Viking Supporters Co-operative
Viking Chat => Off Topic => Topic started by: DonnyOsmond on March 23, 2021, 11:57:40 am
-
What's everyone's thoughts on the matter?
I've no issue with the Union Jack flag being on display at a building, people hanging it up for events like the Olympics, VE Day or the St George's flag being flown during World Cups or Euros.
However, recently it's all just turned cringey with MPs making sure a flag is in shot then if anyone interviewing them makes a light hearted joke about it then they all jump on them. Two of our local Tory MPs, Don Valley and Bassetlaw, even wrote to the head of the BBC asking for Charlie Start and Naga Munchetty to be reprimanded and made to apologise. Surely this is people being snowflakes and cancel culture at its finest?
-
Like everything in life is something becomes overused or overexposed it gradually loses it's value until it is nothing out of the ordinary and undervalued.
That's my opinion, I also think that some of the main flag wavers are also hypocrites. Wave the flag and then do something for yourself rather than the country as a whole.
-
The interesting thing about that whole furore was how it was Naga Munchetty who bore the brunt of it and had to apologise, even though it was Charlie Stayt who made the quip. Wonder white's going on there.
There's nothing inherently wrong with waving the flag but using the flag as a prop to rile people up because you have nothing of substance to say is the problem. Like does anyone really think these politicians have massive 10 by 6 ft f**koff Union flags just lying around their offices, taking up room? It's just patronising.
-
Idler, I go along with that there is a lot of hypocrites waving and dressing themselves up in the flag of the EU, especially outside the Houses of Parliament for the BBC cameras.
They make a noise too.
-
I'll just sum up what no doubt the majority of the thread will be then clear off.
"Grrrrr lefties"
-
No leftie jibes from me Janos..
How can anyone do so when all Party’s do it.
-
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T72TopWbXJg&ab_channel=Paloopah
Amazing how little this has aged.
-
Credit To Hancockup he doesn't have a flag in the background when he is interviewed from home
-
Credit To Hancockup he doesn't have a flag in the background when he is interviewed from home
Not even a white one?
-
Very sad attitude displayed by some on here.
We should be proud of our flag. What's wrong with the Government promoting Britain?
Even the liberals now running the US still have pride in their nation's flag.
If those two making fun of the flag that many gave their lives to defend were in the US their careers would be over now.
-
Very sad attitude displayed by some on here.
We should be proud of our flag. What's wrong with the Government promoting Britain?
Even the liberals now running the US still have pride in their nation's flag.
If those two making fun of the flag that many gave their lives to defend were in the US their careers would be over now.
Yes because the US are worse than anywhere. We aren't and hopefully won't ever be like the US. All a flag is is a piece of cloth and it isn't something to get emotional about when someone else jokes about it.
-
It's getting as bad as poppy shaming.
-
Very sad attitude displayed by some on here.
We should be proud of our flag. What's wrong with the Government promoting Britain?
Even the liberals now running the US still have pride in their nation's flag.
If those two making fun of the flag that many gave their lives to defend were in the US their careers would be over now.
Yes because the US are worse than anywhere. We aren't and hopefully won't ever be like the US. All a flag is is a piece of cloth and it isn't something to get emotional about when someone else jokes about it.
Totally disagree. It is not just a piece of cloth, it is a representation of our nation, history and people which many gave their lives to defend and as such should be treated with the respect it deserves by anyone who has the benefit and honour of being a British citizen.
-
Have you noticed how it as always the intolerant and authoritarian countries that are the most visible in promoting symbols as a means of control. Tolerant countries have no need of that - they take pride in their country as a country.
If you listen or read to the people who actually fough for this country, people like Harry Patch and Tom Moore, they tell you they fought for freedom and the desire not to live under an authoritarian regime.
All this snowflake cancel culture - you can't say anything in this country anymore...
-
Have you noticed how it as always the intolerant and authoritarian countries that are the most visible in promoting symbols as a means of control. Tolerant countries have no need of that - they take pride in their country as a country.
If you listen or read to the people who actually fough for this country, people like Harry Patch and Tom Moore, they tell you they fought for freedom and the desire not to live under an authoritarian regime.
All this snowflake cancel culture - you can't say anything in this country anymore...
There's always some disrespectful lowlife ready to trample the flag. If it was a statue of Nelson Mandela being ridiculed the woke left would be up in arms, stamping their feet as usual. They are so predictably boring.
-
The ex army people that I know certainly still have pride in the flag.
-
The ex army people that I know certainly still have pride in the flag.
As i do in them. For me the flag is a representation of there courage and efforts.
The title of this thread tells you all you need to know about the mentality of some on here.
-
The thing about flagshaggers is they only give a shit about the flag when they can use it to shout down others. That's what deserves mockery. The flag is just a piece of cloth but it's one you can project your values onto. It can be a symbol of good, or it can be a nasty, spiteful thing that little people use to shame others. Just displaying a flag has no value. It gets the knuckle draggers riled up like the fascist eugenics lover in this thread though, which is why vapid politicians use it as a prop.
-
The thing about flagshaggers is they only give a shit about the flag when they can use it to shout down others. That's what deserves mockery. The flag is just a piece of cloth but it's one you can project your values onto. It can be a symbol of good, or it can be a nasty, spiteful thing that little people use to shame others. Just displaying a flag has no value. It gets the knuckle draggers riled up like the fascist eugenics lover in this thread though, which is why vapid politicians use it as a prop.
Thanks for the fascist slur, you really ought to be careful what you write on a public forum, it could get you into trouble.
-
The army is different to politicians adopting it over the last 6 months or so. We've even got one politician demanding the BBC put flags on their annual report as he believes his constituents would like that. I doubt his constituents have ever even read that report, nor care how many pictures of a flag are in it!
-
I love my country and I love the flags of St. George and the Union Jack.
What I don't like is when people ram them down your throat for their own ends as I said earlier. That applies to any party or political group.
Waving a flag doesn't make a repugnant group attractive or empty promises any more valuable.
-
The thing about flagshaggers is they only give a shit about the flag when they can use it to shout down others. That's what deserves mockery. The flag is just a piece of cloth but it's one you can project your values onto. It can be a symbol of good, or it can be a nasty, spiteful thing that little people use to shame others. Just displaying a flag has no value. It gets the knuckle draggers riled up like the fascist eugenics lover in this thread though, which is why vapid politicians use it as a prop.
Thanks for the fascist slur, you really ought to be careful what you write on a public forum, it could get you into trouble.
You're a fascist. Or it's a massive coincidence that you're not a fascist who just so happens to be obsessed with far-right authoritarian politics, loves fascist politicians like Orban, and advocates for fascist ideas like eugenics. Thought you were into free speech and plain speaking, now you're nudge-wink implying legal action (lol good luck with that given your posting history) because someone accurately described you on the internet.
-
The thing about flagshaggers is they only give a shit about the flag when they can use it to shout down others. That's what deserves mockery. The flag is just a piece of cloth but it's one you can project your values onto. It can be a symbol of good, or it can be a nasty, spiteful thing that little people use to shame others. Just displaying a flag has no value. It gets the knuckle draggers riled up like the fascist eugenics lover in this thread though, which is why vapid politicians use it as a prop.
Thanks for the fascist slur, you really ought to be careful what you write on a public forum, it could get you into trouble.
You're a fascist. Or it's a massive coincidence that you're not a fascist who just so happens to be obsessed with far-right authoritarian politics, loves fascist politicians like Orban, and advocates for fascist ideas like eugenics. Thought you were into free speech and plain speaking, now you're nudge-wink implying legal action (lol good luck with that given your posting history) because someone accurately described you on the internet.
Fine, as long as you can take it as well as give it. I'm happy to take insults as long as you are big enough to do the same, although i doubt it as the woke left are all the same. Any point of view is ok as long as it's yours. I would have been equally as happy to listen to a speech by either Enoch Powell or Tony Benn as they were both men of intelligence and honour with valid views and opinions, such a shame this is no longer possible with people with your blinkered mindset.
-
It's popular to call people a fascist when you basically are a commy the union flag used to stand against both, including the red one with the hammer and Sycle on which you might quite like Macho.
-
It's popular to call people a fascist when you basically are a commy the union flag used to stand against both, including the red one with the hammer and Sycle on which you might quite like Macho.
Godwin's law, short for Godwin's law (or rule) of Nazi analogies, is an Internet adage asserting that "as an online discussion grows longer, the probability of a comparison involving Nazis or Hitler becomes more likely. That is, if an online discussion (regardless of topic or scope) goes on long enough, sooner or later someone will compare someone or something to Adolf Hitler or his deeds, the point at which usually dampens discussion.
I think the gist of this is when you begin comparing people with Nazis you have lost your argument.
-
The brass neck of saying you're proud of our military while describing the evil thousands of them died to prevent as "valid".
This is the sinister side of flagshagging. It can cover up some truly abhorrent views. Unfortunately idler, waving a flag CAN make repugnant groups, who hate this country and most of the people in it, attractive to certain people. As this thread is evidence of.
It's popular to call people a fascist when you basically are a commy the union flag used to stand against both, including the red one with the hammer and Sycle on which you might quite like Macho.
Here's Selby defending fascism again. Remember when actual fascists wearing Camp Auschwitz t shirts tried to overthrow the US government and you thought that was cool and implied it should've happened here? And you never responded when called out because you're a cowardly little WUM who realised he'd gone too far? Not sure where communism comes in, I imagine it sounded clever in that perfectly smooth brain of yours.
-
It's popular to call people a fascist when you basically are a commy the union flag used to stand against both, including the red one with the hammer and Sycle on which you might quite like Macho.
Godwin's law, short for Godwin's law (or rule) of Nazi analogies, is an Internet adage asserting that "as an online discussion grows longer, the probability of a comparison involving Nazis or Hitler becomes more likely. That is, if an online discussion (regardless of topic or scope) goes on long enough, sooner or later someone will compare someone or something to Adolf Hitler or his deeds, the point at which usually dampens discussion.
I think the gist of this is when you begin comparing people with Nazis you have lost your argument.
If you don't want to be compared to the Nazis you should probably stop sharing so many of their views. Here is a quote from another thread.
Kids shouldn't suffer because they have wasters for parents
We are breeding another generation on the benefits gravy train, when will it end?
We are massively over populated and there must be a solution. IMO Eugenics is the answer.
This is what Axholme thinks should happen in this country. He claims to love the country, but is happy to wipe out the "feral underclass" (another direct quote from that thread), ie millions of people who live here.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nazi_eugenics
-
It's popular to call people a fascist when you basically are a commy the union flag used to stand against both, including the red one with the hammer and Sycle on which you might quite like Macho.
Godwin's law, short for Godwin's law (or rule) of Nazi analogies, is an Internet adage asserting that "as an online discussion grows longer, the probability of a comparison involving Nazis or Hitler becomes more likely. That is, if an online discussion (regardless of topic or scope) goes on long enough, sooner or later someone will compare someone or something to Adolf Hitler or his deeds, the point at which usually dampens discussion.
I think the gist of this is when you begin comparing people with Nazis you have lost your argument.
If you don't want to be compared to the Nazis you should probably stop sharing so many of their views. Here is a quote from another thread.
Kids shouldn't suffer because they have wasters for parents
We are breeding another generation on the benefits gravy train, when will it end?
We are massively over populated and there must be a solution. IMO Eugenics is the answer.
This is what Axholme thinks should happen in this country. He claims to love the country, but is happy to wipe out the "feral underclass" (another direct quote from that thread), ie millions of people who live here.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nazi_eugenics
I take you are happy for the streets to be full of effing and blinding, spitting, workshy loafers who prevent decent from going about thier business because they are scared of them? If so let's carry on breeding them. why can there be no safe place for normal people without having to come into contact with them?
-
The Nazis are all fascists. Not all Fascists are Nazis.
-
It's popular to call people a fascist when you basically are a commy the union flag used to stand against both, including the red one with the hammer and Sycle on which you might quite like Macho.
Godwin's law, short for Godwin's law (or rule) of Nazi analogies, is an Internet adage asserting that "as an online discussion grows longer, the probability of a comparison involving Nazis or Hitler becomes more likely. That is, if an online discussion (regardless of topic or scope) goes on long enough, sooner or later someone will compare someone or something to Adolf Hitler or his deeds, the point at which usually dampens discussion.
I think the gist of this is when you begin comparing people with Nazis you have lost your argument.
If you don't want to be compared to the Nazis you should probably stop sharing so many of their views. Here is a quote from another thread.
Kids shouldn't suffer because they have wasters for parents
We are breeding another generation on the benefits gravy train, when will it end?
We are massively over populated and there must be a solution. IMO Eugenics is the answer.
This is what Axholme thinks should happen in this country. He claims to love the country, but is happy to wipe out the "feral underclass" (another direct quote from that thread), ie millions of people who live here.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nazi_eugenics
Or alternatively for a balanced reasoned viewpoint.
Eugenics is the practice or advocacy of improving the human species by selectively mating people with specific desirable hereditary traits. It aims to reduce human suffering by “breeding out” disease, disabilities and so-called undesirable characteristics from the human population.
If that is one way of improving life for all i do not see a problem.
If it was possible to stop people being born to be murderers or sex offenders why would that not be a good thing?
-
So how does this eugenically-produced paradise come about?
Do you support compulsory neutering of people who might transmit certain genes, or enforced abortions of their potential offspring?
If no, how does eugenics work in practice?
if yes, are you still going to claim that you're not a fascist?
-
So how does this eugenically-produced paradise come about?
Do you support compulsory neutering of people who might transmit certain genes, or enforced abortions of their potential offspring?
If no, how does eugenics work in practice?
if yes, are you still going to claim that you're not a fascist?
A good start would be to cut out benefits to the ones who are generations into sponging their way through life with no intention of ever working and consider anti social behaviour a good way of life.
-
Right.
So you don't actively stop people having kids who might become criminals. You just starve the kids who might become criminals.
-
Getting rid of 'undesirable characteristics' ain't half going to cut down Millwall's fanbase.
-
So how does this eugenically-produced paradise come about?
Do you support compulsory neutering of people who might transmit certain genes, or enforced abortions of their potential offspring?
If no, how does eugenics work in practice?
if yes, are you still going to claim that you're not a fascist?
A good start would be to cut out benefits to the ones who are generations into sponging their way through life with no intention of ever working and consider anti social behaviour a good way of life.
And just out of interest, how does that stop murderers and rapists? You were putting eugenics forward as a way to prevent future murderers or rapists being born.
-
Right.
So you don't actively stop people having kids who might become criminals. You just starve the kids who might become criminals.
You stop the potential 'parents' having handouts to fund having kids who will become another generation of the same.
Are you lot honestly saying you do not see a problem when you walk around most town centres?
There are legions of them, unemployable, anti social rabble. They don't pay any attention to any covid restrictions as it makes no difference to them, still sucking up benefits while normal are struggling to make ends meet. they roam around spitting, swearing, thieving, not to mention the drugs.
Are you happy to be around this lot?
-
So how does this eugenically-produced paradise come about?
Do you support compulsory neutering of people who might transmit certain genes, or enforced abortions of their potential offspring?
If no, how does eugenics work in practice?
if yes, are you still going to claim that you're not a fascist?
I thought you were the great advocate of science. With research there will be ways to identify the traits.
A good start would be to cut out benefits to the ones who are generations into sponging their way through life with no intention of ever working and consider anti social behaviour a good way of life.
And just out of interest, how does that stop murderers and rapists? You were putting eugenics forward as a way to prevent future murderers or rapists being born.
-
Macho, if I want to feel clever I read your posts commy or comical or loser.
-
Right.
So you don't actively stop people having kids who might become criminals. You just starve the kids who might become criminals.
You stop the potential 'parents' having handouts to fund having kids who will become another generation of the same.
Are you lot honestly saying you do not see a problem when you walk around most town centres?
There are legions of them, unemployable, anti social rabble. They don't pay any attention to any covid restrictions as it makes no difference to them, still sucking up benefits while normal are struggling to make ends meet. they roam around spitting, swearing, thieving, not to mention the drugs.
Are you happy to be around this lot?
Just as the night rises against the day, the light and dark are in eternal conflict. So too, is the subhuman the greatest enemy of the dominant species on earth, mankind. The subhuman is a biological creature, crafted by nature, which has hands, legs, eyes and mouth, even the semblance of a brain. Nevertheless, this terrible creature is only a partial human being.
Although it has features similar to a human, the subhuman is lower on the spiritual and psychological scale than any animal. Inside of this creature lies wild and unrestrained passions: an incessant need to destroy, filled with the most primitive desires, chaos and coldhearted villainy.
A subhuman and nothing more!
Not all of those who appear human are in fact so. Woe to him who forgets it!
From a pamphlet edited by Heinrich Himmler..
-
Well I didn't expect to come back into this thread to see someone advocating starving children to death.
-
I'm changing my mind on eugenics for anti-social behaviour after seeing someone just drive at 60 along our 20mph limit residential street. I'd say sterilise anyone who might give birth to a person who would be genetically predisposed to buying a f**king Audi.
-
I'm changing my mind on eugenics for anti-social behaviour after seeing someone just drive at 60 along our 20mph limit residential street. I'd say sterilise anyone who might give birth to a person who would be genetically predisposed to buying a f**king Audi.
What about BMW?
-
I'm changing my mind on eugenics for anti-social behaviour after seeing someone just drive at 60 along our 20mph limit residential street. I'd say sterilise anyone who might give birth to a person who would be genetically predisposed to buying a f**king Audi.
What about BMW?
Suzuki?
-
Right.
So you don't actively stop people having kids who might become criminals. You just starve the kids who might become criminals.
You stop the potential 'parents' having handouts to fund having kids who will become another generation of the same.
Are you lot honestly saying you do not see a problem when you walk around most town centres?
There are legions of them, unemployable, anti social rabble. They don't pay any attention to any covid restrictions as it makes no difference to them, still sucking up benefits while normal are struggling to make ends meet. they roam around spitting, swearing, thieving, not to mention the drugs.
Are you happy to be around this lot?
So you think those roaming the street are living the life of riley and can make ends meet? Poverty breeds poverty and those through no fault of there own will find themselves discriminated against both at school and by potential employers. If ones parents had parents that were poor then they may never get opportunity that is available to others.
-
Deuteronomy 24:16
-
Had to get the periodic table out Glyn ;)
-
That's once a month, isn't it?
-
So the Tories are ramping up their Culture War tactic. Today the Culture Secretary has decreed that the Union Flag must fly 24/7 from all Govt buildings. Something that neither Churchill nor Thatcher ever bothered to demand.
Coincidentally, I've just finished reading The Road to Wigan Pier by George Orwell. He said, 85 years ago that if English facism every comes, it'll wrap itself up in the Lion and the Unicorn rather than the Swastika. The most perceptive political writer of the 20th century knew a thing or two about what road people are taking us on when they demand respect for symbolic totems rather than people.
-
I'm changing my mind on eugenics for anti-social behaviour after seeing someone just drive at 60 along our 20mph limit residential street. I'd say sterilise anyone who might give birth to a person who would be genetically predisposed to buying a f**king Audi.
What about BMW?
Suzuki?
Ha ha. Subaru too?
-
Right.
So you don't actively stop people having kids who might become criminals. You just starve the kids who might become criminals.
You stop the potential 'parents' having handouts to fund having kids who will become another generation of the same.
Are you lot honestly saying you do not see a problem when you walk around most town centres?
There are legions of them, unemployable, anti social rabble. They don't pay any attention to any covid restrictions as it makes no difference to them, still sucking up benefits while normal are struggling to make ends meet. they roam around spitting, swearing, thieving, not to mention the drugs.
Are you happy to be around this lot?
So you think those roaming the street are living the life of riley and can make ends meet? Poverty breeds poverty and those through no fault of there own will find themselves discriminated against both at school and by potential employers. If ones parents had parents that were poor then they may never get opportunity that is available to others.
You really are a card aren't you? What do you know about the likes of what are plaguing the streets of England's town centres twelve thousand miles away?
You reckon to be a champion of the underprivileged but come out with the most insulting slur on poorer people. Just because you come from a poorer less affluent family it does not follow that you automatically become an obnoxious, anti social, bone idle ne'er do well. I costs nothing for any parent of any back ground to instill in their children the difference between right and wrong and the values of good manners and decency. Not everyone can become a doctor or solicitor, but that doesn't mean you cannot work hard in whatever role you find and build a decent life for yourself.
There too many out there who cannot be bothered to do this and choose the easier option.
-
addressing what I wrote would be a good starting place. I didn't expect anything rational and wasn't disappointed.
-
Right.
So you don't actively stop people having kids who might become criminals. You just starve the kids who might become criminals.
You stop the potential 'parents' having handouts to fund having kids who will become another generation of the same.
Are you lot honestly saying you do not see a problem when you walk around most town centres?
There are legions of them, unemployable, anti social rabble. They don't pay any attention to any covid restrictions as it makes no difference to them, still sucking up benefits while normal are struggling to make ends meet. they roam around spitting, swearing, thieving, not to mention the drugs.
Are you happy to be around this lot?
So you think those roaming the street are living the life of riley and can make ends meet? Poverty breeds poverty and those through no fault of there own will find themselves discriminated against both at school and by potential employers. If ones parents had parents that were poor then they may never get opportunity that is available to others.
You really are a card aren't you? What do you know about the likes of what are plaguing the streets of England's town centres twelve thousand miles away?
You reckon to be a champion of the underprivileged but come out with the most insulting slur on poorer people. Just because you come from a poorer less affluent family it does not follow that you automatically become an obnoxious, anti social, bone idle ne'er do well. I costs nothing for any parent of any back ground to instill in their children the difference between right and wrong and the values of good manners and decency. Not everyone can become a doctor or solicitor, but that doesn't mean you cannot work hard in whatever role you find and build a decent life for yourself.
There too many out there who cannot be bothered to do this and choose the easier option.
I think that the behaviour of the members of the Bullingdon club at times matched the behaviour of some of the supposed lower class that they despised. Rich parents and a private education doesn’t automatically mean the child will develop into a decent and respected member of society.
A lot of self made successful people have also got their despite humble beginnings.
-
I like the light blue back ground with the White Rose in the middle thank you,what do you reckon to the black background with the arabic writing on they want to fly on top of the Houses of Parliament though? not keen myself.
We should stick to the Union Jack for that whatever it takes.
-
I thought if johnson gets his way it would be more like the hammer and sickle
-
addressing what I wrote would be a good starting place. I didn't expect anything rational and wasn't disappointed.
I did address it. Just because some is poor it does not follow that you have to turn out to be antisocial, and as Idler correctly states just because you are from a wealthy background it doesn't mean you will be a decent person either. Like many you just want to use the poor as a weapon to bash the government, you don't care about them. At least i have the honesty to say what i really feel, whereas you pretend to feel sorry for people who you would probably cross the road to avoid. It's the same with BLM, Millwall get slagged off racism but i stand shoulder to shoulder with my fellow fans at the Den and don't give a shit what colour they are, we are all Wall, but how many of the middle class woke who virtue signal with the knee taking would actually speak to a black person other than when they are serving them in a shop or something?
-
I always thought there was something deeply unBritish about flying flags.
It's the kind of thing funny foreigners like Americans do. A big f'kin flag flying on the porch. A sign of a deep seated insecurity I think.
I shouldn't but whenever I see the flag flying in someone's garden over here, I have this feeling that they must be a bit unhinged.
-
UnBritish, deep-seated insecurity? Do you mean like in the way the Labour party likes to sing about keeping the Red flag flying high?
-
addressing what I wrote would be a good starting place. I didn't expect anything rational and wasn't disappointed.
I did address it. Just because some is poor it does not follow that you have to turn out to be antisocial, and as Idler correctly states just because you are from a wealthy background it doesn't mean you will be a decent person either. Like many you just want to use the poor as a weapon to bash the government, you don't care about them. At least i have the honesty to say what i really feel, whereas you pretend to feel sorry for people who you would probably cross the road to avoid. It's the same with BLM, Millwall get slagged off racism but i stand shoulder to shoulder with my fellow fans at the Den and don't give a shit what colour they are, we are all Wall, but how many of the middle class woke who virtue signal with the knee taking would actually speak to a black person other than when they are serving them in a shop or something?
And cry and whinge about your own plight most of the time
-
Deep-seated insecurity? Do you mean like in the way the Labour party likes to sing about keeping the Red flag flying high?
Now you mention it, no, I didn't mean that.
There are appropriate times for a bit of flag waving. Like a royal jubilee for instance.
-
So you don't think the Labour party singing about keeping the Red flag flying high shows an UnBritish, deep-seated insecurity?
-
So you don't think the Labour party singing about keeping the Red flag flying high shows an UnBritish, deep-seated insecurity?
No more than Rovers fans singing about keeping the Red flag flying high.
-
Odd how someone could equate a song that celebrates ordinary people fighting oppression with being un-British.
-
So you don't think the Labour party singing about keeping the Red flag flying high shows an UnBritish, deep-seated insecurity?
No more than Rovers fans singing about keeping the Red flag flying high.
Exactly, just like fans of other football clubs. So it's not such an unBritish, deep-seated insecure thing to do, is it? It is quite a common British feature.
-
So you don't think the Labour party singing about keeping the Red flag flying high shows an UnBritish, deep-seated insecurity?
No more than Rovers fans singing about keeping the Red flag flying high.
Exactly, just like fans of other football clubs. So it's not such an unBritish, deep-seated insecure thing to do, is it? It is quite a common British feature.
My point is, there is a time and place.
Flying a flag all the time in your back garden? A bit odd.
-
I saw a few years ago where a study showed that when everyone in a factory wore the high vis jackets it diluted other workers appreciation of the dangers they were working around.
It became the norm and then became ignored to an extent.
I think that it's the same with the overuse of flags and taking the knee. Once you start doing and using things all of the time a lot of people will just go through the motions without reflecting on the reason behind.
-
I saw a few years ago where a study showed that when everyone in a factory wore the high vis jackets it diluted other workers appreciation of the dangers they were working around.
It became the norm and then became ignored to an extent.
I think that it's the same with the overuse of flags and taking the knee. Once you start doing and using things all of the time a lot of people will just go through the motions without reflecting on the reason behind.
That is a very good point. It's true, you don't notice them, you become blind to them.
-
There are legions of them, unemployable, anti social rabble. They don't pay any attention to any covid restrictions as it makes no difference to them, still sucking up benefits while normal are struggling to make ends meet. they roam around spitting, swearing, thieving, not to mention the drugs.
Are you happy to be around this lot?
As I've got older, I've come to realise there are a great many people with mental health issues. Some are just unfortunate, some have been severely abused.
When they fall off the rails, it doesn't really help to abuse, marginalise and castigate them. Who can be surprised when they become difficult, antisocial, criminal and seek escape through drugs?
It's by no means all but I do think there are a lot.
How do we get rid of 'them'? I don't think it's possible and I don't think it's possible to breed such problems away. Criminalising them probably doesn't help but dealing with such mental health probems would be a longterm expensive process. Throughout history we have usually found reasons to lock them away in one institution or another.
-
There are legions of them, unemployable, anti social rabble. They don't pay any attention to any covid restrictions as it makes no difference to them, still sucking up benefits while normal are struggling to make ends meet. they roam around spitting, swearing, thieving, not to mention the drugs.
Are you happy to be around this lot?
As I've got older, I've come to realise there are a great many people with mental health issues. Some are just unfortunate, some have been severely abused.
When they fall off the rails, it doesn't really help to abuse, marginalise and castigate them. Who can be surprised when they become difficult, antisocial, criminal and seek escape through drugs?
It's by no means all but I do think there are a lot.
Yes, there are some like that and it is very sad. The ones i am thinking about are the army of chavs.
How do we get rid of 'them'? I don't think it's possible and I don't think it's possible to breed such problems away. Criminalising them probably doesn't help but dealing with such mental health probems would be a longterm expensive process. Throughout history we have usually found reasons to lock them away in one institution or another.
-
The army of chavs?
Well, again there I think there are a lot of mental health problems. From young mothers, who neglected as children who feel a deep need to have children of their own, to fulfil a need to feel unconditional love, without necessarily considering how they will support them. To the other extreme of county lines gangsters grooming a generation of vulnerable kids as viscous street criminals.
One way or another there are a lot of blighted young lives out there. Instead of some eugenics program that won't work but will be cruel and discriminatory we'd be better off investing in education and social care.
-
The army of chavs?
Well, again there I think there are a lot of mental health problems. From young mothers, who neglected as children who feel a deep need to have children of their own, to fulfil a need to feel unconditional love, without necessarily considering how they will support them. To the other extreme of county lines gangsters grooming a generation of vulnerable kids as viscous street criminals.
One way or another there are a lot of blighted young lives out there. Instead of some eugenics program that won't work but will be cruel and discriminatory we'd be better off investing in education and social care.
I respect your views, but who foots the bill and when will it end?
-
The army of chavs?
Well, again there I think there are a lot of mental health problems. From young mothers, who neglected as children who feel a deep need to have children of their own, to fulfil a need to feel unconditional love, without necessarily considering how they will support them. To the other extreme of county lines gangsters grooming a generation of vulnerable kids as viscous street criminals.
One way or another there are a lot of blighted young lives out there. Instead of some eugenics program that won't work but will be cruel and discriminatory we'd be better off investing in education and social care.
I respect your views, but who foots the bill and when will it end?
How about the millionaires and billionaires?
-
So you don't think the Labour party singing about keeping the Red flag flying high shows an UnBritish, deep-seated insecurity?
Given that the Red Flag isn't a national flag, no.
-
I've never understood this pride in the flag thing. It seems to demand uncritical support and that is simply childish and unthinking.
I am deeply proud of some things Britain has done and some things it has stood for. Equally, some aspects of British history and British culture utterly disgust me.
I want to be able to promote and praise the former, while criticising and trying to change the latter. But a culture that prioritises the flag is implicitly one which frowns on criticism of any aspect of the nation. And I suspect that is the battle line that the Tories are wanting to draw in the clearly planned move to emphasise the importance of the flag.
-
The other odd thing about this move to have the flag flying 24/7 from Govt buildings. When asked why he supported it, a backwoodsman, Brexit supporting Tory MP said "Because they do it in France and Germany."
-
So you don't think the Labour party singing about keeping the Red flag flying high shows an UnBritish, deep-seated insecurity?
Given that the Red Flag isn't a national flag, no.
What's that got to do with it?
-
So you don't think the Labour party singing about keeping the Red flag flying high shows an UnBritish, deep-seated insecurity?
Given that the Red Flag isn't a national flag, no.
What's that got to do with it?
Surely it has everything to do with it.
You CHOOSE to support a football club. You CHOOSE to agree with a political philosophy. You choose to become part of those movements and the flags are symbols of the identity of the group that you have chosen to join.
You don't choose you nationality. It's an accident of fate. Which is why I've never understood how someone can have pride in their nationality.
-
River Don didn't stipulate national flags. He said he always thought there was something deeply unBritish about flying flags.
Your last paragraph doesn't surprise me in the least. I can't imagine you being capable of showing pride in your country under any circumstance, even though you excel in your obsession with being ashamed of it.
Now, if you were German.........
-
BB
In your rush to trot out another nasty little dig, dragging another intelligent discussion into the gutter, you have totally misunderstood a simple sentence.
I explicitly said earlier that I am extremely proud of many things that Britain has done and stood for. That's a different thing from being proud of my nationality. I'm sure you'll see the difference when the bile level drops a tad.
-
Try again......
River Don didn't stipulate national flags. He said he always thought there was something deeply unBritish about flying flags.
-
My bad, I wasn't precise enough. I accept that.
If it will help the debate, I did mean national flags.
-
The other odd thing about this move to have the flag flying 24/7 from Govt buildings. When asked why he supported it, a backwoodsman, Brexit supporting Tory MP said "Because they do it in France and Germany."
Well the French, Germans, Italians, Dutch, Belgians and such have all been invaded in the relatively recent past. So I suppose there is an urge to proclaim themselves as being in charge. Where as the British haven't really been invaded since William the bas**rd was riding around salting Yorkshire.
And the Americans still can't yet get over that they beat the redcoats, so they still need to hang up flags.
Off topic but quite fascinating. Did you know during the American war of independence the British encouraged slaves to escape and join them against the American colonists with the promise of freedom. At that time the Americans were still fighting for the right to own slaves. I wonder how many black Americans are aware of that when they celebrate Independence Day?
-
UnBritish, deep-seated insecurity? Do you mean like in the way the Labour party likes to sing about keeping the Red flag flying high?
The red flag being the symbol of the ordinary people taking control away from the entitled elite in the French Revolution of course.
The song was written by a chap named Jim Connell after watching a guard wave a train off apparently and refrences working class struggle for their rights in the 19th century, something he participated in. What exactly about it is un-British?
-
I don't have a problem with flags flying from government and civic buildings, we have always done this for special ocassions. Thing is if they are flying all the time how are you going to mark the Queen's Birthday, St George's Day etc - not fly them?
What I do have a problem with is the government ordering this. Just another step on the road to full fascism.
-
I don't have a problem with flags flying from government and civic buildings, we have always done this for special ocassions. Thing is if they are flying all the time how are you going to mark the Queen's Birthday, St George's Day etc - not fly them?
What I do have a problem with is the government ordering this. Just another step on the road to full fascism.
I think they are allowed to fly two flags on occasions like your example, the Royal Standard and St Georges Cross cover your examples
-
Getting rid of 'undesirable characteristics' ain't half going to cut down Millwall's fanbase.
This one didn't gain any traction first time around so I think it's worth a bump just in case Axholme missed it.
-
Getting rid of 'undesirable characteristics' ain't half going to cut down Millwall's fanbase.
This one didn't gain any traction first time around so I think it's worth a bump just in case Axholme missed it.
I did see it and had a chuckle to myself.
-
Making the EU flag could be a good thing to get into like football shirts when a country drops a star off the flag every year.
-
And just a plain old white one would be about right for the Labour party and the Liberals
-
what would a tory flag be ...... solid black maybe a black dot for every unecessary death?
-
what would a tory flag be ...... solid black maybe a black dot for every unecessary death?
That flag would be massive!
-
and ironically a bit like the isis flag
-
what would a tory flag be ...... solid black maybe a black dot for every unecessary death?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jolly_Roger#/media/File:Jolly-roger.svg
-
that's the one Glyn.
We are represented by 'men of integrity' .................
-
Your showing your spots of weakness now boys.
-
what would a tory flag be ...... solid black maybe a black dot for every unecessary death?
That flag would be massive!
Whereas Labour would have handle things sooooooooo much better. We would have been signed up to the EU vaccine programme and Diane Abbott would be reassuring us that 100 vaccine doses procured would be plenty to save the whole country. All over eighties would be vaccinated by Christmas 2022 but only after all BAME had had two doses. :)
-
Fascinating how certain people fixate on Diane Abbott's perceived failings.
Almost as if...
-
what would a tory flag be ...... solid black maybe a black dot for every unecessary death?
That flag would be massive!
Whereas Labour would have handle things sooooooooo much better. We would have been signed up to the EU vaccine programme and Diane Abbott would be reassuring us that 100 vaccine doses procured would be plenty to save the whole country. All over eighties would be vaccinated by Christmas 2022 but only after all BAME had had two doses. :)
Right wingers seem obsessed with Diane Abbott. You don't find people on the opposite side obsessing when Priti Patel said we'd done "three hundred thousand and thirty four nine hundred and seventy four thousand tests".
-
Fascinating how certain people fixate on Diane Abbott's perceived failings.
Almost as if...
...she can't count?
-
what would a tory flag be ...... solid black maybe a black dot for every unecessary death?
That flag would be massive!
Whereas Labour would have handle things sooooooooo much better. We would have been signed up to the EU vaccine programme and Diane Abbott would be reassuring us that 100 vaccine doses procured would be plenty to save the whole country. All over eighties would be vaccinated by Christmas 2022 but only after all BAME had had two doses. :)
Right wingers seem obsessed with Diane Abbott. You don't find people on the opposite side obsessing when Priti Patel said we'd done "three hundred thousand and thirty four nine hundred and seventy four thousand tests".
If you don't like Labour she's an open goal for a laugh. A bit like that SNP goon at Westminster, another mug.
-
what would a tory flag be ...... solid black maybe a black dot for every unecessary death?
That flag would be massive!
Whereas Labour would have handle things sooooooooo much better. We would have been signed up to the EU vaccine programme and Diane Abbott would be reassuring us that 100 vaccine doses procured would be plenty to save the whole country. All over eighties would be vaccinated by Christmas 2022 but only after all BAME had had two doses. :)
Finally, you admit that the Tories have f**ked up and should have done things differently and things should be better :aok:
-
what would a tory flag be ...... solid black maybe a black dot for every unecessary death?
That flag would be massive!
Whereas Labour would have handle things sooooooooo much better. We would have been signed up to the EU vaccine programme and Diane Abbott would be reassuring us that 100 vaccine doses procured would be plenty to save the whole country. All over eighties would be vaccinated by Christmas 2022 but only after all BAME had had two doses. :)
Finally, you admit that the Tories have f**ked up and should have done things differently and things should be better :aok:
Of course they have. I dare say virtually every government in the world has cocked up to some degree as they were dealing with the unknown. I reckon they've still done better than the EU though.
-
what would a tory flag be ...... solid black maybe a black dot for every unecessary death?
That flag would be massive!
Whereas Labour would have handle things sooooooooo much better. We would have been signed up to the EU vaccine programme and Diane Abbott would be reassuring us that 100 vaccine doses procured would be plenty to save the whole country. All over eighties would be vaccinated by Christmas 2022 but only after all BAME had had two doses. :)
Finally, you admit that the Tories have f**ked up and should have done things differently and things should be better :aok:
Of course they have. I dare say virtually every government in the world has cocked up to some degree as they were dealing with the unknown. I reckon they've still done better than the EU though.
Stopping flights or testing people incoming to the country could easily have been improved and wasn't rocket science.
-
what would a tory flag be ...... solid black maybe a black dot for every unecessary death?
That flag would be massive!
Whereas Labour would have handle things sooooooooo much better. We would have been signed up to the EU vaccine programme and Diane Abbott would be reassuring us that 100 vaccine doses procured would be plenty to save the whole country. All over eighties would be vaccinated by Christmas 2022 but only after all BAME had had two doses. :)
Finally, you admit that the Tories have f**ked up and should have done things differently and things should be better :aok:
Of course they have. I dare say virtually every government in the world has cocked up to some degree as they were dealing with the unknown. I reckon they've still done better than the EU though.
Stopping flights or testing people incoming to the country could easily have been improved and wasn't rocket science.
Correct. I would have shut the doors over a year ago and they wouldn't be opening again for another two years minimum.
-
Here's Liz Truss wondering which other flags she can bring into one photo
-
Here's Liz Truss wondering which other flags she can bring into one photo
Or showing respect to another nation we may want to do business with.
-
Does anyone really care? I don't really see the need for the flag but I don't care if it's there either?
-
If Scotland decides to leave it will have to change anyway.
-
If Scotland decides to leave it will have to change anyway.
No it won't. Whatever they do has no effect on the historical significance of our flag. Will Australia, New Zealand and Fiji be changing their flag?
The Scots will be going nowhere. The SNP do not represent or speak for all Scots, there are just a bunch of mega mouths who hate the English and are in love with the sound of their own aggressive voices. Can you imagine Scotland on it's own managing with their share of the current national debt?
-
If I conducted a poll amongst the handful of Scots I know regarding their support for Jimmy Krankie she would get zero votes.
-
If Scotland decides to leave it will have to change anyway.
No it won't. Whatever they do has no effect on the historical significance of our flag. Will Australia, New Zealand and Fiji be changing their flag?
The Scots will be going nowhere. The SNP do not represent or speak for all Scots, there are just a bunch of mega mouths who hate the English and are in love with the sound of their own aggressive voices. Can you imagine Scotland on it's own managing with their share of the current national debt?
I don't think ''they'' hate the english they just want independence, would you want england to be governed by wales or scotland?
-
If Scotland decides to leave it will have to change anyway.
No it won't. Whatever they do has no effect on the historical significance of our flag. Will Australia, New Zealand and Fiji be changing their flag?
The Scots will be going nowhere. The SNP do not represent or speak for all Scots, there are just a bunch of mega mouths who hate the English and are in love with the sound of their own aggressive voices. Can you imagine Scotland on it's own managing with their share of the current national debt?
I don't think ''they'' hate the english they just want independence, would you want england to be governed by wales or scotland?
Totally wrong, in some cases it's actually the opposite. Look at the student finance policies for starters.
I had the pleasure of being an English kid growing up in Scotland...
-
totally or some?
-
Vast majority.
-
I agree not all independance minded scots would not hate the English but the vast majority? wouldn't they hate the like of the the tories that won't support a second vote? and apologies to question the veracity of your claim, but can you support this bfyp?
-
If Scotland decides to leave it will have to change anyway.
No it won't. Whatever they do has no effect on the historical significance of our flag. Will Australia, New Zealand and Fiji be changing their flag?
The Scots will be going nowhere. The SNP do not represent or speak for all Scots, there are just a bunch of mega mouths who hate the English and are in love with the sound of their own aggressive voices. Can you imagine Scotland on it's own managing with their share of the current national debt?
I don't think ''they'' hate the english they just want independence, would you want england to be governed by wales or scotland?
The Scots don't hate the English, the SNP do.
Scotland is NOT governed by England, it is part of the United Kingdom where everyone has an equal vote. In fact the Scots have more independance than the English. The Scots can vote in the Scottish parliament and also in the British parliament on matters which affect the English. There is no English parliament or government. Maybe England should be independant and let them see how they go?
-
It'd get rid of the Northern Irish too if we went independent. They're more trouble than they're worth.
-
It'd get rid of the Northern Irish too if we went independent. They're more trouble than they're worth.
Christ almighty that would end badly!
-
If Scotland decides to leave it will have to change anyway.
No it won't. Whatever they do has no effect on the historical significance of our flag. Will Australia, New Zealand and Fiji be changing their flag?
The Scots will be going nowhere. The SNP do not represent or speak for all Scots, there are just a bunch of mega mouths who hate the English and are in love with the sound of their own aggressive voices. Can you imagine Scotland on it's own managing with their share of the current national debt?
I don't think ''they'' hate the english they just want independence, would you want england to be governed by wales or scotland?
The Scots don't hate the English, the SNP do.
Scotland is NOT governed by England, it is part of the United Kingdom where everyone has an equal vote. In fact the Scots have more independance than the English. The Scots can vote in the Scottish parliament and also in the British parliament on matters which affect the English. There is no English parliament or government. Maybe England should be independant and let them see how they go?
How come they are prevented from voting on their own independence by a parliament based in london?
-
If Scotland decides to leave it will have to change anyway.
No it won't. Whatever they do has no effect on the historical significance of our flag. Will Australia, New Zealand and Fiji be changing their flag?
The Scots will be going nowhere. The SNP do not represent or speak for all Scots, there are just a bunch of mega mouths who hate the English and are in love with the sound of their own aggressive voices. Can you imagine Scotland on it's own managing with their share of the current national debt?
I don't think ''they'' hate the english they just want independence, would you want england to be governed by wales or scotland?
The Scots don't hate the English, the SNP do.
Scotland is NOT governed by England, it is part of the United Kingdom where everyone has an equal vote. In fact the Scots have more independance than the English. The Scots can vote in the Scottish parliament and also in the British parliament on matters which affect the English. There is no English parliament or government. Maybe England should be independant and let them see how they go?
How come they are prevented from voting on their own independence by a parliament based in london?
They aren't, they had it and voted to stay in the UK, you can't keep having a referendum until you get the answer you want.
The SNP line is inconsistent. They want to leave the UK because they want more control then rejoin the EU and give away that control. They want more control over finance but have no idea quite how Scotland can finance itself. They wouldn't even be allowed to join the EU given the size of deficit and independent Scotland would run.
As for my experiences on Scottish people. I grew up in Scotland, spent a lot of time there since, worked there and the vast majority of my family is from Scotland, so I'm quite close to things that occur up there. I do like it up there, but I find the anti English sentiment has grown, the SNP is fostering that, they've created a mini cult.
-
It'd get rid of the Northern Irish too if we went independent. They're more trouble than they're worth.
Isn’t that a racist comment?
-
Not surprising when this was unofficially added to the National Anthem in mid 17 hundreds. Bet they loved that
Lord, grant that Marshal Wade
May by thy mighty aid
Victory bring.
May he sedition hush and like a torrent rush,
Rebellious Scots to crush.
God save the King.
I have many friends and in laws Scottish by birth or descent and met many through working up there and like/liked them all . If they want to leave let them go
-
If Scotland decides to leave it will have to change anyway.
No it won't. Whatever they do has no effect on the historical significance of our flag. Will Australia, New Zealand and Fiji be changing their flag?
The Scots will be going nowhere. The SNP do not represent or speak for all Scots, there are just a bunch of mega mouths who hate the English and are in love with the sound of their own aggressive voices. Can you imagine Scotland on it's own managing with their share of the current national debt?
I don't think ''they'' hate the english they just want independence, would you want england to be governed by wales or scotland?
The Scots don't hate the English, the SNP do.
Scotland is NOT governed by England, it is part of the United Kingdom where everyone has an equal vote. In fact the Scots have more independance than the English. The Scots can vote in the Scottish parliament and also in the British parliament on matters which affect the English. There is no English parliament or government. Maybe England should be independant and let them see how they go?
How come they are prevented from voting on their own independence by a parliament based in london?
Is that the parliament that they have 48 MPs in?
-
Would they prefer to have 100% of representatives in their own parliament?
-
It'd get rid of the Northern Irish too if we went independent. They're more trouble than they're worth.
Isn’t that a racist comment?
No, it's a political comment.
-
Would they prefer to have 100% of representatives in their own parliament?
So would i but being English we do not have our own parliament, only the British parliament which the Scots vote in.
They are winners all ways up as they are. How much of the British national debt would they be taking with them if they leave i wonder?
-
We're going around in circles, maybe the oil off scotland would have paid off their portion. Where would you rather be inscotland or wales governed by a bunch of rich plonkers or in your own country with self rule?
-
We're going around in circles, maybe the oil off scotland would have paid off their portion. Where would you rather be inscotland or wales governed by a bunch of rich plonkers or in your own country with self rule?
So it's their oil but our debt?
They're part of the UK and ruled by democratically elected 'rich plonkers' but if they go it alone will be run by who , Mao Tse Sturgeon?
-
We're going around in circles, maybe the oil off scotland would have paid off their portion. Where would you rather be inscotland or wales governed by a bunch of rich plonkers or in your own country with self rule?
So it's their oil but our debt?
They're part of the UK and ruled by democratically elected 'rich plonkers' but if they go it alone will be run by who , Mao Tse Sturgeon?
Ain't democracy a bitch?
-
We're going around in circles, maybe the oil off scotland would have paid off their portion. Where would you rather be inscotland or wales governed by a bunch of rich plonkers or in your own country with self rule?
So it's their oil but our debt?
They're part of the UK and ruled by democratically elected 'rich plonkers' but if they go it alone will be run by who , Mao Tse Sturgeon?
Ain't democracy a bitch?
A lot of Scots would say so if that's what they end up.
-
We're going around in circles, maybe the oil off scotland would have paid off their portion. Where would you rather be inscotland or wales governed by a bunch of rich plonkers or in your own country with self rule?
So it's their oil but our debt?
They're part of the UK and ruled by democratically elected 'rich plonkers' but if they go it alone will be run by who , Mao Tse Sturgeon?
Ain't democracy a bitch?
A lot of Scots would say so if that's what they end up.
If it's what they end up with it must be what they want. Democracy's still a bitch, eh?
-
At least we can have confidence in the fact that at least they consult with learned people before publishing important reports like the one into racism, which of course there isn't any ...https://twitter.com/blackpoppies14/status/1377522299570638848?s=19
-
We're going around in circles, maybe the oil off scotland would have paid off their portion. Where would you rather be inscotland or wales governed by a bunch of rich plonkers or in your own country with self rule?
So it's their oil but our debt?
They're part of the UK and ruled by democratically elected 'rich plonkers' but if they go it alone will be run by who , Mao Tse Sturgeon?
Ain't democracy a bitch?
A lot of Scots would say so if that's what they end up.
If it's what they end up with it must be what they want. Democracy's still a bitch, eh?
As long as we don't end up paying for it.
-
We're going around in circles, maybe the oil off scotland would have paid off their portion. Where would you rather be inscotland or wales governed by a bunch of rich plonkers or in your own country with self rule?
So it's their oil but our debt?
They're part of the UK and ruled by democratically elected 'rich plonkers' but if they go it alone will be run by who , Mao Tse Sturgeon?
Ain't democracy a bitch?
A lot of Scots would say so if that's what they end up.
If it's what they end up with it must be what they want. Democracy's still a bitch, eh?
As long as we don't end up paying for it.
I thought we'd been paying for Scotland for years. I'm amazed you don't want them to bugger off.