Viking Supporters Co-operative
Viking Chat => Off Topic => Topic started by: normal rules on July 20, 2021, 07:49:03 am
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No , not the fastest swim over La Manche.
Yesterday, a record 430 migrants successfully made the crossing in dinghies.
They need to get Guinness down there and start handing out medals.
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Oh well balanced by the numbers that have left over the last year I guess
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TBF - there is a shortage of workers in some industries.....
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If they've been caught they've hardly been successful, I'd have thought.
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Completely disgusting how the RNLI are being used to ferry these economic migrants across from a safe country .
Wonder how this affects the RNLI response times for genuine people in distress .
Hopefully tge economic migrants get sent back ASAP to the first safe country they landed in .
Then if they still want to come to the UK, they can apply through the proper channels .
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Britons may be economic migrants in the longer term.
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Completely disgusting how the RNLI are being used to ferry these economic migrants across from a safe country .
Wonder how this affects the RNLI response times for genuine people in distress .
Hopefully tge economic migrants get sent back ASAP to the first safe country they landed in .
Then if they still want to come to the UK, they can apply through the proper channels .
The fact is, once they have got here they are pretty safe currently from deportation. The Home Office cannot just deport people. It’s so much more complex than that. The uk can only deport by force to host countries if they accept to take them and they are willing to go. For countries like Iraq, Iran, Eritrea etc, this is simply not the case.
I see today there is news that the uk govt are considering jail terms of up to 4 years for illegal entrants like this.
Good luck with that.
We cannot get burglars and violent criminals locked up as it is.
No where near enough prisons. The ones we have are full to busting as it is.
Plus once they have done time, where do they go then? We still have the difficulty of deportation to hostile countries who we have no memorandum of understanding with.
We have a substantial Royal Navy fleet currently steaming around the Black Sea causing international tension, yet they would be much better employed a bit nearer to home.
I fail to see why we are not using our naval assets to protect our border. There are considerable naval assets along the south coast, perfectly situated to patrol the channel.
I can only surmise the uk govt are accepting these numbers as part of their risk management of this whole situation.
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Completely disgusting how the RNLI are being used to ferry these economic migrants across from a safe country .
Wonder how this affects the RNLI response times for genuine people in distress .
Hopefully tge economic migrants get sent back ASAP to the first safe country they landed in .
Then if they still want to come to the UK, they can apply through the proper channels .
The fact is, once they have got here they are pretty safe currently from deportation. The Home Office cannot just deport people. It’s so much more complex than that. The uk can only deport by force to host countries if they accept to take them and they are willing to go. For countries like Iraq, Iran, Eritrea etc, this is simply not the case.
I see today there is news that the uk govt are considering jail terms of up to 4 years for illegal entrants like this.
Good luck with that.
We cannot get burglars and violent criminals locked up as it is.
No where near enough prisons. The ones we have are full to busting as it is.
Plus once they have done time, where do they go then? We still have the difficulty of deportation to hostile countries who we have no memorandum of understanding with.
We have a substantial Royal Navy fleet currently steaming around the Black Sea causing international tension, yet they would be much better employed a bit nearer to home.
I fail to see why we are not using our naval assets to protect our border. There are considerable naval assets along the south coast, perfectly situated to patrol the channel.
I can only surmise the uk govt are accepting these numbers as part of their risk management of this whole situation.
Makes me think they want the migrants.
Perhaps to underpin our economy in someway, the country needs lower rung workers for the whole system to function .
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Completely disgusting how the RNLI are being used to ferry these economic migrants across from a safe country .
Wonder how this affects the RNLI response times for genuine people in distress .
Hopefully tge economic migrants get sent back ASAP to the first safe country they landed in .
Then if they still want to come to the UK, they can apply through the proper channels .
The fact is, once they have got here they are pretty safe currently from deportation. The Home Office cannot just deport people. It’s so much more complex than that. The uk can only deport by force to host countries if they accept to take them and they are willing to go. For countries like Iraq, Iran, Eritrea etc, this is simply not the case.
I see today there is news that the uk govt are considering jail terms of up to 4 years for illegal entrants like this.
Good luck with that.
We cannot get burglars and violent criminals locked up as it is.
No where near enough prisons. The ones we have are full to busting as it is.
Plus once they have done time, where do they go then? We still have the difficulty of deportation to hostile countries who we have no memorandum of understanding with.
We have a substantial Royal Navy fleet currently steaming around the Black Sea causing international tension, yet they would be much better employed a bit nearer to home.
I fail to see why we are not using our naval assets to protect our border. There are considerable naval assets along the south coast, perfectly situated to patrol the channel.
I can only surmise the uk govt are accepting these numbers as part of their risk management of this whole situation.
Makes me think they want the migrants.
Perhaps to underpin our economy in someway, the country needs lower rung workers for the whole system to function .
Or maybe businesses should pay a decent wage so our own people can do the work?
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Completely disgusting how the RNLI are being used to ferry these economic migrants across from a safe country .
Wonder how this affects the RNLI response times for genuine people in distress .
Hopefully tge economic migrants get sent back ASAP to the first safe country they landed in .
Then if they still want to come to the UK, they can apply through the proper channels .
The fact is, once they have got here they are pretty safe currently from deportation. The Home Office cannot just deport people. It’s so much more complex than that. The uk can only deport by force to host countries if they accept to take them and they are willing to go. For countries like Iraq, Iran, Eritrea etc, this is simply not the case.
I see today there is news that the uk govt are considering jail terms of up to 4 years for illegal entrants like this.
Good luck with that.
We cannot get burglars and violent criminals locked up as it is.
No where near enough prisons. The ones we have are full to busting as it is.
Plus once they have done time, where do they go then? We still have the difficulty of deportation to hostile countries who we have no memorandum of understanding with.
We have a substantial Royal Navy fleet currently steaming around the Black Sea causing international tension, yet they would be much better employed a bit nearer to home.
I fail to see why we are not using our naval assets to protect our border. There are considerable naval assets along the south coast, perfectly situated to patrol the channel.
I can only surmise the uk govt are accepting these numbers as part of their risk management of this whole situation.
What's the point in paying for navy which doesn't protect us from foreign invaders?
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Reports that hgv drivers are being offered double their normal wage to drive due to shortages in the haulage industry.
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Taking back control seems to be working out well then.
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Let's secure our borders, oh how the gullible were lead
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52% of the voting nation were gullible fools. And it’s not even a word in the dictionary.
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Taking back control seems to be working out well then.
Well if that means businesses need to pay higher wages to retain staff then yes it is a good result. Or would you prefer we all were paid the minimum wage?
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Is that what you are Syd, couldn't hack it here so buggered off to poor old Australia, I make no wonder they are not keen on Poms.
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Is that what you are Syd, couldn't hack it here so buggered off to poor old Australia, I make no wonder they are not keen on Poms.
I can't think why he's so bothered about what happens over here seen as he has bailed out and done a runner. Maybe take more of an interest in the politics of Oz.
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Taking back control seems to be working out well then.
Well if that means businesses need to pay higher wages to retain staff then yes it is a good result. Or would you prefer we all were paid the minimum wage?
When you can explain how businesses paying higher wages makes our borders more secure you might have a point.
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Is that what you are Syd, couldn't hack it here so buggered off to poor old Australia, I make no wonder they are not keen on Poms.
I can't think why he's so bothered about what happens over here seen as he has bailed out and done a runner. Maybe take more of an interest in the politics of Oz.
You pissed off from London so presumably you don't give a bugger about Millwall any more. The same principle applies, if you're daft enough to believe it.
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52% of the voting nation were gullible fools. And it’s not even a word in the dictionary.
Correction 52% of those that voted.
Strange it is in the Collins and Cambridge dictionary bit more research needed there Belton or do you only use the Oxford one?
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Is that what you are Syd, couldn't hack it here so buggered off to poor old Australia, I make no wonder they are not keen on Poms.
I can't think why he's so bothered about what happens over here seen as he has bailed out and done a runner. Maybe take more of an interest in the politics of Oz.
You pissed off from London so presumably you don't give a bugger about Millwall any more. The same principle applies, if you're daft enough to believe it.
the 2011 census shows everybody had pi$$ed off From London :headbang:
quote from 2011 : - " London has become the first region where white British people have become a minority.
Some 45% (3.7 million) of people in the capital described themselves as white British, down from 58% (4.3 million) in 2001."
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-20677515
so what will the 2021 figure be ???
as For Wiltshire man the naked truth is it's even worse ..... he pi$$ed off to support another "CLUB"
update akinfenwas geography is better than mine !! always thought that was wiltshire
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52% of the voting nation were gullible fools. And it’s not even a word in the dictionary.
Correction 52% of those that voted.
Strange it is in the Collins and Cambridge dictionary bit more research needed there Belton or do you only use the Oxford one?
So you actually checked to see if gullible was in the dictionary?
And I said the voting nation, not the nation.
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Is that what you are Syd, couldn't hack it here so buggered off to poor old Australia, I make no wonder they are not keen on Poms.
I can't think why he's so bothered about what happens over here seen as he has bailed out and done a runner. Maybe take more of an interest in the politics of Oz.
You pissed off from London so presumably you don't give a bugger about Millwall any more. The same principle applies, if you're daft enough to believe it.
How on earth is moving cities/towns in the same country the same as moving from one side of the world to the other?
The only way such a comparison could be made is if Axholme was constantly moaning about how shit his life is in London despite not having a life in London.
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Is that what you are Syd, couldn't hack it here so buggered off to poor old Australia, I make no wonder they are not keen on Poms.
I can't think why he's so bothered about what happens over here seen as he has bailed out and done a runner. Maybe take more of an interest in the politics of Oz.
You pissed off from London so presumably you don't give a bugger about Millwall any more. The same principle applies, if you're daft enough to believe it.
How on earth is moving cities/towns in the same country the same as moving from one side of the world to the other?
The only way such a comparison could be made is if Axholme was constantly moaning about how shit his life is in London despite not having a life in London.
If you run away from somewhere, it doesn't matter how far or how many borders you cross, the principle AL is espousing is that you shouldn't be allowed to have any opinion on what you've run away from.
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Is that what you are Syd, couldn't hack it here so buggered off to poor old Australia, I make no wonder they are not keen on Poms.
I can't think why he's so bothered about what happens over here seen as he has bailed out and done a runner. Maybe take more of an interest in the politics of Oz.
You pissed off from London so presumably you don't give a bugger about Millwall any more. The same principle applies, if you're daft enough to believe it.
the 2011 census shows everybody had pi$$ed off From London :headbang:
quote from 2011 : - " London has become the first region where white British people have become a minority.
Some 45% (3.7 million) of people in the capital described themselves as white British, down from 58% (4.3 million) in 2001."
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-20677515
so what will the 2021 figure be ???
as For Wiltshire man the naked truth is it's even worse ..... he pi$$ed off to support another "CLUB"
update akinfenwas geography is better than mine !! always thought that was wiltshire
The Cerne Abbas Giant is in Dorset.
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So going back to the navy thing.
If the navy boats intercepted the dinghies what could they do?
Can they tow them back to France.
If they pick up the migrants they have to bring them to the UK.
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It’s a fair general point, Glyn, but the not supporting your home team comparison is a silly one. f**k me - I’d have to support Scunny!
I think if Axholme was on a local (to Millwall) forum obnoxiously arguing with and antagonising those who still lived in that area, then they would have every right to call him a Kitson.
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Completely disgusting how the RNLI are being used to ferry these economic migrants across from a safe country .
Wonder how this affects the RNLI response times for genuine people in distress .
Hopefully tge economic migrants get sent back ASAP to the first safe country they landed in .
Then if they still want to come to the UK, they can apply through the proper channels .
If they are economic migrants they can be deported back to their home country.
If they are refugees fleeing persecution they can go to any country they wish to seek asylum. As covered by International Law and the Geneva Convention, to which the UK is a signatory and a permanment member of the security council responsible for ensuring countries upholding that convention.
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Completely disgusting how the RNLI are being used to ferry these economic migrants across from a safe country .
Wonder how this affects the RNLI response times for genuine people in distress .
Hopefully tge economic migrants get sent back ASAP to the first safe country they landed in .
Then if they still want to come to the UK, they can apply through the proper channels .
If they are economic migrants they can be deported back to their home country.
If they are refugees fleeing persecution they can go to any country they wish to seek asylum. As covered by International Law and the Geneva Convention, to which the UK is a signatory and a permanment member of the security council responsible for ensuring countries upholding that convention.
I wouldn’t think it would be easy to find out which type they are when shouting down to their dinghy from a navy boat.
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52% of the voting nation were gullible fools. And it’s not even a word in the dictionary.
Correction 52% of those that voted.
Strange it is in the Collins and Cambridge dictionary bit more research needed there Belton or do you only use the Oxford one?
So you actually checked to see if gullible was in the dictionary?
And I said the voting nation, not the nation.
No I knew it was a correct word unlike some
No comment re your 52% then no just choose to ignore that one
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I don’t know what you mean, Raven. What have I ignored?
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Is that what you are Syd, couldn't hack it here so buggered off to poor old Australia, I make no wonder they are not keen on Poms.
did you get belton to help you with this sentence selby?
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I saw this written on the side of a bus if anyone is interested ...............
''The UK taxpayer is to hand over a further €62.7m (£55m) to France to fund another clampdown on small-boat crossings of the Channel, the Home Office has revealed.
The home secretary, Priti Patel, agreed to pay the sum as part of a deal reached with the French interior minister, Gérald Darmanin, on Tuesday.
At least 430 people crossed the Dover Strait on Monday, a record for a single day''
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2021/jul/20/uk-french-border-patrols-migrant-clampdown-priti-patel
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It’s a fair general point, Glyn, but the not supporting your home team comparison is a silly one. f**k me - I’d have to support Scunny!
I think if Axholme was on a local (to Millwall) forum obnoxiously arguing with and antagonising those who still lived in that area, then they would have every right to call him a Kitson.
I'm not from London. I support Millwall through choice and through some people i used to know way back. Got a lot of family history around Axholme going back a long, long time.
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It’s a fair general point, Glyn, but the not supporting your home team comparison is a silly one. f**k me - I’d have to support Scunny!
I think if Axholme was on a local (to Millwall) forum obnoxiously arguing with and antagonising those who still lived in that area, then they would have every right to call him a Kitson.
I'm not from London. I support Millwall through choice and through some people i used to know way back. Got a lot of family history around Axholme going back a long, long time.
Dutch then
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It’s a very odd conversation this. I’ve been in London for over 40 years yet I still take an interest in all things Donny. I still miss Donny and every so often it crosses my mind to come home, but I haven’t managed it yet!
Something does need to be done about illegal immigration. What that is, I don’t know though. However we look at it, we need the help of the French and they’re not exactly keen to do anything for us are they?
I’ve seen for myself just how immigration has changed whole districts. Parts of Newham in London are 70-80% made up of Asian or North African immigrants I’d estimate. 20-25 years ago these same areas were virtually made up of white, working class people. This change in population demographics in a relatively short space of time has caused the areas to alter significantly. Churches become mosques, butchers become halal etc. Meanwhile, much of the white population move out to Essex. Also, because there are so many nationalities living in a comparatively small area, it’s very difficult to build any community structure. Last year I was working in Barking and in one street I’d say there were around 10 different nationalities living side by side who never meet or communicate together. However, from my experience, virtually all of the 1st generation immigrants who I’ve worked with over the years are bloody hard workers who aren’t afraid of serious graft. Plus, they all pay taxes and prop up local economies. They contribute so much to the country that many people don’t know, or care, about.
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Good post HA, here too in Oz there is a rapid and continuing change in the population but driven by immigration. How the UK deals with this problem that appears to be more political than actual is indeed a bit of a poser. I say political because the numbers arriving represent a very small fraction of a single percentage point of the population, but causes it so much angst within it. It's extremely difficult not to address the subject without mentioning the dreaded politics of it and deal with it solely on a humanitarian basis. Learning quite recently that the tory party have a paid advisor to stir up racial hate for votes is disappointing but not wholly unexpected.
To stop all refugees coming to the UK one would surely have to try and address the problems that drive them on this dangerous journey. Britain's hand in war and selling arms around the world does nothing to help this along with many other countries I will add. Reducing aid to poor countries will certainly not help either. But to return to an earlier point ..... is it really the problem it is made out to be? if 20.000 refugees landed every year for 30 years it would still not represent 1% of the population.
I have more to say but am happy to give others a chance to add their bit.
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Good post HA, here too in Oz there is a rapid and continuing change in the population but driven by immigration. How the UK deals with this problem that appears to be more political than actual is indeed a bit of a poser. I say political because the numbers arriving represent a very small fraction of a single percentage point of the population, but causes it so much angst within it. It's extremely difficult not to address the subject without mentioning the dreaded politics of it and deal with it solely on a humanitarian basis. Learning quite recently that the tory party have a paid advisor to stir up racial hate for votes is disappointing but not wholly unexpected.
To stop all refugees coming to the UK one would surely have to try and address the problems that drive them on this dangerous journey. Britain's hand in war and selling arms around the world does nothing to help this along with many other countries I will add. Reducing aid to poor countries will certainly not help either. But to return to an earlier point ..... is it really the problem it is made out to be? if 20.000 refugees landed every year for 30 years it would still not represent 1% of the population.
I have more to say but am happy to give others a chance to add their bit.
If twenty thousand refugees landed every year how many offspring will they have added to our population over thirty years. This is the point, it's not the few hundred now, it's the thousands that they will no doubt breed. :headbang:
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It’s a fair general point, Glyn, but the not supporting your home team comparison is a silly one. f**k me - I’d have to support Scunny!
I think if Axholme was on a local (to Millwall) forum obnoxiously arguing with and antagonising those who still lived in that area, then they would have every right to call him a Kitson.
I'm not from London. I support Millwall through choice and through some people i used to know way back. Got a lot of family history around Axholme going back a long, long time.
Dutch then
Some of the family tree predates Vermuyden's vandalism.
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The refugee ''problem'' in Oz ................... it's political, the right + far right fuel the media and the media do their job for them, far more 'illegals' arrive here by plane than by boat and just overstay their visas and a lot apply for refugee status. There is a humanitarian aspect that has damaged labor by some of their supporters going to the greens but the vote gets back to labor via the voting system. If labor show signs of weakness towards refugees the far right media which is the larger slice go viral and labor have to back off.
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It’s a fair general point, Glyn, but the not supporting your home team comparison is a silly one. f**k me - I’d have to support Scunny!
I think if Axholme was on a local (to Millwall) forum obnoxiously arguing with and antagonising those who still lived in that area, then they would have every right to call him a Kitson.
I'm not from London. I support Millwall through choice and through some people i used to know way back. Got a lot of family history around Axholme going back a long, long time.
Dutch then
Some of the family tree predates Vermuyden's vandalism.
he was a bl00dy migrant could say the very first case of "brain drain"
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It’s a fair general point, Glyn, but the not supporting your home team comparison is a silly one. f**k me - I’d have to support Scunny!
I think if Axholme was on a local (to Millwall) forum obnoxiously arguing with and antagonising those who still lived in that area, then they would have every right to call him a Kitson.
I'm not from London. I support Millwall through choice and through some people i used to know way back. Got a lot of family history around Axholme going back a long, long time.
Dutch then
Some of the family tree predates Vermuyden's vandalism.
he was a bl00dy migrant could say the very first case of "brain drain"
I think I am correct in saying he was invited over here though.
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Coming over here, taking control of our isle…
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I wonder who was the first to take him up the isle…..
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Coming over here, taking control of our isle…
Too right. It would be great if we still had to bob about between the villages in little boats. I'll wait for the global warming and buy one for when i need to nip over to Epworth.
Or maybe buy an Amphicar?
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Reports that hgv drivers are being offered double their normal wage to drive due to shortages in the haulage industry.
I can vouch for that NR.
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Is that what you are Syd, couldn't hack it here so buggered off to poor old Australia, I make no wonder they are not keen on Poms.
I can't think why he's so bothered about what happens over here seen as he has bailed out and done a runner. Maybe take more of an interest in the politics of Oz.
You pissed off from London so presumably you don't give a bugger about Millwall any more. The same principle applies, if you're daft enough to believe it.
How on earth is moving cities/towns in the same country the same as moving from one side of the world to the other?
The only way such a comparison could be made is if Axholme was constantly moaning about how shit his life is in London despite not having a life in London.
If you run away from somewhere, it doesn't matter how far or how many borders you cross, the principle AL is espousing is that you shouldn't be allowed to have any opinion on what you've run away from.
Nowhere near the same Glyn_ wigerley
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Completely disgusting how the RNLI are being used to ferry these economic migrants across from a safe country .
Wonder how this affects the RNLI response times for genuine people in distress .
Hopefully tge economic migrants get sent back ASAP to the first safe country they landed in .
Then if they still want to come to the UK, they can apply through the proper channels .
If they are economic migrants they can be deported back to their home country.
If they are refugees fleeing persecution they can go to any country they wish to seek asylum. As covered by International Law and the Geneva Convention, to which the UK is a signatory and a permanment member of the security council responsible for ensuring countries upholding that convention.
They aren't seeking asylum .
They are entering illegally.
They are required to seek asylum in the 1st safe country they enter .
We must be the 4th or 5th !
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Axholme they shouldn’t have too many offspring as they seem in the majority to be fighting age males, all with the latest phones it seems too - makes you wonder how they charge them
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Completely disgusting how the RNLI are being used to ferry these economic migrants across from a safe country .
Wonder how this affects the RNLI response times for genuine people in distress .
Hopefully tge economic migrants get sent back ASAP to the first safe country they landed in .
Then if they still want to come to the UK, they can apply through the proper channels .
If they are economic migrants they can be deported back to their home country.
If they are refugees fleeing persecution they can go to any country they wish to seek asylum. As covered by International Law and the Geneva Convention, to which the UK is a signatory and a permanment member of the security council responsible for ensuring countries upholding that convention.
They aren't seeking asylum .
They are entering illegally.
They are required to seek asylum in the 1st safe country they enter .
We must be the 4th or 5th !
I’m pretty sure that’s not true. Spreading fake news should be moderated on this forum.
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Completely disgusting how the RNLI are being used to ferry these economic migrants across from a safe country .
Wonder how this affects the RNLI response times for genuine people in distress .
Hopefully tge economic migrants get sent back ASAP to the first safe country they landed in .
Then if they still want to come to the UK, they can apply through the proper channels .
If they are economic migrants they can be deported back to their home country.
If they are refugees fleeing persecution they can go to any country they wish to seek asylum. As covered by International Law and the Geneva Convention, to which the UK is a signatory and a permanment member of the security council responsible for ensuring countries upholding that convention.
They aren't seeking asylum .
They are entering illegally.
They are required to seek asylum in the 1st safe country they enter .
We must be the 4th or 5th !
I’m pretty sure that’s not true. Spreading fake news should be moderated on this forum.
We’d need full time moderators for that.
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Axholme they shouldn’t have too many offspring as they seem in the majority to be fighting age males, all with the latest phones it seems too - makes you wonder how they charge them
They will have when they've been here a short while. Get some local girl pregnant and then they can't be split from their 'family'. Human rights, innit?
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Regarding the record number of eager immigrants successfully making the crossing into the UK in their dingies, would it be a good idea for the Rovers board to capitalise on this and have representatives based in France with an eye for footballing talent to handpick the good footballers among them before they embark and instead provide a more exclusive means of transport, strictly for destination Donny Rovers?
Worth a Punt?
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Yeah, there is nothing to say they should stay in the first safe country. That's some GB News style bullshit.
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Yeah, there is nothing to say they should stay in the first safe country. That's some GB News style bullshit.
You will be happy for them to live next door to you then, and to have any of their kids tying up the teachers at school affecting the education of our own which we have paid for?
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Yeah, there is nothing to say they should stay in the first safe country. That's some GB News style bullshit.
You will be happy for them to live next door to you then, and to have any of their kids tying up the teachers at school affecting the education of our own which we have paid for?
Yeah, I suppose so. Are you saying you don't want any asylum seekers ever in this country because of the affects, such as having to give them educations? It's pure luck where people are born, some people are unfortunately born in war torn countries, others in well off countries such as the UK, does that mean the unlucky ones don't deserve opportunities to better themselves because of invisible lines in the ground?
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Yeah, there is nothing to say they should stay in the first safe country. That's some GB News style bullshit.
You will be happy for them to live next door to you then, and to have any of their kids tying up the teachers at school affecting the education of our own which we have paid for?
Yeah, I suppose so. Are you saying you don't want any asylum seekers ever in this country because of the affects, such as having to give them educations? It's pure luck where people are born, some people are unfortunately born in war torn countries, others in well off countries such as the UK, does that mean the unlucky ones don't deserve opportunities to better themselves because of invisible lines in the ground?
We are one of the most densely populated countries in the world. Everywhere you look houses are being built destroying the countryside and wildlife habitats. You can't get a dentist without driving miles and doctor's appointments are hard to get. At what point do we say enough is enough, or do we just keep on relentlessly increasing the population? Overpopulation is IMO the number one problem facing the world today. Most other problems, such as allleged climate change are a symptom of this. Yes, i do consider myself to have been fortunate to be born British, but that doesn't mean just because we're doing ok that we have to look after the rest of the world. Maybe these people should work hard and improve their own countries rather than taking the easy option and rolling up here. Why do they all want to come here rather than go to any other country when we are constantly being told how evil and racist we are?
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Yeah, there is nothing to say they should stay in the first safe country. That's some GB News style bullshit.
You will be happy for them to live next door to you then, and to have any of their kids tying up the teachers at school affecting the education of our own which we have paid for?
Yeah, I suppose so. Are you saying you don't want any asylum seekers ever in this country because of the affects, such as having to give them educations? It's pure luck where people are born, some people are unfortunately born in war torn countries, others in well off countries such as the UK, does that mean the unlucky ones don't deserve opportunities to better themselves because of invisible lines in the ground?
We are one of the most densely populated countries in the world. Everywhere you look houses are being built destroying the countryside and wildlife habitats. You can't get a dentist without driving miles and doctor's appointments are hard to get. At what point do we say enough is enough, or do we just keep on relentlessly increasing the population? Overpopulation is IMO the number one problem facing the world today. Most other problems, such as allleged climate change are a symptom of this. Yes, i do consider myself to have been fortunate to be born British, but that doesn't mean just because we're doing ok that we have to look after the rest of the world. Maybe these people should work hard and improve their own countries rather than taking the easy option and rolling up here. Why do they all want to come here rather than go to any other country when we are constantly being told how evil and racist we are?
It's an interesting point , why indeed risk the english channel and pay even more money to traffickers when you have already landed on safe territory in France .
It's totally unacceptable that the UK taxpayer should be asked to fund their lives whilst they are detained in the UK awaiting judgment on their status .
This is a country who can't even feed its own low income population without foodbanks .
I'm not against asylum seekers for the record but it has to be strictly controlled and our waters policed far better .
Total abject failure from the government which to be honest isn't entirely unsurprising .
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Surely we must be able to find out who these traffickers are. The boats that these refugees come over on must be bought from somewhere - surely we should be able to scrutinise and monitor sales of such craft - or even make it a requirement that they must be registered.
At worst we must have the technology at our disposal to see these craft and monitor their routes. Not sure what the rules are about returning them back to where they came, but it appears that the French/ Belgium authorities aren't exactly breaking a leg to stop them embarking...
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Completely disgusting how the RNLI are being used to ferry these economic migrants across from a safe country .
Wonder how this affects the RNLI response times for genuine people in distress .
Hopefully tge economic migrants get sent back ASAP to the first safe country they landed in .
Then if they still want to come to the UK, they can apply through the proper channels .
If they are economic migrants they can be deported back to their home country.
If they are refugees fleeing persecution they can go to any country they wish to seek asylum. As covered by International Law and the Geneva Convention, to which the UK is a signatory and a permanment member of the security council responsible for ensuring countries upholding that convention.
They aren't seeking asylum .
They are entering illegally.
They are required to seek asylum in the 1st safe country they enter .
We must be the 4th or 5th !
They most certainly are not required to seek asylum in the first safe country. Stop spreading untruths!
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Yeah, there is nothing to say they should stay in the first safe country. That's some GB News style bullshit.
You will be happy for them to live next door to you then, and to have any of their kids tying up the teachers at school affecting the education of our own which we have paid for?
Yeah, I suppose so. Are you saying you don't want any asylum seekers ever in this country because of the affects, such as having to give them educations? It's pure luck where people are born, some people are unfortunately born in war torn countries, others in well off countries such as the UK, does that mean the unlucky ones don't deserve opportunities to better themselves because of invisible lines in the ground?
We are one of the most densely populated countries in the world. Everywhere you look houses are being built destroying the countryside and wildlife habitats. You can't get a dentist without driving miles and doctor's appointments are hard to get. At what point do we say enough is enough, or do we just keep on relentlessly increasing the population? Overpopulation is IMO the number one problem facing the world today. Most other problems, such as allleged climate change are a symptom of this. Yes, i do consider myself to have been fortunate to be born British, but that doesn't mean just because we're doing ok that we have to look after the rest of the world. Maybe these people should work hard and improve their own countries rather than taking the easy option and rolling up here. Why do they all want to come here rather than go to any other country when we are constantly being told how evil and racist we are?
It's an interesting point , why indeed risk the english channel and pay even more money to traffickers when you have already landed on safe territory in France .
It's totally unacceptable that the UK taxpayer should be asked to fund their lives whilst they are detained in the UK awaiting judgment on their status .
This is a country who can't even feed its own low income population without foodbanks .
I'm not against asylum seekers for the record but it has to be strictly controlled and our waters policed far better .
Total abject failure from the government which to be honest isn't entirely unsurprising .
Perhaps because the can speak English and not French?
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Yeah, there is nothing to say they should stay in the first safe country. That's some GB News style bullshit.
You will be happy for them to live next door to you then, and to have any of their kids tying up the teachers at school affecting the education of our own which we have paid for?
Yeah, I suppose so. Are you saying you don't want any asylum seekers ever in this country because of the affects, such as having to give them educations? It's pure luck where people are born, some people are unfortunately born in war torn countries, others in well off countries such as the UK, does that mean the unlucky ones don't deserve opportunities to better themselves because of invisible lines in the ground?
We are one of the most densely populated countries in the world. Everywhere you look houses are being built destroying the countryside and wildlife habitats. You can't get a dentist without driving miles and doctor's appointments are hard to get. At what point do we say enough is enough, or do we just keep on relentlessly increasing the population? Overpopulation is IMO the number one problem facing the world today. Most other problems, such as allleged climate change are a symptom of this. Yes, i do consider myself to have been fortunate to be born British, but that doesn't mean just because we're doing ok that we have to look after the rest of the world. Maybe these people should work hard and improve their own countries rather than taking the easy option and rolling up here. Why do they all want to come here rather than go to any other country when we are constantly being told how evil and racist we are?
You're very naïve if you think they can just "work hard and improve their own countries". They come here in some cases because if they don't then they could be killed. A lot of refugees hear good things about the UK, they'll occasionally have family here or find the language easier to learn. Overall we nowhere near have the largest intake percentage wise of refugees, and as part of the EU their was the Dublin Regulations which allowed us to send any refugees back to the first EU country they arrived in, we don't have that anymore.
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I might also like to add that cutting foreign aid isn't exactly helpful when it comes to economic migrants seeking asylum status .
The foreign aid sent was never the issue in my opinion and was more a case of how that aid was spent in the receiving country .
Once again we are back to controls in place that ensure foreign aid is used effectively to build country's economy's so they can prosper .
You never give a starving man a fish to satisfy his hunger , you offer him a fishing rod .
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Foreign aid was never used to help support the population of the said country. It was used for bribes and to buy votes at places such as the UN.
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Yeah, there is nothing to say they should stay in the first safe country. That's some GB News style bullshit.
You will be happy for them to live next door to you then, and to have any of their kids tying up the teachers at school affecting the education of our own which we have paid for?
Yeah, I suppose so. Are you saying you don't want any asylum seekers ever in this country because of the affects, such as having to give them educations? It's pure luck where people are born, some people are unfortunately born in war torn countries, others in well off countries such as the UK, does that mean the unlucky ones don't deserve opportunities to better themselves because of invisible lines in the ground?
We are one of the most densely populated countries in the world. Everywhere you look houses are being built destroying the countryside and wildlife habitats. You can't get a dentist without driving miles and doctor's appointments are hard to get. At what point do we say enough is enough, or do we just keep on relentlessly increasing the population? Overpopulation is IMO the number one problem facing the world today. Most other problems, such as allleged climate change are a symptom of this. Yes, i do consider myself to have been fortunate to be born British, but that doesn't mean just because we're doing ok that we have to look after the rest of the world. Maybe these people should work hard and improve their own countries rather than taking the easy option and rolling up here. Why do they all want to come here rather than go to any other country when we are constantly being told how evil and racist we are?
You're very naïve if you think they can just "work hard and improve their own countries". They come here in some cases because if they don't then they could be killed. A lot of refugees hear good things about the UK, they'll occasionally have family here or find the language easier to learn. Overall we nowhere near have the largest intake percentage wise of refugees, and as part of the EU their was the Dublin Regulations which allowed us to send any refugees back to the first EU country they arrived in, we don't have that anymore.
If they're not prepared to make an effort in their own country what makes you think they will do it here? I just don't see it as our problem. It's just not true they are the waifs and strays of the world looking for a safe haven. Why do we see loads of fit and healthy young men? Do we really want the country overrun by the likes of what we see hanging around the streets of Hexthorpe? Enver Hoxha had the right idea about controlling borders.
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I might also like to add that cutting foreign aid isn't exactly helpful when it comes to economic migrants seeking asylum status .
The foreign aid sent was never the issue in my opinion and was more a case of how that aid was spent in the receiving country .
Once again we are back to controls in place that ensure foreign aid is used effectively to build country's economy's so they can prosper .
You never give a starving man a fish to satisfy his hunger , you offer him a fishing rod .
Are there people who actually think foreign aid is spent the same way as donated charity money?
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Yeah, there is nothing to say they should stay in the first safe country. That's some GB News style bullshit.
You will be happy for them to live next door to you then, and to have any of their kids tying up the teachers at school affecting the education of our own which we have paid for?
Yeah, I suppose so. Are you saying you don't want any asylum seekers ever in this country because of the affects, such as having to give them educations? It's pure luck where people are born, some people are unfortunately born in war torn countries, others in well off countries such as the UK, does that mean the unlucky ones don't deserve opportunities to better themselves because of invisible lines in the ground?
We are one of the most densely populated countries in the world. Everywhere you look houses are being built destroying the countryside and wildlife habitats. You can't get a dentist without driving miles and doctor's appointments are hard to get. At what point do we say enough is enough, or do we just keep on relentlessly increasing the population? Overpopulation is IMO the number one problem facing the world today. Most other problems, such as allleged climate change are a symptom of this. Yes, i do consider myself to have been fortunate to be born British, but that doesn't mean just because we're doing ok that we have to look after the rest of the world. Maybe these people should work hard and improve their own countries rather than taking the easy option and rolling up here. Why do they all want to come here rather than go to any other country when we are constantly being told how evil and racist we are?
You're very naïve if you think they can just "work hard and improve their own countries". They come here in some cases because if they don't then they could be killed. A lot of refugees hear good things about the UK, they'll occasionally have family here or find the language easier to learn. Overall we nowhere near have the largest intake percentage wise of refugees, and as part of the EU their was the Dublin Regulations which allowed us to send any refugees back to the first EU country they arrived in, we don't have that anymore.
If they're not prepared to make an effort in their own country what makes you think they will do it here? I just don't see it as our problem. It's just not true they are the waifs and strays of the world looking for a safe haven. Why do we see loads of fit and healthy young men? Do we really want the country overrun by the likes of what we see hanging around the streets of Hexthorpe? Enver Hoxha had the right idea about controlling borders.
Bloody hell, AL lauding a Communist. He'll be supporting Brighton next.
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People need to go down the local car wash and speak to the lads down there. I’m friendly with a few Kurds who work down our local car wash. They have told me straight why they came here. Easy money. Cash paid. Get away without paying tax. No NI. No council tax. Send money back home. They have both said when they have sent enough money home, then they will return to Kurdistan.
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Surely we must be able to find out who these traffickers are. The boats that these refugees come over on must be bought from somewhere - surely we should be able to scrutinise and monitor sales of such craft - or even make it a requirement that they must be registered.
At worst we must have the technology at our disposal to see these craft and monitor their routes. Not sure what the rules are about returning them back to where they came, but it appears that the French/ Belgium authorities aren't exactly breaking a leg to stop them embarking...
There's probably someone profiteering from it, buying cheap inflatables here taking them to Calais and selling them at double the price?
https://www.gumtree.com/search?search_category=all&q=inflatable%20boat
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Yeah, there is nothing to say they should stay in the first safe country. That's some GB News style bullshit.
You will be happy for them to live next door to you then, and to have any of their kids tying up the teachers at school affecting the education of our own which we have paid for?
Yeah, I suppose so. Are you saying you don't want any asylum seekers ever in this country because of the affects, such as having to give them educations? It's pure luck where people are born, some people are unfortunately born in war torn countries, others in well off countries such as the UK, does that mean the unlucky ones don't deserve opportunities to better themselves because of invisible lines in the ground?
We are one of the most densely populated countries in the world. Everywhere you look houses are being built destroying the countryside and wildlife habitats. You can't get a dentist without driving miles and doctor's appointments are hard to get. At what point do we say enough is enough, or do we just keep on relentlessly increasing the population? Overpopulation is IMO the number one problem facing the world today. Most other problems, such as allleged climate change are a symptom of this. Yes, i do consider myself to have been fortunate to be born British, but that doesn't mean just because we're doing ok that we have to look after the rest of the world. Maybe these people should work hard and improve their own countries rather than taking the easy option and rolling up here. Why do they all want to come here rather than go to any other country when we are constantly being told how evil and racist we are?
You're very naïve if you think they can just "work hard and improve their own countries". They come here in some cases because if they don't then they could be killed. A lot of refugees hear good things about the UK, they'll occasionally have family here or find the language easier to learn. Overall we nowhere near have the largest intake percentage wise of refugees, and as part of the EU their was the Dublin Regulations which allowed us to send any refugees back to the first EU country they arrived in, we don't have that anymore.
If they're not prepared to make an effort in their own country what makes you think they will do it here? I just don't see it as our problem. It's just not true they are the waifs and strays of the world looking for a safe haven. Why do we see loads of fit and healthy young men? Do we really want the country overrun by the likes of what we see hanging around the streets of Hexthorpe? Enver Hoxha had the right idea about controlling borders.
Bloody hell, AL lauding a Communist. He'll be supporting Brighton next.
:lol: I don't think Comrade Hoxha would have been very keen on that kind of Socialism.
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He wouldn't have been. He was a rabid Communist.
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He wouldn't have been. He was a rabid Communist.
Fair play to him though he stuck to his principles and kept his country on it's chosen course. I dare say Albania was a better place in his day, he wouldn't have put up with all these gangsters.
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He wouldn't have been. He was a rabid Communist.
Fair play to him though he stuck to his principles and kept his country on it's chosen course. I dare say Albania was a better place in his day, he wouldn't have put up with all these gangsters.
"He also outlawed religion, traveling abroad, and private property, shutting down all churches and mosques in Albania. Under his regime, thousands of perceived dissidents were executed, and tens of thousands more were imprisoned or sent to forced labor camps."
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Enver_Hoxha
Your ideal dictatorship, I believe.
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He wouldn't have been. He was a rabid Communist.
Fair play to him though he stuck to his principles and kept his country on it's chosen course. I dare say Albania was a better place in his day, he wouldn't have put up with all these gangsters.
"He also outlawed religion, traveling abroad, and private property, shutting down all churches and mosques in Albania. Under his regime, thousands of perceived dissidents were executed, and tens of thousands more were imprisoned or sent to forced labor camps."
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Enver_Hoxha
Your ideal dictatorship, I believe.
Yes, he's my hero.
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But of course. You've been a big ol' leftie from the start really haven't you.
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The link clears up some of the views posted on this thread .
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/explainers-53734793
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Britons may be economic migrants in the longer term.
Says the'Whingeing POM!
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And this is where spreading lies and fake news alongside belittling people who show compasion for others gets you. Fascists attacking lifeboat crews:
https://twitter.com/TowerRNLI/status/1418703723631624199
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Britons may be economic migrants in the longer term.
Says the'Whingeing POM!
whinge is an Irish term Sprot
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But of course. You've been a big ol' leftie from the start really haven't you.
:lol:
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Surely we must be able to find out who these traffickers are. The boats that these refugees come over on must be bought from somewhere - surely we should be able to scrutinise and monitor sales of such craft - or even make it a requirement that they must be registered.
At worst we must have the technology at our disposal to see these craft and monitor their routes. Not sure what the rules are about returning them back to where they came, but it appears that the French/ Belgium authorities aren't exactly breaking a leg to stop them embarking...
There's probably someone profiteering from it, buying cheap inflatables here taking them to Calais and selling them at double the price?
https://www.gumtree.com/search?search_category=all&q=inflatable%20boat
''Police buy up boats to stop illegal crossings''
''Police have bought up small boats in an efforts to curb channel migrant crossings'' reports from the Daily Polygraph
''The NCA has discovered networks of organised criminal gangs buying them in the UK and then sending them to traffickers in France''
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Wouldn't it have been cheaper to cut a hole in them?
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They bought on the internet from China and shipped to places like Belgium, before being transported to France. They will never stop this.
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They bought on the internet from China and shipped to places like Belgium, before being transported to France. They will never stop this.
Why is the Royal Navy pissing around near Russia? Get them back home to defend our shores.
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They bought on the internet from China and shipped to places like Belgium, before being transported to France. They will never stop this.
Why is the Royal Navy pissing around near Russia? Get them back home to defend our shores.
there's nothing to defend against
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We are one of the most densely populated countries in the world.
we are 15th. take out London, we wouldn't even be top 40.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_and_dependencies_by_population_density
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They bought on the internet from China and shipped to places like Belgium, before being transported to France. They will never stop this.
Why is the Royal Navy pissing around near Russia? Get them back home to defend our shores.
there's nothing to defend against
Loads of young men of fighting age coming from God knows where to gain access to our country and benefits system. How many are IS plants? Nobody knows, however you can have them live next door to yourself if you're happy with the situation.
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Completely disgusting how the RNLI are being used to ferry these economic migrants across from a safe country .
Wonder how this affects the RNLI response times for genuine people in distress .
Hopefully tge economic migrants get sent back ASAP to the first safe country they landed in .
Then if they still want to come to the UK, they can apply through the proper channels .
Volunteers of the RNLI save anyone in distress at sea; it's disgusting how people like you are suggesting they should let people drown purely because of where they come from.
These asylum seekers are in distress, hence why the RNLI are helping.
If they are seeking asylum they aren't migrants, and they aren't breaking any laws by a) crossing the channel b) seeking asylum
Did I mention how its disgusting you would prefer these human beings drown at sea?
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Loads of young men of fighting age coming from God knows where to gain access to our country and benefits system. How many are IS plants? Nobody knows, however you can have them live next door to yourself if you're happy with the situation.
I'd happy have them live next door to me.
Whereas if you did I'd let my dog shit all over your grass on the daily.
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We are one of the most densely populated countries in the world.
we are 15th. take out London, we wouldn't even be top 40.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_and_dependencies_by_population_density
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Area_and_population_of_European_countries
Once you have discounted countries the size of a postage stamp we look pretty high up the list in Europe and would be even higher if we took England in isolation as opposed to the UK.
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''RNLI donations increase after migrant rescue criticism''
Looks as though there are still plenty willing to see people as human being rather than pawns of politicians and right wing rags.
https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-politics-58009646
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Loads of young men of fighting age coming from God knows where to gain access to our country and benefits system. How many are IS plants? Nobody knows, however you can have them live next door to yourself if you're happy with the situation.
I'd happy have them live next door to me.
Whereas if you did, I tell you to f*ck off every day for being a racist t**t and I'd let my dog shit all over your grass on the daily.
The true face of the left. :P
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Completely disgusting how the RNLI are being used to ferry these economic migrants across from a safe country .
Wonder how this affects the RNLI response times for genuine people in distress .
Hopefully tge economic migrants get sent back ASAP to the first safe country they landed in .
Then if they still want to come to the UK, they can apply through the proper channels .
Volunteers of the RNLI save anyone in distress at sea; it's disgusting how people like you are suggesting they should let people drown purely because of where they come from.
These asylum seekers are in distress, hence why the RNLI are helping.
If they are seeking asylum they aren't migrants, and they aren't breaking any laws by a) crossing the channel b) seeking asylum
Did I mention how its disgusting you would prefer these human beings drown at sea?
They are deliberately putting themselves in this dangerous position. What if through there selfish stupidity a member of the RNLI dies because of this? Try an answer which doesn't contain personal abuse this time if you can think of one. Because if you want to go down that route i can too.
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Completely disgusting how the RNLI are being used to ferry these economic migrants across from a safe country .
Wonder how this affects the RNLI response times for genuine people in distress .
Hopefully tge economic migrants get sent back ASAP to the first safe country they landed in .
Then if they still want to come to the UK, they can apply through the proper channels .
Volunteers of the RNLI save anyone in distress at sea; it's disgusting how people like you are suggesting they should let people drown purely because of where they come from.
These asylum seekers are in distress, hence why the RNLI are helping.
If they are seeking asylum they aren't migrants, and they aren't breaking any laws by a) crossing the channel b) seeking asylum
Did I mention how its disgusting you would prefer these human beings drown at sea?
They are deliberately putting themselves in this dangerous position. What if through there selfish stupidity a member of the RNLI dies because of this? Try an answer which doesn't contain personal abuse this time if you can think of one. Because if you want to go down that route i can too.
1. The rnli are amazingly well trained and skilled.
2. They are volunteers so choose to be there.
3. All lives are equal regardless of origin.
Yes we should control criminals coming in but we shouldn't let them die.
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Completely disgusting how the RNLI are being used to ferry these economic migrants across from a safe country .
Wonder how this affects the RNLI response times for genuine people in distress .
Hopefully tge economic migrants get sent back ASAP to the first safe country they landed in .
Then if they still want to come to the UK, they can apply through the proper channels .
Volunteers of the RNLI save anyone in distress at sea; it's disgusting how people like you are suggesting they should let people drown purely because of where they come from.
These asylum seekers are in distress, hence why the RNLI are helping.
If they are seeking asylum they aren't migrants, and they aren't breaking any laws by a) crossing the channel b) seeking asylum
Did I mention how its disgusting you would prefer these human beings drown at sea?
They are deliberately putting themselves in this dangerous position. What if through there selfish stupidity a member of the RNLI dies because of this? Try an answer which doesn't contain personal abuse this time if you can think of one. Because if you want to go down that route i can too.
Then it will be down to the UK government who still refuse to set up and implement a working asylum programme but instead are abrogatting their resposibilty under International Law, the UN Charter for Refugees and UN Law of the Sea, putting lives at risk for PR to appease the racists in the UK.
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How many do we let in each year? 1,000, 10,000, 1,000,000? At what figure do we stop? Everyone is crying about a shortage of housing, this will only make it worse. I don't want to see more of the countryside paved over. Where does the water go to when we have built over the land? Where do the Deer and Hares live when there homes have been ploughed up?
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You could just build upwards? I do agree it can't be an open door but you cannot just let people die.
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The Greeks are willing to
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All lives matter*
*unless they are terrified brown or black people fleeing war and persecution in a little boat
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How many do we let in each year? 1,000, 10,000, 1,000,000? At what figure do we stop? Everyone is crying about a shortage of housing, this will only make it worse. I don't want to see more of the countryside paved over. Where does the water go to when we have built over the land? Where do the Deer and Hares live when there homes have been ploughed up?
There are thought to be around 500000 empty properties in the UK - most of them second homes
https://metro.co.uk/2020/12/30/500000-homes-sitting-empty-in-uk-while-100000-families-are-homeless-13812966/
According to the latest gov figures 268000 have been empty for at least 6 months
https://www.bigissue.com/latest/how-many-empty-homes-are-there-in-the-uk/
Under International Law you allow those applicants who meet the criteria for seeking asylum. By governments own figures successful asylum applicats make up only 6% of immigrants to the UK.
In 2019, there were around 5 asylum applications for every 10,000 people living in the UK. Across the EU28 there were 14 asylum applications for every 10,000 people. The UK was therefore below the average among EU countries for asylum applications per head of population, ranking 17th among EU28 countries on this measure.
https://commonslibrary.parliament.uk/research-briefings/sn01403/
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I always find it strange why anyone would be against immigration anyway? How do people think American became the most powerful, and at one point the richest, country in the world?
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Loads of young men of fighting age coming from God knows where to gain access to our country and benefits system. How many are IS plants? Nobody knows, however you can have them live next door to yourself if you're happy with the situation.
I'd happy have them live next door to me.
Whereas if you did, I tell you to f*ck off every day for being a racist t**t and I'd let my dog shit all over your grass on the daily.
The true face of the left. :P
I feel like advocating innocent men, women and children drown is more extreme than having a dog poo in front of your house.
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I always find it strange why anyone would be against immigration anyway? How do people think American became the most powerful, and at one point the richest, country in the world?
That's a good comparison! The population Density of the USA is 80 per square mile, the population Density of the Uk is 700 per square mile.
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I always find it strange why anyone would be against immigration anyway? How do people think American became the most powerful, and at one point the richest, country in the world?
That's a good comparison! The population Density of the USA is 80 per square mile, the population Density of the Uk is 700 per square mile.
Yeah but with an EU passport you could live in any of 27 other countries in the wealthiest bloc in the world
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I always find it strange why anyone would be against immigration anyway? How do people think American became the most powerful, and at one point the richest, country in the world?
That's a good comparison! The population Density of the USA is 80 per square mile, the population Density of the Uk is 700 per square mile.
Yeah but with an EU passport you could live in any of 27 other countries in the wealthiest bloc in the world
Yes the EU is the promised land!, so why have we got illegal immigrants crossing the Chanel from this Utopian Paradise?
Why have we got hundreds of thousands of Romas living here just what is wrong with the EI that makes us so attractive?
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I always find it strange why anyone would be against immigration anyway? How do people think American became the most powerful, and at one point the richest, country in the world?
That's a good comparison! The population Density of the USA is 80 per square mile, the population Density of the Uk is 700 per square mile.
Yeah but with an EU passport you could live in any of 27 other countries in the wealthiest bloc in the world
Yes the EU is the promised land!, so why have we got illegal immigrants crossing the Chanel from this Utopian Paradise?
Why have we got hundreds of thousands of Romas living here just what is wrong with the EI that makes us so attractive?
I guess the Roma were born in the UK which makes them citizens, what's your heritage sprot, related to the royal family?
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Why have we got hundreds of thousands of Romas living here just what is wrong with the EI that makes us so attractive?
You don't have to worry about it, as asylum seekers can pick any country in the World to seek asylum.
I wonder how many of you against the RNLI saving the lives of these desperate human beings are also in the "All Lives Matter" brigade? The hypocrisy is astounding...
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I always find it strange why anyone would be against immigration anyway? How do people think American became the most powerful, and at one point the richest, country in the world?
That's a good comparison! The population Density of the USA is 80 per square mile, the population Density of the Uk is 700 per square mile.
Yeah but with an EU passport you could live in any of 27 other countries in the wealthiest bloc in the world
I don't want to live in the EU. I was born here and want to live here and i don't want it to change any more by people coming here and destroying our way of life.
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I always find it strange why anyone would be against immigration anyway? How do people think American became the most powerful, and at one point the richest, country in the world?
That's a good comparison! The population Density of the USA is 80 per square mile, the population Density of the Uk is 700 per square mile.
Yeah but with an EU passport you could live in any of 27 other countries in the wealthiest bloc in the world
I don't want to live in the EU. I was born here and want to live here and i don't want it to change any more by people coming here and destroying our way of life.
How are they going to "destroy" it? That's a very dramatic phrasing, and also a very regressive way of thinking. We wouldn't have the language English without immigration, or roads, the list is endless.
Reminds me of this bit from Stewart Lee, warning for any of you UKIP/BNP lot it might burst a blood vessel.
https://youtu.be/1cgeXd5kRDg
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I always find it strange why anyone would be against immigration anyway? How do people think American became the most powerful, and at one point the richest, country in the world?
That's a good comparison! The population Density of the USA is 80 per square mile, the population Density of the Uk is 700 per square mile.
Yeah but with an EU passport you could live in any of 27 other countries in the wealthiest bloc in the world
Yes the EU is the promised land!, so why have we got illegal immigrants crossing the Chanel from this Utopian Paradise?
Why have we got hundreds of thousands of Romas living here just what is wrong with the EI that makes us so attractive?
Doesn't look like anyone wants to answer this Sproty!
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I always find it strange why anyone would be against immigration anyway? How do people think American became the most powerful, and at one point the richest, country in the world?
That's a good comparison! The population Density of the USA is 80 per square mile, the population Density of the Uk is 700 per square mile.
Yeah but with an EU passport you could live in any of 27 other countries in the wealthiest bloc in the world
Yes the EU is the promised land!, so why have we got illegal immigrants crossing the Chanel from this Utopian Paradise?
Why have we got hundreds of thousands of Romas living here just what is wrong with the EI that makes us so attractive?
Doesn't look like anyone wants to answer this Sproty!
The question of why they'd come here from mainland Europe? It's answered earlier in the thread when someone else asked it.
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Because we are seen by many as a soft touch. An easy ticket. Our benefits system has more holes than a sieve.
Come here and claim for your kids who don’t even live in this country. And this is happening now and has been for years.
We are far too trusting, and we are being taken advantage of.
Plain and simple.
France had Sangatte. If this were to crop up in this country, there are some in the political spectrum that would be in uproar. Migrants know they will be treated better in the uk than elsewhere in Europe.
Hungary have quite literally been putting up big fences to stop the flow of migrants into Europe. Whilst it is impossible to put up,a fence in the channel, we have done little to stop this except give the French a few quid to try to stop it. What do they care? Migrants leaving their shores to come to ours is a problem off their hands.
As a very simple comparison, just look how Australia and uk deal with Migrants crossing water to get to where they want.The Australian Navy make them turn around, our RNLI busts a gut to save their lives.
And I’m not criticising the RNLI in this, they have their hands tied.
The uk is seen, quite literally, as the promised land. The land of milk and honey. And it will continue . We are pretty powerless also when they get here, to send them home.
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....And if we try to address this exploitation we are being racist? I see!
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''Child Benefit: coming to
or leaving the UK
Keep these notes for future reference
''
https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/962392/CH5-Notes-2021.pdf
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....And if we try to address this exploitation we are being racist? I see!
There's nothing to address. As a refugee you would receive more in France (and a number of other countries) than in the UK. You clearly believe in fake news, no one is coming to this specific country for our benefit system.
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So why don't they remain in France then instead of risking their lives sailing across the Channel in dinghies to get in the UK where they will receive fewer benefits?
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So why don't they remain in France then instead of risking their lives sailing across the Channel in dinghies to get in the UK where they will receive fewer benefits?
You could give them a whistle as ask them bb
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So why don't they remain in France then instead of risking their lives sailing across the Channel in dinghies to get in the UK where they will receive fewer benefits?
Because it's not purely about the monetary figure they'd receive. They may be able to speak English or may have family over here already.
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So why don't they remain in France then instead of risking their lives sailing across the Channel in dinghies to get in the UK where they will receive fewer benefits?
Because it's not purely about the monetary figure they'd receive. They may be able to speak English or may have family over here already.
I admire your patience and diplomacy DO.
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So why don't they remain in France then instead of risking their lives sailing across the Channel in dinghies to get in the UK where they will receive fewer benefits?
Because it's not purely about the monetary figure they'd receive. They may be able to speak English or may have family over here already.
In that case, they may have a stronger case to apply for asylum. What about those who can't speak English or don't have family here?
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So why don't they remain in France then instead of risking their lives sailing across the Channel in dinghies to get in the UK where they will receive fewer benefits?
Because it's not purely about the monetary figure they'd receive. They may be able to speak English or may have family over here already.
In that case, they may have a stronger case to apply for asylum. What about those who can't speak English or don't have family here?
The 1951 Refugee Convention
https://www.unhcr.org/en-au/1951-refugee-convention.html
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saw this on france 24 the other day
you have heard the phrase " i've started and i'll finish"
you all know where the migrants want to "finish" (The Uk -basically the French don't want the refugees to progress their life- just stay as menial workers) and it doesn't take a "mastermind" to see where they started from ........
"Migrant boat departures from Libya and Tunisia to Italy and other parts of Europe have increased in recent months as weather conditions have improved.
According to the U.N.-affiliated International Organization for Migration, more than 1,100 people fleeing conflict and poverty in Africa and the Middle East have perished this year in the Mediterranean"
https://www.france24.com/en/africa/20210801-rescue-ships-pull-394-migrants-from-dangerously-overcrowded-boat-off-tunisia
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So why don't they remain in France then instead of risking their lives sailing across the Channel in dinghies to get in the UK where they will receive fewer benefits?
Because it's not purely about the monetary figure they'd receive. They may be able to speak English or may have family over here already.
In that case, they may have a stronger case to apply for asylum. What about those who can't speak English or don't have family here?
Have a look online. I don't personally know everyone's circumstances. Feel free to make your point if you're trying to walk me down the garden path.
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Without walking you down the garden path, my point is you haven't answered post 111.
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Without walking you down the garden path, my point is you haven't answered post 111.
I can't find anything about people claiming for family members in other countries. Maybe you should vote for another party if they're not solving current issues the country is having. ;)
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Without walking you down the garden path, my point is you haven't answered post 111.
Post 111 is just full of statements? No questions; nothing to answer to.
I'll bite though - why wouldn't we be proud our country has so much to offer people that people would prefer to come here that stay in France?
(BB - That is a question, and you seem to insist on people answering questions when they are asked, so...)
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Without walking you down the garden path, my point is you haven't answered post 111.
I can't find anything about people claiming for family members in other countries. Maybe you should vote for another party if they're not solving current issues the country is having. ;)
https://www.gov.uk/child-benefit-move-to-uk
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Without walking you down the garden path, my point is you haven't answered post 111.
Post 111 is just full of statements? No questions; nothing to answer to.
I'll bite though - why wouldn't we be proud our country has so much to offer people that people would prefer to come here that stay in France?
(BB - That is a question, and you seem to insist on people answering questions when they are asked, so...)
BJW. Have a walk around Hexthorpe, for instance, and come back and tell me it makes you proud of our country.
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Why would we want people to come here? We have enough rubbish of our own without importing anyone else's.
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Without walking you down the garden path, my point is you haven't answered post 111.
Post 111 is just full of statements? No questions; nothing to answer to.
I'll bite though - why wouldn't we be proud our country has so much to offer people that people would prefer to come here that stay in France?
(BB - That is a question, and you seem to insist on people answering questions when they are asked, so...)
BJW. Have a walk around Hexthorpe, for instance, and come back and tell me it makes you proud of our country.
And this is the problem that rightly should be addressed. It's not about them coming to the UK it is what they do when they get here. It's not one or the other though, we should proudly accept refugees whilst ensuring the culture of the UK remains intact.
I've never understood why you'd want to go to another country and try to turn it in to the place you've left.
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Absolutely, and it is NOTHING to do with racism.
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I always find it strange why anyone would be against immigration anyway? How do people think American became the most powerful, and at one point the richest, country in the world?
That's a good comparison! The population Density of the USA is 80 per square mile, the population Density of the Uk is 700 per square mile.
Yeah but with an EU passport you could live in any of 27 other countries in the wealthiest bloc in the world
Yes the EU is the promised land!, so why have we got illegal immigrants crossing the Chanel from this Utopian Paradise?
Why have we got hundreds of thousands of Romas living here just what is wrong with the EI that makes us so attractive?
I guess the Roma were born in the UK which makes them citizens, what's your heritage sprot, related to the royal family?
Wrong there Sydders most of the Roma were born in the former Czech Republic and Romania, where they lived literally on rubbish tips
That's one of the reasons they chuck everything into the street, no Bobby has ever taught them how to behave. The other reason is is you go down Popple Street in Fir Vale sheffield you will think it's a football crowd, but that's what you get when 32 folks share a 2 up 2 down! Somebody set up a pop up hut buying jumble clothes, nobody dare put their washing out to dry for 6 months!
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So why don't they remain in France then instead of risking their lives sailing across the Channel in dinghies to get in the UK where they will receive fewer benefits?
Because it's not purely about the monetary figure they'd receive. They may be able to speak English or may have family over here already.
In that case, they may have a stronger case to apply for asylum. What about those who can't speak English or don't have family here?
The 1951 Refugee Convention
https://www.unhcr.org/en-au/1951-refugee-convention.html
Your Cobbers know how to sort em mate, thirteen ships of the Armidale class for a start, the RNLI are a humanitarian organisation, we need to take a leaf out of Sydders adopted countries books and use our navy to take em back to France?
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I always find it strange why anyone would be against immigration anyway? How do people think American became the most powerful, and at one point the richest, country in the world?
That's a good comparison! The population Density of the USA is 80 per square mile, the population Density of the Uk is 700 per square mile.
Yeah but with an EU passport you could live in any of 27 other countries in the wealthiest bloc in the world
Yes the EU is the promised land!, so why have we got illegal immigrants crossing the Chanel from this Utopian Paradise?
Why have we got hundreds of thousands of Romas living here just what is wrong with the EI that makes us so attractive?
I guess the Roma were born in the UK which makes them citizens, what's your heritage sprot, related to the royal family?
Wrong there Sydders most of the Roma were born in the former Czech Republic and Romania, where they lived literally on rubbish tips
That's one of the reasons they chuck everything into the street, no Bobby has ever taught them how to behave. The other reason is is you go down Popple Street in Fir Vale sheffield you will think it's a football crowd, but that's what you get when 32 folks share a 2 up 2 down! Somebody set up a pop up hut buying jumble clothes, nobody dare put their washing out to dry for 6 months!
You seem to be a bit of a bobbies helmet you could do your civic duty and show them how you begave in sprotland.
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So why don't they remain in France then instead of risking their lives sailing across the Channel in dinghies to get in the UK where they will receive fewer benefits?
Because it's not purely about the monetary figure they'd receive. They may be able to speak English or may have family over here already.
In that case, they may have a stronger case to apply for asylum. What about those who can't speak English or don't have family here?
The 1951 Refugee Convention
https://www.unhcr.org/en-au/1951-refugee-convention.html
Your Cobbers know how to sort em mate, thirteen ships of the Armidale class for a start, the RNLI are a humanitarian organisation, we need to take a leaf out of Sydders adopted countries books and use our navy to take em back to France?
11 years not long enough sprot?
Hey just a thought, you could have a border in the English Channel?
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Record beat again last Thursday. 592 people made the crossing in a single day.
Where on earth are all these people being put.?
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Record beat again last Thursday. 592 people made the crossing in a single day.
Where on earth are all these people being put.?
At yours and mine's expense .
We can't even solve our own relative poverty .
Never mind at least the lefty middle class ease their conscience in the big city's .
The metropolitan middle class ?
Is why you'll never get a Labour government .
Fact .
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Record beat again last Thursday. 592 people made the crossing in a single day.
Where on earth are all these people being put.?
At yours and mine's expense .
We can't even solve our own relative poverty .
Never mind at least the lefty middle class ease their conscience in the big city's .
The metropolitan middle class ?
Is why you'll never get a Labour government .
Fact .
You are entitled to your own opinion of course but not to your own facts Tyke.
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It's quite disturbing, (distressing?), how many people on here, (and elsewhere in the UK), fail to see these people as human beings in dire need of help.
Farage and his yob mob did a right good job on some folk! I hope you're, (NOT), proud of yourselves!
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It's quite disturbing, (distressing?), how many people on here, (and elsewhere in the UK), fail to see these people as human beings in dire need of help.
Farage and his yob mob did a right good job on some folk! I hope you're, (NOT), proud of yourselves!
Please don’t mistake my comments as anti humanitarian. They are not intended that way. This is a crisis. We are not the land of milk and honey. We have our own issues in this country with poverty and homelessness. We don’t need it adding to.
As a suggestion, there is plenty of work in Lincolnshire for these people, instead of putting them in four star hotels in Kensington. Clements veg processing plant even has its own small town of static caravans to house them in.
But they will end up on the black underground labour market, slaving away in some car wash or takeaway business.
The uk govt is powerless to deport them also. All this talk from PP about sending them back to the last euro country they came from is poppy cock . There is no way the french will take them back.
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So where is all the money NR, 7th wealthiest country in the world? Food banks increased in number by 1200% since 2010, child welfare in real crisis, 2 million classed as poor, working poor, what's going on?
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It's quite disturbing, (distressing?), how many people on here, (and elsewhere in the UK), fail to see these people as human beings in dire need of help.
Farage and his yob mob did a right good job on some folk! I hope you're, (NOT), proud of yourselves!
Please don’t mistake my comments as anti humanitarian. They are not intended that way. This is a crisis. We are not the land of milk and honey. We have our own issues in this country with poverty and homelessness. We don’t need it adding to.
As a suggestion, there is plenty of work in Lincolnshire for these people, instead of putting them in four star hotels in Kensington. Clements veg processing plant even has its own small town of static caravans to house them in.
But they will end up on the black underground labour market, slaving away in some car wash or takeaway business.
The uk govt is powerless to deport them also. All this talk from PP about sending them back to the last euro country they came from is poppy cock . There is no way the french will take them back.
You should stop reading the Daily Mail/Express/Sun/Telegraph, it isn't good for your mental well-being!
Of course your comments are anti-humanitarian, (though others on here have posted worse!), and you clearly don't understand the 'rules' about asylum seekers. Asylum seekers are NOT put up in four star hotels in Kensington; and for the record, both Germany and France take more refugees than we do in the UK.
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I have pointed it out several times Kato, but some people just don't care about the difference, and legal status, between asylum seekers and economic migrants.
It's not becaus they don't know. It's because they dont care, All they want is the opportunity to be cruel to foreigners.
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You have no idea what I do for a living. I work closely with immigration enforcement as part of a partner agency strategy. The uk govt makes no disparity between economic migrants and asylum seekers. They are either illegal entrants or not. It’s that simple.
I read no daily rag. I base my comments on real life experience.
I have personally been involved in extraditions within the schengen area pre covid.
The uk is not the place for tens of thousands of migrants to settle.
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You have no idea what I do for a living. I work closely with immigration enforcement as part of a partner agency strategy. The uk govt makes no disparity between economic migrants and asylum seekers. They are either illegal entrants or not. It’s that simple.
I read no daily rag. I base my comments on real life experience.
I have personally been involved in extraditions within the schengen area pre covid.
The uk is not the place for tens of thousands of migrants to settle.
On the ground experience seems to escape the lefty experts on here .
But fair play for trying .
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You have no idea what I do for a living. I work closely with immigration enforcement as part of a partner agency strategy. The uk govt makes no disparity between economic migrants and asylum seekers. They are either illegal entrants or not. It’s that simple.
I read no daily rag. I base my comments on real life experience.
I have personally been involved in extraditions within the schengen area pre covid.
The uk is not the place for tens of thousands of migrants to settle.
On the ground experience seems to escape the lefty experts on here .
But fair play for trying .
Tyke he also I think told us he was in the army
''Non Taliban leave afghan.
Then carpet bomb every f**king square kilometre. Twice over''
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You have no idea what I do for a living. I work closely with immigration enforcement as part of a partner agency strategy. The uk govt makes no disparity between economic migrants and asylum seekers. They are either illegal entrants or not. It’s that simple.
I read no daily rag. I base my comments on real life experience.
I have personally been involved in extraditions within the schengen area pre covid.
The uk is not the place for tens of thousands of migrants to settle.
On the ground experience seems to escape the lefty experts on here .
But fair play for trying .
Tyke he also I think told us he was in the army
''Non Taliban leave afghan.
Then carpet bomb every f**king square kilometre. Twice over''
Sydney I'm for everyone having a fair crack in this world .
Reality doesn't exactly fit that narrative .
I've had more lessons from Billy and co on reality with regards to the this and that on this board that you can shake a fecking stick at .
Life ain't fair , twas ever thus .
Absolutely ain't no way you will sell illegal crossings of the English channel as some kind of humanitarian crisis that's going to strike a chord with enough of the electorate .
This is planet reality .
I've a heart and I'm a socialist at heart but I ain't a mug and clearly that's the issue here .
This is a country with wealth except you fail to understand it's not shared enough within its population to any significant extent .
Expecting people to be sympathetic towards illegal migrants is at best flawed and naive for those who are struggling themselves .
The Tories have you played all day long but many of you continue down the path that gives them the ammunition they need to get elected .
Your as much as the problem as anybody .
Who gives a feck about cruel to foreigners when our own low paid have it hard .
Get fecking real please .
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You have no idea what I do for a living. I work closely with immigration enforcement as part of a partner agency strategy. The uk govt makes no disparity between economic migrants and asylum seekers. They are either illegal entrants or not. It’s that simple.
I read no daily rag. I base my comments on real life experience.
I have personally been involved in extraditions within the schengen area pre covid.
The uk is not the place for tens of thousands of migrants to settle.
On the ground experience seems to escape the lefty experts on here .
But fair play for trying .
Tyke he also I think told us he was in the army
''Non Taliban leave afghan.
Then carpet bomb every f**king square kilometre. Twice over''
Sydney I'm for everyone having a fair crack in this world .
Reality doesn't exactly fit that narrative .
I've had more lessons from Billy and co on reality with regards to the this and that on this board that you can shake a fecking stick at .
Life ain't fair , twas ever thus .
Absolutely ain't no way you will sell illegal crossings of the English channel as some kind of humanitarian crisis that's going to strike a chord with enough of the electorate .
This is planet reality .
I've a heart and I'm a socialist at heart but I ain't a mug and clearly that's the issue here .
This is a country with wealth except you fail to understand it's not shared enough within its population to any significant extent .
Expecting people to be sympathetic towards illegal migrants is at best flawed and naive for those who are struggling themselves .
The Tories have you played all day long but many of you continue down the path that gives them the ammunition they need to get elected .
Your as much as the problem as anybody .
Who gives a feck about cruel to foreigners when our own low paid have it hard .
Get fecking real please .
Apologies Tyke, when you can point to me ever supporting tories directly or indirectly by voting for another team or not voting at all then you may have a point.
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You have no idea what I do for a living. I work closely with immigration enforcement as part of a partner agency strategy. The uk govt makes no disparity between economic migrants and asylum seekers. They are either illegal entrants or not. It’s that simple. R
I read no daily rag. I base my comments on real life experience.
I have personally been involved in extraditions within the schengen area pre covid.
The uk is not the place for tens of thousands of migrants to settle.
Quite frankly, I don't care what you say you do, but whatever it is you clearly don't know or understand the rules regarding asylum seekers. You appear not to be alone in this lack of understanding.
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There should be an Olympic sport for migrant channel crossing. Broke again yesterday.800 made the trip.
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Yesterday another busy day with around another 740 making use of the good weather to cross the channel. When will this end.the uk govt are going to give the french another 54million to help stop this.isn’t this a bit late ?
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Given that we are out of Afghan now, I’d stick some troops on the french beaches .you would not need many to monitor the coast. And a quick reaction force to deal with any attempt sailings.
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Has Boris turned into Jeremy Corbyn, because as far as i can see he is doing f all about this. The Tories have become Labour lite and they wonder why people get driven into voting for more extreme parties who say will do something about things like this.
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I don’t think that there’s an awful lot that can be done about this. I listened to Farage the other day complaining about this and his solution was to tow the ships back to France! When it was pointed out to him that they’re under no obligation to take them he was stumped!
I’ve suspected for some time that the Government aren’t really that arsed about this. They try to sound like they’re going to take a tough stance but don’t actually do very much. Rich party donors don’t care about illegal immigration so why would the government?
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So, if we can’t stop them setting off from France but can’t take them back when they either get here or are picked up in the Channel, what can be done.
Answers from those in the know please.
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If the French aren't obliged to take them why should we? Tow them back to French waters, drain off their fuel and leave them there. Not our problem, job done.
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So, if we can’t stop them setting off from Fr@nice but can’t take them back when they either get here or are picked up in the Channel, what can be done.
Answers from those in the know please.
Not sure there is much we can do. Were out of the EU and either way France isn't obliged to accept them back. Across the EU in 2019, the rate of asylum applications averaged 14 per 10,000 residents.... in the UK, it was 5 per 10,000. A possible solution that has been touted would be to allow would-be asylum seekers to apply for sanctuary before they arrive in Britain - perhaps at British embassies across the EU.
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So, if we can’t stop them setting off from Fr@nice but can’t take them back when they either get here or are picked up in the Channel, what can be done.
Answers from those in the know please.
Not sure there is much we can do. Were out of the EU and either way France isn't obliged to accept them back. Across the EU in 2019, the rate of asylum applications averaged 14 per 10,000 residents.... in the UK, it was 5 per 10,000. A possible solution that has been touted would be to allow would-be asylum seekers to apply for sanctuary before they arrive in Britain - perhaps at British embassies across the EU.
Can anyone give me a reason why we should take any at all? We can't afford to look after the world and his wife.
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News this morning that this forums fave mp, Priti Patel, has now stated uk boats may turn migrant boats around mid channel, if safe to do so.
This will be interesting to see how this pans out.
Patience finally running out?
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Playing devils advocate a bit, what are they fleeing in France?
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Wait for the outrage when the 1st boat overturns whilst being turned back.
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Well according to maritime law they won't be returning to France unless of course it can be re-written which apparently would need French approval which clearly isn't going to happen .
Simple solutions to complex problems and that's Farage and Patel out of the game it seems .
Or
Perhaps they know that already and are simply playing to the right wing audience .
There's a labour shortage after all and behind the scenes the government may well be the most enthusiastic cheer leaders of illegal migrants of them all .
They just tend to tell you different perhaps .
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I’mguessing the mid way post on the channel is the area where border force will patrol. While ever the migrants are in french waters, they can be turned back. Very difficult to police of course as I’m guessing the migrant boats are not fitted with gps tracking. Then there is the fuel range in the small outboard motors that these boats are fitted with. The french are complaining they have a 300 km range of coats to police. In reality it’s much less than that because these boats have a limited range and to attempt to cross the channel in its wider parts would be totally impossible .
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How do the numbers of boat arrivals compare to those overstaying their visas?
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It’s a good question. 1500 arrived so far this week alone across the channel though.
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How many visa overstayers have been prosecuted or businesses prosecuted for hiring them?
The government doesn't really give a shit they just want a culture war.
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Sajid Javid, December 2018, the number of migrants crossing is a major incident and I am appointing a gold commader to deal with it
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-46705128
Priti Patel, October 2019 - I will halve the number of channel crossings in 6 weekss:
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-7577511/Home-Secretary-Priti-Patel-says-HALVE-migrant-Channel-crossings-weeks.html
Ever felt you have been had?
Ah but Labour will let them all in.
Johnson, July 2019 - , there should be an amnesty for illegal migrants
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/video/news/video-1014078/Boris-supports-amnesty-illegal-immigrants.html
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yep, that's the one wilts
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Playing devils advocate a bit, what are they fleeing in France?
To claim benefits here.
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Sajid Javid, December 2018, the number of migrants crossing is a major incident and I am appointing a gold commader to deal with it
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-46705128
Priti Patel, October 2019 - I will halve the number of channel crossings in 6 weekss:
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-7577511/Home-Secretary-Priti-Patel-says-HALVE-migrant-Channel-crossings-weeks.html
Ever felt you have been had?
Ah but Labour will let them all in.
Johnson, July 2019 - , there should be an amnesty for illegal migrants
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/video/news/video-1014078/Boris-supports-amnesty-illegal-immigrants.html
Well that's all well and good but for those wishing to see the Tories booted out of government and replaced by another one is a serious problem .
A supposedly right wing populist government that acts like a left wing one leaves it's opposition with absolutely no political space to cut through in .
Feckin hell this lot now raise taxes to fund social and health care which is just about the least Conservative thing you can do .
Little wonder Starmer hasn't any policies .
There the same ones as the Tories .
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Love the comment from the French regarding the extra millions we are giving them to patrol their coastline
We didn't understand that it would be performance related
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Love the comment from the French regarding the extra millions we are giving them to patrol their coastline
We didn't understand that it would be performance related
For me the French have been about as incompetent in this as they are when fighting wars. Broadly speaking, I am not against migrations, but I cannot see the benefit of funding the French to patrol their shoreline more, only to find out that the numbers attempting this dangerous crossing is actually increasing.
If only to teach the cheese-eating surrender monkeys a lesson we should withdraw the payments and make sure we return every boat that departs their shores with migrants back to them...... or even better still - keep the boats, and return the migrants to them on P&O Ferries..... until they understand fully what the requirements are.
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Love the comment from the French regarding the extra millions we are giving them to patrol their coastline
We didn't understand that it would be performance related
For me the French have been about as incompetent in this as they are when fighting wars. Broadly speaking, I am not against migrations, but I cannot see the benefit of funding the French to patrol their shoreline more, only to find out that the numbers attempting this dangerous crossing is actually increasing.
If only to teach the cheese-eating surrender monkeys a lesson we should withdraw the payments and make sure we return every boat that departs their shores with migrants back to them...... or even better still - keep the boats, and return the migrants to them on P&O Ferries..... until they understand fully what the requirements are.
Which is what a right wing authentic government probably would do .
Except for the small matter in reality we haven't really got one just one that portrays they are .
Both the Tories and Labour in centrist terms exist to protect capital above everything else .
Capital that since 1979 and the vast changes that were made require a huge amount of cheap labour for those with capital to keep their bank balances turning over .
At this moment in time due to Brexit and Covid there are huge shortages of said cheap labour and in some cases wages are climbing .
This most certainly will not do , the market isn't supposed to work this way and be sure as the nose on your face by hook or by crook it won't be allowed to continue .
Backdoor immigration will be the new show in town whilst Patel and co carry on being the fakes that they are .
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Love the comment from the French regarding the extra millions we are giving them to patrol their coastline
We didn't understand that it would be performance related
For me the French have been about as incompetent in this as they are when fighting wars. Broadly speaking, I am not against migrations, but I cannot see the benefit of funding the French to patrol their shoreline more, only to find out that the numbers attempting this dangerous crossing is actually increasing.
If only to teach the cheese-eating surrender monkeys a lesson we should withdraw the payments and make sure we return every boat that departs their shores with migrants back to them...... or even better still - keep the boats, and return the migrants to them on P&O Ferries..... until they understand fully what the requirements are.
Which is what a right wing authentic government probably would do .
Except for the small matter in reality we haven't really got one just one that portrays they are .
Both the Tories and Labour in centrist terms exist to protect capital above everything else .
Capital that since 1979 and the vast changes that were made require a huge amount of cheap labour for those with capital to keep their bank balances turning over .
At this moment in time due to Brexit and Covid there are huge shortages of said cheap labour and in some cases wages are climbing .
This most certainly will not do , the market isn't supposed to work this way and be sure as the nose on your face by hook or by crook it won't be allowed to continue .
Backdoor immigration will be the new show in town whilst Patel and co carry on being the fakes that they are .
I don't disagree with any of that Tyke........ and I agree that it is chiefly gesture politics.
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Love the comment from the French regarding the extra millions we are giving them to patrol their coastline
We didn't understand that it would be performance related
For me the French have been about as incompetent in this as they are when fighting wars. Broadly speaking, I am not against migrations, but I cannot see the benefit of funding the French to patrol their shoreline more, only to find out that the numbers attempting this dangerous crossing is actually increasing.
If only to teach the cheese-eating surrender monkeys a lesson we should withdraw the payments and make sure we return every boat that departs their shores with migrants back to them...... or even better still - keep the boats, and return the migrants to them on [b]P&O Ferries[/b]..... until they understand fully what the requirements are.
Brittany Ferries surely?
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Forty small boats with 1,115 migrants on board have crossed the Channel in two days, the Home Office has said.
On Saturday, Border Force picked up 491 migrants on 17 boats, while the French authorities prevented 114 people from making the crossing.
On Friday 624 people crossed on 23 boats, with 300 more being stopped by the French authorities.
In September, more migrants crossed than in any other previous month since the crisis began.
Some 3,879 migrants made the crossing in September.
More than 18,000 people have made the crossing from France to England in small boats so far this year, compared to just over 8,460 in 2020, according to Home Office figures.
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Forty small boats with 1,115 migrants on board have crossed the Channel in two days, the Home Office has said.
On Saturday, Border Force picked up 491 migrants on 17 boats, while the French authorities prevented 114 people from making the crossing.
On Friday 624 people crossed on 23 boats, with 300 more being stopped by the French authorities.
In September, more migrants crossed than in any other previous month since the crisis began.
Some 3,879 migrants made the crossing in September.
More than 18,000 people have made the crossing from France to England in small boats so far this year, compared to just over 8,460 in 2020, according to Home Office figures.
Apparently The Grand Hotel in Scarborough is rammed full of Afghans. Nice if you've booked a few days as a seaside break.
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They are proper refugees mate I for one do not have a problem with genuine ones, especially when they are here because of some fault of ours.
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Forty small boats with 1,115 migrants on board have crossed the Channel in two days, the Home Office has said.
On Saturday, Border Force picked up 491 migrants on 17 boats, while the French authorities prevented 114 people from making the crossing.
On Friday 624 people crossed on 23 boats, with 300 more being stopped by the French authorities.
In September, more migrants crossed than in any other previous month since the crisis began.
Some 3,879 migrants made the crossing in September.
More than 18,000 people have made the crossing from France to England in small boats so far this year, compared to just over 8,460 in 2020, according to Home Office figures.
Apparently The Grand Hotel in Scarborough is rammed full of Afghans. Nice if you've booked a few days as a seaside break.
There’s a hotel near me that’s also being used to house immigrants/refugees from a variety of African countries. From the people that I’ve seen they all seem to be young men under 40 who spend all day sitting around in the grounds of the hotel. I’ve seen quite a few of them in the bank so I guess they’re not illegally in the UK.
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Forty small boats with 1,115 migrants on board have crossed the Channel in two days, the Home Office has said.
On Saturday, Border Force picked up 491 migrants on 17 boats, while the French authorities prevented 114 people from making the crossing.
On Friday 624 people crossed on 23 boats, with 300 more being stopped by the French authorities.
In September, more migrants crossed than in any other previous month since the crisis began.
Some 3,879 migrants made the crossing in September.
More than 18,000 people have made the crossing from France to England in small boats so far this year, compared to just over 8,460 in 2020, according to Home Office figures.
Apparently The Grand Hotel in Scarborough is rammed full of Afghans. Nice if you've booked a few days as a seaside break.
There’s a hotel near me that’s also being used to house immigrants/refugees from a variety of African countries. From the people that I’ve seen they all seem to be young men under 40 who spend all day sitting around in the grounds of the hotel. I’ve seen quite a few of them in the bank so I guess they’re not illegally in the UK.
From your description, my guess would be that they are asylum seekers. If that's the case then they are not allowed to work until they are either granted asylum or are rejected, (in which latter case they'd then be deported), so we have an international duty of care to accommodate and feed them and they have no option but to sit around and wait to be processed.
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They are proper refugees mate I for one do not have a problem with genuine ones, especially when they are here because of some fault of ours.
The hotel should make potential holiday makers aware of this though.
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I oils not stay there if you paid me, my cousins husband reads the reviews on Trip advisor says they are more entertaining Han the Beano!
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From your description, my guess would be that they are asylum seekers. If that's the case then they are not allowed to work until they are either granted asylum or are rejected, (in which latter case they'd then be deported), so we have an international duty of care to accommodate and feed them and they have no option but to sit around and wait to be processed.
Stop talking sense, man!
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Another record. Around 1000 made the crossing yesterday (Thursday)
That’s over 23000 this year alone.
By comparison 8400 made the crossing last year.
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Another record. Around 1000 made the crossing yesterday (Thursday)
That’s over 23000 this year alone.
By comparison 8400 made the crossing last year.
That will help the alleged 'housing crisis' no end.
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Playing devils advocate a bit, what are they fleeing in France?
To claim benefits here.
An illegal immigrants, someone who hasn't been granted right to remain can't claim benefit.
A refugee can claim more on benefits in France than they can in the UK.
France take in a fair bit more refugees per year then we do. Not sure where the idea that we get them all comes from.
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Another record. Around 1000 made the crossing yesterday (Thursday)
That’s over 23000 this year alone.
By comparison 8400 made the crossing last year.
I thought we were taking back control of our borders as part of Brexit?
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Meantime, we have uk troops helping to protect the polish border with Belarus. You can’t make this up.
Why can’t we deploy our troops along the French coast if this is ok?
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Meantime, we have uk troops helping to protect the polish border with Belarus. You can’t make this up.
Why can’t we deploy our troops along the French coast if this is ok?
But we left the EU so we could control our own borders....
PS. If you stop the refugees in Belarus then you dont need to stop them in France!
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Meantime, we have uk troops helping to protect the polish border with Belarus. You can’t make this up.
Why can’t we deploy our troops along the French coast if this is ok?
But we left the EU so we could control our own borders....
PS. If you stop the refugees in Belarus then you dont need to stop them in France!
I think you will find refugees are finding numerous ways into Europe. Belarus is very much the long way round. Assisted no doubt by Russia.
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Desperate news re loss of life on the channel today.
It doesn’t need to be and should not be like this.
Patrol the feckin french beaches ffs. It’s not hard.
They are doing it in bloody Poland. With some of our troops too.
And spare a thought for our emergency services that are in the channel tonight, in the dark, cold and no doubt wet searching for those who may be in desperate need.
Cobra meeting as a result, fffs. Too late for this .
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Absolutely shocking this....
Finally Macron has come out with a comment....
France's President Emmanuel Macron has said that "France will not let the Channel become a cemetery". Finally.... after sitting on his hands for so long.
About fookin time you French tosser...... I would sooner see us take people in than see innocent and desperate people die in the Channel...
... apparently four suspected people smugglers arrested by French police Interior Minister Gérald Darmanin has confirmed.
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Just said to Mrs TFE , funny how they can arrest 4 people traffickers so quickly after this tragedy, but not yesterday
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G8 summit in Cornwall , cop26 in Glasgow, thousands of cops deployed to each. The money we have given t9 the french , we could have policed this ourselves.
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G8 summit in Cornwall , cop26 in Glasgow, thousands of cops deployed to each. The money we have given t9 the french , we could have policed this ourselves.
The politics around this is pertinent because the UK is copying some of Oz bad ideas, politicians are using this to wedge the other party, as soon as labor makes any noise about treating refugees arriving by boat in a dignified way the right wing media start screaming out. They hide behind the safety of 'boat people' but use all means to deter them. I suspect the same happens in the the UK with many thousands more arriving by other means, overstaying but nothing is done, it's not a useful political wedge for politicians so it is not pursued.
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and compared to what other countries in Europe have to deal with its not even that much of an issue here. Just hyped up by the right-wingnut Tories and their mates in the gutter press to feed the racists:
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The new German leader has said that Germany will welcome many more immigrants, I wonder if he would have been elected if he had said so before the election?
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The new German leader has said that Germany will welcome many more immigrants, I wonder if he would have been elected if he had said so before the election?
Maybe you shouldn't gripe selby, this means less for you to moan about.
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Syd I am not moaning, Willie is in Munich, direct your scorn and racial hatred at him.
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You're a funny guy selby, but part of the rich forum mix.
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The new German leader has said that Germany will welcome many more immigrants, I wonder if he would have been elected if he had said so before the election?
We can send him some if he needs them. We're full up as far as i can see. Before any of the usual suspects start, at what point do they consider Britain full?
Where are they going to live when we have enough of our own sleeping in doorways?
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I think you'll find the population is decreasing Al
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I think you'll find the population is decreasing Al
Where?
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In the Isle of Axholm :)
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The rate of population increase is dropping AL.
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The population of the UK is growing at a rate of somewhere between 0.5 and 1% a year. It doesn't sound much but it is accumulative and over a period of years soon translates into millions.
The population is probably approaching something like 70million, it's difficult to measure accurately, that is an estimate from the supermarkets, who have to feed it.
(https://urbanrim.org.uk/images/full%20series.png)
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The new German leader has said that Germany will welcome many more immigrants, I wonder if he would have been elected if he had said so before the election?
Yes.
https://www.euractiv.com/section/politics/news/german-parties-and-migration-different-priorities-and-concerns/
They have a coalition government of pretty much the equivalent of Labour, Lib Dems and Green Party.
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The rate of population increase is dropping AL.
But surely that just means it's not growing at the same rate as it was? It doesn't mean that the actual population figure has gone down.
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The rate of population increase is dropping AL.
But surely that just means it's not growing at the same rate as it was? It doesn't mean that the actual population figure has gone down.
Of course it does Al, it is a problem or not depending what information you have to hand and how you view it. The age of the existing pop has to be determined and charted to ensure that there is enough people to do the work to drive the economy to support the ever increasing cohort of pensioners. A decision has to be made where these working people will come from, as wages stagnate and prices go up families become smaller and the ave age of the pop increases. The government has implemented a points system but has put a floor on the wage of those allowed in which has created problems for businesses to gain staff. Therefore as with truck drivers they have had to bring in 'special visas' have they filled the quota? The UK is not the only country grappling with this question as the article that DO posted, Germany requires an intake 400,000 annually to fill the jobs. Some say they don't want continual growth, which is fine but how do you balance that against others that want their standard of living to improve?
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And of course there is always more, those trumpeting the points system of immigration may have not thought about the consequences. What happens when you tip the balance in favour of highly trained people? often but not always the highly trained come from families with above average wealth and come because they want the better jobs, until this high tech, high wage tiger economy develops, who is going to do the other work?
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As many of the back breaking jobs of yesteryear have now gone i don't see any reason not to raise the retirement age. Sixty six is no age nowadays. My grandad retired at 65 but lived through two world wars and a depression, it's just not the same now. Why do we have to have constant growth?
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And of course there is always more, those trumpeting the points system of immigration may have not thought about the consequences. What happens when you tip the balance in favour of highly trained people? often but not always the highly trained come from families with above average wealth and come because they want the better jobs, until this high tech, high wage tiger economy develops, who is going to do the other work?
Well you were one of them so no point complaining at us!
Anyway if the current rate of success in attracting highly skilled people continues, this scheme that had 0 applicants, then its not goingto be that much of an issue is it.
And if the country is 'full-up' - as other posters have said - why do we have so many shortages, drivers, police, NHS staff, agriculture workers etc? Are you saying we should just accept having less of everything (but more crime) and greater waiting lists?
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As many of the back breaking jobs of yesteryear have now gone i don't see any reason not to raise the retirement age. Sixty six is no age nowadays. My grandad retired at 65 but lived through two world wars and a depression, it's just not the same now. Why do we have to have constant growth?
The problem is without constant growth, it's very difficult to create a steady state economy. Things just tend to slide and collapse. The problem is debt, which is basically money borrowed from the future and paid back with interest. To cover that interest the economy must grow.
It's a dilemma because I'm of the opinion we live in a finite world and staying on the treadmill of constant growth will lead eventually to environmental collapse or economic collapse when resources become scarce. Or both.
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The UK’s population continues to grow, but at a slower rate than previously
The UK population has grown year-on-year since 1982.
The 2019 mid-year population estimates release showed that the population of the UK reached 66.8 million, up from 66.4 million in mid-2018. This population growth marks an increase of 0.5%, or an additional 361,000 people, between mid-2018 and mid-2019. Growth in the year mid-2018 to mid-2019 was slower than in any year since mid-2004.
The UK population is projected to increase further; our 2018-based principal national population projections suggest the UK population will surpass 69.6 million by mid-2029 and reach 72 million by mid-2041 – increases of 4.2% and 7.8%, respectively, from mid 2004.
The UK population has grown year on year since 1982.
Projected to be just short of 72million by 2040.
Source: Office for National Statistics.
January 2021.
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As many of the back breaking jobs of yesteryear have now gone i don't see any reason not to raise the retirement age. Sixty six is no age nowadays. My grandad retired at 65 but lived through two world wars and a depression, it's just not the same now. Why do we have to have constant growth?
The problem is without constant growth, it's very difficult to create a steady state economy. Things just tend to slide and collapse. The problem is debt, which is basically money borrowed from the future and paid back with interest. To cover that interest the economy must grow.
It's a dilemma because I'm of the opinion we live in a finite world and staying on the treadmill of constant growth will lead eventually to environmental collapse or economic collapse when resources become scarce. Or both.
Write down the date. I totally agree! :lol:
As you say the resources of the world will not last forever. At some point things will start to go backwards to a less advanced lifestyle than that which we have enjoyed in the past few decades.
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What I can't understand is why when according to the likes of a large magority of posters on here we in a massive mess why are folks walking across Germany, Belgium and France and then risking theirs lives in their tens of thousands to claim asylum in this so called deprived poverty stricken dump that is on its backside since we dumped the EEC why isn't it the other way surely the flow of migrants should be heading to the paradise over the Chanel which is so admired by my fellow forum members?
Oh by the wat just seen a lady who is a French National and resident of Calais giving a France 24 reporter a piece of her mind " We witness inhuman and degrading treatment every day here in Calais people don't often voice it but we talk about it all of the time if people are putting themselves in danger it's also because of that."
So the locals know and see on a daily basis how the French authorities are treating the migrants on the Channel Coast, make as unwelcome as possible in France and force them to make the very dangerous Channel crossing in an inflated inner tube from a HGV tyre. How is that different to what is happening on the eastern Border of Poland?
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Sproty.
Most of theme aren't walking across Germany and France to come to the UK. Go look at the numbers. There are FAR more migrants settling in those countries than coming to the UK. Far more.
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Here's a thought....instead of paying traffickers to load them into inflatables, then risking their lives having spent all their savings with criminals,....we could let them come to the UK on the ferry, normal like!
Once they get here, then they can put in a claim for asylum on arrival, as international law requires.
Then the UK could expedite the claim process, and make an early decision before the migrants transfer into the wider community.
Seems simple, perhaps because it is.
It would prevent the ludicrous posturing of politicians, none of whom have any clue about what it is like to risk their lives to avoid conflict or destitution.
Sorted!
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Sproty.
Most of theme aren't walking across Germany and France to come to the UK. Go look at the numbers. There are FAR more migrants settling in those countries than coming to the UK. Far more.
I had assumed it was a language or family already here thing, but I saw a reporter speaking to an Afghan family of 6 who had been travelling for over a year, and they didn't speak English.
So that theory was incorrect.
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The UK jobs market is far less regulated than in France. It maybe lower paid work with poor conditions but it's work.
And the Dublin agreement is an issue, if the migrants were to claim asylum in France then there is the possibility they could be shipped back to Greece or Poland or whereever they first entered the EU. When the French closed down Sangatte last time, they waived the Dublin agreement. At that point apparently many were willing to claim asylum in France.
But the thing is France doesn't want to accept more migrants, it wants them to make the journey to the UK, which is why offers of helping the French authorities will fall on deaf ears.
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Migrants that are in the Calais region are saying that the French are not humane. They take all their property from them, burn camps down, don’t provide food or accommodation. It’s easy to see why they want to come here when there is the offer of hotel accommodation and allowances.
Meantime, I thought we were on the cusp of real progress between us and France. News just in that Priti Patel has been told she is now not invited to the summit in Calais to discuss the crisis. This as a result of Boris insisting in a letter to Macron that there should be a bi lateral agreement for France to take back migrants . Is he f**king stupid? If we patrolled the beaches there, as was going to be planned, Then there would be no new numbers coming in. He has really shot himself and the country in the foot here.
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Migrants that are in the Calais region are saying that the French are not humane. They take all their property from them, burn camps down, don’t provide food or accommodation. It’s easy to see why they want to come here when there is the offer of hotel accommodation and allowances.
Meantime, I thought we were on the cusp of real progress between us and France. News just in that Priti Patel has been told she is now not invited to the summit in Calais to discuss the crisis. This as a result of Boris insisting in a letter to Macron that there should be a bi lateral agreement for France to take back migrants . Is he f**king stupid? If we patrolled the beaches there, as was going to be planned, Then there would be no new numbers coming in. He has really shot himself and the country in the foot here.
And if the French invited themselves to Dover to patrol the beaches ........................... ?
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Migrants that are in the Calais region are saying that the French are not humane. They take all their property from them, burn camps down, don’t provide food or accommodation. It’s easy to see why they want to come here when there is the offer of hotel accommodation and allowances.
Meantime, I thought we were on the cusp of real progress between us and France. News just in that Priti Patel has been told she is now not invited to the summit in Calais to discuss the crisis. This as a result of Boris insisting in a letter to Macron that there should be a bi lateral agreement for France to take back migrants . Is he f**king stupid? If we patrolled the beaches there, as was going to be planned, Then there would be no new numbers coming in. He has really shot himself and the country in the foot here.
NR, do we know that the French were going to allow us to patrol their beaches?
Also there have been plenty of people saying that we should be able to send some of the migrants back to France.
I think Boris’s mistake has been in making the contents of his letter known to the public before the meeting that was planned.
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NR.
Johnson hasn't shot himself in the foot. Because his primary aim here is not to solve the problem. It's to have a fight with France.
Johnson's best outcome is for the problem to continue and his supporters to blame France and laud Johnson for standing up to them.
There's no other scenario in which his ridiculous Twitter stunt this morning makes any sense.
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Unless he has a complete buffoon other than himself looking after his social media footprint
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Migrants that are in the Calais region are saying that the French are not humane. They take all their property from them, burn camps down, don’t provide food or accommodation. It’s easy to see why they want to come here when there is the offer of hotel accommodation and allowances.
Well who would have thought that? Make it uncomfortable for them and they will go away. When do we begin? It's about time we stopped all this namby pamby pussy footing and sorted the problem once and for all.
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People keep talking about bodies on the ground patrolling the French beaches. An impossible task given the length of the French coastline say from Dunkirk to Boulogne.
Surely using modern tech ie Drones is a much simpler quicker and effective way of monitoring the coast? If drones can be used to identify individual "terrorists" before they are taken out surely a group of desperate migrants 30 or 40 strong can be identified. Or am I missing something?
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Migrants that are in the Calais region are saying that the French are not humane. They take all their property from them, burn camps down, don’t provide food or accommodation. It’s easy to see why they want to come here when there is the offer of hotel accommodation and allowances.
Well who would have thought that? Make it uncomfortable for them and they will go away. When do we begin? It's about time we stopped all this namby pamby pussy footing and sorted the problem once and for all.
There is no once and for all solution. Migration from conflict, political persecution and climate change is only going to get worse. We already know this.
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People keep talking about bodies on the ground patrolling the French beaches. An impossible task given the length of the French coastline say from Dunkirk to Boulogne.
Surely using modern tech ie Drones is a much simpler quicker and effective way of monitoring the coast? If drones can be used to identify individual "terrorists" before they are taken out surely a group of desperate migrants 30 or 40 strong can be identified. Or am I missing something?
It would surely need a co ordinated multi agency approach.
The suppliers of the inflatables for instance. It’s a pretty niche item. This is not a difficult thing to detect. Intelligence has suggested they are being purchased on Amazon. I’m pretty sure Amazon would be more than happy to share info on the buyers of such. There would be a pretty large footprint being left by those purchasing these things. Then there are the outboard motors. Again, this is a pretty specific item. We know the engines that are being used , because they are being seized at Dover. Regarding the coastline. You would not need to deploy too many people along the coast. More so at night time of course due to visibility. Then there is the weather where some days it would be impossible. Drone deployments . Even use of satellites. Planes helicopters. All of this is possible. There is only so much coastline that allows for a crossing in a dinghy. During the day you would only need one spotter every kilometre or two to make this effective. This has a joint military deployment written all over it. Instead we give our tax payers cash to the french who must be lapping it up. There was a cracking bit of footage of a french beach patrol watching a dinghy being launched whilst stood doing nothing.
Beggars belief.
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Migrants that are in the Calais region are saying that the French are not humane. They take all their property from them, burn camps down, don’t provide food or accommodation. It’s easy to see why they want to come here when there is the offer of hotel accommodation and allowances.
Well who would have thought that? Make it uncomfortable for them and they will go away. When do we begin? It's about time we stopped all this namby pamby pussy footing and sorted the problem once and for all.
There is no once and for all solution. Migration from conflict, political persecution and climate change is only going to get worse. We already know this.
There bloody well is. Send out high speed patrol boats to circle the dinghies making it impossible for them to navigate the waters and turn back. Keep doing it until they get the message. If people STILL insist on putting their own lives at risk by carrying on doing it then the consequences are THEIR OWN RESPONSIBLITY. I AM SICK TO DEATH OF SEEING THEM COMING HERE.ENOUGH IS ENOUGH!!!!
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Just pop the dinghies on the beach before they get launched. Job done.
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I wonder how it feels to look in the mirror, when your job is to write this sort of hateful rubbish two days after 27 people died in the Channel?
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FFHK_3xXwAo8ks2?format=jpg&name=900x900
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Migrants that are in the Calais region are saying that the French are not humane. They take all their property from them, burn camps down, don’t provide food or accommodation. It’s easy to see why they want to come here when there is the offer of hotel accommodation and allowances.
Well who would have thought that? Make it uncomfortable for them and they will go away. When do we begin? It's about time we stopped all this namby pamby pussy footing and sorted the problem once and for all.
There is no once and for all solution. Migration from conflict, political persecution and climate change is only going to get worse. We already know this.
There bloody well is. Send out high speed patrol boats to circle the dinghies making it impossible for them to navigate the waters and turn back. Keep doing it until they get the message. If people STILL insist on putting their own lives at risk by carrying on doing it then the consequences are THEIR OWN RESPONSIBLITY. I AM SICK TO DEATH OF SEEING THEM COMING HERE.ENOUGH IS ENOUGH!!!!
And when the 1st dinghy carrying women and kids capsizes during this turn around operation .........
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I’m posting this comment as an observation, it doesn’t represent my opinion …. before anyone piles in and vilifies me.
On the bbc news I heard an interview with a bloke who had been the head of a uk border force team and had been based in France for 16 years.
He said that the majority of the people coming illegally into the UK were economic migrants, not refugees.
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This is not the first time this information has been posted, but I guess it's my turn today
''Most people who risk Channel boat crossings are refugees – report
Analysis contradicts Priti Patel’s claim that 70% are single men who are economic migrants to UK''
Nearly two-thirds of people who migrate to the UK in small boats are deemed to be genuine refugees and allowed to remain, a report says, in an apparent contradiction of past statements by the home secretary, Priti Patel.
Analysis using Home Office data and requests under freedom of information laws has concluded that 61% of migrants who travel by boat are likely to be allowed to stay after claiming asylum.
This means she is a liar surprise surprise, and is fomenting trouble.
https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2021/nov/17/most-people-who-risk-channel-boat-crossings-are-refugees-report
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Official stats are available for those who are interested in the facts;
https://www.gov.uk/government/statistics/immigration-statistics-year-ending-september-2021/how-many-people-do-we-grant-asylum-or-protection-to
Better to look there, than to rely upon the opinions of people who routinely talk absolute bollux.
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Official stats are available for those who are interested in the facts;
https://www.gov.uk/government/statistics/immigration-statistics-year-ending-september-2021/how-many-people-do-we-grant-asylum-or-protection-to
Better to look there, than to rely upon the opinions of people who routinely talk absolute bollux.
Sydders posting more unsubstantiated poop from the Guardian!
Allies WHO figures totally discredit the lazy lying leftie Journo FiBs!
Oh and my lad worked as a immigration Decider at the Home Office and the Albanian guys do their absolute upmost to get some feckless British girl pregnant so they can stay on as 'Daddy'.once they achieved 'Daddyhood' we can't repatriate them,
He used to interview them and the first info they always blurt out is that they have a girlfriend who is pregnant or their 'Baby mother'!
Second bit of info is how they have 'fallen out' with another extended family in Albania and can't go home because they will be killed...bit like the Gang bangers in the 115 organised crime groups in Sheffield and south York's they're all under threat of Death..it's just a pity they don't go and seek asylum in Albania.
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Official stats are available for those who are interested in the facts;
https://www.gov.uk/government/statistics/immigration-statistics-year-ending-september-2021/how-many-people-do-we-grant-asylum-or-protection-to
Better to look there, than to rely upon the opinions of people who routinely talk absolute bollux.
Sydders posting more unsubstantiated poop from the Guardian!
Allies WHO figures totally discredit the lazy lying leftie Journo FiBs!
Oh and my lad worked as a immigration Decider at the Home Office and the Albanian guys do their absolute upmost to get some feckless British girl pregnant so they can stay on as 'Daddy'.once they achieved 'Daddyhood' we can't repatriate them,
He used to interview them and the first info they always blurt out is that they have a girlfriend who is pregnant or their 'Baby mother'!
Second bit of info is how they have 'fallen out' with another extended family in Albania and can't go home because they will be killed...bit like the Gang bangers in the 115 organised crime groups in Sheffield and south York's they're all under threat of Death..it's just a pity they don't go and seek asylum in Albania.
From Albie's link
1. People granted protection and other leave through asylum and resettlement routes
This section covers individuals granted leave to remain in the UK via three routes: applying for asylum, resettlement, and family reunion visas.
The UK offered protection, in the form of asylum, humanitarian protection, alternative forms of leave and resettlement, to 13,210 people (including dependants) in the year ending September 2021. Of these:
81% were granted refugee status following an asylum application (‘asylum’)
7% were granted humanitarian protection
3% were granted alternative forms of leave (such as discretionary leave, UASC leave)
9% were granted refugee status through resettlement schemes, although this proportion was lower than in recent years due to the COVID-19 pandemic
Additionally, 6,524 partners and children of refugees living in the UK were granted entry to the UK through family reunion visas, 8% more than the previous year.
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Again from Albie's link
In the year ending September 2021, there were 14,758 initial decisions made on asylum applications. The number of decisions was 6% fewer than the previous year, in part, as a result of the COVID-19 pandemic. Although the number of decisions made has increased in the latest two quarters, the numbers remain below levels seen before the pandemic.
Almost two thirds (64%) of the initial decisions in the year ending September 2021 were grants of asylum, humanitarian protection or alternative forms of leave. The proportion of grants is higher than the previous year (49%), and higher than levels prior to 2019, when around a third of initial decisions were grants. This is in part because the number of grants has increased, returning to levels similar to those prior to the COVID-19 pandemic, while the number of refusals has decreased, remaining below pre-pandemic levels.
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From the UK Parliament website.
Asylum is protection given by a country to someone fleeing from persecution in their own country. An asylum seeker is someone who has applied for asylum and is awaiting a decision on whether they will be granted refugee status.
An asylum applicant who does not qualify for refugee status may still be granted leave to remain in the UK for humanitarian or other reasons. An asylum seeker whose application is refused at initial decision may appeal the decision through an appeals process and, if successful, may be granted leave to remain.
Asylum applications
The number of asylum applications to the UK peaked in 2002 at 84,132. After that the number fell sharply to reach a twenty-year low point of 17,916 in 2010, before rising again to reach 35,737 in 2019.
The number of applications fell slightly to 29,456 applications in 2020, as the combined result of far fewer arrivals by air and an increase in arrivals by small boat across the English Channel.
Asylum seekers made up around 6% of immigrants to the UK in 2019.
Decisions and refusals
The percentage of asylum applicants refused at initial decision reached its highest point at 88% in 2004. After that, the percentage of applicants refused at initial decision fell to 59% in 2014, then rose again before dropping to 48% in 2019.
In the period from 2004 to 2020, around three-quarters of applicants refused asylum at initial decision lodged an appeal and almost one third of those appeals were allowed.
Asylum caseload
As of June 2021, the total ‘work in progress’ asylum caseload consisted of 125,000 cases. Of these, 57,000 cases were awaiting an initial decision at the end of 2020, 5,900 were awaiting the outcome of an appeal, and approximately 39,500 cases were subject to removal action.
The total asylum caseload has doubled in size since 2014, driven both by applicants waiting longer for an initial decision and a growth in the number of people subject to removal action following a negative decision.
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I'm proving that you're post 233 is incorrect, what are you doing hound?
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Im not trying to prove anything.
And I wasn’t in my earlier post either.
I was just telling people who may not have heard the bbc interview with a man who was in a good position to know what was going on.
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If you acknowledge that what you posted was incorrect it would make for a balanced and useful debate hound.
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If you acknowledge that what you posted was incorrect it would make for a balanced and useful debate hound.
I have no idea if it was incorrect.
I was quoting what someone said on tv so that people could read it.
I also don’t want to debate anything with you.
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If you acknowledge that what you posted was incorrect it would make for a balanced and useful debate hound.
I have no idea if it was incorrect.
I was quoting was someone said on tv so that people could read it.
I also don’t want to debate anything with you.
You didn't read the link Albie put up then? nor the excerpts from it I posted? I suppose you think the government report is full of bollux too?
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The point of the Gov stats link was to show that neither politicians nor media will report the full picture, but cherry pick for their own purpose.
Now you can say it is newsworthy to report what Patel says, as she is Home Secretary.
That said, what she says is unlikely to be accurate, because she has form, and because she is looking to make political capital out of the migrant situation.
The bottom line is that those hoping to cross to the UK will do so, despite any attempts to deter.
They don't think that they have a realistic choice.
So if we want to avoid more tragedy, we need to give them safe passage, away from the criminals.
Once here, deal with their asylum claim fairly and quickly......it really is that simple unless you want to stir the pot and wind people up....which is what the posturing fools in the HoC can only think about!
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The big picture of course is that we in the West supported the Arab Spring, then sat on our hands when Syria collapsed and waves of people wanted to come to the West for a future. We called them every name under the sun. We said we should use gunboats to drive them back.
Now we have a wave coming from Afghanistan which we invaded then abandoned. The response is scum like that Mail journalist saying they are coming because we'll give them 40 quid a week.
As if anyone would pay ever penny they have in the world and risk their lives in dinghies on freezing seas for 40 quid a week. They are coming to try to make a future after their homeland has been f**ked up, partly by our Governments.
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“What drives us down this road is sheer political prejudice. Not the facts. Because the facts do not support a case for cruelty.”
Lord Kerr destroys Priti Patel’s narrative about refugees with three simple facts.
https://twitter.com/PoliticsJOE_UK/status/1464535733058818052?ref_src=twsrc%5Egoogle%7Ctwcamp%5Eserp%7Ctwgr%5Etweet
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If you acknowledge that what you posted was incorrect it would make for a balanced and useful debate hound.
I have no idea if it was incorrect.
I was quoting was someone said on tv so that people could read it.
I also don’t want to debate anything with you.
You didn't read the link Albie put up then? nor the excerpts from it I posted? I suppose you think the government report is full of bollux too?
He doesn't read posted links, he's said so previously. I guess he'll not look at the link Wilts posted re Lord Kerr's destruction of Patel's narrative either!
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I find it interesting that the French answer yesterday is that the UK should make itself less attractive to refugees to solve the problem. Totally bizarre.
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I find it interesting that the French answer yesterday is that the UK should make itself less attractive to refugees to solve the problem. Totally bizarre.
In which they appear to be in agreement with Nigel Farage, Priti Patel and several posters on here who talk about how refugees should be treated/mistreated to stop their arrival. So yes bizarre - but you can clearly see where they are coming from and what/how they wish to stir-up.
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Yes but as a representative of the British Government wasn’t invited to that meeting it has nothing to do with us.
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Yes but as a representative of the British Government wasn’t invited to that meeting it has nothing to do with us.
Actually, Priti Patel was invited until BJ stuck his oar in by provocatively making public his letter to the French President telling him how he should resolve the refugee issue. The French withdrew the invitation as a result.
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I think the French said that the UK were allowing people to work and pay taxes without ID, which would be attractive, this is not true.
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If you acknowledge that what you posted was incorrect it would make for a balanced and useful debate hound.
I have no idea if it was incorrect.
I was quoting was someone said on tv so that people could read it.
I also don’t want to debate anything with you.
You didn't read the link Albie put up then? nor the excerpts from it I posted? I suppose you think the government report is full of bollux too?
He doesn't read posted links, he's said so previously. I guess he'll not look at the link Wilts posted re Lord Kerr's destruction of Patel's narrative either!
I’m not sure if you are lying on purpose kato, or trying to provoke an argument.
I have never said I don’t read any links.
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If you acknowledge that what you posted was incorrect it would make for a balanced and useful debate hound.
I have no idea if it was incorrect.
I was quoting was someone said on tv so that people could read it.
I also don’t want to debate anything with you.
You didn't read the link Albie put up then? nor the excerpts from it I posted? I suppose you think the government report is full of bollux too?
He doesn't read posted links, he's said so previously. I guess he'll not look at the link Wilts posted re Lord Kerr's destruction of Patel's narrative either!
I’m not sure if you are lying on purpose kato, or trying to provoke an argument.
I have never said I don’t read any links.
But you do make claims that you don't read links, don't the papers, don't read comments to explain why you don't know stuff, isn't that correct hound?
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No it is incorrect.
I don’t read SOME links SR.
I don’t buy newspapers but I do listen to news bulletins and do read news on the internet.
I do look up some things that I don’t understand.
I don’t believe everything that I read, especially some of the shite on here.
In fact I don’t read everything that’s gets posted on here.
Hope that helps.
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No it is incorrect.
I don’t read SOME links SR.
I don’t buy newspapers but I do listen to news bulletins and do read news on the internet.
I do look up some things that I don’t understand.
I don’t believe everything that I read, especially some of the shite on here.
In fact I don’t read everything that’s gets posted on here.
Hope that helps.
Maybe if you did you'd have known your comment 233 was incorrect, just sayin' hound
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Maybe if you read that post properly you would see that it wasn’t my opinion, just something that I had heard on the news.
I didn’t suggest it was right.
Just telling you.
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Maybe if you read that post properly you would see that it wasn’t my opinion, just something that I had heard on the news.
I didn’t suggest it was right.
Just telling you.
Yes I totally understand that hound, but you are aware that others are ridiculed for posting anon' sources from the radio etc, that are usually debunked so I'm not sure why you would think that it's a valid point, but I do accept that you posted an unattributed source on a subject you are not familiar with for some reason.
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You’ve got the last word SR so rest easy on that thought.
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I find it interesting that the French answer yesterday is that the UK should make itself less attractive to refugees to solve the problem. Totally bizarre.
At least some one can see the way forward. Treat them bad and they won't want to come here.
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The bloke they interviewed in Iraq who was worried about where his wife and kids were (sadly suspected to have perished in the channel) did not seem like he needed to escape conflict or persecution.
They are economic migrants plain and simple. Not refugees. I believe there is some truth in the case for making the uk less appealing .
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If you acknowledge that what you posted was incorrect it would make for a balanced and useful debate hound.
I have no idea if it was incorrect.
I was quoting was someone said on tv so that people could read it.
I also don’t want to debate anything with you.
You didn't read the link Albie put up then? nor the excerpts from it I posted? I suppose you think the government report is full of bollux too?
He doesn't read posted links, he's said so previously. I guess he'll not look at the link Wilts posted re Lord Kerr's destruction of Patel's narrative either!
I’m not sure if you are lying on purpose kato, or trying to provoke an argument.
I have never said I don’t read any links.
Neither lying nor trying to provoke an argument, it was simply something you typed in a reply to me.
Meanwhile, we seem to have reached a new low in this country....
https://www.hastingsobserver.co.uk/news/people/hastings-rnli-lifeboat-crew-blocked-from-going-out-to-sea-by-people-angry-at-them-rescuing-refugees-3475179
And I'm given to understand that the ringleader is actually a local fisherman down there of all people!
p.s. I wonder if you'll read the article in this link?
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Interesting! Chairman of Hastings fishermens association states it was a row about the lifeboat launching from the east side of the Harbour arm instead of the West side ,there was a fishing boat in the way and there was a fall out, Police attended and no arrests made!
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If you acknowledge that what you posted was incorrect it would make for a balanced and useful debate hound.
I have no idea if it was incorrect.
I was quoting was someone said on tv so that people could read it.
I also don’t want to debate anything with you.
You didn't read the link Albie put up then? nor the excerpts from it I posted? I suppose you think the government report is full of bollux too?
He doesn't read posted links, he's said so previously. I guess he'll not look at the link Wilts posted re Lord Kerr's destruction of Patel's narrative either!
I’m not sure if you are lying on purpose kato, or trying to provoke an argument.
I have never said I don’t read any links.
Neither lying nor trying to provoke an argument, it was simply something you typed in a reply to me.
Meanwhile, we seem to have reached a new low in this country....
https://www.hastingsobserver.co.uk/news/people/hastings-rnli-lifeboat-crew-blocked-from-going-out-to-sea-by-people-angry-at-them-rescuing-refugees-3475179
And I'm given to understand that the ringleader is actually a local fisherman down there of all people!
p.s. I wonder if you'll read the article in this link?
Kato, sorry to correct you but I have never said I don’t read any links.
You won’t find a post of mine that says I never read any of them.
I did say that I don’t read some links, usually dependant on who posts them or what their agenda is.
I did read this latest one of yours because it seemed interesting.
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It is nothing to do with us, the accident happened in French waters. They want a border in the Irish sea, give them one in the channel.
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Another 900 between thurs and Friday this week.
Where on earth are they putting all these people?
In 2021 I reckon that’s the keepmoat filled twice, and that’s just the ones we know about.
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Just think of it as one of the richest countries in the world helping those that are being displaced through no fault of their own.
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I’ll agree with you up to and including the word helping.
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I was wondering why you keep posting about it
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Just think of it as one of the richest countries in the world helping those that are being displaced through no fault of their own.
Plenty of room here Sydney
despite the fact it's a small country , people who work can't always feed themselves other than foodbanks .
Decent housing and Schools at a premium and an NHS on its ass and needs more patients like I need piles.
Good shout from ten thousand miles away .
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Maybe the compact nature doesn't allow their minds to expand, but there you go aye
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Maybe the compact nature doesn't allow their minds to expand, but there you go aye
It certainly doesn't yours and you've the Outback to find your soul .
Although reality escapes you .
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Maybe the compact nature doesn't allow their minds to expand, but there you go aye
It certainly doesn't yours and you've the Outback to find your soul .
Although reality escapes you .
Nothing like a bit of sovrenty to bring out the worst in people aye
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Maybe the compact nature doesn't allow their minds to expand, but there you go aye
It certainly doesn't yours and you've the Outback to find your soul .
Although reality escapes you .
Nothing like a bit of sovrenty to bring out the worst in people aye
Nowt to do with sovereignty Sydney and more reality .
You've more room for expansion in Australia than any country I know .
Yet you have some of the toughest immigration rules in the world .
Not a word about that , not a peep .
Funny that .
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You need to read my back cattledog, meanwhile ...................
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7HxenkZBSRU
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You need to read my back cattledog, meanwhile ...................
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7HxenkZBSRU
Your alright though aren't you Sydney ? , well away from the reality .
The champagne clearly tastes very good in not me Guv land .
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A couple of weeks ago when that boat tragically went down in the channel with the pointless loss of life, a news team tracked down a man in Iraq who had lost his wife and children on the boat. He was still in Iraq. He had stayed behind in Iraq. He did not look, sound or allege to be suffering. He was not complaining of persecution or tyranny. He was certainly not fleeing conflict.
Many of those crossing the channel are economic migrants. Why else would they pass through safe countries such as Austria, Slovenia, Switzerland, Germany, France.
They are not fleeing persecution or conflict.
They come looking for a better life. That I accept.
But is that here for them?
Tens of thousands already use food banks in this country. We have our own homeless issues. This is a very difficult country to live in if you have little or nothing.
And it’s not getting any easier.
They think this is the land of milk and honey. It isn’t.
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A couple of weeks ago when that boat tragically went down in the channel with the pointless loss of life, a news team tracked down a man in Iraq who had lost his wife and children on the boat. He was still in Iraq. He had stayed behind in Iraq. He did not look, sound or allege to be suffering. He was not complaining of persecution or tyranny. He was certainly not fleeing conflict.
Many of those crossing the channel are economic migrants. Why else would they pass through safe countries such as Austria, Slovenia, Switzerland, Germany, France.
They are not fleeing persecution or conflict.
They come looking for a better life. That I accept.
But is that here for them?
Tens of thousands already use food banks in this country. We have our own homeless issues. This is a very difficult country to live in if you have little or nothing.
And it’s not getting any easier.
They think this is the land of milk and honey. It isn’t.
Absolutely nailed it .
We aren't heartless feckers we just see the reality of this .
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A couple of weeks ago when that boat tragically went down in the channel with the pointless loss of life, a news team tracked down a man in Iraq who had lost his wife and children on the boat. He was still in Iraq. He had stayed behind in Iraq. He did not look, sound or allege to be suffering. He was not complaining of persecution or tyranny. He was certainly not fleeing conflict.
Many of those crossing the channel are economic migrants. Why else would they pass through safe countries such as Austria, Slovenia, Switzerland, Germany, France.
They are not fleeing persecution or conflict.
They come looking for a better life. That I accept.
But is that here for them?
Tens of thousands already use food banks in this country. We have our own homeless issues. This is a very difficult country to live in if you have little or nothing.
And it’s not getting any easier.
They think this is the land of milk and honey. It isn’t.
Do you only read your own posts NR? if you go back through the thread you will see that you don't really have a clue or are maliciously trying to foment trouble, the majority of those landing are found to be genuine refugees.
I'll post it again
''Most people who risk Channel boat crossings are refugees – report
Analysis contradicts Priti Patel’s claim that 70% are single men who are economic migrants to UK''
https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2021/nov/17/most-people-who-risk-channel-boat-crossings-are-refugees-report
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Well it is in the Guardian so it must be true.
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A couple of weeks ago when that boat tragically went down in the channel with the pointless loss of life, a news team tracked down a man in Iraq who had lost his wife and children on the boat. He was still in Iraq. He had stayed behind in Iraq. He did not look, sound or allege to be suffering. He was not complaining of persecution or tyranny. He was certainly not fleeing conflict.
Many of those crossing the channel are economic migrants. Why else would they pass through safe countries such as Austria, Slovenia, Switzerland, Germany, France.
They are not fleeing persecution or conflict.
They come looking for a better life. That I accept.
But is that here for them?
Tens of thousands already use food banks in this country. We have our own homeless issues. This is a very difficult country to live in if you have little or nothing.
And it’s not getting any easier.
They think this is the land of milk and honey. It isn’t.
Absolutely spot on. Anyone who doesn't see this is either naive or kidding themselves for political righteousness.
Post of the year.
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https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2021/nov/17/most-people-who-risk-channel-boat-crossings-are-refugees-report
Any of the brave boys out there happy to bet on this and prove it is incorrect???
I'll put my £100 up to your £50 for the food bank, put up or shut I say.
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Well it is in the Guardian so it must be true.
Its heartening that your average Labour voter isn't swayed by the written media .
I mean for God sake like your average Tory voter or leaver is influenced by the Mail and Express .
Does this work only one way Hound ?
The Guardian is also owned by a tax dodging multi millionaire by the way .
Hypocrisy , who knew hound ?
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https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2021/nov/17/most-people-who-risk-channel-boat-crossings-are-refugees-report
Any of the brave boys out there happy to bet on this and prove it is incorrect???
I'll put my £100 up to your £50 for the food bank, put up or shut I say.
I've supported a food bank and worked in one free of charge .
You can shove your £100 up your ass pal .
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Our very own "Little Drummer Boy" at Christmas!
Come, they told me he's a proper pom pom
Our newborn King to see, a proper pom pom
The finest gifts he brings a proper pom pom
To lay before the king a proper pom pom, proper pom pom, proper pom pom
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Well it is in the Guardian so it must be true.
Its heartening that your average Labour voter isn't swayed by the written media .
I mean for God sake like your average Tory voter or leaver is influenced by the Mail and Express .
Does this work only one way Hound ?
The Guardian is also owned by a tax dodging multi millionaire by the way .
Hypocrisy , who knew hound ?
Would you like to pull another £50 our of your own arse and back yourself in on this I'm betting your wrong about this, Mr mouth no trousers? Double up if you wish. :)
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A couple of weeks ago when that boat tragically went down in the channel with the pointless loss of life, a news team tracked down a man in Iraq who had lost his wife and children on the boat. He was still in Iraq. He had stayed behind in Iraq. He did not look, sound or allege to be suffering. He was not complaining of persecution or tyranny. He was certainly not fleeing conflict.
Many of those crossing the channel are economic migrants. Why else would they pass through safe countries such as Austria, Slovenia, Switzerland, Germany, France.
They are not fleeing persecution or conflict.
They come looking for a better life. That I accept.
But is that here for them?
Tens of thousands already use food banks in this country. We have our own homeless issues. This is a very difficult country to live in if you have little or nothing.
And it’s not getting any easier.
They think this is the land of milk and honey. It isn’t.
Absolutely nailed it .
We aren't heartless feckers we just see the reality of this .
Nailed it? What utter twaddle. Based on what? the view of one life and how they interpreted it, not based on fact or anything akin to humanity. People fleeing persecution, would see food banks as a positive not a negative, it would show that people in this country care for their fellow human beings.
If you really want to put people off fleeing to the uk shores, we should allow them access to this forum.
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Seems some of them are not happy with uk hotel accommodation and want to go home. Oh, reported by the guardian also.
https://www.google.com/urlsa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=&ved=2ahUKEwjRsrC16u_0AhWDQ0EAHYNJCt8QFnoECCsQAQ&url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.theguardian.com%2Fworld%2F2021%2Foct%2F09%2Fafghan-refugees-uk-hotels-operation-warm-welcome&usg=AOvVaw2GBVEGQMAct0u0GkfuIhxC
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Figures release today shown that migrant crossing of the uk trebled that of 2020. In 2021, at least 28500 made the crossing.
That’s the equivalent of the pop of Beverley or Pontefract.
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They'll help repopulate the six Pontefract sized towns who died of Covid in 2020 then.
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Where are they all going to live? I am sick to death of seeing more and more housing estates being thrown up. Tiny houses, tiny gardens, so called detached houses about eighteen inches apart, cars parked everywhere... What about our quality of life? No wonder everyone is angry living on top of each other. When is full up? At what point will the do gooders accept the country is full up? What number is maxxed out?
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It’s not that we don’t have the room, we have if you compare us to places like Hong Kong or Mexico City. We just do not have the infrastructure. Services are already maxed out.
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It’s not that we don’t have the room, we have if you compare us to places like Hong Kong or Mexico City. We just do not have the infrastructure. Services are already maxed out.
Who wants to live in Hong Kong or Mexico City. The peace and quiet of the English countryside is a thing to be treasured. Once it's gone it's gone forever. Do we really want to look out of our windows at a sea of grey concrete and people?
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Whilst my examples were at the extreme, we do have room in the uk lots of it, by comparison.
But there are not enough houses, hospitals, doctors, nurses, dentists , schools, care homes to cater for extra thousands.
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Not particularly on the topic subject but relevant to what people have been discussing - talks on a trade deal with India will begin this week.
As previously mentioned one key damand that the Indian government has made to agree a deal is more & easier visas for Indian's to live and work in the UK. According to the Daily Mail, the government is set to agree to this:
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-10360317/Ministers-relax-immigration-rules-help-thousands-Indians-live-work-UK.html
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Not particularly on the topic subject but relevant to what people have been discussing - talks on a trade deal with India will begin this week.
As previously mentioned one key damand that the Indian government has made to agree a deal is more & easier visas for Indian's to live and work in the UK. According to the Daily Mail, the government is set to agree to this:
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-10360317/Ministers-relax-immigration-rules-help-thousands-Indians-live-work-UK.html
Providing any visas are reciprocal.
Cheap housing in India .
Nice climate.
Great food.
That’s my retirement sorted.
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Refugees that arrive legitimately are a net benefit to most countries, look no further than the US, Canada, Australia and many others, here's another good news story.
''Matil Haddad arrived in Alice Springs when she was 14, now she's the dux of her year 12 class.
"I was sort of thrown into this new world, and it was like 'OK, now go be an adult', and I was not ready; it was hard," she said.
Being one of the only Arab families in Alice Springs, there were no translators available to help her parents, so she was the family's translator''
Now Dux of her school.
https://www.abc.net.au/news/2022-01-05/matil-haddad-dux-year-12-class-alice-springs/100737810
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Not particularly on the topic subject but relevant to what people have been discussing - talks on a trade deal with India will begin this week.
As previously mentioned one key damand that the Indian government has made to agree a deal is more & easier visas for Indian's to live and work in the UK. According to the Daily Mail, the government is set to agree to this:
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-10360317/Ministers-relax-immigration-rules-help-thousands-Indians-live-work-UK.html
Providing any visas are reciprocal.
Cheap housing in India .
Nice climate.
Great food.
That’s my retirement sorted.
You'll have plenty to report on when you get there and being an economic refugee NR, be prepared for a forum backlash if you dare hold an opinion opposite to the mob.
''Refugees are people who are recognized as refugees under the 1951 Convention Relating to the Status of Refugees or its 1967 Protocol, the 1969 Organization of African Unity Convention Governing the Specific Aspects of Refugee Problems in Africa, people recognized as refugees in accordance with the UNHCR statute, people granted refugee-like humanitarian status, and people provided temporary protection. Asylum seekers--people who have applied for asylum or refugee status and who have not yet received a decision or who are registered as asylum seekers--are excluded. Palestinian refugees are people (and their descendants) whose residence was Palestine between June 1946 and May 1948 and who lost their homes and means of livelihood as a result of the 1948 Arab-Israeli conflict. Country of asylum is the country where an asylum claim was filed and granted.
India refugee statistics for 2020 was 195,403.00, a 0.15% increase from 2019''
India refugee statistics for 2019 was 195,103.00, a 0.4% decline from 2018.
India refugee statistics for 2018 was 195,887.00, a 0.64% decline from 2017.
India refugee statistics for 2017 was 197,142.00, a 0.36% decline from 2016''
https://www.macrotrends.net/countries/IND/india/refugee-statistics
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So brits that move abroad are classed as refugees ? Get real.
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So brits that move abroad are classed as refugees ? Get real.
So what would you call brits that have left the UK for better jobs or conditions in the middle east, the US, Europe or anywhere else including Australia for that matter?
''Providing any visas are reciprocal.
Cheap housing in India .
Nice climate.
Great food.
That’s my retirement sorted.
''
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So brits that move abroad are classed as refugees ? Get real.
So what would you call brits that have left the UK for better jobs or conditions in the middle east, the US, Europe or anywhere else including Australia for that matter?
''Providing any visas are reciprocal.
Cheap housing in India .
Nice climate.
Great food.
That’s my retirement sorted.
''
Not refugees don't be ridiculous. Migrants that's all. Economic migrants mainly. Better jobs and conditions is a highly subjective point.
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So brits that move abroad are classed as refugees ? Get real.
So what would you call brits that have left the UK for better jobs or conditions in the middle east, the US, Europe or anywhere else including Australia for that matter?
''Providing any visas are reciprocal.
Cheap housing in India .
Nice climate.
Great food.
That’s my retirement sorted.
''
Not refugees don't be ridiculous. Migrants that's all. Economic migrants mainly. Better jobs and conditions is a highly subjective point.
:that:
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So brits that move abroad are classed as refugees ? Get real.
So what would you call brits that have left the UK for better jobs or conditions in the middle east, the US, Europe or anywhere else including Australia for that matter?
''Providing any visas are reciprocal.
Cheap housing in India .
Nice climate.
Great food.
That’s my retirement sorted.
''
I could use exactly the same statement replacing India with Spain.
Are ex pats in Spain refugees. ?
Besides. I have no intention to work in retirement .
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So brits that move abroad are classed as refugees ? Get real.
So what would you call brits that have left the UK for better jobs or conditions in the middle east, the US, Europe or anywhere else including Australia for that matter?
''Providing any visas are reciprocal.
Cheap housing in India .
Nice climate.
Great food.
That’s my retirement sorted.
''
Do us all a favour and pick a spot where there is no WiFI
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You guys must remember some of the first Brit refugees in the early 1600 from around Bawtry and sailed went to America. Fortunately the native Americans were more civilised, probably cos they didn't have religion and saved a lot of them from starving.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lrOgGxSgGF4
By the way most of the hundreds of thousands of Brits that leave every year are of working age.
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Oh I think you will find that most of the original inhabitants of countries had a form of religion a belief in something powerfull usually associated with nature, including Oz
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but I'll think you'll find RR that most didn't want to kill any that didn't follow the official brand.
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Who didn't want to kill whom and official brand of which?
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Correction accepted, if you had to pay fines and couldn't work, I guess you starved. Much like the 1.5m Irish under British rule that emigrated.
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Will this help....be interesting to see if this dissuades the people smugglers?
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-60021252
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I’m hoping the Navy won’t f**k around with this. It will be all down to the mandate they are given I suppose.
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Will this help....be interesting to see if this dissuades the people smugglers?
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-60021252
Are they going to operate in France?
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This has got bugger all to do with addressing the basic problem. It's another offensive (in every sense of the word) of Operation Red Meat to try to get the backwoodsmen Tory MPs off Johnson's back.
Same with the BBC policy.
If you're being chased by a pack of baying dogs, chucking them a couple of uncooked steaks might distract them. There is no joined up thinking in any of it though. Just a self-preservation panic response.
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Will this help....be interesting to see if this dissuades the people smugglers?
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-60021252
Are they going to operate in France?
I don't know - missed the meeting.
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Missed reading the article too methinks
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Seems as a result of me badgering Priti Patel on the channel crisis, I’ve been added to the mailing list for the clandestine channel threat commander. Here’s what he has to say.I will judge him on the outcomes.I’m not optimistic.
Thank you for your correspondence of 12 November 2021 regarding illegal entry to the UK, in particular via small boat crossings of the English Channel. I am the Clandestine Channel Threat Commander and I am responding on behalf of the Home Secretary.
We are deeply saddened by the loss of life seen in the Channel on 24 November, and our thoughts are with the victims and their families. This is yet another reminder of how lethal these journeys are and why they must be stopped. The criminals that facilitate these journeys have no regard for life and we will use every tactic at our disposal to break their business model.
The Government is clear that those who need protection should claim asylum in the first safe country they reach. That is the fastest route to safety. France, where almost all of these crossings originate, is a safe country with its own asylum system. The Government is doing all it can to ensure that those who need protection seek it in the first safe country they arrive.
The UK is also working closely with France to improve border security in Calais and the surrounding region. In July, the Home Secretary agreed a package of support with the French Interior Minister, Gerald Darmanin, as part of our shared commitment to fight all forms of illegal immigration.
This package includes measures to:
• strengthen law enforcement deployments along the French coast, more than doubling police resources on the ground;
• deploy more surveillance technology, in the air and on land, to prevent crossing attempts;
• increase border security at key transport infrastructure points along the French coast; and
• increase support for migrants in France, including options for voluntary return to countries of origin where appropriate.
These measures will enable patrols of wider areas of coastline, improve the detection and prevention of crossing attempts, and better ensure that those fleeing persecution are properly supported in France.
In 2021, more than 23,000 crossing attempts were prevented – a massive increase on the same point in 2020. In the first six months of 2021, arrests of facilitators averaged over 100 a month.
However, boats have continued to arrive and so we need to adapt our tactics. Our tactics will include physically opposing these crossings and turning boats back at sea. Disclosing the detail of this would advantage the people smugglers, but we will only use these techniques when it is safe to do so. However, these crossings are inherently dangerous and those embarking upon them are endangering themselves and others. Stopping these crossings and deterring future ones is an essential safety measure.
My officers are working closely with the National Crime Agency and with our partners in Europe to target the criminal gangs. We need to dismantle these networks and bring the criminals who treat human beings as cargo to justice. We have prosecuted dozens of people for facilitating these dangerous and unnecessary crossings and the provisions in the Nationality and Borders Bill will increase the penalties for those endangering life in pursuit of profit in this way.
These measures are all part of the Government’s New Plan for Immigration, designed to bring root and branch reform to the asylum system. The Nationality and Borders Bill is the legislative framework for this plan.
The Bill introduces a one-stop process requiring all asylum, human rights, and any other protection matters to be brought and considered together in a single assessment upfront, in order to end the practice of bringing last-minute legal actions which can frustrate lawful removal. There will also be significant reforms to the age assessment process, to better identify those adults passing themselves off as children.
It is currently a criminal offence to enter or be in the UK illegally, carrying a maximum penalty of six months in prison. The Government intends to increase that penalty through the Bill, and for the offence to cover the act of seeking illegal entry to the UK. Tougher action will be taken against anyone who facilitates illegal entry, such as by piloting a small boat. The Bill also raises the maximum sentence for people smuggling to life imprisonment.
I can assure you that we are taking every necessary step to stop these Channel crossings, to bring to justice the criminals that profit from them, and to control our borders.
Dan O’Mahoney
Clandestine Channel Threat Commander.
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Is this a spoof NR?
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No, genuine email from Border Force .
I’ve been constantly badgering Priti Patel via email. I’m probably not alone.so they have seen fit to put this out.
I don’t believe in just whining on here.
I express my concerns with those who are paid to sort it.
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It's very similar the the Oz gov't response, hide behind concern for the refugees safety but it drives the culture war.
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Do you think it is a good idea to appoint such a role SR.
What are your thoughts about this?
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My concern is it is just an alternative person to lay blame on when crossings continue. Priti is passing the book here IMO. Probably part of her master plan to be next PM no doubt.
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''Hi, I’m Dan O’Mahoney - Clandestine Channel Threat Commander.
Follow me for updates on everything we’re doing to stop the people smugglers sending people across the Channel and to make this dangerous route unviable''
https://twitter.com/ukhomeoffice/status/1313094621937971207?lang=en
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I guess Dan Dare type stuff make more noise and the gov't gets more bang for their buck on chasing down poor f**kers in little boats.
Estimates of over 400,000 illegal immigrants in the UK.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Illegal_immigration_to_the_United_Kingdom#:~:text=For%20the%20LSE%20team%20illegal,ranging%20between%2044%2C000%20and%20144%2C000.
And these people must have to earn a crust somewhere, no? .........
''The number of people prosecuted for employing illegal immigrants fell by 75 per cent in the year after the law was changed to lower the threshold for the offence, new figures have revealed.
Data from the Home Office, released in a freedom of information (FOI) request submitted by People Management, revealed that between 12 July 2016 and 11 July 2017 just three individuals were prosecuted under section 21 of the Immigration, Asylum and Nationality Act 2006. By contrast, 12 individuals were prosecuted under the same offence between 12 July 2015 and 11 July 2016''
https://www.peoplemanagement.co.uk/news/articles/prosecutions-hiring-illegal-immigrants-fell#gref
I asked Dan what the latest figures were but he said to ask Petty Patel.
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Well it seems the single males who are entering the country will soon be finding themselves on a one way ticket to Rwanda.
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Anyone quoting either johnson or his minions should know by now to wait for the truth to come out.
''The Refugee Council said 172 people could have been sent to the east African country had a deal been in place. It estimates that this year the number is not likely to be much higher.
The figures cast doubt on Boris Johnson’s claim that “tens of thousands” of people who have arrived in the UK without authorisation could be given a one-way ticket to Rwanda.''
https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2022/apr/25/refugee-data-analysis-casts-doubt-on-boris-johnsons-rwanda-claim
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The first flight to Rwanda is in 2 weeks.
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The first flight to Rwanda is in 2 weeks.
Except it won't be. Which is the whole point.
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Just to set out the utter moral vacuum at the heart of this Government, the plan is to send 15 Syrians to Rwanda. That's 15 people who have fled another one of Putin's bestial wars.
They won't send them of course, beuse as ever, the Home Office will have played fast and loose with the legal process. There will be appeals. Patel will put her Himmler face on and play to the reactionary pensioners in the Culture War, with lines about lefty activist lawyers from the Elite stopping you having your pound of flesh.
And does anyone think for a minute it's a coincidence that this has been announced as the 54 letter target is hoving into view?
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Compare our chilling, un Christian and vengeful policy towards refugees to that which applies in Colombia. 20% of the population of Venezuela have WALKED out of the country in the last 10 years. A helluva lot of those have walked into Colombia. It's a huge, huge number. On every road you walk, drive or look down you will see a family walking. Destitute. Begging. Starving. And the reaction of the locals, and the politicians? The locals put their hands in their pockets. The poliiticians last year granted such refugees, en masse, a 5 year visa which allows them to work and to be there legally. It gave them dignity and it stopped them being forced into the shadows. Yes. A lot of them are poor, very poor. But they have a chance now.
Us? I am in the midst of trying to obtain a UK visitor visa for a none European.For a bloody holiday. No more. Not only is the process itself shameful in its mendacity and its well nigh unbelievable rules and processes, but the tick box decision makers, in Sheffield, are inexperienced, almost untrained (all the good ones are now devoted to Ukraine only), and, impossible to appeal. It is ILLEGAL to appeal! What sort of f**king country is this??? Billy is right. Throiw out some red meat.
Oh. And the government appointed contractors who do the leg work taking photos and finger prints of applicants, seem to be unpoliced, unchecked and uncontrolled. Extortion rackets are going on under the name of the British government. Even my local Tory MP, a devoted leadership sycophant, was moved to call it 'concerning'. I await Pritti Patel's response...
BobG
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population of Nigeria will reach £450 million by 2050 Put that in your pipe and smoke it!
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Wash rinse repeat .......
''Clear majority of people crossing Channel are refugees, says UNHCR
UN agency says most arriving in UK by small boat should not be called migrants, in challenge to Priti Patel''
https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2022/jun/02/clear-majority-of-people-crossing-channel-are-refugees-says-unhcr
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Yes they are.. economic refugees!
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Yes they are.. economic refugees!
You are Jonathan Harmsworth and I claim my £5
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Wash rinse repeat .......
''Clear majority of people crossing Channel are refugees, says UNHCR
UN agency says most arriving in UK by small boat should not be called migrants, in challenge to Priti Patel''
https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2022/jun/02/clear-majority-of-people-crossing-channel-are-refugees-says-unhcr
Is this the same UNHCR where staff in Uganda and Kenya were taking back handlers from “refugees” to be resettled in western countries?
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Just to set out the utter moral vacuum at the heart of this Government, the plan is to send 15 Syrians to Rwanda. That's 15 people who have fled another one of Putin's bestial wars.
They won't send them of course, beuse as ever, the Home Office will have played fast and loose with the legal process. There will be appeals. Patel will put her Himmler face on and play to the reactionary pensioners in the Culture War, with lines about lefty activist lawyers from the Elite stopping you having your pound of flesh.
And does anyone think for a minute it's a coincidence that this has been announced as the 54 letter target is hoving into view?
Aaaaaaaaannnnnddddd....here we go.
https://mobile.twitter.com/Samfr/status/1534647311342743559
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All so depressingly predictable.
No solutions from this Govt. Just yet another play in the Culture War. Because that is the only strategy they have.
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When the EU do it, when the UN do it not a word when this government do it everyone is up in arms
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And
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I've no idea about the detail of the EU scheme, but what exactly is your point. If we implement a policy that is simply barbaric, is it all OK as long as the EU is doing something bad?
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I think his point is that no one has said a word about the EU policy.
Some might say, why has that got anything to do with us because we are in another country.
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I think his point is that no one has said a word about the EU policy.
Some might say, why has that got anything to do with us because we are in another country.
Your right it doesn't have anything to do with us as a different country. But his point does stand that there is always a certain hypocrisy from some of the biggest whiners about all things and everything when it's done here but not a murmur when the same things are occurring elsewhere in the world. Some of the climate change rent a mob are some of the worst, they complain about our emissions but not a word is spoken about what happens in the far east where they buy there bundles of crap from, jump on planes to holiday destinations and have their heating on full blast all autumn and winter, like anything they do doesn't matter, it has to be someone else, shocking.
Back to genuine refugees, its pretty obvious that there are a sizable number of these on the continent who wish to come here for various reason, (language, family ties, friends, the British way of life?)whats desperately required is a solution that allows these people to stake their claims in their current place of abode, to be processed by competent border control and when all criteria is satisfied to allow them to come here by convectional means, the people smugglers must be taken out of the equation, if this happens then we might just find that the overall coast to the country is reduced by billions. This is taken off the front pages and people can get back to moaning about something else.
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I think his point is that no one has said a word about the EU policy.
Some might say, why has that got anything to do with us because we are in another country.
Your right it doesn't have anything to do with us as a different country. But his point does stand that there is always a certain hypocrisy from some of the biggest whiners about all things and everything when it's done here but not a murmur when the same things are occurring elsewhere in the world. Some of the climate change rent a mob are some of the worst, they complain about our emissions but not a word is spoken about what happens in the far east where they buy there bundles of crap from, jump on planes to holiday destinations and have their heating on full blast all autumn and winter, like anything they do doesn't matter, it has to be someone else, shocking.
Back to genuine refugees, its pretty obvious that there are a sizable number of these on the continent who wish to come here for various reason, (language, family ties, friends, the British way of life?)whats desperately required is a solution that allows these people to stake their claims in their current place of abode, to be processed by competent border control and when all criteria is satisfied to allow them to come here by convectional means, the people smugglers must be taken out of the equation, if this happens then we might just find that the overall coast to the country is reduced by billions. This is taken off the front pages and people can get back to moaning about something else.
You are right with much of that Danumdon.
I also agree about the hypocrisy factor.
It should be true as well that some people from overseas have no right to complain about how things that happen in England have anything to do with them.
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I only want the answer to the question what some people on here think the word illegal means, would they be happy for someone to smash their head in with a brick if someone said t was ok and was not illegal?
Legal immigrants even if they were sky blue pink with yellow dots would be welcome for me, but the illegal and economic migrants are not whatever colour or creed.
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Look up what the UK signed up to in 1951 the UNHCR refugee convention that should tell you something about it.
Although the government you put in doesn't appear to care for laws that don't suit them aye?
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Only just realised that the policy is a transfer agreement - that is the UK government has agreed to take-in refugees FROM Rwanda in return for us shipping some out there (Point 16).
Funny how this hasn't been more widely publicisied...
https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/memorandum-of-understanding-mou-between-the-uk-and-rwanda/memorandum-of-understanding-between-the-government-of-the-united-kingdom-of-great-britain-and-northern-ireland-and-the-government-of-the-republic-of-r#part-1--transfer-arrangments
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Look up what the UK signed up to in 1951 the UNHCR refugee convention that should tell you something about it.
Although the government you put in doesn't appear to care for laws that don't suit them aye?
Genuine Refugees Welcome
Illegal migrants Not Welcome
Telling the difference? Thats the million dollar question
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Look up what the UK signed up to in 1951 the UNHCR refugee convention that should tell you something about it.
Although the government you put in doesn't appear to care for laws that don't suit them aye?
Genuine Refugees Welcome
Illegal migrants Not Welcome
Telling the difference? Thats the million dollar question
75% of arrivals to year end March 2022 were granted asylum - so clearly there is a system
https://www.refugeecouncil.org.uk/information/refugee-asylum-facts/top-10-facts-about-refugees-and-people-seeking-asylum/
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Look up what the UK signed up to in 1951 the UNHCR refugee convention that should tell you something about it.
Although the government you put in doesn't appear to care for laws that don't suit them aye?
Genuine Refugees Welcome
Illegal migrants Not Welcome
Telling the difference? Thats the million dollar question
75% of arrivals to year end March 2022 were granted asylum - so clearly there is a system
https://www.refugeecouncil.org.uk/information/refugee-asylum-facts/top-10-facts-about-refugees-and-people-seeking-asylum/
75% of those that presented and requested asylum, what about the ones who land on the beaches and just disappear?
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Are they the similar to the ones that arrive by plane and just disappear?
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Are they the similar to the ones that arrive by plane and just disappear?
Syd, I dont think any decent human being has an issue with genuine refugees, likewise I don't think anyone who thinks about it can honestly say all beach arrivals are genuine refugees
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I've no idea about the detail of the EU scheme, but what exactly is your point. If we implement a policy that is simply barbaric, is it all OK as long as the EU is doing something bad?
Why is it Barbaric?
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That's correct Ldr but until they are evaluated they are refugees not illegals despite what members of the govt the populist media and some on here say. And to repeat, most of those that do get here are deemed to be genuine refugees. Have you any numbers on those that 'just disappear' where is your evidence?
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That's correct Ldr but until they are evaluated they are refugees not illegals despite what members of the govt the populist media and some on here say. And to repeat, most of those that do get here are deemed to be genuine refugees. Have you any numbers on those that 'just disappear' where is your evidence?
Don't come on here criticising the UK Government, have a go at you own countries policies first!
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That's correct Ldr but until they are evaluated they are refugees not illegals despite what members of the govt the populist media and some on here say. And to repeat, most of those that do get here are deemed to be genuine refugees. Have you any numbers on those that 'just disappear' where is your evidence?
Don't come on here criticising the UK Government, have a go at you own countries policies first!
We just voted them out sprot
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That's correct Ldr but until they are evaluated they are refugees not illegals despite what members of the govt the populist media and some on here say. And to repeat, most of those that do get here are deemed to be genuine refugees. Have you any numbers on those that 'just disappear' where is your evidence?
Interesting that someone should be asking for evidence of numbers who land on the beach and then just disappear.
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That's correct Ldr but until they are evaluated they are refugees not illegals despite what members of the govt the populist media and some on here say. And to repeat, most of those that do get here are deemed to be genuine refugees. Have you any numbers on those that 'just disappear' where is your evidence?
Interesting that someone should be asking for evidence of numbers who land on the beach and then just disappear.
Someone has made a claim that people land on a beach and then disappear - so they must know more about it?
Lets hope they are not potential terrorists if it is that easy to land in this country - and just disappear. I would be surprised if this were so - but happy to await the evidence.
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That's correct Ldr but until they are evaluated they are refugees not illegals despite what members of the govt the populist media and some on here say. And to repeat, most of those that do get here are deemed to be genuine refugees. Have you any numbers on those that 'just disappear' where is your evidence?
Interesting that someone should be asking for evidence of numbers who land on the beach and then just disappear.
Someone has made a claim that people land on a beach and then disappear - so they must know more about it?
Lets hope they are not potential terrorists if it is that easy to land in this country - and just disappear. I would be surprised if this were so - but happy to await the evidence.
Wilts, I would be even more surprised if anyone has evidence of numbers, given that no one has any records of them.
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That's correct Ldr but until they are evaluated they are refugees not illegals despite what members of the govt the populist media and some on here say. And to repeat, most of those that do get here are deemed to be genuine refugees. Have you any numbers on those that 'just disappear' where is your evidence?
Interesting that someone should be asking for evidence of numbers who land on the beach and then just disappear.
Someone has made a claim that people land on a beach and then disappear - so they must know more about it?
Lets hope they are not potential terrorists if it is that easy to land in this country - and just disappear. I would be surprised if this were so - but happy to await the evidence.
Wilts, I would be even more surprised if anyone has evidence of numbers, given that no one has any records of them.
Somebody said they were landing - so they must have evidence of them - or how would they know they are landing?
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Another record yesterday. 700+
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About time they did summat to stop these illegals coming over.
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sort of like a Dunkirk thingy?
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About time they did summat to stop these illegals coming over.
Probably quite difficult when the French turn a blind eye.
They probably even give them the boats.
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About time they did summat to stop these illegals coming over.
Probably quite difficult when the French turn a blind eye.
They probably even give them the boats.
I thought we had taken control of our borders? I didnt realise we had asked the French to do it. Are they going to protect us from Russian subs as well?
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About time they did summat to stop these illegals coming over.
Probably quite difficult when the French turn a blind eye.
They probably even give them the boats.
I thought we had taken control of our borders? I didnt realise we had asked the French to do it. Are they going to protect us from Russian subs as well?
I wouldn’t know about any of that wilts.
Are Russian subs a threat to us?
Do you think the French are trying to stop them setting off?
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About time they did summat to stop these illegals coming over.
Probably quite difficult when the French turn a blind eye.
They probably even give them the boats.
I thought we had taken control of our borders? I didnt realise we had asked the French to do it. Are they going to protect us from Russian subs as well?
Our area of Control starts somehere in the middle of the Channel we have no control of what is happening on the coastline of another Soverigbn state. As you well know!
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Maybe a wall should be built there, similar to the one in the Irish sea
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Priti’Pathetic’ is keeping her head down these days.
Customs used to employ ‘Watchmen’ who would patrol a section of the coast of Britain. They knew every harbour master, every fisherman’s boat, every landing area for small boats.
They were done away with as a government cost cutting exercise sometime in the 60/70’s.
We have some 7700 miles of coastline along the British shores. If the government were to employ Customs Officers to ‘protect’ 30 miles of that coastline, in effect being our ‘wall’ against smugglers landing anything anywhere without being discovered, you’d be talking about 250 Officers.
Have them patrol a 60 mile area & you halve the number of Officers needed.
Is that too much to ask of any government?
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About time they did summat to stop these illegals coming over.
Probably quite difficult when the French turn a blind eye.
They probably even give them the boats.
I thought we had taken control of our borders? I didnt realise we had asked the French to do it. Are they going to protect us from Russian subs as well?
Our area of Control starts somehere in the middle of the Channel we have no control of what is happening on the coastline of another Soverigbn state. As you well know!
So its irrelevant what the French do then? Better tell hound that - he appears under the impression they are supposed to be guarding 'our border'.
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About time they did summat to stop these illegals coming over.
Probably quite difficult when the French turn a blind eye.
They probably even give them the boats.
I thought we had taken control of our borders? I didnt realise we had asked the French to do it. Are they going to protect us from Russian subs as well?
Our area of Control starts somehere in the middle of the Channel we have no control of what is happening on the coastline of another Soverigbn state. As you well know!
So its irrelevant what the French do then? Better tell hound that - he appears under the impression they are supposed to be guarding 'our border'.
Wilts, the French don’t want them as much as we don’t.
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About time they did summat to stop these illegals coming over.
Probably quite difficult when the French turn a blind eye.
They probably even give them the boats.
I thought we had taken control of our borders? I didnt realise we had asked the French to do it. Are they going to protect us from Russian subs as well?
Our area of Control starts somehere in the middle of the Channel we have no control of what is happening on the coastline of another Soverigbn state. As you well know!
So its irrelevant what the French do then? Better tell hound that - he appears under the impression they are supposed to be guarding 'our border'.
Weren't we chucking £58 million at the French to patrol their coastline?
Also I just don't understand why they would want to come to England when they are already in the Utopian Paradise(according to the Wokes who post on here)of the EU?
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About time they did summat to stop these illegals coming over.
Probably quite difficult when the French turn a blind eye.
They probably even give them the boats.
I thought we had taken control of our borders? I didnt realise we had asked the French to do it. Are they going to protect us from Russian subs as well?
Our area of Control starts somehere in the middle of the Channel we have no control of what is happening on the coastline of another Soverigbn state. As you well know!
So its irrelevant what the French do then? Better tell hound that - he appears under the impression they are supposed to be guarding 'our border'.
Wilts, the French don’t want them as much as we don’t.
Given how hard it is to get enough staff in any of our factories I very much do want them. Grocery inflation is surging and the high wages, golden hellos, loyalty bonuses etc. we're having to pay to try and get anywhere near the amount of staff we need are all contributing factors.
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About time they did summat to stop these illegals coming over.
Probably quite difficult when the French turn a blind eye.
They probably even give them the boats.
I thought we had taken control of our borders? I didnt realise we had asked the French to do it. Are they going to protect us from Russian subs as well?
Our area of Control starts somehere in the middle of the Channel we have no control of what is happening on the coastline of another Soverigbn state. As you well know!
So its irrelevant what the French do then? Better tell hound that - he appears under the impression they are supposed to be guarding 'our border'.
Wilts, the French don’t want them as much as we don’t.
Given how hard it is to get enough staff in any of our factories I very much do want them. Grocery inflation is surging and the high wages, golden hellos, loyalty bonuses etc. we're having to pay to try and get anywhere near the amount of staff we need are all contributing factors.
As a remain voter, I agree with you.
My post was a bit tongue in cheek Mike (we still need that emoji) based on the reasons that many in favour of Brexit voted for.
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Sorry, Hound. I've not been on the forum much for quite a long time so forgot your position on this.
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Sorry, Hound. I've not been on the forum much for quite a long time so forgot your position on this.
Not an issue Mike. I don’t read all of the posts either, in fact i don’t go into the Ukraine or Coronavirus threads anymore as they seem to be about one or two people arguing with bst.
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Well you can't blame them for wanting to come here, they have a good chance of being warmer in their hotels than lots of pensioners will be in their own homes from November to March.
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Yep, Iran, Iraq, Eritrea and the Sudan are fairly cool areas
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Yep, Iran, Iraq, Eritrea and the Sudan are fairly cool areas
Unlike North West France, which will be freezing come winter living under a tarpaulin.
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Yep, Iran, Iraq, Eritrea and the Sudan are fairly cool areas
There speaks someone who has never been to the desert in Iraq. Where temperatures can and do get below zero on occasion. Winter temps in Bagdhad for instance range from 2-15 c in winter months .
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Yep, Iran, Iraq, Eritrea and the Sudan are fairly cool areas
There speaks someone who has never been to the desert in Iraq. Where temperatures can and do get below zero on occasion. Winter temps in Bagdhad for instance range from 2-15 c in winter months .
Obviously it’s never been mentioned in the Guardian NR
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Yep, Iran, Iraq, Eritrea and the Sudan are fairly cool areas
Unlike North West France, which will be freezing come winter living under a tarpaulin.
Why they living under tarpaulin shouldn't the French being treating em the same as us or am I missing something here?
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Yep, Iran, Iraq, Eritrea and the Sudan are fairly cool areas
There speaks someone who has never been to the desert in Iraq. Where temperatures can and do get below zero on occasion. Winter temps in Bagdhad for instance range from 2-15 c in winter months .
And you know this because .................?
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Yep, Iran, Iraq, Eritrea and the Sudan are fairly cool areas
Unlike North West France, which will be freezing come winter living under a tarpaulin.
Why they living under tarpaulin shouldn't the French being treating em the same as us or am I missing something here?
some say you are missing something that's true sprot
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Yep, Iran, Iraq, Eritrea and the Sudan are fairly cool areas
There speaks someone who has never been to the desert in Iraq. Where temperatures can and do get below zero on occasion. Winter temps in Bagdhad for instance range from 2-15 c in winter months .
And you know this because .................?
I’ve been there. 1991. Op Haven. ( Op Provide Comfort was the US name )
Protecting north of the 37th parallel when saddams national guard were being pushed north by what was happening in Kuwait. And he thought it was ok to shoot the shit out of the Kurds.
Freezing cold at night time. Baking hot during the day.
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and the revelence is ?
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and the revelence is ?
Your comment about the climate in Iraq et Al was tongue in cheek. Sarcasm. A dig at Selbys comment about migrants being kept warm in the uk.
You believe those Middle Eastern and African countries are hot/ warm. They are. On the whole.
But in the case of Iraq, it can get f**king cold too,
So your sarcasm is ill placed. I can’t talk of Eritrea, or Iran or Sudan as I haven’t been to any of those areas.
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and the revelence is ?
Your comment about the climate in Iraq et Al was tongue in cheek. Sarcasm. A dig at Selbys comment about migrants being kept warm in the uk.
You believe those Middle Eastern and African countries are hot/ warm. They are. On the whole.
But in the case of Iraq, it can get f**king cold too,
So your sarcasm is ill placed. I can’t talk of Eritrea, or Iran or Sudan as I haven’t been to any of those areas.
selby is confused a bit like an old radio not quite tuned in properly on the station, a bit passed the sweet spot you might say.
And is still doesn't explain your post
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It seems 1500 male Asylum seekers are not welcome in a certain part of North Yorkshire.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-york-north-yorkshire-62481011
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Yep, Iran, Iraq, Eritrea and the Sudan are fairly cool areas
Unlike North West France, which will be freezing come winter living under a tarpaulin.
Why they living under tarpaulin shouldn't the French being treating em the same as us or am I missing something here?
some say you are missing something that's true sprot
You need to be getting some military training ready for the forthcoming invasion!
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Stop sucking on the lead soldiers sprot
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Yep, Iran, Iraq, Eritrea and the Sudan are fairly cool areas
What, you mean like to ‘hang out’ in?
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dunno Col does it say that in the quote?
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Well you can't blame them for wanting to come here, they have a good chance of being warmer in their hotels than lots of pensioners will be in their own homes from November to March.
''Getting out of the house and being in a different place costs money. So our accommodation often feels like a prison''
https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2022/aug/10/i-miss-the-simple-things-having-a-drink-or-an-ice-cream-you-cant-do-that-on-41-a-week
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Official figures now puts the number of those that have crossed the channel this year to over 20,000. Or around the population of Selby.
That’s the ones we know about.
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Does that add any credence to the need for photo ID to enable people to vote in elections etc.
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I'll just park this here....
https://www.mirror.co.uk/news/politics/anger-over-rwanda-political-killings-27761375
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Stupid idea St Kilda would have been a much better option
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I'll just park this here....
https://www.mirror.co.uk/news/politics/anger-over-rwanda-political-killings-27761375
Just to summarise.
1) Patel asks an expert on Rwanda for his take on whether Rwanda is safe.
2) Experts says it isn't.
3) Patel ignores him and goes ahead with the scheme.
4) Patel us taken to court and a redacted version of expert's report is presented as evidence.
5) The Plaintiffs ask for the redacted to be dumped so they can see the rest.
6) Patel's lawyer says there's no point as all it is is one expert's opinion.
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I’m f**king outraged
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Goodness, is that the time?
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A record number of migrants attempted to cross the English Channel in small boats yesterday, the Ministry of Defence has revealed.
A total of 1,295 people were detected crossing the channel, the highest daily number since current records began, with 27 boats detected by the Royal Navy and Border Force vessels.
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A record number of migrants attempted to cross the English Channel in small boats yesterday, the Ministry of Defence has revealed.
A total of 1,295 people were detected crossing the channel, the highest daily number since current records began, with 27 boats detected by the Royal Navy and Border Force vessels.
27 separate boats and we have no means of stopping them..... it does seem incredulous.
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How do you inflate 27 Boats large enough to carry 50 people put our order motors on them load them and not come to the attention of the French authorities!
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How do you inflate 27 Boats large enough to carry 50 people put our order motors on them load them and not come to the attention of the French authorities!
Naive to think the French authorities pay anything more than lip service to these activities. They certainly don't want these migrants and are quite happy to see them disappear in their boats towards the demarcation line in the channel.
There was an article a while back that stated they were even piloting some of the boats in the right direction and virtually handing them over to the British border force to deal with.
What kind of behaviour is that! and more importantly why are the usual types on here and the EU authorities, who feel they have something to say about everything except this, not making any sort of fuss about the French pursuing this very dangerous for the migrants policy. ?
Why are the French considered untouchable and unimpeachable for everything they wish to do.
Why do so many NGO.s make such a big stink about how these arrivals are handled and subsequently dealt with over here but have absolutely nothing to say about the disgusting conditions that the French force these unfortunates to have to live in?
Can anyone blame them for risking their lives to get here?
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How do you inflate 27 Boats large enough to carry 50 people put our order motors on them load them and not come to the attention of the French authorities!
Naive to think the French authorities pay anything more than lip service to these activities. They certainly don't want these migrants and are quite happy to see them disappear in their boats towards the demarcation line in the channel.
There was an article a while back that stated they were even piloting some of the boats in the right direction and virtually handing them over to the British border force to deal with.
What kind of behaviour is that! and more importantly why are the usual types on here and the EU authorities, who feel they have something to say about everything except this, not making any sort of fuss about the French pursuing this very dangerous for the migrants policy. ?
Why are the French considered untouchable and unimpeachable for everything they wish to do.
Why do so many NGO.s make such a big stink about how these arrivals are handled and subsequently dealt with over here but have absolutely nothing to say about the disgusting conditions that the French force these unfortunates to have to live in?
Can anyone blame them for risking their lives to get here?
Go on then, DD, tell us what the UK would do if the boot were on the other foot.
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How do you inflate 27 Boats large enough to carry 50 people put our order motors on them load them and not come to the attention of the French authorities!
Naive to think the French authorities pay anything more than lip service to these activities. They certainly don't want these migrants and are quite happy to see them disappear in their boats towards the demarcation line in the channel.
There was an article a while back that stated they were even piloting some of the boats in the right direction and virtually handing them over to the British border force to deal with.
What kind of behaviour is that! and more importantly why are the usual types on here and the EU authorities, who feel they have something to say about everything except this, not making any sort of fuss about the French pursuing this very dangerous for the migrants policy. ?
Why are the French considered untouchable and unimpeachable for everything they wish to do.
Why do so many NGO.s make such a big stink about how these arrivals are handled and subsequently dealt with over here but have absolutely nothing to say about the disgusting conditions that the French force these unfortunates to have to live in?
Can anyone blame them for risking their lives to get here?
Go on then, DD, tell us what the UK would do if the boot were on the other foot.
Totally hypothetical and crass question as the UK is proving what it's doing by treating these migrants with some respect and dignity by giving them a damn sight more assistance than the French have ever done.
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How do you inflate 27 Boats large enough to carry 50 people put our order motors on them load them and not come to the attention of the French authorities!
I read a report about this when it first started. Many of the boats are bought on Amazon. You would think it would be easy to track where they come from. But it isn’t by all accounts. Selling boats isn’t illegal of course. Neither is selling outboard motors.
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and the revelence is ?
To answer your question Syd……
R E V A L E N C E
A band of Finnish Corinthians touring the leading regattas of the world.
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How do you inflate 27 Boats large enough to carry 50 people put our order motors on them load them and not come to the attention of the French authorities!
Naive to think the French authorities pay anything more than lip service to these activities. They certainly don't want these migrants and are quite happy to see them disappear in their boats towards the demarcation line in the channel.
There was an article a while back that stated they were even piloting some of the boats in the right direction and virtually handing them over to the British border force to deal with.
What kind of behaviour is that! and more importantly why are the usual types on here and the EU authorities, who feel they have something to say about everything except this, not making any sort of fuss about the French pursuing this very dangerous for the migrants policy. ?
Why are the French considered untouchable and unimpeachable for everything they wish to do.
Why do so many NGO.s make such a big stink about how these arrivals are handled and subsequently dealt with over here but have absolutely nothing to say about the disgusting conditions that the French force these unfortunates to have to live in?
Can anyone blame them for risking their lives to get here?
Go on then, DD, tell us what the UK would do if the boot were on the other foot.
Totally hypothetical and crass question as the UK is proving what it's doing by treating these migrants with some respect and dignity by giving them a damn sight more assistance than the French have ever done.
Along with the irresistible inducement of an all expenses paid trip to Rwanda?
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How do you inflate 27 Boats large enough to carry 50 people put our order motors on them load them and not come to the attention of the French authorities!
Naive to think the French authorities pay anything more than lip service to these activities. They certainly don't want these migrants and are quite happy to see them disappear in their boats towards the demarcation line in the channel.
There was an article a while back that stated they were even piloting some of the boats in the right direction and virtually handing them over to the British border force to deal with.
What kind of behaviour is that! and more importantly why are the usual types on here and the EU authorities, who feel they have something to say about everything except this, not making any sort of fuss about the French pursuing this very dangerous for the migrants policy. ?
Why are the French considered untouchable and unimpeachable for everything they wish to do.
Why do so many NGO.s make such a big stink about how these arrivals are handled and subsequently dealt with over here but have absolutely nothing to say about the disgusting conditions that the French force these unfortunates to have to live in?
Can anyone blame them for risking their lives to get here?
Go on then, DD, tell us what the UK would do if the boot were on the other foot.
Totally hypothetical and crass question as the UK is proving what it's doing by treating these migrants with some respect and dignity by giving them a damn sight more assistance than the French have ever done.
Along with the irresistible inducement of an all expenses paid trip to Rwanda?
Using a fictional situation that is never likely to happen to try to strengthen your point of view = lame point of view.
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How do you inflate 27 Boats large enough to carry 50 people put our order motors on them load them and not come to the attention of the French authorities!
Naive to think the French authorities pay anything more than lip service to these activities. They certainly don't want these migrants and are quite happy to see them disappear in their boats towards the demarcation line in the channel.
There was an article a while back that stated they were even piloting some of the boats in the right direction and virtually handing them over to the British border force to deal with.
What kind of behaviour is that! and more importantly why are the usual types on here and the EU authorities, who feel they have something to say about everything except this, not making any sort of fuss about the French pursuing this very dangerous for the migrants policy. ?
Why are the French considered untouchable and unimpeachable for everything they wish to do.
Why do so many NGO.s make such a big stink about how these arrivals are handled and subsequently dealt with over here but have absolutely nothing to say about the disgusting conditions that the French force these unfortunates to have to live in?
Can anyone blame them for risking their lives to get here?
Go on then, DD, tell us what the UK would do if the boot were on the other foot.
Totally hypothetical and crass question as the UK is proving what it's doing by treating these migrants with some respect and dignity by giving them a damn sight more assistance than the French have ever done.
Along with the irresistible inducement of an all expenses paid trip to Rwanda?
Using a fictional situation that is never likely to happen to try to strengthen your point of view = lame point of view.
I think anyone reading this can decide for themselves which of us is offering a lame point of view.
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You won’t see this in the news, but 50 Albanian migrants that were being housed in the Comfort Inn at Bicker Bar, near Boston have disappeared. They have failed to comply with their Immigration bail conditions. They have up and left. And the authorities have no idea where they are. They are not alone. There are increasing reports of Albanian migrants disappearing from hostels, hotels and motels where the uk govt were housing them. Up and down the uk.
The growing concern in the UK is that they are being recruited by existing uk based Albanian organised crime groups.
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It isn't a growing concern. It is a reality.
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They are the masters of Human Traffickig, males used to deal drugs, females forced to prostitution!
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They are the masters of Human Traffickig, males used to deal drugs, females forced to prostitution!
The Albanian crime gangs are well know across Europe for being the most determined, most organised, and most ruthless of all criminal enterprises.
And we let em here. In rubber dinghies. And they keep coming.
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If only the Tories had been in power for... oh hang on...
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They are the masters of Human Traffickig, males used to deal drugs, females forced to prostitution!
I wonder who uses these services, surely not Brits?
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They are the masters of Human Traffickig, males used to deal drugs, females forced to prostitution!
I wonder who uses these services, surely not Brits?
It's a fair point.
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I doubt many come across in Dinghies, they are coming in on stolen identity documents, they have developed an entire industry around forging documents and stealing identities.
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I had occasion to check some documents produced to a Magistrates courts that a Twit produced as proof that he was bona fide, the bench were taken In! I asked for an adjournment and checked the papers which merely were a letter on the chief of Zpolice to a Person with a name stating they were that person, our chum was Not said Person,
Can't believe how guilable our Courts are. I did some research and watched a Magazine programme made in the Albaniian Municipality of Schroder, virtually every degree qualification issued by the local Education Authority was discovered to be false, and the entire exam system was under investigation?.
So if you find yourself being treated by an Albanian Doctor!!!
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I doubt many come across in Dinghies, they are coming in on stolen identity documents, they have developed an entire industry around forging documents and stealing identities.
That suggests poor customs and immigration control, which would have been beefed up and streamlined immediately following 'we got brexit done' of course. 6 years was long enough to prepare, no?
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But we took back control of our borders...
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Not all customs and border control officers are good at their jobs though.
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32,000 have arrived this year thus far. A total that could fill both Goole and Maltby combined. In the space of 9 months. Staggering. They keep on a comin' too.
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Not all customs and border control officers are good at their jobs though.
[/quote
Apparently Border Force staff quitting in Droves, they have also halved the new entrants training course to 3 weeks from 6!
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Not all customs and border control officers are good at their jobs though.
It doesn't really matter if we have no border force at all. Everyone who wants to come here will do so and not only be allowed in anyway, but also allowed to stay unless we leave the ECHR.
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When the Italian right take power that are talking about imposing a naval blockade on Libya to prevent boat crossings.
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Makes me laugh the way the media label these parties like in Italy and Sweden as being right wing on the verge of far right. They aren't. They just want things addressing that useless politicians previously have failed to address on behalf of the people. Nothing right wing about that. They just want to sweep up the shit that previous failing political parties have left behind.
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Makes me laugh the way the media label these parties like in Italy and Sweden as being right wing on the verge of far right. They aren't. They just want things addressing that useless politicians previously have failed to address on behalf of the people. Nothing right wing about that. They just want to sweep up the shit that previous failing political parties have left behind.
The media don’t need to label them Panda.
They are, by definition, right wing. Ultra conservative. Utterly non liberal. A step back to 1940’s Mussolini. The poor of Italy will speak. The economically disadvantaged in the south have had enough. Hmm. Where have we heard this before?
The south of Italy resonates with the North of England.
#brothersofitaly
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Another 1000 yesterday. That’s very nearly 40000 already this year. The vast majority now making the crossing are not from Eritrea or Iraq. They are Albanians.
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All the shops in Copley Road are now taken.
Where can they go?
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Another 1000 yesterday. That’s very nearly 40000 already this year. The vast majority now making the crossing are not from Eritrea or Iraq. They are Albanians.
Some people just won't accept what's going on NR .
This isn't from GB News it's from Channel Four .
https://youtu.be/i0E-4ZnMqKQ
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Another 1000 yesterday. That’s very nearly 40000 already this year. The vast majority now making the crossing are not from Eritrea or Iraq. They are Albanians.
Really, thats interesting, have you the source evidence for that?
Earlier this month only 18% were from Albania so 82% weren't. A lot must have changed in two weeks.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/explainers-53734793
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Another 1000 yesterday. That’s very nearly 40000 already this year. The vast majority now making the crossing are not from Eritrea or Iraq. They are Albanians.
Really, thats interesting, have you the source evidence for that?
Earlier this month only 18% were from Albania so 82% weren't. A lot must have changed in two weeks.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/explainers-53734793
The Home Affairs Committee was told that "one to two percent" of the entire male population of Albania - around 10,000 men - arrived on small boats this year alone.
( source sky news)
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Some 12,000 Albanians have entered the UK in small boats compared with 800 last year. ( telegraph 5 days ago)
Wilts. You may note I said the vast majority NOW making the crossing . That’s not over this whole year. That is much more recently.
But for the year around a third of all migrants are from Albania. These are not fleeing a war torn country or oppression. They come for our attractive state benefit system, NHS and general standard of living.
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Labours response to this crisis:
Labour has accused the government of allowing a huge backlog of asylum claims to build up, and failing to deal with the increased number of Channel crossings this year.
Earlier, the party's shadow home secretary Yvette Cooper said “added bureaucracy” meant claims were taking 3-6 months longer to process.
She said her party would reduce this, and also wanted to reduce the number of people being sent to hotels, adding that “increasing the use of hotels is itself a sign of failure”.
She added there had been a “huge proliferation” in criminal gang activity driving increased crossings, including Albanian organised crime.
The party wants the government to set up a specialist unit within the National Crime Agency tasked with tackling the problem.
But here’s the thing. Labour propose to reduce the backlog and fast track asylum applications. I would very much like to hear the “what then” policy if asylum applications fail. I want to see a govt where we deal with these migrants firmly and fairly and quickly. If they fail application then what ? Because if Labour came out with a policy of shipping these people straight back to say Albania within weeks of them arriving illegally then they would get my vote at the next GE. Something I thought I would never hear myself say. But we all know the truth of the matter. It simply won’t happen. And the asylum centres being set up around the country will continue to overflow. Hotels in seaside resorts around the country will continue to fill up. Our NHS will struggle more and so it goes on.
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NR
1) We are still receiving a tiny fraction of the number of immigrants that the rest of Europe is dealing with.
2) Reports today are that the Home Secretary has been told by officials that she is breaking UK law in the way she is housing the arrivals in internment camps.
3) The Home Office's own figures say that, of the applications for asylum that they have processed, only 4% have been rejected.
5) Here's the real question. In the light of all of that information, shouldn't we be making it possible for asylum applicants to make legal applications for asylum, rather than forcing them into illegally crossing the Channel?
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Not all customs and border control officers are good at their jobs though.
There has been no customs work done at Leeds Bradford Airport for 2 years. One of my ex colleagues told me all of the equipment used by ex customs officers (that role no longer exists) lies in cupboards gathering dust.
This is an airport that takes flights from Amsterdam which is a main hub for passengers arriving into Europe from all over the World.
The vast majority of drug seizures were previously made from passengers on this flight.
When the Border Force was ‘created’, all customs officers from LBA were sent on a 2 week ‘crash immigration course’ at Manchester Airport. On their return they were immediately put onto passport control & to all intents & purposes customs duties ceased.
We went from seizing upwards of 350,000 illegally imported tobacco goods per month to 300,000 per year.
Weapons (knives, knuckle dusters, martial art weapons) & drugs (cocaine, heroin, marijuna) were no longer targeted, the onus being on the controls & keeping passenger arrival queues down.
The ‘dog team’ at Hull (with whom we had many successful detections) were disbanded & Manchester is now the only airport in the country where sniffer dogs are based.
No ‘new staff’ were employed, the Home Secretary (Theresa May) simply bolstered immigration staff by taking customs staff from detection work onto passport control in order to be able to stand up in Parliament & say ‘we now have a further x amount of officers protecting our borders’……….really?
So you now know which airport to use to smuggle drugs into the UK without fear of detection.
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NR
1) We are still receiving a tiny fraction of the number of immigrants that the rest of Europe is dealing with.
2) Reports today are that the Home Secretary has been told by officials that she is breaking UK law in the way she is housing the arrivals in internment camps.
3) The Home Office's own figures say that, of the applications for asylum that they have processed, only 4% have been rejected.
5) Here's the real question. In the light of all of that information, shouldn't we be making it possible for asylum applicants to make legal applications for asylum, rather than forcing them into illegally crossing the Channel?
On point 1, the uk is ranked fifth in the world for the number of foreign born residents (immigrants) in the world. Based on stats provided by World population review. Only surpassed by Russia, the USA , Saudi Arabia and Germany. Just one EU country.
On point 2. Desperate times call for desperate measures. Where else are they to be housed until a proper solution can be found?
On point 3. The stats provided by the home office for “processed” application are very misleading. The current asylum application process is complex to say the least. The 4 % they allude to will be those at the first hurdle. There are many many asylum applicants in this country who have been here 10 years, who are still pending final decision. Why is this? Because we have no current strategy to deport people for the uk in the sort of numbers we would need to to bring this whole thing under control.
On point 4. Let’s not forget that the current uk govt policy for successful asylum application is that the applicant must satisfy 2 criteria. One is that they have left their home country, that’s the easy bit. The second is that they must prove that they are escaping persecution and for them to go home would put their lives at risk. As per the 1951 refugee convention. Albanians are leaving Albania because they are desperate for a better standard of living. That does not fit with current uk govt policy for asylum.
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Labours response to this crisis:
Labour has accused the government of allowing a huge backlog of asylum claims to build up, and failing to deal with the increased number of Channel crossings this year.
Earlier, the party's shadow home secretary Yvette Cooper said “added bureaucracy” meant claims were taking 3-6 months longer to process.
She said her party would reduce this, and also wanted to reduce the number of people being sent to hotels, adding that “increasing the use of hotels is itself a sign of failure”.
She added there had been a “huge proliferation” in criminal gang activity driving increased crossings, including Albanian organised crime.
The party wants the government to set up a specialist unit within the National Crime Agency tasked with tackling the problem.
But here’s the thing. Labour propose to reduce the backlog and fast track asylum applications. I would very much like to hear the “what then” policy if asylum applications fail. I want to see a govt where we deal with these migrants firmly and fairly and quickly. If they fail application then what ? Because if Labour came out with a policy of shipping these people straight back to say Albania within weeks of them arriving illegally then they would get my vote at the next GE. Something I thought I would never hear myself say. But we all know the truth of the matter. It simply won’t happen. And the asylum centres being set up around the country will continue to overflow. Hotels in seaside resorts around the country will continue to fill up. Our NHS will struggle more and so it goes on.
Totally agree immigration is one of the main stumbling blocks to me voting Labour
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A lot of Albanians are being trafficked in to the UK to deal drugs,and for the Sextrade if female, they are threatened with extreme violence and also resort to violence if in trouble. There are a large number in the Prison system and are responsible foe a great deal of the violence occurring therein. If they get deported they get trafficked back into the uk with false passports ,driving licences and bank accounts, its highly organised crime on a grand scale.
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The Daily Mail is alive and well, and living in Doncaster!
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NR
1) We are still receiving a tiny fraction of the number of immigrants that the rest of Europe is dealing with.
2) Reports today are that the Home Secretary has been told by officials that she is breaking UK law in the way she is housing the arrivals in internment camps.
3) The Home Office's own figures say that, of the applications for asylum that they have processed, only 4% have been rejected.
5) Here's the real question. In the light of all of that information, shouldn't we be making it possible for asylum applicants to make legal applications for asylum, rather than forcing them into illegally crossing the Channel?
On point 1, the uk is ranked fifth in the world for the number of foreign born residents (immigrants) in the world. Based on stats provided by World population review. Only surpassed by Russia, the USA , Saudi Arabia and Germany. Just one EU country.
On point 2. Desperate times call for desperate measures. Where else are they to be housed until a proper solution can be found?
On point 3. The stats provided by the home office for “processed” application are very misleading. The current asylum application process is complex to say the least. The 4 % they allude to will be those at the first hurdle. There are many many asylum applicants in this country who have been here 10 years, who are still pending final decision. Why is this? Because we have no current strategy to deport people for the uk in the sort of numbers we would need to to bring this whole thing under control.
On point 4. Let’s not forget that the current uk govt policy for successful asylum application is that the applicant must satisfy 2 criteria. One is that they have left their home country, that’s the easy bit. The second is that they must prove that they are escaping persecution and for them to go home would put their lives at risk. As per the 1951 refugee convention. Albanians are leaving Albania because they are desperate for a better standard of living. That does not fit with current uk govt policy for asylum.
Do you have a source for that first claim? I'd be interested to see the numbers.
By the way, the 4% figure came from a statement at the Home Affairs Committee in Parliament last week. The Home Office has processed 15% of all the incoming asylum cases in the last year (which shocked the MPs on the Committee, as it should - it's that incompetence that's resulting in applicants illegally being incarcerated for months at Manston). Of those, 96% had had their cases approved. Full leave to remain in the country. Don't take my word for it. That's direct from a Govt minister.
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Some 12,000 Albanians have entered the UK in small boats compared with 800 last year. ( telegraph 5 days ago)
Wilts. You may note I said the vast majority NOW making the crossing . That’s not over this whole year. That is much more recently.
But for the year around a third of all migrants are from Albania. These are not fleeing a war torn country or oppression. They come for our attractive state benefit system, NHS and general standard of living.
By 'now' do mean in the time it has taken me to type this reply? This hour? Today? In the last week? The last month? I note the lack of figures and source of these figures.
Give 'them' jobs then. There are a million vacancies in the UK including c200000 in social care. That will freeup space and reduce the pressure on the NHS.
Of course if 'they' are just scroungers who dont want to work they will soon leave. Problem sorted.
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Labours response to this crisis:
Labour has accused the government of allowing a huge backlog of asylum claims to build up, and failing to deal with the increased number of Channel crossings this year.
Earlier, the party's shadow home secretary Yvette Cooper said “added bureaucracy” meant claims were taking 3-6 months longer to process.
She said her party would reduce this, and also wanted to reduce the number of people being sent to hotels, adding that “increasing the use of hotels is itself a sign of failure”.
She added there had been a “huge proliferation” in criminal gang activity driving increased crossings, including Albanian organised crime.
The party wants the government to set up a specialist unit within the National Crime Agency tasked with tackling the problem.
But here’s the thing. Labour propose to reduce the backlog and fast track asylum applications. I would very much like to hear the “what then” policy if asylum applications fail. I want to see a govt where we deal with these migrants firmly and fairly and quickly. If they fail application then what ? Because if Labour came out with a policy of shipping these people straight back to say Albania within weeks of them arriving illegally then they would get my vote at the next GE. Something I thought I would never hear myself say. But we all know the truth of the matter. It simply won’t happen. And the asylum centres being set up around the country will continue to overflow. Hotels in seaside resorts around the country will continue to fill up. Our NHS will struggle more and so it goes on.
Failed asylum seekers should be deported back to their country of origin - Yvette Cooper on Channel 4 News just. It should be online in the next hour or so I should think. She had a good 5 minutes on a range on issues, the focus was on refugees and immigration, but it's worth watching it so you know what she said.
She did talk about closer co-operation with France to stop the boats. Personally I feel there should be a processing centre in France, Calais or elsewhere. So there should then be no-need for anyone to cross on a boat - and anyone who did probably has very little cause for asylum so should be able to be removed back quicker. But as far as I am aware that is not Labour policy.
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Here's a chart showing what the actual issue is - not the number of arrivals but the failure to process them.
And here is the former head of UK Border Force saying the same:
It’s 9 years since I left @ukhomeoffice as CEO of UKBA.
The rhetoric has got stronger; the control of the border has reduced.
Here’s the nub: it’s a policy failure not a delivery failure; and successful policy is mostly responding to events collaboratively with others.
https://twitter.com/RobWhiteman/status/1587173265113600003
To me it's almost as if it is a deliberate 'policy' of this government to invent a 'migrant crises' so they both distract from their many other economic and social policy failure and keep the far-right racists (not that there any on here) onside.
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NR
1) We are still receiving a tiny fraction of the number of immigrants that the rest of Europe is dealing with.
2) Reports today are that the Home Secretary has been told by officials that she is breaking UK law in the way she is housing the arrivals in internment camps.
3) The Home Office's own figures say that, of the applications for asylum that they have processed, only 4% have been rejected.
5) Here's the real question. In the light of all of that information, shouldn't we be making it possible for asylum applicants to make legal applications for asylum, rather than forcing them into illegally crossing the Channel?
On point 1, the uk is ranked fifth in the world for the number of foreign born residents (immigrants) in the world. Based on stats provided by World population review. Only surpassed by Russia, the USA , Saudi Arabia and Germany. Just one EU country.
On point 2. Desperate times call for desperate measures. Where else are they to be housed until a proper solution can be found?
On point 3. The stats provided by the home office for “processed” application are very misleading. The current asylum application process is complex to say the least. The 4 % they allude to will be those at the first hurdle. There are many many asylum applicants in this country who have been here 10 years, who are still pending final decision. Why is this? Because we have no current strategy to deport people for the uk in the sort of numbers we would need to to bring this whole thing under control.
On point 4. Let’s not forget that the current uk govt policy for successful asylum application is that the applicant must satisfy 2 criteria. One is that they have left their home country, that’s the easy bit. The second is that they must prove that they are escaping persecution and for them to go home would put their lives at risk. As per the 1951 refugee convention. Albanians are leaving Albania because they are desperate for a better standard of living. That does not fit with current uk govt policy for asylum.
Do you have a source for that first claim? I'd be interested to see the numbers.
By the way, the 4% figure came from a statement at the Home Affairs Committee in Parliament last week. The Home Office has processed 15% of all the incoming asylum cases in the last year (which shocked the MPs on the Committee, as it should - it's that incompetence that's resulting in applicants illegally being incarcerated for months at Manston). Of those, 96% had had their cases approved. Full leave to remain in the country. Don't take my word for it. That's direct from a Govt minister.
And if this gov't goes ahead and sacks 90,000 public servants we should all expect it to get worse.
''Redundancies as part of 91,000 job cuts plan ‘will be on 2010 terms’
Union says Cabinet Office officials confirmed voluntary exit schemes will be needed to hit PM’s target''
https://www.civilserviceworld.com/professions/article/redundancies-as-part-of-91000-job-cuts-plan-will-be-on-2010-terms#:~:text=The%20civil%20service%20shrank%20by,and%20the%20Covid%2D19%20pandemic.
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Charlotte Lynch twitter/guardian
''EXCL: Senior Home Office source tells me Home Sec refused to sign off on hotel bookings for migrants at Manston last week “because they were in Tory areas”.
@LBC
6:32 pm · 1 Nov 2022
·Twitter for iPhone
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I didn't think it was possible to have a Home Secretary who was more vile and deranged than Patel. But Braverman knocks her into a cocked hat
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And if this gov't goes ahead and sacks 90,000 public servants we should all expect it to get worse.
''Redundancies as part of 91,000 job cuts plan ‘will be on 2010 terms’
Union says Cabinet Office officials confirmed voluntary exit schemes will be needed to hit PM’s target''
https://www.civilserviceworld.com/professions/article/redundancies-as-part-of-91000-job-cuts-plan-will-be-on-2010-terms#:~:text=The%20civil%20service%20shrank%20by,and%20the%20Covid%2D19%20pandemic.
I work as a contractor in a sector where there are loads of civil servants and many haven't yet returned to work post Covid. I can spend half my day trying to contact people by email who are apparently WFH and it is so frustrating. If some of these folk are facing the chop then I for one won't be surprised or disappointed.
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Charlotte Lynch twitter/guardian
''EXCL: Senior Home Office source tells me Home Sec refused to sign off on hotel bookings for migrants at Manston last week “because they were in Tory areas”.
@LBC
6:32 pm · 1 Nov 2022
·Twitter for iPhone
This isn't surprising at all.
The Tories will always look after their own.
What's good for the party is first, last and always.
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Labours response to this crisis:
Labour has accused the government of allowing a huge backlog of asylum claims to build up, and failing to deal with the increased number of Channel crossings this year.
Earlier, the party's shadow home secretary Yvette Cooper said “added bureaucracy” meant claims were taking 3-6 months longer to process.
She said her party would reduce this, and also wanted to reduce the number of people being sent to hotels, adding that “increasing the use of hotels is itself a sign of failure”.
She added there had been a “huge proliferation” in criminal gang activity driving increased crossings, including Albanian organised crime.
The party wants the government to set up a specialist unit within the National Crime Agency tasked with tackling the problem.
But here’s the thing. Labour propose to reduce the backlog and fast track asylum applications. I would very much like to hear the “what then” policy if asylum applications fail. I want to see a govt where we deal with these migrants firmly and fairly and quickly. If they fail application then what ? Because if Labour came out with a policy of shipping these people straight back to say Albania within weeks of them arriving illegally then they would get my vote at the next GE. Something I thought I would never hear myself say. But we all know the truth of the matter. It simply won’t happen. And the asylum centres being set up around the country will continue to overflow. Hotels in seaside resorts around the country will continue to fill up. Our NHS will struggle more and so it goes on.
Failed asylum seekers should be deported back to their country of origin - Yvette Cooper on Channel 4 News just. It should be online in the next hour or so I should think. She had a good 5 minutes on a range on issues, the focus was on refugees and immigration, but it's worth watching it so you know what she said.
She did talk about closer co-operation with France to stop the boats. Personally I feel there should be a processing centre in France, Calais or elsewhere. So there should then be no-need for anyone to cross on a boat - and anyone who did probably has very little cause for asylum so should be able to be removed back quicker. But as far as I am aware that is not Labour policy.
And it’s beggars belief why this isn’t happening. Albanians should be put straight back on a flight to Tirana. They are not fleeing persecution, war or conflict. It’s that Simple.
And re French Co operation, didn’t we give them millions of pounds last year to help sort this? It hasn’t made a jot of difference. Things have got worse.
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NR
1) We are still receiving a tiny fraction of the number of immigrants that the rest of Europe is dealing with.
2) Reports today are that the Home Secretary has been told by officials that she is breaking UK law in the way she is housing the arrivals in internment camps.
3) The Home Office's own figures say that, of the applications for asylum that they have processed, only 4% have been rejected.
5) Here's the real question. In the light of all of that information, shouldn't we be making it possible for asylum applicants to make legal applications for asylum, rather than forcing them into illegally crossing the Channel?
On point 1, the uk is ranked fifth in the world for the number of foreign born residents (immigrants) in the world. Based on stats provided by World population review. Only surpassed by Russia, the USA , Saudi Arabia and Germany. Just one EU country.
On point 2. Desperate times call for desperate measures. Where else are they to be housed until a proper solution can be found?
On point 3. The stats provided by the home office for “processed” application are very misleading. The current asylum application process is complex to say the least. The 4 % they allude to will be those at the first hurdle. There are many many asylum applicants in this country who have been here 10 years, who are still pending final decision. Why is this? Because we have no current strategy to deport people for the uk in the sort of numbers we would need to to bring this whole thing under control.
On point 4. Let’s not forget that the current uk govt policy for successful asylum application is that the applicant must satisfy 2 criteria. One is that they have left their home country, that’s the easy bit. The second is that they must prove that they are escaping persecution and for them to go home would put their lives at risk. As per the 1951 refugee convention. Albanians are leaving Albania because they are desperate for a better standard of living. That does not fit with current uk govt policy for asylum.
Do you have a source for that first claim? I'd be interested to see the numbers.
Bump.
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Labours response to this crisis:
Labour has accused the government of allowing a huge backlog of asylum claims to build up, and failing to deal with the increased number of Channel crossings this year.
Earlier, the party's shadow home secretary Yvette Cooper said “added bureaucracy” meant claims were taking 3-6 months longer to process.
She said her party would reduce this, and also wanted to reduce the number of people being sent to hotels, adding that “increasing the use of hotels is itself a sign of failure”.
She added there had been a “huge proliferation” in criminal gang activity driving increased crossings, including Albanian organised crime.
The party wants the government to set up a specialist unit within the National Crime Agency tasked with tackling the problem.
But here’s the thing. Labour propose to reduce the backlog and fast track asylum applications. I would very much like to hear the “what then” policy if asylum applications fail. I want to see a govt where we deal with these migrants firmly and fairly and quickly. If they fail application then what ? Because if Labour came out with a policy of shipping these people straight back to say Albania within weeks of them arriving illegally then they would get my vote at the next GE. Something I thought I would never hear myself say. But we all know the truth of the matter. It simply won’t happen. And the asylum centres being set up around the country will continue to overflow. Hotels in seaside resorts around the country will continue to fill up. Our NHS will struggle more and so it goes on.
Failed asylum seekers should be deported back to their country of origin - Yvette Cooper on Channel 4 News just. It should be online in the next hour or so I should think. She had a good 5 minutes on a range on issues, the focus was on refugees and immigration, but it's worth watching it so you know what she said.
She did talk about closer co-operation with France to stop the boats. Personally I feel there should be a processing centre in France, Calais or elsewhere. So there should then be no-need for anyone to cross on a boat - and anyone who did probably has very little cause for asylum so should be able to be removed back quicker. But as far as I am aware that is not Labour policy.
And it’s beggars belief why this isn’t happening. Albanians should be put straight back on a flight to Tirana. They are not fleeing persecution, war or conflict. It’s that Simple.
And re French Co operation, didn’t we give them millions of pounds last year to help sort this? It hasn’t made a jot of difference. Things have got worse.
According to the latest figures I can find, August 2022, 53% of Albanian refugees were granted Asylum status. That is, it was accepted by this Tory government that they were fleeing persecution.
I think you will find that the French have stopped about twice as many people as have arrived. That is, without the money the government have given to the French the numbers could have been 3x as many.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-62676829
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And of the 53% of Albanians who were granted asylum - 86% of them were women being trafficed.
So rather than the false narrative some people have been keen to push, rather than these people being Albanian criminals they are mostly victims of Albanian criminals.
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/braverman-asylum-seekers-albania-trafficking-b2215187.html
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And of the 53% of Albanians who were granted asylum - 86% of them were women being trafficed.
So rather than the false narrative some people have been keen to push, rather than these people being Albanian criminals they are mostly victims of Albanian criminals.
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/braverman-asylum-seekers-albania-trafficking-b2215187.html
Ooooh watch it! Your 'Woke mates' on here will be accusing you of reading the Daily mail?
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From the wait for it .......BBC !
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-63488070
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And of the 53% of Albanians who were granted asylum - 86% of them were women being trafficed.
So rather than the false narrative some people have been keen to push, rather than these people being Albanian criminals they are mostly victims of Albanian criminals.
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/braverman-asylum-seekers-albania-trafficking-b2215187.html
Ooooh watch it! Your 'Woke mates' on here will be accusing you of reading the Daily mail?
I do it so you don't have to sproty. See how good I am to you...
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Can someone explain why migrants at the immigration centre near Heathrow think it’s appropriate to arm themselves?
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Can someone explain why migrants at the immigration centre near Heathrow think it’s appropriate to arm themselves?
Same reason that somone thinks its appropriate to petrol bomb the processing centre at Dover I suppose?
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looks to me like successive home office ministers have used migrants as pawns in their ongoing political culture wars but have shot themselves in the arse
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Can someone explain why migrants at the immigration centre near Heathrow think it’s appropriate to arm themselves?
Same reason that somone thinks its appropriate to petrol bomb the processing centre at Dover I suppose?
But he was a right wing terrorist. Acting on a deluded ideology. What’s their motive?
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Can someone explain why migrants at the immigration centre near Heathrow think it’s appropriate to arm themselves?
Same reason that somone thinks its appropriate to petrol bomb the processing centre at Dover I suppose?
But he was a right wing terrorist. Acting on a deluded ideology. What’s their motive?
No idea. Let us know when you have done your research.
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A new poll out today shows that instead of 'taking back control', a large majority of the public think Brexit has made our borders less secure.
According to the latest Opinium poll, 73% think the UK has not been in control of its borders since Brexit. Only 12% think Britain has been in control. Meanwhile, only 9% of the public believe Brexit has made Britain’s ability to manage its borders better, while 45% think it has made it worse.
Those who backed Brexit are also taking a dim view. Only 7% of leave voters think the UK is in control of its borders since Brexit, while 85% think it is not.
https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2022/nov/05/most-britons-think-country-has-lost-control-of-its-border-since-brexit-poll
Vote Tory.
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looks to me like successive home office ministers have used migrants as pawns in their ongoing political culture wars but have shot themselves in the arse
Sue-Ellen Cassiana certainly appears to have....
https://archive.ph/bsyyn
And it appears it's going to cost us, the tax payers!
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looks like braverman is bang to rights there Kato, telling porkies too I should think
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This from the Labour Policy Forum. He suggests pragmatic humane solutions yet only puts forward one. An utterly insane one at that:
It is clear that large numbers of older voters have moved to conservatism (with a small 'c') out of fear that immigration from the middle east, Africa and Asia is a threat to our culture and way of life. This fear has been obviously hyped up by the extreme Right, and the Conservative Party has also jumped on the bandwagon. 'Brexit' is one outcome to that process and the election of the conservative party the other.
Unfortunately I believe that the Labour Party under its previous leader turned a blind eye to this and suffered a humiliating defeat as a result. We must not make the same mistake again.
Obviously we feel uncomfortable with the idea of conforming to these extremist views, and I would not suggest that we do that. But there is a median position that we can adopt which recognises the problem and offers solutions other than pretending to close the doors on immigration.
I say 'pretending' because as we have seen with the continuous arrival of boats loaded with asylum seekers from France, it is obvious that the Conservatives have no solution to this. Brexit has deprived the UK of essential workers but what extremists see as the true 'aliens' are still coming across the channel.
I have some sympathy with the argument that many of the asylum seekers landing on our shores are 'economic migrants'. Making the UK an unwelcoming destination for them appears callous but I would argue that most of those arriving have paid for their passage to illegal people smugglers and are not fleeing war or oppression, Ukrainians obviously exempt from that.
International law prevents us from simply sending them back to where they came from but I believe that we should not be a 'soft touch', and I am sure all of those people who did not vote Labour at the last election think the same. We should therefore come up with some proposals for tackling this problem in a humane way.
Can I also suggest that we should make efforts to stop the flood of asylum seekers at source. People smugglers are conning these people, not to mention often causing their deaths. This is, or should be, an international problem and the developed countries must make much greater efforts to force the developing countries to tackle this problem.
I suggest that the UK increases foreign aid substantially, specifically targeting countries which are the source of asylum seekers, with the proviso that we must be sure the money is not being siphoned off into the pockets of corrupt leaders; perhaps by giving funds to reputable charities to do good works for the poor in these countries. It is crucial that we tackle the causes that drive people to emigrate illegally and I am sure that there is much more we can do at source.
In this context the Labour Party must be seen to recognise the problem and come up with humane and pragmatic solutions that people can believe in.
Thank you
Andrew Pavli
I’m sure the tax paying uk public will be crawling over themselves to vote for a party that thinks sending millions or more to countries like Albania, one of the most corrupt Nations on the planet, will help stop large swathes of them travelling across Europe to illegally enter and settle in the Uk. The tories are being seen to be failing to tackle the issue of illegal immigration.
But let’s look back a little further, the decision by Blair’s labour govt to allow citizens of the A8 countries free movement to come to the UK was fiscally sound as the economy was booming and extra skilled labour was valuable, but it was politically costly. The unexpectedly large migration from Central and Eastern Europe lent the impression that Labour could not control the borders. This is an issue which continues to dog the Labour party and contributed to electoral defeats in 2010 and 2015.
I have no faith that a labour govt will sort this issue should they get into power. I fear it will get worse.
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A new poll out today shows that instead of 'taking back control', a large majority of the public think Brexit has made our borders less secure.
According to the latest Opinium poll, 73% think the UK has not been in control of its borders since Brexit. Only 12% think Britain has been in control. Meanwhile, only 9% of the public believe Brexit has made Britain’s ability to manage its borders better, while 45% think it has made it worse.
Those who backed Brexit are also taking a dim view. Only 7% of leave voters think the UK is in control of its borders since Brexit, while 85% think it is not.
https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2022/nov/05/most-britons-think-country-has-lost-control-of-its-border-since-brexit-poll
Vote Tory.
Wilts stop quoting’Woke’ Cr’p since we left Europe we can have a look at all entrants, no more convicted Child molesters and Killers just sauntering on the Ferry those 300,000 immigrants Germany let in a large proportion of who ran riot on New Year’s Eve Sexually assaulting Hundreds of German Women , now qualify for a German Passport fortunately we can now check em at the order!
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NR
Remind me who Andrew Pavli is.
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''I have no faith that a labour govt will sort this issue should they get into power. I fear it will get worse''
Has it been getting worse while any other party has been in power over the past 12 years or so NR?
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Just a thought NR, if you would like to comment on other topics such as the police, nursing, NHS, Rail Transport, housing, river and ocean pollution, teaching for the same period and of course the economy it would be appreciated.
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Just a thought NR, if you would like to comment on other topics such as the police, nursing, NHS, Rail Transport, housing, river and ocean pollution, teaching for the same period and of course the economy it would be appreciated.
Having a pop at the individual and not the topic SR. Speaks volumes.
Given that Mr Pavil is probably no better qualified on political matters than any of us on here. I’d love to hear some thoughts on how Labour voters on this forum would tackle the issue of cross channel immigration. I noted his post because in the whole I thought he talked a lot of sense. His comments were balanced and sensible. Barring the ridiculous suggestion on overseas aid of course.
Immigration affects many of those other topics you raise. Which is why it is important. Housing, the NHS, schools, the police and consequently the criminal justice system and prisons, nurses and travel. Oh and while we are at it, I don’t suppose Albanians care much for the environment and pollution. Their idea of recycling is to put stolen cooking oil in their diesel cars.
So please, I’d love to hear what your solution to this would be.
Or do we just continue to spend millions of pounds of tax payers money every day housing these people.
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I'm just trying to get a fix on what your priorities are, what would make a difference in your life, the UK receiving a few less boat people or being able to get an appointment at the doctors when you need one and a bed in a hospital that's not decaying (hospitals need 10bn spent to bring them up to scratch on buildings and equipment)
Yes immigration does make a big difference to the economy, not half or a tenth to what a well run economy would. Parliament having to chase a corrupt government around. The biggest difference immigration makes is it improves and economy.
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I'm just trying to get a fix on what your priorities are, what would make a difference in your life, the UK receiving a few less boat people or being able to get an appointment at the doctors when you need one and a bed in a hospital that's not decaying (hospitals need 10bn spent to bring them up to scratch on buildings and equipment)
Yes immigration does make a big difference to the economy, not half or a tenth to what a well run economy would. Parliament having to chase a corrupt government around. The biggest difference immigration makes is it improves and economy.
Might I remind you what the topic of this thread is firstly.
Drs, dentists, surgery, nhs specialists, hospital beds are already being taken up by those crossing the channel. And the cost of housing them is not helping the economy at all.
regarding my priorities and what makes a difference to my life, I live in an area where we have huge swathes of Eastern Europeans living and working. I have no issue with them at all. They contribute. They help the economy. They integrate with UK life. We have Eastern Europeans now locally as PCSO’s. I have Eastern European friends.
But, with the specific case of Albanians, which I take big issue with, a considerable number of them bring crime and related issues with them. They have no interest in contributing to UK PLC. They are sending tens of millions of pounds back to Albania through Ill gotten gains in the UK as a result of prostitution, cannabis growing and human trafficking. To name but a few. Their familial culture is such that they have no interest in integrating with UK life and it’s people. They are here for one reason and one reason only. And that’s to take take take. With some very rare exceptions.
Do you realise that 1-2% of the entire male population of Albania has travelled to the UK this year alone? Overlay this data with the deeply entrenched criminal networks Albania has rooted very substantially within most of their society and it makes for a very bad mix. The govt have concerns about this. The NCA and Europol and Interpol all have concerns about this. This isn’t another Windrush scenario we are talking about. It’s something much more sinister and serious.
I mentioned in an earlier thread about a group of 50 Albanians who had been housed in a local motel near where I live, One morning the staff there found that they were all gone. Disappeared. No trace of them at all. These are people the home office were supposed to be responsible for. God only knows where they are and what they are up to. This is just the tip of the iceberg. They are highly likely to be victims of exploitation and crime . They won’t be contributing to the economy or paying tax. They will be in a local car wash, or brothel. Or worse. As long as we allow them to come and stay, we are complicit to this.
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NR
1) We are still receiving a tiny fraction of the number of immigrants that the rest of Europe is dealing with.
2) Reports today are that the Home Secretary has been told by officials that she is breaking UK law in the way she is housing the arrivals in internment camps.
3) The Home Office's own figures say that, of the applications for asylum that they have processed, only 4% have been rejected.
5) Here's the real question. In the light of all of that information, shouldn't we be making it possible for asylum applicants to make legal applications for asylum, rather than forcing them into illegally crossing the Channel?
On point 1, the uk is ranked fifth in the world for the number of foreign born residents (immigrants) in the world. Based on stats provided by World population review. Only surpassed by Russia, the USA , Saudi Arabia and Germany. Just one EU country.
On point 2. Desperate times call for desperate measures. Where else are they to be housed until a proper solution can be found?
On point 3. The stats provided by the home office for “processed” application are very misleading. The current asylum application process is complex to say the least. The 4 % they allude to will be those at the first hurdle. There are many many asylum applicants in this country who have been here 10 years, who are still pending final decision. Why is this? Because we have no current strategy to deport people for the uk in the sort of numbers we would need to to bring this whole thing under control.
On point 4. Let’s not forget that the current uk govt policy for successful asylum application is that the applicant must satisfy 2 criteria. One is that they have left their home country, that’s the easy bit. The second is that they must prove that they are escaping persecution and for them to go home would put their lives at risk. As per the 1951 refugee convention. Albanians are leaving Albania because they are desperate for a better standard of living. That does not fit with current uk govt policy for asylum.
Do you have a source for that first claim? I'd be interested to see the numbers.
Bump.
NR.
Did you get anywhere with the source of these numbers? I'm interested in seeing them.
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OK NR, how many Albanians in your area that effect you are either illegal immigrants, criminals or both and how do you know?
What I am trying to get across, although this is a big deal to you as you are the one that keeps posting the daily mail type topic headlines, in terms of the cost compared to GDP it is an extremely small fraction. This series of tory governments has spaffed more up the wall in any week than the cost of all channel crossers put together.
All this government needs to keep getting back in power is enough people to get wound up about Albanians swarming across the channel rather than look at the important stuff.
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NR
1) We are still receiving a tiny fraction of the number of immigrants that the rest of Europe is dealing with.
2) Reports today are that the Home Secretary has been told by officials that she is breaking UK law in the way she is housing the arrivals in internment camps.
3) The Home Office's own figures say that, of the applications for asylum that they have processed, only 4% have been rejected.
5) Here's the real question. In the light of all of that information, shouldn't we be making it possible for asylum applicants to make legal applications for asylum, rather than forcing them into illegally crossing the Channel?
On point 1, the uk is ranked fifth in the world for the number of foreign born residents (immigrants) in the world. Based on stats provided by World population review. Only surpassed by Russia, the USA , Saudi Arabia and Germany. Just one EU country.
On point 2. Desperate times call for desperate measures. Where else are they to be housed until a proper solution can be found?
On point 3. The stats provided by the home office for “processed” application are very misleading. The current asylum application process is complex to say the least. The 4 % they allude to will be those at the first hurdle. There are many many asylum applicants in this country who have been here 10 years, who are still pending final decision. Why is this? Because we have no current strategy to deport people for the uk in the sort of numbers we would need to to bring this whole thing under control.
On point 4. Let’s not forget that the current uk govt policy for successful asylum application is that the applicant must satisfy 2 criteria. One is that they have left their home country, that’s the easy bit. The second is that they must prove that they are escaping persecution and for them to go home would put their lives at risk. As per the 1951 refugee convention. Albanians are leaving Albania because they are desperate for a better standard of living. That does not fit with current uk govt policy for asylum.
Do you have a source for that first claim? I'd be interested to see the numbers.
Bump.
NR.
Did you get anywhere with the source of these numbers? I'm interested in seeing them.
If you look under world population review you may find them. Sorry don’t have the link.
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The
OK NR, how many Albanians in your area that effect you are either illegal immigrants, criminals or both and how do you know?
What I am trying to get across, although this is a big deal to you as you are the one that keeps posting the daily mail type topic headlines, in terms of the cost compared to GDP it is an extremely small fraction. This series of tory governments has spaffed more up the wall in any week than the cost of all channel crossers put together.
All this government needs to keep getting back in power is enough people to get wound up about Albanians swarming across the channel rather than look at the important stuff.
We have very few Albanians locally, currently.
I would give very serious consideration to voting labour at the next GE. But I would like to see a very firm, fair policy from the opposition as to what they would do with this issue. It may seem like a small issue in the grand scheme financially. But in the world I see and experience every day, it’s important. Crime and the fear of crime affects everyone in this country.
What’s important to me, is not necessarily what’s important to you.
I like your use of the word swarming btw. Very apt.
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Would you like to show me a link or is it confidential? it's quite normal when posting figures supporting and argument that the source of those figures are posted along with them.
How do these Albanian criminals compare in numbers to other ethnic groupings including English, Scottish and Welsh?
How do you know that the Albanians are 'boat people' and not here by immigration channels?
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Would you like to show me a link or is it confidential? it's quite normal when posting figures supporting and argument that the source of those figures are posted along with them.
How do these Albanian criminals compare in numbers to other ethnic groupings including English, Scottish and Welsh?
How do you know that the Albanians are 'boat people' and not here by immigration channels?
I suspect he read it in the Daily Mail.
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NR
1) We are still receiving a tiny fraction of the number of immigrants that the rest of Europe is dealing with.
2) Reports today are that the Home Secretary has been told by officials that she is breaking UK law in the way she is housing the arrivals in internment camps.
3) The Home Office's own figures say that, of the applications for asylum that they have processed, only 4% have been rejected.
5) Here's the real question. In the light of all of that information, shouldn't we be making it possible for asylum applicants to make legal applications for asylum, rather than forcing them into illegally crossing the Channel?
On point 1, the uk is ranked fifth in the world for the number of foreign born residents (immigrants) in the world. Based on stats provided by World population review. Only surpassed by Russia, the USA , Saudi Arabia and Germany. Just one EU country.
On point 2. Desperate times call for desperate measures. Where else are they to be housed until a proper solution can be found?
On point 3. The stats provided by the home office for “processed” application are very misleading. The current asylum application process is complex to say the least. The 4 % they allude to will be those at the first hurdle. There are many many asylum applicants in this country who have been here 10 years, who are still pending final decision. Why is this? Because we have no current strategy to deport people for the uk in the sort of numbers we would need to to bring this whole thing under control.
On point 4. Let’s not forget that the current uk govt policy for successful asylum application is that the applicant must satisfy 2 criteria. One is that they have left their home country, that’s the easy bit. The second is that they must prove that they are escaping persecution and for them to go home would put their lives at risk. As per the 1951 refugee convention. Albanians are leaving Albania because they are desperate for a better standard of living. That does not fit with current uk govt policy for asylum.
Do you have a source for that first claim? I'd be interested to see the numbers.
Bump.
NR.
Did you get anywhere with the source of these numbers? I'm interested in seeing them.
If you look under world population review you may find them. Sorry don’t have the link.
Thanks.
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Would you like to show me a link or is it confidential? it's quite normal when posting figures supporting and argument that the source of those figures are posted along with them.
How do these Albanian criminals compare in numbers to other ethnic groupings including English, Scottish and Welsh?
How do you know that the Albanians are 'boat people' and not here by immigration channels?
I suspect he read it in the Daily Mail.
I don’t read the daily Mail. Never have, never will.
The open source stuff is freely available on the internet web regarding Uk based Albanian criminality and the effect mass migration of Albanians to the uk is having on this.
The closed source stuff Im privy to is not for public consumption.
As a starting point might I suggest you search under “ albanian organised crime in the uk nca”
You will see various threads all relating to recent NCA ops targeting the people traffickers. And this is the tip of the iceberg. There will be dozens and dozens of similar operations ongoin as we speak.
Of course, once they get to the uk, tracking and disrupting them becomes a whole different ballgame. One which is devolved to the forces of the shires who have neither the money or resources to deal with it properly.
To get a feeling for uk based Albanian crime , take a look at the Organised crime index aka OCINDEX. Scroll down to the criminal actors part which talks about Drug supply into the UK and who controls it. There is one specific country named. Just one.
This is the tip of the iceberg also.
https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=&ved=2ahUKEwjR0JCLpJz7AhXDlFwKHYFTBCgQFnoECCAQAQ&url=https%3A%2F%2Focindex.net%2Fcountry%2Funited_kingdom&usg=AOvVaw3AxmD1-sAtaM9NK9Wx7rKG.
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I suggest you read this NR it may help you see what is happening in the media. If you type in 50 migrants escape from hotel and then look at the responses you will likely find that the tele, daily mail, express plus a few more obscure sources at the top of the list. I think you would find lots of countries are dealing with the masses of displaced people and migrants right across Europe.
https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2022/nov/07/tories-myth-migrant-crisis-brexit-immigration-centre
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I'm just trying to get a fix on what your priorities are, what would make a difference in your life, the UK receiving a few less boat people or being able to get an appointment at the doctors when you need one and a bed in a hospital that's not decaying (hospitals need 10bn spent to bring them up to scratch on buildings and equipment)
Yes immigration does make a big difference to the economy, not half or a tenth to what a well run economy would. Parliament having to chase a corrupt government around. The biggest difference immigration makes is it improves and economy.
That's not what your great leader says .
https://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/news/politics/keir-starmer-says-many-people-28420205?utm_source=linkCopy&utm_medium=social&utm_campaign=sharebar
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What he hasn’t said is that we are pinching highly skilled medical staff from Third world countries where they are really needed that’s morally wrong, I don’t see anything wrong in recruiting warehouse staff etc from Eastern European nations properly or technology minded Individuals for that matter
But the issue with Albanians is they are being trafficked into the UK and are then being made to conduct immoral activities such as Drug dealing or Prostitution to pay back their Debts, we got 6,000 Romanians in Donny and 11,000 Poles 99% of them working and paying tax, by the way have a look at Copley and Netherhall Road they are buzzing.
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Good point sprot, modern western countries should strive to train their own whilst also giving opportunities for staff to be cross trained across the world.
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A new poll out today shows that instead of 'taking back control', a large majority of the public think Brexit has made our borders less secure.
According to the latest Opinium poll, 73% think the UK has not been in control of its borders since Brexit. Only 12% think Britain has been in control. Meanwhile, only 9% of the public believe Brexit has made Britain’s ability to manage its borders better, while 45% think it has made it worse.
Those who backed Brexit are also taking a dim view. Only 7% of leave voters think the UK is in control of its borders since Brexit, while 85% think it is not.
https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2022/nov/05/most-britons-think-country-has-lost-control-of-its-border-since-brexit-poll
Vote Tory.
Wilts stop quoting’Woke’ Cr’p since we left Europe we can have a look at all entrants, no more convicted Child molesters and Killers just sauntering on the Ferry those 300,000 immigrants Germany let in a large proportion of who ran riot on New Year’s Eve Sexually assaulting Hundreds of German Women , now qualify for a German Passport fortunately we can now check em at the order!
Don't blame me for what the public think sproty. Including one prominent poster who is telling us we are not doing any of those things but instead letting in criminals by the boatload. 6 years after the Brexit vote and 3 years since Johnson's deal.
When is it exactly we are going to take control of our borders then?
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It would appear people have either missed or ignored this, so posted again for information:
According to the latest figures I can find, August 2022, 53% of Albanian refugees were granted Asylum status. That is, it was accepted by this Tory government that they were fleeing persecution.
And of the 53% of Albanians who were granted asylum - 86% of them were women being trafficked.
So rather than the false narrative some people have been keen to push, rather than these people being Albanian criminals they are mostly victims of Albanian criminals.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-62676829
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/braverman-asylum-seekers-albania-trafficking-b2215187.html
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I would like to see proof that all boat arrivers claim asylum before I get convinced by figures on refugee status Wilts
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I would like to see proof that all boat arrivers claim asylum before I get convinced by figures on refugee status Wilts
There's either gov't figures or nothing Ldr, there is no other data.
https://www.gov.uk/government/statistics/factsheet-small-boat-crossings-since-july-2022/factsheet-small-boat-crossings-since-july-2022
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That’s the problem Syd, a case of don’t know what we don’t know
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That’s the problem Syd, a case of don’t know what we don’t know
I am quite prepared to believe this government is useless, has no idea how to control small boat crossings and is using inflamatory language to turn people against refugees fleeing persecution and war (much of which they had supported) in order to hide their failures.
What I wont believe is that they are inflating the number of people making the crossing and claiming refugee. When in order to keep support of those people who dont believe the refugees are refugees - they could just make it up and put a lower figure in. As you say - no one can check.
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https://mobile.twitter.com/Haggis_UK/status/1595362008072863746
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And then she couldn't/wouldn't answer the question of when she, as Home Sec, became aware of problems at Manston in that the Govt was breaking the law
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https://news.sky.com/story/uk-sees-highest-net-migration-since-second-world-war-12754404
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Germany returns all Albanian Asylum seeker immediately as they have deemed it a ‘Safe’ Country
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Here's some more about Germany sprot
''Five Years Later, One Million Refugees Are Thriving in Germany''
https://www.cgdev.org/blog/five-years-later-one-million-refugees-are-thriving-germany
''With the number of people fleeing to Germany this year set to exceed the 1.2 million who arrived in 2015-2016, the government is under growing pressure to avert a "refugee crisis".
As the number of asylum seekers and refugees arriving in Germany rises again, so do the comparisons to 2015, when more than 1.2 million people crossed the borders. Today, with even more expected to arrive than during the so-called "refugee crisis", there is again talk of becoming "overwhelmed" and "pressure" from an influx of migrants''
http://www.infomigrants.net/en/post/43934/over-a-million-refugees-and-asylum-seekers-in-germany-how-will-it-manage-this-time
I guess it's all about context
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The irony of people who said we had to leave the EU to control immigration now quoting an EU country as a model to control immigration...
The US and Canada accept most Albanian asylum seekers btw.
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Keith will sort it .
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-63707941
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https://www.ons.gov.uk/peoplepopulationandcommunity/populationandmigration/internationalmigration/bulletins/longterminternationalmigrationprovisional/yearendingjune2022?utm_source=Sailthru&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=IND_WESTMINSTER%2024-11-2022&utm_term=IND_VIEW_WESTMINSTER_cdp#immigration-to-the-uk%20%20https://twitter.com/PaulBrandITV/status/1595719259048525825
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Keith and his new buddy Farage will sort it .
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We should be immensely proud as a nation of these latest net migration figures.
Over the last c. 20 years net migration into the UK has run at c. 250k per year.
In the year recently reported we've given refugee status to c. 175k escaping war torn regions of Ukraine and c. 75k people escaping persecution in Hong Kong.
We have a duty as a democratic nation to defend democratic values and as a wealthy nation to provide a safe haven. Like I say these net migration figures should be a source of pride.
Take the c. 250k from Ukraine and HK from the headline 500k figure and you get back to the 250k long term average.
If 250k is too much/too little immigration as a long term average is another question.
I'd suggest in the period in question given unemployment rates reached historic low levels (lowest in over 50 years) and wage growth was comparatively very high versus neighbouring countries that the level of work-related inward migration made sound economic sense.
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I wonder if this critter was intent on contributing to the uk economy?
More tragic stories like this to come no doubt.
https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=&ved=2ahUKEwj938LYkOH8AhVaiv0HHWVABowQFnoECA4QAQ&url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.telegraph.co.uk%2Fnews%2F2023%2F01%2F23%2Fafghan-asylum-seeker-murdered-aspiring-royal-marine%2F&usg=AOvVaw3mhgDPwZQBVhYUJ-BeY500
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This is the future for modern western countries if the birth rate problem is not addressed and somewhat offset with immigration.
“Japan's prime minister says his country is on the brink of not being able to function as a society because of its falling birth rate.”
“Japan has continued implementing strict immigration laws despite some relaxations, but some experts are now saying that the rules should be loosened further to help tackle its ageing society.”
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-64373950.amp
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This is the future for modern western countries if the birth rate problem is not addressed and somewhat offset with immigration.
“Japan's prime minister says his country is on the brink of not being able to function as a society because of its falling birth rate.”
“Japan has continued implementing strict immigration laws despite some relaxations, but some experts are now saying that the rules should be loosened further to help tackle its ageing society.”
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-64373950.amp
A low birth rate makes more room for those that want to come to the UK
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If people were educated to their potential and better jobs provided maybe they would have more children.
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If people were educated to their potential and better jobs provided maybe they would have more children.
https://www.drake.edu/media/departmentsoffices/dussj/2020documents/Cornett%20DUSSJ%202020.pdf
“There is a strong link between increased levels of education for females and lower
fertility rates. That is, the higher the level of a woman’s educational attainment, the fewer number of children she is likely to bear, and this effect is shown in countries and cultures around the world. The data support that this relationship is causal (Alam et al. 2003)”
Not a factor Sydney
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So you think the uk is a developing country now nc, I know we have gone way backwards under tory rule but how far back is the question.
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''The research found that the two-child limit has led to a decline in the number of third and subsequent births of approximately 5,600 a year, just under 1 percent of total annual births in England and Wales''
https://www.lse.ac.uk/News/Latest-news-from-LSE/2022/d-Apr-22/Two-child-benefit-limit#:~:text=The%20research%20found%20that%20the,births%20in%20England%20and%20Wales.
suggestion read this after you read the link you posted nc
This may interest you also
https://www.ons.gov.uk/peoplepopulationandcommunity/birthsdeathsandmarriages/livebirths/articles/anoteonchildbearingbysocioeconomicstatusandcountryofbirthofmother/2016
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Where did I say the UK was now a developing country? Not sure I catch your drift.
That is interesting Sydney I didn’t know that. Correlation doesn’t equal causation in that case. But, there should not be a limit on 2 children there at all. Given the effect that a declining and top-heavy population will have on the economy, people need to be given financial incentives to have more children. And immigration should not be restricted any more.
There are also likely cultural influences as to why people are having less children as well. If women leave it later to pursue career they are less likely to successfully get pregnant. Not to mention declining male sperm counts. Time to promote family values again?
Thankfully I can’t see us going back to the anti-immigration sentiment of the brexit era.
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So you think the uk is a developing country now nc, I know we have gone way backwards under tory rule but how far back is the question.
Appreciate your opinion Syd (and agree with it) but less if this “We” aye? You ain’t one of us anymore
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Where did I say the UK was now a developing country? Not sure I catch your drift.
That is interesting Sydney I didn’t know that. Correlation doesn’t equal causation in that case. But, there should not be a limit on 2 children there at all. Given the effect that a declining and top-heavy population will have on the economy, people need to be given financial incentives to have more children. And immigration should not be restricted any more.
There are also likely cultural influences as to why people are having less children as well. If women leave it later to pursue career they are less likely to successfully get pregnant. Not to mention declining male sperm counts. Time to promote family values again?
Thankfully I can’t see us going back to the anti-immigration sentiment of the brexit era.
Read the link you put up
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So you think the uk is a developing country now nc, I know we have gone way backwards under tory rule but how far back is the question.
Appreciate your opinion Syd (and agree with it) but less if this “We” aye? You ain’t one of us anymore
While ever this is going on I will have my say and you'll have to become a mod to stop me so you may as well shut up about it or find another way to stop me.
Maybe you need to put into the forum rules what distance from the ground and the time away from it is that determines how people see themselves and comment Ldr
I was watching ''The US and the Holocaust'' last night, it's all about 'us and them' 'you and me' attitudes and how it all starts and changes so easily.
The uk and australia get a guernsey too.
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So you think the uk is a developing country now nc, I know we have gone way backwards under tory rule but how far back is the question.
Appreciate your opinion Syd (and agree with it) but less if this “We” aye? You ain’t one of us anymore
While ever this is going on I will have my say and you'll have to become a mod to stop me so you may as well shut up about it or find another way to stop me.
Maybe you need to put into the forum rules what distance from the ground and the time away from it is that determines how people see themselves and comment Ldr
I was watching ''The US and the Holocaust'' last night, it's all about 'us and them' 'you and me' attitudes and how it all starts and changes so easily.
The uk and australia get a guernsey too.
Syd I have genuinely no idea what point you are making? Nowhere have I said you can’t or shouldn’t voice your opinion. I just said don’t use “we” as you’re not one of us anymore
We in the uk are definitely going backwards but don’t include yourself in that since you left
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Why should I care what you do and don't understand?
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Where did I say the UK was now a developing country? Not sure I catch your drift.
That is interesting Sydney I didn’t know that. Correlation doesn’t equal causation in that case. But, there should not be a limit on 2 children there at all. Given the effect that a declining and top-heavy population will have on the economy, people need to be given financial incentives to have more children. And immigration should not be restricted any more.
There are also likely cultural influences as to why people are having less children as well. If women leave it later to pursue career they are less likely to successfully get pregnant. Not to mention declining male sperm counts. Time to promote family values again?
Thankfully I can’t see us going back to the anti-immigration sentiment of the brexit era.
Read the link you put up
You’re not making any sense to me. I was quoting the conclusion. You’ve read the first sentence by the looks of it.
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The opening para of your link states the focus is on developing countries and tries for most of the rest to link that to all other countries with varying degrees of success. Show me where it has been peer reviewed.
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Seems the govt are pressing ahead with this new law , which will push the boundaries of legislation.
It will be interesting to see the detail in it.
Albanians now form the majority of boat crossings.
And I understand the uk govt already has some sort of memorandum of understanding in place for them to take back their own Nationals.
And so, the only action I can see in the future for this to properly send out the message is detain on arrival, house securely and as soon as possible fly them back to Tirana.
No delay. No messing around. No asylum application. No argument.
Only then will this been seen to be a success. And only then will the message get out that our borders are secure.
Get this right and the Tories get my vote at the next GE. I suspect I’m not alone in this philosophy either.
The other countries will be more interesting. I can’t see there being any such arrangement for countries like Eritrea, Libya, Iraq, Iran and Afghanistan.
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Interview on Beeb this morning only 21 sent back out of 20,000 if I heard correctly.
Also this "law" will take years to come into force, if it actually does.
Who knows where these people will be returned, as apart from Albania we have no return agreement in place so I wonder where the safe country is that they will be returned to.
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The longer it takes to come into force, the more harm will come to the tories chances of re election. This is their latest high profile “we will sort it “ policy. They will be judged on its outcome .
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It's got sweet FA to do with actually solving the problem. It's all about keeping angry people angry.
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They've got no agreements,other than Albania. There's nowhere to send them to.
It's all smoke and mirrors and a handy tool for the Tories in the culture war as an awful lot of people are up in arms about this, and despite it being way down the list of real problems we've got, the likes of Braverman will keep stirring it up and banging Britain for the British drum.
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The last idea they came up with - send them to Rwanada - cost the British taxpayer £200 million and deported exactly 0 people. I can see this having about the same effect for the same cost.
Sunak & Braverman promising things they know they cant deliver - and then blaming it on everyone else.
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Sunak & Braverman promising things they know they cant deliver.
Wilts, I know you won’t mind me saying this……. That phrase of your sounds a bit like being in opposition.
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Sunak & Braverman promising things they know they cant deliver.
Wilts, I know you won’t mind me saying this……. That phrase of your sounds a bit like being in opposition.
Unfortunately for us hound - quite a lot of the time they act like it too. Practicing for 18 months time I suppose.
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I thought this summed them up well:
The Tories - tough with
nurses
refugees
rail workers
climate change protestors
- easy with
tax evaders
PPE VIPs
sewage dumpers
lying ex PMs
Strong with the weak and weak with the strong.
https://twitter.com/JolyonMaugham/status/1633170702160338946
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I get that it's about playing politics and holding on to the one thing the Tories have (the appeal to benighted nationalism) but there's something so utterly obscene about this woman trying to make out we are some paragon of decency for saving people from Afghanistan, and complaining that our asylum system is overwhelmed, when we have blocked pretty much all legal forms of asylum claim and left people who worked for our army in Afghanistan to fend for themselves.
https://mobile.twitter.com/ukhomeoffice/status/1633022905628884992
She's a frightening moral stain on our country. I hope to God she never gets near power again after next year.
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Sunak & Braverman promising things they know they cant deliver.
Wilts, I know you won’t mind me saying this……. That phrase of your sounds a bit like being in opposition.
Unfortunately for us hound - quite a lot of the time they act like it too. Practicing for 18 months time I suppose.
Agreed wilts.
Everything will change after the next GE.
It’s going to be great.
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After tonight’s shit show, I wonder if any of these asylum seekers play football?
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Read this from UNHCR.
This isn't Russia or China or some other nationalistic dictatorship they are talking about.
It's the UK. In the 21st Century.
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Like I say, this disgusting cabal has nothing left but the Culture War.
https://twitter.com/SophiaSleigh/status/1633112409341583360?s=20
That's what is at the root of this awful new law.
It won't stop crossings. It's can't stop crossings. It's not intended to stop crossings.
The best possible outcome for the Govt, I'd say the very intention of the legislation is that it should be declared in breach of the ECHR.
Then Braverman can put on her Bodecia act and wind up the target audience with "See! It's those interfering do gooders in Brussels to blame!"
Everything aimed at making angry people even angrier.
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The perceived failure of the govt to get to grips with this will be their final un doing.
And then it’s over the Labour Party no doubt.
Who will oversee the continuing, uncontrolled waves of incomers.
And I’m not seeing any constructive plan coming out of starmer for this eventuality. Just criticism aimed at the govt.
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braverman has said they are breaking the law, so why don't the police charge them? is she lying or the police not doing there job?
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If this law was in place from 1900 most of my family would have ended up being wiped out. I'd never have been born. It's highly unlikely my wife's family would be here either.
This bill is monstrous and must be opposed as such.
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And, there is estimated to be around 1 million living undocumented in the country, we don't here much about that.
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And meanwhile, once again my brother in law who was born, raised and schooled to the age of 8 in the UK, to a father with indefinite leave to remain, is hitting a brick wall with this disgusting Home Office when he tries to exercise his right to receive a British passport. Once again HE is being asked to provide written proof that his father had leave to remain, despite the fact that his father died in chaotic circumstances when he was only 8 years old. Despite his father having lived, married, worked, raised two families, run three companies and paid taxes in the UK, the Home Office has no record of him.
Most people in this country have no idea whatsoever of this callous incompetence, and how it f**ks up people's lives.
Worse, I think there's a decent proportion of the population who really don't care what is done in their name.
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Anything for a vote, one of the ukip ones I'd imagine.
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And meanwhile, once again my brother in law who was born, raised and schooled to the age of 8 in the UK, to a father with indefinite leave to remain, is hitting a brick wall with this disgusting Home Office when he tries to exercise his right to receive a British passport. Once again HE is being asked to provide written proof that his father had leave to remain, despite the fact that his father died in chaotic circumstances when he was only 8 years old. Despite his father having lived, married, worked, raised two families, run three companies and paid taxes in the UK, the Home Office has no record of him.
Most people in this country have no idea whatsoever of this callous incompetence, and how it f**ks up people's lives.
Worse, I think there's a decent proportion of the population who really don't care what is done in their name.
I think one of the problems is that for all the genuine cases like your brother-in-law’s, there are, no doubt, many fraudulent claims for a British passport. As harsh as it sounds, talking someone’s word for it just opens the floodgates for false claims to be accepted.
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I see Cruella sent out an email to Tory activists yesterday saying their previous plans had been thwarted by "an activist blob of left lawyers, civil servants and the Labour party" and saying that anyone who was against the Govt policy was disloyal to the country.
This from the moral vacuum who refused to condemn rioters who tried to storm an asylum seekers' accommodation centre.
And the Tory MPs are up in arms about someone calling out facism for what it is. She's not even trying to put a façade on it.
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This is why this law is a stain on the country.
1) The Govt has made it impossible for people from the vast majority of countries to legally claim asylum here.
2) You CAN claim asylum if you fly to the UK and claim it at border control. But the whole point is that people fleeing genuine oppression will not be able to get a visa to be able to legally fly to the UK in the first place
3) Last year, 90% of "illegal" arrivals on Channel boats claimed asylum.
4) Of the cases dealt with to date, 62% have been granted asylum or some other leave to remain.
5) So the Govt's response is to remove the legal right to claim asylum if you arrive illegally.
Just beyond words.
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And meanwhile, once again my brother in law who was born, raised and schooled to the age of 8 in the UK, to a father with indefinite leave to remain, is hitting a brick wall with this disgusting Home Office when he tries to exercise his right to receive a British passport. Once again HE is being asked to provide written proof that his father had leave to remain, despite the fact that his father died in chaotic circumstances when he was only 8 years old. Despite his father having lived, married, worked, raised two families, run three companies and paid taxes in the UK, the Home Office has no record of him.
Most people in this country have no idea whatsoever of this callous incompetence, and how it f**ks up people's lives.
Worse, I think there's a decent proportion of the population who really don't care what is done in their name.
I think one of the problems is that for all the genuine cases like your brother-in-law’s, there are, no doubt, many fraudulent claims for a British passport. As harsh as it sounds, talking someone’s word for it just opens the floodgates for false claims to be accepted.
Yes, it does sound harsh. There is no doubt some signficant evidence of the situation in the case BST uses, just not the evidence that is required. Looking at individual circumstances is the human way to go, and doesn't necessarily take that long to process. The same goes for so many situations in life. The reason lines are drawn in the sand, ie strict laws and strict processes is because the powers that be can firmly define things that support their aims. In this case bigging up the us and them card - always a right wing vote winner, and a distraction from real human issues.
This is not for "the people", it's for the nefarious powers in control. They've constructed the narrative over many decades that way.
It's worth paralleling "harsh" in this instance to "harsh" in the case of bringing back hanging. "Harsh" says, for the few who fall foul of misjustice, the majority are guilty. It also plays the populist fantasy card of being "harsh" will disuade others from murdering - paralleled by gettiing on a dingy in Calais. It maybe makes a low single percentage figure difference, but the narrative that is being used makes out it's far far higher - ie it's b*llocks, and the masses are being conned by those in power - no change there then.
Then it is important to look at who is being targetted. Boat people. There are other immigrants - currently including those from Ukraine - that are ignored in this. Why would that be? And it's not just Ukraines. Also, there is this fallacy of getting people in the country with high qualifications, with bags of money, with some relatives here. We need people of all kinds including hard grafting Africans and others. What we could expell are the likes of the spongers personified by Rees Mogg, Sunak, Johnson, Braverman and thousands of others.
Can't you see what's going on?
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I don’t disagree with any of that, Bristol.
But you are quoting my post which is in response to Billy’s personal story regarding his BIL and British passports, not ‘boat people’.
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This is why this law is a stain on the country.
1) The Govt has made it impossible for people from the vast majority of countries to legally claim asylum here.
2) You CAN claim asylum if you fly to the UK and claim it at border control. But the whole point is that people fleeing genuine oppression will not be able to get a visa to be able to legally fly to the UK in the first place
3) Last year, 90% of "illegal" arrivals on Channel boats claimed asylum.
4) Of the cases dealt with to date, 62% have been granted asylum or some other leave to remain.
5) So the Govt's response is to remove the legal right to claim asylum if you arrive illegally.
Just beyond words.
Not forgetting they need for the correct ID/passport to arrange a flight/visa
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BRR
I'm generally a believer in the cock up model of history rather than the conspiracy model.
In the case of my brother in law, the core of the problem is that the Home Office which granted his father indefinite leave to remain has no record of the fact that it did so. I KNOW they did because I once saw the documentary evidence he had.
That is a classic case of institutional incompetence. The HO haven't had the systems to record their own decisions on something as fundamental as who has the right to live and work here.
Under this Govt though, there's been more of a move towards the conspiracy angle. By batting this back to a person who was 8 when his father died and insisting it is HIS responsibility to prove that the HO made that decision, they are deliberately choosing to prevent someone who currently lives overseas from getting his birthright. And of course, it's a low hanging fruit in their aim of being able to crow that they've reduced the numbers of "foreigners" coming to Britain.
If this is how they deal with people with a legal right to a British passport, it's a small step to them denying the rights of geniune asylum seekers, which is precisely what this new law will do.
But of course this new law is not about justice or morality. It's about stoking the Culture War and making sure angry right wing people stay angry and vote Tory.
Thats
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https://twitter.com/BestForBritain/status/1633497536831815680?s=20
If you support this nasty, vicious law from Braverman, or if you don't oppose it, be aware of what you are allowing. It's the end of the system that was set up, by Britain and the Allies after the War.
If you do this, don't ever dare compare yourselves to that generation.
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i have a genuine question for those on here who take issue with the govt immigration policy.
How do you feel about the thousands of young Albanian males coming to the UK. Who now, by some distance, make up the largest percentage of cross channel migrants entering the uk illegally.
Please evidence your response.
And for context, i ask this because Albanian Organised Crime is going through an explosive increase in the uk currently. Albanian migration into the uk is not a new thing. But this recent wave is next level, and then some.
Albanian Organised Crime are like Italian Mafia on steroids. Albanian OCG's now how control of most of the cocaine markets in the uk, with Liverpool being the sole exception (for now) It is this explosion in their activity that is fuelling the dramatic increase in cross channel migration.
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NR.
The solution is, if they are claiming asylum and don't have grounds for that, process their case and deport them.
What you must not do is effectively ban the whole concept of seeking asylum in the UK.
It's a question of managerial incompetence that has been turned into an issue of Culture War (im)morality.
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BRR
I'm generally a believer in the cock up model of history rather than the conspiracy model.
In the case of my brother in law, the core of the problem is that the Home Office which granted his father indefinite leave to remain has no record of the fact that it did so. I KNOW they did because I once saw the documentary evidence he had.
That is a classic case of institutional incompetence. The HO haven't had the systems to record their own decisions on something as fundamental as who has the right to live and work here.
Under this Govt though, there's been more of a move towards the conspiracy angle. By batting this back to a person who was 8 when his father died and insisting it is HIS responsibility to prove that the HO made that decision, they are deliberately choosing to prevent someone who currently lives overseas from getting his birthright. And of course, it's a low hanging fruit in their aim of being able to crow that they've reduced the numbers of "foreigners" coming to Britain.
If this is how they deal with people with a legal right to a British passport, it's a small step to them denying the rights of geniune asylum seekers, which is precisely what this new law will do.
But of course this new law is not about justice or morality. It's about stoking the Culture War and making sure angry right wing people stay angry and vote Tory.
Thats
BST. genuine question here.
If your bro in law has got documentary evidence then why can't he copy it and send it to the Home Office.
Perhaps get a solicitor to verify that it is genuine and not something that has been recently made.
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i have a genuine question for those on here who take issue with the govt immigration policy.
How do you feel about the thousands of young Albanian males coming to the UK. Who now, by some distance, make up the largest percentage of cross channel migrants entering the uk illegally.
Please evidence your response.
And for context, i ask this because Albanian Organised Crime is going through an explosive increase in the uk currently. Albanian migration into the uk is not a new thing. But this recent wave is next level, and then some.
Albanian Organised Crime are like Italian Mafia on steroids. Albanian OCG's now how control of most of the cocaine markets in the uk, with Liverpool being the sole exception (for now) It is this explosion in their activity that is fuelling the dramatic increase in cross channel migration.
Why not ask why the government has not stopped Albanians taking over the the major drug scene in the UK and working directly with the mafia before now?
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Im not asking you SR
You gave up the uk some time ago.
You don't count.
You don't live here.
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The Police are well aware of it syd and are trying to deal with it.
As you might know, it isn't so easy to do.
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Im not asking you SR
You gave up the uk some time ago.
You don't count.
You don't live here.
How do you know I'm not in the country right now nr?
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you dont live here anymore.
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you dont live here anymore.
What are you going to do shoot me in the back?
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you dont live here anymore.
What are you going to do shoot me in the back?
waste of lead.
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you sound like a right wing extremist nr and you let yourself get wound up by a government wanting to do just that.
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I'm my own person SR. What you think I "sound" like is irrelevant to me.
From my military days, i was taught not to waste ammo on non combatants or non threats. you raised the topic of shooting people in the back, hypothetically or otherwise. i see you as both of the above. not worth the effort. or the lead.
If you knew me you would think diff. Im opinionated. But defo not extreme.
Get y' sen down t' Anderson Park.
Its the closest you'll get to being a "Rovers" supporter now.
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Talk about mixed messaging: tomorrows Financial Times - government to introduce measures to bring in more foreign construction workers.
Hope they dont bring them over by ferry - or they will be building houses in the first safe country they arrive in.
https://twitter.com/BBCNews/status/1633599500861460480
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I don’t disagree with any of that, Bristol.
But you are quoting my post which is in response to Billy’s personal story regarding his BIL and British passports, not ‘boat people’.
Fair enough, that was written after my third strong coffee, and I raced a touch too fast! :woot:
My point though was about BSTs BIL, and how I don't see any floodgates being opened if the case is dealt with humanely - which is the same for the boat people. Just that bureaucracy plus the pandering to fear of foreigners policy, including this recent law, is anti humanity.
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you sound like a right wing extremist nr and you let yourself get wound up by a government wanting to do just that.
Someone with inside knowledge and an opinion gets called a right wing extremist for asking a valid question ?
But then what else did we expect from the usual sources.
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I'll just put this here so anyone wanting to complain to the mods has the overall story.
Im not asking you SR
You gave up the uk some time ago.
You don't count.
You don't live here.
Re: 1 in 10 Police Officers a danger to the public
« Reply #13 on March 08, 2023, 10:17:57 pm by SydneyRover »
Quote from: normal rules on February 07, 2023, 09:55:05 am
In you first scenario, then there would most certainly be a charge of death by careless or death by dangerous. Which most certainly would result in a job loss of course and a custodial term being imposed.
If only we lived in a world where everyone complied with the law, then there would be no need for police or any other law enforcement agency.
But what sort of a world would that be ?
Having a supervisor and obeying their instruction. Hmmm. Where do I start with this?
Some leaders I would gladly follow into battle. All day long.
Some I would happily shoot in the back. Literally. Because their orders and instructions would put lives at risk. Because they are clueless.
And I have experience of both.
This sounds like extremist behaviour to me?
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My military days are well behind me thankfully.
Complain away.
And be sure to let us know how Anderson Park is.
And when you are bored, which seems apparent is often due to the amount of time you spend on here, read up on Lt Col H Jones of the Para Regt.
And look for the truth. Not the wiki story.
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Meanwhile, our opposition party is opposing the plan based on how ineffective it is, rather than how disgustingly immoral it is, creating a moral vacuum seemingly filled by f**king Gary Lineker. The story is now about Gary Lineker's opinion of our stride towards fascism rather than the stride itself. We're in a dangerous place here.
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Starmer will sort it!
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Meanwhile, our opposition party is opposing the plan based on how ineffective it is, rather than how disgustingly immoral it is, creating a moral vacuum seemingly filled by f**king Gary Lineker. The story is now about Gary Lineker's opinion of our stride towards fascism rather than the stride itself. We're in a dangerous place here.
I know you dislike the current Labour party, but even for someone coming from that angle you're being wilfully blind here.
There are two parallel and separate issues about the boat crossings.
1) There ARE economic migrants originating in safe countries who are trying to get into the country illegally.
2) There ARE desperate people trying to escape oppression and seeing the UK as a place to claim asylum.
Unless you separate out this two, you're not going to solve the issue.
The problem at the moment is that everyone is treated the same. Those who really are economic migrants know that the asylum system is so dysfunctional that if they get caught, they can claim asylum and often vanish into the black economy before their case is ever processed.
Braverman literally doesn't give a f**k about the second and THAT is the moral obscenity. Her response is to address that blockinf any arriving people from claiming asylum so that they can all be deported quickly.
The ONLY way you solve this problem in a way that combines effective deterence with genuine morality is to have an asylum processing system that works quickly so that it can filter out the geniune and non-genuine cases efficiently while also rooting out the criminal gangs that facilitate the economic migrant trade. Do that and you can properly target the illegal economic migrants while still allowing genuine asylum claims.
But it's bloody hard and it needs a remorseless focus. Under Braverman and Patel there wasn't even the will to do that, because it was better for them to be seen to hit ALL the alien invasion with the same stick. It plays to a particularly nasty brand of English Nationalism that their support is rooted in.
Labour's policy is the one I've just outlined above. Will it work? I don't know. But to suggest there's some sort of moral black hole at the core of Labour because they are talking about effectivity of the policy is beneath you MM. It comes from that intellectually bone idle attitude of so many Corbynistas that any non-Corbynite Labour party is effectively Tory.
You talk about dangerous places. That attitude is one of the most corrosive in current politics.
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Sunak has agreed a 500mil pound scheme to give the French over 3 years to help sort this. They will employ 500 extra officers and have a detention centre . They are going to call it Le Scampton.
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Surely having an online portal or a center to process them was the first port of call, that alone would stop the boats. It's not f*cking rocket science. Give them a safe way to claim asylum in this country and they would have used it.
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My solution would be,build a detention centre in North France, staff it with Border Force/immigration/French Security officers. All asylum Seekers will be processed there if they are genuine put the on a ferry and ship em to a resettlement site, if they Fail, i.e. Albanian or other safe country, or clearly a military militant threat they are not processed but sent on their way, from 'D' days any boat loads recovered Mid Chanel are returned to the centre and processed. It might cost £500 million a year but it will be effective. A bit like the huge compound in Nigeria that processes peeps wanting to travel to the UK legally.and I wouldn't bother with Rwanda.
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My solution would be,build a detention centre in North France, staff it with Border Force/immigration/French Security officers. All asylum Seekers will be processed there if they are genuine put the on a ferry and ship em to a resettlement site, if they Fail, i.e. Albanian or other safe country, or clearly a military militant threat they are not processed but sent on their way, from 'D' days any boat loads recovered Mid Chanel are returned to the centre and processed. It might cost £500 a year but it will be effective. A bit like the huge compound in Nigeria that processes peeps wanting to travel to the UK legally.and I wouldn't bother with Rwanda.
£500 would be decent. ;)
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And what do you think France might say about that?
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I hope that is what was agreed on Friday' Mon Ami!
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My solution would be,build a detention centre in North France, staff it with Border Force/immigration/French Security officers. All asylum Seekers will be processed there if they are genuine put the on a ferry and ship em to a resettlement site, if they Fail, i.e. Albanian or other safe country, or clearly a military militant threat they are not processed but sent on their way, from 'D' days any boat loads recovered Mid Chanel are returned to the centre and processed. It might cost £500 a year but it will be effective. A bit like the huge compound in Nigeria that processes peeps wanting to travel to the UK legally.and I wouldn't bother with Rwanda.
When you look at the money that has been spent and on the results we have achieved it becomes a no brainer to not start to process all applicants in France, if the asylum achieved percentage is running at over 70% then it really beggars belief why we waste so much money on the far fetched schemes like Rwanda, ect. Id imagine this method would require assistance from the French authorities to deal with the failed individuals but when we are ready and willing to pay them even more for what they have obviously not achieved previously they its not really in their interests to help us out.
Lets hope that when Starmer assumes control he applies some common sense to this issue and stop the smugglers business plan in its tracks. We are throwing absolutely huge sums at this issue for no real return, we need to be much smarter/honest/pragmatic/ and take our responsibilities much more seriously for all concerned.
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My solution would be,build a detention centre in North France, staff it with Border Force/immigration/French Security officers. All asylum Seekers will be processed there if they are genuine put the on a ferry and ship em to a resettlement site, if they Fail, i.e. Albanian or other safe country, or clearly a military militant threat they are not processed but sent on their way, from 'D' days any boat loads recovered Mid Chanel are returned to the centre and processed. It might cost £500 a year but it will be effective. A bit like the huge compound in Nigeria that processes peeps wanting to travel to the UK legally.and I wouldn't bother with Rwanda.
When you look at the money that has been spent and on the results we have achieved it becomes a no brainer to not start to process all applicants in France, if the asylum achieved percentage is running at over 70% then it really beggars belief why we waste so much money on the far fetched schemes like Rwanda, ect. Id imagine this method would require assistance from the French authorities to deal with the failed individuals but when we are ready and willing to pay them even more for what they have obviously not achieved previously they its not really in their interests to help us out.
Lets hope that when Starmer assumes control he applies some common sense to this issue and stop the smugglers business plan in its tracks. We are throwing absolutely huge sums at this issue for no real return, we need to be much smarter/honest/pragmatic/ and take our responsibilities much more seriously for all concerned.
Not forgetting the lives it would save.
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But would it stop the ones rejected from making the crossing? Where are these safe countries Cruella talks about?
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The staff and funding that's been over there for years hasn't made much difference so not sure this will.
I do wonder what is it about this country that's so attractive for them versus say France?
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BFYP.
If you were seeking asylum and you had the choice between Australia and Japan, which would be your preference?
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The staff and funding that's been over there for years hasn't made much difference so not sure this will.
I do wonder what is it about this country that's so attractive for them versus say France?
Language or family potentially.
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BFYP.
If you were seeking asylum and you had the choice between Australia and Japan, which would be your preference?
I'd imagine Japan to be more welcoming than australia.
Get the point on language that makes sense but not sure what the attraction is for the non English speakers.
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Many people speak English as a second language.
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You're right pud Australia is not welcoming at all to any that arrive by boat.
“We will decide who comes to this country and the circumstances in which they come.”
One Nation were taking votes from the right and John Howard (lib/nat coalition) seized the opportunity when the Tampa rescued boat people at sea, he refused them entry. Since then the murdoch and mainly rw media have used is to bash anyone that speaks against it.
All this latest shit shit in the UK is take straight from this inhuman playbook.
https://howardlibrary.unsw.edu.au/explore/tampa-controversy
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The Tories Immigration Bill is doomed to failure from legal objections in the Courts. I suspect that they are aware of this and are simply playing to the gallery of their supporters.
However these small boat crossings, and indeed the smuggling of people from Asia/Africa across Europe need to be stopped. Lives are being put at risk by criminals who are profiting out of it.
My 6 step process of dealing with this in the UK.
1) Most obviously. Put money into the system to process claims a heck of a lot quicker.
2) Pursuing and leading on International policing co-operation going for the criminal gangs. A couple of years ago after migrants died crossing the Channel it was amazingly enlightening how quickly, with international co-operation, the criminal gang responsible were brought to justice.
3) More co-operation with France in stopping the boats being launched. Give the French what they really want, and what morally we have a duty to do, which is more military support of the French army in sub-Saharan Africa defending democracies against ISIS insurgencies.
4) Set up, with the co-operation of the relevant countries, refugee processing centres as close to the borders of the countries most refugees come from as possible. Save the refugees therefore the need of travelling dangerously 100s of miles using criminal gangs and give the most vulnerable and needing of our protection more chance of applying.
5) In said centres take photos and fingerprints of all applicants. Those whose applications fail should be told clearly that if they at a later date are caught entering the UK that their failed application will still be valid and they will be immediately deported. Hence again preventing unnecessary fraught journeys to the UK using criminals.
6) Those entering the UK who refuse to identify where they are from or give false information of where they are from to be deported asap to a 3rd country (not Rwanda given their human rights record but a deal can be done with a safe country in return for £££). No genuine refugee would behave in this way.
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What about those fleeing without papers?
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What about those fleeing without papers?
They will take longer to process obviously.
A refugee can be honest about where they are from without papers - time will just be needed to verify their claim but that should be possible with the right resources.
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And that is part of the problem it can take an age, because the story has to be verified by someone on the ground where the person has come from.
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And that is part of the problem it can take an age, because the story has to be verified by someone on the ground where the person has come from.
I absolutely agree Sydney.
Hence my first point about the importance of putting more resources into the system to process claims quicker.
The more people employed doing this, the quicker the claims can be processed.
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And fixing the ''problem'' becomes far more expensive than the problem
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And fixing the ''problem'' becomes far more expensive than the problem
We're a wealthy country though and have a moral duty to process these claims as quickly as possible rather than keeping genuine refugees in an insecure, unsure limbo for months on end. No?
This increase in funding would only need to be temporary whilst the backlog is dealt with - my other 5 points are about stopping the issue at source.
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And the ''problem'' never goes away because it's always a shadow, a threat to decent politics, whenever an election looms it rises out of the sewers as a threat by the right wing that the left are going soft on refugees.
The far right will always use division and the the right will feel forced to adopt parts of to save drift of their votes.
This has been raging for 5 or so years and has only recently been sorted, poor people being whipped up as the enemy.
''What we've learnt from nine weeks of Robodebt royal commission hearings''
https://www.abc.net.au/news/2023-03-11/robodebt-scheme-government-royal-commission-fraud/102074840
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So what do you suggest Syd, to sort out the delays.
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Yvette Cooper saying the right thing for a future Labour Govt.
Ms Cooper said that a Labour government would set itself the target of stopping all small boat crossings.
She said: “That has to be our objective to stop all of the boat crossings and prevent the boat crossings because they’re putting lives at risk and because they undermine border security.
https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=&ved=2ahUKEwjOpLP6nt79AhWGZ8AKHbJYAi8QFnoECAsQAQ&url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.telegraph.co.uk%2Fpolitics%2F2023%2F03%2F10%2Fyvette-cooper-labour-government-will-aim-stop-small-boat-crossings%2F&usg=AOvVaw1S0gc635uRffn2h9-vNz_O
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But Yvette Cooper wont need to stop the small boat crossings as Sunak will have already stopped them by then wont he? Or is he lying to the country when he says he will?
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I didn’t think Sunak said he would stop the boats coming.
I’m sure he said that if people come here illegally he would ensure they would not be able to stay.
Good luck to anyone who says they can stop the boats coming over.
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The question here is what constitutes "illegal". As I understand it , it is not illegal to enter by a small boat and claim asylum even without any papers, it becomes illegal if your claim is rejected.
How many have had their claim processed and turned down and removed to a "safe" country?
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The question here is what constitutes "illegal". As I understand it , it is not illegal to enter by a small boat and claim asylum even without any papers, it becomes illegal if your claim is rejected.
How many have had their claim processed and turned down and removed to a "safe" country?
And then it is only illegal if you stay in the country against an order to be deported.
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The question here is what constitutes "illegal". As I understand it , it is not illegal to enter by a small boat and claim asylum even without any papers, it becomes illegal if your claim is rejected.
How many have had their claim processed and turned down and removed to a "safe" country?
I guess it's illegal if you enter the country and then don't report your entry to anyone.
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Agreed, but are they the small boats contingents? I think not, how many land without being escorted in?
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Agreed, but are they the small boats contingents? I think not, how many land without being escorted in?
98% of those that come here claim asylum, was the governments figures.
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So you are talking about 2%
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The question here is what constitutes "illegal". As I understand it , it is not illegal to enter by a small boat and claim asylum even without any papers, it becomes illegal if your claim is rejected.
How many have had their claim processed and turned down and removed to a "safe" country?
It's going to become illegal to arrive that way once this Bill is approved.
At that point, if you arrive in a boat, even if you are a genuibe asylum seeker (as was the case in 62% of processed applications from those who arrived in boats last year) you will be deemed to have committed a criminal act and will be deported.
And other than a few specific situations, there will then be no way for any genuine asylum seeker to arrive legally I'm Britain and claim sanctuary.
That is the morally disgusting aspect of this Bill.
It's designed not to solve the problem.
It's designed to be legally unworkable and smashed by lawyers, the UN and the ECHR.
That's what Braverman wants.
To be able to say "Look I've tried to sort this out, but the pinko, woke blob are stopping me delivering the Will of the People."
It's all about making angry people more angry.
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BST do you honestly believe that this obnoxious Bill will become law before the next GE? I don't. The Govt are sowing seeds to germinate just before or after the next GE ready for the next Govt, whichever Party, to deal with
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RR.
I think Braverman would be delighted if the Bill gets delayed. That's precisely what she wants. To keep angry people angry, and position herself on their side. She's a reprehensible person.
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If that is her plan it obviously is working already.
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Under section 40 of the Nationality and Borders Act 2022 (NABA), it is difficult for a person to arrive in the UK without a visa.
As there is no such thing as an ‘asylum visa’, this law will apply to almost all asylum seekers entering the UK. From 28 July 2022 onwards, anybody who enters the UK (without a visa) and claims asylum will be going against this law. This offence carries a maximum sentence of 4 years (5 years for people who re-enter the UK in breach of a deportation order).
However, it is important to remember that it would not be practical for the Government to prosecute (this means to bring criminal proceedings against) everybody who enters the UK without a visa, because this would put a lot of pressure on the courts and prison systems.
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NR
Virtually no-one is getting into the UK by commercial plane or ferry without a visa, because the carriers won't let them onboard.
Pretty much by definition, genuine asylum seekers will not be in a position to get a visa issued in their home country to allow them to travel to Britain legally and then claim asylum.
There is no mechanism for applying for asylum BEFORE coming to Britain from the vast majority of countries in the world.
Genuine asylum seekers who arrived by "illegal" boat will, once this Bill is passed, be considered to have broken the law and will not be allowed to claim asylum.
Tell me. What is the mechanism whereby a genuine asylum seeker can claim asylum in the UK once this Bill goes through?
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The illegality is what will be challenged in the courts which is one of the main reasons this Bill won't come into Law in the next couple of years. The leftie lawyers will see to that which gives the current Govt, if not re elected, the opportunity to say at leadt we tried
If Labour come to power they will dispense with it.
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NR
Virtually no-one is getting into the UK by commercial plane or ferry without a visa, because the carriers won't let them onboard.
Pretty much by definition, genuine asylum seekers will not be in a position to get a visa issued in their home country to allow them to travel to Britain legally and then claim asylum.
There is no mechanism for applying for asylum BEFORE coming to Britain from the vast majority of countries in the world.
Genuine asylum seekers who arrived by "illegal" boat will, once this Bill is passed, be considered to have broken the law and will not be allowed to claim asylum.
Tell me. What is the mechanism whereby a genuine asylum seeker can claim asylum in the UK once this Bill goes through?
There is no mechanism currently. Let alone when/if this bill goes through.
My take on it is this.
The govt has to put their foot on the ball. Apply a very big brake. Take control. And then after that, then and only then can we accept controlled migration. Perhaps with a reception centre on the French side. We already have our Border control at the Cinque Ports and the tunnel. Maybe there is scope for this to be expanded.
If the uk govt went completely the other way and just put word out that cross channel ferries were a free for all for anyone wanting to come to the uk, then where would we be? I'm genuinely open to everyones thoughts on this. If we totally threw the rule book out and opened our doors to all, anytime, no borders, then where would this end up?
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NR.
You're repeatedly posing a false dichotomy.
There's a lot of space between allow everyone in and allow no-one in. Braverman doesn't want that debate and you are falling right into her trap.
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NR.
You're repeatedly posing a false dichotomy.
There's a lot of space between allow everyone in and allow no-one in. Braverman doesn't want that debate and you are falling right into her trap.
I’m all ears. You propose no solution. ?
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NR.
You're repeatedly posing a false dichotomy.
There's a lot of space between allow everyone in and allow no-one in. Braverman doesn't want that debate and you are falling right into her trap.
I’m all ears. You propose no solution. ?
It generally works along the lines of anybody proposing tougher measures is racist and the debate shut down .
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Truth is if Labour had proposed similar measures to Braverman it would have been far more accepted by Labour voters, and no doubt Billy & co would have defended it.
It's all entirely political.
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NR.
You're repeatedly posing a false dichotomy.
There's a lot of space between allow everyone in and allow no-one in. Braverman doesn't want that debate and you are falling right into her trap.
I’m all ears. You propose no solution. ?
You've clearly not been reading what I've written then because I've said this several times.
You start by having an asylum processing system that is fit for purpose. The HO has been dysfunctional for years because this Govt doesn't want a solution. It wants angry people to keep on feeling angry.
There is currently a backlog of over 100,000 asylum claims. Last year, 40,000 people arrived on boats and claimed asylum. 314 cases were processed.
THAT is the core of the problem. If we had a system that worked to process these cases, we could then deport the bogus claimants while still upholding our legal and moral obligations to genuine claimants.
We could also offer a chance for asylum seeker to apply before they arrive. But this Govt has chosen not to offer that other than from a few select countries.
Do that effectively and the attraction of boat passage vanishes.
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Truth is if Labour had proposed similar measures to Braverman it would have been far more accepted by Labour voters, and no doubt Billy & co would have defended it.
It's all entirely political.
It is not acceptable as a proposal, by any Party
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You're wasting your time RR.
BB is obsessed with the idea that everyone is as incapable of dealing with arguments on their merits as he is.
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Na BST, I'm obsessed with the truth, that's all.
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Strange that all you ever do is refuse to engage in discussion and just try to wind people up then BB.
I'm sure you get something out of it, but I don't envy you.
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Truth is if Labour had proposed similar measures to Braverman it would have been far more accepted by Labour voters, and no doubt Billy & co would have defended it.
It's all entirely political.
What are you on about?
I would hope any other party would think logically and decide the first way to solve boat issue is to address the issue where you can only claim asylum in the UK by getting to the UK.
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Strange that all you ever do is refuse to engage in discussion and just try to wind people up then BB.
I'm sure you get something out of it, but I don't envy you.
BST. I seem to only wind those people up whose cap fits. It is they who chose to be wound up. It is they who admit to their culpability simply by responding to it objectionably. They even sometimes use foul language and make false accusations, for which they refuse to apologise.
By the way, if I had an answer to the problem of immigration without being called a racist, I would tell you it.
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BB.
You're normally water off a duck's back to me. But I'll admit, you got under my skin when I was explaining about the mental health issue my son has, and you continued to niggle and wind up.
Did I say "got under my skin?" My apologies. What I meant was, you finally, after all these years, made me realise what a deeply nasty, twisted individual you are. I hope you get something out of acting like that but I cannot for the life of me figure what that might be.
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BST, you're entitled to your opinion, and as head of this forum, you are allowed to say it in any way you like and with no consequence.
Of course, after all these years I don't expect you to be right all of a sudden. If the truth were known, and you were willing to accept it for once, you'd discover that I'm a really nice, kind, generous, compassionate and loyal bloke. I do have faults, like everyone else, of course. One of the major ones is an intolerance to self-righteous bullshitters who spend their time preaching God-like perfection on fourth-division off-topic football forums.
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You just can't stop it can you?
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NR.
You're repeatedly posing a false dichotomy.
There's a lot of space between allow everyone in and allow no-one in. Braverman doesn't want that debate and you are falling right into her trap.
I’m all ears. You propose no solution. ?
You've clearly not been reading what I've written then because I've said this several times.
You start by having an asylum processing system that is fit for purpose. The HO has been dysfunctional for years because this Govt doesn't want a solution. It wants angry people to keep on feeling angry.
There is currently a backlog of over 100,000 asylum claims. Last year, 40,000 people arrived on boats and claimed asylum. 314 cases were processed.
THAT is the core of the problem. If we had a system that worked to process these cases, we could then deport the bogus claimants while still upholding our legal and moral obligations to genuine claimants.
We could also offer a chance for asylum seeker to apply before they arrive. But this Govt has chosen not to offer that other than from a few select countries.
Do that effectively and the attraction of boat passage vanishes.
[/quot
Isn’t it a lot more complex than that? Easy to blame the govt. For every asylum claim that the HO rejects. There will be a counter claim by some human rights lawyer getting paid for by us as they get free and independent legal advice . And so it goes on. The legal aid bill for asylum counter claims must run into tens of millions alone .
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So the first immigrant hss landed in Rwanda, hope they keep her
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By the way! Just be careful as to which charity you donate money to, you may well be funding some of the flotilla of 'Rescue' ships currently saving illegal immigrants from Rubber dinghies, they then don't take em back from whence they came to take them to to a European Port having already coached them in how to claim refugee status, or it could go to the Charities operating in North France coaching encouraging and assisting would be asylum seekers.
You might be happy with that, I prefer y donations to go to needy Persons in the U.K. And there are plenty in need!
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Which charities do you donate to Sproty? So we can all help like.
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NR.
You're repeatedly posing a false dichotomy.
There's a lot of space between allow everyone in and allow no-one in. Braverman doesn't want that debate and you are falling right into her trap.
I’m all ears. You propose no solution. ?
You've clearly not been reading what I've written then because I've said this several times.
You start by having an asylum processing system that is fit for purpose. The HO has been dysfunctional for years because this Govt doesn't want a solution. It wants angry people to keep on feeling angry.
There is currently a backlog of over 100,000 asylum claims. Last year, 40,000 people arrived on boats and claimed asylum. 314 cases were processed.
THAT is the core of the problem. If we had a system that worked to process these cases, we could then deport the bogus claimants while still upholding our legal and moral obligations to genuine claimants.
We could also offer a chance for asylum seeker to apply before they arrive. But this Govt has chosen not to offer that other than from a few select countries.
Do that effectively and the attraction of boat passage vanishes.
[/quot
Isn’t it a lot more complex than that? Easy to blame the govt. For every asylum claim that the HO rejects. There will be a counter claim by some human rights lawyer getting paid for by us as they get free and independent legal advice . And so it goes on. The legal aid bill for asylum counter claims must run into tens of millions alone .
NR ''Because if Labour came out with a policy of shipping these people straight back to say Albania within weeks of them arriving illegally then they would get my vote''
Instead of sidling up to the former home secretary and claiming 'inside knowledge' shouldn't you be writing to the current government asking for a humane solution?
Labour are not in power ffs
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I see Sunak has been reproached by the UK Statistics Authority for lying in Parliament last week. He claimed that the Tories had the backlog in asylum claims cases down to lower that it was under the last Labour Government.
The fact is they have gone up since 2010 by 1400%.
I expect Sunak will correct the record in Parliament next week.
Aye, well. Maybe not, eh?
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Which charities do you donate to Sproty? So we can all help like.
That’s very good of you Wilts, Zarach is a charity in Leeds that Donates Bed bundles to impoverished kids so they can sleep in a real bed rather than a Sack on the kitchen Floor, (it’s not just the Poem called Timothy Winters it’s real)Parkinson’s Uk and Cancer research Uk.
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Which charities do you donate to Sproty? So we can all help like.
That’s very good of you Wilts, Zarach is a charity in Leeds that Donates Bed bundles to impoverished kids so they can sleep in a real bed rather than a Sack on the kitchen Floor, (it’s not just the Poem called Timothy Winters it’s real)Parkinson’s Uk and Cancer research Uk.
Thanks Sproty. Never heard of Zarach before but that's real good work they do there. The next charity event I do I will donate to them.
I always think it's best & more productive to promote things you like rather than moan about stuff you dont.
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''Britain, be warned: with ‘stop the boats’ policies you brutalise migrants – and damage yourselves''
''This hostile approach to asylum helped the Australian right win elections, but it created divisions that still scar us as a nation''
https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2023/mar/27/britain-be-warned-with-stop-the-boats-policies-you-brutalise-migrants-and-damage-yourselves
This could be what you're in for.
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NR.
You're repeatedly posing a false dichotomy.
There's a lot of space between allow everyone in and allow no-one in. Braverman doesn't want that debate and you are falling right into her trap.
I’m all ears. You propose no solution. ?
You've clearly not been reading what I've written then because I've said this several times.
You start by having an asylum processing system that is fit for purpose. The HO has been dysfunctional for years because this Govt doesn't want a solution. It wants angry people to keep on feeling angry.
There is currently a backlog of over 100,000 asylum claims. Last year, 40,000 people arrived on boats and claimed asylum. 314 cases were processed.
THAT is the core of the problem. If we had a system that worked to process these cases, we could then deport the bogus claimants while still upholding our legal and moral obligations to genuine claimants.
We could also offer a chance for asylum seeker to apply before they arrive. But this Govt has chosen not to offer that other than from a few select countries.
Do that effectively and the attraction of boat passage vanishes.
[/quot
Isn’t it a lot more complex than that? Easy to blame the govt. For every asylum claim that the HO rejects. There will be a counter claim by some human rights lawyer getting paid for by us as they get free and independent legal advice . And so it goes on. The legal aid bill for asylum counter claims must run into tens of millions alone .
NR ''Because if Labour came out with a policy of shipping these people straight back to say Albania within weeks of them arriving illegally then they would get my vote''
Instead of sidling up to the former home secretary and claiming 'inside knowledge' shouldn't you be writing to the current government asking for a humane solution?
Labour are not in power ffs
Once again sr you fail to recognise context. Any fool knows Labour aren’t in power yet, but it’s looking likely. And they would get my vote if this was in their policy.
As an aside, it looks like the govt has a plan to house boat migrants, on, you guessed it, boats (old ferries).
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With all the shit going in and has gone on in the uk you choose to separate out a single aspect of policy of any government now and in the future and promise them your vote on that basis that they may be able to deliver ''stop the boats''
This is exactly where the tory party want to be, they want to make the next election about as few issues as possible with the above and 'law and order' positions they have manufactured themselves. It is these issues that they are driving, to persuade voters to hate those on welfare with the ''something for nothing'' mantra and foreigners with the ''stop the boats'' shit, more fool you if you accept it.
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With all the shit going in and has gone on in the uk you choose to separate out a single aspect of policy of any government now and in the future and promise them your vote on that basis that they may be able to deliver ''stop the boats''
This is exactly where the tory party want to be, they want to make the next election about as few issues as possible with the above and 'law and order' positions they have manufactured themselves. It is these issues that they are driving, to persuade voters to hate those on welfare with the ''something for nothing'' mantra and foreigners with the ''stop the boats'' shit, more fool you if you accept it.
Peoples priorities are different. Go to the local parish council meeting and it’s dog shit and parking, local council it’s all about flytipping and car parking, and at national level it’s a myriad of things. Many things to many people. It’s called diversity.
I foresee immigration being an important issue in the lead up the the 2024 GE.
I’d be interested in your opinion on Ted Heaths Immigration Act of 1971. The foundations for which were laid by Harold Wilson before him. Which has been described as “explicitly racist.” His Labour Govt feared an influx of 200000 Asian migrants from Africa. The bill was passed in just three days to prevent this.
Or Blair’s late nineties Immigration and Asylum Acts? Under which he had built three detention centres. Humane you say?
Throw shame all you like on the current govt policy on immigration.
Labour already has a shameful record on the matter by your standards.
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This is about here and now nr, the next election, if you want to talk about council issues then maybe you should look at why the tories starved councils of funds.
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Funny.
It’s ok then that Labour had shitty standards in the past.
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And the good old Guardian newspaper. Quoted by many of the Leftwaffe on here, now found to have built its foundation on the slave trade. Who would have thought it? But it’s in the past , so that doesn’t matter does it ?
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So from a thread about refugees that you started you are banging on about dogshit, councils and now the guardian, is this because you can't put together a coherent debate nr?
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You ignore history at your convenience .
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We're in the process of closing down Scampton - not sure it would be habitable for immigrants yet....... although military boys have been using it in dribs and drabs for ages...
I understand that they are considering adding several accommodation containers (ISO's) onto the runway to provide bunks for the incoming guests...
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History has a funny way of turning things around aye nr?
''King Charles signals first explicit support for research into monarchy’s slavery ties''
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I dont think that Charles should be held responsible for stuff that happened decades ago.
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History has a funny way of turning things around aye nr?
''King Charles signals first explicit support for research into monarchy’s slavery ties''
Edward the First stole the Duchy of Cornwall from its rightful Heir, is Charles going to give it up?
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Strange aye, almost everyone knew ...........
''Home Office admits no evidence to support key claim on small boat crossings
Exclusive: UK Government concedes it cannot substantiate assertion that majority crossing Channel are economic migrants''
https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2023/apr/08/home-office-admits-no-evidence-to-support-key-claim-on-small-boat-crossings
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Strange aye, almost everyone knew ...........
''Home Office admits no evidence to support key claim on small boat crossings
Exclusive: UK Government concedes it cannot substantiate assertion that majority crossing Channel are economic migrants''
https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2023/apr/08/home-office-admits-no-evidence-to-support-key-claim-on-small-boat-crossings
So, the Government lied yet again. What a surprise - not. Problem is, so many people fall for it!
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Strange aye, almost everyone knew ...........
''Home Office admits no evidence to support key claim on small boat crossings
Exclusive: UK Government concedes it cannot substantiate assertion that majority crossing Channel are economic migrants''
https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2023/apr/08/home-office-admits-no-evidence-to-support-key-claim-on-small-boat-crossings
So, the Government lied yet again. What a surprise - not. Problem is, so many people fall for it!
So to sumize the Link! Some lazy journo has submitted a freedom of information request to Whitehall and it has been answered by a Labour voting Junior Clerk! And that is Evidence in your eyes
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Or you could just read the UN agreement on human rights regarding refugees that the UK has signed which I have posted before or read the stats that many have posted up.
found any aliens yet?
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1056 non economic migrants crossed last week. That’s a weekly record for this year. Going to need some more barges .
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1056 non economic migrants crossed last week. That’s a weekly record for this year. Going to need some more barges .
And we still have the summer months to look forward to.... :thumbsup:
It baffles me that we have no ability to stop or at least reduce this.... all the technology at our disposal and we are still bobbing about in boats in the Channel
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1056 non economic migrants crossed last week. That’s a weekly record for this year. Going to need some more barges .
And we still have the summer months to look forward to.... :thumbsup:
It baffles me that we have no ability to stop or at least reduce this.... all the technology at our disposal and we are still bobbing about in boats in the Channel
politics aside. we have a navy that is, at best, redundant, and an army that are not really committed like they were during recent conflicts like falklands, iraq, bosnia, afghan. Then there is the raf who probably have shinier bottoms than usual. together, with surveillance and patrolling, this could be stopped, overnight.
but the govt of the day choose to allow/ignore it. for reason better known to themselves. And pay the french huge sums - to ignore it also.
some think this is to make angry people angrier.
im not angry about it. i just dont get it. at all
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1056 non economic migrants crossed last week. That’s a weekly record for this year. Going to need some more barges .
And we still have the summer months to look forward to.... :thumbsup:
It baffles me that we have no ability to stop or at least reduce this.... all the technology at our disposal and we are still bobbing about in boats in the Channel
politics aside. we have a navy that is, at best, redundant, and an army that are not really committed like they were during recent conflicts like falklands, iraq, bosnia, afghan. Then there is the raf who probably have shinier bottoms than usual. together, with surveillance and patrolling, this could be stopped, overnight.
How? It would be against international law to intercept them in French waters, and it would be against international law to return them to French waters once they were in ours. Of course, had we still been in the EU then we could have returned them to France as per EU rules. Another wonderful benefit of Brexit!
but the govt of the day choose to allow/ignore it. for reason better known to themselves. And pay the french huge sums - to ignore it also.
some think this is to make angry people angrier.
im not angry about it. i just dont get it. at all
Really? See below.
The government choose to allow it because it makes the news, makes people angry and takes their minds off the real problems in this country; problems that this government is incapable of fixing.
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He got headlines for saying he will stoo the small boats but I see Sunaks backtracking on that is hidden on page 2, the one no one reads, in the Mail which sensible people don't read
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He got headlines for saying he will stoo the small boats but I see Sunaks backtracking on that is hidden on page 2, the one no one reads, in the Mail which sensible people don't read
Yvette Cooper has also said a labour govt would stop the boats.
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1056 non economic migrants crossed last week. That’s a weekly record for this year. Going to need some more barges .
And we still have the summer months to look forward to.... :thumbsup:
It baffles me that we have no ability to stop or at least reduce this.... all the technology at our disposal and we are still bobbing about in boats in the Channel
politics aside. we have a navy that is, at best, redundant, and an army that are not really committed like they were during recent conflicts like falklands, iraq, bosnia, afghan. Then there is the raf who probably have shinier bottoms than usual. together, with surveillance and patrolling, this could be stopped, overnight.
How? It would be against international law to intercept them in French waters, and it would be against international law to return them to French waters once they were in ours. Of course, had we still been in the EU then we could have returned them to France as per EU rules. Another wonderful benefit of Brexit!
but the govt of the day choose to allow/ignore it. for reason better known to themselves. And pay the french huge sums - to ignore it also.
some think this is to make angry people angrier.
im not angry about it. i just dont get it. at all
Really? See below.
The government choose to allow it because it makes the news, makes people angry and takes their minds off the real problems in this country; problems that this government is incapable of fixing.
Australia managed to turn back boats. And still do. I don’t see the international courts chasing them.
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He got headlines for saying he will stoo the small boats but I see Sunaks backtracking on that is hidden on page 2, the one no one reads, in the Mail which sensible people don't read
Yvette Cooper has also said a labour govt would stop the boats.
Did she get front page headlines for saying it NR?
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He got headlines for saying he will stoo the small boats but I see Sunaks backtracking on that is hidden on page 2, the one no one reads, in the Mail which sensible people don't read
Yvette Cooper has also said a labour govt would stop the boats.
Did she get front page headlines for saying it NR?
What she didn’t say was that they would let em in on the Ferries!
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This years highest figure recorded......
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-kent-65878554
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Nice calm seas, warm weather. They’ll be crossing in pedalo’s.
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I can't understand why they would want to come to such a badly run, unfair country that only looks after the rich.
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It’s the cheapest way they can get to sunny Rwanda.
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Crossing the English Channel, one of the busiest shipping lanes in the world, on poorly maintained small boats and dinghies is dangerous enough.
But these people have been smuggled much further distances by criminals at even greater danger.
This story is beyond horrific www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-65925558
When will the international community come together to put a stop to this abhorrent, dangerous and cruel trade?
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Crossing the English Channel, one of the busiest shipping lanes in the world, on poorly maintained small boats and dinghies is dangerous enough.
But these people have been smuggled much further distances by criminals at even greater danger.
This story is beyond horrific www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-65925558
When will the international community come together to put a stop to this abhorrent, dangerous and cruel trade?
What’s the answer for stopping the people smugglers?
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Let people come on the ferry, like you and me do.
Then process their applications promptly once they are safe, to decide if they have a legitimate claim.
It really is very easy, if we want to take out the smugglers, and manage the inflow, rather than stoking headlines in the gutter press for political advantage.
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Crossing the English Channel, one of the busiest shipping lanes in the world, on poorly maintained small boats and dinghies is dangerous enough.
But these people have been smuggled much further distances by criminals at even greater danger.
This story is beyond horrific www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-65925558
When will the international community come together to put a stop to this abhorrent, dangerous and cruel trade?
What’s the answer for stopping the people smugglers?
3 suggestions
1) Pursuing International policing co-operation going for the criminal gangs. A couple of years ago after migrants died crossing the Channel it was amazingly enlightening how quickly, with international co-operation, the criminal gang responsible were brought to justice.
2) Set up refugee processing centres as close to the borders of the countries most refugees come from as possible. Save the refugees therefore the need of travelling dangerously 100s of miles using criminal gangs and give the most vulnerable and needing of our protection more chance of applying.
3) In said centres take photos and fingerprints of all applicants. Those whose applications fail should be told clearly that if they at a later date are caught entering Europe that their failed application will still be valid and they will be immediately deported. Hence again preventing unnecessary fraught journeys to Europe using criminals.
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Crossing the English Channel, one of the busiest shipping lanes in the world, on poorly maintained small boats and dinghies is dangerous enough.
But these people have been smuggled much further distances by criminals at even greater danger.
This story is beyond horrific www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-65925558
When will the international community come together to put a stop to this abhorrent, dangerous and cruel trade?
What’s the answer for stopping the people smugglers?
3 suggestions
1) Pursuing International policing co-operation going for the criminal gangs. A couple of years ago after migrants died crossing the Channel it was amazingly enlightening how quickly, with international co-operation, the criminal gang responsible were brought to justice.
2) Set up refugee processing centres as close to the borders of the countries most refugees come from as possible. Save the refugees therefore the need of travelling dangerously 100s of miles using criminal gangs and give the most vulnerable and needing of our protection more chance of applying.
3) In said centres take photos and fingerprints of all applicants. Those whose applications fail should be told clearly that if they at a later date are caught entering Europe that their failed application will still be valid and they will be immediately deported. Hence again preventing unnecessary fraught journeys to Europe using criminals.
Really?
Run that one by the people crossing the channel in inflatables.
It’s political jargon. When you have ANY possibility of bringing your children from poverty or a war zone, as a parent I’d do it…you’d do it.
I voted Brexit to ‘protect our borders’ having finished my career as a Customs Officer & seeing those borders abused & crossed by so many ‘young men’ who because of the government’s inadequate ‘holding places’ & non-existent monitoring of such men ended up with them ultimately being ‘lost in the system’ & free to wander the country.
I was duped along with the other 17,000 who voted to leave the EU for similar purposes.
During WW11 being an island was our saving grace.
Fast forward half a generation & that island has become a beacon for an unarmed invasion we have no idea how to deal with.
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Another record for Sunak. Last month was the highest total for June since records began:
https://twitter.com/alexwickham/status/1675906177551544322
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Graeme Souness at it now!
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That is funny CC3.
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Gotta lighten the load sometimes hound…..no irreverence intended.
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Let people come on the ferry, like you and me do.
Then process their applications promptly once they are safe, to decide if they have a legitimate claim.
It really is very easy, if we want to take out the smugglers, and manage the inflow, rather than stoking headlines in the gutter press for political advantage.
33 yr old asylum seeker staying at the tax payer funded County Hotel in Skegness has recently been charged with rape of a local woman . He had been in the uk just 40 days. He arrived on a boat.
How would you feel if this victim was your aunt, or mum, or sister?
Bbc news won’t show this though will they?
Yeah, let them come on the ferry. In fact, let’s send some planes direct to Iraq to pick them up. Ffs.
Next time you go to Skegness. Take a walk around Tower Gardens. That bit just off Grand Parade where families gather. This is where this beast dragged his victim into the bushes before attacking her..
But it’s ok, because he was “safe” in the uk and I’m sure the authorities thought his claim was legitimate too.
https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=&ved=2ahUKEwicn9etsPj_AhUZTkEAHVJYD3cQFnoECBAQAQ&url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.dailymail.co.uk%2Fnews%2Farticle-12251981%2FTensions-grow-Skegness-migrant-charged-raping-woman-park.html&usg=AOvVaw0MkAgm8lNI2Y8FD8FODMIN&opi=89978449
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The Metropolitan Police are reviewing 1691 cases of alleged sexual assualt by 1061 of it's officers.
How would you feel if one of these 1000's of victims was your aunt, mum or sister?
But you wont find this on right wing twitter.
And your aunt, mum or sister is more likely to encounter a dodgy copper than they are an asylum seeker.
https://metro.co.uk/2023/01/17/1000-met-police-officers-investigated-over-sexual-and-abuse-claims-18112806/
Lock up all criminals. It's irrelevant who they are or where they came from. Unless of course you have a particular thing about race?
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Deviant cops/ doctors/ nurses/ judges/ bbc presenters exist within our society whether we like it or not. The vast majority are British “ citizens” and I use that term in the loosest sense.
The Skegness rape was totally preventable.
The beast should have never been here.
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Simple solution, we don’t grant asylum to anyone. Who really cares what our reputation is
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The Metropolitan Police are reviewing 1691 cases of alleged sexual assualt by 1061 of it's officers.
How would you feel if one of these 1000's of victims was your aunt, mum or sister?
But you wont find this on right wing twitter.
And your aunt, mum or sister is more likely to encounter a dodgy copper than they are an asylum seeker.
https://metro.co.uk/2023/01/17/1000-met-police-officers-investigated-over-sexual-and-abuse-claims-18112806/
Lock up all criminals. It's irrelevant who they are or where they came from. Unless of course you have a particular thing about race?
So they are reviewing 1600 old cases they decided did not warrant fit action to see if each one was dealt with correctly , so you really see 1,000 Police officers get charged? I would wait until the cases are reviewed before likening members of our Police Force to illegal immigrants
I think you should keep your flippant comments to yourself, Our Police Force recruits are heavily vetted, they are now re vetted every 12 months and also vetted if they apply to move into another department ie Traffic from the Beat! Your remarks are simply childish.we Don’t recruit Police officers from Russian Gaols we recruit them from our own society!
A typical hysterical knee jerk mis informative quote from Wilts Rover!
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The Metropolitan Police are reviewing 1691 cases of alleged sexual assualt by 1061 of it's officers.
How would you feel if one of these 1000's of victims was your aunt, mum or sister?
But you wont find this on right wing twitter.
And your aunt, mum or sister is more likely to encounter a dodgy copper than they are an asylum seeker.
https://metro.co.uk/2023/01/17/1000-met-police-officers-investigated-over-sexual-and-abuse-claims-18112806/
Lock up all criminals. It's irrelevant who they are or where they came from. Unless of course you have a particular thing about race?
So they are reviewing 1600 old cases they decided did not warrant fit action to see if each one was dealt with correctly , so you really see 1,000 Police officers get charged? I would wait until the cases are reviewed before likening members of our Police Force to illegal immigrants
I think you should keep your flippant comments to yourself, Our Police Force recruits are heavily vetted, they are now re vetted every 12 months and also vetted if they apply to move into another department ie Traffic from the Beat! Your remarks are simply childish.we Don’t recruit Police officers from Russian Gaols we recruit them from our own society!
FFS! A rapist is a rapist regardless of their background!
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The Metropolitan Police are reviewing 1691 cases of alleged sexual assualt by 1061 of it's officers.
How would you feel if one of these 1000's of victims was your aunt, mum or sister?
But you wont find this on right wing twitter.
And your aunt, mum or sister is more likely to encounter a dodgy copper than they are an asylum seeker.
https://metro.co.uk/2023/01/17/1000-met-police-officers-investigated-over-sexual-and-abuse-claims-18112806/
Lock up all criminals. It's irrelevant who they are or where they came from. Unless of course you have a particular thing about race?
So they are reviewing 1600 old cases they decided did not warrant fit action to see if each one was dealt with correctly , so you really see 1,000 Police officers get charged? I would wait until the cases are reviewed before likening members of our Police Force to illegal immigrants
I think you should keep your flippant comments to yourself, Our Police Force recruits are heavily vetted, they are now re vetted every 12 months and also vetted if they apply to move into another department ie Traffic from the Beat! Your remarks are simply childish.we Don’t recruit Police officers from Russian Gaols we recruit them from our own society!
FFS! A rapist is a rapist regardless of their background!
Well, unless they are wrongly convicted like Makinson.
Last week people would have said he is a rapist but this week he isn’t.
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How very pedantic.
For years justice has been sought in that particular case.
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Simple solution, we don’t grant asylum to anyone. Who really cares what our reputation is
Would you have been on the side of those, led by the Daily Mail, who would have closed our borders to Jews fleeing Germany in the 1930s?
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Simple solution, we don’t grant asylum to anyone. Who really cares what our reputation is
Would you have been on the side of those, led by the Daily Mail, who would have closed our borders to Jews fleeing Germany in the 1930s?
Probably.
Apologies Ldr,I thought after reading that quote it was from one of the regular racists on here.
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Simple solution, we don’t grant asylum to anyone. Who really cares what our reputation is
Would you have been on the side of those, led by the Daily Mail, who would have closed our borders to Jews fleeing Germany in the 1930s?
Probably.
Apologies Ldr,I thought after reading that quote it was from one of the regular racists on here.
Who are the regular racists on here Iberian?
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The Metropolitan Police are reviewing 1691 cases of alleged sexual assualt by 1061 of it's officers.
How would you feel if one of these 1000's of victims was your aunt, mum or sister?
But you wont find this on right wing twitter.
And your aunt, mum or sister is more likely to encounter a dodgy copper than they are an asylum seeker.
https://metro.co.uk/2023/01/17/1000-met-police-officers-investigated-over-sexual-and-abuse-claims-18112806/
Lock up all criminals. It's irrelevant who they are or where they came from. Unless of course you have a particular thing about race?
So they are reviewing 1600 old cases they decided did not warrant fit action to see if each one was dealt with correctly , so you really see 1,000 Police officers get charged? I would wait until the cases are reviewed before likening members of our Police Force to illegal immigrants
I think you should keep your flippant comments to yourself, Our Police Force recruits are heavily vetted, they are now re vetted every 12 months and also vetted if they apply to move into another department ie Traffic from the Beat! Your remarks are simply childish.we Don’t recruit Police officers from Russian Gaols we recruit them from our own society!
FFS! A rapist is a rapist regardless of their background!
Do you really, really believe that there are 1691 alleged rapes committed by Met Police officers being re investigated ???
https://www.google.co.uk/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=&ved=2ahUKEwjI546sq7KAAxW6UkEAHURfBj4QFnoECA4QAQ&url=https%3A%2F%2Fnews.sky.com%2Fstory%2Fmet-police-reviewing-over-1-600-cases-of-alleged-sexual-offences-and-domestic-abuse-involving-its-staff-12788452&usg=AOvVaw2p0f_uZHVXmnPjb7A3OaNO&opi=89978449
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How very pedantic.
For years justice has been sought in that particular case.
There will be plenty of others in jail pleading their innocence too.
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How very pedantic.
For years justice has been sought in that particular case.
There will be plenty of others in jail pleading their innocence too.
I reviewed every South Yorkshire sentenced offender arriving at a Prison in Doncaster between 2014 and 2016, something like 95% had not committed the crime they were convicted of, most had no replied throughout their tape recorded interview and most were convicted on Forensic evidence alone, Blood on themselves or the victim, blood inside the house they hadn’t burgled etc.
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How very pedantic.
For years justice has been sought in that particular case.
There will be plenty of others in jail pleading their innocence too.
I reviewed every South Yorkshire sentenced offender arriving at a Prison in Doncaster between 2014 and 2016, something like 95% had not committed the crime they were convicted of, most had no replied throughout their tape recorded interview and most were convicted on Forensic evidence alone, Blood on themselves or the victim, blood inside the house they hadn’t burgled etc.
Yes sproty, interesting that.
I have several friends who are prison officers at Moorlands and they tell me that loads of inmates claim they were wrongly convicted.
How true their claims are, well who knows.
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How very pedantic.
For years justice has been sought in that particular case.
There will be plenty of others in jail pleading their innocence too.
I reviewed every South Yorkshire sentenced offender arriving at a Prison in Doncaster between 2014 and 2016, something like 95% had not committed the crime they were convicted of, most had no replied throughout their tape recorded interview and most were convicted on Forensic evidence alone, Blood on themselves or the victim, blood inside the house they hadn’t burgled etc.
Yes sproty, interesting that.
I have several friends who are prison officers at Moorlands and they tell me that loads of inmates claim they were wrongly convicted.
How true their claims are, well who knows.
Can’t speak for the present but back in 2016 the Sentenced or remanded innocents came from Court with a PER form which did not show any summary of the circumstances of the
Miscaiiof just ther had suffered, one guy came in
Terry x from Lincoln, he told the reception staff that he was perplexed and very upset for getting 14 years for a carrier bag full of Cannabis he was caught with, oh dear poor Terry got the full run of the prison and an orderly job in the Gym so he had contact with all of the inmates, as they all love their gym sessions, can you imagine the opportunities? Any way when Sprotbrough looked into it, he was actually the Kingpin for the whole drug dealing and supply network in Northern England, he had control over the O’Rourkes in Manchester, three Black heroin dealers in Yorkshire, our very own Doncaster top dog xxxx, the Freemans in Northumbria, the deal was that as he was the Big boss he would only handle the Cannabis operation as it was the lowest sentence when caught,
So the NCS had conducted a massive 12 month long operation which included secret follows as they were meeting in Lay-bys like Marr
Anyway the NCS concocted enough evidence to convict them all in our very unjust Court system, the others all got very heavy sentences and Terry got 14 years for his ‘Bit of Canabis’ any he had his cell busted shortly after that and he was moved to a Cat A and activities severely restricted.
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Have i just entered as parallel universe or was this thread originally about Channel crossing Refugees?
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Simple solution, we don’t grant asylum to anyone. Who really cares what our reputation is
Would you have been on the side of those, led by the Daily Mail, who would have closed our borders to Jews fleeing Germany in the 1930s?
Probably.
Apologies Ldr,I thought after reading that quote it was from one of the regular racists on here.
Who are the regular racists on here Iberian?
Iberian, it is interesting that you throw in the grenade that the forum has regular racists but won’t back up your post when asked who they are.
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If it looks like a duck,
and posts like a xenophobe
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Simple solution, we don’t grant asylum to anyone. Who really cares what our reputation is
Would you have been on the side of those, led by the Daily Mail, who would have closed our borders to Jews fleeing Germany in the 1930s?
Probably.
Apologies Ldr,I thought after reading that quote it was from one of the regular racists on here.
Who are the regular racists on here Iberian?
Iberian, it is interesting that you throw in the grenade that the forum has regular racists but won’t back up your post when asked who they are.
Nice try GG.
Keep lobbing them,and eventually you might hit the target.
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Simple solution, we don’t grant asylum to anyone. Who really cares what our reputation is
Would you have been on the side of those, led by the Daily Mail, who would have closed our borders to Jews fleeing Germany in the 1930s?
Probably.
Apologies Ldr,I thought after reading that quote it was from one of the regular racists on here.
Who are the regular racists on here Iberian?
Iberian, it is interesting that you throw in the grenade that the forum has regular racists but won’t back up your post when asked who they are.
Nice try GG.
Keep lobbing them,and eventually you might hit the target.
LoL.
It was you who chucked the last one but very obviously you daren’t back up your accusations.
Sad man.
Stick to defending the leader.
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Who might my leader be?
You're sending like one of those obsessed teens on tik tok I keep reading about.
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I keep saying the Tories have nothing left but Culture War.
Here's how low they are scraping the barrel. A minister openly supporting the words of the reborn NF gobshite Anderson.
https://twitter.com/LBC/status/1688827637152546816
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And by the way, if you don't believe me that the Tories have nothing left, not even competence, this is a Tory supporter absolutely excoriating the party for the same reasons.
https://www.joxleywrites.jmoxley.co.uk/p/the-problem-with-the-conservative-afd
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Tory dirty tricks....
https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2023/aug/08/immigration-lawyer-braverman-smear-campaign-rightwing-press-deported-to-rwanda
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Vote for Labour then!
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I keep saying the Tories have nothing left but Culture War.
Here's how low they are scraping the barrel. A minister openly supporting the words of the reborn NF gobshite Anderson.
https://twitter.com/LBC/status/1688827637152546816
How would you deal with illegal immigration?
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What I do know is that this is a complex issue with nobody able or willing to come up with the solutions that's obviously needed .
What I also know is that this cannot continue .
Personally I see two easy hits , firstly putting the traffickers out of business and secondly looking at our own economy and the number of jobs that aren't filled .
So instead of paying traffickers why don't we offer a 12 month work permit for a reasonable fee , let's say £200 .
That work permit allows you to work and reside here for 12 months however other than the NHS it doesn't entitle you to benefits .
After 12 months and you've not committed any offences you can apply for a 5 year work permit which entitles you to certain benefits but not everything .
A successful 6 years here with no criminality and paying in to the system you automatically qualify for full residency and the same benefits as everyone else .
Whilst this scheme is in operation governments may well want to improve the infrastructure , schools , NHS and housing .
Dependent on economic conditions we need to use this scheme with everything on the table , once jobs dry up , houses sparse , schools full the scheme is then scaled down accordingly .
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Tyke.
Something like that is an obvious solution.
The problem with this lot is that they have absolutely zero interest in solving this problem. They need, for Culture War reasons, to keep the "we are under invasion by fireign sponges supported by Woke Lefties" narrative going. Because they have nothing else to offer their base.
If they we truly interested in stopping the boats, they could do so with the stroke of a pen. Open up other ways for people to make asylum claims through legal entry into the country. Then process the f**king asylum claims instead of sitting on them.
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What I do know is that this is a complex issue with nobody able or willing to come up with the solutions that's obviously needed .
What I also know is that this cannot continue .
Personally I see two easy hits , firstly putting the traffickers out of business and secondly looking at our own economy and the number of jobs that aren't filled .
So instead of paying traffickers why don't we offer a 12 month work permit for a reasonable fee , let's say £200 .
That work permit allows you to work and reside here for 12 months however other than the NHS it doesn't entitle you to benefits .
After 12 months and you've not committed any offences you can apply for a 5 year work permit which entitles you to certain benefits but not everything .
A successful 6 years here with no criminality and paying in to the system you automatically qualify for full residency and the same benefits as everyone else .
Whilst this scheme is in operation governments may well want to improve the infrastructure , schools , NHS and housing .
Dependent on economic conditions we need to use this scheme with everything on the table , once jobs dry up , houses sparse , schools full the scheme is then scaled down accordingly .
Sounds like a perfectly reasonable solution to an ongoing problem that nobody wants to deal with.
It was very noticeable from BST's reply that he very quickly wanted to move on from it and continue to use this useless government as a reason it would not or could not be implemented.
Would the Starmer's Labour party agree to this type of solution to this issue, i very much doubt it. And therein lies the crux, we don't have any political representation available to us to take this type of issue seriously and to get to the bottom of this problem. None of them are fit for purpose.
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DD
I talk about this Govt because this Govt has knowingly created this issue. It is them who have cut off pretty much every form of legally claiming asylum here. It is them who have sat on a mountain of asylum claims from people who have still managed to get here.
Anyone has a massive job to turn this around now. Not least because the public discourse is poisoned by ten bob fascists like Anderson and Braverman who will whip up their mob if Labour moves so much as an inch towards the sort of sensible solution that Tyke proposes.
Unless people see through this Culture War act for what it is, there's no solving thus because the political risk us too high. Its up to the British people to WANT a sensible solution.
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What I do know is that this is a complex issue with nobody able or willing to come up with the solutions that's obviously needed .
What I also know is that this cannot continue .
Personally I see two easy hits , firstly putting the traffickers out of business and secondly looking at our own economy and the number of jobs that aren't filled .
So instead of paying traffickers why don't we offer a 12 month work permit for a reasonable fee , let's say £200 .
That work permit allows you to work and reside here for 12 months however other than the NHS it doesn't entitle you to benefits .
After 12 months and you've not committed any offences you can apply for a 5 year work permit which entitles you to certain benefits but not everything .
A successful 6 years here with no criminality and paying in to the system you automatically qualify for full residency and the same benefits as everyone else .
Whilst this scheme is in operation governments may well want to improve the infrastructure , schools , NHS and housing .
Dependent on economic conditions we need to use this scheme with everything on the table , once jobs dry up , houses sparse , schools full the scheme is then scaled down accordingly .
Sounds like a perfectly reasonable solution to an ongoing problem that nobody wants to deal with.
It was very noticeable from BST's reply that he very quickly wanted to move on from it and continue to use this useless government as a reason it would not or could not be implemented.
Would the Starmer's Labour party agree to this type of solution to this issue, i very much doubt it. And therein lies the crux, we don't have any political representation available to us to take this type of issue seriously and to get to the bottom of this problem. None of them are fit for purpose.
What we have here are two extremes , on the right we have the taking our jobs , our houses our school places and they all come for the benefits .
On the left we have the no borders , open immigration and apparently everyone claiming asylum is escaping persecution and conflict viewpoint .
There's nothing in the middle that takes both views out of the conversation , it takes oxygen away from the culture war fires .
I wouldn't go as far as to say my scheme is perfect by any means but there seems to be something in it for both sides of the debate .
Unless this issue is resolved it will be used as a political football for generations to come and the right will win and we don't want the right to win because when they are eventually toppled as they always are it's generally no consolation to its victims and besides that have we not learned anything from history .
That said this country isn't a charity either , it's taxpayers do not get value for money and it's wealth is unevenly distributed .
So seen as nobody dare tax the wealth or it's inhabitants prepared to pay more tax given anybody putting that in its manifesto may as well not put themselves up for election we have a problem .
If people want to come here for a better life or indeed escape conflict and persecution , work hard and contribute then that's fine but it's probably a good idea to at least have some means to support yourself whilst you find your feet here , if you can pay traffickers you can support yourself too that's not unreasonable .
Barges , hotels and sent to Rwanda isn't a solution and if the country needs workers given both of the major party's follow the same economic model then you'd better scale up the infrastructure then hadn't you .
It's call investment , not everyone in this country lives in London and not everyone in London lives in the Docklands either .
You seemed to find plenty of taxpayers money to fund that area and all kinds of golden hello goodies .
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Tyke.
If thus Govt hadn't made it illegal for most asylum seekers to come to this country via normal routes, and hadn't blocked the overwhelming majority of asylum seekers from applying for asylum before coming here, there'd be literally no valid asylum seeker paying traffickers.
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Tyke.
If thus Govt hadn't made it illegal for most asylum seekers to come to this country via normal routes, and hadn't blocked the overwhelming majority of asylum seekers from applying for asylum before coming here, there'd be literally no valid asylum seeker paying traffickers.
Are you referring to the legislation that was voted on in April 2023 Billy ?
We've had this boats crisis for quite a while and pre dates that legislation .
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Tyke.
If thus Govt hadn't made it illegal for most asylum seekers to come to this country via normal routes, and hadn't blocked the overwhelming majority of asylum seekers from applying for asylum before coming here, there'd be literally no valid asylum seeker paying traffickers.
And if we legalised all drugs there'd be no drug dealers :silly:
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Tyke.
If thus Govt hadn't made it illegal for most asylum seekers to come to this country via normal routes, and hadn't blocked the overwhelming majority of asylum seekers from applying for asylum before coming here, there'd be literally no valid asylum seeker paying traffickers.
Are you referring to the legislation that was voted on in April 2023 Billy ?
We've had this boats crisis for quite a while and pre dates that legislation .
No I'm not.
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Vote for Labour then!
You could, and many will at the next GE according to the polls. But then, the Tories seem to have a habit of finding useful idiots, for who'm they do absolutely nothing, to vote for them.
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Vote for Labour then!
You could, and many will at the next GE according to the polls. But then, the Tories seem to have a habit of finding
them.
I could, yes, but I'd rather eat shit and die.
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Vote for Labour then!
You could, and many will at the next GE according to the polls. But then, the Tories seem to have a habit of finding
them.
I could, yes, but I'd rather eat shit and die.
Great idea!
Seriously tho, it's all starting to make sense why you talk it now. Don't take the idea further than eating it and regurgitating it.
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Well I’m hoping that Labour win then I can see what excuses are made for them when nothing changes.
Number one will probably be along the lines of it will take a decade to put things right.
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Well won't it?
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Labour won't get a decade in power if the first five years are a shyte show .
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Vote for Labour then!
You could, and many will at the next GE according to the polls. But then, the Tories seem to have a habit of finding
them.
I could, yes, but I'd rather eat shit and die.
I guess that’s better than talking it BB.
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Vote for Labour then!
You could, and many will at the next GE according to the polls. But then, the Tories seem to have a habit of finding
them.
I could, yes, but I'd rather eat shit and die.
I guess that’s better than talking it BB.
Let it be an inspiration to you. It's never too late to change.
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Oh dear, everyone off the barge!
You really couldn't make it up, could you!
Incompetence of the highest level, have tests done but move people in before getting the results! Unbelievable!
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Oh dear, everyone off the barge!
You really couldn't make it up, could you!
Incompetence of the highest level, have tests done but move people in before getting the results! Unbelievable!
Theresa May nailed it more that 10 years ago. She said that back in the 80s, many people thought the Tories were bas**rds, but at least they accepted that they were competent bas**rds. She said there was a danger that the current generation of Tories would be seen as not having the competence but still being bas**rds.
What better description is there for Braverman than a totally incompetent bas**rd?
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Don’t you mean many people think she is an incompetent bas**rd?
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Hard drive conatining info about people smugglers stolen from UK base.
Believed to be an inside job by people connected with the criminal gangs concerned.
In which case - the UK government is employing people smugglers to stop the people smugglers!
https://www.lbc.co.uk/news/gang-steals-evidence-migrant-crossings/
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Don’t you mean many people think she is an incompetent bas**rd?
Belton.
What conclusion do you draw from these facts?
1) There were Legionella tests done on the water supply of the migrant accommodation ship.
2) Braverman's Home Office put people in there at the earliest possible opportunity, before the rest results had cone back from the lab.
3) The test results showed the water had Legionella.
Tell you what I think. I know, from professional experience that anyone who has any responsibility for estates infrastructure has a legal responsibility to check water systems for Legionella, and not expose users to potentially infected water.
Anyone riding a coach and horses through that requirement is lucky if all they are called is "incompetent bas**rd".
"Criminally irresponsible" is probably a better description.
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You misunderstand my point, Billy.
May said ‘many people thought’, not ‘they were’.
I don’t personally disagree about Braverman being incompetent btw. It’s the pedant in me.
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Correction accepted Belton, although the meaning was clear enough. Politicians use "have you seen how we appear to be?" as code for "have you seen what we have become?" frequently when they are trying to get their party to see sense.
Meanwhile, I always thought Suella was going to vanish into obscurity with the nickname Cruella, but it seems that Legionella is making a late bid.
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PS.
When I tried to find that May speech online I couldn't locate it so I was working from memory. Do you have a link to it? I'd be interested to re-read the overall context. Especially coming from a woman who set the then standard for how toxically horrible the HO could be.
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Fill the docks in Calais with accommodation barges and operate an uk asylum screening centre in France . Controlled immigration . No loss of life in the channel .
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Fill the docks in Calais with accommodation barges and operate an uk asylum screening centre in France . Controlled immigration . No loss of life in the channel .
Sensible. But doesn't fit the left agenda of importing poverty, crime and young males, to then complain about housing and schooling shortages etc
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Oh yeah! How stupid of me not to realise that people on the left want crime and poverty and overcrowded schools!
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Seems the Albanians are now promoting a new route . Santander to Portsmouth ferry, in lorries.
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Record for 2023 beaten yesterday. 800 in a day. All males .
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And the barge when it's fit to use holds how many?
Another total waste of our money was it £1.6billion for 3? but hey the chap who supplied it is a Tory donor and the cotract didn't go to tender so that's OK then
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Record for 2023 beaten yesterday. 800 in a day. All males .
Thank Christ we had sensible politicians that took back control.
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Sunak in June - My plan to stop the boats is working
Sunak today - Errrr....
https://twitter.com/implausibleblog/status/1693700738461880640
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The bloke is,shall we say, Hi Risk and unelected.
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The Daily Express, of all papers, puts the channel crossings in perspective.
"These numbers are substantial and increasing, but from the perspective of our European neighbours, they are not exceptionally large."
"A quarter of all applications were made in Germany alone – their 243,835 total higher than anywhere else in the EU, and over three times more than the UK."
"Greece has a population of 10.5 million, compared to the UK's 67.5 million. In terms of asylum seekers per head – a rough barometer of a country’s ability to assimilate refugees – Greece had a rate of 356 per 100,000. The UK figure is 113."
"Austria tops the table in this regard, receiving just over 1,200 requests per 100,000 residents – a ratio over ten times higher than the UK."
https://www.express.co.uk/news/politics/1804406/european-countries-with-most-asylum-seekers-map-spt
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Fill the docks in Calais with accommodation barges and operate an uk asylum screening centre in France . Controlled immigration . No loss of life in the channel .
Sensible. But doesn't fit the left agenda of importing poverty, crime and young males, to then complain about housing and schooling shortages etc
We're you on at Edinburgh Fringe this year?
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https://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/1801180/The-maps-that-prove-French-warships-are-escorting-migrants-on-small-boats-to-UK
Bit of a strange one I watched a report on Talk Tv today they were out in the channel today watching a French Offshore patrol vessel merrily escorting a boat full of migrants into British waters, I can’t understand why they don’t intercept and take em back, The Border Force intercepts them when they reach British waters and them take em off the Dinghy and in to Port?
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https://twitter.com/visegrad24/status/1702238132769333668
according to this twitter Account 8,000 migrants landed in Lamperdusa in the last 48 hours!