Viking Supporters Co-operative
Viking Chat => Off Topic => Topic started by: EasyforDennis on August 01, 2020, 12:37:41 pm
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Just watching the start of the Scottish Premier League. How long is the taking a knee going to continue?
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Till they get a crowd back at Leeds and Millwall.
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Till they get a crowd back at Leeds and Millwall.
Meaning what exactly.?
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I will take one knee for the queen and the wife and nothing else
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Kneel for the Queen.? Are you expecting to be knighted.? Otherwise that’s a ridiculous thing to say.
If you’re in the forces you stand to attention and/or salute.
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For as long as people feel the need to do it?
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Not as ridiculous as kneeling for blm
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Not as ridiculous as kneeling for blm
Explain.?
Kneeling for BLM is a done thing, whether you agree with it or not.. kneeling for the Queen isn’t.
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oh dear haha
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Not as ridiculous as kneeling for blm
Explain.?
Kneeling for BLM is a done thing, whether you agree with it or not.. kneeling for the Queen isn’t.
its not the taking to a knee that bothered me it's the one black glove salute that gets to me
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After taking the oath to serve my queen and Country I would take the knee for the queen if its a done thing or not , and will never take the knee for blm or any other such organisation
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If you have served Queen and country then you know how paying of respect is done. It isn’t by kneeling.
By implying it is, in a counter argument to taking a knee for BLM, then that makes me question your motives..
I’m anti racist but I am not on the public eye so there is no need for me to take a knee to send out a message.
But these counter arguments, like “white lives matter”, are disturbing.
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After taking the oath to serve my queen and Country I would take the knee for the queen if its a done thing or not , and will never take the knee for blm or any other such organisation
and you have the right to do what you want it is or was a free country
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If you have served Queen and country then you know how paying of respect is done. It isn’t by kneeling.
By implying it is, in a counter argument to taking a knee for BLM, then that makes me question your motives..
I’m anti racist but I am not on the public eye so there is no need for me to take a knee to send out a message.
But these counter arguments, like “white lives matter”, are disturbing.
so in reality IDM saying all lives matter bothers you
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After taking the oath to serve my queen and Country I would take the knee for the queen if its a done thing or not , and will never take the knee for blm or any other such organisation
and you have the right to do what you want it is or was a free country
Her Majesty’s forced have protocols and traditions for the paying of compliments to superiors and ultimately to the Sovereign. Service men and women are not free to vary those practices.
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If you have served Queen and country then you know how paying of respect is done. It isn’t by kneeling.
By implying it is, in a counter argument to taking a knee for BLM, then that makes me question your motives..
I’m anti racist but I am not on the public eye so there is no need for me to take a knee to send out a message.
But these counter arguments, like “white lives matter”, are disturbing.
so in reality IDM saying all lives matter bothers you
In the context of it being said to counter BLM then yes.
Anyway, unless the mods want to move this to off topic, I’m out.
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Never said I had knelt for the queen ,I said I would kneel for the queen rather than blm if it was the done thing or not .
Yes I do know how to pay my respects not just Google it like yourself
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yes I'm off aswell bye
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Never said I had knelt for the queen ,I said I would kneel for the queen rather than blm if it was the done thing or not .
Yes I do know how to pay my respects not just Google it like yourself
I said I was out but I will respond to this. You know nothing of my background so assuming I googled it makes my piss boil. I’ve done my time, in service. Where and when etc is none of your business but I do know what I was talking about.
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And you still can't take banter
Bye google
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After taking the oath to serve my queen and Country I would take the knee for the queen if its a done thing or not , and will never take the knee for blm or any other such organisation
#blacklivesdontmatter
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Here we go ,,,,,
And that means
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And you still can't take banter
Bye google
Just shy of 20 years service doesn’t equal google.
Your “banter” is hiding borderline racism. Banter my arse. You’d use that as a defence in your orderly room would you.?
If you’re still in the forces, concentrate on doing what you’re good at, and be the best you can. Sometimes our private thoughts and views are best kept like that.
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why border line racism????
I've not mention colour ,I've just said i won't kneel for blm or any such organisation .
Who ever puts a colour in front of lives matter is a racist in my opinion
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IDM it is only against BLM if you say white lives matter, but if you are saying ALL lives matter then it is not and as I said earlier the only thing I have against the whole matter is the wearing of a black glove and the one arm fist salute
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There's a lot of misunderstanding about what taking the knee means. It doesn't mean you're kneeling, like you kneel for the Queen. It's about showing solidarity with the civil rights movement because kneeling has been part of three major civil rights incidents over the decades.
1. MLK kneeling in prayer after hundreds of peaceful demonstators, who were out trying to get black people registered to vote, were arrested. It's a very famous image, give it a Google and I bet you'll have seen it before.
2. Colin Kaepernick, NFL player, who knelt on the field in protest when the American national anthem was played before a game. This was a huge deal in the states and has basically ended his football career.
3. George Floyd being murdered by a cop kneeling on his neck for nearly 9 minutes.
So, for one reason or another, kneeling is now synonymous with civil rights. THAT is what it's about. If you choose to get the arse on about that, it says a lot about you, frankly.
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My problem is not with civil rights movement (which I have researched).its with taking the knee for the blm organisation which I my opinion are very dangerous with little to do with civil rights and again this is just my opinion.
Ps you don't take the knee for the queen as a certain person will no doubt tell you lol
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why border line racism????
I've not mention colour ,I've just said i won't kneel for blm or any such organisation .
Who ever puts a colour in front of lives matter is a racist in my opinion
The people kneeling for BLM are not kneeling for an organisation. They are kneeling in support of a movement for political change.
There is an organisation BLM (who have organised many of the actual protests) but taking the knee does not equate to support for them. Just like going to a football match - you can wear a replica shirt or not wear a replica shirt - you are still supporting the team.
I doubt that you are a racist but I have noticed that it is the racists who don't like a colour being put in front of lives matter. Not a team you would wish to support I suggest.
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Sorry for causing such an argument between one and other guys. For what it's worth my opinion is: The point has been made and maybe now is the time to stop the knee bending before every game.
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why border line racism????
I've not mention colour ,I've just said i won't kneel for blm or any such organisation .
Who ever puts a colour in front of lives matter is a racist in my opinion
It's not hard Scunny. There's no need to talk about white lives mattering because society is set up in a way that white lives DO matter. The point is that black.people HAVE been systematically discriminated against for decades and centuries. Which is why the "black" in BLM matters.
Using the All Lives Matter meme, deliberately or not, waters down that message.
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Well I still won't be taking a knee
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I don't think anyone cares, I certainly don't
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If you have served Queen and country then you know how paying of respect is done. It isn’t by kneeling.
By implying it is, in a counter argument to taking a knee for BLM, then that makes me question your motives..
I’m anti racist but I am not on the public eye so there is no need for me to take a knee to send out a message.
But these counter arguments, like “white lives matter”, are disturbing.
so in reality IDM saying all lives matter bothers you
(https://i.imgur.com/VdGLrBL.jpg)
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Well I still won't be taking a knee
You're in good company by the way, saying you'd only take a knee for your wife and the Queen.
The Foreign Secretary said exactly the same thing.
That's the same Foreign Secretary who wrote a book ten years ago saying that the White British working class were thick and bone idle.
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Well I still won't be taking a knee
You're in good company by the way, saying you'd only take a knee for your wife and the Queen.
The Foreign Secretary said exactly the same thing.
That's the same Foreign Secretary who wrote a book ten years ago saying that the White British working class were thick and bone idle.
I have more in common with my black next door neighbours than I do the Queen. Unlike my neighbours, the Queen has done precisely f**k all for me, so there’s no way I’d take the knee for her or her family. However I’d happily do it for my neighbours.
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So let me think about this .....
Yeah still wont take a knee
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Strange that you feel the need to make such a show of telling us this, but I'm sure you have your reasons.
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Why strange its my opinion some don't agree some do ,likewise I don't agree to some comments but others I can see there point.
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Scunny.
You are of course, perfectly entitled to your opinions.
It's just an odd stance to refuse to engage with other peoples' arguments but just restate your own opinion. Seems a pointless exercise. You made your point once. Why keep doing it?
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I've just said i agree and don't agree with some posts on here and have done my research and my stance is still the same.has your stance changed or is it just me who's got to change.
Anyway have a nice rest of the day im gonna try and sneak a hours kip in before the night shift.
Bye
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Billy are we not maybe getting to a situation where if your opinion differs to the protestors you’re deemed to be wrong
Surely everyone has a right to agree or disagree with a way things are done or supported
Just because someone doesn’t want to take the knee doesn’t mean they are racist or wrong to have that opinion. It also doesn’t mean they are racist.
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Precisely Phil.
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Phil, it mainly highlights that he is an individual with a mind of his own, unlike a lot of people who join in with the latest craze.
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Indeed, not joining in the protest and not “taking the knee”’does not make anyone a racist.
However, actively promoting other slogans or statements which are seen to oppose or downgrade anti-racism actions is a different matter. Not demonstrably racist perhaps, but dangerous in my opinion.
For example, what does someone saying they would only kneel for the Queen (in a debate about anti racism protest and taking the knee) actually mean, when the only reason to kneel for the Queen is to receive a knighthood.?
Everyone is entitled to their own opinions and beliefs, however Service men and women are supposed to be apolitical, outwardly at least.
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Till they get a crowd back at Leeds and Millwall.
Still waiting for an explanation on what this means.?
It would be easy to conclude that Selby thinks Millwall and Leeds have lots of supporters who are racists, so much so there would be a feeling of threat so strong that players wouldn’t take a knee.? Does Selby think those racist fans would riot or somehow threaten the safety of those players.?
That’s just an easy supposition I could make, but really it’s down to Selby to explain his reasons.
What is it, eh.?
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I actually think that that pressure to take the knee is far greater than any fear of repercussions from fans for not taking it
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I actually think that that pressure to take the knee is far greater than any fear of repercussions from fans for not taking it
I think a lot of people are 'taking the knee' beacuse they work/play sport alongside black colleagues and wish to support/show solidarity to those colleagues.
My evidence is based on what I can see on tv and in life. What's yours based on?
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Mine comes from a belief that sportsmen are normal human beings with their own views.
No one can realistically say that all sportsmen that are bending the knee are doing it through choice. Look at motor racing. Why would other sports be different
Are you genuinely suggesting that every sportsman bending the knee has no reservations or differing views about it. It’s not logical that every premiership footballer agrees with it. (NOT THAT THEY'RE RACIST IN ANY WAY) before that shout goes out
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Who knows why most are not taking a knee in motor racing?
Different country, obviously, but the ostentatious flying of the Confederate flag at NASCAR events says something about the culture of the crowds there.
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Mine comes from a belief that sportsmen are normal human beings with their own views.
No one can realistically say that all sportsmen that are bending the knee are doing it through choice. Look at motor racing. Why would other sports be different
Are you genuinely suggesting that every sportsman bending the knee has no reservations or differing views about it. It’s not logical that every premiership footballer agrees with it. (NOT THAT THEY'RE RACIST IN ANY WAY) before that shout goes out
You do understand the concept of solidarity, yes?
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It's not logical that every footballer agrees with the poppy either, but look how the ones who choose not to wear one get treated. No one seems to have an issue with that, though.
Not an entirely fair comparison, I admit, but footballers have made gestures and supported causes on the pitch for years. It's interesting that it's only THIS one that people seem to have a problem with.
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Was that not my point in the first place. They’re afraid not to
Likewise with other things
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Who knows why most are not taking a knee in motor racing?
Different country, obviously, but the ostentatious flying of the Confederate flag at NASCAR events says something about the culture of the crowds there.
Confederate flag has now been banned I believe
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https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/amp/world-us-canada-53450820
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https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&url=https://www.nytimes.com/2020/06/13/sports/bubba-wallace-nascar-confederate-flag.amp.html&ved=2ahUKEwjN1oDv9onrAhWOSsAKHV28A64QFjALegQIAxAC&usg=AOvVaw1MaWU5ZqPrmToFoZAcxoES&cf=1
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This subject shouldn't be a big deal doing it shows support not doing it is of course the opposite.
If you support fairness, equality, human rights and many other reasons ....... why wouldn't you do it?
Don't make it complicated, it's not.
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I think the point is it's a matter of choice to bend or not, you shouldn't be labelled by not bending
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Sydney. Agreed if you agree with all those things why shouldn’t you do it if that’s what you want to do
Likewise if you agree with all those things why shouldn’t you be allowed to choose not to do it
It’s a matter of choice. Not doing it doesn’t outlaw you a racist same as bending the knee because you’re afraid not to doesn’t highlight you as someone who isn’t racist or bigoted
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I think the point is it's a matter of choice to bend or not, you shouldn't be labelled by not bending
Agreed. But supporting or promoting actions that are opposite, or almost opposite, is more disturbing.
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Sydney. Agreed if you agree with all those things why shouldn’t you do it if that’s what you want to do
Likewise if you agree with all those things why shouldn’t you be allowed to choose not to do it
It’s a matter of choice. Not doing it doesn’t outlaw you a racist same as bending the knee because you’re afraid not to doesn’t highlight you as someone who isn’t racist or bigoted
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I think I agree with you but I'm not sure what you said Phil
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Who’s supporting bigotry
I’m definitely not
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I really worry that our society is becoming a place where differences of opinion are not respected. A healthy debate is all well and good, but it seems there has to be a winner; the other side must be proved wrong. Whether it’s taking a knee, Brexit, or which end to eat a boiled egg from, discussions and debate is becoming an unpleasant experience.
A different topic, but after very careful consideration, I voted to leave the EU, and I was torn pretty much by the ratio of 52/48 that happened to be the final result. I have been labelled an ignorant, racist, Daily Mail reader (of which I’m none of these, by the way). I chose a long time ago not to discuss my vote on Brexit because of this.
I don’t want to speak for Scunny, but he seems to have an issue with the BLM organisation - you know, the one that wants to defund the police among other things. I have major concerns with this too - it’s a frightening thought.
Just because someone doesn’t support the Black Lives Matter movement, doesn’t mean that they think black lives don’t matter. The two things are very different, which is why, I think, not everyone is comfortable ‘taking the knee’.
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And that is all fair enough.. but it’s the suggestion of doing something else, to counter or even to mock, which I find distasteful.
And there are extremes on either side of the coin - I would think most fair minded people do not support the BLM movement “de fund the police” thinking, but at the same time abhor racism.
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Again, though, defund the police is a 3-word slogan to get people's attention. If people are that worried by it, they should probably read up on it more.
Firstly, "defund the police" is largely an American thing, and it refers to getting rid of the militarised police who go around shooting people, teargassing peaceful protestors, and crippling people because they're dangerous psychopaths in uniform. Thankfully, this is less of an issue over here, but we do still have our share of racist thugs in uniform who are enabled by the system. That's why you'll see a few British voices joining in, but rarely without the caveat mentioned below.
Over here, it's more about putting funding to better use in society. Mental health services, social care, youth clubs, support for families and those in extreme poverty etc. Every bit of research you'll find shows this is how you really tackle violent crime. You don't send the police out pulling over random black people in nice cars and locking people up for relatively minor things that they could easily be rehabbed from. It's what worked in Glasgow - https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-45572691
One interesting note about Glasgow - back when it was the murder capital of Europe, it was never viewed as a white problem, or a Scottish problem. We never had pretend concern in the media about how white kids were killing each other. No prizes for guessing why. That's a separate debate, though.
Ultimately, the slogan might well be frightening, but your fears are unfounded. Sadly, what many black people are frightened of is being beaten up, unfairly arrested and having their lives destroyed, or even killed by police. That's the case in this country too, even though police killings are much rarer than they are in the states. If confronting that by kneeling makes a few people uncomfortable, that's a price worth paying in my book. If it means a few people get a gobful because they chose not to show solidarity when it would've cost them nothing, that's a price worth paying as well.
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Macho your second paragraph sums it up for me
When are people going to remember WE ARE NOT AMERICAN
we live in a generally very good place with opportunity for all. Generally a very tolerant and welcoming country
The police in this country are not like they are in the USA
Obviously there are bad ones but that’s not a reason to down cry them all as racist fascists
Shall we oust the Labour Party and everyone in it because of a few racist anti Semitic bigots
You could go on and on
What people need to remember is that a lot of what is shown on TV and social media could be edited to suit the purpose of the person reporting or posting
People seem very quick to jump to conclusions without knowing the full facts
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Again, this is a big part of the problem. Too many people have the attitude that a difference of opinion is born from ignorance.
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Oh and thanks for the capital letters Phil, I was just about to have waffles and root beer for my breakfast.
Just on the American thing. One of the faces and voices of the BLM protests/riots in this country, a young, well spoken, clearly well educated black woman, said she she woke up every morning fearing that she would be murdered by the police.
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No we are not American but we have plenty of work to do .............
Black people ‘40 times more likely’ to be stopped and searched in UK
Campaigners say controversial new powers are doing untold damage to communities’ trust
https://www.theguardian.com/law/2019/may/04/stop-and-search-new-row-racial-bias
Lack of BAME councillors 'perpetuating racial inequality and disadvantage' in the UK, says report
Campaigners say the findings are a "wake-up call" and that "communities feel like these institutions don't belong to us".
https://news.sky.com/story/lack-of-bame-councillors-perpetuating-racial-inequality-and-disadvantage-in-the-uk-says-report-12022993
Universities are still leaving BAME students behind – and the problem goes beyond Oxbridge
As Britain is forced to reassess the frameworks that have hitherto been taken for granted, universities must take stock. Moving towards a new future rests on a commitment to leave no one behind
https://www.independent.co.uk/voices/universities-bame-students-inequality-oxbridge-race-a8837771.html
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Macho your second paragraph sums it up for me
When are people going to remember WE ARE NOT AMERICAN
we live in a generally very good place with opportunity for all. Generally a very tolerant and welcoming country
The police in this country are not like they are in the USA
Obviously there are bad ones but that’s not a reason to down cry them all as racist fascists
Shall we oust the Labour Party and everyone in it because of a few racist anti Semitic bigots
You could go on and on
What people need to remember is that a lot of what is shown on TV and social media could be edited to suit the purpose of the person reporting or posting
People seem very quick to jump to conclusions without knowing the full facts
So why do black people driving expensive cars get stopped more frequently than they should.?
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Macho your second paragraph sums it up for me
When are people going to remember WE ARE NOT AMERICAN
we live in a generally very good place with opportunity for all. Generally a very tolerant and welcoming country
The police in this country are not like they are in the USA
Obviously there are bad ones but that’s not a reason to down cry them all as racist fascists
Shall we oust the Labour Party and everyone in it because of a few racist anti Semitic bigots
You could go on and on
What people need to remember is that a lot of what is shown on TV and social media could be edited to suit the purpose of the person reporting or posting
People seem very quick to jump to conclusions without knowing the full facts
So why do black people driving expensive cars get stopped more frequently than they should.?
It's easy to say that without having any evidence to substantiate it.
How many young white people get stopped for the same reason but without the BLM stigma it isn't newsworthy.
A factor could be that most stops are initiated by a registration number being picked up on an ANPR camera that has a "flag" against it.
The flags can be for a number of reasons such as outstanding warrants or fines, known drug dealer or prolific burglar, etc.
A better measure would be what percentage of BAME and non BAME people who get stopped are charged with an offence?
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''RACIAL PROFILING' Seven in 10 pulled over for ‘drug driving’ are BAME background and most haven’t committed crime after sprinter’s fury''
https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/12128163/seven-10-pulled-over-drug-driving-bame-background-london/
''Black people over 9 times more likely than white people to be stopped and searched
Peter Keeling, CJA Policy Officer - 26 October 2018''
http://criminaljusticealliance.org/blog/black-people-9-times-likely-white-people-stopped-searched/
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I’m talking about the MP who was stopped on Sunday. The police stopped her and her partner because they incorrectly entered the reg number and they thought the car was registered in North Yorkshire.
Two points spring to mind immediately. What is wrong with a car registered in one part of the country being seen elsewhere, and why did they decide to search this registration number in the first place.?
Yes that’s only anecdotal rather than a statistical analysis, but it’s also very wrong in my book.
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We said same last night , there has to be another reason for car getting pulled / checked in first place, because I'm fairly confident it's not illegal to visit a different part of country. If it was dodgy driving or a light out they would have said so doesn't leave much to imagination as to why they got pulled.
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I’m talking about the MP who was stopped on Sunday. The police stopped her and her partner because they incorrectly entered the reg number and they thought the car was registered in North Yorkshire.
Two points spring to mind immediately. What is wrong with a car registered in one part of the country being seen elsewhere, and why did they decide to search this registration number in the first place.?
Yes that’s only anecdotal rather than a statistical analysis, but it’s also very wrong in my book.
Imagine a car with a registration linked to a London address being seen in Barnard Castle 🤪
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Macho your second paragraph sums it up for me
When are people going to remember WE ARE NOT AMERICAN
we live in a generally very good place with opportunity for all. Generally a very tolerant and welcoming country
The police in this country are not like they are in the USA
Obviously there are bad ones but that’s not a reason to down cry them all as racist fascists
Shall we oust the Labour Party and everyone in it because of a few racist anti Semitic bigots
You could go on and on
What people need to remember is that a lot of what is shown on TV and social media could be edited to suit the purpose of the person reporting or posting
People seem very quick to jump to conclusions without knowing the full facts
Actually Phil, we are becoming more 'American' and less 'European' by the day. Our shopping habits, our eating habits, our politics, our policing, (you saw far less riot gear during the miners strike than you do for a 'peaceful protest' in London nowadays, our prejudices being driven by a right wing media and by people like Johnson and Farage - all moving in the American direction.
So yes, we're not American; but we're not far off.
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We said same last night , there has to be another reason for car getting pulled / checked in first place, because I'm fairly confident it's not illegal to visit a different part of country. If it was dodgy driving or a light out they would have said so doesn't leave much to imagination as to why they got pulled.
It might have been that the reg number that was accidentally typed in turned out to be of interest to the police.
Or that the wrong number showed up as being on a different car.
Earlier this year my wife got a traffic ticket from Glasgow Council for driving her car into a bus and taxi only zone.
She has never driven in Glasgow and at the time of the alleged offence, was at home recovering from a hip replacement.
The photo they supplied was her reg plate but on a totally different make of car to hers.
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Hound it wouldn’t be anything like that. Remember every police man in the uk is a racist facist bigot with nothing better to do than hound totally innocent people
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Hound it wouldn’t be anything like that. Remember every police man in the uk is a racist facist bigot with nothing better to do than hound totally innocent people
No Phil of course they are not - except the ones that are
https://www.standard.co.uk/news/crime/met-police-far-right-a4494071.html
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Hound it wouldn’t be anything like that. Remember every police man in the uk is a racist facist bigot with nothing better to do than hound totally innocent people
No Phil of course they are not - except the ones that are
https://www.standard.co.uk/news/crime/met-police-far-right-a4494071.html
Mmmm, so that is one then.
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That’s it then point proven. I apologise
All cops are bad
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There’s been accusations that the Uk is becoming more ‘Americanised’ for decades. From my own point of view I don’t think this is the case outside of London, however there are parts of the capital that could be compared with some cities in the US. I rarely venture into South London if I can help it but when I do i can see how some could compare it to some districts of New York.
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2019 survey.
19% of people think that some people are more intelligent than others because of their race
38% of people think that some people work harder than others because of their race
(this does of course mean that 81% and 62% dont think that) but trying to downplay what a significant minority of British think - and therefore how they might act - is foolish
https://theconversation.com/how-racist-is-britain-today-what-the-evidence-tells-us-141657
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That’s it then point proven. I apologise
All cops are bad
Are you posting this because you haven't got an argument Phil? is this your defence. You know well no one is saying that but their is plenty of evidence of racial bias against the police and it's been posted on this thread.
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So what do they want then?
Pull over more white folk just to even up the score?
Maybe there are lots more blacks in parts of London than whites?
Maybe, just maybe more young black men are involved in crime in these areas.
As far as I am aware I don't think the Police need any reason to pull over any vehicle.
I was pulled over once pushing a motorbike along the road in Bradford with no motorcycle gear, helmet etc. I was asked who I was, did I own the bike and proof of ID. I didn't get the hump on with the bobbie as I just saw it as him being thorough and preventing a potential theft. It could have been someone nicking my bike.
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AL.
I utterly give up.
Read your post again and engage brain.
YOU were pulled up because you were committing an offence. The whole point about this discussion is that black people are overwhelmingly more likely than whites to be pulled up when they HAVEN'T committed an offence.
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Is that because statistically they are more likely to have committed a crime Billy?
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AL.
I utterly give up.
Read your post again and engage brain.
YOU were pulled up because you were committing an offence. The whole point about this discussion is that black people are overwhelmingly more likely than whites to be pulled up when they HAVEN'T committed an offence.
I wasn't committing an offence. I was pushing a motorcycle along the road. It was a non runner at the time. However as I had no crash helmet etc at the time with me, it did look a bit dodgy. It was taxed, tested and insured and I think the police did the correct thing in verifying my identity and ownership. I could have been in the act of stealing it but the actions of the policeman prevented what he thought could have been an offence taking place. I am all for it as this is what we pay the police to do.
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Apologies AL, I missed the word "pushing" while skim reading. Fair to say that you were displaying unusual behaviour which perhaps warranted police attention? Again, the point being that blacks are more frequently pulled over when there is no genuine evidence of suspicious behaviour.
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Apologies AL, I missed the word "pushing" while skim reading. Fair to say that you were displaying unusual behaviour which perhaps warranted police attention? Again, the point being that blacks are more frequently pulled over when there is no genuine evidence of suspicious behaviour.
No problem. I just think the demographic of some cities makes it more likely that certain groups will be pulled up. If this was happening in somewhere like Donny then I would agree it would be strange but certain areas of London have a vastly different racial mix to say here or Hereford or Exeter for example.
I understand that most black people are like us and just want to get on with their lives, so it really is a shame that the activities of some of their community cause this to happen. Not all Police are bad, not all black people are up to no good. But we can not have a situation where the Police are afraid to pull some one over for a word for fear of being involved in a race row.
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I used to get stopped on a regular basis because I used to leave for work in the very early hours of the morning, mostly out in the countryside.
No problem and used to feel assured by it really, one time I was coming back from Crewe when they put a load (8) past us. conversation went where have you been? Crewe and we got hammered and I am not happy, well you had better get yourself off to bed then.
Had a number plate cloned and received six parking fines all for the Plymouth Magistrates court car park, must have been a judge or an habituel attender.
Used to see loads of lampers and scroats buzzing about, on the A19 between Selby and Askern.
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Apologies AL, I missed the word "pushing" while skim reading. Fair to say that you were displaying unusual behaviour which perhaps warranted police attention? Again, the point being that blacks are more frequently pulled over when there is no genuine evidence of suspicious behaviour.
No problem. I just think the demographic of some cities makes it more likely that certain groups will be pulled up. If this was happening in somewhere like Donny then I would agree it would be strange but certain areas of London have a vastly different racial mix to say here or Hereford or Exeter for example.
I understand that most black people are like us and just want to get on with their lives, so it really is a shame that the activities of some of their community cause this to happen. Not all Police are bad, not all black people are up to no good. But we can not have a situation where the Police are afraid to pull some one over for a word for fear of being involved in a race row.
Black people ARE part of “us”..
I assume you didn’t mean to but your post implies it’s a case of “us” and “them”..
As for police stopping more suspects in cities, that’s fair enough, but it’s the reasons that the people are suspected which is the problem.
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Apologies AL, I missed the word "pushing" while skim reading. Fair to say that you were displaying unusual behaviour which perhaps warranted police attention? Again, the point being that blacks are more frequently pulled over when there is no genuine evidence of suspicious behaviour.
No problem. I just think the demographic of some cities makes it more likely that certain groups will be pulled up. If this was happening in somewhere like Donny then I would agree it would be strange but certain areas of London have a vastly different racial mix to say here or Hereford or Exeter for example.
I understand that most black people are like us and just want to get on with their lives, so it really is a shame that the activities of some of their community cause this to happen. Not all Police are bad, not all black people are up to no good. But we can not have a situation where the Police are afraid to pull some one over for a word for fear of being involved in a race row.
Black people ARE part of “us”..
I assume you didn’t mean to but your post implies it’s a case of “us” and “them”..
As for police stopping more suspects in cities, that’s fair enough, but it’s the reasons that the people are suspected which is the problem.
I didn't mean it to come over in a bad way, I just meant as a group within a group for want of a better expression.
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And there in lies much of the problem. People say and do things with no malice aforethought and with no intent to offend, yet such things can be taken the wrong way. When we say things like that we don’t realise how it affects those who we refer to.
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And there in lies much of the problem. People say and do things with no malice aforethought and with no intent to offend, yet such things can be taken the wrong way. When we say things like that we don’t realise how it affects those who we refer to.
I'm too old for all this. It hurts my head. I think i'll go and live in a hut in the woods. :chair:
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And there in lies much of the problem. People say and do things with no malice aforethought and with no intent to offend, yet such things can be taken the wrong way. When we say things like that we don’t realise how it affects those who we refer to.
And therein lies the problem, no intention to offend..... can and at times will offend,
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Especially when it's lily livered loony lefties deciding what's offensive.
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Especially when it's lily livered loony lefties deciding what's offensive.
That offends me! 😉
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Especially when it's lily livered loony lefties deciding what's offensive.
That offends me! 😉
If your offended I'll take a knee for you brother..... :rolleyes:
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Especially when it's lily livered loony lefties deciding what's offensive.
That offends me! 😉
If your offended I'll take a knee for you brother..... :rolleyes:
My ex-wife used to take a knee to me.
Right in the b*llocks.
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Especially when it's lily livered loony lefties deciding what's offensive.
That offends me! 😉
If your offended I'll take a knee for you brother..... :rolleyes:
My ex-wife used to take a knee to me.
Right in the b*llocks.
That sounds like my ex wife as well.😳
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Especially when it's lily livered loony lefties deciding what's offensive.
So you think it is ok to think of different racial groups as “us”’ them.? That it isn’t offensive to be considered “them” and not us.?
So having principles makes me a lily livered lefty does it.?
To quote Game of Thrones, you know nothing BB.
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I am a 58yr old man, i supported and marched on many rock against racism rallies in the late 70s and am very proud to have added my voice to the cause against racism. What i don't like is the current situation in this country were the BLM supporters are marching in berets and stab vests, marching in paramilitary order.
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As opposed to the right-wing facists/DFLA marching through Nottingham in para-military uniform and carring Nazi themed flags you mean?
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As opposed to the right-wing facists/DFLA marching through Nottingham in para-military uniform and carring Nazi themed flags you mean?
[/quot
Don't even try to turn my words back on me you prick, no one should be spreading hate and fear under any flag or cause. All men are equal.
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Darren.
Absolutely no attempt from me to turn your words back. I agree that anyone looking to start violence is the problem.
Thing is, this is the context.
https://mobile.twitter.com/IwriteOK/status/1297245319449571328
Scroll through that Twitter thread. Look at the right wing parmilitaries (that's what they are) carrying assault rifles, baseball bats, mace spray, wearing helmets and body armour.
Watch one of them assault a journalist filming the violence with a baton, breaking his hand.
https://mobile.twitter.com/IwriteOK/status/1297270144947765248
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Especially when it's lily livered loony lefties deciding what's offensive.
So you think it is ok to think of different racial groups as “us”’ them.? That it isn’t offensive to be considered “them” and not us.?
So having principles makes me a lily livered lefty does it.?
To quote Game of Thrones, you know nothing BB.
So you think it's OK to have principles that mean all people should "take a knee" because if they don't they are racist?
And where is there a quote in Game of Thrones that says I know nothing?
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Especially when it's lily livered loony lefties deciding what's offensive.
So you think it is ok to think of different racial groups as “us”’ them.? That it isn’t offensive to be considered “them” and not us.?
So having principles makes me a lily livered lefty does it.?
To quote Game of Thrones, you know nothing BB.
So you think it's OK to have principles that mean all people should "take a knee" because if they don't they are racist?
And where is there a quote in Game of Thrones that says I know nothing?
I think Manuel said that to Basil.
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As opposed to the right-wing facists/DFLA marching through Nottingham in para-military uniform and carring Nazi themed flags you mean?
[/quot
Don't even try to turn my words back on me you prick, no one should be spreading hate and fear under any flag or cause. All men are equal.
You wrote them - would you like me to call you something offensive as well if that's your level.
You decided to comment on black people in para-military uniform whislt ignoring that the far-right had marched in para-military uniform through Nottingham on Saturday. That's not my problem for pointing it out.
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Especially when it's lily livered loony lefties deciding what's offensive.
So you think it is ok to think of different racial groups as “us”’ them.? That it isn’t offensive to be considered “them” and not us.?
So having principles makes me a lily livered lefty does it.?
To quote Game of Thrones, you know nothing BB.
So you think it's OK to have principles that mean all people should "take a knee" because if they don't they are racist?
And where is there a quote in Game of Thrones that says I know nothing?
I’ve never said that not taking a knee makes someone a racist.
Making a specific anti-statement about not taking a knee such as “I would only kneel for the Queen”, I do find disturbing.
Doesn’t make me a lily livered lefty still.
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Especially when it's lily livered loony lefties deciding what's offensive.
So you think it is ok to think of different racial groups as “us”’ them.? That it isn’t offensive to be considered “them” and not us.?
So having principles makes me a lily livered lefty does it.?
To quote Game of Thrones, you know nothing BB.
So you think it's OK to have principles that mean all people should "take a knee" because if they don't they are racist?
And where is there a quote in Game of Thrones that says I know nothing?
I’ve never said that not taking a knee makes someone a racist.
Making a specific anti-statement about not taking a knee such as “I would only kneel for the Queen”, I do find disturbing.
Doesn’t make me a lily livered lefty still.
You volunteered yourself in that category!
Oh, and where is there a quote in Game of Thrones that says I know nothing?
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I was paraphrasing, if you prefer..
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What were you paraphrasing?
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GoT, obviously
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So what is the quote in Game of Thrones that you are paraphrasing?
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“You know nothing”, as in “you know nothing, Jon Snow”..
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Especially when it's lily livered loony lefties deciding what's offensive.
That offends me! 😉
If your offended I'll take a knee for you brother..... :rolleyes:
My ex-wife used to take a knee to me.
Right in the b*llocks.
I took another knee in the b*llocks today; from ifollow.
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So I see the Right are getting all foamy mouthed about the wokey idea not to sing the lyrics of Land of Hope and Glory at the Proms.
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.telegraph.co.uk/women/life/dear-bbc-dont-want-live-land-woke-sorry/amp/
It's a sign of the times that The Left would be such killjoys isn't it? Wouldn't have even discussed such things years ago would we?
Except ...err...
https://mobile.twitter.com/Otto_English/status/1299684419918344193
Amazing isn't it how people like Philips, (when she takes time off from being a COVID-denier) who scream loudest about how disgraceful it is for the Left to deny us our history, turn out to know the square root of nowt about our history.
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Apologies AL, I missed the word "pushing" while skim reading. Fair to say that you were displaying unusual behaviour which perhaps warranted police attention? Again, the point being that blacks are more frequently pulled over when there is no genuine evidence of suspicious behaviour.
No problem. I just think the demographic of some cities makes it more likely that certain groups will be pulled up. If this was happening in somewhere like Donny then I would agree it would be strange but certain areas of London have a vastly different racial mix to say here or Hereford or Exeter for example.
I understand that most black people are like us and just want to get on with their lives, so it really is a shame that the activities of some of their community cause this to happen. Not all Police are bad, not all black people are up to no good. But we can not have a situation where the Police are afraid to pull some one over for a word for fear of being involved in a race row.
Black people ARE part of “us”..
I assume you didn’t mean to but your post implies it’s a case of “us” and “them”..
As for police stopping more suspects in cities, that’s fair enough, but it’s the reasons that the people are suspected which is the problem.
as an observation, in his tribute speech, Lewis Hamilton spoke about the great work chadwick had done for "our people". If that isn't a leading light of the BLM movement suggesting an us and them situation, then I don't know what is?
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So I see the Right are getting all foamy mouthed about the wokey idea not to sing the lyrics of Land of Hope and Glory at the Proms.
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.telegraph.co.uk/women/life/dear-bbc-dont-want-live-land-woke-sorry/amp/
It's a sign of the times that The Left would be such killjoys isn't it? Wouldn't have even discussed such things years ago would we?
Except ...err...
https://mobile.twitter.com/Otto_English/status/1299684419918344193
Amazing isn't it how people like Philips, (when she takes time off from being a COVID-denier) who scream loudest about how disgraceful it is for the Left to deny us our history, turn out to know the square root of nowt about our history.
*breaking news* opposition to war and imperialism existed in 1918.
Who would have thought it?
Ain’t the internet a wonderful thing?
You can find WHATEVER you want to find in a couple of clicks.
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I moved to London in 1981 to find work with my mate from Donny, initially for 6 months and I’m still here! We worked on the building sites around the old Docklands area. Those sites definitely weren’t for the faint hearted and the ‘banter’ often moved from Micky taking to outright bullying. There was a black lad working with us called Leon who was often the brunt of this simply due to his colour. The abuse ranged from racist comments to things like leaving bananas in his work bag. This was every single day, without fail. Leon would laugh it off but I know from talking to him at the time that it was wearing him down. He once told us something that happened to him that I still often think about to this day.
Him and a mate (who was also black) were working on a site near Canning Town when a car full of men pulled up on the street beside them. One of the men got out the car and threatened Leon and his mate with a knife and racially abused them. A very frightening experience. They called the police who arrived quite quickly, but instead of asking them about the men who’d threatened them, spent half an hour on the street asking Leon and his mate what they were doing in a ‘white’ area without showing any interest in finding the perpetrators! Apparently things like this weren’t uncommon for young black men.
Leon was one of the nicest men you could meet, and he didn’t deserve the daily racist abuse he took on the sites by these arseholes. One day he came into work and told us that he was going to give them what they want and ‘go back to where he came from’. He left the site that night and never came back. I never saw him again but I’m sure that his experiences contributed to my involvement in the anti racist movement around that time.
Things are different now and I don’t believe that there’s the institutional racism there once was, however racism still exists without a doubt. If taking the knee existed back then I would certainly have done this to show my support to lovely guys like Leon.
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HA, that is a very depressing story. But it has a use. Anyone who ever complains about PC culture should be given a link to your post.
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Another example for people who complain about PC culture stopping them saying and doing what they want. This time it's from this weekend.
The picture below is from a right wing French magazine. The article is about slavery. The picture at centre is a cartoon of a prominent French black politician who has been vocal in demanding that France faces up to its past on slavery.
The implied message is quite clear.
https://api.arretsurimages.net/api/public/media/obonovaleurs1_cr/action/show?format=article_header&t=2020-08-29T15:47:42+02:00
Many critics of what they call "Political Correctness" (and what I call, "not acting like an obnoxious t**t") claim that things WERE bad years ago, but they are much better now.
That magazine, eh? Or the abuse that Diane Abbott deals with on a daily basis?
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HA, that is a very depressing story. But it has a use. Anyone who ever complains about PC culture should be given a link to your post.
What are you laughing for then?
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HA, that is a very depressing story. But it has a use. Anyone who ever complains about PC culture should be given a link to your post.
Anyone who EVER complains about PC culture? What about the PC culture that suggests that all Brexit voters are racists? Shouldn't we complain about them?
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SS.
That's not "PC culture" (whatever that is). It's individuals being abusive.
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I moved to London in 1981 to find work with my mate from Donny, initially for 6 months and I’m still here! We worked on the building sites around the old Docklands area. Those sites definitely weren’t for the faint hearted and the ‘banter’ often moved from Micky taking to outright bullying. There was a black lad working with us called Leon who was often the brunt of this simply due to his colour. The abuse ranged from racist comments to things like leaving bananas in his work bag. This was every single day, without fail. Leon would laugh it off but I know from talking to him at the time that it was wearing him down. He once told us something that happened to him that I still often think about to this day.
Him and a mate (who was also black) were working on a site near Canning Town when a car full of men pulled up on the street beside them. One of the men got out the car and threatened Leon and his mate with a knife and racially abused them. A very frightening experience. They called the police who arrived quite quickly, but instead of asking them about the men who’d threatened them, spent half an hour on the street asking Leon and his mate what they were doing in a ‘white’ area without showing any interest in finding the perpetrators! Apparently things like this weren’t uncommon for young black men.
Leon was one of the nicest men you could meet, and he didn’t deserve the daily racist abuse he took on the sites by these arseholes. One day he came into work and told us that he was going to give them what they want and ‘go back to where he came from’. He left the site that night and never came back. I never saw him again but I’m sure that his experiences contributed to my involvement in the anti racist movement around that time.
Things are different now and I don’t believe that there’s the institutional racism there once was, however racism still exists without a doubt. If taking the knee existed back then I would certainly have done this to show my support to lovely guys like Leon.
It's a moving story HA and I would imagine all too familiar to too many. I don't get it, never have it's such a waste of precious time and energy and for what, a petty power trip.
Another story this time about a bully, no racism just bullying. I knew a guy yonks ago hadn't seen him for quite a while and exchanged greetings the talking point his arm was in cast. It went like this ''I like a bit of a scrap but one night right here (pub) I picked the wrong one and before I knew it I was on the floor nursing this ''never again'' he said ''that's it for me'' It turns out I didn't know him much at all, he was a big lad but it was only ok when he chose the right mark.
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We didn't have to wait long for fararge to enter stage right and start making bullets for his droogs.
farage is too much of a coward to be at the protest himself and just uses a bunch of no-hopers to do his bidding.
''Port of Dover is brought to a standstill by far-right groups
Flag-waving extremists and white nationalists block roads in protest over migrant Channel crossings''
''Just after 1pm, below the white cliffs of Dover, Nigel Marcham offered his take on one of the summer’s most potent symbols. “Take a knee for the brethren of this f**king country,” Marcham screamed into his megaphone.
Around him a ragtag collection of far-right supporters, white nationalists and neo-nazis knelt on the A20 outside Dover’s Eastern Docks. “Thanks for taking a f**king knee in the proper way,” he said, clearly delighted with his perversion of the global peaceful protest symbol adopted by millions following the death of George Floyd in Minneapolis''
''Support for the protest has been amplified by a number of political figures inflaming tensions over refugees arriving by boat.
Chief among them has been the Brexit party leader, Nigel Farage, who has posted pictures of himself on the lookout above Dover for vessels carrying refugees and has regularly described the recent arrivals as an “invasion”. Farage even made a widely ridiculed boat trip into the Channel in an attempt to monitor asylum seekers arriving in the UK''
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/sep/05/port-of-dover-is-brought-to-a-standstill-by-far-right-groups
''NHS worker and Londoner Donna Carr, 50, said immigrants had sustained the health service throughout the pandemic and it was important to remember their contribution.
“Where were the far right then? Were they on the front line risking their lives? Were they caring for the elderly?”
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The 4000 refugees that have arrived by boat this year represents around 0.0058823529% of the population.