Viking Supporters Co-operative
Viking Chat => Viking Chat => Topic started by: TonySoprano on February 07, 2026, 04:38:15 pm
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Im not asking if we should sack him yet, im asking if all the good things he's done have been undone by the bad things.
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Just no fight today other than from captain fantastic and Gotts, Mols, Jay, Bryne, Sterry, Lee, Haks all looked totally off it and disinterested!
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All the team habe been out of it. Terrible
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What a stupid f**king poll. It’s not even grammatically correct.
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What a stupid f**king poll. It’s not even grammatically correct.
How so einstein? Easy to say when you're hiding behind your keyboard though.
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What a stupid f**king poll. It’s not even grammatically correct.
How so einstein? Easy to say when you're hiding behind your keyboard though.
*Einstein
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Not at all. Remember where we were when he came back?
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What a stupid f**king poll. It’s not even grammatically correct.
How so einstein? Easy to say when you're hiding behind your keyboard though.
*Einstein
Pathetic
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What a stupid f**king poll. It’s not even grammatically correct.
How so einstein? Easy to say when you're hiding behind your keyboard though.
*Einstein
Pathetic
It was a joke. Try and have a day off.
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What a stupid f**king poll. It’s not even grammatically correct.
How so einstein? Easy to say when you're hiding behind your keyboard though.
You’re a nob.
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Here we go, another McCann in or out vote. Yaaaaawwwwwn. Bad day, entire team looked knackered, rest up refocus and move on, oh yes , and with the same manager.
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What a stupid f**king poll. It’s not even grammatically correct.
How so einstein? Easy to say when you're hiding behind your keyboard though.
What the f**k are you talking about… hiding behind my keyboard? It’s an online forum. You can’t think things onto here. It requires, you know, typing and stuff.
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What a stupid f**king poll. It’s not even grammatically correct.
How so einstein? Easy to say when you're hiding behind your keyboard though.
You’re a nob.
Another keyboard warrior I see. Pathetic.
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What a stupid f**king poll. It’s not even grammatically correct.
How so einstein? Easy to say when you're hiding behind your keyboard though.
What the f**k are you talking about… hiding behind my keyboard? It’s an online forum. You can’t think things onto here. It requires, you know, typing and stuff.
You wouldn't say that to my face would you fella?
Again, explain why you think its poor grammar.
Either type it out on here, or we can meet if you'd like.
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I'm trying to imagine the mindset of someone who regularly writes abusive posts on here, then accuses people who give him some back that they are hiding behind keyboards.
Strange world...
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What a stupid f**king poll. It’s not even grammatically correct.
How so einstein? Easy to say when you're hiding behind your keyboard though.
What the f**k are you talking about… hiding behind my keyboard? It’s an online forum. You can’t think things onto here. It requires, you know, typing and stuff.
You wouldn't say that to my face would you fella?
Again, explain why you think its poor grammar.
Either type it out on here, or we can meet if you'd like.
'PDX'
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Here we go, another McCann in or out vote. Yaaaaawwwwwn. Bad day, entire team looked knackered, rest up refocus and move on, oh yes , and with the same manager.
Get a grip fella, I clearly said I want asking if we should sack him.
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Where’s the Cookie Monster when you need it
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What a stupid f**king poll. It’s not even grammatically correct.
How so einstein? Easy to say when you're hiding behind your keyboard though.
What the f**k are you talking about… hiding behind my keyboard? It’s an online forum. You can’t think things onto here. It requires, you know, typing and stuff.
You wouldn't say that to my face would you fella?
Again, explain why you think its poor grammar.
Either type it out on here, or we can meet if you'd like.
Go meet him at his local.
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I'm trying to imagine the mindset of someone who regularly writes abusive posts on here, then accuses people who give him some back that they are hiding behind keyboards.
Strange world...
Abuse from me ? Where ? Show me ?
As for you, your the biggest keyboard warrior of them all. Sad little old man.
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Here we go, another McCann in or out vote. Yaaaaawwwwwn. Bad day, entire team looked knackered, rest up refocus and move on, oh yes , and with the same manager.
Get a grip fella, I clearly said I want asking if we should sack him.
Then what's the purpose of the post? It's surely just a pre-req to him being sacked?
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Here we go, another McCann in or out vote. Yaaaaawwwwwn. Bad day, entire team looked knackered, rest up refocus and move on, oh yes , and with the same manager.
Get a grip fella, I clearly said I want asking if we should sack him.
Then what's the purpose of the post? It's surely just a pre-req to him being sacked?
No, im asking if his credit has ran out, not if hes in overdraft yet.
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Im not asking if we should sack him yet, im asking if all the good things he's done have been undone by the bad things.
As a club we are always going to be bargain basement in the recruitment. BUT we do have decent players on the books and that’s down to McCann and co ..and recent recruitment has been positive. . Yet we our performance levels still drop too often to be competitive.
McCann is imo is not a motivator but a good coach . We’re getting beat by teams who know how to take the game away from teams and have the determination to control games . This season was promised to deliver a challenge but yet it has stuttered along . McCann has to now concentrate on keeping us in the league and leave next season and maybe leave it to someone else .
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Im not asking if we should sack him yet, im asking if all the good things he's done have been undone by the bad things.
As a club we are always going to be bargain basement in the recruitment. BUT we do have decent players on the books and that’s down to McCann and co ..and recent recruitment has been positive. . Yet we our performance levels still drop too often to be competitive.
McCann is imo is not a motivator but a good coach . We’re getting beat by teams who know how to take the game away from teams and have the determination to control games . This season was promised to deliver a challenge but yet it has stuttered along . McCann has to now concentrate on keeping us in the league and leave next season and maybe leave it to someone else .
Good points, and thanks for actually replying with an intelligent response :thumbsup:
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When we reach the end of the season, if he's kept us up, he'll be here next season. If not, then he won't.
I think it's as simple as that.
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When we reach the end of the season, if he's kept us up, he'll be here next season. If not, then he won't.
I think it's as simple as that.
He would be the best chance of us going back up again though.
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For what it's worth, I dont think we should sack him at the moment.
But I DO think his credit is running low.
Mcann is very good at saying the right things, but let's see where we are in 5 games.
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No Mcann has not run out of credit, he deserves at least this season to keep us up or not, but be stronger next season. My worry is the better players will leave and it will be a rebuild whichever way we go.
We have been largely unlucky to be where we are in the league, and we are much better than the position we find ourselves in, but if you only watched today, you would think we re 2 leagues over our level.
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When we reach the end of the season, if he's kept us up, he'll be here next season. If not, then he won't.
I think it's as simple as that.
He would be the best chance of us going back up again though.
Rightly or wrongly, the board think we should be a League 1 club with the resources available.
If McCann can't keep us in League 1 then what's the point?
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On the way back. For me it’s the same mistakes and more importantly the same mindset when in a losing position for me. It was game over at 1-0 there and as much as I love Mols, he’s the main culprit for it. Just downs tools. Sterry should have been dragged at HT and not for the first time this season. He then goes and makes the mistake for the 2nd. We never ever learn. Win a game and think we’re invincible. He’s out far too much trust in these players and tried to patch it up again in January but, not in the areas most needed. Full backs need to be addressed.
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The answer to the question is No.
But having said that McCann should take the majority of the blame for today's shambles.
Not making any changes to the side from Tuesday's tough assignment was absolute stupidity.
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Yes noone can disagree aweful today.
I thought 5 subs at once would have come on as it wasnt happening for anybody.
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On the way back. For me it’s the same mistakes and more importantly the same mindset when in a losing position for me. It was game over at 1-0 there and as much as I love Mols, he’s the main culprit for it. Just downs tools. Sterry should have been dragged at HT and not for the first time this season. He then goes and makes the mistake for the 2nd. We never ever learn. Win a game and think we’re invincible. He’s out far too much trust in these players and tried to patch it up again in January but, not in the areas most needed. Full backs need to be addressed.
Winning isn’t the thing , it’s not wanting get beat that should be our thing . We fall apart as a team when going behind instead of galvanising to get back into the game . McCann has to take the blame for not creating the right mindset to compete for 90mins and only then can you say that your tried your best !!!
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3rd away game in 7 days.
Their budget is huge too.
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A poll like this when before today we were flying high in the form table just about sums this clown up.
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McCann and run.
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On the way back. For me it’s the same mistakes and more importantly the same mindset when in a losing position for me. It was game over at 1-0 there and as much as I love Mols, he’s the main culprit for it. Just downs tools. Sterry should have been dragged at HT and not for the first time this season. He then goes and makes the mistake for the 2nd. We never ever learn. Win a game and think we’re invincible. He’s out far too much trust in these players and tried to patch it up again in January but, not in the areas most needed. Full backs need to be addressed.
Winning isn’t the thing , it’s not wanting get beat that should be our thing . We fall apart as a team when going behind instead of galvanising to get back into the game . McCann has to take the blame for not creating the right mindset to compete for 90mins and only then can you say that your tried your best !!!
That’s what I’m saying.
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Here we go, another McCann in or out vote. Yaaaaawwwwwn. Bad day, entire team looked knackered, rest up refocus and move on, oh yes , and with the same manager.
Get a grip fella, I clearly said I want asking if we should sack him.
*wasn’t
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Here we go, another McCann in or out vote. Yaaaaawwwwwn. Bad day, entire team looked knackered, rest up refocus and move on, oh yes , and with the same manager.
Disagree with that as an excuse an it'll be a poor cop out to just put it down to that.
They did a proper job on us that first half, totally nullified Molyneux (and in turn, Adelakun, who does nothing when Molyneux isn’t on it).
McCann should’ve been trying to work round that at half time, it was obvious a tactical change was needed but like we’ve done plenty this season, we wait for another then just throw a couple of subs on.
It isn’t “knackered” that’s got us all at sea defending our own box.
It isn’t “knackered” that sees McGrath step out of position, fail to win the dual and leave us stranded time and time again.
It isn’t “knackered” why we’re never proactive with tactical changes.
It’s horrendous defensive recruitment, set up and in-game management.
I’m not calling for McCann to be sacked but he’s getting a level of excuses from our fanbase that previous managers haven’t been afforded and some of it is unwarranted.
Yes he got us back up but that will account for very little if after a few more million of Bramall’s money, we end up back in the very same league as we started.
The current season is the be all and end all for a football manager, that is the job. You don’t gain any league points for achievements made in a previous season.
We as fans need to hope we can grind out enough from now to end of season, or at least drop lucky with a couple of others being laughably bad (thanks Wigan) but for me, there’s serious talks and decision to be made at the seasons ends as to where we and McCann go next. We cannot have another season of recruitment like this, it is as simple as that. Some need reminding we support Doncaster Rovers FC, not Grant McCann FC.**
**this isn't a post just on reaction to today’s loss.
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How teams have we beaten this season that were in the top half when we played them?
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3rd away game in 7 days.
Their budget is huge too.
Here we go. Same mindset as the players and staff. May as well all not made the 3hr journey then eh!
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Today was probably on par with Orient away for the worst performance of the season. I think two attempts on goal all game. Hope we improve next time out. Today was an insult.
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It's just one game. We have been so much better recently. That said, we do seem to have games where, when we are behind, I don't see a way back.
This is all part of a learning experience in this league, where clearly the quality is much higher than some of us thought it would be.
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It has been a tough on the players in the last week or so. - it would be on any team, it eventually tells.
Wycombe do have a huge budget too and a great squad of players, we would struggle against them when we are fully firing, but it’s the manner of performance today that is my biggest concern.
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It has been a tough on the players in the last week or so. - it would be on any team, it eventually tells.
Wycombe do have a huge budget too and a great squad of players, we would struggle against them when we are fully firing, but it’s the manner of performance today that is my biggest concern.
That’s why not making changes today was mystifying.
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Yep should have rested some today, but they’ve all been great form so would’ve been replacing in form players with players who were out of form.
Catch 22
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Yep should have rested some today, but they’ve all been great form so would’ve been replacing in form players with players who were out of form.
Catch 22
It’s not a catch 22 at all. It’s what you have a squad for. There’s enough medical data now to be ably to make smart decision in these spots.
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Can’t change many if any without a big drop off in quality. He played our best 11. If he really believed the “knackered” nonsense then he’d have shifted things at half time or even earlier. Don’t think leggy was even an issue today tbh.
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Here we go, another McCann in or out vote. Yaaaaawwwwwn. Bad day, entire team looked knackered, rest up refocus and move on, oh yes , and with the same manager.
Get a grip fella, I clearly said I want asking if we should sack him.
*wasn’t
Still hiding I see, and not answering after I've called you out. Pathetic.
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Here we go, another McCann in or out vote. Yaaaaawwwwwn. Bad day, entire team looked knackered, rest up refocus and move on, oh yes , and with the same manager.
Get a grip fella, I clearly said I want asking if we should sack him.
*wasn’t
Still hiding I see, and not answering after I've called you out. Pathetic.
Scroll up.
Hiding…where? In the data stream?
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I mean 10 PTS from the 5 games before says absolutely not. He wasn't the goat after those wins and he's not useless today, stop with the sensationalist shite.
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He’s not ran out of credit yet. If he keeps us up he’s done his job. If we go down we should think about changing because he’s been backed well enough.
I think he’ll keep us up we can beat the teams around us
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What's the point of changing the manager now? If he keeps us up this season he will have done well, anything else from the very beginning was way off the mark at this level and the players we have, a lot of whom are grossly over rated by the supporters.
Player recruitment and the future is a conversation to be had at the end of the season by the powers that be.
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Here we go, another McCann in or out vote. Yaaaaawwwwwn. Bad day, entire team looked knackered, rest up refocus and move on, oh yes , and with the same manager.
Get a grip fella, I clearly said I want asking if we should sack him.
*wasn’t
Still hiding I see, and not answering after I've called you out. Pathetic.
Scroll up.
Hiding…where? In the data stream?
Behind your keyboard, saying things you can only fantasise about saying to someone's face.
Still not answered my question.
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The answer to the question is No.
But having said that McCann should take the majority of the blame for today's shambles.
Not making any changes to the side from Tuesday's tough assignment was absolute stupidity.
When have heard in an interview McCann take complete responsibility for the result , team selection or performance. Never as far as I can recall .., he can talk a good game before it but never says that one’s down to him !!
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The answer to the question is No.
But having said that McCann should take the majority of the blame for today's shambles.
Not making any changes to the side from Tuesday's tough assignment was absolute stupidity.
When have heard in an interview McCann take complete responsibility for the result , team selection or performance. Never as far as I can recall .., he can talk a good game before it but never says that one’s down to him !!
Really?
https://x.com/footballheaven/status/1977059357402812811
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Whatever the reason, we were easily third to every ball today. Miles off it.
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The answer to the question is No.
But having said that McCann should take the majority of the blame for today's shambles.
Not making any changes to the side from Tuesday's tough assignment was absolute stupidity.
When have heard in an interview McCann take complete responsibility for the result , team selection or performance. Never as far as I can recall .., he can talk a good game before it but never says that one’s down to him !!
Really?
https://x.com/footballheaven/status/1977059357402812811
No he didn’t he says he’s been too loyal to players .. still blaming them !!
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It has been a tough on the players in the last week or so. - it would be on any team, it eventually tells.
Wycombe do have a huge budget too and a great squad of players, we would struggle against them when we are fully firing, but it’s the manner of performance today that is my biggest concern.
That’s why not making changes today was mystifying.
He can't win though can he? If he changed a winning team he'd have been heavily criticised for that!
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The answer to the question is No.
But having said that McCann should take the majority of the blame for today's shambles.
Not making any changes to the side from Tuesday's tough assignment was absolute stupidity.
When have heard in an interview McCann take complete responsibility for the result , team selection or performance. Never as far as I can recall .., he can talk a good game before it but never says that one’s down to him !!
Really?
https://x.com/footballheaven/status/1977059357402812811
No he didn’t he says he’s been too loyal to players .. still blaming them !!
He clearly says “Myself included”….
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It has been a tough on the players in the last week or so. - it would be on any team, it eventually tells.
Wycombe do have a huge budget too and a great squad of players, we would struggle against them when we are fully firing, but it’s the manner of performance today that is my biggest concern.
That’s why not making changes today was mystifying.
He can't win though can he? If he changed a winning team he'd have been heavily criticised for that!
Why would he? Maybe only from the ignorant. If he made a few changes and we did get beat he can explain his decision making. If he says changes were a necessity due to certain players running on empty, who would question that?
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Quite a few are
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Yep should have rested some today, but they’ve all been great form so would’ve been replacing in form players with players who were out of form.
Catch 22
It’s not a catch 22 at all. It’s what you have a squad for. There’s enough medical data now to be ably to make smart decision in these spots.
And if he made 4/5 changes and we got beat 4-0 do you think nobody would be saying why have we changed a team when we’re playing so well.
Both the runs we went on at back end of the last two seasons saw a consistent team selection each week. Nobody was complaining then
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Yep should have rested some today, but they’ve all been great form so would’ve been replacing in form players with players who were out of form.
Catch 22
It’s not a catch 22 at all. It’s what you have a squad for. There’s enough medical data now to be ably to make smart decision in these spots.
And if he made 4/5 changes and we got beat 4-0 do you think nobody would be saying why have we changed a team when we’re playing so well.
Both the runs we went on at back end of the last two seasons saw a consistent team selection each week. Nobody was complaining then
Have we only got 10 outfield players capable of playing? People have spent two seasons talking about the depth and strength of our squad.
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Here we go, another McCann in or out vote. Yaaaaawwwwwn. Bad day, entire team looked knackered, rest up refocus and move on, oh yes , and with the same manager.
Get a grip fella, I clearly said I want asking if we should sack him.
*wasn’t
Still hiding I see, and not answering after I've called you out. Pathetic.
Scroll up.
Hiding…where? In the data stream?
Behind your keyboard, saying things you can only fantasise about saying to someone's face.
Still not answered my question.
The irony. You posting about hiding behind a keyboard,from a keyboard.
I dont think you're Tont Soprano, more like Christopher
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And the players we played today are the ones in form,
People spend half this season saying he doesn’t know his best team and there’s too much chopping and changing, then we get on a good run and keep the same team because they’re performing. We lose a game and then folk are saying he should’ve changed the line up.
What changes would you have made for today’s game?
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Yep should have rested some today, but they’ve all been great form so would’ve been replacing in form players with players who were out of form.
Catch 22
It’s not a catch 22 at all. It’s what you have a squad for. There’s enough medical data now to be ably to make smart decision in these spots.
And if he made 4/5 changes and we got beat 4-0 do you think nobody would be saying why have we changed a team when we’re playing so well.
Both the runs we went on at back end of the last two seasons saw a consistent team selection each week. Nobody was complaining then
Have we only got 10 outfield players capable of playing? People have spent two seasons talking about the depth and strength of our squad.
Has McCann been traumatised by the injury crisis in that first season?
Since Dave Rennie has been brought in we’ve not had loads of injuries but have continued to spread the budget out over a lot of players. We haven’t really needed the depth that much.
It would be nice to hear him take accountability for his poor recruitment rather than in my view ask for too much from his players.
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No manager in the history of football would come out and say the players they’ve signed who are still at the club were bad signings.
We’ve made some great signings this year and some poor ones, pretty much every club in the country would say the same
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I’m not sure whether anyone has used the word “resilience”, but it seems a quality which is lacking. Does the team lose confidence in the plan for the match if we concede first? Do the managerial staff, including the analysts in combination with the coaches, prepare the team for setbacks and how to react?
I make this point because the manner of defeats seems to follow a pattern, yet when the sequence begins with the opposition going ahead, the team morale and the game-plan seem to disintegrate. As a test of morale and team spirit we just cannot cope with going behind this season. It really doesn’t make sense.
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No manager in the history of football would come out and say the players they’ve signed who are still at the club were bad signings.
We’ve made some great signings this year and some poor ones, pretty much every club in the country would say the same
What was the good summer business with regards to contract extensions and signings for you dicko?
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I think most if not all agreed the summer was a success and on paper we were looking good. Also the business in Jan has improved us again.
We just have to by hook or crook stay in the league and add again.
My only worry is 2 defeats on the trot and todays being a humiliation to all, will have knocked the confidence we were showing.
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No manager in the history of football would come out and say the players they’ve signed who are still at the club were bad signings.
We’ve made some great signings this year and some poor ones, pretty much every club in the country would say the same
What was the good summer business with regards to contract extensions and signings for you dicko?
Good signings this season
Gotts
Lee
Clark
Francis
Haks
Alsos when we signed crew, TLT, everyone was over the moon with those
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The game plan for today just did not work, and this has happened previously this season and therefore Grant and his team must take responsibility, which unfortunately they seem unwilling to do.
We lost the Wigan away game due to the game plan, and then the Wigan home game due to the inept timing of the substitutions where the players were blamed for not taking chances. Yet in the following game against orient he did not repeat, so for me this is evidence he did make a mistake in the Wigan game.
Today we sat back for players who were consistently left in acres of space, not marked or challenged immediately when they got the ball. If this was down to the players, the surely this would have been sorted early in the game. However it continued throughout the game so surely this was the game plan?
Was mols left in acres of space? Absolutely not every time he got the ball, he immediately had 2 players in close proximity, and sometimes a 3rd player has back up.
I am sick of players being blamed when things go wrong, we need to look closer at our management team.
Also why have we got so many issuing instructions to the players, constantly we have Grant, Clive and Kyle all getting involved, surely it’s time to keep things more simple and have one issuing instructions during game time.
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The game plan for today just did not work, and this has happened previously this season and therefore Grant and his team must take responsibility, which unfortunately they seem unwilling to do.
We lost the Wigan away game due to the game plan, and then the Wigan home game due to the inept timing of the substitutions where the players were blamed for not taking chances. Yet in the following game against orient he did not repeat, so for me this is evidence he did make a mistake in the Wigan game.
Today we sat back for players who were consistently left in acres of space, not marked or challenged immediately when they got the ball. If this was down to the players, the surely this would have been sorted early in the game. However it continued throughout the game so surely this was the game plan?
Was mols left in acres of space? Absolutely not every time he got the ball, he immediately had 2 players in close proximity, and sometimes a 3rd player has back up.
I am sick of players being blamed when things go wrong, we need to look closer at our management team.
Also why have we got so many issuing instructions to the players, constantly we have Grant, Clive and Kyle all getting involved, surely it’s time to keep things more simple and have one issuing instructions during game time.
McCann has often spoken in interviews stating they all weren’t good enough including himself and the staff.
Have you been on here praising McCann and his staff after a good performance?
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You can’t use “fans were happy with who we brought in at the time” as any sort of argument in favour of the recruitment. They’re the experts they’re meant to know a lot better than fans what to expect from each player, the job they’ll do etc. we signed so many with absolute no clue how we were even going to deploy them, didn’t we?
The jury is out still on the January signings, it’s too early to judge them either positively or negatively and there’s also an argument we didn’t sign enough at centre back… We needed 2 imo.
The summer you can judge and it was a disaster, only Gotts has been a (belated) success.
We got close to a point where a summer rebuild (finally) wasn’t necessary but we’ve blown that now, especially if we go down. Might now lose Bailey and Molyneux too.
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No manager in the history of football would come out and say the players they’ve signed who are still at the club were bad signings.
We’ve made some great signings this year and some poor ones, pretty much every club in the country would say the same
What was the good summer business with regards to contract extensions and signings for you dicko?
Good signings this season
Gotts
Lee
Clark
Francis
Haks
Alsos when we signed crew, TLT, everyone was over the moon with those
So you think only one good signing in the summer? I agree on Gotts now, but Grant misprofiling him left us short in attacking midfield.
A lot of damage is done to a season with a poor summer window. You say most other clubs have poor signings but to come out of it saying only 1 good one is surely far below average, you agree?
Also on your Crew and TLT points - the fans aren’t paid to do that job!
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No manager in the history of football would come out and say the players they’ve signed who are still at the club were bad signings.
We’ve made some great signings this year and some poor ones, pretty much every club in the country would say the same
What was the good summer business with regards to contract extensions and signings for you dicko?
Good signings this season
Gotts
Lee
Clark
Francis
Haks
Alsos when we signed crew, TLT, everyone was over the moon with those
Haks is no certainty to age well as a good signing in league one by the way, and Frankie has had a very good game against Orient but there’s a long way to go with him also. The recruitment this year has been very poor. When’s signing Lee and playing him as a 9 is strange to me. Anonymous today. Surely you have to play a player with his ability in his best position. We game Hanlan and Sharp contracts in the summer, are we deeming them to be not good enough 7 months later? That a lot of wages on the bonfire.
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Stupid poll, getting rid of a guy with 500 managerial games under his belt is ridiculous. Have you lost your mind? Go on then, sack McCann and reappoint Schofield. Today’s game was undoubtedly our worst performance this season but I doubt that team could replicate today and do as bad again.
Our recent form has been good winning at Wimbledon and Burton, beating Orient at home and drawing with Wigan which prevented them taking all 3 points which could prove pivotal considering they’re down there too.
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What concerns me is the inability to manage a match. Whatever the circumstances we seem to be all out attack. I’m sure it’s why we lose so many winning positions and our goal difference is so bad. Winning, let’s just attack them. Losing, attack even harder. I don’t want to lose 1-0 but it’s a lot better than getting pasted!
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No manager in the history of football would come out and say the players they’ve signed who are still at the club were bad signings.
We’ve made some great signings this year and some poor ones, pretty much every club in the country would say the same
What was the good summer business with regards to contract extensions and signings for you dicko?
Good signings this season
Gotts
Lee
Clark
Francis
Haks
Alsos when we signed crew, TLT, everyone was over the moon with those
So you think only one good signing in the summer? I agree on Gotts now, but Grant misprofiling him left us short in attacking midfield.
A lot of damage is done to a season with a poor summer window. You say most other clubs have poor signings but to come out of it saying only 1 good one is surely far below average, you agree?
Also on your Crew and TLT points - the fans aren’t paid to do that job!
I’m talking as a whole,
Last few seasons we’ve made very good signings in Jan that have transformed our seasons,
Of course fans aren’t paid to do that job but there was nothing to suggest that those two signings wouldn’t be as good as what everyone thought they would be
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No manager in the history of football would come out and say the players they’ve signed who are still at the club were bad signings.
We’ve made some great signings this year and some poor ones, pretty much every club in the country would say the same
What was the good summer business with regards to contract extensions and signings for you dicko?
Good signings this season
Gotts
Lee
Clark
Francis
Haks
Alsos when we signed crew, TLT, everyone was over the moon with those
Haks is no certainty to age well as a good signing in league one by the way, and Frankie has had a very good game against Orient but there’s a long way to go with him also. The recruitment this year has been very poor. When’s signing Lee and playing him as a 9 is strange to me. Anonymous today. Surely you have to play a player with his ability in his best position. We game Hanlan and Sharp contracts in the summer, are we deeming them to be not good enough 7 months later? That a lot of wages on the bonfire.
Haks is a good signing at this level, think he’s already proving that.
When we signed him 2 years ago, I recall you weren’t sure he was a good signing then either.
Our recruitment this year hasn’t been great but it hasn’t been awful either
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I’m not sure whether anyone has used the word “resilience”, but it seems a quality which is lacking. Does the team lose confidence in the plan for the match if we concede first? Do the managerial staff, including the analysts in combination with the coaches, prepare the team for setbacks and how to react?
I make this point because the manner of defeats seems to follow a pattern, yet when the sequence begins with the opposition going ahead, the team morale and the game-plan seem to disintegrate. As a test of morale and team spirit we just cannot cope with going behind this season. It really doesn’t make sense.
What is Copps doing these days? I thought he was the sports psychologist type bloke, all about getting your head straight etc.
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No manager in the history of football would come out and say the players they’ve signed who are still at the club were bad signings.
We’ve made some great signings this year and some poor ones, pretty much every club in the country would say the same
What was the good summer business with regards to contract extensions and signings for you dicko?
Good signings this season
Gotts
Lee
Clark
Francis
Haks
Alsos when we signed crew, TLT, everyone was over the moon with those
So you think only one good signing in the summer? I agree on Gotts now, but Grant misprofiling him left us short in attacking midfield.
A lot of damage is done to a season with a poor summer window. You say most other clubs have poor signings but to come out of it saying only 1 good one is surely far below average, you agree?
Also on your Crew and TLT points - the fans aren’t paid to do that job!
I’m talking as a whole,
Last few seasons we’ve made very good signings in Jan that have transformed our seasons,
Of course fans aren’t paid to do that job but there was nothing to suggest that those two signings wouldn’t be as good as what everyone thought they would be
Exactly. They were decent signings in anyones book, yet form, not fit in, what ever reason it hasnt worked.... that is football.
It doesn't mean it was bad recruitment
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I have read numerous times that the season will have been a success if we finish twentieth or higher and (obviously) stay up, then build on that next season.
If fifty points is the required total for that to happen, then we need to average a fraction over just one point per game.
Does anyone think that won’t happen?
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The game plan for today just did not work, and this has happened previously this season and therefore Grant and his team must take responsibility, which unfortunately they seem unwilling to do.
We lost the Wigan away game due to the game plan, and then the Wigan home game due to the inept timing of the substitutions where the players were blamed for not taking chances. Yet in the following game against orient he did not repeat, so for me this is evidence he did make a mistake in the Wigan game.
Today we sat back for players who were consistently left in acres of space, not marked or challenged immediately when they got the ball. If this was down to the players, the surely this would have been sorted early in the game. However it continued throughout the game so surely this was the game plan?
Was mols left in acres of space? Absolutely not every time he got the ball, he immediately had 2 players in close proximity, and sometimes a 3rd player has back up.
I am sick of players being blamed when things go wrong, we need to look closer at our management team.
Also why have we got so many issuing instructions to the players, constantly we have Grant, Clive and Kyle all getting involved, surely it’s time to keep things more simple and have one issuing instructions during game time.
McCann has often spoken in interviews stating they all weren’t good enough including himself and the staff.
Have you been on here praising McCann and his staff after a good performance?
Well he didn’t say that after the Wigan home game.
We have only won 4 in the last 23 league games, how many times has he said the management team got it wrong?
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Our recruitment has not been good. Nobody sentient can claim otherwise. It might be some of the loans in January could be just enough to get us over the line. But that almost doubles down on the poor signings made in the summer window. We’ve given ourselves concrete boots with how the summer window unfolded. Senior players signed on presumably good money and then either benched or banished. You could forgive that for one of our youth or even a loan but not senior lads. We’ve got to be far better at this. It’s not good enough.
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For what it's worth, I dont think we should sack him at the moment.
But I DO think his credit is running low.
Mcann is very good at saying the right things, but let's see where we are in 5 games.
[/quote
I honestly think you thrive on us getting beat, you never say anything positive, I think you were gutted that we won on Tuesday, it’s 10 point from 18, that’s dreadful isn’t it. In fact I now have doubts that you actually support the club and are a supporter of another club.
Good forbid we get to Wembley and don’t get relegated.
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I can’t believe there is anyone trying to argue our recruitment has been anything other than awful. It is either a wind up or delusion. It is fine to criticise some things and some personnel you know? Like, you aren’t going to have your season ticket taking off of you. You don’t get given a special hospitality box for refraining and it certainly isn’t going to kill you.
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A couple of points from today’s match . We played rubbish. Wycombe played well
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No manager in the history of football would come out and say the players they’ve signed who are still at the club were bad signings.
We’ve made some great signings this year and some poor ones, pretty much every club in the country would say the same
What was the good summer business with regards to contract extensions and signings for you dicko?
Good signings this season
Gotts
Lee
Clark
Francis
Haks
Alsos when we signed crew, TLT, everyone was over the moon with those
So you think only one good signing in the summer? I agree on Gotts now, but Grant misprofiling him left us short in attacking midfield.
A lot of damage is done to a season with a poor summer window. You say most other clubs have poor signings but to come out of it saying only 1 good one is surely far below average, you agree?
Also on your Crew and TLT points - the fans aren’t paid to do that job!
I’m talking as a whole,
Last few seasons we’ve made very good signings in Jan that have transformed our seasons,
Of course fans aren’t paid to do that job but there was nothing to suggest that those two signings wouldn’t be as good as what everyone thought they would be
We make very good signings every January that dramatically improve our season… until we don’t.
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The game plan for today just did not work, and this has happened previously this season and therefore Grant and his team must take responsibility, which unfortunately they seem unwilling to do.
We lost the Wigan away game due to the game plan, and then the Wigan home game due to the inept timing of the substitutions where the players were blamed for not taking chances. Yet in the following game against orient he did not repeat, so for me this is evidence he did make a mistake in the Wigan game.
Today we sat back for players who were consistently left in acres of space, not marked or challenged immediately when they got the ball. If this was down to the players, the surely this would have been sorted early in the game. However it continued throughout the game so surely this was the game plan?
Was mols left in acres of space? Absolutely not every time he got the ball, he immediately had 2 players in close proximity, and sometimes a 3rd player has back up.
I am sick of players being blamed when things go wrong, we need to look closer at our management team.
Also why have we got so many issuing instructions to the players, constantly we have Grant, Clive and Kyle all getting involved, surely it’s time to keep things more simple and have one issuing instructions during game time.
McCann has often spoken in interviews stating they all weren’t good enough including himself and the staff.
Have you been on here praising McCann and his staff after a good performance?
Doing a good job is what McCann & co are paid for ,?otherwise what’s the point ? It’s about results and we barely look like getting results on too many occasions. I’m happy to see us play scruffy , battle hard , despairing tackles , and even accumulate bookings if it puts points on the board . But though we play mainly football that IS good to watch , it often lacks grunt and vigour . Trying not loose is better than just trying to win!!
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And we have been getting results, we’ve got 11 points from 7 games since the turn of the year, keep that up and we will be midtable at least come May.
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I think most if not all agreed the summer was a success and on paper we were looking good. Also the business in Jan has improved us again.
We just have to by hook or crook stay in the league and add again.
My only worry is 2 defeats on the trot and todays being a humiliation to all, will have knocked the confidence we were showing.
2 defeats on the trot?
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And we have been getting results, we’ve got 11 points from 7 games since the turn of the year, keep that up and we will be midtable at least come May.
My slight concern is the form of the teams we have beaten recently.
We’ve beaten two teams currently in the top half, Bradford and Peterborough, and from memory I’m sure Posh were in the bottom group when we played them.
Burton 2 wins in 14
Orient 2 wins in 12
Wimbledon 1 win in 14
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I'd say we weren't much better than we were against Wimbledon today. We won that game more so because of how useless Wimbledon were.
Orient we actually were very good and started to get excited a bit.
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And we have been getting results, we’ve got 11 points from 7 games since the turn of the year, keep that up and we will be midtable at least come May.
Seems like you have been posting during those 7 games, but not many if at all any, during the many weeks previous.
Early in the season some on here were raising some concerns about game plan tactics, team selections etc. and how it was affecting performances, yet you were constantly saying don’t worry we will end up at the high end of the table.
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Mainly because the negativity on here is ridiculous when the going gets tough,
As is being proven now after one bad defeat amongst a good run of form
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You could have had the decency to spell his name correctly .
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Here we go, another McCann in or out vote. Yaaaaawwwwwn. Bad day, entire team looked knackered, rest up refocus and move on, oh yes , and with the same manager.
Get a grip fella, I clearly said I want asking if we should sack him.
*wasn’t
Still hiding I see, and not answering after I've called you out. Pathetic.
Calling people out on a football forum is incredibly cute little Tony. But I think it's about time you found yourself a lovely woman or man if that's what your into to give your old love flute a kiss and relieve some tension darling :kiss:
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Mainly because the negativity on here is ridiculous when the going gets tough,
As is being proven now after one bad defeat amongst a good run of form
Negativity?
The overwhelming majority on this forum are backing mcann according to the poll.
But that doesnt mean we cant talk about it
-
Mainly because the negativity on here is ridiculous when the going gets tough,
As is being proven now after one bad defeat amongst a good run of form
Negativity?
The overwhelming majority on this forum are backing mcann according to the poll.
But that doesnt mean we cant talk about it
This is it in a nutshell, you come on here and tell people what to think without looking at the bigger picture, “ McCann should go” , or in your case Mcann, then you’ll turn on the ownership saying that they don’t spend money, bad recruitment and anything else that takes your fancy that.
In previous times of so called struggling everyone has tended to pull together, but you seem hell bent of causing divisions amongst the supporters/club because I’ll go back to what I wrote previously, I don’t think you are an actual supporter, but someone who lives locally and likes causing unrest
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Here we go, another McCann in or out vote. Yaaaaawwwwwn. Bad day, entire team looked knackered, rest up refocus and move on, oh yes , and with the same manager.
Get a grip fella, I clearly said I want asking if we should sack him.
*wasn’t
Still hiding I see, and not answering after I've called you out. Pathetic.
Scroll up.
Hiding…where? In the data stream?
Behind your keyboard, saying things you can only fantasise about saying to someone's face.
Still not answered my question.
Are you a child or a grown man, just wondering?
-
Mainly because the negativity on here is ridiculous when the going gets tough,
As is being proven now after one bad defeat amongst a good run of form
Negativity?
The overwhelming majority on this forum are backing mcann according to the poll.
But that doesnt mean we cant talk about it
This is it in a nutshell, you come on here and tell people what to think without looking at the bigger picture, “ McCann should go” , or in your case Mcann, then you’ll turn on the ownership saying that they don’t spend money, bad recruitment and anything else that takes your fancy that.
In previous times of so called struggling everyone has tended to pull together, but you seem hell bent of causing divisions amongst the supporters/club because I’ll go back to what I wrote previously, I don’t think you are an actual supporter, but someone who lives locally and likes causing unrest
Funnily someone posts the exact same posts as Tony does on here on x, different name though although they claim not to be the same person
-
Mainly because the negativity on here is ridiculous when the going gets tough,
As is being proven now after one bad defeat amongst a good run of form
Negativity?
The overwhelming majority on this forum are backing mcann according to the poll.
But that doesnt mean we cant talk about it
This is it in a nutshell, you come on here and tell people what to think without looking at the bigger picture, “ McCann should go” , or in your case Mcann, then you’ll turn on the ownership saying that they don’t spend money, bad recruitment and anything else that takes your fancy that.
In previous times of so called struggling everyone has tended to pull together, but you seem hell bent of causing divisions amongst the supporters/club because I’ll go back to what I wrote previously, I don’t think you are an actual supporter, but someone who lives locally and likes causing unrest
Funnily someone posts the exact same posts as Tony does on here on x, different name though although they claim not to be the same person
If it’s me you’re insinuating, like PDX does, it isn’t. I also wouldn’t be arsed about calling PDX out about saying things face to face as I know he lives in America whereas reading through comments on here TS doesn’t know.
I also don’t share some of the same views as this Tony Soprano character.
If you’re on about someone else then fair enough.
-
Mainly because the negativity on here is ridiculous when the going gets tough,
As is being proven now after one bad defeat amongst a good run of form
Negativity?
The overwhelming majority on this forum are backing mcann according to the poll.
But that doesnt mean we cant talk about it
This is it in a nutshell, you come on here and tell people what to think without looking at the bigger picture, “ McCann should go” , or in your case Mcann, then you’ll turn on the ownership saying that they don’t spend money, bad recruitment and anything else that takes your fancy that.
In previous times of so called struggling everyone has tended to pull together, but you seem hell bent of causing divisions amongst the supporters/club because I’ll go back to what I wrote previously, I don’t think you are an actual supporter, but someone who lives locally and likes causing unrest
Funnily someone posts the exact same posts as Tony does on here on x, different name though although they claim not to be the same person
If it’s me you’re insinuating, like PDX does, it isn’t. I also wouldn’t be arsed about calling PDX out about saying things face to face as I know he lives in America whereas reading through comments on here TS doesn’t know.
I also don’t share some of the same views as this Tony Soprano character.
If you’re on about someone else then fair enough.
Is your name Tony on here? I suggest you read things properly
-
Mainly because the negativity on here is ridiculous when the going gets tough,
As is being proven now after one bad defeat amongst a good run of form
Negativity?
The overwhelming majority on this forum are backing mcann according to the poll.
But that doesnt mean we cant talk about it
This is it in a nutshell, you come on here and tell people what to think without looking at the bigger picture, “ McCann should go” , or in your case Mcann, then you’ll turn on the ownership saying that they don’t spend money, bad recruitment and anything else that takes your fancy that.
In previous times of so called struggling everyone has tended to pull together, but you seem hell bent of causing divisions amongst the supporters/club because I’ll go back to what I wrote previously, I don’t think you are an actual supporter, but someone who lives locally and likes causing unrest
Funnily someone posts the exact same posts as Tony does on here on x, different name though although they claim not to be the same person
If it’s me you’re insinuating, like PDX does, it isn’t. I also wouldn’t be arsed about calling PDX out about saying things face to face as I know he lives in America whereas reading through comments on here TS doesn’t know.
I also don’t share some of the same views as this Tony Soprano character.
If you’re on about someone else then fair enough.
Is your name Tony on here? I suggest you read things properly
Sorry if I have wrong end of the stick. I’ve been accused of being behind the Tony Soprano account a few times on here, hadn’t seen anyone else accused so assumed you was referring to me.
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According to many most managers in football should lose their job, based on these suggestions.
The future of the club is bright with Mccann here.
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Here we go, another McCann in or out vote. Yaaaaawwwwwn. Bad day, entire team looked knackered, rest up refocus and move on, oh yes , and with the same manager.
Get a grip fella, I clearly said I want asking if we should sack him.
*wasn’t
Q: What's more pathetic than a keyboard warrior?
A: A keyboard warrior who's can't even use the right words or tenses of what is presumably their native tongue.
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Everybody loses football games but i have to admit Saturday was a worry and we can only hope it was a one off.. There's nothing that turns a fan base against you as a manager quicker than when your team turns out and looks like it's not bothered one way or another with a perceived lack of effort and application.
Now i'm sure that wasn't the case but we were really that bad that's how it was perceived. Another concern was that he didn't have enough faith in the squad players to freshen things up after some tough games.
For me i hope he sticks with playing the squad players Tuesday, rest the likes of Bailey (i dont want to see him in the squad) he's played far to many games, and rest the team, give them a nice break and a chance to work on ways of stopping teams strolling through our midfield at will.
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It's a no from me but if we turn in the kind of spineless display shown on Saturday at Rotherham in a couple of weeks then there is something seriously wrong somewhere.
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Here we go, another McCann in or out vote. Yaaaaawwwwwn. Bad day, entire team looked knackered, rest up refocus and move on, oh yes , and with the same manager.
Get a grip fella, I clearly said I want asking if we should sack him.
*wasn’t
Q: What's more pathetic than a keyboard warrior?
A: A keyboard warrior who's can't even use the right words or tenses of what is presumably their native tongue.
*who
**correct
***which
-
Mainly because the negativity on here is ridiculous when the going gets tough,
As is being proven now after one bad defeat amongst a good run of form
Negativity?
The overwhelming majority on this forum are backing mcann according to the poll.
But that doesnt mean we cant talk about it
This is it in a nutshell, you come on here and tell people what to think without looking at the bigger picture, “ McCann should go” , or in your case Mcann, then you’ll turn on the ownership saying that they don’t spend money, bad recruitment and anything else that takes your fancy that.
In previous times of so called struggling everyone has tended to pull together, but you seem hell bent of causing divisions amongst the supporters/club because I’ll go back to what I wrote previously, I don’t think you are an actual supporter, but someone who lives locally and likes causing unrest
Funnily someone posts the exact same posts as Tony does on here on x, different name though although they claim not to be the same person
Andy Gorham
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Here we go, another McCann in or out vote. Yaaaaawwwwwn. Bad day, entire team looked knackered, rest up refocus and move on, oh yes , and with the same manager.
Get a grip fella, I clearly said I want asking if we should sack him.
*wasn’t
Q: What's more pathetic than a keyboard warrior?
A: A keyboard warrior who's can't even use the right words or tenses of what is presumably their native tongue.
What a nob you are
-
Here we go, another McCann in or out vote. Yaaaaawwwwwn. Bad day, entire team looked knackered, rest up refocus and move on, oh yes , and with the same manager.
Get a grip fella, I clearly said I want asking if we should sack him.
*wasn’t
Q: What's more pathetic than a keyboard warrior?
A: A keyboard warrior who's can't even use the right words or tenses of what is presumably their native tongue.
*who
**correct
***which
Nice bit of irony wasn’t it Tony. :lol: :lol:
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Here we go, another McCann in or out vote. Yaaaaawwwwwn. Bad day, entire team looked knackered, rest up refocus and move on, oh yes , and with the same manager.
Get a grip fella, I clearly said I want asking if we should sack him.
*wasn’t
Still hiding I see, and not answering after I've called you out. Pathetic.
Yeah… if your eyes worked you’d have seen that I answered you, McGoo.
-
Mainly because the negativity on here is ridiculous when the going gets tough,
As is being proven now after one bad defeat amongst a good run of form
Negativity?
The overwhelming majority on this forum are backing mcann according to the poll.
But that doesnt mean we cant talk about it
This is it in a nutshell, you come on here and tell people what to think without looking at the bigger picture, “ McCann should go” , or in your case Mcann, then you’ll turn on the ownership saying that they don’t spend money, bad recruitment and anything else that takes your fancy that.
In previous times of so called struggling everyone has tended to pull together, but you seem hell bent of causing divisions amongst the supporters/club because I’ll go back to what I wrote previously, I don’t think you are an actual supporter, but someone who lives locally and likes causing unrest
Funnily someone posts the exact same posts as Tony does on here on x, different name though although they claim not to be the same person
If it’s me you’re insinuating, like PDX does, it isn’t. I also wouldn’t be arsed about calling PDX out about saying things face to face as I know he lives in America whereas reading through comments on here TS doesn’t know.
I also don’t share some of the same views as this Tony Soprano character.
If you’re on about someone else then fair enough.
Yeah. I’m sorry about that by the way.
-
Here we go, another McCann in or out vote. Yaaaaawwwwwn. Bad day, entire team looked knackered, rest up refocus and move on, oh yes , and with the same manager.
Get a grip fella, I clearly said I want asking if we should sack him.
*wasn’t
Still hiding I see, and not answering after I've called you out. Pathetic.
Yeah… if your eyes worked you’d have seen that I answered you, McGoo.
No, still waiting for you to explain why you think the grammar is wrong
-
Here we go, another McCann in or out vote. Yaaaaawwwwwn. Bad day, entire team looked knackered, rest up refocus and move on, oh yes , and with the same manager.
Get a grip fella, I clearly said I want asking if we should sack him.
*wasn’t
Q: What's more pathetic than a keyboard warrior?
A: A keyboard warrior who's can't even use the right words or tenses of what is presumably their native tongue.
*who
**correct
***which
Nice bit of irony wasn’t it Tony. :lol: :lol:
Unfortunately lost on Mr wiggly :lol:
-
Mainly because the negativity on here is ridiculous when the going gets tough,
As is being proven now after one bad defeat amongst a good run of form
Negativity?
The overwhelming majority on this forum are backing mcann according to the poll.
But that doesnt mean we cant talk about it
This is it in a nutshell, you come on here and tell people what to think without looking at the bigger picture, “ McCann should go” , or in your case Mcann, then you’ll turn on the ownership saying that they don’t spend money, bad recruitment and anything else that takes your fancy that.
In previous times of so called struggling everyone has tended to pull together, but you seem hell bent of causing divisions amongst the supporters/club because I’ll go back to what I wrote previously, I don’t think you are an actual supporter, but someone who lives locally and likes causing unrest
Funnily someone posts the exact same posts as Tony does on here on x, different name though although they claim not to be the same person
If it’s me you’re insinuating, like PDX does, it isn’t. I also wouldn’t be arsed about calling PDX out about saying things face to face as I know he lives in America whereas reading through comments on here TS doesn’t know.
I also don’t share some of the same views as this Tony Soprano character.
If you’re on about someone else then fair enough.
Yeah. I’m sorry about that by the way.
No worries :) was just frustrating as I couldn’t post to say it wasn’t and I didn’t want someone saying something terrible and it being attributed to me.
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Why has this thread escalated into yet another arguement rather than actual decent discussion??
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Why has this thread escalated into yet another arguement rather than actual decent discussion??
It wasn’t really a decent discussion from the start
-
I thought it was a perfectly reasonable and appropriate question, at this stage of the season as we teeter on the edge of relegation, as to whether McCann still has credit left from last years promotion.
The majority view seems to be that he does, with some wavering on whether he should go if we go down.
My view is that he's fast running out of credit, we've seen bad recruitment and some terrible in-game management decisions, and he's been very well backed by the board - more than any manager in a long long time here.
But the winter window looks good. Haks, Francis and Lee in particular may be the magic we need to stay up, with Byrne adding strength at the back, so reasons to be positive.
I would get rid of McCann this summer whether we go down or not. A full summer for a new manager, a chance to refresh some of the back office to freshen up the decision-making around transfers and tactics. And invest in a manager who can look after the pennies a bit better. The other lively debate on here was succession planning for Bramhall - that is a harder task if our manager has a strike rate of one good player in every three signings. The money we've wasted this year alone is obscene.
I don't know who else we should get, but I think whatever happens we need a freshen up and reset all round if we want to be a competitive league one team longer term.
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I thought it was a perfectly reasonable and appropriate question, at this stage of the season as we teeter on the edge of relegation, as to whether McCann still has credit left from last years promotion.
The majority view seems to be that he does, with some wavering on whether he should go if we go down.
My view is that he's fast running out of credit, we've seen bad recruitment and some terrible in-game management decisions, and he's been very well backed by the board - more than any manager in a long long time here.
But the winter window looks good. Haks, Francis and Lee in particular may be the magic we need to stay up, with Byrne adding strength at the back, so reasons to be positive.
I would get rid of McCann this summer whether we go down or not. A full summer for a new manager, a chance to refresh some of the back office to freshen up the decision-making around transfers and tactics. And invest in a manager who can look after the pennies a bit better. The other lively debate on here was succession planning for Bramhall - that is a harder task if our manager has a strike rate of one good player in every three signings. The money we've wasted this year alone is obscene.
I don't know who else we should get, but I think whatever happens we need a freshen up and reset all round if we want to be a competitive league one team longer term.
A sensible post and well put !
I hope we stay up and McCann keeps his job. We were in a real mess before he came in, and we’ve been getting stronger every year.
PS: The grammar police will be all over this because it goes against their narrative.
Except Wiggle — it’s way above his intellect.
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I thought it was a perfectly reasonable and appropriate question, at this stage of the season as we teeter on the edge of relegation, as to whether McCann still has credit left from last years promotion.
The majority view seems to be that he does, with some wavering on whether he should go if we go down.
My view is that he's fast running out of credit, we've seen bad recruitment and some terrible in-game management decisions, and he's been very well backed by the board - more than any manager in a long long time here.
But the winter window looks good. Haks, Francis and Lee in particular may be the magic we need to stay up, with Byrne adding strength at the back, so reasons to be positive.
I would get rid of McCann this summer whether we go down or not. A full summer for a new manager, a chance to refresh some of the back office to freshen up the decision-making around transfers and tactics. And invest in a manager who can look after the pennies a bit better. The other lively debate on here was succession planning for Bramhall - that is a harder task if our manager has a strike rate of one good player in every three signings. The money we've wasted this year alone is obscene.
I don't know who else we should get, but I think whatever happens we need a freshen up and reset all round if we want to be a competitive league one team longer term.
The only point i would question him as manager would be if we went down AND had a really poor start to next season like we did a couple of seasons ago. Only then will my viewpoint change, for now even if we go down he is the best person to bring us straight back up and will have learned from this season.
I think most fans can agree that the standard in League One is much greater than it was the last time we were in it and some fans need to take a reality check with their expectations.
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Here we go, another McCann in or out vote. Yaaaaawwwwwn. Bad day, entire team looked knackered, rest up refocus and move on, oh yes , and with the same manager.
Get a grip fella, I clearly said I want asking if we should sack him.
*wasn’t
Q: What's more pathetic than a keyboard warrior?
A: A keyboard warrior who's can't even use the right words or tenses of what is presumably their native tongue.
*who
**correct
***which
Nice bit of irony wasn’t it Tony. :lol: :lol:
It would have been if 'right' wasn't a synonym of 'correct' and therefore still right, and using 'which' instead of 'what' would be completely incorrect.
However, I accept I used 'who's' incorrectly instead of 'who'. An admission that appears to be beyond some people.
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Here we go, another McCann in or out vote. Yaaaaawwwwwn. Bad day, entire team looked knackered, rest up refocus and move on, oh yes , and with the same manager.
Get a grip fella, I clearly said I want asking if we should sack him.
*wasn’t
Q: What's more pathetic than a keyboard warrior?
A: A keyboard warrior who's can't even use the right words or tenses of what is presumably their native tongue.
What a nob you are
That's your opinion and you're entitled to it.
At least I'm not such a nob as to challenge you to 'say it to my face'!
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Here we go, another McCann in or out vote. Yaaaaawwwwwn. Bad day, entire team looked knackered, rest up refocus and move on, oh yes , and with the same manager.
Get a grip fella, I clearly said I want asking if we should sack him.
*wasn’t
Q: What's more pathetic than a keyboard warrior?
A: A keyboard warrior who's can't even use the right words or tenses of what is presumably their native tongue.
*who
**correct
***which
Nice bit of irony wasn’t it Tony. :lol: :lol:
Unfortunately lost on Mr wiggly :lol:
Your incorrect corrections certainly weren't. I presume that makes them doubly ironic!
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I thought it was a perfectly reasonable and appropriate question, at this stage of the season as we teeter on the edge of relegation, as to whether McCann still has credit left from last years promotion.
The majority view seems to be that he does, with some wavering on whether he should go if we go down.
My view is that he's fast running out of credit, we've seen bad recruitment and some terrible in-game management decisions, and he's been very well backed by the board - more than any manager in a long long time here.
But the winter window looks good. Haks, Francis and Lee in particular may be the magic we need to stay up, with Byrne adding strength at the back, so reasons to be positive.
I would get rid of McCann this summer whether we go down or not. A full summer for a new manager, a chance to refresh some of the back office to freshen up the decision-making around transfers and tactics. And invest in a manager who can look after the pennies a bit better. The other lively debate on here was succession planning for Bramhall - that is a harder task if our manager has a strike rate of one good player in every three signings. The money we've wasted this year alone is obscene.
I don't know who else we should get, but I think whatever happens we need a freshen up and reset all round if we want to be a competitive league one team longer term.
The only point i would question him as manager would be if we went down AND had a really poor start to next season like we did a couple of seasons ago. Only then will my viewpoint change, for now even if we go down he is the best person to bring us straight back up and will have learned from this season.
I think most fans can agree that the standard in League One is much greater than it was the last time we were in it and some fans need to take a reality check with their expectations.
That’s potentially throwing another season out the way though and with a poor start you’d imagine it will have been another poor summer of recruitment. It’s his recruitment that is my biggest doubt about him. I’ve thought about McCann’s performance/job security a few times this season and I keep landing on replacing him in the summer, solely down to that reason.
If we’re to improve our whole process around identifying targets, then it makes sense to also remove and replace the people who don’t really fit in to that. McCann demands full control of the football department.
EDIT: also on your last point about L1 being much tougher than before (it is) and fans needing a reality check on expectations… It’s McCann who has been saying quite confidently since last season that he knows L1 better than L2 and how he’s signing players with that (this) league in mind. I would argue he’s the guilty one of underestimating this division and overestimating his and his players ability.
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I thought it was a perfectly reasonable and appropriate question, at this stage of the season as we teeter on the edge of relegation, as to whether McCann still has credit left from last years promotion.
The majority view seems to be that he does, with some wavering on whether he should go if we go down.
My view is that he's fast running out of credit, we've seen bad recruitment and some terrible in-game management decisions, and he's been very well backed by the board - more than any manager in a long long time here.
But the winter window looks good. Haks, Francis and Lee in particular may be the magic we need to stay up, with Byrne adding strength at the back, so reasons to be positive.
I would get rid of McCann this summer whether we go down or not. A full summer for a new manager, a chance to refresh some of the back office to freshen up the decision-making around transfers and tactics. And invest in a manager who can look after the pennies a bit better. The other lively debate on here was succession planning for Bramhall - that is a harder task if our manager has a strike rate of one good player in every three signings. The money we've wasted this year alone is obscene.
I don't know who else we should get, but I think whatever happens we need a freshen up and reset all round if we want to be a competitive league one team longer term.
The only point i would question him as manager would be if we went down AND had a really poor start to next season like we did a couple of seasons ago. Only then will my viewpoint change, for now even if we go down he is the best person to bring us straight back up and will have learned from this season.
I think most fans can agree that the standard in League One is much greater than it was the last time we were in it and some fans need to take a reality check with their expectations.
Fal, mate, I really don't think you're getting the gravity of this situation. If we go down this season, it'll set the club back years, and there's no evidence whatsoever that we'll bounce straight back up.
ST sales will take a massive hit, floating fans that came back to the club because of promotion to League 1 will f*ck off again, we'll lose our best players and yet another re-build will have to be assembled.
We simply must stay up this season or we're in real trouble.
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I thought it was a perfectly reasonable and appropriate question, at this stage of the season as we teeter on the edge of relegation, as to whether McCann still has credit left from last years promotion.
The majority view seems to be that he does, with some wavering on whether he should go if we go down.
My view is that he's fast running out of credit, we've seen bad recruitment and some terrible in-game management decisions, and he's been very well backed by the board - more than any manager in a long long time here.
But the winter window looks good. Haks, Francis and Lee in particular may be the magic we need to stay up, with Byrne adding strength at the back, so reasons to be positive.
I would get rid of McCann this summer whether we go down or not. A full summer for a new manager, a chance to refresh some of the back office to freshen up the decision-making around transfers and tactics. And invest in a manager who can look after the pennies a bit better. The other lively debate on here was succession planning for Bramhall - that is a harder task if our manager has a strike rate of one good player in every three signings. The money we've wasted this year alone is obscene.
I don't know who else we should get, but I think whatever happens we need a freshen up and reset all round if we want to be a competitive league one team longer term.
The only point i would question him as manager would be if we went down AND had a really poor start to next season like we did a couple of seasons ago. Only then will my viewpoint change, for now even if we go down he is the best person to bring us straight back up and will have learned from this season.
I think most fans can agree that the standard in League One is much greater than it was the last time we were in it and some fans need to take a reality check with their expectations.
Fal, mate, I really don't think you're getting the gravity of this situation. If we go down this season, it'll set the club back years, and there's no evidence whatsoever that we'll bounce straight back up.
ST sales will take a massive hit, floating fans that came back to the club because of promotion to League 1 will f*ck off again, we'll lose our best players and yet another re-build will have to be assembled.
We simply must stay up this season or we're in real trouble.
Even if we stayed up we may lose our best players, so that point is mute if im honest. We could've quite easily lost Bailey and Molyneux in this past window but we didn't. There is also no evidence that we would struggle next season as we don't know the signings we make in the summer.
I honestly don't agree that it would set us back years, the way the club is run is different now. Beforehand they tried to make it a self sustainable club and that backfired with relegation and the subsequent awful post covid years with frees and journeymen signing. Terry will not let that happen i can almost guarentee and you can see that from how he is with the meet the owner events.
Theres 48 points still to play for, for all we know we could win every one (not likely i know). Realistically 4 wins and a couple of draws may be enough, im just not concerned about relegation when theres still 16 games left to play. In April with 6 or so left sure but right now not so much, we are going to sadly have days like the Wycombe game, its just part an parcel of being a mid table to lower side in thsi division. We are also just like a bunch of others 6 points away from the top half of the league.
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The difference in price between selling Molyneux and Bailey as a L1 club rather than L2 will be massive for a club of our size.
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In answer to the question on the Poll
I would of said
No in September & October
Maybe in November & December
Yes in January & February
I have had enough of watching the same tactics and formation every game, played with the same terrible execution week in week out.
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Here we go, another McCann in or out vote. Yaaaaawwwwwn. Bad day, entire team looked knackered, rest up refocus and move on, oh yes , and with the same manager.
Get a grip fella, I clearly said I want asking if we should sack him.
*wasn’t
Still hiding I see, and not answering after I've called you out. Pathetic.
Yeah… if your eyes worked you’d have seen that I answered you, McGoo.
No, still waiting for you to explain why you think the grammar is wrong
Grant McCann and it’s run.
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I thought it was a perfectly reasonable and appropriate question, at this stage of the season as we teeter on the edge of relegation, as to whether McCann still has credit left from last years promotion.
The majority view seems to be that he does, with some wavering on whether he should go if we go down.
My view is that he's fast running out of credit, we've seen bad recruitment and some terrible in-game management decisions, and he's been very well backed by the board - more than any manager in a long long time here.
But the winter window looks good. Haks, Francis and Lee in particular may be the magic we need to stay up, with Byrne adding strength at the back, so reasons to be positive.
I would get rid of McCann this summer whether we go down or not. A full summer for a new manager, a chance to refresh some of the back office to freshen up the decision-making around transfers and tactics. And invest in a manager who can look after the pennies a bit better. The other lively debate on here was succession planning for Bramhall - that is a harder task if our manager has a strike rate of one good player in every three signings. The money we've wasted this year alone is obscene.
I don't know who else we should get, but I think whatever happens we need a freshen up and reset all round if we want to be a competitive league one team longer term.
Great post
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Here we go, another McCann in or out vote. Yaaaaawwwwwn. Bad day, entire team looked knackered, rest up refocus and move on, oh yes , and with the same manager.
Get a grip fella, I clearly said I want asking if we should sack him.
*wasn’t
Q: What's more pathetic than a keyboard warrior?
A: A keyboard warrior who's can't even use the right words or tenses of what is presumably their native tongue.
*who
**correct
***which
Nice bit of irony wasn’t it Tony. :lol: :lol:
It would have been if 'right' wasn't a synonym of 'correct' and therefore still right, and using 'which' instead of 'what' would be completely incorrect.
However, I accept I used 'who's' incorrectly instead of 'who'. An admission that appears to be beyond some people.
Wrong as usual Mr wiggly
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Says the person who's had three days to work out his original cock-ups and still can't manage it!
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For all those wanting to jettison Grant McCann, tomorrow, next week, next month or the end of the season, two simple questions.
Who do you replace him with ?
Why this replacement ?
Simple questions
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I don't know who specifically, but a manager who has the following characteristics / skills:
- Good in the transfer market (using evidence-based techniques to make robust decisions)
- Able to create a balanced team - where key areas of weakness are identified and rectified.
- Able to set a team up dynamically in response to the personnel available and strengths / weaknesses of the opposition, not the same predictable set up every time
- Able to change a game responsively and in a timely way - not just standing and watching games pass us by, and then make 'like-for-like' changes which actually weaken us
- Respectful and nurturing to the potential we have in house (Faulkner, Flint, Brown, Hurst etc)
I think these are non-negotiables for a manager, and Grant is poor in most of these areas. He seems to have a good bond with most of the players, but sometimes that's a weakness - these aren't his mates he needs to manage them to get the best from them and set clear expectations.
We had a good season to win Lg2 last year, but in the same way we need to upgrade many of our players to be competitive in Lg1, we also need to upgrade our manager, coaching staff and scouting set up.
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For all those wanting to jettison Grant McCann, tomorrow, next week, next month or the end of the season, two simple questions.
Who do you replace him with ?
Why this replacement ?
Simple questions
1. Simple questions are the best type for simple people.
2. Which of your two faces would you like me to say it to Soprano?
3.Last season we were promoted as Champions under Grant. This season we will finish mid table & win a Trophy at Wembley.
But let’s sack this manager anyway eh?
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For all those wanting to jettison Grant McCann, tomorrow, next week, next month or the end of the season, two simple questions.
Who do you replace him with ?
Why this replacement ?
Simple questions
I don’t want Grant to get the sack but my first choice, should we have needed a manager at any point recently, would have been Gary Caldwell. Looks like he’s joining Wigan.
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I think the success and demise of the likes of Thomas Frank and Graham Potter shows that the background football operation is more important than who the manager is.
If McCann had more guidance on recruitment it would help. For example someone say “look Grant, you don’t normally go for Glenn Middleton and Billy Sharp type players in those positions”.
Good recruitment compounds positively as it allows you to focus your energy on sustainable longer-lasting improvements rather than chasing your tail trying to correct mistakes with loans mid-season then having to rebuild in the summer again.
I think Grant is a good manager for this level. If he had better in-game management he wouldn’t be in League One.
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It's often debated who is our biggest rivals. Is it Rotherham, is it Scunny, is it Barnsley.
Nope our own fans
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I don't know who specifically, but a manager who has the following characteristics / skills:
- Good in the transfer market (using evidence-based techniques to make robust decisions)
- Able to create a balanced team - where key areas of weakness are identified and rectified.
- Able to set a team up dynamically in response to the personnel available and strengths / weaknesses of the opposition, not the same predictable set up every time
- Able to change a game responsively and in a timely way - not just standing and watching games pass us by, and then make 'like-for-like' changes which actually weaken us
- Respectful and nurturing to the potential we have in house (Faulkner, Flint, Brown, Hurst etc)
I think these are non-negotiables for a manager, and Grant is poor in most of these areas. He seems to have a good bond with most of the players, but sometimes that's a weakness - these aren't his mates he needs to manage them to get the best from them and set clear expectations.
We had a good season to win Lg2 last year, but in the same way we need to upgrade many of our players to be competitive in Lg1, we also need to upgrade our manager, coaching staff and scouting set up.
Is that not too much for one individual to be accountable for? Particularly when there's a conflict between some of them - e.g. talent pathways and recruitment are longer term things than next opposition. Managers will typically look more short term.
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I think the success and demise of the likes of Thomas Frank and Graham Potter shows that the background football operation is more important than who the manager is.
If McCann had more guidance on recruitment it would help. For example someone say “look Grant, you don’t normally go for Glenn Middleton and Billy Sharp type players in those positions”.
Good recruitment compounds positively as it allows you to focus your energy on sustainable longer-lasting improvements rather than chasing your tail trying to correct mistakes with loans mid-season then having to rebuild in the summer again.
I think Grant is a good manager for this level. If he had better in-game management he wouldn’t be in League One.
Just had the same conversation on bluesky - Can you really expect Thomas Frank to repeat what he did at Brentford without the infrastructure he had behind him at Brentford?
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For all those wanting to jettison Grant McCann, tomorrow, next week, next month or the end of the season, two simple questions.
Who do you replace him with ?
Why this replacement ?
Simple questions
1. Simple questions are the best type for simple people.
2. Which of your two faces would you like me to say it to Soprano?
3.Last season we were promoted as Champions under Grant. This season we will finish mid table & win a Trophy at Wembley.
But let’s sack this manager anyway eh?
Soprano ?????
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In answer to the question on the Poll
I would of said
No in September & October
Maybe in November & December
Yes in January & February
I have had enough of watching the same tactics and formation every game, played with the same terrible execution week in week out.
Odd that Jan and Feb have tipped you over the edge.
Our league record in that time is P7 W3 D2 L2 Pts 11 - More or less play-off form.
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Says the person who's had three days to work out his original cock-ups and still can't manage it!
Seems my post from this morning has been deleted, but ill repost this.
You and pdx are resorting to ad homenim attacks, to try and divert attention from the substance of the discussion.
Pathetic really, given I was only posing a legitimate question
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Says the person who's had three days to work out his original cock-ups and still can't manage it!
Seems my post from this morning has been deleted, but ill repost this.
You and pdx are resorting to ad homenim attacks, to try and divert attention from the substance of the discussion.
Pathetic really, given I was only posing a legitimate question
It's ad hominem
Which kind of closes the loop.
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Perhaps as supporters we should be doing what we expect of the players, be together, win together, lose together and draw together. Support each other show character and stop bloody panicking, as panic spreads.
What’s the saying? Never too low when you lose never too high when you win.
Some of the stuff on this thread ain’t great folks.
So, we stay up up and go to Wembley…. Now relax !
Oh!, and sorry for any grammar cock ups.
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Perhaps as supporters we should be doing what we expect of the players, be together, win together, lose together and draw together. Support each other show character and stop bloody panicking, as panic spreads.
What’s the saying? Never too low when you lose never too high when you win.
Some of the stuff on this thread ain’t great folks.
So, we stay up up and go to Wembley…. Now relax !
Oh!, and sorry for any grammar cock ups.
Perhaps as supporters, mostly life-long and unlikely to forsake the club, we focus too closely on our own collective but diverse opinions, when the fact is that the bottom line is that even when we hold totally opposed views we won’t desert the club we love.
In considering the interests of the club and its finances the Board’s target is financial and building new support which means consistent progress and success on the field to reflect value for money invested in players so as to increase the revenue stream.
Mere survival, which is unlikely to attract more support, may not be enough and I doubt whether relegation and the rebuild needed for a team without Bailey and Molyneux would be sensibly entrusted to a manager who has not recruited well.
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Strange one. Is Grant actually in a stronger position if we get relegated? Who else would you want to build a promotion chasing team than someone who built a L2 title winning side last season?
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Strange one. Is Grant actually in a stronger position if we get relegated? Who else would you want to build a promotion chasing team than someone who built a L2 title winning side last season?
He will probably stay even if we are relegated and this would be the reasoning but i’d argue against that. He has told us himself publicly that he knows L1 better than L2. Next summer would/will be a very big one, recruitment wise. We’ll need a lot of quality through the door. Has he shown enough to be trusted on that front? Absolutely not imo.
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From watching it feels like we are a lower bottom half team. The impression I got at the start of the season from McCann and the club is that we would be better than we currently are.
Something has gone wrong.
Loads of similar quality players, maybe the January recruits will make a bigger difference.
There definitely needs to be a comprehensive lessons learned session done so if McCann stays we have a different, hopefully better approach before next season.
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I dont get this part of not recruited well.
Just because every player hasn't blown the world apart.
It's like you all expect each player to play to the top of their form every game and we then win promotion.
We have made great strides on and off the pitch, we are building. It might be slightly disappointing that a hope of mid table ish may not happen, but I dont think we are that far from it.
We have had great cup days / runs and 1 game from Wembley.
I dont know what people want from a club where nobody can be arsed to turn up from the city.
Fans that over moan and get on at the players in some case in a rather disgusting way.
For me our fanbase is one of our major downfalls.
More positive vibe, support of the players, a city that turns up and I think you wont be far off all getting what you want.
Is it really the clubs fault? Personally I think the club is let down from the support of the city, which would give revenues, I think supporters dont understand the flux and building stage we are in.... just players play brilliant football or you are rubbish mentality.
They are already losing millions trying to sustain the position and give to the fans and struggling to get the support from football manager wanna be.
Going through the days of not knowing if the club was going to be here at all was probably an eye opener and a growing up moment for me, years ago.
And before anyone replies with its a forum, you can still talk about football without just ever saying all the players are rubbish.
Mccann stays, keep building, its a silly conversation. Further success will come in time with our current regime.
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I dont get this part of not recruited well.
Just because every player hasn't blown the world apart.
It's like you all expect each player to play to the top of their form every game and we then win promotion.
For me it’s really hard to argue with the fact recruitment hasn’t been good enough and you’re presenting a non-existent argument (for the most part, there are always some who are totally unrealistic) about expectations for promotion. In the summer we signed:
- Hanlan, who has consistently been a L1 player but struggles to get a game and when he has played, hasn’t looked like fitting in. He won’t be cheap given the level he’s previously played at
- Pearson, again signed as a reasonably high profile player but clearly not fancied despite how bad we’ve been defensively
- Crew - sent back in January
- Ajayi - sent back in January
- Olusanya - not sure if he was sent back or just loan expired but either way he was nowhere near good enough
- Grehan - doesn’t look ready but still trusted with a reasonable amount of game time
- Middleton - doesn’t look a bad player necessarily but clearly a bad fit
- O’Riordan - very good
- Gotts - very good lately, but inexplicably took 5 months to find a position for him to get that level of performance
- TLT - despite his Huddersfield heroics you’d struggle to argue this has been a success. He’s cost us a lot of points over the season and we replaced him as number 1 in January
So out of 10 signings, only 2 I’d say have been successful. I don’t think any of the rest have even been average so for me 8 out of 10 have been poor. It’s really clear to me (and hopefully the club!) that we recruited badly in the summer.
The January signings immediately look better but it’s still too early to judge, and even if they all turn out to be decent it’s still not a great record for the full season.
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Do you mean league 1 player for hanlan?
Crew, TLT, both excellent signings, that every supporter celebrated.
The fact they haven’t worked out this time as well as the first time is surely down to the player.
We know they’re both very good players who will no doubt play at a higher level than this.
Crew especially seemed to turn up here with a poor attitude this season,
It’s too early to suggest grehan is a bad signing for me, and I think Middleton, Gotts, o Riordan have been good signings, add to that haks, Clark, Byrne, Lee, Robinson I can’t see how this years recruitment can be described as poorly as people seem to be making out
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Do you mean league 1 player for hanlan?
Crew, TLT, both excellent signings, that every supporter celebrated.
The fact they haven’t worked out this time as well as the first time is surely down to the player.
We know they’re both very good players who will no doubt play at a higher level than this.
Crew especially seemed to turn up here with a poor attitude this season,
It’s too early to suggest grehan is a bad signing for me, and I think Middleton, Gotts, o Riordan have been good signings, add to that haks, Clark, Byrne, Lee, Robinson I can’t see how this years recruitment can be described as poorly as people seem to be making out
I did mean that with Hanlan thanks, have corrected now.
What supporters thought about Crew and TLT is totally irrelevant, they’ve proved to be poor signings and some of the responsibility of that has to sit with the people who signed them.
The fact you say Middleton has been a good signing just shows that we see things completely differently. He’s hasn’t played much and when he has he has barely contributed. It’s not as though he’s being kept on the bench by someone playing out of their skin either, for the most part he’s been competing with an underwhelming Gibson. For me it’s mad to call him a “good signing”.
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Not every signing is going to be our best player, it’s obvious the plan this season was to have two good players for every position. To help with injuries, loss of form etc, to get into a position like that means your signing players to cover positions so not every single one is going to be a star player.
Can’t recall us ever having a squad this good with as much cover
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Do you mean league 1 player for hanlan?
Crew, TLT, both excellent signings, that every supporter celebrated.
The fact they haven’t worked out this time as well as the first time is surely down to the player.
We know they’re both very good players who will no doubt play at a higher level than this.
Crew especially seemed to turn up here with a poor attitude this season,
It’s too early to suggest grehan is a bad signing for me, and I think Middleton, Gotts, o Riordan have been good signings, add to that haks, Clark, Byrne, Lee, Robinson I can’t see how this years recruitment can be described as poorly as people seem to be making out
I did mean that with Hanlan thanks, have corrected now.
What supporters thought about Crew and TLT is totally irrelevant, they’ve proved to be poor signings and some of the responsibility of that has to sit with the people who signed them.
The fact you say Middleton has been a good signing just shows that we see things completely differently. He’s hasn’t played much and when he has he has barely contributed. It’s not as though he’s being kept on the bench by someone playing out of their skin either, for the most part he’s been competing with an underwhelming Gibson. For me it’s mad to call him a “good signing”.
How can you say they havent been good signing, they havent performed which is nothong to do with the recruitment team. We all would have signed those players.
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Do you mean league 1 player for hanlan?
Crew, TLT, both excellent signings, that every supporter celebrated.
The fact they haven’t worked out this time as well as the first time is surely down to the player.
We know they’re both very good players who will no doubt play at a higher level than this.
Crew especially seemed to turn up here with a poor attitude this season,
It’s too early to suggest grehan is a bad signing for me, and I think Middleton, Gotts, o Riordan have been good signings, add to that haks, Clark, Byrne, Lee, Robinson I can’t see how this years recruitment can be described as poorly as people seem to be making out
We currently have one summer signing in our first choice XI. The summer recruitment was indeed poor.
Signing Lee, Byrne, Clark, Haks isn't genius recruitment is it? They may be ok players but the talent identification part of the process isn't spectacular is it? Is signing 30+ year olds, that are likely past their best the route we go down long term?
How can we improve the talent identification part of the recruitment process? How can we identify undervalued talent that will be able to help us punch above our weight long term? We are certainly punching below our weight at the minute and thats largely down to not having a functioning recruitment setup.
What is our edge over other teams when it comes to recruiting? What are we doing better than the rest?
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Do you mean league 1 player for hanlan?
Crew, TLT, both excellent signings, that every supporter celebrated.
The fact they haven’t worked out this time as well as the first time is surely down to the player.
We know they’re both very good players who will no doubt play at a higher level than this.
Crew especially seemed to turn up here with a poor attitude this season,
It’s too early to suggest grehan is a bad signing for me, and I think Middleton, Gotts, o Riordan have been good signings, add to that haks, Clark, Byrne, Lee, Robinson I can’t see how this years recruitment can be described as poorly as people seem to be making out
I did mean that with Hanlan thanks, have corrected now.
What supporters thought about Crew and TLT is totally irrelevant, they’ve proved to be poor signings and some of the responsibility of that has to sit with the people who signed them.
The fact you say Middleton has been a good signing just shows that we see things completely differently. He’s hasn’t played much and when he has he has barely contributed. It’s not as though he’s being kept on the bench by someone playing out of their skin either, for the most part he’s been competing with an underwhelming Gibson. For me it’s mad to call him a “good signing”.
How can you say they havent been good signing, they havent performed which is nothong to do with the recruitment team. We all would have signed those players.
Even if some of the players we recruited are good, just not performing, surely that lends itself to the fact that perhaps they don't fit into the managers system/style of play maybe. Thats all part of a poor recruitment process. No point signing good players that don't align with what you are trying to do on the pitch.
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Can’t quite believe what I am reading. Nobody can be saying our summer recruitment wasn’t anything other than bad and being serious.
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Do you mean league 1 player for hanlan?
Crew, TLT, both excellent signings, that every supporter celebrated.
The fact they haven’t worked out this time as well as the first time is surely down to the player.
We know they’re both very good players who will no doubt play at a higher level than this.
Crew especially seemed to turn up here with a poor attitude this season,
It’s too early to suggest grehan is a bad signing for me, and I think Middleton, Gotts, o Riordan have been good signings, add to that haks, Clark, Byrne, Lee, Robinson I can’t see how this years recruitment can be described as poorly as people seem to be making out
I did mean that with Hanlan thanks, have corrected now.
What supporters thought about Crew and TLT is totally irrelevant, they’ve proved to be poor signings and some of the responsibility of that has to sit with the people who signed them.
The fact you say Middleton has been a good signing just shows that we see things completely differently. He’s hasn’t played much and when he has he has barely contributed. It’s not as though he’s being kept on the bench by someone playing out of their skin either, for the most part he’s been competing with an underwhelming Gibson. For me it’s mad to call him a “good signing”.
How can you say they havent been good signing, they havent performed which is nothong to do with the recruitment team. We all would have signed those players.
Even if some of the players we recruited are good, just not performing, surely that lends itself to the fact that perhaps they don't fit into the managers system/style of play maybe. Thats all part of a poor recruitment process. No point signing good players that don't align with what you are trying to do on the pitch.
Hiw can it be pior receuitment...... those 2 had played with us before and been good. Crazy agenda that doesn't fit. It all boils down to everyone thinks we have a right to be top of the league and our players the best in the world
You support Doncaster Rovers.... there doesn't need to be a blame, its just part of where we are and the way we are evolving. Even Wrexham throwing shit loads at it have and are still having ups and downs. Thats not just football that is life.
Now if bad recruitment is the case how have we got sone great players worth decent money, all of those the fans have slagged off at some point. The difference is the fans do it in hindsight, unfortunately, thats not real world.
The club and Mccaan already have plans for enhanced data and the club are investing in it.
Maybe we could have had it this year but the only thing the fans could blame was the tannoy last year, so we had to spend money on that instead.
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Can’t quite believe what I am reading. Nobody can be saying our summer recruitment wasn’t anything other than bad and being serious.
I don't think it was bad at all, it looks bad now due to how the signings worked out but at the time 99% of fans were happy with them all.
As mpc said, it boils down to fans thinking we have a god given right to be a great team in this league. Yes McCann hasn't helped with his ambition telling us he thinks we can push for the playoffs but he is hardly going to come out and say our squad isn't good enough and we will be in a relegation battle is he?
Too many fifa and football manager experts these days, makes me wonder how they would've coped during the 1997/98 season had social media been around.
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Can’t quite believe what I am reading. Nobody can be saying our summer recruitment wasn’t anything other than bad and being serious.
I don't think it was bad at all, it looks bad now due to how the signings worked out but at the time 99% of fans were happy with them all.
As mpc said, it boils down to fans thinking we have a god given right to be a great team in this league. Yes McCann hasn't helped with his ambition telling us he thinks we can push for the playoffs but he is hardly going to come out and say our squad isn't good enough and we will be in a relegation battle is he?
Too many fifa and football manager experts these days, makes me wonder how they would've coped during the 1997/98 season had social media been around.
Surely recruitment gets judged on how signings work out? Isn't that the best way to assess it?
I'm only interested in process, do i think our process can be improved? yes.
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Hindsight is a wonderful thing isn't it?
I for one was pretty well pleased with our summer recruitment based on where we stand as a club and the budget we have available, has it turns out some of the comments from fans of their previous clubs turned out to be not far from the mark on their short comings and on the whole I don't think anybody can argue it's been a disappointment.
That said the area I would be questioning more than recruitment is the actual coaching of the players. We don't seem to have any variety in our set pieces whether it's free kicks or corners and when we are defending them we are often guilty of not been switched on getting away with it, only to concede in the same situation later in the game
Maybe we have rose tinted spectacles but you look at our midfield of Ads,Bails,Mols,broadbent,clifton and Middleton and you think that has to be a superior league 1 midfield for controlling the game and the ball based on their individual talents yet the stats suggest we have inferior possession compared to the opposition more times than not so for me either they are not as good as we think or the shape and coaching is not good enough.
That might be down to GM's attacking philosophy but you can hardly say that's as entertaining to watch as it sounds. As for GM himself my biggest moan with him is his bloody reluctance to throw his hat behind an out and out striker like Billy was. He just goes for utility forward players who can play anywhere up top but those type of players are never going to trouble the goal scoring charts.
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‘Fans were happy when the signings were announced’ meaning they are good signings regardless of how regularly they play or the quality of their performance is a new one on me.
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Footballers at whatever standard they play at are doing their job, it’s just like if they were for instance forklift drivers or plumbers or whatever. You can not force people to join a company, in a job 80% of people will go for the money the rest is made up of issues like location and other such variables. We could chuck fists full of money at players and do well for a couple of seasons but it’s not sustainable in the long run, we can all pick examples of clubs that have tried that over the last 40 years and the mess they have got themselves in.
We will see a prime example of this in Hollywood FC because they might reach the promised land in a season or so, but they will be able to carry on like they are ? No, and slip back and find their true level
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This is Grant’s fourth season with us, in the first 3 we reached the play-off’s twice and won the league. This is by far the worst season (position wise) we have had under him as things stand at the present, so are we judging him on that? In regards to quality I can honestly say that in all those 3 previous seasons we weren’t that great before the January window so in that respect nothing has changed other than we haven’t kicked on as noticeably as we did in the previous 3.
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Not sure Grant is the issue. If the recruitment team think signing a Sharp like player who is short and doesnt want to head a ball for what is effectively a direct team alongside Middleton who would be perfect for a target man or larger forward who is good in the air like Ironside a few years ago then there is your issue.
The disconnect between what Grant wants as a player versus what hes been given is miles apart. Even I know that he wants industrious wide forwards who are a goal threat, not an old-school winger getting to the byline and crossing it.
He wants a Hanlan type, just a bit better. No coincedence that the physical Okoronkwo looked really good where he struggled at Lincoln... it's how we play. he needs players for the system.
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We were absolutely dire when Grant came to the club. We were 18th in League Two.
He had to totally rebuild the club, the players, work ethic and even the staff. To get to the playoffs was a massive achievement for the club. Champions last year and if we stay up or even finish mid-table this year, I don’t see him as a failure. I don’t understand his formations or logic behind his subs, but then I don’t claim to know more about being a manager than Grant.
He has still earned plenty of credit from me.
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Not sure Grant is the issue. If the recruitment team think signing a Sharp like player who is short and doesnt want to head a ball for what is effectively a direct team alongside Middleton who would be perfect for a target man or larger forward who is good in the air like Ironside a few years ago then there is your issue.
The disconnect between what Grant wants as a player versus what hes been given is miles apart. Even I know that he wants industrious wide forwards who are a goal threat, not an old-school winger getting to the byline and crossing it.
He wants a Hanlan type, just a bit better. No coincedence that the physical Okoronkwo looked really good where he struggled at Lincoln... it's how we play. he needs players for the system.
That would be a fair defence if McCann hadn’t brought in the man who’s currently in charge of our recruitment (+ the numerous times McCann has publicly stated he makes the decisions as it’s him in the dugout).
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This is Grant’s fourth season with us, in the first 3 we reached the play-off’s twice and won the league. This is by far the worst season (position wise) we have had under him as things stand at the present, so are we judging him on that? In regards to quality I can honestly say that in all those 3 previous seasons we weren’t that great before the January window so in that respect nothing has changed other than we haven’t kicked on as noticeably as we did in the previous 3.
You can’t say this season isn’t far the worst under McCann, this time two years ago we were 3rd bottom of league 2. You can’t compare completed seasons with a season we have 15 or so games left in. If we continue the decent run we’re currently on we will finish midtable, and a decent first season in this league.
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I like McCann in general and still think he's probably as good as we can hope for given our stature, league status etc. There are a couple of things I'd be outlining on his mid-season report;
- Starting the season without a recognised, proper number 9. We all know that position is pivotal to the system, when the season started we had Hanlon, Sharp and Ironside, with the later addition of Olusanya. It became clear quite quickly that the only number 9 amongst that lot wasn't going to play and he ended up leaving. Whether Ironside could have done the job, we'll never know. So why did we conclude our business without a proper number 9?
- We've got to improve our recruitment success rate. Too many dud's again and then having to perform a rescue job in January. I note the statement about reviewing recruitment processes from the meet the owners event and that is definitely something that needs to happen.
- We need to think about whether we want two players to cover every position and have a large squad, or do we want a stronger spine with more focussed investment in a smaller senior squad? Ok, that larger squad has paid dividends with the cup runs, but its been shown to be out of its depth in the league.
I really hope Frankie is fit again to make the impact we need up top. Him, Moly and Haks will be vital to the goals we need.
As I said, I think we've got the beginnings of something, structurally, it just needs some refinement in order to make the most of what we've got.
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Do you mean league 1 player for hanlan?
Crew, TLT, both excellent signings, that every supporter celebrated.
The fact they haven’t worked out this time as well as the first time is surely down to the player.
We know they’re both very good players who will no doubt play at a higher level than this.
Crew especially seemed to turn up here with a poor attitude this season,
It’s too early to suggest grehan is a bad signing for me, and I think Middleton, Gotts, o Riordan have been good signings, add to that haks, Clark, Byrne, Lee, Robinson I can’t see how this years recruitment can be described as poorly as people seem to be making out
We currently have one summer signing in our first choice XI. The summer recruitment was indeed poor.
Signing Lee, Byrne, Clark, Haks isn't genius recruitment is it? They may be ok players but the talent identification part of the process isn't spectacular is it? Is signing 30+ year olds, that are likely past their best the route we go down long term?
How can we improve the talent identification part of the recruitment process? How can we identify undervalued talent that will be able to help us punch above our weight long term? We are certainly punching below our weight at the minute and thats largely down to not having a functioning recruitment setup.
What is our edge over other teams when it comes to recruiting? What are we doing better than the rest?
Who’s to say McCann didn’t want to give the majority of the team that got us promoted a chance at the higher level,
He wasn’t going to just replace the likes of molyneux, Bailey, Sterry, mcgrath, Clifton, he wanted to increase competition, so suggesting that just because they aren’t in our starting 11 every week means they’re poor signings is wrong.
But even taking that into consideration I think 5 of the new signings we’ve made over the last 12 months would get into our strongest 11, so that can’t be bad recruitment, along with half a dozen players that have made the squad stronger.
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Can’t quite believe what I am reading. Nobody can be saying our summer recruitment wasn’t anything other than bad and being serious.
I don't think it was bad at all, it looks bad now due to how the signings worked out but at the time 99% of fans were happy with them all.
As mpc said, it boils down to fans thinking we have a god given right to be a great team in this league. Yes McCann hasn't helped with his ambition telling us he thinks we can push for the playoffs but he is hardly going to come out and say our squad isn't good enough and we will be in a relegation battle is he?
Too many fifa and football manager experts these days, makes me wonder how they would've coped during the 1997/98 season had social media been around.
Surely recruitment gets judged on how signings work out? Isn't that the best way to assess it?
I'm only interested in process, do i think our process can be improved? yes.
The best team in the world needs improvement, that never stops. As a club we have limited funds, there is only so much progress a year you can do. We are taking all the right steps under an agreed budget, we cannot ask for more than that.
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From what I’ve seen McCann has been backed, certainly far more than the previous managers who were definitely having to magic something out of a hat.
The beauty about football is that there are so many different opinions and I personally enjoy this forum for that.
The biggest disappointment for me was Crew. I really thought he would take the step up in his stride but for whatever reason he had minimal impact.
The thing is I am not the expert but people at our club are or should be.
I just think they should have done better. Better with some of the ones we decided to retain, some, possibly most of the ones we brought in and the tactics, formations, style, in game decisions etc.
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I thought Grant was quite clear in his recent interview when he accepted we had things to learn from data analysis and the application of AI to add predictive performance, but he added something along the lines of the need to assess a true individual as a person with characteristics and personality.
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Can’t quite believe what I am reading. Nobody can be saying our summer recruitment wasn’t anything other than bad and being serious.
I don't think it was bad at all, it looks bad now due to how the signings worked out but at the time 99% of fans were happy with them all.
As mpc said, it boils down to fans thinking we have a god given right to be a great team in this league. Yes McCann hasn't helped with his ambition telling us he thinks we can push for the playoffs but he is hardly going to come out and say our squad isn't good enough and we will be in a relegation battle is he?
Too many fifa and football manager experts these days, makes me wonder how they would've coped during the 1997/98 season had social media been around.
Surely recruitment gets judged on how signings work out? Isn't that the best way to assess it?
I'm only interested in process, do i think our process can be improved? yes.
The best team in the world needs improvement, that never stops. As a club we have limited funds, there is only so much progress a year you can do. We are taking all the right steps under an agreed budget, we cannot ask for more than that.
We’re currently on our 5th different centre forward of the season.
We also have 4 left wingers on the books.
Byrne was only signed because Pearson hasn’t worked out as McCann planned.
If we don’t have one of the bigger budgets we need to be efficient.
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Hindsight is a wonderful thing isn't it?
I for one was pretty well pleased with our summer recruitment based on where we stand as a club and the budget we have available, has it turns out some of the comments from fans of their previous clubs turned out to be not far from the mark on their short comings and on the whole I don't think anybody can argue it's been a disappointment.
That said the area I would be questioning more than recruitment is the actual coaching of the players. We don't seem to have any variety in our set pieces whether it's free kicks or corners and when we are defending them we are often guilty of not been switched on getting away with it, only to concede in the same situation later in the game
Maybe we have rose tinted spectacles but you look at our midfield of Ads,Bails,Mols,broadbent,clifton and Middleton and you think that has to be a superior league 1 midfield for controlling the game and the ball based on their individual talents yet the stats suggest we have inferior possession compared to the opposition more times than not so for me either they are not as good as we think or the shape and coaching is not good enough.
That might be down to GM's attacking philosophy but you can hardly say that's as entertaining to watch as it sounds. As for GM himself my biggest moan with him is his bloody reluctance to throw his hat behind an out and out striker like Billy was. He just goes for utility forward players who can play anywhere up top but those type of players are never going to trouble the goal scoring charts.
Pretty much sums up where I'm coming from too.
Whilst recruitment cam always ve questioned, once the players are in the building they should know pretty quickly what's expected of them and how they will fit into the team plus what areas of their game where there's room for improvement. Collectively, work on team shapes, patterns, set plays etc so good habits become standard by repetition then some innovation from the coaches to challenge the players to try different things.
What's concerning me most is those existing players who's games we know pretty well have struggled at times with the very basics of the game with their standards dropping too often.
We've heard McCann say 'That's not like us' 'That's not what my teams are about" "That's a one off...".
Yes, we know players are not robots but we have a big enough squad to create a competitive environment for places. They all should be pushing each other and driving standards up but, there's lots of parts of our game where we make the same mistakes and we don't see much evidence of work on set plays etc.
I was listening to Cliff Byrne's vid 'A coffee with..." and his pre and post match interviews and couldn't help thinking he doesn't inspire me. Whether McCann and Cliff as a pair are a bit old school I don't know but are they doing enough on the training ground or, is there an element of the players hearing the same voices and becoming complacent? We've no way of knowing what goes on at Cantley Park but with the extra investment in facilties we would hope the players have all they need to excel.
It feels like we are on the very edge at the moment where things can go either way.
Hopefully this gap in fixtures will help McCann to reflect and see things more clearly and inspire the players to perform as well, and better, as we know they can.
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Why should we know what goes on at Cantley Park , it’s a place of work, you can’t walk into any,film set, music study,engineering work or factory because you fancy a look around. Football is business, you don’t let competition know what you’re up to. Remember all that spy gate stuff with Leeds and Derby
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I dont get this part of not recruited well.
Just because every player hasn't blown the world apart.
It's like you all expect each player to play to the top of their form every game and we then win promotion.
We have made great strides on and off the pitch, we are building. It might be slightly disappointing that a hope of mid table ish may not happen, but I dont think we are that far from it.
We have had great cup days / runs and 1 game from Wembley.
I dont know what people want from a club where nobody can be arsed to turn up from the city.
Fans that over moan and get on at the players in some case in a rather disgusting way.
For me our fanbase is one of our major downfalls.
More positive vibe, support of the players, a city that turns up and I think you wont be far off all getting what you want.
Is it really the clubs fault? Personally I think the club is let down from the support of the city, which would give revenues, I think supporters dont understand the flux and building stage we are in.... just players play brilliant football or you are rubbish mentality.
They are already losing millions trying to sustain the position and give to the fans and struggling to get the support from football manager wanna be.
Going through the days of not knowing if the club was going to be here at all was probably an eye opener and a growing up moment for me, years ago.
And before anyone replies with its a forum, you can still talk about football without just ever saying all the players are rubbish.
Mccann stays, keep building, its a silly conversation. Further success will come in time with our current regime.
Long winded post that basically says nothing. Just someone moaning about people moaning.
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Why should we know what goes on at Cantley Park , it’s a place of work, you can’t walk into any,film set, music study,engineering work or factory because you fancy a look around. Football is business, you don’t let competition know what you’re up to. Remember all that spy gate stuff with Leeds and Derby
Totally agree. That's beyond fan privilege so I'm not saying anything different however there has to be some accountability and I guess ultimately it's McCanns responsibility which he's never shied away from. It's up to TB to explore that with McCann if and when he thinks it necessary.
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I dont get this part of not recruited well.
Just because every player hasn't blown the world apart.
It's like you all expect each player to play to the top of their form every game and we then win promotion.
We have made great strides on and off the pitch, we are building. It might be slightly disappointing that a hope of mid table ish may not happen, but I dont think we are that far from it.
We have had great cup days / runs and 1 game from Wembley.
I dont know what people want from a club where nobody can be arsed to turn up from the city.
Fans that over moan and get on at the players in some case in a rather disgusting way.
For me our fanbase is one of our major downfalls.
More positive vibe, support of the players, a city that turns up and I think you wont be far off all getting what you want.
Is it really the clubs fault? Personally I think the club is let down from the support of the city, which would give revenues, I think supporters dont understand the flux and building stage we are in.... just players play brilliant football or you are rubbish mentality.
They are already losing millions trying to sustain the position and give to the fans and struggling to get the support from football manager wanna be.
Going through the days of not knowing if the club was going to be here at all was probably an eye opener and a growing up moment for me, years ago.
And before anyone replies with its a forum, you can still talk about football without just ever saying all the players are rubbish.
Mccann stays, keep building, its a silly conversation. Further success will come in time with our current regime.
Long winded post that basically says nothing. Just someone moaning about people moaning.
Proves the point yet again... well done. It says a hell of alot if you are willing to listen.
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I dont get this part of not recruited well.
Just because every player hasn't blown the world apart.
It's like you all expect each player to play to the top of their form every game and we then win promotion.
We have made great strides on and off the pitch, we are building. It might be slightly disappointing that a hope of mid table ish may not happen, but I dont think we are that far from it.
We have had great cup days / runs and 1 game from Wembley.
I dont know what people want from a club where nobody can be arsed to turn up from the city.
Fans that over moan and get on at the players in some case in a rather disgusting way.
For me our fanbase is one of our major downfalls.
More positive vibe, support of the players, a city that turns up and I think you wont be far off all getting what you want.
Is it really the clubs fault? Personally I think the club is let down from the support of the city, which would give revenues, I think supporters dont understand the flux and building stage we are in.... just players play brilliant football or you are rubbish mentality.
They are already losing millions trying to sustain the position and give to the fans and struggling to get the support from football manager wanna be.
Going through the days of not knowing if the club was going to be here at all was probably an eye opener and a growing up moment for me, years ago.
And before anyone replies with its a forum, you can still talk about football without just ever saying all the players are rubbish.
Mccann stays, keep building, its a silly conversation. Further success will come in time with our current regime.
Long winded post that basically says nothing. Just someone moaning about people moaning.
Steve, for me Mpcs post was spot on.
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I dont get this part of not recruited well.
Just because every player hasn't blown the world apart.
It's like you all expect each player to play to the top of their form every game and we then win promotion.
We have made great strides on and off the pitch, we are building. It might be slightly disappointing that a hope of mid table ish may not happen, but I dont think we are that far from it.
We have had great cup days / runs and 1 game from Wembley.
I dont know what people want from a club where nobody can be arsed to turn up from the city.
Fans that over moan and get on at the players in some case in a rather disgusting way.
For me our fanbase is one of our major downfalls.
More positive vibe, support of the players, a city that turns up and I think you wont be far off all getting what you want.
Is it really the clubs fault? Personally I think the club is let down from the support of the city, which would give revenues, I think supporters dont understand the flux and building stage we are in.... just players play brilliant football or you are rubbish mentality.
They are already losing millions trying to sustain the position and give to the fans and struggling to get the support from football manager wanna be.
Going through the days of not knowing if the club was going to be here at all was probably an eye opener and a growing up moment for me, years ago.
And before anyone replies with its a forum, you can still talk about football without just ever saying all the players are rubbish.
Mccann stays, keep building, its a silly conversation. Further success will come in time with our current regime.
Long winded post that basically says nothing. Just someone moaning about people moaning.
Proves the point yet again... well done. It says a hell of alot if you are willing to listen.
I think you mean listen and agree with everything you say and which no doubt you will keep repeating at length until you have worn down all opposing views.
It is rather novel to blame the Doncaster public. Do you really expect the casual observer to look past the fact that the team was regularly losing for the last 3 months of last year? They are not likely to rationalise performances as elaborately as you do to dress everything up so attractively. Regular winning is the key. Thousands of words are no substitute.
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Too many words, your saying?
All those words and you took out of it something I haven't said. Haha.
Nobody has to listen to me at all. It's a football forum, remember!!!!
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I dont get this part of not recruited well.
Just because every player hasn't blown the world apart.
It's like you all expect each player to play to the top of their form every game and we then win promotion.
We have made great strides on and off the pitch, we are building. It might be slightly disappointing that a hope of mid table ish may not happen, but I dont think we are that far from it.
We have had great cup days / runs and 1 game from Wembley.
I dont know what people want from a club where nobody can be arsed to turn up from the city.
Fans that over moan and get on at the players in some case in a rather disgusting way.
For me our fanbase is one of our major downfalls.
More positive vibe, support of the players, a city that turns up and I think you wont be far off all getting what you want.
Is it really the clubs fault? Personally I think the club is let down from the support of the city, which would give revenues, I think supporters dont understand the flux and building stage we are in.... just players play brilliant football or you are rubbish mentality.
They are already losing millions trying to sustain the position and give to the fans and struggling to get the support from football manager wanna be.
Going through the days of not knowing if the club was going to be here at all was probably an eye opener and a growing up moment for me, years ago.
And before anyone replies with its a forum, you can still talk about football without just ever saying all the players are rubbish.
Mccann stays, keep building, its a silly conversation. Further success will come in time with our current regime.
Long winded post that basically says nothing. Just someone moaning about people moaning.
Proves the point yet again... well done. It says a hell of alot if you are willing to listen.
I think you mean listen and agree with everything you say and which no doubt you will keep repeating at length until you have worn down all opposing views.
It is rather novel to blame the Doncaster public. Do you really expect the casual observer to look past the fact that the team was regularly losing for the last 3 months of last year? They are not likely to rationalise performances as elaborately as you do to dress everything up so attractively. Regular winning is the key. Thousands of words are no substitute.
Regualr winning is the key.... oh well now you pointed it out, it's that easy, every club is top of the league now
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Do you mean league 1 player for hanlan?
Crew, TLT, both excellent signings, that every supporter celebrated.
The fact they haven’t worked out this time as well as the first time is surely down to the player.
We know they’re both very good players who will no doubt play at a higher level than this.
Crew especially seemed to turn up here with a poor attitude this season,
It’s too early to suggest grehan is a bad signing for me, and I think Middleton, Gotts, o Riordan have been good signings, add to that haks, Clark, Byrne, Lee, Robinson I can’t see how this years recruitment can be described as poorly as people seem to be making out
I did mean that with Hanlan thanks, have corrected now.
What supporters thought about Crew and TLT is totally irrelevant, they’ve proved to be poor signings and some of the responsibility of that has to sit with the people who signed them.
The fact you say Middleton has been a good signing just shows that we see things completely differently. He’s hasn’t played much and when he has he has barely contributed. It’s not as though he’s being kept on the bench by someone playing out of their skin either, for the most part he’s been competing with an underwhelming Gibson. For me it’s mad to call him a “good signing”.
. Middleton looks well overweight for a start so has not got to anything like his potential. Gibson mostly just couldn’t give a damn unless it’s against a side he previously played for. I thought Maxwell would have moved up a notch but is poor in the tackle. Crew just didn’t seem interested and wouldn’t be surprised if he expected to go to a championship team. TLT has not had any motivation last season and looks like he’s still under a cloud. Some of the the central defenders need to learn how to head a ball as they seem to go way up in the air in any direction and mostly to an opponent. Sadly Billy has come to the end of his career except for the rare occasions he hit the target which is mostly mistimed. The backbone of a team tends to be the most important but Grant seems to think loans are the way to go which is where he falls short. Every time we have a player being interviewed it’s like they are saying the same thing which is we are all ready to step up when called upon for the team. The fight for staying in the team has been lost by the changing of the team even when nothing to do with injuries. Grant needs to look back to how he felt when left out of a team in his playing days I am sure he would have been having a quiet word to his gaffer about that. It seems a few players are being told to play out of position which again plays with the minds of those. Some substitutions have not made sense and even wrecked the flow and sure someone has a stat about goals conceded after the making of the said substitutes.
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Do you mean league 1 player for hanlan?
Crew, TLT, both excellent signings, that every supporter celebrated.
The fact they haven’t worked out this time as well as the first time is surely down to the player.
We know they’re both very good players who will no doubt play at a higher level than this.
Crew especially seemed to turn up here with a poor attitude this season,
It’s too early to suggest grehan is a bad signing for me, and I think Middleton, Gotts, o Riordan have been good signings, add to that haks, Clark, Byrne, Lee, Robinson I can’t see how this years recruitment can be described as poorly as people seem to be making out
I did mean that with Hanlan thanks, have corrected now.
What supporters thought about Crew and TLT is totally irrelevant, they’ve proved to be poor signings and some of the responsibility of that has to sit with the people who signed them.
The fact you say Middleton has been a good signing just shows that we see things completely differently. He’s hasn’t played much and when he has he has barely contributed. It’s not as though he’s being kept on the bench by someone playing out of their skin either, for the most part he’s been competing with an underwhelming Gibson. For me it’s mad to call him a “good signing”.
. Middleton looks well overweight for a start so has not got to anything like his potential. Gibson mostly just couldn’t give a damn unless it’s against a side he previously played for. I thought Maxwell would have moved up a notch but is poor in the tackle. Crew just didn’t seem interested and wouldn’t be surprised if he expected to go to a championship team. TLT has not had any motivation last season and looks like he’s still under a cloud. Some of the the central defenders need to learn how to head a ball as they seem to go way up in the air in any direction and mostly to an opponent. Sadly Billy has come to the end of his career except for the rare occasions he hit the target which is mostly mistimed. The backbone of a team tends to be the most important but Grant seems to think loans are the way to go which is where he falls short. Every time we have a player being interviewed it’s like they are saying the same thing which is we are all ready to step up when called upon for the team. The fight for staying in the team has been lost by the changing of the team even when nothing to do with injuries. Grant needs to look back to how he felt when left out of a team in his playing days I am sure he would have been having a quiet word to his gaffer about that. It seems a few players are being told to play out of position which again plays with the minds of those. Some substitutions have not made sense and even wrecked the flow and sure someone has a stat about goals conceded after the making of the said substitutes.
I agree mostly with that, apart from the changing of the team.
He is damned if he does damned if he doesn't. Whats the point in having a back room staff working all week to check out the opposition and for example says they do x so grant changes a player to hopefully combat that. Fundamentally I get all your points though. Hanlan got slagged off, Mccann bought him back into a bit of form, now some ask where is he.
Maxwell has been a unsung hero over the years he has been here, but this year senior seems s to have really come on again, more than Maxwell. What do you do? That's foorball for every manager, every club, not just Mccann / doncaster rovers.
Funny I get a bit frustrated with Gibson and thought he was lazy, I think he just runs like he can't be bothered, not that he isn't bothered, im not sure.
Support them all, support the club, keep going. The club is heading in the right direction.
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Says the person who's had three days to work out his original cock-ups and still can't manage it!
Seems my post from this morning has been deleted, but ill repost this.
You and pdx are resorting to ad homenim attacks, to try and divert attention from the substance of the discussion.
Pathetic really, given I was only posing a legitimate question
I honestly didn't give a shit about it until you started your pathetic 'say it to my face' bleatings.
I'm using the word pathetic as it appears to be your word of the week.
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Can we have the identities of the 10 % please lol !
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Can we have the identities of the 10 % please lol !
Probably all of Mr Castrato's aliases!
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I dont get this part of not recruited well.
Just because every player hasn't blown the world apart.
It's like you all expect each player to play to the top of their form every game and we then win promotion.
We have made great strides on and off the pitch, we are building. It might be slightly disappointing that a hope of mid table ish may not happen, but I dont think we are that far from it.
We have had great cup days / runs and 1 game from Wembley.
I dont know what people want from a club where nobody can be arsed to turn up from the city.
Fans that over moan and get on at the players in some case in a rather disgusting way.
For me our fanbase is one of our major downfalls.
More positive vibe, support of the players, a city that turns up and I think you wont be far off all getting what you want.
Is it really the clubs fault? Personally I think the club is let down from the support of the city, which would give revenues, I think supporters dont understand the flux and building stage we are in.... just players play brilliant football or you are rubbish mentality.
They are already losing millions trying to sustain the position and give to the fans and struggling to get the support from football manager wanna be.
Going through the days of not knowing if the club was going to be here at all was probably an eye opener and a growing up moment for me, years ago.
And before anyone replies with its a forum, you can still talk about football without just ever saying all the players are rubbish.
Mccann stays, keep building, its a silly conversation. Further success will come in time with our current regime.
Long winded post that basically says nothing. Just someone moaning about people moaning.
Proves the point yet again... well done. It says a hell of alot if you are willing to listen.
I think you mean listen and agree with everything you say and which no doubt you will keep repeating at length until you have worn down all opposing views.
It is rather novel to blame the Doncaster public. Do you really expect the casual observer to look past the fact that the team was regularly losing for the last 3 months of last year? They are not likely to rationalise performances as elaborately as you do to dress everything up so attractively. Regular winning is the key. Thousands of words are no substitute.
Regular winning you say.
We won very regularly for 21 out of the last 24 months. Attendances didn’t suddenly jump up during that time.
I doubt there’ll be that many teams who have won more games than us over the last 24 months
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I dont get this part of not recruited well.
Just because every player hasn't blown the world apart.
It's like you all expect each player to play to the top of their form every game and we then win promotion.
We have made great strides on and off the pitch, we are building. It might be slightly disappointing that a hope of mid table ish may not happen, but I dont think we are that far from it.
We have had great cup days / runs and 1 game from Wembley.
I dont know what people want from a club where nobody can be arsed to turn up from the city.
Fans that over moan and get on at the players in some case in a rather disgusting way.
For me our fanbase is one of our major downfalls.
More positive vibe, support of the players, a city that turns up and I think you wont be far off all getting what you want.
Is it really the clubs fault? Personally I think the club is let down from the support of the city, which would give revenues, I think supporters dont understand the flux and building stage we are in.... just players play brilliant football or you are rubbish mentality.
They are already losing millions trying to sustain the position and give to the fans and struggling to get the support from football manager wanna be.
Going through the days of not knowing if the club was going to be here at all was probably an eye opener and a growing up moment for me, years ago.
And before anyone replies with its a forum, you can still talk about football without just ever saying all the players are rubbish.
Mccann stays, keep building, its a silly conversation. Further success will come in time with our current regime.
Long winded post that basically says nothing. Just someone moaning about people moaning.
Proves the point yet again... well done. It says a hell of alot if you are willing to listen.
I think you mean listen and agree with everything you say and which no doubt you will keep repeating at length until you have worn down all opposing views.
It is rather novel to blame the Doncaster public. Do you really expect the casual observer to look past the fact that the team was regularly losing for the last 3 months of last year? They are not likely to rationalise performances as elaborately as you do to dress everything up so attractively. Regular winning is the key. Thousands of words are no substitute.
Regular winning you say.
We won very regularly for 21 out of the last 24 months. Attendances didn’t suddenly jump up during that time.
I doubt there’ll be that many teams who have won more games than us over the last 24 months
Had a quick look at this and if you only look at league games we have won 46 out of 92 games over the last 24 months.
If you included the cup games the percentage would jump up higher,
But we’ve won 50% of all our league games over the last 24 months if that isn’t winning regularly then I don’t know what is.
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We’ve had a good couple of seasons. Only the present season matters though in terms of managers job security etc surely? Said it before but you don’t get extra points added to your tally at the end of the season for previous achievements.
Here’s a question… If (after being given x millions extra investment) after 3 seasons under McCann, we are still in L2, is that considered a failure despite a promotion in between?
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Why choose league 2, its like your hoping it happens. We could still hit the play offs (im not saying we will).
This is what Im trying to say about the mentality it is so negative.
What Mccann had to do when he got to the club was change that mentality internally.
If you can change the fans too, you have a real chance.
Moaning at every pass, every performance.
Moaning about the tannoy.
Its crazy and the club must feel like no matter what they do they are damned or waiting for the next moan.
The fans need to have a positive atmosphere or its going to be 10 times harder to be successful.
Of course unless if a negative place is a comfortable place. Every club are far more likely to fail at promotion, no matter who you are. There are only 3 places.
Our average attendance puts us 13th, we are only 6 points from it and in much better form, playing better than pre xmas.
I dont understand the negativity, around performance / budget.
Your asking every manager to come and perform a miracle.
Just get behind the players and team with positivity, like always has been said, its the 12th man, thats what difference it can make.
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Eh?
We’re very close to the relegation spots (having been in them) and you’re questioning why people are bringing up fear of relegation and not the hope of the play-offs?
I predicted 14th and thought just staying up this season should be considered a success and I still do. I’ve seen a lot of glaring issues in our game the last few months that have me really concerned that we will go down though and I think most of it lands at McCann’s door. I wouldn’t sack him though. That’s a discussion for the summer but you can question things now.
Sorry that this isn’t a post rammed full with positivity verging on delusion.
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Eh?
We’re very close to the relegation spots (having been in them) and you’re questioning why people are bringing up fear of relegation and not the hope of the play-offs?
I predicted 14th and thought just staying up this season should be considered a success and I still do. I’ve seen a lot of glaring issues in our game the last few months that have me really concerned that we will go down though and I think most of it lands at McCann’s door. I wouldn’t sack him though. That’s a discussion for the summer but you can question things now.
Sorry that this isn’t a post rammed full with positivity verging on delusion.
Its not delusion Ghosh, its just some people don't take the game as seriously as others, i completely get the concerns due to our current position. However, for all we know we could win both games this week and be a point behind 12th (assuming they don't pick up points).
If we are in this position in 10 games time then i will probably share your concern, however still i won't let it ruin my weekend or enjoyment of watching football. I'll support the team no matter what league we are in but of course i would love us to stay up this season and have a day out a Wembley.
Lets just see what the future holds rather than worrying about things that haven't happened or might not happen.
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There average predicted finish on here was 10th.
It would be interesting to know after how low a finish people would start to want the club hierarchy to treat McCann’s performance just like they would any other manager going in to next season.
That is I think what the post was asking.
Recruitment does need to improve, yes. McCann can only work with what he has got. But while we have a manager set up and not a head coach / sporting director set up, the manager himself needs to have an extremely well crystallised idea of what he wants and what the team needs.
(I predicted 12th-16th).
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The most important alignment is Grant - Gavin - Terry .
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If we go down, this is a poor season. No hiding from that.
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By worrying, obviously take it in context. Worrying in football terms. It shouldn’t affect anyone’s personal life. It’s natural to debate and share opinions as something plays out rather than just sit and wait. The forum would be dead without it.
Hopefully we stay up and kick on, the whole club will be in such a strong position for doing so just as much as it’ll be in a much weaker position for not.
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Do you mean league 1 player for hanlan?
Crew, TLT, both excellent signings, that every supporter celebrated.
The fact they haven’t worked out this time as well as the first time is surely down to the player.
We know they’re both very good players who will no doubt play at a higher level than this.
Crew especially seemed to turn up here with a poor attitude this season,
It’s too early to suggest grehan is a bad signing for me, and I think Middleton, Gotts, o Riordan have been good signings, add to that haks, Clark, Byrne, Lee, Robinson I can’t see how this years recruitment can be described as poorly as people seem to be making out
Too early to decide if Grehan is a good or bad signing but f*ck it, Clark, Byrne, Robinson, Lee are all good signings despite playing less minutes to judge.
Make it make sense.
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Eh?
We’re very close to the relegation spots (having been in them) and you’re questioning why people are bringing up fear of relegation and not the hope of the play-offs?
I predicted 14th and thought just staying up this season should be considered a success and I still do. I’ve seen a lot of glaring issues in our game the last few months that have me really concerned that we will go down though and I think most of it lands at McCann’s door. I wouldn’t sack him though. That’s a discussion for the summer but you can question things now.
Sorry that this isn’t a post rammed full with positivity verging on delusion.
It would help if you read my post, then you wouldn't just pick out snippets.
I get why people could be worried, be worried is fine. No need to be negative, doom and gloom amd everyone is rubbish thats all, I'm saying.
If you see I haven't actually put anything delusional.
Why is it so hard for people to think positive
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Eh?
We’re very close to the relegation spots (having been in them) and you’re questioning why people are bringing up fear of relegation and not the hope of the play-offs?
I predicted 14th and thought just staying up this season should be considered a success and I still do. I’ve seen a lot of glaring issues in our game the last few months that have me really concerned that we will go down though and I think most of it lands at McCann’s door. I wouldn’t sack him though. That’s a discussion for the summer but you can question things now.
Sorry that this isn’t a post rammed full with positivity verging on delusion.
It would help if you read my post, then you wouldn't just pick out snippets.
I get why people could be worried, be worried is fine. No need to be negative, doom and gloom amd everyone is rubbish thats all, I'm saying.
If you see I haven't actually put anything delusional.
Why is it so hard for people to think positive
Regarding that last sentence, I don't know if you're aware of it, but depression is a serious problem in the UK. Anti-depression medication is the most prescribed medication by most GPs.
Some people find positive thinking very difficult, often because of circumstances. If you're not one of these people, you're very lucky.
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In my life and business, thinking positive makes a huge difference sometimes thinking negative is much easier I have found.
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Eh?
We’re very close to the relegation spots (having been in them) and you’re questioning why people are bringing up fear of relegation and not the hope of the play-offs?
I predicted 14th and thought just staying up this season should be considered a success and I still do. I’ve seen a lot of glaring issues in our game the last few months that have me really concerned that we will go down though and I think most of it lands at McCann’s door. I wouldn’t sack him though. That’s a discussion for the summer but you can question things now.
Sorry that this isn’t a post rammed full with positivity verging on delusion.
It would help if you read my post, then you wouldn't just pick out snippets.
I get why people could be worried, be worried is fine. No need to be negative, doom and gloom amd everyone is rubbish thats all, I'm saying.
If you see I haven't actually put anything delusional.
Why is it so hard for people to think positive
Regarding that last sentence, I don't know if you're aware of it, but depression is a serious problem in the UK. Anti-depression medication is the most prescribed medication by most GPs.
Some people find positive thinking very difficult, often because of circumstances. If you're not one of these people, you're very lucky.
Agreed its definitely a worsening situation in the world, sadly despite the multitude of stuff out there to help people who suffer the only person who can help anyone recover from depression is the person themselves. However, it is easier said than done for a lot of people, trust me i've been there.
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We’ve had a good couple of seasons. Only the present season matters though in terms of managers job security etc surely? Said it before but you don’t get extra points added to your tally at the end of the season for previous achievements.
Here’s a question… If (after being given x millions extra investment) after 3 seasons under McCann, we are still in L2, is that considered a failure despite a promotion in between?
My post was in response to someone who was talking about gates, and the fact he believed they weren’t great because we aren’t winnning regularly.
I was just pointing out we’ve been winning very regularly over the last two years and the gates stayed the same generally
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We’ve had a good couple of seasons. Only the present season matters though in terms of managers job security etc surely? Said it before but you don’t get extra points added to your tally at the end of the season for previous achievements.
Here’s a question… If (after being given x millions extra investment) after 3 seasons under McCann, we are still in L2, is that considered a failure despite a promotion in between?
My post was in response to someone who was talking about gates, and the fact he believed they weren’t great because we aren’t winnning regularly.
I was just pointing out we’ve been winning very regularly over the last two years and the gates stayed the same generally
I think you are missing my point Dickos. I don’t dispute that you are probably right about the 50% win ratio. Attracting new support though is surely encouraging new people through the gates and (unlike us, the stalwarts) they won’t keep the faith come what may; they want to see the home team win. That did not happen for week after week because following our very good start (which would have encouraged new support) we failed to win a league match for 10 games until the Peterborough game and then failed again for another 6 matches before the next victory. New supporters might come back once, but not after 9 without one.
Going back many years (before season-ticket holders were automatically included in the attendance) it is surely behind dispute that crowds build when we go on a good run and fall back when we have the sort of 4 months that we suffered from mid September to mid January. We were failing to win and mostly losing match after match and spirits were low even amongst the VSC faithful.
I admire your unwavering optimism, but my relationship with the club, though demonstrably permanent, is more pragmatic.
PS You could have drawn my attention to the fact that “winning regularly” could mean doing so at consistent intervals. Repeating a win every fifth game would not stimulate public enthusiasm. So, “Winning frequently” would have been more apt way of putting it. There could also be a debate about whether our record-breaking run to the Play-offs attracted more new support than our steady title-winning 2024/25.
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I’m sorry but I have to ask.
After 200+ posts, has this topic not ‘Run out of Credit’?
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It has, and it has proved the point that the vast majority of fans are behind the manager even if it is just a small number on the forum.
I can imagine the 20 who say he has are the twitter mob no doubt.
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We’ve had a good couple of seasons. Only the present season matters though in terms of managers job security etc surely? Said it before but you don’t get extra points added to your tally at the end of the season for previous achievements.
Here’s a question… If (after being given x millions extra investment) after 3 seasons under McCann, we are still in L2, is that considered a failure despite a promotion in between?
My post was in response to someone who was talking about gates, and the fact he believed they weren’t great because we aren’t winnning regularly.
I was just pointing out we’ve been winning very regularly over the last two years and the gates stayed the same generally
I think you are missing my point Dickos. I don’t dispute that you are probably right about the 50% win ratio. Attracting new support though is surely encouraging new people through the gates and (unlike us, the stalwarts) they won’t keep the faith come what may; they want to see the home team win. That did not happen for week after week because following our very good start (which would have encouraged new support) we failed to win a league match for 10 games until the Peterborough game and then failed again for another 6 matches before the next victory. New supporters might come back once, but not after 9 without one.
Going back many years (before season-ticket holders were automatically included in the attendance) it is surely behind dispute that crowds build when we go on a good run and fall back when we have the sort of 4 months that we suffered from mid September to mid January. We were failing to win and mostly losing match after match and spirits were low even amongst the VSC faithful.
I admire your unwavering optimism, but my relationship with the club, though demonstrably permanent, is more pragmatic.
PS You could have drawn my attention to the fact that “winning regularly” could mean doing so at consistent intervals. Repeating a win every fifth game would not stimulate public enthusiasm. So, “Winning frequently” would have been more apt way of putting it. There could also be a debate about whether our record-breaking run to the Play-offs attracted more new support than our steady title-winning 2024/25.
I’m not missing your point, your point is winning week after week would increase our attendances. I’m pointing out we’ve been winning pretty much more games than anyone else in the country over the last 24 months and the gates haven’t improved
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Im not even thinking of going down. More around what does the recruitment look like in the summer to help us get a better league position in league 1. Lots to play for, 1 result can make a difference where we are and lots of teams playing each other down below over the coming weeks.
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I am also part of the X.com mob and am a fervent supporter of McCann and the other two in the top triumvirate at Doncaster FC
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I’m sorry but I have to ask.
After 200+ posts, has this topic not ‘Run out of Credit’?
Well done for correcting Mr Castrato's error that he still can't see for himself! ;)