Viking Supporters Co-operative
Viking Chat => Viking Chat => Topic started by: Boomstick on February 17, 2019, 07:42:32 pm
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For me, today highlighted the problem of money in football, and how it ruined it.
A mediocre provincial club like crystal Palace can afford 150k a week players, they get crowds less than 3x ours.
It's not a meritocracy, it's just about who can scrabble to get to the Premier league for the big pay day.
Nah, you can shove it up yer arse.
It's all about the football league for me, the Premier league is completely and utterly irrelevant, and I'm canceling my sky sports subscription tomorrow.
Please don't get me wrong, this isn't sour grapes. I genuely think the Premier league is shite, ruined by the obscene amounts of money.
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I think on the whole your Post is accurate and I agree (but will keep my Sky) but the description / definition of provincial applied to Palace is a bit out- its what they would be calling us if the boot was on the other foot !
Provincial - an inhabitant of the regions outside the capital city of a country, especially when regarded as unsophisticated or narrow-minded.
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I think on the whole your Post is accurate and I agree (but will keep my Sky) but the description / definition of provincial applied to Palace is a bit out- its what they would be calling us if the boot was on the other foot !
Provincial - an inhabitant of the regions outside the capital city of a country, especially when regarded as unsophisticated or narrow-minded.
Croydon is a province of London, they hardly draw their support from further afield. Unlike arsenal, Chelsea or even Tottenham.
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Can’t disagree with much of that Boomstick.
A couple of things I noticed...
Electronic ad hoardings are a pain in the arse. Could barely see the ball up the other end when they got them working again 2nd half.
How completely natural and normal it felt for Palace to just stifle the game 2nd half. Take an age over every set play, take forever to get up after a challenge etc. Normally in the league it sticks out like a sore thumb when a team is basically trying it on (a la Peterborough) but it just seemed par for the course with Palace today. I’ve noticed that sort of approach is pretty much the norm in the PL (and has crept into the Championship too). Makes it a difficult watch.
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Quite a negative style they had but they were fairly comfortable. Doesn't make for amazing entertainment but they set up to be solid and Nick a goal, which they did.
The PL in general has took off and I expect I'll enjoy next week more as it's a closer match. But we've had great performances and games vs palace before, the.gulf in finance makes a big difference.
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You're not wrong, Boomstick. It's practically a different sport at that level in many ways.
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One of their fans on here earlier in the week said they would play,away from home, exactly as they did do.
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Double edged sword for me , to tell the truth the championship is getting to be a bit of a holy grail too for clubs our size .
However the year we had in the PL was something else , it was bloody fantastic , going to Old Trafford , Highbury , White Hart Lane and Anfield , what's not to like ? , Oakwell a season ticket sell out , every home game was buzzing , fantastic atmosphere all season .
The media exposure is off the scale , I'd love another shot at it all day long .
Then again league one is enjoyable too but in a different way , the fans are more grounded and friendlier and it's proper football with good old fashioned tackles and players more honest .
If you ever make it I'll guarantee you'd love it .
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Tyke we were discussing it earlier and I agree, 1 season would be nice. But I wouldn't want it to be regular. I feel we'd lose the things I like about rovers, family feel, down to earth players etc.
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Tyke we were discussing it earlier and I agree, 1 season would be nice. But I wouldn't want it to be regular. I feel we'd lose the things I like about rovers, family feel, down to earth players etc.
I know what you mean and I agree , your club does change , it's inevitable , one minute our record transfer fee is £250k and the next it's £1.8m .
I couldn't believe it .
Following relegation the club had a taste for it , hired Dave Bassett and backed him with some serious money , Hignett , Bruce Dyer , Neil Shipperley and Mike Sheron come in and we almost make it back up there unfortunately losing the play off final to Ipswich Town .
It nearly put us out of business altogether but that said we gave it a go and lived the dream to a certain extent .
Wonderful era mate and unlikely to be repeated .
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For me, today highlighted the problem of money in football, and how it ruined it.
A mediocre provincial club like crystal Palace can afford 150k a week players, they get crowds less than 3x ours.
It's not a meritocracy, it's just about who can scrabble to get to the Premier league for the big pay day.
Nah, you can shove it up yer arse.
It's all about the football league for me, the Premier league is completely and utterly irrelevant, and I'm canceling my sky sports subscription tomorrow.
Please don't get me wrong, this isn't sour grapes. I genuely think the Premier league is shite, ruined by the obscene amounts of money.
Firstly and most importantly the dream that any team in land can reach the very top is precious in our game and that should never be taken away. We may never reach the premier League and yes I agree with lots of you sentiments but I would love to experience it for at least one season in my lifetime. If the dream of reaching the top tier went and promotion to the top stopped that would kill off the football league.
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My dream is different.
Seriously.
My ideal would be us winning the Championship every year.
Each time, you go to sleep after we've won it, and we wake up again at the start of a new Championship season. Which we win.
The fairytale joy of succeeding.
Without the snouts in troughs reality to follow.
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It'd be nice for one season. Surely that's the ultimate goal, whatever we think of the PL. Ther dream of promotion and fighting to retain your status is what we love and hate. It's a different proposition to the closed shop by application only set up that professional sport is all like over here in the States. No promotion or relegation. Teams move cities - they are called franchises FFS. It's a bit alien (still) to me after 15 years here. I've been to a fair bit of MLS and it's been really good. but . here there isn't that excitement of promotion or fear of relegation, which for me is integral - that your team can progress or regress - to the journey as a fan. Insead all teams are on an equal footing in terms of their potential to win the national championship. You fail, you just go again next season.
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The dream has to be to reach the PL, but never at the risk of bankrupting the football club.
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The whole EPL thing is really weird. We spend pretty much all our time trying to avoid relegation and getting the very occasional win over the top six which is normally the highlight of our season. We have learnt a style of football which is defend for our lives and hit teams on the break. We aren’t going to make top 6 or even top 8 we are highly unlikely to get into Europe and even if we did it would be a disaster as we don’t have the squad to compete. We are desperately trying to improve our ground but have been for 5 years + and it looks like at least another 5 before we succeed, predominantly because we pay our player so much we can’t afford a new stadium, but we have to pay them fortunes or they won’t want to come to us. The atmosphere at most EPL clubs is woeful but we try to be the odd ones out in that respect. On the plus side we do see some incredible players, we do get that occasional win over Man City, Chelsea, Arsenal and we do sometimes get opportunities in the cup which is why we, the fans, wanted to win it so much yesterday.
I think some of your fans are unnecessary harsh on your team after yesterday. We had the fortune of scoring early and the timing of the second couldn’t have been better. I think if you could have grown into the game and kept it 0-0 for 30 mins we would have had a very difficult afternoon but after the first goal your crowd and some players seemed to lose belief and it went a bit quiet. I wish you well for the rest of the season and have a sneaking suspicion you will be at Wembley at the end of May. Good luck!! I suspect many Palace fans will be supporting you if you do.
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I agree with your comments about yesterday, I thought we played well and if we could have kept it at 1-0 into half time we could have nicked a goal second half, maybe lasted until extra time, even penalties and who knows what might happen then. That second goal was a right sickener, especially the timing! I for one had a great day and I am proud of the players, the fans (most of them) and the club - as a season ticket holder for 40 years I’ve rarely seen the stadium (BV or KM) as full or bouncing as it was before kick off yesterday. I hope we can kick on from here & that day at Wembley might become reality - 2 great days in one season would be amazing!!
:clapping:
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Very nice comments, Palace fan, thank you.
Always liked Crystal Palace and feel you all did yourselves proud as a club, players and fans. No Billy big time behaviour on or off the pitch. Good luck for the rest of the season.
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I think our best spell of the game came after the first went in, but the 2nd really knocked the stuffing out of us. We tried again at the start of the 2nd but you could see the belief draining with every failed attack. By the end they comfortably saw the game out. Very professional performance from Palace, I thought, but it's good that they showed us a lot of respect.
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The whole EPL thing is really weird. We spend pretty much all our time trying to avoid relegation and getting the very occasional win over the top six which is normally the highlight of our season. We have learnt a style of football which is defend for our lives and hit teams on the break. We aren’t going to make top 6 or even top 8 we are highly unlikely to get into Europe and even if we did it would be a disaster as we don’t have the squad to compete. We are desperately trying to improve our ground but have been for 5 years + and it looks like at least another 5 before we succeed, predominantly because we play our player so much we can’t afford a new stadium, but we have the pay them fortunes or they won’t want to come to us. The atmosphere at most EPL clubs is woeful but we try to be the odd ones out in that respect. On the plus side we do see some incredible players, we do get that occasional win over Man City, Chelsea, Arsenal and we do sometimes get opportunities in the cup which is why we, the fans, wanted to win it so much yesterday.
I think some of your fans are unnecessary harsh on your team after yesterday. We had the fortune of scoring early and the timing of the second couldn’t have been better. I think if you could have grown into the game and kept it 0-0 for 30 mins we would have had a very difficult afternoon but after the first goal your crowd and some players seemed to lose belief and it went a bit quiet. I wish you well for the rest of the season and have a sneaking suspicion you will be at Wembley at the end of May. Good luck!! I suspect many Palace fans will be supporting you if you do.
Hi Palace Fan in Peace.
Your description of your life in the PL reminds me very much of the time spent in the Championship.
As a small club it was always going to be tough just to stay up and we also had the pleasure of kicking sand into the face of a big club now and again.
You are very astute in your observation of some of our fans.
We were second best in the game but that was to be expected I guess.
Our hope was to cause an upset but the odds were against us and we needed to have luck to win.
The early deflected goal was a big setback but even then I thought we might have nicked an equaliser and it would have been game on.
On another day eh...........
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You have to have the aspiration to succeed and beat the odds. The sheer joy of getting there and joining the elite is something can never be erased from the history books.
Once there, it's a different ball game/mindset.
Teams like Palace, Swansea, Burnley, Watford, who we used to compete with in the Championship with modest fan bases managed to find a formula that worked for them.
How you use the finances to your advantage is a massive part of the game now. I think the clubs above have done it well and kept their integrity and recognise how important the fans are as part of their identity. Palace have had their hardships in the past so fair play to them and good luck to them
Anyway, one step at a time. .
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Then the Bournemouth billy big b*ll*xes (not easy to say after a pint or three) will start saying Bournemouth should beat TLO Donny because of that time we beat Everton or such like! You’re only as good/big as your last season - except for the obscene parachute payments for failure of course! :headbang:
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My football utopia would be winning Tier 3 like we did at Brentford, then going all Groundhog Day. Forgetting it had ever happened and doing again the next season.
Over, and over, and over again...
I have no interest whatsoever in making it to the PL, because that could only be done with an obscene injection of cash in the current climate. And if that happened, my club would no longer be my club.
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I would have thought most fans of every club who's not been there would want just one season in the Premier League mixing it with the big boys. If the team survives? Brilliant - that'll be at least two years - a bit like Huddersfield now!
If you want great stories to tell the kids about, I'm sure 'that one season where we won at Liverpool, drew at Man City, and nearly stayed up' is more interesting than endless tales about not winning at Walsall in so many years.
Getting into Europe - possible for a relatively small club like Bournemouth nowadays - will also bring about stories when the inevitable 'dropping back down a couple of divisions' becomes a reality!
Agreed. You must be mental if Prem isn't your dream being a Rovers fan. England to win the World Cup and Rovers to get in the Prem are the two football dreams for me
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I would have thought most fans of every club who's not been there would want just one season in the Premier League mixing it with the big boys. If the team survives? Brilliant - that'll be at least two years - a bit like Huddersfield now!
If you want great stories to tell the kids about, I'm sure 'that one season where we won at Liverpool, drew at Man City, and nearly stayed up' is more interesting than endless tales about not winning at Walsall in so many years.
Getting into Europe - possible for a relatively small club like Bournemouth nowadays - will also bring about stories when the inevitable 'dropping back down a couple of divisions' becomes a reality!
Agreed. You must be mental if Prem isn't your dream being a Rovers fan. England to win the World Cup and Rovers to get in the Prem are the two football dreams for me
What gets me to attend games on a Saturday is the belief that we have an equal chance of competing and beating the team we're up against. Being in the PL would do nothing, absolutely nothing to soften the misery of seeing my team arseholed week in and week out.
Between the two of us, Move DRFC, I'm damned sure I know who is mental on this matter.
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One season in the Premier League would make perfect sense, especially when you consider the size and longevity of parachute payments.
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My football utopia would be winning Tier 3 like we did at Brentford, then going all Groundhog Day. Forgetting it had ever happened and doing again the next season.
Over, and over, and over again...
I have no interest whatsoever in making it to the PL, because that could only be done with an obscene injection of cash in the current climate. And if that happened, my club would no longer be my club.
And I thought it was only me that felt like that. Agree with you BST...we would lose the soul of our club.
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I don't understand why fans says they would not like to get to premier league , really it would be amazing , the championship was good but to watch rovers going to Liverpool, city and united would not excite you ,for me it would be fxxking amazing we would still be Donny rovers just enjoy the ride these things would not come around every day
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My football utopia would be winning Tier 3 like we did at Brentford, then going all Groundhog Day. Forgetting it had ever happened and doing again the next season.
Over, and over, and over again...
I have no interest whatsoever in making it to the PL, because that could only be done with an obscene injection of cash in the current climate. And if that happened, my club would no longer be my club.
Cardiff and Huddersfield have both done it over the last couple of seasons without spending anywhere near an obscene amount of cash.
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If we could get there without *risking* breaking the bank, grab the money available, invest only in players that would serve us well in the Championship, sabotage the advertising illuminations, not have a betting company sponsor us, and then bask in that parachute payment, that'll do.
But realistically, it's not for me.
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I would have thought most fans of every club who's not been there would want just one season in the Premier League mixing it with the big boys. If the team survives? Brilliant - that'll be at least two years - a bit like Huddersfield now!
If you want great stories to tell the kids about, I'm sure 'that one season where we won at Liverpool, drew at Man City, and nearly stayed up' is more interesting than endless tales about not winning at Walsall in so many years.
Getting into Europe - possible for a relatively small club like Bournemouth nowadays - will also bring about stories when the inevitable 'dropping back down a couple of divisions' becomes a reality!
Agreed. You must be mental if Prem isn't your dream being a Rovers fan. England to win the World Cup and Rovers to get in the Prem are the two football dreams for me
What gets me to attend games on a Saturday is the belief that we have an equal chance of competing and beating the team we're up against. Being in the PL would do nothing, absolutely nothing to soften the misery of seeing my team arseholed week in and week out.
Between the two of us, Move DRFC, I'm damned sure I know who is mental on this matter.
But if we got to the Prem, we would be an attractive proposition to international players, investors etc, enabling us to massivley improve our team and club and thus giving us a chance to stay up. It would be massive for the club. Look at Huddersfield and Bournemouth. Huddersfield stayed up and Bournemouth have kept on improving. Burnley as well are now established in the Prem.
Not to mention the quality of football on show every week - plus the euphoria of getting promoted from the Championship. If I'm mental for wanting that, then shoot me down!
Through your logic you'd rather us be in League Two than the Premier League then I assume? Sorry just having a giggle at that thought.
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Dickos.
In 2016/17 Cardiff City made a loss of £21m. In May 2017, their accounts showed an overall debt of £115m, the majority owed to lifelong fan and Cardiff lad...checks notes...err...Vincent Tan.
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.walesonline.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/cardiff-citys-debt-stands-115m-14381088.amp
Not sure what you're idea of spending obscene amounts of money is, but if you're going to the bar, mine's a pint of liquid gold.
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Rigo.
That year Brentford made the playoffs.
They had an income of £10m and expenditure of £27.5m. Their wage bill alone was 77% higher than their entire income.
If you're going to the bar with Dickos, I'll have a bag of scampi flavoured Nik-Naks.
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I know I’m in the minority and going to get shot down but I despise the Premier League. I know the standard of football is or can be amazing but I detest with a passion all that goes with that. I chose not to watch it but understand why many do.
For me watching Rovers is far, far more than just the quality of the football or the opposition. They are my team, my club. I have so many memories tied up in Rovers. I love the values of the club and I love that being a supporter of a smallish club means I have a personal connection with them. I don’t want to see the heart and soul torn out of the club by the obscene financial demands of the Premier League.
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For me, the big challenge is whether we could do it with our present owners, who I trust implicitly to do it the right way and for the right reasons. I trust them to manage the finances to give the club the best opportunity without jeopardising our existence.
The notion of attracting other investors who have no emotional or community commitment fills me with horror. Always beware of so called investors who allegedly have a potful of money and promise the earth. As said, there's great danger in ripping the heart and soul out of the club.
In a number of cases, certain clubs successes have been based on funds from money laundering although the source of those funds are carefully hidden in a web of multiple overseas registered companies.
Stick with what and who we know.
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For me, the big challenge is whether we could do it with our present owners, who I trust implicitly to do it the right way and for the right reasons. I trust them to manage the finances to give the club the best opportunity without jeopardising our existence.
The notion of attracting other investors who have no emotional or community commitment fills me with horror. Always beware of so called investors who allegedly have a potful of money and promise the earth. As said, there's great danger in ripping the heart and soul out of the club.
In a number of cases, certain clubs successes have been based on funds from money laundering although the source of those funds are carefully hidden in a web of multiple overseas registered companies.
Stick with what and who we know.
and others have "allegedly" effectively taken out an "inverted life insurance policy" so that their high profile status means they literally "stay alive" they might not have been bourne with a silver spoon in their mouth but a certain bee gees song comes to mind
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I would have thought most fans of every club who's not been there would want just one season in the Premier League mixing it with the big boys. If the team survives? Brilliant - that'll be at least two years - a bit like Huddersfield now!
If you want great stories to tell the kids about, I'm sure 'that one season where we won at Liverpool, drew at Man City, and nearly stayed up' is more interesting than endless tales about not winning at Walsall in so many years.
Getting into Europe - possible for a relatively small club like Bournemouth nowadays - will also bring about stories when the inevitable 'dropping back down a couple of divisions' becomes a reality!
Agreed. You must be mental if Prem isn't your dream being a Rovers fan. England to win the World Cup and Rovers to get in the Prem are the two football dreams for me
What gets me to attend games on a Saturday is the belief that we have an equal chance of competing and beating the team we're up against. Being in the PL would do nothing, absolutely nothing to soften the misery of seeing my team arseholed week in and week out.
Between the two of us, Move DRFC, I'm damned sure I know who is mental on this matter.
But if we got to the Prem, we would be an attractive proposition to international players, investors etc, enabling us to massivley improve our team and club and thus giving us a chance to stay up. It would be massive for the club. Look at Huddersfield and Bournemouth. Huddersfield stayed up and Bournemouth have kept on improving. Burnley as well are now established in the Prem.
Not to mention the quality of football on show every week - plus the euphoria of getting promoted from the Championship. If I'm mental for wanting that, then shoot me down!
Through your logic you'd rather us be in League Two than the Premier League then I assume? Sorry just having a giggle at that thought.
Crystal Palace were a side full of highly paid international players. Did you enjoy watching them? They struggled to string more than a couple of passes together and not a single Palace player stood out above ours in terms of technical ability, not one. There were all physically bigger either in height or build (in most cases both) and some were fast runners but despite what the media tells you being "blessed"with pace doesn't make you a good footballer. That's your "quality of football on show every week" shot down in flames!
You say LOOK at Huddersfield and Bournemouth and cite how "they've kept on improving" but you're the only who isn't LOOKing or he isn't capable of seeing the reality. Both teams have lost more games than they've won in every season they've spent in the EPL! Hows that an improvement and more importantly whats the point of spending loads of money on staff, players and facilities to lose more games than you win? So fans can watch you play "the big boys"? Losing to Man City is the same as losing to Bury, it's still losing! To go to Old Trafford, Anfield and the Emirates and alike every other week? They're only football stadiums! Unique but essentially just a place to watch football were if you sit close to the pitch you'll get wet if it rains, the toilets will likely still be a state, and the food is still substandard and overpriced. Then there's the cost to the supporter. Spending the sort of money you have to for a ticket to a EPL game to watch your team lose more than it wins is frankly retarded!
Personally I'd rather win League 2 than finish 1 place above relegation in the Premier League. I think you need to be careful what you wish for or go and find another club to 'support'.
Oh and don't mistake or misinterpret what I've written as a lack of ambition as nothing could be further from the truth and I will remind and ban anyone who suggests as much when I make it onto the board/become chairman of Doncaster Rovers! It's worth pointing out at this point I won't be chucking all my hard earned money at the club when I do achieve my goal either!
I want to see Doncaster Rovers doing as well as they possibly can, winning games, winning leagues and playing attractive football but not at any price. It's far more important to me that Doncaster Rovers is around and stays around for as long as enough people continue to want to watch professional football in Doncaster. Afterall professional sport is entertainment and if nobody wants entertaining then sadly there's no need for a professional team. If we achieved promotion to the top division of English football then of course I'd be pleased, more so if we'd done so by actually winning the Championship as the only goal/target for every professional football club every season should be to win the league. If you finish runner up you get promoted as a reward but you still failed as the aim is to win and it's important to remember that. When a manager comes out and says his aim for the season is promotion, he should be sacked immediately, as who the f*%^k sets out to finish 3rd? The way EPL is currently I'd be quite content with a single season of getting thumped knowing the money made from promotion and parachute payments would ensure the club was financially secure in the immediate and medium term. The next season I'd expect us to target winning the Championship again!
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Agree with all of that, RedRover....
The premiership is not even entertaining to watch....
And my footballing ambition is;
to live to witness the premiership imploding
to see an England team without a millionaire playing
to see Forest green Rovers in the Championship
and
to watch good old Donny beat more teams than they lose to....
and only watch them in the Premiership if we keep the same team that gets us there, then I would know we are just a pub team having a laugh in the berry red faces of the p**s poor pundits...
Pundit....“ Grant,! so Doncaster got beat 6 nil by Chelsea today...what are your feelings?
Grant..... fe*k off
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I would have thought most fans of every club who's not been there would want just one season in the Premier League mixing it with the big boys. If the team survives? Brilliant - that'll be at least two years - a bit like Huddersfield now!
If you want great stories to tell the kids about, I'm sure 'that one season where we won at Liverpool, drew at Man City, and nearly stayed up' is more interesting than endless tales about not winning at Walsall in so many years.
Getting into Europe - possible for a relatively small club like Bournemouth nowadays - will also bring about stories when the inevitable 'dropping back down a couple of divisions' becomes a reality!
Agreed. You must be mental if Prem isn't your dream being a Rovers fan. England to win the World Cup and Rovers to get in the Prem are the two football dreams for me
What gets me to attend games on a Saturday is the belief that we have an equal chance of competing and beating the team we're up against. Being in the PL would do nothing, absolutely nothing to soften the misery of seeing my team arseholed week in and week out.
Between the two of us, Move DRFC, I'm damned sure I know who is mental on this matter.
But if we got to the Prem, we would be an attractive proposition to international players, investors etc, enabling us to massivley improve our team and club and thus giving us a chance to stay up. It would be massive for the club. Look at Huddersfield and Bournemouth. Huddersfield stayed up and Bournemouth have kept on improving. Burnley as well are now established in the Prem.
Not to mention the quality of football on show every week - plus the euphoria of getting promoted from the Championship. If I'm mental for wanting that, then shoot me down!
Through your logic you'd rather us be in League Two than the Premier League then I assume? Sorry just having a giggle at that thought.
Crystal Palace were a side full of highly paid international players. Did you enjoy watching them? They struggled to string more than a couple of passes together and not a single Palace player stood out above ours in terms of technical ability, not one. There were all physically bigger either in height or build (in most cases both) and some were fast runners but despite what the media tells you being "blessed"with pace doesn't make you a good footballer. That's your "quality of football on show every week" shot down in flames!
You say LOOK at Huddersfield and Bournemouth and cite how "they've kept on improving" but you're the only who isn't LOOKing or he isn't capable of seeing the reality. Both teams have lost more games than they've won in every season they've spent in the EPL! Hows that an improvement and more importantly whats the point of spending loads of money on staff, players and facilities to lose more games than you win? So fans can watch you play "the big boys"? Losing to Man City is the same as losing to Bury, it's still losing! To go to Old Trafford, Anfield and the Emirates and alike every other week? They're only football stadiums! Unique but essentially just a place to watch football were if you sit close to the pitch you'll get wet if it rains, the toilets will likely still be a state, and the food is still substandard and overpriced. Then there's the cost to the supporter. Spending the sort of money you have to for a ticket to a EPL game to watch your team lose more than it wins is frankly retarded!
Personally I'd rather win League 2 than finish 1 place above relegation in the Premier League. I think you need to be careful what you wish for or go and find another club to 'support'.
Oh and don't mistake or misinterpret what I've written as a lack of ambition as nothing could be further from the truth and I will remind and ban anyone who suggests as much when I make it onto the board/become chairman of Doncaster Rovers! It's worth pointing out at this point I won't be chucking all my hard earned money at the club when I do achieve my goal either!
I want to see Doncaster Rovers doing as well as they possibly can, winning games, winning leagues and playing attractive football but not at any price. It's far more important to me that Doncaster Rovers is around and stays around for as long as enough people continue to want to watch professional football in Doncaster. Afterall professional sport is entertainment and if nobody wants entertaining then sadly there's no need for a professional team. If we achieved promotion to the top division of English football then of course I'd be pleased, more so if we'd done so by actually winning the Championship as the only goal/target for every professional football club every season should be to win the league. If you finish runner up you get promoted as a reward but you still failed as the aim is to win and it's important to remember that. When a manager comes out and says his aim for the season is promotion, he should be sacked immediately, as who the f*%^k sets out to finish 3rd? The way EPL is currently I'd be quite content with a single season of getting thumped knowing the money made from promotion and parachute payments would ensure the club was financially secure in the immediate and medium term. The next season I'd expect us to target winning the Championship again!
A very good post, mate; the only thing I disagree with is the technical ability comparison; I thought their passing ability looked light years ahead of ours.
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Sustainability post premiership- Bradford City down to L2, Barnsley similar, lets see where Huddersfield fare and even "big clubs" in free fall such as Wolves and Sunderland 2 successive relegation's after crashing out - buying over inflated wage earners on silly contracts to maintain/return t the promised land....even Villa/Forest European Cup winners mediocre in the Championship or at best "challengers". Its a massive business being in the PL unless you are savvy/lucky like Burnley and little old Bournemouth.. oh their Bulgarian (?) trillionaire is not exactly cash strapped to support his latest plaything... I rest my case...
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Red rover, I have read your post a few times now and I am still not sure whether you want us to get to the PL or not.
As for finishing third, I reckon i know someone who will disagree with you on that point.
My own view on the PL is that , generally it is three divisions in one.
The top six, the bottom six or seven, which very often includes the three that came up the previous season and then the rest of the mid table clubs, which are almost always the same few clubs.
If we ever got there I would be happy to just avoid relegation.
It would be much the same as when we were in the Championship, staying up was a good result really.
As for going to the Emirates, Old Trafford or Anfield every other week, well we wouldn’t would we.
It would just be once a season unless we got them in a cup game.
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I completely agree Rigo
Its irrational to support a Team - especially your home town Team - and NOT want them to get Promoted and NOT get as high in the pyramind as possible
Anyway for once I will say na more except :that:
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If getting to the premiership means totally dismantling the team that got you there and all the pleasures and frustrations that goes with supporting Donny,...
to then replace a large percentage of these players with either over priced over paid journeymen or unpronounceable foreigners , then to watch your team be beaten week in week out with the occasional 3 points won , but always knowing you were gonna get relegated with a team cobbled together .......pahhhhh, you primo premiership dreamers are dreaming
You would sell us out for glory coins ......
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If it came down to it, I don't think that many people would be wanting promotion not to happen.
Lets say this current squad gets promoted and somehow, with a few acquisitions, hits the ground running and ends up in a promotion battle in the Championship this time next year.
You might as well say "Let's say I jumped really hard and hit my head on the moon."
Name me one club that has made it to the Premier League in the past 20 years, since the finance disparity was really bedded in, without either having far bigger crowd capacity or having run up very large debts in doing so.
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Blackpool lost £7m the year they went up. And that particular story didn't pan out too well did it.
By the way. The other examples that have been suggested if how you can get, or nearly get to the PL on the cheap.
Huddersfield lost £17m the year they went up, taking their total debts to £65m.
Bristol City, having lost in the play-offs in 2007/08, had debts so high that Deloitte Touche Ross, their auditors said they "may cast significant doubt on the ability to continue as a going concern."
Then there was the very special case of Bournemouth, whose foreign owner bankrolled them by covering losses to the tune of £48m in the two years before they joined the PL.
It doesn't happen. This lovely wet dream fantasy of a pub team getting to the highest level through their spirit and ability on the pitch.
It doesn't happen.
You make it to the PL by being a big club, having a sugar daddy pour tens of millions into the club, or by taking the most outrageous of financial risks.
The dream is dead. It was throttled off over the past 25 years while folk were buying into Murdoch's vision of football.
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Blackpool's journey was a dream, was it? I'd hate to live in one of your nightmares.
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The rest of your post is irrelevant to what we were talking about.
I'll repeat. No club gets to the PL without
a) Being big already
b) Running up huge losses that are covered by a sugar daddy
c) Running up huge losses that aren't covered and run the risk of finishing the club off.
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The rest of your post is irrelevant to what we were talking about.
I'll repeat. No club gets to the PL without
a) Being big already
b) Running up huge losses that are covered by a sugar daddy
c) Running up huge losses that aren't covered and run the risk of finishing the club off.
WHAT HE SAID!!!!!
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Nowt personal Rigo, but I REALLY don't want you in my dreams. I think you'd probably feel a bit uncomfortable there an all if you were watching what was going off.
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I fancy that all those wishing a premiership journey for Doncaster Rovers, are already affiliated to premiership teams by birth...
dazing doe-eyed from Friday to Tuesday, mesmerised at the skill of the beautiful game.......wishing and dreaming that Messi pulled on a Rovers shirt for a giveaway million a week...
as their Skysports subscription multiplies to the tune of Murdoch rubbing his gnarly greedy Aussie hands.....
zzzzzzzzzzzZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZ
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Sustainability post premiership- Bradford City down to L2, Barnsley similar, lets see where Huddersfield fare and even "big clubs" in free fall such as Wolves and Sunderland 2 successive relegation's after crashing out - buying over inflated wage earners on silly contracts to maintain/return t the promised land....even Villa/Forest European Cup winners mediocre in the Championship or at best "challengers". Its a massive business being in the PL unless you are savvy/lucky like Burnley and little old Bournemouth.. oh their Bulgarian (?) trillionaire is not exactly cash strapped to support his latest plaything... I rest my case...
I watched that Brighton Burnley match on Bt sports and it dawned on me The Burnley players all had either traditional names or European -- and realised they have no Africans (remember Egypt Tunisia Morocco is Africa) nor iran iwalk etc players
and i think Bournemouth might be the same anyone fancy checking this fact . COINCIDENCE ??
https://www.skysports.com/burnley-squad
https://www.skysports.com/bournemouth-squad
in fact i am sure Burnley must have the most British players in their squad ? If we didn't have this "pollution" of foreign players they must be in the top six squad wise
by the way the bloke at Bournemouth is a Russian - no comments about him necessary HERE.
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Blackpool's journey was a dream, was it? I'd hate to live in one of your nightmares.
Change your profile pic then :evil:
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Cardiff city and Burnley have both reached the premier league without spending a fortune or putting themselves in debt.
Cardiff has one of the lowest wage bills in the championship last season
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Cardiff city and Burnley have both reached the premier league without spending a fortune or putting themselves in debt.
Cardiff has one of the lowest wage bills in the championship last season
at May 2017, Cardiff has a net deficit of £108m, including £115m of debt to their shareholders. They then had a net spend of £10m on players, and assuming a similar loss to that year (£27m) they were probably about £135m+ in debt by the time they reached the Premier League.
Burnley is a better example but they still ran up a small amount of debt in getting promoted the first time.
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Cardiff city and Burnley have both reached the premier league without spending a fortune or putting themselves in debt.
Cardiff has one of the lowest wage bills in the championship last season
Dickos
Do you actually look at numbers before you post these claims?
Cardiff, as several of us have pointed out, ran up debts of over £100m getting to the PL.
Burnley lost nearly £13m in the two years leading up to their 2013/14 promotion, despite getting parachute payments.
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Aye the first time maybe,
But last season they had the third smallest wage bill in the division and got promoted.
Therefore they reached the premiership without spending millions and bankrupting themselves.
The first time Burnley went up they did so on a shoestring,
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Dickos.
No. Not the first time Cardiff were promoted to the PL. THIS most recent time.
In their audited, publicly available accounts up to June 2017, they had an overall debt of £108m. They lost £20m that season.
If you're claiming they had the 3rd lowest wage bill in the Championship last season, I'd love to see where you got your figures from, seeing as how most clubs won't file their accounts for last season until this summer. But bearing in mind that their wage bill for 2016/17 in their audited accounts was £21m, it'd be some effort for them to have got it down into the lowest 3 the following season.
I'll be fascinated to see your numbers.
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Neil warnock said it on the radio, may not be correct but he would be a bit silly to make numbers up that anyone can view further down the line.
They were signing players like mandez Laing on free transfers from Rochdale,
They were amongst the favourites to go down that season similar to Huddersfield the year before, yet both reached the prem.
almost all clubs lose money each year not just the ones getting promoted
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Neil Warnock said it...?
Right. Well we'll see this summer then, won't we, when the accounts are published?
Two possibilities.
1) Warnock reduced the wage bill by £10m and got them promoted last season.
2) Warnock was talking ba-baa.
Do you want to go all-in on which one it was?
And then there's the issue about all clubs being in debt. Do all clubs end up with a £110m debt? Which you dismiss as not a very big debt?
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Neil warnock said it on the radio, may not be correct but he would be a bit silly to make numbers up that anyone can view further down the line.
They were signing players like mandez Laing on free transfers from Rochdale,
They were amongst the favourites to go down that season similar to Huddersfield the year before, yet both reached the prem.
almost all clubs lose money each year not just the ones getting promoted
Wouldn’t be like Neil Warnock to try and over-egg his achievements would it?
We can revisit it when the accounts are released over the next few months, but I bet you a £20 charity bet that Cardiff’s wage bill wasn’t in the lowest 3 for the division. I’ll even double your chances and offer you a win if it was in the bottom 6.
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Maybe
But even if he is exaggerating they certainly won’t have had a wage bill in the top 3.
Most of the championship clubs will be in debt, sides like Rotherham even. You’ve got to spend just to survive in that league, doesn’t mean getting promotion always destroys the club.
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£110m
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That’s in isolation
How much did all the championship clubs lose?
Cardiff didn’t go for it spending big did they?
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Dickos
They lost £20m in 16/17. What would you call "spending big" if that doesn't count?
You're moving the goalposts with every post. It started off with the observation that it's impossible to get to the PL without incurring large debts or having a very large fan base.
You didn't accept that. You gave examples of clubs who DID run up large debts and now you're saying that a) a club losing £20m in a year is not spending big and) it doesn't matter because all the clubs in the Championship run up debts.
Not really going anywhere, this, is it?
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Billy
In isolation maybe
Show me how they fair in comparison to all other championship clubs whether they’ve gone up or not. The fact is clubs in the championship lose money, Cardiff didn’t “go for it” look at the players they signed and how much for.
They weren’t even in the reckoning with bookies for promotion. It was a miracle they went up same with Huddersfield
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You said no club can reach the premier league without spending an obscene amount of money.
Cardiff didn’t spend an obscene amount of money last season.
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People are spending millions in the Championship and achieving nothing. Joe Bloggs bang ordinary players on thousands a week for providing mid table performances. It's a diluted version of the PL.
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Exactly
Clubs are getting to the premier league and spending less than clubs that are struggling in the championship.
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I do like a good natter but this is the dictionary definition of pointless. I'm out.
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No Billy, that's Dragons Den. 😉
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Wey-hey!
Not that I'd watch neo-liberal propaganda like that...