Viking Supporters Co-operative
Viking Chat => Viking Chat => Topic started by: sf9944 on August 12, 2024, 10:55:18 am
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Firstly only one draw in our league.
Secondly we were the only winning team to have more possession than our opponents. The losers had more possession, often a lot more, than the winners in every other game. At least according to BBC stats.
Does this tell us anything about how teams will be approaching the season tactically in league 2 or is it just a coincidence?
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Possession is irrelevant unless progressive and teams are happy to reduce the size of the pitch by getting between the ball and their own goal making it hard to penetrate a defence.
That is why good strikers are now the main players on the field of play, even at the top level they now feed on less balls into the oppositions penalty area.
I feel the game has progressed from depending on one or two main goal scorers, the teams that have a threat from more than one or two players are now the teams to fear, as tactically one or two players can be starved of the ball, especially at the top level, as PSG and Manchester City found out last season no matter how good the strikers were.
It is a simple game being made difficult, generally the teams that get tight when not in possession and in space when they are in possession, and play the ball quickly forward are the most successful with men arriving late into the edge of the area now a bigger feature in scoring goals, along with less dominating goalkeepers being impeded or weak at collecting high balls into the area compared with much more physical keepers of the past who took the lot out with knees, fists, elbows and a foot up on challenging players.
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Actually two draws of course - forgot about Chesterfield game Friday night.
Interesting thanks Selby.
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Possession is great if you’ve got very very clever players who can do things with the ball and players off the ball making very intelligent movement. But quite frankly, possession becomes farting around with it when you get to league 2 level players, who can only pass confidently backwards and sideways because they’re just not good enough and the movement ahead is non existent or just poor.
Wreaks of over coaching, and looks great on paper. In reality in Lge 2 it becomes hilarious with all the cock ups passing it around the back.
Possession to me means moving it quickly, through the thirds, lots of movement, tempo and aggression. Win it back when lost (famously within 6 seconds??) and move it quickly again, with lots of width and pace to panic opponents.
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Thank you Hull City for proving the farting around theory is indeed correct tonight.
You’re not Barcachuffinlona
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... and of course possession tires and frustrates the opposition chasing the ball to get it back. Better to have the ball and control the game than not have possession. Only goals really count and right now we have some great finishers.
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You’re right there MS, it’s about goals, Leeds 59% fannying around, with Boro thinking’well they’re doing sod all here’ Boro 41%, enough possession for a 3-0 win 17 shots to 12… possession stats become weaker at any level less than the top 6 or so in the premier.
I’ll be at Valencia Barcelona Saturday evening and will be interested to see how Barcelona now play with a lot less talent than they used to have.
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I guess that possession stats may be have different relevance in different divisions. So maybe in the premier league the pattern will be that the team with most possession will more often win, where the first weekend suggests the opposite might be true in league 2.
I'm going to check out whether the trend of winning teams having less possession in league 2 continues this weekend.
First weekend probably a coincidence though. We'll see.
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I guess that possession stats may be have different relevance in different divisions. So maybe in the premier league the pattern will be that the team with most possession will more often win, where the first weekend suggests the opposite might be true in league 2.
I'm going to check out whether the trend of winning teams having less possession in league 2 continues this weekend.
First weekend probably a coincidence though. We'll see.
Good of you to take time out SF to monitor this. Will be interesting to see.
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Quick update on this; the league 2 trend of the team with the least possession winning the game continues in week 2.
Of the 17 games that have been won over the first two weeks, 14 have been won by the team that had the least possession.
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Gaz was saying something similar to this last season. Didn't we have a far better record when having less possession?
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Perhaps the possession stat should be split. Possession in opposition half, possession in own half. As it is it seems a useless measure.
Big thanks to Sheffield Wednesday for again demonstrating passing around aimlessly at the back is total nonsense, though very beneficial for the opposition.
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Perhaps the possession stat should be split. Possession in opposition half, possession in own half. As it is it seems a useless measure.
Big thanks to Sheffield Wednesday for again demonstrating passing around aimlessly at the back is total nonsense, though very beneficial for the opposition.
Yes but if it’s labelled as ‘expansive’ and ‘progressive’ that makes it desirable
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Perhaps the possession stat should be split. Possession in opposition half, possession in own half. As it is it seems a useless measure.
Big thanks to Sheffield Wednesday for again demonstrating passing around aimlessly at the back is total nonsense, though very beneficial for the opposition.
Yes but if it’s labelled as ‘expansive’ and ‘progressive’ that makes it desirable
Agreed, but you need to be Man City or Barcelona of old to meet that description.
We’ve got League1, League 2 and some pretty average Championship sides trying it. Totally bizarre! And at this low level it’s shocking to watch them trying to be something they’re not, endlessly ending in sideways, backwards, sideways aimless passing. Over coaching, perfectly demonstrated by Mr Schofield.
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Interesting stats. Fleetwood were seconds away from a win at Notts County with 19% possession.
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Update after 4 games with just Salford to play MK tomorrow.
47 games played in the division, only ten of which have been draws. As a result of the lack of draws there are already biggish gaps between teams at the top and bottom of the division.
Of the 35 games won by one team or the other so far this season, the team with the LEAST possession has won 24 times (about 69%).
Does seem to be a pattern?
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Perhaps the possession stat should be split. Possession in opposition half, possession in own half. As it is it seems a useless measure.
Big thanks to Sheffield Wednesday for again demonstrating passing around aimlessly at the back is total nonsense, though very beneficial for the opposition.
Yes but if it’s labelled as ‘expansive’ and ‘progressive’ that makes it desirable
Agreed, but you need to be Man City or Barcelona of old to meet that description.
We’ve got League1, League 2 and some pretty average Championship sides trying it. Totally bizarre! And at this low level it’s shocking to watch them trying to be something they’re not, endlessly ending in sideways, backwards, sideways aimless passing. Over coaching, perfectly demonstrated by Mr Schofield.
Somebody said earlier in the thread that possession tires the opposition out and of course this only occurs when the other team try to regain the ball. In a sense you would be right to say that the team with the least possession and wins makes better use of the ball when they’ve got it - economical and direct. We scored goals today with brisk movement and rapid break-through.
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Agreed. All three of our goals yesterday on the break, from deep. It’s when we look most dangerous and also was on our great run last season.
Almost as if we let the other team have it, let them feel comfortable having it then nick it and sting them. The football equivalent of rope-a-dope.
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Let's just hope the dope is Gillingham on Saturday. That game will be a massive indicator of how good we really are. Win that one and we can be in the top 3 all season. Come on Rovers.
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Let's just hope the dope is Gillingham on Saturday. That game will be a massive indicator of how good we really are. Win that one and we can be in the top 3 all season. Come on Rovers.
Depends if we assume Gillingham are good. Looks like Chesterfield were all over them yesterday hitting the woodwork about 4 times.
Of course, we can only win what's in front of you and given their points haul, they should be confident in themselves.
Like many games, they'll probably be a threat from set pieces and crosses but in open play, I expect us to be better.
Typical reasons why possession stats mean little when set pieces can be teams main weapons.
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Unbelievable stuff from MK Dons.
Trailing for most of the game, 74% possession, 540 passes and not a shot on target until the 93rd minute as they lose 3-0 to their fiercest rivals.
At least they can pay themselves on the back about “Playing the right way”!
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Unbelievable stuff from MK Dons.
Trailing for most of the game, 74% possession, 540 passes and not a shot on target until the 93rd minute as they lose 3-0 to their fiercest rivals.
At least they can pay themselves on the back about “Playing the right way”!
Reaction next week against us? As Brian(Selby) says, we've got a habit of putting failing sides back on track.
I'll be there nonetheless.
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Unbelievable stuff from MK Dons.
Trailing for most of the game, 74% possession, 540 passes and not a shot on target until the 93rd minute as they lose 3-0 to their fiercest rivals.
At least they can pay themselves on the back about “Playing the right way”!
Reaction next week against us? As Brian(Selby) says, we've got a habit of putting failing sides back on track.
I'll be there nonetheless.
No Steve, the other habit will happen.
We will beat them and get their manager sacked.
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Unbelievable stuff from MK Dons.
Trailing for most of the game, 74% possession, 540 passes and not a shot on target until the 93rd minute as they lose 3-0 to their fiercest rivals.
At least they can pay themselves on the back about “Playing the right way”!
Reaction next week against us? As Brian(Selby) says, we've got a habit of putting failing sides back on track.
I'll be there nonetheless.
We are hoping for a reaction from Rovers too.
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Unbelievable stuff from MK Dons.
Trailing for most of the game, 74% possession, 540 passes and not a shot on target until the 93rd minute as they lose 3-0 to their fiercest rivals.
At least they can pay themselves on the back about “Playing the right way”!
Reaction next week against us? As Brian(Selby) says, we've got a habit of putting failing sides back on track.
I'll be there nonetheless.
Well if Selby says it, it must be true ……
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Over the weekend there have been 12 football league games in which one side has dominated possession (>60%). Only 1 of those sides won.
Leeds (71%) L
Hull (68%) L
Cardiff (64%) L
Peterborough (71%) D
Crawley (63%) D
MK (74%) L
Doncaster (69%) L
Notts (66%) W
Tranmere L (63%)
Grimsby L (62%)
Chesterfield L (61%)
Carlisle L (60%)
Have I missed any?
We could be witnessing a shift in the favoured tactics of the time?