Viking Supporters Co-operative
Viking Chat => Viking Chat => Topic started by: selby on December 08, 2024, 04:16:02 pm
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Can we extend our run in this cup competition until after Christmas? Will Our old manager and player Darren Moore look on the game as important? and after a somewhat disappointing weekend for both teams, which one will be the happier at the end of the game? And how strong a sides will the managers feel fit to pick with a final not that far away for the winning Side?
All valid questions and basically comes down to how important the relative managers see the game and competition
So added interest in second v third in the division and two clubs rising again after slumbering along for quite a while but at a time of the year it is easy to give a game a miss and watch on TV in relative comfort and warmth. So what will you do ?
Despite having 60% of the possession v Walsall the Vale lost 1-0 a thing we had to get used to when led by Moore and all though we are finding it difficult to put teams away at home I will be surprised of we don't make the running in this game and Vale try to hit us on the break, which was Moore's master tactic here with non scoring loan centre forwards.
Vale have a good away record winning six league games on their travels but unusually have no player in the top twenty division 2 scorers list so a lot of players have shared their 26 league goals and spreads the danger wider although v Walsall they didn't record a shot on target, lets hope they carry that form forward in this game.
So what do we offer, a team that has disappointed at home lately, a leaky defence especially when attacked directly down the centre, and even in games blow hot and cold very rarely putting a quality full game together, and have been on the end of some shocking refereeing decisions especially in the oppositions penalty area.
What we do have are players that score goals, a never say die attitude, and players who can change a game in a flash, and are slowly coming to terms with teams that employ the dark arts of slowing games down and the tactical foul.
How the teams are made up usually reflects the importance the manager holds the competition in, and with the heavy grounds we have played on the recovery of certain players, so guessing the make up of the teams is a complete guess, fortunately Grant has gone strong in previous rounds, and has had its rewards getting this far.
I expect Port Vale will also want to do well, and expect a hard game, hard to predict a result but am hoping for the best.
Lots to discuss, and a very hard game facing us next weekend against another top division 2 side in AFC Wimbledon, so a week that could point our way forward although early in the season, but would give us a good idea of where we are at relative to the teams around us.
Lots to talk about, lots to look forward to, please have your say.
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Many of our senior players will be shattered after 3 difficult games in 6 days, all played in lousy conditions.
A lot of players to be rested on Tuesday IMO.
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I can’t find how much the prize money is for this match ..anybody know.
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I can’t find how much the prize money is for this match ..anybody know.
3rd winners £10,000
4th rd winners £15,000
Quarter final winners £25,000
Semi final winners £25,000
Losing finalists £50,000
Winners £100,000
Not mega bucks.
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All the fringe players should (and will) start. Main crop can do with a rest.
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Something like…
Lawlor
Bailey
Anderson
Senior
Emmanuel
Westbrooke
Clifton
Kelly
Fleming
Ironside
Molyneux
?
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Plenty of years I've looked at this cup as an annoying irrelevance. Especially when we had a threadbare squad crippled with injuries. Not this year. This cup is a good way of keeping the whole squad match fit, and truth be told I want to win it.
We have nothing to be scared of from Port Vale.
I'd expect to see us make a fair few changes but even our second team should be competitive.
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If we continue to have to score two three or four goals to win a game of football it will not end well.
We need to start defending better to progress.
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D
Something like…
Lawlor
Bailey
Anderson
Senior
Emmanuel
Westbrooke
Clifton
Kelly
Fleming
Ironside
Molyneux
?
Do we want to win this game that side will be over powered and Lawlor in goal is not the right answer the midfield is powered puff. Let’s see what GM comes up with. That a below average side with with 4/5 players above average
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Plenty of years I've looked at this cup as an annoying irrelevance. Especially when we had a threadbare squad crippled with injuries. Not this year. This cup is a good way of keeping the whole squad match fit, and truth be told I want to win it.
We have nothing to be scared of from Port Vale.
I'd expect to see us make a fair few changes but even our second team should be competitive.
It's still an irrevalence. Rest as many of the regulars as possible.
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DSomething like…
Lawlor
Bailey
Anderson
Senior
Emmanuel
Westbrooke
Clifton
Kelly
Fleming
Ironside
Molyneux
?
Do we want to win this game that side will be over powered and Lawlor in goal is not the right answer the midfield is powered puff. Let’s see what GM comes up with. That a below average side with with 4/5 players above average
Steve, what's the point in having a big squad if some of them can't get any game time, even in an inferior competition?
You sound as though you've no confidence in many of GM's squad.
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Steve you are right I do not have confidence in 6 of those players in that squad above.The back three and two up front are ok . If we want to progress in this competition I believe that team against Port Vale will not progress
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Steve you are right I do not have confidence in 6 of those players in that squad above.The back three and two up front are ok . If we want to progress in this competition I believe that team against Port Vale will not progress
It would be nice to progress in this competition, but in terms of importance, it's light years away from the need to get promoted this year.
If we played our best 11 for this match and some of them got injured, when we have such a large squad, it would be criminal IMO.
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Ticket sales don't look good - are they doing walk ups?
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Plenty of years I've looked at this cup as an annoying irrelevance. Especially when we had a threadbare squad crippled with injuries. Not this year. This cup is a good way of keeping the whole squad match fit, and truth be told I want to win it.
We have nothing to be scared of from Port Vale.
I'd expect to see us make a fair few changes but even our second team should be competitive.
It's still an irrevalence. Rest as many of the regulars as possible.
Whilst we're organising midweek friendlies to keep our squad fit, this isn't an irrelevance. It's an opportunity to achieve something whilst keeping our whole team involved.
Make lots of changes, yes. Stay in the competition, also yes.
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The drop in quality between 11s isn’t as big as it would have been in previous seasons. So we can make changes and still put out a proper team. They are all pro players so expect every game to be taken seriously!
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Plenty of years I've looked at this cup as an annoying irrelevance. Especially when we had a threadbare squad crippled with injuries. Not this year. This cup is a good way of keeping the whole squad match fit, and truth be told I want to win it.
We have nothing to be scared of from Port Vale.
I'd expect to see us make a fair few changes but even our second team should be competitive.
I like you want to win it. I remember how good it was to beat Bristol Rovers at Cardiff and how sick I was when we lost at Grimsby " defending " that Trophy
I see no reason why the Clubs hierarchy are not hounding GM to contest each Round with winning it in mind
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Plenty of years I've looked at this cup as an annoying irrelevance. Especially when we had a threadbare squad crippled with injuries. Not this year. This cup is a good way of keeping the whole squad match fit, and truth be told I want to win it.
We have nothing to be scared of from Port Vale.
I'd expect to see us make a fair few changes but even our second team should be competitive.
I like you want to win it. I remember how good it was to beat Bristol Rovers at Cardiff and how sick I was when we lost at Grimsby " defending " that Trophy
I see no reason why the Clubs hierarchy are not hounding GM to contest each Round with winning it in mind
That’s a bit ‘Politburo’sounding hound!
“The clubs hierarchy”?
Easy tiger, I mean bear!
Of course at home against a side in the same division with the same ‘desires as us’ i.e., promotion out of this god damned division we would hope to see this tie as winnable at this stage so yes,let’s push on but please, no firing squad come dawn!
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Plenty of years I've looked at this cup as an annoying irrelevance. Especially when we had a threadbare squad crippled with injuries. Not this year. This cup is a good way of keeping the whole squad match fit, and truth be told I want to win it.
We have nothing to be scared of from Port Vale.
I'd expect to see us make a fair few changes but even our second team should be competitive.
I like you want to win it. I remember how good it was to beat Bristol Rovers at Cardiff and how sick I was when we lost at Grimsby " defending " that Trophy
I see no reason why the Clubs hierarchy are not hounding GM to contest each Round with winning it in mind
That’s a bit ‘Politburo’sounding hound!
“The clubs hierarchy”?
Easy tiger, I mean bear!
Of course at home against a side in the same division with the same ‘desires as us’ i.e., promotion out of this god damned division we would hope to see this tie as winnable at this stage so yes,let’s push on but please, no firing squad come dawn!
Not sure where I come into it Usher.
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Something like…
Lawlor
Bailey
Anderson
Senior
Emmanuel
Westbrooke
Clifton
Kelly
Fleming
Ironside
Molyneux
?
Yeboah?
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Something like…
Lawlor
Bailey
Anderson
Senior
Emmanuel
Westbrooke
Clifton
Kelly
Fleming
Ironside
Molyneux
?
Yeboah?
No thanks
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Plenty of years I've looked at this cup as an annoying irrelevance. Especially when we had a threadbare squad crippled with injuries. Not this year. This cup is a good way of keeping the whole squad match fit, and truth be told I want to win it.
We have nothing to be scared of from Port Vale.
I'd expect to see us make a fair few changes but even our second team should be competitive.
I like you want to win it. I remember how good it was to beat Bristol Rovers at Cardiff and how sick I was when we lost at Grimsby " defending " that Trophy
I see no reason why the Clubs hierarchy are not hounding GM to contest each Round with winning it in mind
That’s a bit ‘Politburo’sounding hound!
“The clubs hierarchy”?
Easy tiger, I mean bear!
Of course at home against a side in the same division with the same ‘desires as us’ i.e., promotion out of this god damned division we would hope to see this tie as winnable at this stage so yes,let’s push on but please, no firing squad come dawn!
Not sure where I come into it Usher.
'I see no reason why the Clubs hierarchy are not hounding GM to contest each Round with winning it in mind'.
That bit I was referring to hound. Seemed like a 'crack the whip' comment aimed at Grant. I could well have misinterpreted it of course after a bottle of red?
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The Manager GM will surely be influenced by those who underwrite the Club ?
In the past not just Rovers but many other Clubs have played weakened sides to get out of this Comp and FL Cup and for Champ and Prem Clubs even the FA Cup
Surely those in charge "allow" the Manager to go weak , but just as surely they might demand " let's go as far as we can " and they may have done that this time round ?
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Reading Usher's comment about the prize fund
A) I've no idea what it costs in staff & overheads to stage a match, is it worth it?
B) If there is, what I perceive to be a general apathy from supporters, and (possibly) from within the club, are we obliged to enter the competition?
C) The furore that greeted Man U when they went on their Asian money tour, would we the
supporters care?. I think not.
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The Manager GM will surely be influenced by those who underwrite the Club ?
In the past not just Rovers but many other Clubs have played weakened sides to get out of this Comp and FL Cup and for Champ and Prem Clubs even the FA Cup
Surely those in charge "allow" the Manager to go weak , but just as surely they might demand " let's go as far as we can " and they may have done that this time round ?
Totally disagree, Wolfie, and I'll tell you why. Terry's gone out on a limb this season to ensure that GM has the squad he wants, and one big enough to cover all bases.
He also will be aware that a balancing act is needed by GM to protect senior players, but also to try and progress in cup competitions.
I think Terry will trust GM to make those decisions, and so should we.
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Decent line up & bench tonight.
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Ben close needs to put himsen in the shop window for January
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Yeboah done a Faal?
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What does Westbrook need to do to get a game?
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Yeboah done a Faal?
He was training at the Eco yesterday.
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Yeboah done a Faal?
Think this pretty much confirms he’s going back in January
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Smallest crowd I've ever seen 20 mins before KO?
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Team news....?
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No Yeboha on the team sheet? Maybe that confirms he won’t be here in the new year.
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What does Westbrook need to do to get a game?
Coming back from injury, not fully match fit I presume? I mentioned this on another thread. Can anybody else confirm this is the case?
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Smallest crowd I've ever seen 20 mins before KO?
Adam, just before kick off the sky commentator said “it looks to be a decent crowd in this evening”.
Mind you, he also said at half time “let’s look at the half time results”.
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Giving Port Vale more games so the regular wheels falling off the bus for Darren Moore happens a bit earlier.
Smart move.
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We didn’t deserve that.
92nd minute the ball drops to one of theirs & he gets a good connection.
I thought we were the better & most dominant side gouging forwards & calm in defence.
Hit the woodwork twice, Lawlor made a good save in the first half which really up until the goal was their only shot on target that i can recall.
Ah well, that’s football i guess.
Some ‘fringe players’ did their ‘cause’ no harm tonight. I thought Josh Emmanuel was a threat going forward all game & so quick to recover defensively.
Fleming was exactly the same on the other side of the pitch, winning headers, getting forward & delivered some good crosses i hope he’s offered a contract (yes i know we’re ‘blessed’ with players in that position) come the end of the season if he’s left without a club.
Gibson was excellent on the wide right, cutting in to shoot or getting a cross into the box.
Clifton had a decent game as dare i say it did Close but they’re nowhere near Bailey.
Sbarra’s an enigma to me. At 5’4” he has no right to be an effective midfield player but he put himself about tonight, showed for the ball & played some good passes. He’s not however & never will be in the same class as a Tommy Rowe.
So until January & we have ‘a jolly in Hull’, we can as they say ‘now concentrate on the league’.
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Was that the smallest crowd of the season? There looked to be hardly anyone there on Sky.
I doubt it was much above 1000.
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Usher: I think you put up a rosey picture and whilst you might say that no one did anything seriously wrong, they were not good enough to really threaten.
Considering how much attacking we did, there was not much variation in the approach so it is predictable for the opposing defence. We don’t seem to be able to break away so there is always a defender confronting the man with the ball.
There is little ingenuity and even when the first choice palyers came on the quality did not improve.
TSL is a much more active presence in the goal area. h
His long-distance clearances offer opportunities to break away without being confronted with a blanket defence. Beinmore mobile and alert he might well have made a better effort to keep out their goal. Unlike Lawlor on this occasion he rarely gestures at the defence as though letting on goals is not his job!
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…didn’t read that through properly, but I hope you get the drift.
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Usher: I think you put up a rosey picture and whilst you might say that no one did anything seriously wrong, they were not good enough to really threaten.
Considering how much attacking we did, there was not much variation in the approach so it is predictable for the opposing defence. We don’t seem to be able to break away so there is always a defender confronting the man with the ball.
There is little ingenuity and even when the first choice palyers came on the quality did not improve.
TSL is a much more active presence in the goal area. h
His long-distance clearances offer opportunities to break away without being confronted with a blanket defence. Beinmore mobile and alert he might well have made a better effort to keep out their goal. Unlike Lawlor on this occasion he rarely gestures at the defence as though letting on goals is not his job!
FR, you're doing it again. We can't score goals for toffee, and yet the only individual you're blaming is Lawlor.
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Was that the smallest crowd of the season? There looked to be hardly anyone there on Sky.
I doubt it was much above 1000.
1396 - lowest home crowd although there were fewer at Salford in our League Cup tie
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We didn’t deserve that.
92nd minute the ball drops to one of theirs & he gets a good connection.
I thought we were the better & most dominant side gouging forwards & calm in defence.
Hit the woodwork twice, Lawlor made a good save in the first half which really up until the goal was their only shot on target that i can recall.
Ah well, that’s football i guess.
Some ‘fringe players’ did their ‘cause’ no harm tonight. I thought Josh Emmanuel was a threat going forward all game & so quick to recover defensively.
Fleming was exactly the same on the other side of the pitch, winning headers, getting forward & delivered some good crosses i hope he’s offered a contract (yes i know we’re ‘blessed’ with players in that position) come the end of the season if he’s left without a club.
Gibson was excellent on the wide right, cutting in to shoot or getting a cross into the box.
Clifton had a decent game as dare i say it did Close but they’re nowhere near Bailey.
Sbarra’s an enigma to me. At 5’4” he has no right to be an effective midfield player but he put himself about tonight, showed for the ball & played some good passes. He’s not however & never will be in the same class as a Tommy Rowe.
So until January & we have ‘a jolly in Hull’, we can as they say ‘now concentrate on the league’.
Agree with most of that Usher
Thought over the 90 we were the better team
JE had a great game at RB
BF played well at LB
Gibson still flatters to deceive, tonight in particular didn't get his head up enough for me and get a cross in. People were getting on his back towards the end about being lazy but I think he was just knackered.
Sbarra played really well IMO
Dont think Lawlor did much wrong so doesn't deserve stick.
My main concern was we seemed to weaken the midfield when we put Bailey and Westbrook on.
Over all a good run out, dominated again with no cutting edge.....seems to be a recurring theme.
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Grant should have put Bailey as the deep
Lying midfielder and let Westbrooke go forward on leave on the bench and leave Clifton on
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…didn’t read that through properly, but I hope you get the drift.
Yep.
I think one goal was always going to win this game.
We made eight changes from the Cheltenham game yet we were still playing very much on the front foot. The players won 90% of their ‘individual’ battles & as i said, one or two gave Grant food for thought with their performances.
A couple of questions for you forsolong.
Did Anderson & McGrath look solid both defensively & in bringing the ball out?
Were Fleming & Emmanuel as effective defensively & when attacking down the flanks tonight as Maxwell, Senior, Nixon or Sterry?
Did we not ‘create’ enough chances to have (deservedly imo) won the game tonight not forgetting we hit the woodwork twice.
Did we ultimately have more chances on goal than Port Vale?
I take your point about converting those chances which for whatever reason we have granted, failed to do so too regularly however, getting back to tonight’s game I believe we saw the strength in depth of the squad we have, under GM, brought together this season.
It’s all about perceptions & opinions so let me just say I’m happy on this occasion to agree to disagree.
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Lots for us still to be happy about. But the lack of scoring goals from what we create is a huge problem. Is it the players on the end of the passes or the passes themselves? Worrying but still lots to be positive about if we solve it.
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Another game that we created enough chances to win, and didn't. If we get the performances right the results will come. GM will have learnt something from this game about his squad players, a couple enhanced their claims tonight in Emmanuele and Flemming, some others really need to find some form.
The best thing we can say about tonight, its done and over with, we don't have it as a distraction going forwards and we can now concentrate on winning the league. We have a squad to do it, we just need the rub of the green to get us going again. GM knows what he needs and requires from this squad, with a couple of astute signing in Jan we need to capitalise.
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I thought we lost control of the midfield when Close was taken off.
Most things went through him across the centre and he linked up well with those further forward.
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Usher: I think you put up a rosey picture and whilst you might say that no one did anything seriously wrong, they were not good enough to really threaten.
Considering how much attacking we did, there was not much variation in the approach so it is predictable for the opposing defence. We don’t seem to be able to break away so there is always a defender confronting the man with the ball.
There is little ingenuity and even when the first choice palyers came on the quality did not improve.
TSL is a much more active presence in the goal area. h
His long-distance clearances offer opportunities to break away without being confronted with a blanket defence. Beinmore mobile and alert he might well have made a better effort to keep out their goal. Unlike Lawlor on this occasion he rarely gestures at the defence as though letting on goals is not his job!
FR, you're doing it again. We can't score goals for toffee, and yet the only individual you're blaming is Lawlor.
I did not say that really; a lot of them could have done better and I was contrasting TSL’s usual contribution to the team effort as compared with Lawlor’s. One goal should not have been the difference between winning and losing based on the extent to which we were in attacking positions.
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Although we played ok and should have scored at least one goal our best players on the pitch were defenders two fullbacks and centre halves.
Midfield was ok Clifton doing all the graft and Close picking up the ball deep and distributing.
Kelly was poor driving forward and loosing the ball passing not good enough and easily knocked off the ball. The wide players were poor whether it was Gibson or Sbarra neither put in meaningful consistent good crosses. Were easily overpowered and loss the ball.
The mid field was weaken with substitutes allowing Bailey to go forward and have Westbrooke deep was wrong just like Sbarra he runs along side of players instead of tackling.
Overall it’s a game we should have won but our lack of goals and creativity plus not good enough in midfield especially after the substitutions.
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For me just really disappointing night , match , result
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Almost all the attendances in the Vertu Cup were abysmal.
A cold night not long before Christmas in a secondary competition against a fellow League 2 team isn’t going to get many off their couches.
As for the game apart from the first 7 mins and the last 3 mins we were the better team by quite some margin.
Our problem is once again our end product. We simply are not clinical enough. Trying to score the perfect goal too often for me.
We need to get the ball in the box quicker. Too many touches are being made.
Gibson frustrates me so much. He has considerable ability but over plays time after time.
Why Grant doesn’t play him on the right for at least 50% of the time is a mystery to me.
Same with Molly get him on the left and get down the line on their natural foot crossing from near the by line. Joe Ironside might just get some decent service. How many times does he receive the ball in and around the penalty spot with his back to goal with no opportunity to get a shot off.
Good performances from all the players last night.
The back 4 were outstanding, Tom thought he was Beckenbaur.
Ben Close looked rusty but otherwise everyone put a shift in and if we had won 3-0 it would not have flattered us.
We got caught out at the death going for the winner.
This could be a blessing in disguise being one distraction less.
2007 it affected our league performance quite considerably in Feb & March.
We will just have to settle for the League title and FA Cup winners medals this season. :thumbsup: :chair:
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Several posters on the Lucky Pint thread last night were inferring that Grant has weakened our squad compared to last season, with colincramb for example suggesting that:
Sbarra is not as good as Biggins
Kelly nowhere near as good as Craig
Gibson not as good as Adelakun (he hasn't done much this season has he?)
TSL not as good as TLT
I think it's worth reminding ourselves that these were not conscious choices by Grant.
He offered contracts to Adelakun and Biggins; both turned them down, feeling they could do better than stay with Rovers;
Craig's parent club wanted him to have a loan at a club in a higher League;
TLT not available to us either
Rowe was also mentioned, but leaving emotion aside I don't think Grant can be criticised for not offering Tommy another contract.
So Grant had to go back to the drawing board in all these cases.
In my opinion, in challenging circumstances bearing in mind the above, Grant has assembled a squad which is stronger than the one we had last season.
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A couple of the players Emmanuel and Fleming played well to be considered for inclusion in the match day squad, however in my view Sabarra and particularly Gibson didn’t.
I thought Gibson was poor again.
In general yes we had good possession and got forward, but for me it’s the same problem that we don,t get forward quick enough. Playing from the back is not the problem, it’s by the time we get to the half way line the opposition generally have all players behind the ball.
We then end up with our forwards coming too deep with their backs to goal.
It’s been said my many posts before, we are too predictable particularly at home
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A couple of the players Emmanuel and Fleming played well to be considered for inclusion in the match day squad, however in my view Sabarra and particularly Gibson didn’t.
I thought Gibson was poor again.
In general yes we had good possession and got forward, but for me it’s the same problem that we don,t get forward quick enough. Playing from the back is not the problem, it’s by the time we get to the half way line the opposition generally have all players behind the ball.
We then end up with our forwards coming too deep with their backs to goal.
It’s been said my many posts before, we are too predictable particularly at home
Completely agree, there were numerous times in last night's game where keeper or defence got the ball forward quickly with half the PV team in our box and as soon as our ball carrier got past halfway and a defender approached he turned around and passed it back instead of either taking the man on or looking to pass it to one of the forward players. Then by the time we get the ball forward the PV defence is back and set.
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Quote
Rowe was also mentioned, but leaving emotion aside I don't think Grant can be criticised for not offering Tommy another contract.
It was me who mentioned Tommy to a specific answer
When it was said Sbarra was fringe player every team needs one. We had Biggins and Rowe who where fringe players and a lot better than Sbarra and I appreciate we only saw the best of Biggins in the games from February. But the point stand in our games since the start of the season when selected Sbarra as been anonymous in most games
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I don't know if its implied but we have this awful and wasteful trait of whenever a player is on the ball.
The first choice in the thought process is always to turn back and look for the easy lay off backwards, it happens in every game, we have a break from defence and the player bringing the ball forward gets towards the opposition defence and then turns 180° and lays the ball backwards, it happens so often it just kills every move we make stone dead. Last night i counted four occasions where we had broken forward, two or three passes later the ball is back with the our keeper?
I'm well aware of the need to protect possession and deny the opposition the ball, sometimes you need to go back to reset and attack again but it always looks in our case that the final through balls, the ones the split the defence and put a forward running player through into space and onto goal just don't happen for us, the forward play is slow, deliberate and over cautious in my opinion, id rather see us try to move the ball forward or thread a through ball and loose possession than not try.
Im sure GM is asking the players to be braver in their outlook and play, some have already commented on players like Mols and Gibson loosing possession trying something, its this unpredictability that needs to be attempted for us to achieve, if we don't try and just keep playing percentage football then we will undoubtedly miss out again.
We need brave players to have the confidence to go alongside the skill element, Adulaken demonstrated this perfectly last season, it got Mols and a few others playing at a higher and better tempo, the confidence throughout the squad soared and the overall improvement was massive.
This side have the ability, we just need to see them being brave, having a go and not always looking to play the safe option, our season depends on this.
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I think people need to stop judging TSL against TLT. TSL is a great keeper and hasn’t done a thing wrong yet.
I’m not sure we need another striker or winger, I think we are good enough(more than) in that area. Midfield is the issue for me.
I think we need to find a way to get Close or Westbrooke in the team for possession control, and rotate the others, but I’m not 100% sure on any of them.
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I don't know if its implied but we have this awful and wasteful trait of whenever a player is on the ball.
The first choice in the thought process is always to turn back and look for the easy lay off backwards, it happens in every game, we have a break from defence and the player bringing the ball forward gets towards the opposition defence and then turns 180° and lays the ball backwards, it happens so often it just kills every move we make stone dead. Last night i counted four occasions where we had broken forward, two or three passes later the ball is back with the our keeper?
I'm well aware of the need to protect possession and deny the opposition the ball, sometimes you need to go back to reset and attack again but it always looks in our case that the final through balls, the ones the split the defence and put a forward running player through into space and onto goal just don't happen for us, the forward play is slow, deliberate and over cautious in my opinion, id rather see us try to move the ball forward or thread a through ball and loose possession than not try.
Im sure GM is asking the players to be braver in their outlook and play, some have already commented on players like Mols and Gibson loosing possession trying something, its this unpredictability that needs to be attempted for us to achieve, if we don't try and just keep playing percentage football then we will undoubtedly miss out again.
We need brave players to have the confidence to go alongside the skill element, Adulaken demonstrated this perfectly last season, it got Mols and a few others playing at a higher and better tempo, the confidence throughout the squad soared and the overall improvement was massive.
This side have the ability, we just need to see them being brave, having a go and not always looking to play the safe option, our season depends on this.
Very good points and well made there danumdon.
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I think people need to stop judging TSL against TLT. TSL is a great keeper and hasn’t done a thing wrong yet.
I’m not sure we need another striker or winger, I think we are good enough(more than) in that area. Midfield is the issue for me.
I think we need to find a way to get Close or Westbrooke in the team for possession control, and rotate the others, but I’m not 100% sure on any of them.
100% we do need another strike. What happens if Joe or Billy get an injury that keeps them out for a few weeks or even worse.
If we could get Mathew Craig back then it’s a no brainer. His partnership with Owen Bailey was fantastic.
TSL is not as good as TLT in the air. He is much sounder imo. Catches the ball more rather than the punches
Of TSL when not under much pressure.
Having said that we can get promoted and be Champions with our current keeper, but if TLT became available then that’s a no brainer also for me. He is 3rd choice at Hull and isn’t even on the bench. Crazy for a keeper of his ability.
We are just 2 players short of the full jigsaw imo. Then it’s all about being quicker and more clinical in the final third.
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I don't know if its implied but we have this awful and wasteful trait of whenever a player is on the ball.
The first choice in the thought process is always to turn back and look for the easy lay off backwards, it happens in every game, we have a break from defence and the player bringing the ball forward gets towards the opposition defence and then turns 180° and lays the ball backwards, it happens so often it just kills every move we make stone dead. Last night i counted four occasions where we had broken forward, two or three passes later the ball is back with the our keeper?
I'm well aware of the need to protect possession and deny the opposition the ball, sometimes you need to go back to reset and attack again but it always looks in our case that the final through balls, the ones the split the defence and put a forward running player through into space and onto goal just don't happen for us, the forward play is slow, deliberate and over cautious in my opinion, id rather see us try to move the ball forward or thread a through ball and loose possession than not try.
Im sure GM is asking the players to be braver in their outlook and play, some have already commented on players like Mols and Gibson loosing possession trying something, its this unpredictability that needs to be attempted for us to achieve, if we don't try and just keep playing percentage football then we will undoubtedly miss out again.
We need brave players to have the confidence to go alongside the skill element, Adulaken demonstrated this perfectly last season, it got Mols and a few others playing at a higher and better tempo, the confidence throughout the squad soared and the overall improvement was massive.
This side have the ability, we just need to see them being brave, having a go and not always looking to play the safe option, our season
Great Post, I agree with all this, Grant doesn't tell the players to go sideways, backwards, so why are the players still doing it. Is it confidence, fluency, lack of movement, lack of pace up front, too much swapping & changing, lack of understanding. It's certainly frustrating watching us at home at the minute but it's certainly not through lack of effort.
Although we are in a great position, it needs sorting fairly quickly as we can't keep relying on our away form. I'm sure Grant knows what's needed in January as we're not playing the McCann way currently at home.
We need to be braver & quicker going forward & more practice needed on corners, two consecutive one's last night were passed straight into their keepers hands.
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Summarising opinion, some believe that it will all work out in time, others feel that we ought to be seeing more progress. GM seems to have a benevolent view of those in the team who play it safe rather than exhibit the ambition of taking on the opposition, be it by tackling or being more positive in getting the ball forward quickly.
Expecting current away form to be sustained is unrealistic especially when nerves seems to be destroying confidence at home. Getting TLT and Craig back is the fairy-tale solution (and I’m not sure TLT is so much better than TSL to make a really significant a difference). The fallback is finding a way to re-energise the present squad and “investing” in some really good quality Championship loanees. Two key attributes in the two experienced ones we have, (Fleming and Emmanuel) are that they have the confidence to take the ball forwards - as does Sterry. There should be such people available - edged out of their current first teams and perhaps going out of contract next May, but needing to put themselves in the shop window for 2024/25.
The players we have at the moment are clearly better than those that were here in December 2023, but without extra strength the present form, mixed at best, cannot be assumed to be sufficient.