulator kicks in the better.
Amen to that.
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I'm sure Grant knows by now, if he didn't already, that the squad re-shaping efforts done in the summer are probably only 1/3 to 1/2 of what is required. We need better/more robust (delete as appropriate) players in place of Anderson, Wood, Miller, Rowe, Taylor, the goalkeepers, Biggins, Long, Lavery, and possibly Molyneux as well. There's a very decent chunk of budget there I would imagine.
Didn't he say in an interview that it would take another 1 or 2 years to sort the Club out?
I don't know about that, but he said in an early interview that the play-offs were the aim this season.
He knows now, as we all do, that we've underachieved terribly so far this season. Let's hope Terry sorts it all out.
And he said in an even earlier interview that anything less than promotion would be a failure.
He also said that the signings he had made were with a view to them being a force in L1.
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League One is a very good level.
Top 10 or maybe top half of League 1 is a decent standard agreed. After that It's only a tiny fraction better than L2 . Lot's of poor sides in L1 every season, but those decent sides make it a very difficult league to get out of.
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The point about competing the championship is key. That costs a lot of money which he must be willing to provide.
The wage bill would have to increase 6 fold, minimum, to even have a chance of challenging to get promoted to the championship.
I understand what you are saying but I'd be astonished if Stevenage were paying 6 times our wage bill.
That was a typo actually, it was meant to be 4. ~£1.5m (best guess btw, no inside knowledge there) now to £6m ish to challenge realistically. Thats factoring in the value we have had out of our budget in recent years. We won’t get the same value for out £ as Brentford would for example.
£6m feels like a really decent budget in League One but it is interesting that the last time we made it out (upwards!) of League One, our wage bill was more - £6.3m in 2012/13. In a decade that would be something if the wage budget at that point hasn’t increased.
Where do you get that 6.3 million from CBcb
I don’t think our wage bill was much over 4 million in 2012/13.
Do you have any evidence for that figure?
Suggest we ask JR as he will know.
It was included in our statutory accounts for the trading year ending June 2013.
Yeah ok but ......
Campsall - where do you get your £4m figure from? Do you have any evidence for that?
No I don’t. I vaguely remember that figure being mentioned at the time.
I wasn’t trying to be clever just wondered where your figure came from that’s all.
If it’s in the audited accounts then fair enough.
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I think the self sustainability model of looking for talent , selling for decent profit and reinvesting back in to the squad with the aim of securing championship football does come from a good place .
It comes from a good place rather than the club should be bankrolled and many football fans are very good at spending somebody else's money .
The reality and I speak as a supporter whose club have adopted this model since 2015 and found and sold a good number of players for very good money is that it's hugely difficult to be successful with .
Continuously selling your best players is one thing but having to find new recruits regularly whilst trying to be successful is another .
The flaw with the model is you have to be extremely good with the replacements with at least a 70% success rate and that is a big ask given the industry standard is around 40% .
Eventually with the almost inevitable relegation from the championship you then run out of money which is precisely what's happened over here .
I'm not saying it can't be done but the recruitment team need to be absolutely top notch and deliver players who can hit the ground running in the championship even though you've generally recruited them from a lower level .
The championship is no league to be learning on the job , you just get smashed .
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Maybe the answer is already on this site if you trawl back far enough, as to what our budgets have been. Let’s be fair though, it has become impossible to say what our budgets have been over the last few seasons, as they’re not displayed, so it’s guesswork.
I think a few are misinterpreting what has been said, re Championship football. What TB said was having ‘aspirations’ of being in the Championship again. What I think that means is building a side of being able to compete at the top end of L1. That is exactly where we were prior to GM leaving last time! Then the wheels totally fell off!
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I think it is necessary to hear Mr Bramall say what he thinks has gone wrong over the last 3 years.
McCann said post-Morecambe that David Rennie has been brought in to get to the bottom of the yearly injury situations.
He also said that work on recruitment needs to be better with the use of statistics but also answering questions like; Are players robust? What are they like mentally?
But other league 2 teams already have a grasp of the points above. Hopefully our coaching staff can be the edge.
In terms of the club as a whole, how is this vision going to be worked towards in the practical sense? What changes are going to be made? We aren’t going to get back to the top end of league one simply by dreaming of it.
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I might be rose tinted glasses but I don’t think our recruitment this summer was bad. In hindsight we should have known better than offering Wood a deal and signed someone in their prime. But other than that I couldn’t knock it.
Yes previous years were terrible and in truth all those who played under Schofield and McSheffery need to leave club. But this summer was good imo. But for injuries we could have had Ironside, Faal, Miller and Marsh competing up front. That’s good at this level isn’t it?
Injuries and player fitness is a big problem that imo is more urgent after seeing last summers business. Of course we can always improve that too but if we’re talking priorities fitness and robustness is nr1. No point signing the best players if we consistently injure them, delay and then botch their recovery. And even when they are fit if they run out of steam after 60min they aren’t at a good enough level regardless of ability.
Luckily these problems shouldn’t be that hard to solve. Lots of clubs have a normal amount of injuries and manage to get their player fit to a standard you’d expect of a professional club.
For a start have we had the same doctor, physio, fitness coaches for the last few years? If the answer is yes then it’s bye bye like you would a player or manager who hasn’t been good enough.
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What's the betting on how soon some berk will whinge about TB not being a good chairman simply because he doesn't have the charisma of JR?
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TB does not have the charisma of JR.
JR does not have the charisma of my brothers.
Unfortunately, neither of them are millionaires.
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This is good news but won’t turn our season around. I don’t see what Blunt has had to do with our recruitment/ injuries/lack of ability to defend. Maybe I’m missing something.
It’s just looks like that only TB is prepared to prop up the clubs short fall . But this has to be short term as TB isn’t a football type person and even he must put a lid on the amount of money he can keep putting in , without an exit clause . Is going to be a Sale or transfer of ownership ?
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I might be rose tinted glasses but I don’t think our recruitment this summer was bad. In hindsight we should have known better than offering Wood a deal and signed someone in their prime. But other than that I couldn’t knock it.
Yes previous years were terrible and in truth all those who played under Schofield and McSheffery need to leave club. But this summer was good imo. But for injuries we could have had Ironside, Faal, Miller and Marsh competing up front. That’s good at this level isn’t it?
Injuries and player fitness is a big problem that imo is more urgent after seeing last summers business. Of course we can always improve that too but if we’re talking priorities fitness and robustness is nr1. No point signing the best players if we consistently injure them, delay and then botch their recovery. And even when they are fit if they run out of steam after 60min they aren’t at a good enough level regardless of ability.
Luckily these problems shouldn’t be that hard to solve. Lots of clubs have a normal amount of injuries and manage to get their player fit to a standard you’d expect of a professional club.
For a start have we had the same doctor, physio, fitness coaches for the last few years? If the answer is yes then it’s bye bye like you would a player or manager who hasn’t been good enough.
I reckon Chelsea bought better players than we did this summer. But then they did spend a bit more than we did.
Point?
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I'm sure Grant knows by now, if he didn't already, that the squad re-shaping efforts done in the summer are probably only 1/3 to 1/2 of what is required. We need better/more robust (delete as appropriate) players in place of Anderson, Wood, Miller, Rowe, Taylor, the goalkeepers, Biggins, Long, Lavery, and possibly Molyneux as well. There's a very decent chunk of budget there I would imagine.
Molyneux?! Really!?
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I'm sure Grant knows by now, if he didn't already, that the squad re-shaping efforts done in the summer are probably only 1/3 to 1/2 of what is required. We need better/more robust (delete as appropriate) players in place of Anderson, Wood, Miller, Rowe, Taylor, the goalkeepers, Biggins, Long, Lavery, and possibly Molyneux as well. There's a very decent chunk of budget there I would imagine.
Molyneux?! Really!?
Possibly yeah. He’s pacy and good to watch but does he provide enough output? I think it’s 4 league goals he’s got in his time with us so far.
I’m more than happy to be proven wrong or convinced otherwise on him as I do like him, but is there maybe better out there for the money? Maybe.
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I'm sure Grant knows by now, if he didn't already, that the squad re-shaping efforts done in the summer are probably only 1/3 to 1/2 of what is required. We need better/more robust (delete as appropriate) players in place of Anderson, Wood, Miller, Rowe, Taylor, the goalkeepers, Biggins, Long, Lavery, and possibly Molyneux as well. There's a very decent chunk of budget there I would imagine.
Molyneux?! Really!?
Possibly yeah. He’s pacy and good to watch but does he provide enough output? I think it’s 4 league goals he’s got in his time with us so far.
I’m more than happy to be proven wrong or convinced otherwise on him as I do like him, but is there maybe better out there for the money? Maybe.
Molly will be a better player in a better team. In our better performances this season he has been very influential but yes needs to score more goals and is capable of scoring more.
He is a confidence player and needs a free role. What we need are some proper misters in this team so that players like Molly & Hurst can go and express themselves at the right end of the pitch.
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Molyneux has his failings but is hard working, keeps shape, rarely gets injured and is our top assist provider this season. Question is can we improve him further.
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I might be rose tinted glasses but I don’t think our recruitment this summer was bad. In hindsight we should have known better than offering Wood a deal and signed someone in their prime. But other than that I couldn’t knock it.
Yes previous years were terrible and in truth all those who played under Schofield and McSheffery need to leave club. But this summer was good imo. But for injuries we could have had Ironside, Faal, Miller and Marsh competing up front. That’s good at this level isn’t it?
Injuries and player fitness is a big problem that imo is more urgent after seeing last summers business. Of course we can always improve that too but if we’re talking priorities fitness and robustness is nr1. No point signing the best players if we consistently injure them, delay and then botch their recovery. And even when they are fit if they run out of steam after 60min they aren’t at a good enough level regardless of ability.
Luckily these problems shouldn’t be that hard to solve. Lots of clubs have a normal amount of injuries and manage to get their player fit to a standard you’d expect of a professional club.
For a start have we had the same doctor, physio, fitness coaches for the last few years? If the answer is yes then it’s bye bye like you would a player or manager who hasn’t been good enough.
I reckon Chelsea bought better players than we did this summer. But then they did spend a bit more than we did.
Point?
Good reckoning there. Give yourself a gold star. Great contribution
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I'm sure Grant knows by now, if he didn't already, that the squad re-shaping efforts done in the summer are probably only 1/3 to 1/2 of what is required. We need better/more robust (delete as appropriate) players in place of Anderson, Wood, Miller, Rowe, Taylor, the goalkeepers, Biggins, Long, Lavery, and possibly Molyneux as well. There's a very decent chunk of budget there I would imagine.
Molyneux?! Really!?
Possibly yeah. He’s pacy and good to watch but does he provide enough output? I think it’s 4 league goals he’s got in his time with us so far.
I’m more than happy to be proven wrong or convinced otherwise on him as I do like him, but is there maybe better out there for the money? Maybe.
Leading assist maker this season.
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I'm sure Grant knows by now, if he didn't already, that the squad re-shaping efforts done in the summer are probably only 1/3 to 1/2 of what is required. We need better/more robust (delete as appropriate) players in place of Anderson, Wood, Miller, Rowe, Taylor, the goalkeepers, Biggins, Long, Lavery, and possibly Molyneux as well. There's a very decent chunk of budget there I would imagine.
Molyneux?! Really!?
Possibly yeah. He’s pacy and good to watch but does he provide enough output? I think it’s 4 league goals he’s got in his time with us so far.
I’m more than happy to be proven wrong or convinced otherwise on him as I do like him, but is there maybe better out there for the money? Maybe.
Leading assist maker this season.
Fair enough. Hold my hands up there, happy to be proven wrong. I’ll stand by the others though I think.
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I'm sure Grant knows by now, if he didn't already, that the squad re-shaping efforts done in the summer are probably only 1/3 to 1/2 of what is required. We need better/more robust (delete as appropriate) players in place of Anderson, Wood, Miller, Rowe, Taylor, the goalkeepers, Biggins, Long, Lavery, and possibly Molyneux as well. There's a very decent chunk of budget there I would imagine.
Molyneux?! Really!?
Possibly yeah. He’s pacy and good to watch but does he provide enough output? I think it’s 4 league goals he’s got in his time with us so far.
I’m more than happy to be proven wrong or convinced otherwise on him as I do like him, but is there maybe better out there for the money? Maybe.
Leading assist maker this season.
Fair enough. Hold my hands up there, happy to be proven wrong. I’ll stand by the others though I think.
apart from Jones and Moly you're spot on
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Moly is a good player but needs to add goals to his game
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I'm sure Grant knows by now, if he didn't already, that the squad re-shaping efforts done in the summer are probably only 1/3 to 1/2 of what is required. We need better/more robust (delete as appropriate) players in place of Anderson, Wood, Miller, Rowe, Taylor, the goalkeepers, Biggins, Long, Lavery, and possibly Molyneux as well. There's a very decent chunk of budget there I would imagine.
Molyneux?! Really!?
Possibly yeah. He’s pacy and good to watch but does he provide enough output? I think it’s 4 league goals he’s got in his time with us so far.
I’m more than happy to be proven wrong or convinced otherwise on him as I do like him, but is there maybe better out there for the money? Maybe.
Leading assist maker this season.
Only 4, in 21 matches. Not great.
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I don’t mind Molyneux but when we are challenging at the top end next season (which we will be) I do wonder if he will be a starter for us.
I have my doubts.
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I don’t mind Molyneux but be when we are challenging at the top and next season (which we will be) I do wonder if he will be a starter for us.
I have my doubts.
So have you lost hope for us to challenge this season?
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I don’t mind Molyneux but be when we are challenging at the top and next season (which we will be) I do wonder if he will be a starter for us.
I have my doubts.
So have you lost hope for us to challenge this season?
Yes
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Does anyone know if Terry has bought Blunt our entirely or what the arrangements of the actual deal entails?
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I don’t mind Molyneux but be when we are challenging at the top and next season (which we will be) I do wonder if he will be a starter for us.
I have my doubts.
So have you lost hope for us to challenge this season?
Yes
I think the next 4 games will be the most important games of this season, if we could get 9 points then, I’d say we are in with a shout of reaching the playoffs if we also invest in the January transfer window. Anything less than 9 points then that’s it, regardless of who we being in.
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Does anyone know if Terry has bought Blunt our entirely or what the arrangements of the actual deal entails?
At the moment that’s not happened. We’ll have to wait and see.
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I don’t mind Molyneux but be when we are challenging at the top and next season (which we will be) I do wonder if he will be a starter for us.
I have my doubts.
So have you lost hope for us to challenge this season?
Yes
I think the next 4 games will be the most important games of this season, if we could get 9 points then, I’d say we are in with a shout of reaching the playoffs if we also invest in the January transfer window. Anything less than 9 points then that’s it, regardless of who we being in.
I would agree.
I also don’t think anyone can cope with the amount of injuries we have, so regularly.
Especially when we started so poorly.
I think Grant will have us pushing for top 3 next year.
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Does anyone know if Terry has bought Blunt our entirely or what the arrangements of the actual deal entails?
At the moment that’s not happened. We’ll have to wait and see.
Didn't others that left the club just hand over their share, e.g. Andrew Watson and John Ryan?
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What's the betting on how soon some berk will whinge about TB not being a good chairman simply because he doesn't have the charisma of JR?
And the point of that utterly hypothetical question is ...?
The reason why most of us wanted shut of Blunt is because there's strong evidence that he kept the purse strings tight on the playing budget, and players' wages.
Why do you think Terry's shifted him?
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I don’t mind Molyneux but be when we are challenging at the top and next season (which we will be) I do wonder if he will be a starter for us.
I have my doubts.
So have you lost hope for us to challenge this season?
No - and tongue in cheek would remind readers of our neighbours - Rotherham Utd season 81 - 82 as an example of anything can happen.
30th January 1982
20th position in League 2 ( Championship) with 20 points
P 20
W 6
D 3
L 11
6th March 1982
3rd with 48 points
P 29
W 15
D 3
L 11
Finished 7th on 67 points but many involved still maintain they were ordered by their own powers within not to get promoted that year
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I don’t mind Molyneux but be when we are challenging at the top and next season (which we will be) I do wonder if he will be a starter for us.
I have my doubts.
So have you lost hope for us to challenge this season?
No - and tongue in cheek would remind readers of our neighbours - Rotherham Utd season 81 - 82 as an example of anything can happen.
30th January 1982
20th position in League 2 ( Championship) with 20 points
P 20
W 6
D 3
L 11
6th March 1982
3rd with 48 points
P 29
W 15
D 3
L 11
Finished 7th on 67 points but many involved still maintain they were ordered by their own powers within not to get promoted that year
About 8 years ago, Barnsley were rock bottom of League1 at Christmas. They ended up beating Millwall at Wembley in the play-off final.
These things are rare, but not impossible.
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What's the betting on how soon some berk will whinge about TB not being a good chairman simply because he doesn't have the charisma of JR?
And the point of that utterly hypothetical question is ...?
The reason why most of us wanted shut of Blunt is because there's strong evidence that he kept the purse strings tight on the playing budget, and players' wages.
Why do you think Terry's shifted him?
The point of that hypothetical question is to question how quickly the more moronic section of the fans are going to turn on TB based on an utterly pathetic reason. We've had the 'he's not a football man' b*llocks in this thread already.
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I might be rose tinted glasses but I don’t think our recruitment this summer was bad. In hindsight we should have known better than offering Wood a deal and signed someone in their prime. But other than that I couldn’t knock it.
Yes previous years were terrible and in truth all those who played under Schofield and McSheffery need to leave club. But this summer was good imo. But for injuries we could have had Ironside, Faal, Miller and Marsh competing up front. That’s good at this level isn’t it?
Injuries and player fitness is a big problem that imo is more urgent after seeing last summers business. Of course we can always improve that too but if we’re talking priorities fitness and robustness is nr1. No point signing the best players if we consistently injure them, delay and then botch their recovery. And even when they are fit if they run out of steam after 60min they aren’t at a good enough level regardless of ability.
Luckily these problems shouldn’t be that hard to solve. Lots of clubs have a normal amount of injuries and manage to get their player fit to a standard you’d expect of a professional club.
For a start have we had the same doctor, physio, fitness coaches for the last few years? If the answer is yes then it’s bye bye like you would a player or manager who hasn’t been good enough.
I reckon Chelsea bought better players than we did this summer. But then they did spend a bit more than we did.
Point?
Good reckoning there. Give yourself a gold star. Great contribution
It makes a valid point though. If you have a lot more money to spend, you'd expect to sign better players.
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Some on here should have been around in the Hubert Bates years to see what tight purse strings really was.
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The Tight I agree with but there wasn't a lot of purse strings about.
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Some on here should have been around in the Hubert Bates years to see what tight purse strings really was.
He was so tight that when he farted only dogs could hear it.
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I don’t mind Molyneux but be when we are challenging at the top and next season (which we will be) I do wonder if he will be a starter for us.
I have my doubts.
So have you lost hope for us to challenge this season?
No - and tongue in cheek would remind readers of our neighbours - Rotherham Utd season 81 - 82 as an example of anything can happen.
30th January 1982
20th position in League 2 ( Championship) with 20 points
P 20
W 6
D 3
L 11
6th March 1982
3rd with 48 points
P 29
W 15
D 3
L 11
Finished 7th on 67 points but many involved still maintain they were ordered by their own powers within not to get promoted that year
About 8 years ago, Barnsley were rock bottom of League1 at Christmas. They ended up beating Millwall at Wembley in the play-off final.
These things are rare, but not impossible.
2017/18
Rotherham were 13th in L1 (9 points adrift of the play-offs).
They finished in 4th (11 points clear of 7th)
Beat Shrewsbury 2-0 at Wembley in the final with one Richard Wood grabbing a brace.
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The only brace he’ll get at Rovers would be on his leg!
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I don’t mind Molyneux but be when we are challenging at the top and next season (which we will be) I do wonder if he will be a starter for us.
I have my doubts.
So have you lost hope for us to challenge this season?
No - and tongue in cheek would remind readers of our neighbours - Rotherham Utd season 81 - 82 as an example of anything can happen.
30th January 1982
20th position in League 2 ( Championship) with 20 points
P 20
W 6
D 3
L 11
6th March 1982
3rd with 48 points
P 29
W 15
D 3
L 11
Finished 7th on 67 points but many involved still maintain they were ordered by their own powers within not to get promoted that year
Butchers, something not right with those figures mate.
If they won six and drew three in the first half season that would have given them 21 points.
That would then have made 69 points at the end of the season, not 67.
Sorry matey but I’m just getting in before SS spots it.
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Some on here should have been around in the Hubert Bates years to see what tight purse strings really was.
And there wasn’t much you could do about it back then to let him know how unpopular he was. At least Terry Bramall will know that the vast majority of us recognise his importance to our club. Successful, sensible, educated “owners” are not exactly in the majority in football these days.
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Some on here should have been around in the Hubert Bates years to see what tight purse strings really was.
And there wasn’t much you could do about it back then to let him know how unpopular he was. At least Terry Bramall will know that the vast majority of us recognise his importance to our club. Successful, sensible, educated “owners” are not exactly in the majority in football these days.
Well there are not many sensible ones that’s for sure FR
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You don't become the chairman of a football club at the age of 80-odd for the hell of it.
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The Tight I agree with but there wasn't a lot of purse strings about.
At times, maybe, Brian, but what happened to the £25000 we got for Harry Gregg? That was a colossal amount of money in those days, and it certainly didn't get put into the playing budget, with the 2 successive relegations that followed it.