Has to resign simple as that
Agree ... Good post and in fact I would change just one letter of it
I'm astonished anyone is shocked or surprised by any of this.i take it you don't like them 2 bst
It's just what Johnson is. What he's always been. He's not that buffoonish likeable chap off HIGNFY.
He's an arrogant, narcissistic, lying, entitled, selfish Kitson.
He always has been and always will be. Anyone who ever spent 10 minutes looking into his past could have told you that. And it was inevitable that it would catch up on him. Especially when he threw his lot in with a truly nasty, vengeful bas**rd like Cummings.
I'm astonished anyone is shocked or surprised by any of this.i take it you don't like them 2 bst
It's just what Johnson is. What he's always been. He's not that buffoonish likeable chap off HIGNFY.
He's an arrogant, narcissistic, lying, entitled, selfish Kitson.
He always has been and always will be. Anyone who ever spent 10 minutes looking into his past could have told you that. And it was inevitable that it would catch up on him. Especially when he threw his lot in with a truly nasty, vengeful bas**rd like Cummings.
Downing st said he only broke the law for 10 minutes.
Cummings has told Sue Gray he will only respond to her questions in writing, so that the PM can’t twist his words
He's an arrogant, narcissistic, lying, entitled, selfish Kitson.
He always has been and always will be.
Sky News saying there was two birthday events on that day.
The met police are going to investigate the parties held at number 10 over the last 2 years this has to be the final nail in his coffin
The met police are going to investigate the parties held at number 10 over the last 2 years this has to be the final nail in his coffin
Not too sure about that. Watch out for PMQ's tomorrow - 'Sue Grays report publication will have to wait until the result of the police enquiry'!
IMO 'Dame Dick' knows exactly what she's doing - protect Big Dog!
At least it'll be a change of answer at PMQ's tomorrow. Instead of 'We must wait the outcome of Sue Gray's report' to every question, we will have 'We must await the outcome of the Metropolitan Police inquiry'.
This looks like it could be the cover up to end all cover ups.
The plan, apparently, is to publish all the parts of the Gray report that don't refer to the things that the Met is investigating.
So the redacted report will have no smoking gun.
Then if the Met investigate and report that there is nothing to justify them taking any action, the redacted parts of the Gray report can be shelved as irrelevant.
Is that realistic? Well the Electoral Commission gave the Met a file on illegal use of funds by the Leave side in the 2016 Ref. The Met sat on it for two years, while Johnson was elected, then summarily announced that there was no case to answer. To the best of my knowledge, they have never explained the basis of that decision. And attention moves on.
But a birthday cake will.
Moving in from this and diversifying a little
Does anyone else feel that they couldn’t employ D Cummings. He’s an untrustworthy snake who’d stab anyone in the back
That’s got nothing to do with what’s happened at number 10 they deserve everything that’s coming
I just find Cummings a 2 faced hypocrite
That is the next big question Tyke, can Labour at the moment afford Johnson to be replaced.
He is the only subject on their agenda at the moment, Covid, The Ukraine situation, the economy, fuel poverty, the main things to the electorate not really important to them, just get rid of Johnson, and the replacement no doubt will be a much bigger problem in a couple of years time if they manage to remove him.
That is the next big question Tyke, can Labour at the moment afford Johnson to be replaced.
He is the only subject on their agenda at the moment, Covid, The Ukraine situation, the economy, fuel poverty, the main things to the electorate not really important to them, just get rid of Johnson, and the replacement no doubt will be a much bigger problem in a couple of years time if they manage to remove him.
I think this particular Tory Party is done for personally Selby .
I think the real question is can the Labour Party beat the Dems to form a majority government ?
That is the next big question Tyke, can Labour at the moment afford Johnson to be replaced.
He is the only subject on their agenda at the moment, Covid, The Ukraine situation, the economy, fuel poverty, the main things to the electorate not really important to them, just get rid of Johnson, and the replacement no doubt will be a much bigger problem in a couple of years time if they manage to remove him.
I think this particular Tory Party is done for personally Selby .
I think the real question is can the Labour Party beat the Dems to form a majority government ?
That is a good point tyke.
It is very possible that lots of Tory voters will switch to the Libdems.
That is the next big question Tyke, can Labour at the moment afford Johnson to be replaced.
He is the only subject on their agenda at the moment, Covid, The Ukraine situation, the economy, fuel poverty, the main things to the electorate not really important to them, just get rid of Johnson, and the replacement no doubt will be a much bigger problem in a couple of years time if they manage to remove him.
I think this particular Tory Party is done for personally Selby .
I think the real question is can the Labour Party beat the Dems to form a majority government ?
That is a good point tyke.
It is very possible that lots of Tory voters will switch to the Libdems.
If Labour were to stand down any candidates in traditional Tory voting constituencies it would certainly ensure in many cases as things stand today that the Tories wouldn't win enough of their traditional seats .
With the former Red Wall returning it would be a pretty close thing in my opinion between Labour and The Dems .
Whether they'd work together is of course open to debate .
Cummings should be sent to Moscow, as British ambassador. He’d do a job there for us.
That is the next big question Tyke, can Labour at the moment afford Johnson to be replaced.
He is the only subject on their agenda at the moment, Covid, The Ukraine situation, the economy, fuel poverty, the main things to the electorate not really important to them, just get rid of Johnson, and the replacement no doubt will be a much bigger problem in a couple of years time if they manage to remove him.
I think this particular Tory Party is done for personally Selby .
I think the real question is can the Labour Party beat the Dems to form a majority government ?
That is a good point tyke.
It is very possible that lots of Tory voters will switch to the Libdems.
If Labour were to stand down any candidates in traditional Tory voting constituencies it would certainly ensure in many cases as things stand today that the Tories wouldn't win enough of their traditional seats .
With the former Red Wall returning it would be a pretty close thing in my opinion between Labour and The Dems .
Whether they'd work together is of course open to debate .
F*cking hell, the prospect of snake oil Chuka Umunna as Prime Minister draws ever closer.
That is the next big question Tyke, can Labour at the moment afford Johnson to be replaced.
He is the only subject on their agenda at the moment, Covid, The Ukraine situation, the economy, fuel poverty, the main things to the electorate not really important to them, just get rid of Johnson, and the replacement no doubt will be a much bigger problem in a couple of years time if they manage to remove him.
I think this particular Tory Party is done for personally Selby .
I think the real question is can the Labour Party beat the Dems to form a majority government ?
That is a good point tyke.
It is very possible that lots of Tory voters will switch to the Libdems.
If Labour were to stand down any candidates in traditional Tory voting constituencies it would certainly ensure in many cases as things stand today that the Tories wouldn't win enough of their traditional seats .
With the former Red Wall returning it would be a pretty close thing in my opinion between Labour and The Dems .
Whether they'd work together is of course open to debate .
That is the next big question Tyke, can Labour at the moment afford Johnson to be replaced.
He is the only subject on their agenda at the moment, Covid, The Ukraine situation, the economy, fuel poverty, the main things to the electorate not really important to them, just get rid of Johnson, and the replacement no doubt will be a much bigger problem in a couple of years time if they manage to remove him.
I think this particular Tory Party is done for personally Selby .
I think the real question is can the Labour Party beat the Dems to form a majority government ?
That is a good point tyke.
It is very possible that lots of Tory voters will switch to the Libdems.
That is the next big question Tyke, can Labour at the moment afford Johnson to be replaced.
He is the only subject on their agenda at the moment, Covid, The Ukraine situation, the economy, fuel poverty, the main things to the electorate not really important to them, just get rid of Johnson, and the replacement no doubt will be a much bigger problem in a couple of years time if they manage to remove him.
I think this particular Tory Party is done for personally Selby .
I think the real question is can the Labour Party beat the Dems to form a majority government ?
That is a good point tyke.
It is very possible that lots of Tory voters will switch to the Libdems.
If Labour were to stand down any candidates in traditional Tory voting constituencies it would certainly ensure in many cases as things stand today that the Tories wouldn't win enough of their traditional seats .
With the former Red Wall returning it would be a pretty close thing in my opinion between Labour and The Dems .
Whether they'd work together is of course open to debate .
F*cking hell, the prospect of snake oil Chuka Umunna as Prime Minister draws ever closer.That is the next big question Tyke, can Labour at the moment afford Johnson to be replaced.
He is the only subject on their agenda at the moment, Covid, The Ukraine situation, the economy, fuel poverty, the main things to the electorate not really important to them, just get rid of Johnson, and the replacement no doubt will be a much bigger problem in a couple of years time if they manage to remove him.
I think this particular Tory Party is done for personally Selby .
I think the real question is can the Labour Party beat the Dems to form a majority government ?
That is a good point tyke.
It is very possible that lots of Tory voters will switch to the Libdems.
If Labour were to stand down any candidates in traditional Tory voting constituencies it would certainly ensure in many cases as things stand today that the Tories wouldn't win enough of their traditional seats .
With the former Red Wall returning it would be a pretty close thing in my opinion between Labour and The Dems .
Whether they'd work together is of course open to debate .
There's not a chance in a million of the Tories not being in the top 2 in a General Election anytime soon. There's a core of 25-30% who will never leave them. And they are well distributed across constituencies. So it's almost inconceivable that they'd ever get much fewer that 200 seats.
That is the next big question Tyke, can Labour at the moment afford Johnson to be replaced.
He is the only subject on their agenda at the moment, Covid, The Ukraine situation, the economy, fuel poverty, the main things to the electorate not really important to them, just get rid of Johnson, and the replacement no doubt will be a much bigger problem in a couple of years time if they manage to remove him.
I think this particular Tory Party is done for personally Selby .
I think the real question is can the Labour Party beat the Dems to form a majority government ?
That is a good point tyke.
It is very possible that lots of Tory voters will switch to the Libdems.
If Labour were to stand down any candidates in traditional Tory voting constituencies it would certainly ensure in many cases as things stand today that the Tories wouldn't win enough of their traditional seats .
With the former Red Wall returning it would be a pretty close thing in my opinion between Labour and The Dems .
Whether they'd work together is of course open to debate .
F*cking hell, the prospect of snake oil Chuka Umunna as Prime Minister draws ever closer.That is the next big question Tyke, can Labour at the moment afford Johnson to be replaced.
He is the only subject on their agenda at the moment, Covid, The Ukraine situation, the economy, fuel poverty, the main things to the electorate not really important to them, just get rid of Johnson, and the replacement no doubt will be a much bigger problem in a couple of years time if they manage to remove him.
I think this particular Tory Party is done for personally Selby .
I think the real question is can the Labour Party beat the Dems to form a majority government ?
That is a good point tyke.
It is very possible that lots of Tory voters will switch to the Libdems.
If Labour were to stand down any candidates in traditional Tory voting constituencies it would certainly ensure in many cases as things stand today that the Tories wouldn't win enough of their traditional seats .
With the former Red Wall returning it would be a pretty close thing in my opinion between Labour and The Dems .
Whether they'd work together is of course open to debate .
There's not a chance in a million of the Tories not being in the top 2 in a General Election anytime soon. There's a core of 25-30% who will never leave them. And they are well distributed across constituencies. So it's almost inconceivable that they'd ever get much fewer that 200 seats.
Well it isn't inconceivable is it because they only won 165 seats in 1997 .
So it is possible given the damage they've contributed to themselves today is far more than in the mid 90's .
That is the next big question Tyke, can Labour at the moment afford Johnson to be replaced.
He is the only subject on their agenda at the moment, Covid, The Ukraine situation, the economy, fuel poverty, the main things to the electorate not really important to them, just get rid of Johnson, and the replacement no doubt will be a much bigger problem in a couple of years time if they manage to remove him.
I think this particular Tory Party is done for personally Selby .
I think the real question is can the Labour Party beat the Dems to form a majority government ?
That is a good point tyke.
It is very possible that lots of Tory voters will switch to the Libdems.
If Labour were to stand down any candidates in traditional Tory voting constituencies it would certainly ensure in many cases as things stand today that the Tories wouldn't win enough of their traditional seats .
With the former Red Wall returning it would be a pretty close thing in my opinion between Labour and The Dems .
Whether they'd work together is of course open to debate .
F*cking hell, the prospect of snake oil Chuka Umunna as Prime Minister draws ever closer.That is the next big question Tyke, can Labour at the moment afford Johnson to be replaced.
He is the only subject on their agenda at the moment, Covid, The Ukraine situation, the economy, fuel poverty, the main things to the electorate not really important to them, just get rid of Johnson, and the replacement no doubt will be a much bigger problem in a couple of years time if they manage to remove him.
I think this particular Tory Party is done for personally Selby .
I think the real question is can the Labour Party beat the Dems to form a majority government ?
That is a good point tyke.
It is very possible that lots of Tory voters will switch to the Libdems.
If Labour were to stand down any candidates in traditional Tory voting constituencies it would certainly ensure in many cases as things stand today that the Tories wouldn't win enough of their traditional seats .
With the former Red Wall returning it would be a pretty close thing in my opinion between Labour and The Dems .
Whether they'd work together is of course open to debate .
There's not a chance in a million of the Tories not being in the top 2 in a General Election anytime soon. There's a core of 25-30% who will never leave them. And they are well distributed across constituencies. So it's almost inconceivable that they'd ever get much fewer that 200 seats.
Well it isn't inconceivable is it because they only won 165 seats in 1997 .
So it is possible given the damage they've contributed to themselves today is far more than in the mid 90's .
That's several worlds away. Voters used to switch in large numbers directly between Lab and Con in those days. They do it far less these days.
A question worth asking is, what would it take for the coppers at #10 to take action over criminal activity by senior politicians or public servants?
That is the next big question Tyke, can Labour at the moment afford Johnson to be replaced.
He is the only subject on their agenda at the moment, Covid, The Ukraine situation, the economy, fuel poverty, the main things to the electorate not really important to them, just get rid of Johnson, and the replacement no doubt will be a much bigger problem in a couple of years time if they manage to remove him.
I think this particular Tory Party is done for personally Selby .
I think the real question is can the Labour Party beat the Dems to form a majority government ?
That is a good point tyke.
It is very possible that lots of Tory voters will switch to the Libdems.
If Labour were to stand down any candidates in traditional Tory voting constituencies it would certainly ensure in many cases as things stand today that the Tories wouldn't win enough of their traditional seats .
With the former Red Wall returning it would be a pretty close thing in my opinion between Labour and The Dems .
Whether they'd work together is of course open to debate .
F*cking hell, the prospect of snake oil Chuka Umunna as Prime Minister draws ever closer.That is the next big question Tyke, can Labour at the moment afford Johnson to be replaced.
He is the only subject on their agenda at the moment, Covid, The Ukraine situation, the economy, fuel poverty, the main things to the electorate not really important to them, just get rid of Johnson, and the replacement no doubt will be a much bigger problem in a couple of years time if they manage to remove him.
I think this particular Tory Party is done for personally Selby .
I think the real question is can the Labour Party beat the Dems to form a majority government ?
That is a good point tyke.
It is very possible that lots of Tory voters will switch to the Libdems.
If Labour were to stand down any candidates in traditional Tory voting constituencies it would certainly ensure in many cases as things stand today that the Tories wouldn't win enough of their traditional seats .
With the former Red Wall returning it would be a pretty close thing in my opinion between Labour and The Dems .
Whether they'd work together is of course open to debate .
There's not a chance in a million of the Tories not being in the top 2 in a General Election anytime soon. There's a core of 25-30% who will never leave them. And they are well distributed across constituencies. So it's almost inconceivable that they'd ever get much fewer that 200 seats.
Well it isn't inconceivable is it because they only won 165 seats in 1997 .
So it is possible given the damage they've contributed to themselves today is far more than in the mid 90's .
That's several worlds away. Voters used to switch in large numbers directly between Lab and Con in those days. They do it far less these days.
I haven't suggested they'd switch between Tory and Labour , I've suggested a Tory government is in danger from the Dems in their own back yard .
That is the next big question Tyke, can Labour at the moment afford Johnson to be replaced.
He is the only subject on their agenda at the moment, Covid, The Ukraine situation, the economy, fuel poverty, the main things to the electorate not really important to them, just get rid of Johnson, and the replacement no doubt will be a much bigger problem in a couple of years time if they manage to remove him.
I think this particular Tory Party is done for personally Selby .
I think the real question is can the Labour Party beat the Dems to form a majority government ?
That is a good point tyke.
It is very possible that lots of Tory voters will switch to the Libdems.
If Labour were to stand down any candidates in traditional Tory voting constituencies it would certainly ensure in many cases as things stand today that the Tories wouldn't win enough of their traditional seats .
With the former Red Wall returning it would be a pretty close thing in my opinion between Labour and The Dems .
Whether they'd work together is of course open to debate .
F*cking hell, the prospect of snake oil Chuka Umunna as Prime Minister draws ever closer.That is the next big question Tyke, can Labour at the moment afford Johnson to be replaced.
He is the only subject on their agenda at the moment, Covid, The Ukraine situation, the economy, fuel poverty, the main things to the electorate not really important to them, just get rid of Johnson, and the replacement no doubt will be a much bigger problem in a couple of years time if they manage to remove him.
I think this particular Tory Party is done for personally Selby .
I think the real question is can the Labour Party beat the Dems to form a majority government ?
That is a good point tyke.
It is very possible that lots of Tory voters will switch to the Libdems.
If Labour were to stand down any candidates in traditional Tory voting constituencies it would certainly ensure in many cases as things stand today that the Tories wouldn't win enough of their traditional seats .
With the former Red Wall returning it would be a pretty close thing in my opinion between Labour and The Dems .
Whether they'd work together is of course open to debate .
There's not a chance in a million of the Tories not being in the top 2 in a General Election anytime soon. There's a core of 25-30% who will never leave them. And they are well distributed across constituencies. So it's almost inconceivable that they'd ever get much fewer that 200 seats.
Well it isn't inconceivable is it because they only won 165 seats in 1997 .
So it is possible given the damage they've contributed to themselves today is far more than in the mid 90's .
That's several worlds away. Voters used to switch in large numbers directly between Lab and Con in those days. They do it far less these days.
I haven't suggested they'd switch between Tory and Labour , I've suggested a Tory government is in danger from the Dems in their own back yard .
They might lose the odd marginal, but you don't seem to factor in how powerful the whole Culture War concept is.
Culturally, the LDs are further removed from the Tories than Labour are.
A question worth asking is, what would it take for the coppers at #10 to take action over criminal activity by senior politicians or public servants?
That is the next big question Tyke, can Labour at the moment afford Johnson to be replaced.
He is the only subject on their agenda at the moment, Covid, The Ukraine situation, the economy, fuel poverty, the main things to the electorate not really important to them, just get rid of Johnson, and the replacement no doubt will be a much bigger problem in a couple of years time if they manage to remove him.
I think this particular Tory Party is done for personally Selby .
I think the real question is can the Labour Party beat the Dems to form a majority government ?
That is a good point tyke.
It is very possible that lots of Tory voters will switch to the Libdems.
If Labour were to stand down any candidates in traditional Tory voting constituencies it would certainly ensure in many cases as things stand today that the Tories wouldn't win enough of their traditional seats .
With the former Red Wall returning it would be a pretty close thing in my opinion between Labour and The Dems .
Whether they'd work together is of course open to debate .
F*cking hell, the prospect of snake oil Chuka Umunna as Prime Minister draws ever closer.That is the next big question Tyke, can Labour at the moment afford Johnson to be replaced.
He is the only subject on their agenda at the moment, Covid, The Ukraine situation, the economy, fuel poverty, the main things to the electorate not really important to them, just get rid of Johnson, and the replacement no doubt will be a much bigger problem in a couple of years time if they manage to remove him.
I think this particular Tory Party is done for personally Selby .
I think the real question is can the Labour Party beat the Dems to form a majority government ?
That is a good point tyke.
It is very possible that lots of Tory voters will switch to the Libdems.
If Labour were to stand down any candidates in traditional Tory voting constituencies it would certainly ensure in many cases as things stand today that the Tories wouldn't win enough of their traditional seats .
With the former Red Wall returning it would be a pretty close thing in my opinion between Labour and The Dems .
Whether they'd work together is of course open to debate .
There's not a chance in a million of the Tories not being in the top 2 in a General Election anytime soon. There's a core of 25-30% who will never leave them. And they are well distributed across constituencies. So it's almost inconceivable that they'd ever get much fewer that 200 seats.
Well it isn't inconceivable is it because they only won 165 seats in 1997 .
So it is possible given the damage they've contributed to themselves today is far more than in the mid 90's .
That's several worlds away. Voters used to switch in large numbers directly between Lab and Con in those days. They do it far less these days.
I haven't suggested they'd switch between Tory and Labour , I've suggested a Tory government is in danger from the Dems in their own back yard .
They might lose the odd marginal, but you don't seem to factor in how powerful the whole Culture War concept is.
Culturally, the LDs are further removed from the Tories than Labour are.
A question worth asking is, what would it take for the coppers at #10 to take action over criminal activity by senior politicians or public servants?
The cops on the door of no 10 did nothing when Blair wagering war crimes from his living room there. And this is not a slur on Labour. My point is the cops that police Downing Street are just cops. PCs. They probably are not even detectives.
They have a simple mandate. Protect Downing Street and those that live/ work down there. Nothing else.
It would be a bit like asking a royal protection officer to arrest Prince Andrew for child sex offences. Ain’t going to happen.
A question worth asking is, what would it take for the coppers at #10 to take action over criminal activity by senior politicians or public servants?
The cops on the door of no 10 did nothing when Blair wagering war crimes from his living room there. And this is not a slur on Labour. My point is the cops that police Downing Street are just cops. PCs. They probably are not even detectives.
They have a simple mandate. Protect Downing Street and those that live/ work down there. Nothing else.
It would be a bit like asking a royal protection officer to arrest Prince Andrew for child sex offences. Ain’t going to happen.
Not taking it as a slur but didn't all your undercover work tell you that it's unlikely that they were party to conversations within the building.
It’s also quite possible that the cops working no10 had no idea there were parties taking place.
Had they known, and blew the whistle, I’d imagine they would have been found alternative employment directing traffic in Clapham.
Sometimes, in life it easier just to keep your mouth shut I guess.
It’s also quite possible that the cops working no10 had no idea there were parties taking place.
Had they known, and blew the whistle, I’d imagine they would have been found alternative employment directing traffic in Clapham.
Sometimes, in life it easier just to keep your mouth shut I guess.
which goes back to my original question: ''what would it take for the coppers at #10 to take action over criminal activity by senior politicians or public servants?
It’s also quite possible that the cops working no10 had no idea there were parties taking place.
Had they known, and blew the whistle, I’d imagine they would have been found alternative employment directing traffic in Clapham.
Sometimes, in life it easier just to keep your mouth shut I guess.
which goes back to my original question: ''what would it take for the coppers at #10 to take action over criminal activity by senior politicians or public servants?
A frontal lobotomy.
I don't wish to drag the conversation to another point on the map but ask any non-white person subject to a stop and search if they think that criteria was used when they are 9x more likely to be the subject of one.
... repeatedly and proven time and again
It's not about a piece of cake, it's about a PM that's lying to Parliament.
That is the next big question Tyke, can Labour at the moment afford Johnson to be replaced.
He is the only subject on their agenda at the moment, Covid, The Ukraine situation, the economy, fuel poverty, the main things to the electorate not really important to them, just get rid of Johnson, and the replacement no doubt will be a much bigger problem in a couple of years time if they manage to remove him.
I think this particular Tory Party is done for personally Selby .
I think the real question is can the Labour Party beat the Dems to form a majority government ?
That is a good point tyke.
It is very possible that lots of Tory voters will switch to the Libdems.
If Labour were to stand down any candidates in traditional Tory voting constituencies it would certainly ensure in many cases as things stand today that the Tories wouldn't win enough of their traditional seats .
With the former Red Wall returning it would be a pretty close thing in my opinion between Labour and The Dems .
Whether they'd work together is of course open to debate .
F*cking hell, the prospect of snake oil Chuka Umunna as Prime Minister draws ever closer.That is the next big question Tyke, can Labour at the moment afford Johnson to be replaced.
He is the only subject on their agenda at the moment, Covid, The Ukraine situation, the economy, fuel poverty, the main things to the electorate not really important to them, just get rid of Johnson, and the replacement no doubt will be a much bigger problem in a couple of years time if they manage to remove him.
I think this particular Tory Party is done for personally Selby .
I think the real question is can the Labour Party beat the Dems to form a majority government ?
That is a good point tyke.
It is very possible that lots of Tory voters will switch to the Libdems.
If Labour were to stand down any candidates in traditional Tory voting constituencies it would certainly ensure in many cases as things stand today that the Tories wouldn't win enough of their traditional seats .
With the former Red Wall returning it would be a pretty close thing in my opinion between Labour and The Dems .
Whether they'd work together is of course open to debate .
There's not a chance in a million of the Tories not being in the top 2 in a General Election anytime soon. There's a core of 25-30% who will never leave them. And they are well distributed across constituencies. So it's almost inconceivable that they'd ever get much fewer that 200 seats.
Well it isn't inconceivable is it because they only won 165 seats in 1997 .
So it is possible given the damage they've contributed to themselves today is far more than in the mid 90's .
That's several worlds away. Voters used to switch in large numbers directly between Lab and Con in those days. They do it far less these days.
I haven't suggested they'd switch between Tory and Labour , I've suggested a Tory government is in danger from the Dems in their own back yard .
They might lose the odd marginal, but you don't seem to factor in how powerful the whole Culture War concept is.
Culturally, the LDs are further removed from the Tories than Labour are.
The Lib Dem’s manifesto makes for scary reading.
That is the next big question Tyke, can Labour at the moment afford Johnson to be replaced.
He is the only subject on their agenda at the moment, Covid, The Ukraine situation, the economy, fuel poverty, the main things to the electorate not really important to them, just get rid of Johnson, and the replacement no doubt will be a much bigger problem in a couple of years time if they manage to remove him.
I think this particular Tory Party is done for personally Selby .
I think the real question is can the Labour Party beat the Dems to form a majority government ?
That is a good point tyke.
It is very possible that lots of Tory voters will switch to the Libdems.
If Labour were to stand down any candidates in traditional Tory voting constituencies it would certainly ensure in many cases as things stand today that the Tories wouldn't win enough of their traditional seats .
With the former Red Wall returning it would be a pretty close thing in my opinion between Labour and The Dems .
Whether they'd work together is of course open to debate .
F*cking hell, the prospect of snake oil Chuka Umunna as Prime Minister draws ever closer.That is the next big question Tyke, can Labour at the moment afford Johnson to be replaced.
He is the only subject on their agenda at the moment, Covid, The Ukraine situation, the economy, fuel poverty, the main things to the electorate not really important to them, just get rid of Johnson, and the replacement no doubt will be a much bigger problem in a couple of years time if they manage to remove him.
I think this particular Tory Party is done for personally Selby .
I think the real question is can the Labour Party beat the Dems to form a majority government ?
That is a good point tyke.
It is very possible that lots of Tory voters will switch to the Libdems.
If Labour were to stand down any candidates in traditional Tory voting constituencies it would certainly ensure in many cases as things stand today that the Tories wouldn't win enough of their traditional seats .
With the former Red Wall returning it would be a pretty close thing in my opinion between Labour and The Dems .
Whether they'd work together is of course open to debate .
There's not a chance in a million of the Tories not being in the top 2 in a General Election anytime soon. There's a core of 25-30% who will never leave them. And they are well distributed across constituencies. So it's almost inconceivable that they'd ever get much fewer that 200 seats.
Well it isn't inconceivable is it because they only won 165 seats in 1997 .
So it is possible given the damage they've contributed to themselves today is far more than in the mid 90's .
That's several worlds away. Voters used to switch in large numbers directly between Lab and Con in those days. They do it far less these days.
I haven't suggested they'd switch between Tory and Labour , I've suggested a Tory government is in danger from the Dems in their own back yard .
They might lose the odd marginal, but you don't seem to factor in how powerful the whole Culture War concept is.
Culturally, the LDs are further removed from the Tories than Labour are.
The Lib Dem’s manifesto makes for scary reading.
The above quote a quote a quote etc surely breaks the record for longest ever
Or it did
When will people realise that much of the British public prefer someone who broke social distancing rules to someone who wanted to revoke a democratic vote!
That is the next big question Tyke, can Labour at the moment afford Johnson to be replaced.
He is the only subject on their agenda at the moment, Covid, The Ukraine situation, the economy, fuel poverty, the main things to the electorate not really important to them, just get rid of Johnson, and the replacement no doubt will be a much bigger problem in a couple of years time if they manage to remove him.
I think this particular Tory Party is done for personally Selby .
I think the real question is can the Labour Party beat the Dems to form a majority government ?
That is a good point tyke.
It is very possible that lots of Tory voters will switch to the Libdems.
If Labour were to stand down any candidates in traditional Tory voting constituencies it would certainly ensure in many cases as things stand today that the Tories wouldn't win enough of their traditional seats .
With the former Red Wall returning it would be a pretty close thing in my opinion between Labour and The Dems .
Whether they'd work together is of course open to debate .
F*cking hell, the prospect of snake oil Chuka Umunna as Prime Minister draws ever closer.That is the next big question Tyke, can Labour at the moment afford Johnson to be replaced.
He is the only subject on their agenda at the moment, Covid, The Ukraine situation, the economy, fuel poverty, the main things to the electorate not really important to them, just get rid of Johnson, and the replacement no doubt will be a much bigger problem in a couple of years time if they manage to remove him.
I think this particular Tory Party is done for personally Selby .
I think the real question is can the Labour Party beat the Dems to form a majority government ?
That is a good point tyke.
It is very possible that lots of Tory voters will switch to the Libdems.
If Labour were to stand down any candidates in traditional Tory voting constituencies it would certainly ensure in many cases as things stand today that the Tories wouldn't win enough of their traditional seats .
With the former Red Wall returning it would be a pretty close thing in my opinion between Labour and The Dems .
Whether they'd work together is of course open to debate .
There's not a chance in a million of the Tories not being in the top 2 in a General Election anytime soon. There's a core of 25-30% who will never leave them. And they are well distributed across constituencies. So it's almost inconceivable that they'd ever get much fewer that 200 seats.
Well it isn't inconceivable is it because they only won 165 seats in 1997 .
So it is possible given the damage they've contributed to themselves today is far more than in the mid 90's .
That's several worlds away. Voters used to switch in large numbers directly between Lab and Con in those days. They do it far less these days.
I haven't suggested they'd switch between Tory and Labour , I've suggested a Tory government is in danger from the Dems in their own back yard .
They might lose the odd marginal, but you don't seem to factor in how powerful the whole Culture War concept is.
Culturally, the LDs are further removed from the Tories than Labour are.
The Lib Dem’s manifesto makes for scary reading.
The above quote a quote a quote etc surely breaks the record for longest ever
Or it did
Not trying to extend the record here DW, but I have seen far more quote above quote etc posts on here mate.
Funny why you thought of Brexit. If Starmer didn't want to revoke that vote, why would it even cross your mind to think that was the democratic vote I was talking about?When will people realise that much of the British public prefer someone who broke social distancing rules to someone who wanted to revoke a democratic vote!
And who wanted to revoke the Brexit vote?
Right, it's one of THOSE nights is it? I'm out.Annoying, int it!
Funny why you thought of Brexit. If Starmer didn't want to revoke that vote, why would it even cross your mind to think that was the democratic vote I was talking about?When will people realise that much of the British public prefer someone who broke social distancing rules to someone who wanted to revoke a democratic vote!
And who wanted to revoke the Brexit vote?
Yet still #starmerout is trending on twitter....
Seems to be a race to the bottom for the main leaders.
I thought Bojo summed up stabber well today.
He is not a leader, he is a lawyer.
Dead original!I thought Bojo summed up stabber well today.
He is not a leader, he is a lawyer.
Would you rather be led by a lawyer or a liar?
Dead original!I thought Bojo summed up stabber well today.
He is not a leader, he is a lawyer.
Would you rather be led by a lawyer or a liar?
I thought Bojo summed up stabber well today.
He is not a leader, he is a lawyer.
Would you rather be led by a lawyer or a liar?
A bloke walks into a bar and shouts, “All Lawyers are ARSEHOLES!”
A man shouts back at him “I take exception to that statement!”
The first bloke said, “Are you a Lawyer?”
The man responded, “No, I’m an arsehole!”
A bloke walks into a bar and shouts, “All Lawyers are ARSEHOLES!”
A man shouts back at him “I take exception to that statement!”
The first bloke said, “Are you a Lawyer?”
The man responded, “No, I’m an arsehole!”
That would be Mark Spencer then?
I thought Bojo summed up stabber well today.
He is not a leader, he is a lawyer.
Would you rather be led by a lawyer or a liar?
It is claimed that lawyers don't lie, but they sometimes hide the truth. The question is, is hiding the truth a form of lying?
What Stabber Starmer really is is a traitor to the UK electorate, He has voted 48 times against Brexit, some of them votes taken after the referendum result, he has colluded openly with the EU negotiators to undermine the UK electorates and the countries standing when negotiations of an agreement were on going.
He is not and never will be a person to trust, in times gone by he would have been shot or in the tower and rightly so.
And whats more when he says he now accepts Brexit is done, he is a bare faced liar.
When will people realise that much of the British public prefer someone who broke social distancing rules to someone who wanted to revoke a democratic vote!
When will people realise that much of the British public prefer someone who broke social distancing rules to someone who wanted to revoke a democratic vote!
You are John from Formby, and I claim my £5.
https://www.dkpw.co.uk/watch/John%20From%20Formby.mp3
When will people realise that much of the British public prefer someone who broke social distancing rules to someone who wanted to revoke a democratic vote!
You are John from Formby, and I claim my £5.
https://www.dkpw.co.uk/watch/John%20From%20Formby.mp3
You've not been right yet, so there's nothing unusual about you being wrong this time. However, I do agree with John Formby, and I'd much rather be him than that utter bell end James O'brien.
This looks like it could be the cover up to end all cover ups.
The plan, apparently, is to publish all the parts of the Gray report that don't refer to the things that the Met is investigating.
So the redacted report will have no smoking gun.
Then if the Met investigate and report that there is nothing to justify them taking any action, the redacted parts of the Gray report can be shelved as irrelevant.
Is that realistic? Well the Electoral Commission gave the Met a file on illegal use of funds by the Leave side in the 2016 Ref. The Met sat on it for two years, while Johnson was elected, then summarily announced that there was no case to answer. To the best of my knowledge, they have never explained the basis of that decision. And attention moves on.
It's too big to be covered up. You can't have it all ways. Big cry for police to investigate. They now are and there's grumbles the report isn't out. Can't have it all ways. The key thing is it shouldn't take long.
All three opposition parties voicing concerns about a possible cover up being engineered between the Met and Gray.
All demanding full disclosure of the Gray report.
And interestingly, someone has dug up an old report in the Times of the Downing Street birthday party, which featured a Union Jack birthday cake and confirms Boris and Sunak were in attendance.
I told you things will keep popping up.
All three opposition parties voicing concerns about a possible cover up being engineered between the Met and Gray.
All demanding full disclosure of the Gray report.
And interestingly, someone has dug up an old report in the Times of the Downing Street birthday party, which featured a Union Jack birthday cake and confirms Boris and Sunak were in attendance.
I told you things will keep popping up.
I can't keep up. They had denied there was a birthday cake. So what is this Union Jack birthday cake?
Another lie in the lie-athon.
Dark forces at work here.
The Home Secretary overseas everything the Police does. Especially so when her own are being investigated.
And now Metpol saying they don’t want certain Disclosures made as it may undermine their enquiry?
Is this the Metpol stance, or are they under influence by the very people they are trying to investigate. A very, very tangled web.
I'll just have a beer and stand at the window.
I'll just have a beer and stand at the window.
Cake?
I've thought about this for many many years probably from the time of the financial crash in 2008 .
You know you can corrupt everything you want to retain power , rig the game anyway you want , pass this law that law or even have the armed forces backing you .
History tells us that only works for a certain period of time .
History tells us that if you don't quite get the balance right between corruption , a rigged society and enough to eat for the vast majority of the people it isn't going to end well for those at the top .
All it takes is a spark , I wouldn't suggest for one minute we are even close right now but the direction of travel isn't good I have to say .
It could go up in the US any day and in my opinion it probably will descend in to a civil war and that day isn't too far away .
I sincerely hope it never happens here but I wouldn't dismiss massive disorder breaking out either given as I say the direction of travel this country is heading towards .
I've thought about this for many many years probably from the time of the financial crash in 2008 .
You know you can corrupt everything you want to retain power , rig the game anyway you want , pass this law that law or even have the armed forces backing you .
History tells us that only works for a certain period of time .
History tells us that if you don't quite get the balance right between corruption , a rigged society and enough to eat for the vast majority of the people it isn't going to end well for those at the top .
All it takes is a spark , I wouldn't suggest for one minute we are even close right now but the direction of travel isn't good I have to say .
It could go up in the US any day and in my opinion it probably will descend in to a civil war and that day isn't too far away .
I sincerely hope it never happens here but I wouldn't dismiss massive disorder breaking out either given as I say the direction of travel this country is heading towards .
I agree, in the current climate civil disobedience can’t be too far away, if this was happening in another Country the UK would be shouting corruption from the rooftops
I've thought about this for many many years probably from the time of the financial crash in 2008 .
You know you can corrupt everything you want to retain power , rig the game anyway you want , pass this law that law or even have the armed forces backing you .
History tells us that only works for a certain period of time .
History tells us that if you don't quite get the balance right between corruption , a rigged society and enough to eat for the vast majority of the people it isn't going to end well for those at the top .
All it takes is a spark , I wouldn't suggest for one minute we are even close right now but the direction of travel isn't good I have to say .
It could go up in the US any day and in my opinion it probably will descend in to a civil war and that day isn't too far away .
I sincerely hope it never happens here but I wouldn't dismiss massive disorder breaking out either given as I say the direction of travel this country is heading towards .
I agree, in the current climate civil disobedience can’t be too far away, if this was happening in another Country the UK would be shouting corruption from the rooftops
There's clearly nothing Johnson and his minions won't throw under the bus to hold on to power .
Once the state decides to limit its powers and focus on those who aren't at the top of the tree you are heading in to very serious territory .
As an enemy of the state in 84/85 I'm more than well placed to know what it's capabilities are , it's never left me .
However this is different territory today , this isn't about putting down some trade union and it's leader this has consequences for everybody who is just about getting by .
Just about getting by is measured in millions rather than a NUM membership in to the thousands .
I'm of the opinion since 2008 almost everything is capable of happening and all it needs is for want of a better term " a perfect storm " .
All this talk over a party in June 2020, when it was first reported in June of that year no one gave a shit, why now?
https://order-order.com/2022/01/28/burns-claims-boris-denies-birthday-cake/
I've thought about this for many many years probably from the time of the financial crash in 2008 .
You know you can corrupt everything you want to retain power , rig the game anyway you want , pass this law that law or even have the armed forces backing you .
History tells us that only works for a certain period of time .
History tells us that if you don't quite get the balance right between corruption , a rigged society and enough to eat for the vast majority of the people it isn't going to end well for those at the top .
All it takes is a spark , I wouldn't suggest for one minute we are even close right now but the direction of travel isn't good I have to say .
It could go up in the US any day and in my opinion it probably will descend in to a civil war and that day isn't too far away .
I sincerely hope it never happens here but I wouldn't dismiss massive disorder breaking out either given as I say the direction of travel this country is heading towards .
I agree, in the current climate civil disobedience can’t be too far away, if this was happening in another Country the UK would be shouting corruption from the rooftops
There's clearly nothing Johnson and his minions won't throw under the bus to hold on to power .
Once the state decides to limit its powers and focus on those who aren't at the top of the tree you are heading in to very serious territory .
As an enemy of the state in 84/85 I'm more than well placed to know what it's capabilities are , it's never left me .
However this is different territory today , this isn't about putting down some trade union and it's leader this has consequences for everybody who is just about getting by .
Just about getting by is measured in millions rather than a NUM membership in to the thousands .
I'm of the opinion since 2008 almost everything is capable of happening and all it needs is for want of a better term " a perfect storm " .
And going back to 84, we all know what the Met were like and what they stand for, Tory private army
All this talk over a party in June 2020, when it was first reported in June of that year no one gave a shit, why now?
https://order-order.com/2022/01/28/burns-claims-boris-denies-birthday-cake/
Ever heard of Marie Antoinette?
Entitlement and arrogance in the face of real hardship. That's what's coming.
All this talk over a party in June 2020, when it was first reported in June of that year no one gave a shit, why now?
https://order-order.com/2022/01/28/burns-claims-boris-denies-birthday-cake/
Ever heard of Marie Antoinette?
Entitlement and arrogance in the face of real hardship. That's what's coming.
Yep, it's just confirmation of the tory view that law and order is for everyone else.
All this talk over a party in June 2020, when it was first reported in June of that year no one gave a shit, why now?
https://order-order.com/2022/01/28/burns-claims-boris-denies-birthday-cake/
Ever heard of Marie Antoinette?
Entitlement and arrogance in the face of real hardship. That's what's coming.
Yep, it's just confirmation of the tory view that law and order is for everyone else.
Certainly looks that way with people like Reese Mogg who think it's all just a game to push the limits of the law as far as they can.
This looks like it could be the cover up to end all cover ups.
The plan, apparently, is to publish all the parts of the Gray report that don't refer to the things that the Met is investigating.
So the redacted report will have no smoking gun.
Then if the Met investigate and report that there is nothing to justify them taking any action, the redacted parts of the Gray report can be shelved as irrelevant.
Is that realistic? Well the Electoral Commission gave the Met a file on illegal use of funds by the Leave side in the 2016 Ref. The Met sat on it for two years, while Johnson was elected, then summarily announced that there was no case to answer. To the best of my knowledge, they have never explained the basis of that decision. And attention moves on.
Here we go. Step 1 of the cover up.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-60166997
Step 2 will be Johnson crowing next week that he's released the report in full for all to see and as he said all along, there's nothing to see.
Step 3 will be the Met dragging out their investigation for weeks or months until everyone is bored or has forgotten that revulsion they felt when they first heard about Johnson's partying.
Step 4 will be Cressida Dick saying that while there may have been some contraventions of the letter of the law, there's nothing to warrant prosecutions.
Step 5 is Johnson standing up in Parliament saying "I told you all along that I'd been honest on this point. I've been entirely vindicated. But it's clear that there was a culture among staff where the rules were flouted, and I'm disgusted at that. I have sacked several of my No10 team."
Just watch them try to roll it out.
Everyone who applies their brain to this will know it is b*llocks.
But that's not what matters. Johnson is a new breed of politician. We've never had his like before. He has absolutely zero capacity for shame. All that matters to him is power. It doesn't matter to him if people know he's a lying bas**rd. What matters is whether they support him.
If this plan rolls out and he is still supported by a large enough number of voters, he might well survive. And then our democracy truly is off the edge of the cliff.
All this talk over a party in June 2020, when it was first reported in June of that year no one gave a shit, why now?
https://order-order.com/2022/01/28/burns-claims-boris-denies-birthday-cake/
All this talk over a party in June 2020, when it was first reported in June of that year no one gave a shit, why now?
https://order-order.com/2022/01/28/burns-claims-boris-denies-birthday-cake/
Because the Prime Minister hadn't lied to Parliament about it then, that's why.
This looks like it could be the cover up to end all cover ups.
The plan, apparently, is to publish all the parts of the Gray report that don't refer to the things that the Met is investigating.
So the redacted report will have no smoking gun.
Then if the Met investigate and report that there is nothing to justify them taking any action, the redacted parts of the Gray report can be shelved as irrelevant.
Is that realistic? Well the Electoral Commission gave the Met a file on illegal use of funds by the Leave side in the 2016 Ref. The Met sat on it for two years, while Johnson was elected, then summarily announced that there was no case to answer. To the best of my knowledge, they have never explained the basis of that decision. And attention moves on.
Here we go. Step 1 of the cover up.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-60166997
Step 2 will be Johnson crowing next week that he's released the report in full for all to see and as he said all along, there's nothing to see.
Step 3 will be the Met dragging out their investigation for weeks or months until everyone is bored or has forgotten that revulsion they felt when they first heard about Johnson's partying.
Step 4 will be Cressida Dick saying that while there may have been some contraventions of the letter of the law, there's nothing to warrant prosecutions.
Step 5 is Johnson standing up in Parliament saying "I told you all along that I'd been honest on this point. I've been entirely vindicated. But it's clear that there was a culture among staff where the rules were flouted, and I'm disgusted at that. I have sacked several of my No10 team."
Just watch them try to roll it out.
Everyone who applies their brain to this will know it is b*llocks.
But that's not what matters. Johnson is a new breed of politician. We've never had his like before. He has absolutely zero capacity for shame. All that matters to him is power. It doesn't matter to him if people know he's a lying bas**rd. What matters is whether they support him.
If this plan rolls out and he is still supported by a large enough number of voters, he might well survive. And then our democracy truly is off the edge of the cliff.
Step 1a is in place.
Gray is submitting a redacted report. Deputy Editor of Sky News says he's been informed that Gray will NOT be submitting an unredacted version for publication once the police investigation is over.
So, on police instruction, all the most sensitive parts of Gray's report will now never be published. It is 100% the choice of Cressida Dick what the public and Parliament get to see. That gives her a clear path to Step 4.
This stinks to high heaven. And they aren't even trying to hide what they are doing. Because, probably rightly, they think that not enough people care enough.
Tyke.
Because he got Brexit done. He was their man against the bas**rd foreigners and the Elite. He took back control.
Like I keep telling you, this isn't old style normal politics, where policies and reasoned arguments matter. It's a Culture War. If you don't get that, you'll never understand Johnson or his supporters in here or outside.
Thing is, everyone in their right mind knows that this partying inquest has blown over any form of reasonable proportion simply for political reasons, and it has been amplified for the simple reason that the opposition has absolutely nothing going for it and can only raise its own popularity by lowering the oppositions.
Put it this way, how many of you Labour lot would have condemned a Labour government so vehemently for doing the same thing?
Thing is, everyone in their right mind knows that this partying inquest has blown over any form of reasonable proportion simply for political reasons, and it has been amplified for the simple reason that the opposition has absolutely nothing going for it and can only raise its own popularity by lowering the oppositions.
Put it this way, how many of you Labour lot would have condemned a Labour government so vehemently for doing the same thing?
Thing is, everyone in their right mind knows that this partying inquest has blown over any form of reasonable proportion simply for political reasons, and it has been amplified for the simple reason that the opposition has absolutely nothing going for it and can only raise its own popularity by lowering the oppositions.
Put it this way, how many of you Labour lot would have condemned a Labour government so vehemently for doing the same thing?
My guess none, but watch them Come on here and say otherwise
Agree, but how many of them will be in their right mind?Thing is, everyone in their right mind knows that this partying inquest has blown over any form of reasonable proportion simply for political reasons, and it has been amplified for the simple reason that the opposition has absolutely nothing going for it and can only raise its own popularity by lowering the oppositions.
Put it this way, how many of you Labour lot would have condemned a Labour government so vehemently for doing the same thing?
My guess none, but watch them Come on here and say otherwise
I seem to have read somewhere that Her words were translated incorrectly during the bread shortage, rather than the alleged let them eat cake, it was let them eat brioche, a type of sweet bread. Just sayingAll this talk over a party in June 2020, when it was first reported in June of that year no one gave a shit, why now?
https://order-order.com/2022/01/28/burns-claims-boris-denies-birthday-cake/
Ever heard of Marie Antoinette?
Entitlement and arrogance in the face of real hardship. That's what's coming.
Well here we are in politics 2022.
The likes of BB and his clique are so closed off to the concept of normal behaviour in politics that they are certain, just certain that folk on the other side would accept without criticism a leader who:
1) Chose the side of the referendum campaign to support based purely on how it would suit his career.
2) Lied repeatedly in the referendum campaign that followed.
3) Voted against the Brexit deal in order to bring down the PM, replaced her then signed an near identical Brexit deal.
4) Illegally prorogues Parliament and lied to the Queen.
5) Lied about the deal he'd signed repeatedly during the Election campaign.
6) Vanished for a month after the Election to sort out his divorce while COVID got hold.
7) Returned making stupid boasts about shaking hands on COVID wards as we started on a wave that killed nearly 70,000 people in a couple of months.
8) Delayed action on the second lockdown, leading to maybe 40,000 avoidable deaths and a far longer lockdown with much greater economic damage when it finally did come.
9) Regularly held social events at work during all this, while the rest of us were sticking to the spirit and the letter of the law.
10) Lied about this repeatedly in Parliament when faced with what he'd done.
You do have to wonder about the soul of someone who not only cannot find it in them to mumble a word of criticism about that, but assumes that everyone else is as morally bankrupt as them, and wouldn't criticise someone closer to their political stance who acted like that. Must be a barren, parched landscape.
On the matter of class war or culture war, the answer is surely that it is both.
The Tories have always pursued policies that favour the wealthy.
In doing so, the gains that come to to those who have resources, be it property or other assets, are at the cost to those without resources.
That is class war.
The political strategy is to disguise it from those who are exploited to make it happen.
This is where culture wars come in....as a means to that end.
The marketing of regressive political policies is hidden (and justified) by use of cultural dog whistles. Blaming all sorts of social issues on immigration without evidence is a great example of this in action.
Twas ever thus, but the means to exploit these divisions has changed, with social media giving a booster platform....Q'anon anyone!
Christopher Chope an MP with integrity.
Thing is, everyone in their right mind knows that this partying inquest has blown over any form of reasonable proportion simply for political reasons, and it has been amplified for the simple reason that the opposition has absolutely nothing going for it and can only raise its own popularity by lowering the oppositions.
Put it this way, how many of you Labour lot would have condemned a Labour government so vehemently for doing the same thing?
This looks like it could be the cover up to end all cover ups.
The plan, apparently, is to publish all the parts of the Gray report that don't refer to the things that the Met is investigating.
So the redacted report will have no smoking gun.
Then if the Met investigate and report that there is nothing to justify them taking any action, the redacted parts of the Gray report can be shelved as irrelevant.
Is that realistic? Well the Electoral Commission gave the Met a file on illegal use of funds by the Leave side in the 2016 Ref. The Met sat on it for two years, while Johnson was elected, then summarily announced that there was no case to answer. To the best of my knowledge, they have never explained the basis of that decision. And attention moves on.
Here we go. Step 1 of the cover up.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-60166997
Step 2 will be Johnson crowing next week that he's released the report in full for all to see and as he said all along, there's nothing to see.
Step 3 will be the Met dragging out their investigation for weeks or months until everyone is bored or has forgotten that revulsion they felt when they first heard about Johnson's partying.
Step 4 will be Cressida Dick saying that while there may have been some contraventions of the letter of the law, there's nothing to warrant prosecutions.
Step 5 is Johnson standing up in Parliament saying "I told you all along that I'd been honest on this point. I've been entirely vindicated. But it's clear that there was a culture among staff where the rules were flouted, and I'm disgusted at that. I have sacked several of my No10 team."
Just watch them try to roll it out.
Everyone who applies their brain to this will know it is b*llocks.
But that's not what matters. Johnson is a new breed of politician. We've never had his like before. He has absolutely zero capacity for shame. All that matters to him is power. It doesn't matter to him if people know he's a lying bas**rd. What matters is whether they support him.
If this plan rolls out and he is still supported by a large enough number of voters, he might well survive. And then our democracy truly is off the edge of the cliff.
At the request of the police I have provided the material compiled in the course of
my investigation relevant to the gatherings that they are now investigating. I have
also been asked to retain all the other information collected in the course of this
work, which I have confirmed that I will do. I will therefore ensure the secure
storage and safekeeping of all the information gathered until such time as it may
be required further. I will not be circulating the information internally within
government, it has been provided in confidence to the Cabinet Office investigation
team and it is important that this confidence is maintained to protect the integrity of
the process.
But you’ll just get the usual bluster & blithering.
This ba***rd is bomb proof!!
Bojo hits back with the Jimmy saville accusation.https://www.reuters.com/article/factcheck-britain-savile-idUSL1N2RP200
I’ll get the popcorn.
Bojo hits back with the Jimmy saville accusation.https://www.reuters.com/article/factcheck-britain-savile-idUSL1N2RP200
I’ll get the popcorn.
Finest speech Starmer's made yet , absolutely nailed it .
Even the Tories knew he was right on the money , they had to sit and take it because Bunter can't be defended anymore or at least defended in a way that's credible .
At the bottom line, he is only bomb proof if enough voters don't care.
If voters refuse to back him, the Tory party will do away with him.
If voters don't refuse to back him, he'll be right in his judgement that he can lie every time he opens his mouth and it doesn't matter.
Here's the key part of the Gray report.
Paragraph 13.QuoteAt the request of the police I have provided the material compiled in the course of
my investigation relevant to the gatherings that they are now investigating. I have
also been asked to retain all the other information collected in the course of this
work, which I have confirmed that I will do. I will therefore ensure the secure
storage and safekeeping of all the information gathered until such time as it may
be required further. I will not be circulating the information internally within
government, it has been provided in confidence to the Cabinet Office investigation
team and it is important that this confidence is maintained to protect the integrity of
the process.
To understand this, you have to realise where the cover up now is.
Gray is saying that she has more information than in included in this report. But because Dick has effectively instructed her not to release it, that information is not in the public domain.
Here's the key thing.
If Dick decides that there will be no action taken against Johnson, there is no legal mechanisms whereby Gray on her own can release that information.
She can't pipe up and say "Here's the full report!" on her own initiative.
She can only submit a full and unredacted report if the Govt invite her to.
There is absolutely f**k all chance of Johnson ever doing that. He mumbled today "we'll see when the time comes what we can publish" when asked about that. Which basically means "f**k off."
What Gray is doing here is screaming out of the page. She's saying "More information exists. When Dick and Johnson take steps to ensure that doesn't see the light of day, you will KNOW how damning when. Why wouldn't they release it if it was harmless? When they do refuse to release it, don't let this drop. Hound the bas**rd every time he opens his mouth. Ask him every day why he is not releasing it."
Here's the key part of the Gray report.
Paragraph 13.QuoteAt the request of the police I have provided the material compiled in the course of
my investigation relevant to the gatherings that they are now investigating. I have
also been asked to retain all the other information collected in the course of this
work, which I have confirmed that I will do. I will therefore ensure the secure
storage and safekeeping of all the information gathered until such time as it may
be required further. I will not be circulating the information internally within
government, it has been provided in confidence to the Cabinet Office investigation
team and it is important that this confidence is maintained to protect the integrity of
the process.
To understand this, you have to realise where the cover up now is.
Gray is saying that she has more information than in included in this report. But because Dick has effectively instructed her not to release it, that information is not in the public domain.
Here's the key thing.
If Dick decides that there will be no action taken against Johnson, there is no legal mechanisms whereby Gray on her own can release that information.
She can't pipe up and say "Here's the full report!" on her own initiative.
She can only submit a full and unredacted report if the Govt invite her to.
There is absolutely f**k all chance of Johnson ever doing that. He mumbled today "we'll see when the time comes what we can publish" when asked about that. Which basically means "f**k off."
What Gray is doing here is screaming out of the page. She's saying "More information exists. When Dick and Johnson take steps to ensure that doesn't see the light of day, you will KNOW how damning when. Why wouldn't they release it if it was harmless? When they do refuse to release it, don't let this drop. Hound the bas**rd every time he opens his mouth. Ask him every day why he is not releasing it."
OK, things are developing quickly.
If Johnson was happy to have the full Gray Report published, he would have said so unequivocally in the House today. That would have sounded confident. Instead he mumbled about "seeing what could be published when the time comes".
No10 has now announced they will publish the full report after the Met investigation. Apparently Tory MPs have been threatening to force a no confidence vote now if they didn't get that promise.
He's winging it. He's lost control of the agenda now and he's looking at day-to-day survival. This development really feels like the net closing.
Tory MPs want him out now because they know he is electorally likely to be a liability. But they also know they need proof of just what a Kitson he's been. Otherwise those who move against him will be called traitors by the Johnson supporters. So they need to get the Gray evidence out in the open. Then they can strike. And he's just given in to that. Saved himself today but massively weakened himself down the line.
That's what happens when a career of lying finally catches up with you. Eventually, you run out of options.
His only hope now is that, in the time he's just won, something turns up that increases his popularity with voters.
Expect top of the head populist policies to be sprayed out like cow shit from a muck spreader.
Here's the key part of the Gray report.
Paragraph 13.QuoteAt the request of the police I have provided the material compiled in the course of
my investigation relevant to the gatherings that they are now investigating. I have
also been asked to retain all the other information collected in the course of this
work, which I have confirmed that I will do. I will therefore ensure the secure
storage and safekeeping of all the information gathered until such time as it may
be required further. I will not be circulating the information internally within
government, it has been provided in confidence to the Cabinet Office investigation
team and it is important that this confidence is maintained to protect the integrity of
the process.
To understand this, you have to realise where the cover up now is.
Gray is saying that she has more information than in included in this report. But because Dick has effectively instructed her not to release it, that information is not in the public domain.
Here's the key thing.
If Dick decides that there will be no action taken against Johnson, there is no legal mechanisms whereby Gray on her own can release that information.
She can't pipe up and say "Here's the full report!" on her own initiative.
She can only submit a full and unredacted report if the Govt invite her to.
There is absolutely f**k all chance of Johnson ever doing that. He mumbled today "we'll see when the time comes what we can publish" when asked about that. Which basically means "f**k off."
What Gray is doing here is screaming out of the page. She's saying "More information exists. When Dick and Johnson take steps to ensure that doesn't see the light of day, you will KNOW how damning when. Why wouldn't they release it if it was harmless? When they do refuse to release it, don't let this drop. Hound the bas**rd every time he opens his mouth. Ask him every day why he is not releasing it."
OK, things are developing quickly.
If Johnson was happy to have the full Gray Report published, he would have said so unequivocally in the House today. That would have sounded confident. Instead he mumbled about "seeing what could be published when the time comes".
No10 has now announced they will publish the full report after the Met investigation. Apparently Tory MPs have been threatening to force a no confidence vote now if they didn't get that promise.
He's winging it. He's lost control of the agenda now and he's looking at day-to-day survival. This development really feels like the net closing.
Tory MPs want him out now because they know he is electorally likely to be a liability. But they also know they need proof of just what a Kitson he's been. Otherwise those who move against him will be called traitors by the Johnson supporters. So they need to get the Gray evidence out in the open. Then they can strike. And he's just given in to that. Saved himself today but massively weakened himself down the line.
That's what happens when a career of lying finally catches up with you. Eventually, you run out of options.
His only hope now is that, in the time he's just won, something turns up that increases his popularity with voters.
Expect top of the head populist policies to be sprayed out like cow shit from a muck spreader.
Lol!It reminded me of Dennis Skinner the way he would not retract what he said to Boris
The Jimmy Saville retort from Bunter was desperate with Starmer still with his foot on his throat .
His last card played and one with no value given practically everybody whose had some kind of education knows the facts surrounding Starmer and the Saville case .
I've thought he might wriggle off the hook over the weekend but tonight I firmly believe he's toast and run out of road .
He did accept blame and was adamant he'd sort it out. Can you imagine receiving two hours of barracking from all and sundry and not losing control on the odd occasion?
Again he got it wrong. The tone was not to attack the opposition, it should be to accept some blame and be adamant you will sort it out.
But to say you'll do it then go on the attack is weak and desperate.
He did accept blame and was adamant he'd sort it out. Can you imagine receiving two hours of barracking from all and sundry and not losing control on the odd occasion?
My older brother voted Tory for the first time at the last election, simply because he was seduced by the Johnson rhetoric and charm.
We nearly fell out as I called him a fool, telling him that Johnson was a liar and a charlatan who couldn't lay straight in in bed.
Well he rang me tonight and apologised for his mistake, which is massive for him as he's always known better than me in his opinion.
Who knows, BB might be next.
TT is the kind of person who really puts me off the Labour partyThere are a few people on this forum who I simply couldn't be on the same side of. I'd rather support L**ds.
TT is the kind of person who really puts me off the Labour partyGood
TT is the kind of person who really puts me off the Labour partyGood
No surprise to see the yapping hound feels the same.
TT is the kind of person who really puts me off the Labour partyGood
No surprise to see the yapping hound feels the same.
Yes he does.
It isn’t hard to see why.
My older brother voted Tory for the first time at the last election, simply because he was seduced by the Johnson rhetoric and charm.
We nearly fell out as I called him a fool, telling him that Johnson was a liar and a charlatan who couldn't lay straight in in bed.
Well he rang me tonight and apologised for his mistake, which is massive for him as he's always known better than me in his opinion.
Who knows, BB might be next.
Ed Balls talking to Ian Blackford on GMB this morning:
“The House of Commons has rules. You were saying the Prime Minister should not break the rule of misleading the House of Commons.
“At the same time, you were undermining the rules of the House of Commons because you know full well the Speaker has to enforce the rules that you can’t call people a liar.
“It seems a bit disingenuous to me for you to claim you didn’t know what you were doing, you did that to get thrown out.”
Look, I among many others knew what Johnson was like and predicted it at the time and told my brother then.My older brother voted Tory for the first time at the last election, simply because he was seduced by the Johnson rhetoric and charm.
We nearly fell out as I called him a fool, telling him that Johnson was a liar and a charlatan who couldn't lay straight in in bed.
Well he rang me tonight and apologised for his mistake, which is massive for him as he's always known better than me in his opinion.
Who knows, BB might be next.
Maybe he just felt there was no point in having rational debate with you because you believe that anyone who doesn’t think like you is a fool.
Look, I among many others knew what Johnson was like and predicted it at the time and told my brother then.My older brother voted Tory for the first time at the last election, simply because he was seduced by the Johnson rhetoric and charm.
We nearly fell out as I called him a fool, telling him that Johnson was a liar and a charlatan who couldn't lay straight in in bed.
Well he rang me tonight and apologised for his mistake, which is massive for him as he's always known better than me in his opinion.
Who knows, BB might be next.
Maybe he just felt there was no point in having rational debate with you because you believe that anyone who doesn’t think like you is a fool.
Ive been wrong and foolish on many occasions but on this occasion he was and I told him so.
Doesn't mean him, or you for that matter, are serial fools.
Look, I among many others knew what Johnson was like and predicted it at the time and told my brother then.My older brother voted Tory for the first time at the last election, simply because he was seduced by the Johnson rhetoric and charm.
We nearly fell out as I called him a fool, telling him that Johnson was a liar and a charlatan who couldn't lay straight in in bed.
Well he rang me tonight and apologised for his mistake, which is massive for him as he's always known better than me in his opinion.
Who knows, BB might be next.
Maybe he just felt there was no point in having rational debate with you because you believe that anyone who doesn’t think like you is a fool.
Ive been wrong and foolish on many occasions but on this occasion he was and I told him so.
Doesn't mean him, or you for that matter, are serial fools.
Here's a serious problem.
When we try to discuss things in here, the interaction frequently goes down a rabbit hole of which this is a perfect example.
Examples are given of where people got specific calls wrong (believing Brexit would be economically beneficial, believing Johnson would be an honest, decent PM). Then that gets extrapolated by people who don't like that argument into somehow meaning that the person making it thinks everything the other side believes is stupid or knowingly held in bad faith.
It destroys grown up discussion, because it immediately puts people in opposing trenches where they refuse to listen to anything the other side puts forward.
Look, I among many others knew what Johnson was like and predicted it at the time and told my brother then.My older brother voted Tory for the first time at the last election, simply because he was seduced by the Johnson rhetoric and charm.
We nearly fell out as I called him a fool, telling him that Johnson was a liar and a charlatan who couldn't lay straight in in bed.
Well he rang me tonight and apologised for his mistake, which is massive for him as he's always known better than me in his opinion.
Who knows, BB might be next.
Maybe he just felt there was no point in having rational debate with you because you believe that anyone who doesn’t think like you is a fool.
Ive been wrong and foolish on many occasions but on this occasion he was and I told him so.
Doesn't mean him, or you for that matter, are serial fools.
Johnson has had the most difficult job as PM in history. He hasn't had the chance to show his true effectiveness yet.Look, I among many others knew what Johnson was like and predicted it at the time and told my brother then.My older brother voted Tory for the first time at the last election, simply because he was seduced by the Johnson rhetoric and charm.
We nearly fell out as I called him a fool, telling him that Johnson was a liar and a charlatan who couldn't lay straight in in bed.
Well he rang me tonight and apologised for his mistake, which is massive for him as he's always known better than me in his opinion.
Who knows, BB might be next.
Maybe he just felt there was no point in having rational debate with you because you believe that anyone who doesn’t think like you is a fool.
Ive been wrong and foolish on many occasions but on this occasion he was and I told him so.
Doesn't mean him, or you for that matter, are serial fools.
Here's a serious problem.
When we try to discuss things in here, the interaction frequently goes down a rabbit hole of which this is a perfect example.
Examples are given of where people got specific calls wrong (believing Brexit would be economically beneficial, believing Johnson would be an honest, decent PM). Then that gets extrapolated by people who don't like that argument into somehow meaning that the person making it thinks everything the other side believes is stupid or knowingly held in bad faith.
It destroys grown up discussion, because it immediately puts people in opposing trenches where they refuse to listen to anything the other side puts forward.
Here we go again.Look, I among many others knew what Johnson was like and predicted it at the time and told my brother then.My older brother voted Tory for the first time at the last election, simply because he was seduced by the Johnson rhetoric and charm.
We nearly fell out as I called him a fool, telling him that Johnson was a liar and a charlatan who couldn't lay straight in in bed.
Well he rang me tonight and apologised for his mistake, which is massive for him as he's always known better than me in his opinion.
Who knows, BB might be next.
Maybe he just felt there was no point in having rational debate with you because you believe that anyone who doesn’t think like you is a fool.
Ive been wrong and foolish on many occasions but on this occasion he was and I told him so.
Doesn't mean him, or you for that matter, are serial fools.
Trying to disregard Billy’s preconceived nonsense, Tommy, my point is it is very difficult to debate anything regarding Johnson or this Government with you.
I never inferred that you thought your brother (or me, for that matter) was a serial fool. But with Johnson, you appear to think there is no debate to be had.
That’s wrong, but unfortunately, it’s another example of the ‘with me or agin me’ state of discussion we are trapped in at the moment.
Here we go again.Look, I among many others knew what Johnson was like and predicted it at the time and told my brother then.My older brother voted Tory for the first time at the last election, simply because he was seduced by the Johnson rhetoric and charm.
We nearly fell out as I called him a fool, telling him that Johnson was a liar and a charlatan who couldn't lay straight in in bed.
Well he rang me tonight and apologised for his mistake, which is massive for him as he's always known better than me in his opinion.
Who knows, BB might be next.
Maybe he just felt there was no point in having rational debate with you because you believe that anyone who doesn’t think like you is a fool.
Ive been wrong and foolish on many occasions but on this occasion he was and I told him so.
Doesn't mean him, or you for that matter, are serial fools.
Trying to disregard Billy’s preconceived nonsense, Tommy, my point is it is very difficult to debate anything regarding Johnson or this Government with you.
I never inferred that you thought your brother (or me, for that matter) was a serial fool. But with Johnson, you appear to think there is no debate to be had.
That’s wrong, but unfortunately, it’s another example of the ‘with me or agin me’ state of discussion we are trapped in at the moment.
You said that i believe that anyone who doesn't think like me is a fool.
Which kind of infers that on any subject anyone who disagrees with me is wrong. This is not so as has been proved to me on many occasions throughout my life.
By the way BST is spot on as usual.
Here we go again.Look, I among many others knew what Johnson was like and predicted it at the time and told my brother then.My older brother voted Tory for the first time at the last election, simply because he was seduced by the Johnson rhetoric and charm.
We nearly fell out as I called him a fool, telling him that Johnson was a liar and a charlatan who couldn't lay straight in in bed.
Well he rang me tonight and apologised for his mistake, which is massive for him as he's always known better than me in his opinion.
Who knows, BB might be next.
Maybe he just felt there was no point in having rational debate with you because you believe that anyone who doesn’t think like you is a fool.
Ive been wrong and foolish on many occasions but on this occasion he was and I told him so.
Doesn't mean him, or you for that matter, are serial fools.
Trying to disregard Billy’s preconceived nonsense, Tommy, my point is it is very difficult to debate anything regarding Johnson or this Government with you.
I never inferred that you thought your brother (or me, for that matter) was a serial fool. But with Johnson, you appear to think there is no debate to be had.
That’s wrong, but unfortunately, it’s another example of the ‘with me or agin me’ state of discussion we are trapped in at the moment.
You said that i believe that anyone who doesn't think like me is a fool.
Which kind of infers that on any subject anyone who disagrees with me is wrong. This is not so as has been proved to me on many occasions throughout my life.
By the way BST is spot on as usual.
Belton.
You are right that I will hear nothing good about Johnson and this Government.
They keep going on about how they've rolled out the most successful vaccine project, when blow me, I thought it was the scientists and the NHS who'd done all the work.
Brexit is a disaster and as time goes by we'll all recognise that.
Just think about it, what's good about getting trade deals with Australia and NZ, when we had better deals with no red tape with countries on our doorstep.
Doesn't make any sense.
Still. we've taken back control and have £350m going into the NHS every week
Belton.
What you wrote is there in black and white. There was no 'perhaps'
I ain't going down this road with you again.
Have a good day.
I'm off to do some unpaid work for the village now.
TT is the kind of person who really puts me off the Labour partyGood
No surprise to see the yapping hound feels the same.
Yes he does.
It isn’t hard to see why.
Fair enough.
I have no regard at all for you either, whereas I respect BB for his forthrightness.
BB.
1) On Brexit, the Bank of England tells us that we have lost £727 per second over the past 5 years de to the Brexit vote. You are perfectly at liberty to explain how we a) stop that loss and b) make up the difference. Please point me to some specific policies that you reckon can turn that around.
2) On Johnson, I was in this instance talking about his honesty and decency. I assume, since you've never once said anything to the contrary, that you are happy with him on those issues, but in the wider population, there's a growing realisation that they've been had by a pathological liar, and that having a pathological liar in charge is a very bad thing. That doesn't mean I think those people are incapable of getting any decision right. Whereas you, by your own words, are so against the people you see on the other side of the debate that you'd rather be wrong and support a liar than admit they might have a point.
It doesn't have to be one or the other though. It's fine to think that Boris is a Kitson but also think that the opposition isn't up to much either. A bit like the football tonight, I'm not wholely convinced that Rovers are good enough to get the job done, but it doesn't mean I'm buying a ticket in the away end.
Back on the topic of truth, standards and decency in politics.What’s the difference between that and ‘Scumgate’?
Raab was wheeled out on R4 this morning to protect Big Dog.
He was asked if he would dare repeat Johnson's disgusting dig that Starmer had protected Jimmy Savile. Bearing in mind that you can't be prosecuted for slander for what you say in the House, but you can if you repeat it outside.
Raab declined.
The interviewer asked him if he would therefore criticise Johnson for saying it in Parliament.
Can you guess how he replied?
He said accusations like that were (and I quote) "part of the cut and thrust of Parliamentary debate."
Just read that again.
The Deputy PM things wrongly accusing your opponent of protecting a serial paedophile is fair game.
Imagine senior people in the Thatcher or Major or even Cameron Govts acting like this? What the f**king hell has happened to standards? Truth? Common f**king decency?
Nye Bevan was nearly right all those years ago. SOME Tories truly are lower than vermin.
Back on the topic of truth, standards and decency in politics.What’s the difference between that and ‘Scumgate’?
Raab was wheeled out on R4 this morning to protect Big Dog.
He was asked if he would dare repeat Johnson's disgusting dig that Starmer had protected Jimmy Savile. Bearing in mind that you can't be prosecuted for slander for what you say in the House, but you can if you repeat it outside.
Raab declined.
The interviewer asked him if he would therefore criticise Johnson for saying it in Parliament.
Can you guess how he replied?
He said accusations like that were (and I quote) "part of the cut and thrust of Parliamentary debate."
Just read that again.
The Deputy PM things wrongly accusing your opponent of protecting a serial paedophile is fair game.
Imagine senior people in the Thatcher or Major or even Cameron Govts acting like this? What the f**king hell has happened to standards? Truth? Common f**king decency?
Nye Bevan was nearly right all those years ago. SOME Tories truly are lower than vermin.
Hound.
Find evidence of me mocking anyone. I hardly ever post on here. Disagree strongly yes.
I didn't fall out with my brother, only nearly.
I feel passionately about Johnson being exposed for what he is, and always has been.
On other subjects I'm not too bothered either way.
And stop calling BST my leader.
Can't help you're usual bit of sh*t stirring can you?
TT is the kind of person who really puts me off the Labour partyGood
No surprise to see the yapping hound feels the same.
Back on the topic of truth, standards and decency in politics.What’s the difference between that and ‘Scumgate’?
Raab was wheeled out on R4 this morning to protect Big Dog.
He was asked if he would dare repeat Johnson's disgusting dig that Starmer had protected Jimmy Savile. Bearing in mind that you can't be prosecuted for slander for what you say in the House, but you can if you repeat it outside.
Raab declined.
The interviewer asked him if he would therefore criticise Johnson for saying it in Parliament.
Can you guess how he replied?
He said accusations like that were (and I quote) "part of the cut and thrust of Parliamentary debate."
Just read that again.
The Deputy PM things wrongly accusing your opponent of protecting a serial paedophile is fair game.
Imagine senior people in the Thatcher or Major or even Cameron Govts acting like this? What the f**king hell has happened to standards? Truth? Common f**king decency?
Nye Bevan was nearly right all those years ago. SOME Tories truly are lower than vermin.
As I explained to Filo, Wilts, my point was about her fellow party members’ responses when asked by the media, which was the point of Billy’s post.Back on the topic of truth, standards and decency in politics.What’s the difference between that and ‘Scumgate’?
Raab was wheeled out on R4 this morning to protect Big Dog.
He was asked if he would dare repeat Johnson's disgusting dig that Starmer had protected Jimmy Savile. Bearing in mind that you can't be prosecuted for slander for what you say in the House, but you can if you repeat it outside.
Raab declined.
The interviewer asked him if he would therefore criticise Johnson for saying it in Parliament.
Can you guess how he replied?
He said accusations like that were (and I quote) "part of the cut and thrust of Parliamentary debate."
Just read that again.
The Deputy PM things wrongly accusing your opponent of protecting a serial paedophile is fair game.
Imagine senior people in the Thatcher or Major or even Cameron Govts acting like this? What the f**king hell has happened to standards? Truth? Common f**king decency?
Nye Bevan was nearly right all those years ago. SOME Tories truly are lower than vermin.
One of them made a comment in public and took full responsibilty and any consequences that came from it.
The other refused to either repeat or disclaim a known far-right lie in public, despite several promtings.
And it will get worse - history tells us that.
Johnson has had the most difficult job as PM in history. He hasn't had the chance to show his true effectiveness yet.Look, I among many others knew what Johnson was like and predicted it at the time and told my brother then.My older brother voted Tory for the first time at the last election, simply because he was seduced by the Johnson rhetoric and charm.
We nearly fell out as I called him a fool, telling him that Johnson was a liar and a charlatan who couldn't lay straight in in bed.
Well he rang me tonight and apologised for his mistake, which is massive for him as he's always known better than me in his opinion.
Who knows, BB might be next.
Maybe he just felt there was no point in having rational debate with you because you believe that anyone who doesn’t think like you is a fool.
Ive been wrong and foolish on many occasions but on this occasion he was and I told him so.
Doesn't mean him, or you for that matter, are serial fools.
Here's a serious problem.
When we try to discuss things in here, the interaction frequently goes down a rabbit hole of which this is a perfect example.
Examples are given of where people got specific calls wrong (believing Brexit would be economically beneficial, believing Johnson would be an honest, decent PM). Then that gets extrapolated by people who don't like that argument into somehow meaning that the person making it thinks everything the other side believes is stupid or knowingly held in bad faith.
It destroys grown up discussion, because it immediately puts people in opposing trenches where they refuse to listen to anything the other side puts forward.
How do we know yet that Brexit won't be economically beneficial to us?
You see, No, in fact, you don't see, there are so many things you use as ammunition for your attacks that are so misleading, it's hard to know where to begin.
Maybe sometimes you'd be better just firing offensive insults and skipping the bullshit.
As I explained to Filo, Wilts, my point was about her fellow party members’ responses when asked by the media, which was the point of Billy’s post.Back on the topic of truth, standards and decency in politics.What’s the difference between that and ‘Scumgate’?
Raab was wheeled out on R4 this morning to protect Big Dog.
He was asked if he would dare repeat Johnson's disgusting dig that Starmer had protected Jimmy Savile. Bearing in mind that you can't be prosecuted for slander for what you say in the House, but you can if you repeat it outside.
Raab declined.
The interviewer asked him if he would therefore criticise Johnson for saying it in Parliament.
Can you guess how he replied?
He said accusations like that were (and I quote) "part of the cut and thrust of Parliamentary debate."
Just read that again.
The Deputy PM things wrongly accusing your opponent of protecting a serial paedophile is fair game.
Imagine senior people in the Thatcher or Major or even Cameron Govts acting like this? What the f**king hell has happened to standards? Truth? Common f**king decency?
Nye Bevan was nearly right all those years ago. SOME Tories truly are lower than vermin.
One of them made a comment in public and took full responsibilty and any consequences that came from it.
The other refused to either repeat or disclaim a known far-right lie in public, despite several promtings.
And it will get worse - history tells us that.
For the record, I agree with what Billy said about Raab, but I felt the hypocrisy needed highlighting.
Back on the topic of truth, standards and decency in politics.What’s the difference between that and ‘Scumgate’?
Raab was wheeled out on R4 this morning to protect Big Dog.
He was asked if he would dare repeat Johnson's disgusting dig that Starmer had protected Jimmy Savile. Bearing in mind that you can't be prosecuted for slander for what you say in the House, but you can if you repeat it outside.
Raab declined.
The interviewer asked him if he would therefore criticise Johnson for saying it in Parliament.
Can you guess how he replied?
He said accusations like that were (and I quote) "part of the cut and thrust of Parliamentary debate."
Just read that again.
The Deputy PM things wrongly accusing your opponent of protecting a serial paedophile is fair game.
Imagine senior people in the Thatcher or Major or even Cameron Govts acting like this? What the f**king hell has happened to standards? Truth? Common f**king decency?
Nye Bevan was nearly right all those years ago. SOME Tories truly are lower than vermin.
Rayner has said it outside of the House, Raab daren’t repeat Johnsons words outside of the House
Don’t hazard guesses, Billy. You just make yourself look silly.Back on the topic of truth, standards and decency in politics.What’s the difference between that and ‘Scumgate’?
Raab was wheeled out on R4 this morning to protect Big Dog.
He was asked if he would dare repeat Johnson's disgusting dig that Starmer had protected Jimmy Savile. Bearing in mind that you can't be prosecuted for slander for what you say in the House, but you can if you repeat it outside.
Raab declined.
The interviewer asked him if he would therefore criticise Johnson for saying it in Parliament.
Can you guess how he replied?
He said accusations like that were (and I quote) "part of the cut and thrust of Parliamentary debate."
Just read that again.
The Deputy PM things wrongly accusing your opponent of protecting a serial paedophile is fair game.
Imagine senior people in the Thatcher or Major or even Cameron Govts acting like this? What the f**king hell has happened to standards? Truth? Common f**king decency?
Nye Bevan was nearly right all those years ago. SOME Tories truly are lower than vermin.
Rayner has said it outside of the House, Raab daren’t repeat Johnsons words outside of the House
Filo
I'd hazard a guess that Belton is having a pop at my choice of phrase and comparing that to what Rayner said.
For the record, I stand by what I said. For senior politicians to make false accusations that another politician knowingly chose to protect a paedophile, and for that to be passed off as "Parliamentary cut and thrust" is utterly disgusting and it needs calling out as such.
EDIT. Just seen Belton's response to Wilts, so hands up - I misread what he was saying.
So the comparison is Rayner vs Johnson and the reaction of colleagues.
1) Rayner was calling "scum" comment was aimed at a party that elected a man who had a history of unretracted racist statements to his name, and had publicly called gay men "tank top wearing bum boys". Rayner offered to retract her statement if Johnson did.
2) I personally thought she was stupid to use such an insult, and absolutely stupid to apply it to all Tories, but to be frank, is difficult to argue that it doesn't apply to Johnson's career long behaviour.
3) Starmer didn't defend Rayner. he publicly rebuked her and smacked her down over the next few weeks.
4) Comparing any of the above to the PM chucking out a revolting untrue slur under Parliamentary Privilege, then having his deputy condone it is what you do when you are determined to take bothsidesism to the edge of credulity.
Hound.
Find evidence of me mocking anyone. I hardly ever post on here. Disagree strongly yes.
I didn't fall out with my brother, only nearly.
I feel passionately about Johnson being exposed for what he is, and always has been.
On other subjects I'm not too bothered either way.
And stop calling BST my leader.
Can't help you're usual bit of sh*t stirring can you?
TT, speaking of shit stirring, it was you who brought me into the conversation with your comment below.
You did that with the intention of baiting, which sadly I took this time, so don’t preach on here about shit stirring when you do the exact same thing.
I see that you picked up a like from a troll too.TT is the kind of person who really puts me off the Labour partyGood
No surprise to see the yapping hound feels the same.
Hound.
Find evidence of me mocking anyone. I hardly ever post on here. Disagree strongly yes.
I didn't fall out with my brother, only nearly.
I feel passionately about Johnson being exposed for what he is, and always has been.
On other subjects I'm not too bothered either way.
And stop calling BST my leader.
Can't help you're usual bit of sh*t stirring can you?
TT, speaking of shit stirring, it was you who brought me into the conversation with your comment below.
You did that with the intention of baiting, which sadly I took this time, so don’t preach on here about shit stirring when you do the exact same thing.
I see that you picked up a like from a troll too.TT is the kind of person who really puts me off the Labour partyGood
No surprise to see the yapping hound feels the same.
I wouldn't have mentioned you at all if you hadn't liked Ldr's post.
I had no intention to bait you.
Couldn't care less what you post.
So when the most unoriginal, boring trolling poster likes a post that disparages me I should not respond eh?
And that's why I called you the yapping hound. You run along at the side of others egging them on.
Nothing constructive to say for yourself.
And that's why I called you the yapping hound. You run along at the side of others egging them on.
Nothing constructive to say for yourself.
Still picking up the stainy troll.
And that's why I called you the yapping hound. You run along at the side of others egging them on.
Nothing constructive to say for yourself.
Still picking up the stainy troll.
Knew I’d get the bite, but that aside you done this before with me, the difference is you cry like a baby when you’re pulled up about it, and TT is correct, you’re like the little kid running with the big boys egging them on, nothing else to say, just keep chipping in, it’s pathetic!
Johnson has had the most difficult job as PM in history. He hasn't had the chance to show his true effectiveness yet.Look, I among many others knew what Johnson was like and predicted it at the time and told my brother then.My older brother voted Tory for the first time at the last election, simply because he was seduced by the Johnson rhetoric and charm.
We nearly fell out as I called him a fool, telling him that Johnson was a liar and a charlatan who couldn't lay straight in in bed.
Well he rang me tonight and apologised for his mistake, which is massive for him as he's always known better than me in his opinion.
Who knows, BB might be next.
Maybe he just felt there was no point in having rational debate with you because you believe that anyone who doesn’t think like you is a fool.
Ive been wrong and foolish on many occasions but on this occasion he was and I told him so.
Doesn't mean him, or you for that matter, are serial fools.
Here's a serious problem.
When we try to discuss things in here, the interaction frequently goes down a rabbit hole of which this is a perfect example.
Examples are given of where people got specific calls wrong (believing Brexit would be economically beneficial, believing Johnson would be an honest, decent PM). Then that gets extrapolated by people who don't like that argument into somehow meaning that the person making it thinks everything the other side believes is stupid or knowingly held in bad faith.
It destroys grown up discussion, because it immediately puts people in opposing trenches where they refuse to listen to anything the other side puts forward.
How do we know yet that Brexit won't be economically beneficial to us?
You see, No, in fact, you don't see, there are so many things you use as ammunition for your attacks that are so misleading, it's hard to know where to begin.
Maybe sometimes you'd be better just firing offensive insults and skipping the bullshit.
Rubbish. Four of them fought World War's in the last century, one of them facing serious threat of invasion with few allies. Blair faced the breakdown of the country's banks and everyone losing their money, Wilson and Heath, oil crises, Major and Thatcher, massive unemployment and home financial crises.
How many of them would have skipped COBRA meetings to write a book? Ignored WHO advice to lockdown and introduce testing?
He has faced exactly the same problems as every other leader in the world at this time, with arguably greater resources than most of them. He is up there with Trump and Bolsanaro in his response, ignoring the public and looking after his cronies.
He is a totally out of his depth liar. Churchill and Thatcher will be looking down in shame.
Future PM material?
''Johnson has nothing to apologise for over Savile comments, says Gove
Minister defends PM after remarks that Keir Starmer failed to prosecute broadcaster while head of CPS''
54 or around that number I think
What would happen then though ?
A vote of confidence in Johnson .... but would it simply be passed because on top of the 54 MPs submitting letters another 126 [ish] would have to join them to force a Leadership contest ?
OR do loads of them willingly join the anti Johnson gang. They might be lying low now unwilling to rock the boat and look traitors but they might get "brave" if they get chance
Personally I have no idea but just getting to 54 Letters wouldnt mean he was gone
He cant run for Leader again in short term - maybe never
One of the most important aides in No10, Munir Mirza, has resigned in protest at Johnson's shit-slinging over the Savile case.Do you really expect everyone ‘on here’ to type out their criticism of anything you mention, otherwise it will be assumed they think the opposite?
https://www.spectator.co.uk/article/exclusive-boris-s-policy-chief-quits-over-jimmy-savile-slur
Telling that there are still people in here who cannot find it in themselves to criticise that disgusting bit of gutter politics.
One of Johnson's closest advisors, Munira Mirza, has resigned following Johnson's reprehensible comments about the Jimmy Savile case. Her letter of resignation is damning also.
The tide is certainly turning against Johnson. I suspect a few more letters will be making their way to the chair of the 1922 Committee over the next couple of days.
One of the most important aides in No10, Munir Mirza, has resigned in protest at Johnson's shit-slinging over the Savile case.Do you really expect everyone ‘on here’ to type out their criticism of anything you mention, otherwise it will be assumed they think the opposite?
https://www.spectator.co.uk/article/exclusive-boris-s-policy-chief-quits-over-jimmy-savile-slur
Telling that there are still people in here who cannot find it in themselves to criticise that disgusting bit of gutter politics.
Do you realise just how many people ‘on here’ have not typed their criticism of that statement, regardless of their views?
Do you really believe that anyone who hasn’t criticised believes Johnson was right to say what he said?
Or was this just another attempt to play the WUM to one or two posters, probably just one?
I know which one my money’s on.
Hard to see him surviving this.
And then get his supporters to storm parliament and start a civil war.Hard to see him surviving this.
We keep saying this, but he has no shame, I’m sure if he’s kicked out he’ll refuse to leave Downing street
And then get his supporters to storm parliament and start a civil war.Hard to see him surviving this.
We keep saying this, but he has no shame, I’m sure if he’s kicked out he’ll refuse to leave Downing street
''Four senior aides to Boris Johnson resign from No 10''Now “..the bodies pile high” Boris, pile high on top of you.
An avalanche
Get out and take the blame with you
The Telegraphs top headline tonight is... The party is over, it's time to resign.
It goes without saying he won't, in fact he's planning on remaining in post until 2030. The Tory party need to kick him out now before he can do much more damage.
What would happen then though ?
A vote of confidence in Johnson .... but would it simply be passed because on top of the 54 MPs submitting letters another 126 [ish] would have to join them to force a Leadership contest ?
OR do loads of them willingly join the anti Johnson gang. They might be lying low now unwilling to rock the boat and look traitors but they might get "brave" if they get chance
Personally I have no idea but just getting to 54 Letters wouldnt mean he was gone
He cant run for Leader again in short term - maybe never
If 54 submit their letters then it invokes an overall vote amongst the tories.
If he wins this he is secure for another year.
If he doesn’t, it goes to a leadership bun fight.
What would happen then though ?
A vote of confidence in Johnson .... but would it simply be passed because on top of the 54 MPs submitting letters another 126 [ish] would have to join them to force a Leadership contest ?
OR do loads of them willingly join the anti Johnson gang. They might be lying low now unwilling to rock the boat and look traitors but they might get "brave" if they get chance
Personally I have no idea but just getting to 54 Letters wouldnt mean he was gone
He cant run for Leader again in short term - maybe never
If 54 submit their letters then it invokes an overall vote amongst the tories.
If he wins this he is secure for another year.
If he doesn’t, it goes to a leadership bun fight.
Hi NR - yes I was really asking what people thought if the 54 letters went in
Would they be the only dissenters and get nowhere near the 50pc they needed for Voc
Or
Would they having seen the opportunity to pile on to force a voc ?
What would happen then though ?
A vote of confidence in Johnson .... but would it simply be passed because on top of the 54 MPs submitting letters another 126 [ish] would have to join them to force a Leadership contest ?
OR do loads of them willingly join the anti Johnson gang. They might be lying low now unwilling to rock the boat and look traitors but they might get "brave" if they get chance
Personally I have no idea but just getting to 54 Letters wouldnt mean he was gone
He cant run for Leader again in short term - maybe never
If 54 submit their letters then it invokes an overall vote amongst the tories.
If he wins this he is secure for another year.
If he doesn’t, it goes to a leadership bun fight.
Hi NR - yes I was really asking what people thought if the 54 letters went in
Would they be the only dissenters and get nowhere near the 50pc they needed for Voc
Or
Would they having seen the opportunity to pile on to force a voc ?
If the 54 threshold is met, I reckon it will open the floodgates. Create an environment where other Tory MPs feel safer to tread.
What would happen then though ?
A vote of confidence in Johnson .... but would it simply be passed because on top of the 54 MPs submitting letters another 126 [ish] would have to join them to force a Leadership contest ?
OR do loads of them willingly join the anti Johnson gang. They might be lying low now unwilling to rock the boat and look traitors but they might get "brave" if they get chance
Personally I have no idea but just getting to 54 Letters wouldnt mean he was gone
He cant run for Leader again in short term - maybe never
If 54 submit their letters then it invokes an overall vote amongst the tories.
If he wins this he is secure for another year.
If he doesn’t, it goes to a leadership bun fight.
Hi NR - yes I was really asking what people thought if the 54 letters went in
Would they be the only dissenters and get nowhere near the 50pc they needed for Voc
Or
Would they having seen the opportunity to pile on to force a voc ?
If the 54 threshold is met, I reckon it will open the floodgates. Create an environment where other Tory MPs feel safer to tread.
Did anyone notice that serial failure Lynton Crosby has been re-appointed by Boris?
''Boris Johnson still has control of Downing Street after a string of close aides quit their jobs, his official spokesman has insisted.
Mr Johnson quoted The Lion King as he attempted to rally remaining staff, telling them "change is good"''
???????????
If you are going to hold a birthday party when other people are not allowed to go to a relatives funeral - probably best not to take your official photographer along...
EXCL: Police have a photo of Boris Johnson holding a can of a beer at his lockdown birthday party in June 2020 - taken by his taxpayer funded official photographe
https://twitter.com/PippaCrerar/status/1489696594576486405
He was holding it for a friend ,not his of courseIf you are going to hold a birthday party when other people are not allowed to go to a relatives funeral - probably best not to take your official photographer along...
EXCL: Police have a photo of Boris Johnson holding a can of a beer at his lockdown birthday party in June 2020 - taken by his taxpayer funded official photographe
https://twitter.com/PippaCrerar/status/1489696594576486405
He didn’t realise he was a photographer
No one told him
Meanwhile.
https://mobile.twitter.com/nytopinion/status/1489566060328198148
He was holding it for a friend ,not his of courseIf you are going to hold a birthday party when other people are not allowed to go to a relatives funeral - probably best not to take your official photographer along...
EXCL: Police have a photo of Boris Johnson holding a can of a beer at his lockdown birthday party in June 2020 - taken by his taxpayer funded official photographe
https://twitter.com/PippaCrerar/status/1489696594576486405
He didn’t realise he was a photographer
No one told him
Did anyone notice that serial failure Lynton Crosby has been re-appointed by Boris?
I will.
“Mr Speaker, while Captain Hindsight blathers on about things, things, things the British people no longer listen to…I..we..this government has been responsible for a 14% rise, a 14% rise..& yes, my learned friend may well shake his head, may well shake his head Mr Speaker, but he & his party….he can laugh, he can laugh. His party….let me shuffle my papers Mr Speaker..I have it here..here it is Mr Speaker, this note was left by his outgoing Labour government Mr Speaker, when they..when they were thrown out of office & it reads Mr Speaker….”The coke has all gone”……no..no…sorry, erm forgive me, forgive me..it’s here somewhere….are yes…here it is Mr Speaker, “We’ve spent all the money!” All the money Mr Speaker..& so I ask you, he may shake his head Mr Speaker, I ask you….if all the money was spent, how then could I…or indeed we…us….My Right Honourable Friend’s have afforded a party!?”.
Richi was next to him holding a soft drink ,FFS did not know we could all have had a party if it was soft drinks only ,who in their right mind invites a photographer to party in lockdown
Someone should point out to Bunter and Mogg that it was Heath who gave Saville an OBE and it was under Thatcher that he received his knighthood .“Jimmy did a great deal of good as well as wrong. In anybody’s life, you must look at both sides of the ledger”.
Thatcher actually pushed for it despite advisors at the time telling her there were strong rumours surrounding his character .
Looks like Bozo will be staying put. After everything he's done and overseen he is still backed by members of his own parliament and a lot of the general public. He should have been long gone by now but he isn't. Just sums up the lack of integrity that many people and politicians have and if they have it, they are also prepared to accept it from others and put up with it.
Looks like Bozo will be staying put. After everything he's done and overseen he is still backed by members of his own parliament and a lot of the general public. He should have been long gone by now but he isn't. Just sums up the lack of integrity that many people and politicians have and if they have it, they are also prepared to accept it from others and put up with it.
Looks like Bozo will be staying put. After everything he's done and overseen he is still backed by members of his own parliament and a lot of the general public. He should have been long gone by now but he isn't. Just sums up the lack of integrity that many people and politicians have and if they have it, they are also prepared to accept it from others and put up with it.
I think you might be confusing lack of integrity with loyalty.
Looks like Bozo will be staying put. After everything he's done and overseen he is still backed by members of his own parliament and a lot of the general public. He should have been long gone by now but he isn't. Just sums up the lack of integrity that many people and politicians have and if they have it, they are also prepared to accept it from others and put up with it.
I think you might be confusing lack of integrity with loyalty.
That may be quite clear to you, but it obviously isn't to those who are loyal to him.Looks like Bozo will be staying put. After everything he's done and overseen he is still backed by members of his own parliament and a lot of the general public. He should have been long gone by now but he isn't. Just sums up the lack of integrity that many people and politicians have and if they have it, they are also prepared to accept it from others and put up with it.
I think you might be confusing lack of integrity with loyalty.
No. I'm clear. A lack of integrity. Anyone supporting this PM has a lack of integrity. That is quite clear.
That may be quite clear to you, but it obviously isn't to those who are loyal to him.Looks like Bozo will be staying put. After everything he's done and overseen he is still backed by members of his own parliament and a lot of the general public. He should have been long gone by now but he isn't. Just sums up the lack of integrity that many people and politicians have and if they have it, they are also prepared to accept it from others and put up with it.
I think you might be confusing lack of integrity with loyalty.
No. I'm clear. A lack of integrity. Anyone supporting this PM has a lack of integrity. That is quite clear.
That may be quite clear to you, but it obviously isn't to those who are loyal to him.Looks like Bozo will be staying put. After everything he's done and overseen he is still backed by members of his own parliament and a lot of the general public. He should have been long gone by now but he isn't. Just sums up the lack of integrity that many people and politicians have and if they have it, they are also prepared to accept it from others and put up with it.
I think you might be confusing lack of integrity with loyalty.
No. I'm clear. A lack of integrity. Anyone supporting this PM has a lack of integrity. That is quite clear.
That may be quite clear to you, but it obviously isn't to those who are loyal to him.Looks like Bozo will be staying put. After everything he's done and overseen he is still backed by members of his own parliament and a lot of the general public. He should have been long gone by now but he isn't. Just sums up the lack of integrity that many people and politicians have and if they have it, they are also prepared to accept it from others and put up with it.
I think you might be confusing lack of integrity with loyalty.
No. I'm clear. A lack of integrity. Anyone supporting this PM has a lack of integrity. That is quite clear.
Quite right. A lot of them are probably loyal to him because having a lying, unprincipled scoundrel as PM is exactly what they want.
What says everything is you've never understood my whole point in getting involved with you and your biased, one-sided political views. As I've said umpteen times, it's not what I think that matters. What does matter (to me anyway) is that I try to address the balance.
I've also said all along that you would have defended your beloved Labour party all the way if it had acted in exactly the same way as this government has, and in fact, you've shown your true colours by defending Starmer's lies over the EU vaccine programme, and his backstabbing of Corbyn.
Those loyal to Johnson are claiming that his attack on Starmer regarding the Savile case was in response to Starmer's apology regarding his responsibility towards it because he was Director of Public Prosecutions at the time. They claim that Johnson is being attacked for apologising about Partygate in the same way, and if he should resign, why didn't Starmer?
As I said, had it been the other way round, you Labour lot would have!
Regarding the resignations, maybe some of them have gone to save their own skin?
You are simply beyond hope BB.I understand your disbelief Billy lad, the difference between someone attempting to shorten the gap between level-headedness and your biased, one-sided bullshit is probably a bridge too far.
f**king risible.
I don't know what is the more disturbing.
That you genuinely DO believe the EU vaccination issue shoes that Starmer is a liar. In which case your bias has unhinged you.
Or you don't actually believe it, in which case you are the WUM you've always been.
......A bridge too far.
Ooh, you're such a master baiter, Mr Wiggerly.
Ooh, you're such a master baiter, Mr Wiggerly.
Ah, the traditional BB descent into personal insults when he's run out of things to say. More see-through than a Boris apology.
See if you can guess who once said this:
"The tragedy of the stooge is that . . . he wants so much to believe that his relationship with the candidate is special that he shuts out the truth. The terrible art of the candidate is to coddle the self-deception of the stooge."
See if you can guess who once said this:
"The tragedy of the stooge is that . . . he wants so much to believe that his relationship with the candidate is special that he shuts out the truth. The terrible art of the candidate is to coddle the self-deception of the stooge."
Sydney?
''Give me back my £200,000, major donor tells Tories
Controversial telecoms mogul Mohamed Amersi takes on Conservative party over exclusion from elite gatherings and auction prizes never received''
Would you accept a candlelit dinner with bb and hound as a booby prize?
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2022/feb/05/give-me-back-my-200000-major-donor-tells-tories
''Nadine Dorries rides the airwaves to back PM amid ‘partygate’ row''
trying to out-do the Jonathon Pie sketch
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2022/feb/05/nadine-dorries-rides-the-airwaves-to-back-pm-amid-partygate-row
the poor people of Gloucestershire
They show a 'best of' reel of all the latest videos on South Parade once a week
''Nadine Dorries rides the airwaves to back PM amid ‘partygate’ row''
trying to out-do the Jonathon Pie sketch
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2022/feb/05/nadine-dorries-rides-the-airwaves-to-back-pm-amid-partygate-row
the poor people of Gloucestershire
BBC News - Boris Johnson sang 'I Will Survive' to new communications chief Guto Harri
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-60289339
What do you all think of this?
I think you should send that to Starmer before PMQ's!!BBC News - Boris Johnson sang 'I Will Survive' to new communications chief Guto Harri
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-60289339
What do you all think of this?
The lyric that springs to mind is:
So now go, walk out the door
Just turnaround now
Cause you're not welcome anymore.
I think you should send that to Starmer before PMQ's!!BBC News - Boris Johnson sang 'I Will Survive' to new communications chief Guto Harri
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-60289339
What do you all think of this?
The lyric that springs to mind is:
So now go, walk out the door
Just turnaround now
Cause you're not welcome anymore.
Starmer needs all the material he can get because he's probably the most insipid, witless, characterless, uninspiring wet lettuce ever to lead a political party.
Starmer needs all the material he can get because he's probably the most insipid, witless, characterless, uninspiring wet lettuce ever to lead a political party.
Starmer needs all the material he can get because he's probably the most insipid, witless, characterless, uninspiring wet lettuce ever to lead a political party.
Major and May might have been dull, but they were leaders with policies. Starmer is just a prosecutor with no policies, and from what I've seen he's pretty shite at prosecuting too.
Yes the fascists seem to think so to BB. You must be so proud
https://twitter.com/PoliticsJOE_UK/status/1490754883724713987
I mean, obviously the best way to reassure us the party is over, is to do it in the form of a disco anthem.
Major and May might have been dull, but they were leaders with policies. Starmer is just a prosecutor with no policies, and from what I've seen he's pretty shite at prosecuting too.
Johnson has been caught out republishing the magna carta and claiming it as a new bill of rights.
Johnson has been caught out republishing the magna carta and claiming it as a new bill of rights.
Have you got a link to that.
:lol:
I'm referring to his role as prosecutor to the Tories at the despatch box.Major and May might have been dull, but they were leaders with policies. Starmer is just a prosecutor with no policies, and from what I've seen he's pretty shite at prosecuting too.
Any particular case he was shite at?
I'm referring to his role as prosecutor to the Tories at the despatch box.Major and May might have been dull, but they were leaders with policies. Starmer is just a prosecutor with no policies, and from what I've seen he's pretty shite at prosecuting too.
Any particular case he was shite at?
I'm referring to his role as prosecutor to the Tories at the despatch box.Major and May might have been dull, but they were leaders with policies. Starmer is just a prosecutor with no policies, and from what I've seen he's pretty shite at prosecuting too.
Any particular case he was shite at?
Sounds a bit hound, what I write means what want it to mean
The latest work event picture features an open bottle of Veuve Clicquot, tinsel, a santa hat and if you look closely a security camera wrapped in fabric, perhaps a scarf.Its the way the crisps are open for all to share and it looks like a black plastic bag covering the camera
Nothing suspect there then. Veueve Cliquot being a standard, everyday office champagne.
Apparently this one isn't conclusive enough for the investigation to bother with.
The amazing thing is that surely he must have known about events that he did attend and seen others taking pictures?
To deny knowing about them or attending them just makes him look an even bigger fool.
It was like Chemical Ali denying American tanks being in Baghdad when they were in shot behind him as he spoke.
According to Tory MP and new Leader of the Commons Mark Spencer 'real people' in the 'real world' don't care about No. 10s lockdown parties.
www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-60318610
As a real person who, unlike Mr Spencer, lives in the real world I beg to differ.
Assuming the PM hangs on that long Mr Spencer, I suspect, will be in for a shock when the results from the upcoming local elections are declared.
Johnson has announced today that he plans to remove the requirement to self-isolate if you test positive for COVID.
Note: There's no-one from SAGE supporting this.
But it was received with cheers by the people who really matter, and who it was aimed at. The swivel eyed loons on the Tory backbenches, who are the ones who will decide Johnson's fate.
Let's be absolutely clear about this: people WILL die as a result of this decision.
Johnson has announced today that he plans to remove the requirement to self-isolate if you test positive for COVID.No surprise there really from a man who said ‘I would rather see bodies stacked up in the street than go into another hard lockdown’.
Note: There's no-one from SAGE supporting this.
But it was received with cheers by the people who really matter, and who it was aimed at. The swivel eyed loons on the Tory backbenches, who are the ones who will decide Johnson's fate.
Let's be absolutely clear about this: people WILL die as a result of this decision.
Johnson has announced today that he plans to remove the requirement to self-isolate if you test positive for COVID.
Note: There's no-one from SAGE supporting this.
But it was received with cheers by the people who really matter, and who it was aimed at. The swivel eyed loons on the Tory backbenches, who are the ones who will decide Johnson's fate.
Let's be absolutely clear about this: people WILL die as a result of this decision.
People will die if he made this decision in 10/20/30 years time though. Because Covid will be around. At some point total normality must be resumed even though people will sadly die. May as well do that now really.
People will die if he made this decision in 10/20/30 years time though. Because Covid will be around. At some point total normality must be resumed even though people will sadly die. May as well do that now really.
Interesting that you're so outraged about somebody kicking a cat but don't give a damn about decisions that result in the deaths of people.
Not much different to the labour party in that respect. How many of them believe there is a failure in leadership across the board?
Not much different to the labour party in that respect. How many of them believe there is a failure in leadership across the board?
Most of the ones who only joined in 2015 do. They are irrelevant.
Not much different to the labour party in that respect. How many of them believe there is a failure in leadership across the board?
Most of the ones who only joined in 2015 do. They are irrelevant.
But they are members of the Labour Party, so not irrelevant at all.
They have a vote.
desperation ................
''Responding to reports that a senior ally of Boris Johnson has said the Met Police will need to be “very certain” that he has breached lockdown rules before issuing him with a fine, Liberal Democrat leader Ed Davey said:
This veiled threat by Number 10 allies is amongst very heavy competition perhaps the darkest moment of this whole sorry saga.
It shows a fundamental belief in the heart of government that Boris Johnson should be above the law and that Number 10 will bring any institution into disrepute to save Johnson’s skin.
This is a sobering reminder of why we need a cast-iron guarantee that Boris Johnson and his team will have nothing to do with the appointment of Cressida Dick’s successor.
There was a time that the Conservatives called themselves the party of law and order; the public will laugh at that very idea for generations''
Not much different to the labour party in that respect. How many of them believe there is a failure in leadership across the board?
Most of the ones who only joined in 2015 do. They are irrelevant.
But they are members of the Labour Party, so not irrelevant at all.
They have a vote.
What I mean Tyke, is that the opinions of 100,000 people are irrelevant compared to an electorate of 30 million.Not much different to the labour party in that respect. How many of them believe there is a failure in leadership across the board?
Most of the ones who only joined in 2015 do. They are irrelevant.
But they are members of the Labour Party, so not irrelevant at all.
They have a vote.
Amazing how Billy tells you that if you don't vote Labour you are aiding the Tories but yet at the same time you are irrelevant .
It's remarkable when the Labour Party is a broad church and when it isn't .
Generally only during election campaigns or when a new centre Labour Party leader wants to win a leadership contest .
According to The Times today.
1) Johnson will appoint a solicitor to handle his reply if the Met send him a questionnaire.
2) A "senior ally" has said the Met needs to be "absolutely certain" before finding Johnson guilty and should use discretion because he is PM. That's there in black a white. A quote from a senior Johnson ally saying different rules apply to him.
Britain hasn't declared war on anyone yet.
Britain hasn't declared war on anyone yet.
Even more reason to get rid of johnson
Britain hasn't declared war on anyone yet.
Even more reason to get rid of johnson
Well, not officially at war.
And it's the decision of the Tories, I'd be surprised if they drop him now.
That's a difficult question Syd.
Would you prefer Sunak or Truss or ?... I dunno who making the calls?
does the truth mean so little to these people ................. I would have thought raab would have had enough the last time he made an utter abject fool of himself defending johnson
does the truth mean so little to these people ................. I would have thought raab would have had enough the last time he made an utter abject fool of himself defending johnson
Yes. And it seems to mean so little to quite a number of posters on here too, sadly!
We have a great choice, a lying conservative, a back stabbing traitor labour leader, and a nobody Liberal wanting you to spend your life savings saving the world.
Uh.
We have a great choice, a lying conservative, a back stabbing traitor labour leader, and a nobody Liberal wanting you to spend your life savings saving the world.
Uh.
We have a great choice, a lying conservative, a back stabbing traitor labour leader, and a nobody Liberal wanting you to spend your life savings saving the world.
Uh.
We have a choice between a Tory leader who treats the electorate with contempt and a Labour Party that treats democracy with contempt.
We have a great choice, a lying conservative, a back stabbing traitor labour leader, and a nobody Liberal wanting you to spend your life savings saving the world.
Uh.
We have a choice between a Tory leader who treats the electorate with contempt and a Labour Party that treats democracy with contempt.
We have a great choice, a lying conservative, a back stabbing traitor labour leader, and a nobody Liberal wanting you to spend your life savings saving the world.
Uh.
We have a choice between a Tory leader who treats the electorate with contempt and a Labour Party that treats democracy with contempt.
I did hope, given what's going on in a true fight between democracy and authoritarianism that this sort of intellectually idle stuff that Brexit supporters might fade away.
At the last election, the Labour party campaigned in a free and open election, for the support of voters to hold a vote to confirm or challenge the outcome of another vote. And we've still got people saying that is anti-democratic.
Just grow up will you?
We have a great choice, a lying conservative, a back stabbing traitor labour leader, and a nobody Liberal wanting you to spend your life savings saving the world.
Uh.
We have a choice between a Tory leader who treats the electorate with contempt and a Labour Party that treats democracy with contempt.
I did hope, given what's going on in a true fight between democracy and authoritarianism that this sort of intellectually idle stuff that Brexit supporters might fade away.
At the last election, the Labour party campaigned in a free and open election, for the support of voters to hold a vote to confirm or challenge the outcome of another vote. And we've still got people saying that is anti-democratic.
Just grow up will you?
The only people who needed to grow up were the ones in Parliament Billy .
The electorate gave them the result to the question they were asked .
The only people who were intellectually short of understanding that are well documented , Keith included .
Tyke
And the Labour party hasnt questioned that decision
You and Johnson and Farage won. It's gone. It's in the past.
Move on. And now look at what real contempt for democracy is.
We have a choice between a Tory leader who treats the electorate with contempt and a Labour Party that treats democracy with contempt.
I did hope, given what's going on in a true fight between democracy and authoritarianism that this sort of intellectually idle stuff that Brexit supporters might fade away.
At the last election, the Labour party campaigned in a free and open election, for the support of voters to hold a vote to confirm or challenge the outcome of another vote. And we've still got people saying that is anti-democratic.
Just grow up will you?
We have a great choice, a lying conservative, a back stabbing traitor labour leader, and a nobody Liberal wanting you to spend your life savings saving the world.
Uh.
We have a choice between a Tory leader who treats the electorate with contempt and a Labour Party that treats democracy with contempt.
Branton.
If you really insist that standing in a General Election on a ticket that asked people to support a vote is anti-democratic, I truly despair for the prospects for sensible discussion.
Insisting on that, in my opinion, devalues the whole concept of democracy.
Starmer was on the bbc news this morning.
When he talked about the energy price hike he very sensibly talked about imposing a windfall tax on the energy companies who had made unforeseen extra profits and that the Labour Party would give £600 to some households to help to pay the higher bills.
A brilliant thing to say IMO.
He was then asked how the LP would help people in the following year.
Starmer then spent a couple of minutes telling us how, as the Opposition, it was his job to challenge decisions made by the government but he didn’t explain what they would do to help people beyond the £600 that he would give this year.
He was asked time and again to answer the question but appeared to get agitated and the interview was ended.
It was noticeable that he didn’t appear to have a forward plan.
I was wondering how he could attract people to vote for him if people don’t know what his plans are.
Then what on earth do you mean by saying the Labour party treats democracy with contempt?
Leave campaigned on leaving the Single Market and Customs Union - the majority of the benefits from Brexit they claimed derived from this.
Where on the referendum voting slip did it mention leaving the Single Market or the Customs Union?
Where on the referendum voting slip did it mention leaving the Single Market or the Customs Union?
Where on the referendum voting slip did it mention leaving the Single Market or the Customs Union?
Hi Glyn.
My answer to this question is implicit in my previous post on this thread so I won't repeat myself.
May I ask re your quote "I knew leaving the Single Market was the single most damaging prospect of them all". Was this one of the reasons you presumably voted Remain?
I don't care what you think is 'implicit'. Leave didn't campaign on leaving Single Market at all, so everything you say after the assertion they did is based on a false premise. The leaflet they sent to everybody didn't mention the Single Market once. Hardly at the forefront of their campaign, was it?
I don't care what you think is 'implicit'. Leave didn't campaign on leaving Single Market at all, so everything you say after the assertion they did is based on a false premise. The leaflet they sent to everybody didn't mention the Single Market once. Hardly at the forefront of their campaign, was it?
This leaflet you mean? https://d3n8a8pro7vhmx.cloudfront.net/voteleave/pages/2318/attachments/original/1458915760/Vote_Leave_8pg_leaflet_print.pdf?1458915760
Where clearly out of only 5 points: -
- Point 3 is an advantage per Vote Leave of leaving the Single Market
- Point 4 is an advantage per Vote Leave of leaving the Customs Union
- Point 2 is in part (trade/borders) an advantage per Vote Leave of leaving both.
I don't care what you think is 'implicit'. Leave didn't campaign on leaving Single Market at all, so everything you say after the assertion they did is based on a false premise. The leaflet they sent to everybody didn't mention the Single Market once. Hardly at the forefront of their campaign, was it?
This leaflet you mean? https://d3n8a8pro7vhmx.cloudfront.net/voteleave/pages/2318/attachments/original/1458915760/Vote_Leave_8pg_leaflet_print.pdf?1458915760
Where clearly out of only 5 points: -
- Point 3 is an advantage per Vote Leave of leaving the Single Market
- Point 4 is an advantage per Vote Leave of leaving the Customs Union
- Point 2 is in part (trade/borders) an advantage per Vote Leave of leaving both.
Please point out where it mentions the Single Market, or leaving it. If you can.
I don't care less about what you think is 'implied', that means f**k all. You don't vote for 'implications'...or this really the kind of democracy you claim to be such a champion of?
As for all the remain guff you posted - irrelevant. You - yes, you - claim the LEAVE campaign definitely stated that voting leave meant leaving the Single Market, so whatever Remain said is completely irrelevant. It tells me that you can't find anything from Leave saying that Leave means leaving the Single Market if you're having to resort to referencing the Remain stuff! If Leave said we'd leave the Single Market there must be tons of stuff online saying so, wouldn't there?
Up to 30 people were at his birthday party during the first lockdown in June it's just emerged .
Rules at the time forbid all social gatherings indoors at that time .
Bye bye Bunter .
https://d3n8a8pro7vhmx.cloudfront.net/voteleave/pages/2318/attachments/original/1458915760/Vote_Leave_8pg_leaflet_print.pdf?1458915760
Main leaflet of Vote Leave - Point 3 clearly shows a leave vote involves leaving the Single Market.
www.gov.uk/government/publications/why-the-government-believes-that-voting-to-remain-in-the-european-union-is-the-best-decision-for-the-uk/why-the-government-believes-that-voting-to-remain-in-the-european-union-is-the-best-decision-for-the-uk
Pre-campaign correspondence from the Government to every household clearly stating a leave vote involves leaving the Single Market.
Billy please find me a quote from a prominent Leave campaigner during the referendum campaign that contradicts this.
And to repeat myself I do not think and therefore have never said that Labour's 2nd referendum General election policy was antidemocratic or in contempt of democracy.
Never mind Johnson.
The governments ex chief of ethics, Helen McNamara, has admitted to having received a fixed penalty for attending a leaving do at no10.
She is now the Premier Leagues Director of Policy.
Doesn’t look like this is affecting her career.
Never mind Johnson.
The governments ex chief of ethics, Helen McNamara, has admitted to having received a fixed penalty for attending a leaving do at no10.
She is now the Premier Leagues Director of Policy.
Doesn’t look like this is affecting her career.
At the time she was fined it was illegal for more than two people to meet indoors for a social gathering and at those events where more than two people were allowed to gather no singing was allowed.
She was fined for providing a kareoke machine for a leaving party.
Glyn and Wilts
Oh dear
It is clear from each of your last posts on this thread that neither of you understand what the EU Single Market is and what leaving it entails.
I cannot be bothered to educate you
I withdraw from this discussion in bemused exasperation
Glyn and Wilts
Oh dear
It is clear from each of your last posts on this thread that neither of you understand what the EU Single Market is and what leaving it entails.
I cannot be bothered to educate you
I withdraw from this discussion in bemused exasperation
Yeah, someone who was an International Trade Officer with Customs for twenty years obviously knows nothing about the Single Market.
I certainly don't need to be 'educated' about it by a berk like you.
Glyn and Wilts
Oh dear
It is clear from each of your last posts on this thread that neither of you understand what the EU Single Market is and what leaving it entails.
I cannot be bothered to educate you
I withdraw from this discussion in bemused exasperation
Yeah, someone who was an International Trade Officer with Customs for twenty years obviously knows nothing about the Single Market.
I certainly don't need to be 'educated' about it by a berk like you.
Collapse of stout party....
BobG
Glyn and Wilts
Oh dear
It is clear from each of your last posts on this thread that neither of you understand what the EU Single Market is and what leaving it entails.
I cannot be bothered to educate you
I withdraw from this discussion in bemused exasperation
Yeah, someone who was an International Trade Officer with Customs for twenty years obviously knows nothing about the Single Market.
I certainly don't need to be 'educated' about it by a berk like you.
Collapse of stout party....
BobG
Can't answer a complete repudiation of your bullshit? Then flounce off in huff! :silly:
Word of the day is 'snollygoster' (19th century): an unprincipled person in office who is motivated by personal rather than public gain.
Can't answer a complete repudiation of your bullshit? Then flounce off in huff! :silly:
He's a nice lad Branton (I know him vaguely) but as he has shown here anyone can let themselves be brainwashed if they want to.
Which is the objective truth at the heart of this thread. Do you want to be governed by a government who are judged by scruitny of an open factual discussion of their actions - or do you just want to believe what they want you to believe and make the facts suit?
He's a nice lad Branton (I know him vaguely) but as he has shown here anyone can let themselves be brainwashed if they want to.
Which is the objective truth at the heart of this thread. Do you want to be governed by a government who are judged by scruitny of an open factual discussion of their actions - or do you just want to believe what they want you to believe and make the facts suit?
Wilts sorry but it's the laziest of arguments that somebody who disagrees with you has been brainwashed. My views are wholly my own. Neither am I a fan of the Tories esp Boris Johnson who I've described variously on this forum as: -
- "treating the electorate with contempt"; - "a weak/disreputable individual"; - "record and actions as PM are appalling in many areas"; - "has a lack of common sense/discretion"
Does this sound like someone who has been brainwashed by the Johnson Government?!
PS Your Gove quote from earlier. He wasn't talking about staying in the Single Market after Brexit but talking up the chances of us striking a free trade deal with the EU in order to stay in the "free trade zone stretching from Iceland to Turkey". Hint: the clue to this is in your quote as Turkey isn't in the EU or the Single Market.
I wasn't referring to the Johnson government Branton.
Nor was Gove referring to a free trade deal. Hint - he doesnt mention a free trade deal but that the UK will 'remain' in a trading zone.
Can't answer a complete repudiation of your bullshit? Then flounce off in huff! :silly:
Glyn you claim you've been a Customs official for 20 years this suggests you're an adult; yet you resort to name calling the preserve of the playground which suggests you're a child.
Saying the below leaflet doesn't say the words "Single Market" isn't a complete repudiation of my points; it just suggests you're a child of reading age.
https://d3n8a8pro7vhmx.cloudfront.net/voteleave/pages/2318/attachments/original/1458915760/Vote_Leave_8pg_leaflet_print.pdf?1458915760
As an expert in the field you should be aware that you can't abandon freedom of movement of labour and stay in the Single Market. Therefore in Point 3 Leave are proposing leaving the Single Market.
You should also be aware that you can't make your own trade deals and stay in the Customs Union. Therefore in Point 4 Leave are proposing leaving the Customs Union.
Now can you prove you're an adult and either accept these facts or alternatively counter them with reasoned views of your own without descending into silly aggression, swearing, name calling or just making simplistic generic points? Try actually reading and then considering my words first before replying.
I wasn't referring to the Johnson government Branton.
Nor was Gove referring to a free trade deal. Hint - he doesnt mention a free trade deal but that the UK will 'remain' in a trading zone.
Wrong. Read the whole speech www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/michael-gove/michael-gove-vote-leave_b_9728548.html
"The In campaign often argues that we would find it impossible to reach a trading agreement with EU nations after we vote leave.
.......
There is a free trade zone stretching from Iceland to Turkey that all European nations have access to, regardless of whether they are in or out of the euro or EU. After we vote to leave we will remain in this zone. The suggestion that Bosnia, Serbia, Albania and the Ukraine would remain part of this free trade area - and Britain would be on the outside with just Belarus - is as credible as Jean-Claude Juncker joining Ukip. Agreeing to maintain this continental free trade zone is the simple course and emphatically in everyone's interests."
To repeat he wasn't talking about staying in the Single Market after Brexit but talking up the chances of us striking a free trade deal with the EU in order to stay in the "free trade zone stretching from Iceland to Turkey".
Hint: check your sources thoroughly before quoting them - reading what you want into half-quotes is ironically just what you'd expect from someone who has actually been brainwashed.
He's a nice lad Branton (I know him vaguely) but as he has shown here anyone can let themselves be brainwashed if they want to.
Which is the objective truth at the heart of this thread. Do you want to be governed by a government who are judged by scruitny of an open factual discussion of their actions - or do you just want to believe what they want you to believe and make the facts suit?
Wilts sorry but it's the laziest of arguments that somebody who disagrees with you has been brainwashed. My views are wholly my own. Neither am I a fan of the Tories esp Boris Johnson who I've described variously on this forum as: -
- "treating the electorate with contempt"; - "a weak/disreputable individual"; - "record and actions as PM are appalling in many areas"; - "has a lack of common sense/discretion"
Does this sound like someone who has been brainwashed by the Johnson Government?!
PS Your Gove quote from earlier. He wasn't talking about staying in the Single Market after Brexit but talking up the chances of us striking a free trade deal with the EU in order to stay in the "free trade zone stretching from Iceland to Turkey". Hint: the clue to this is in your quote as Turkey isn't in the EU or the Single Market.
I wasn't referring to the Johnson government Branton.
Nor was Gove referring to a free trade deal. Hint - he doesnt mention a free trade deal but that the UK will 'remain' in a trading zone.
Wrong. Read the whole speech www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/michael-gove/michael-gove-vote-leave_b_9728548.html
"The In campaign often argues that we would find it impossible to reach a trading agreement with EU nations after we vote leave.
.......
There is a free trade zone stretching from Iceland to Turkey that all European nations have access to, regardless of whether they are in or out of the euro or EU. After we vote to leave we will remain in this zone. The suggestion that Bosnia, Serbia, Albania and the Ukraine would remain part of this free trade area - and Britain would be on the outside with just Belarus - is as credible as Jean-Claude Juncker joining Ukip. Agreeing to maintain this continental free trade zone is the simple course and emphatically in everyone's interests."
To repeat he wasn't talking about staying in the Single Market after Brexit but talking up the chances of us striking a free trade deal with the EU in order to stay in the "free trade zone stretching from Iceland to Turkey".
Hint: check your sources thoroughly before quoting them - reading what you want into half-quotes is ironically just what you'd expect from someone who has actually been brainwashed.
Just got his fine has Boris and richi ,talk your way out of this one Bonzo
This
https://mobile.twitter.com/AdamBienkov/status/1513862592770543617
Deliberately and knowingly misleading Parliament.
In ANY other era, this is a stone cold resigning issue.
Just got his fine has Boris and richi ,talk your way out of this one Bonzo
Just to be clear.
We now have a criminal Prime Minister.
We now have a criminal Chancellor.
Just to be clear.
We now have a criminal Prime Minister.
We now have a criminal Chancellor.
Technically not, fixed penalty notices for covid do not lead to a criminal record according to the bbc
Most, if not all, families will have experienced some awful periods over the last two years. Personally, one of my grandparents spent much of the final two years of her life unable to see family members, with human contact often limited to that from care workers.
Others will have lost family members who died alone. All while these criminals held party after party. They then lied to us, seemingly with no shame.
They should both be out of office by the end of the day.
One for the history books.
Boris Johnson is the first sitting PM in the history of the UK to be formally found guilty of a crime.
Some of us did warn folk what this man was like.
One for the history books.
Boris Johnson is the first sitting PM in the history of the UK to be formally found guilty of a crime.
Some of us did warn folk what this man was like.
And that is why he has to go
Where does the Sue Gray report stand in all this now, it should be published un redacted now
The line some tory MPs are taking is they can't sack the PM in the middle of the Ukraine war.
Well, we did change PM during WWII.
The line some tory MPs are taking is they can't sack the PM in the middle of the Ukraine war.
Well, we did change PM during WWII.
Who are we at war with please?
BobG
The line some tory MPs are taking is they can't sack the PM in the middle of the Ukraine war.
Well, we did change PM during WWII.
Previously, we have seen the resignation of sitting PMs during:
WWII
WWI
The Crimean War
The Napoleonic War (x4 plus another one assassinated)
The American War of Independence (x2 plus another one who died in office)
In addition, Churchill was voted out as PM while WWII was still ongoing.
Anthony Eden was effectively replaced during the Suez Crisis due to a nervous breakdown.
It is absolute horseshit to say Johnson cannot be removed because of Ukraine. Those saying it have one of two motives.
1) They are paid-up Johnson supporters.
2) They know that this year is going to be horrific for people's living standards, and they know that whoever is PM is going to take a massive popularity hit. Better to leave Johnson to take the flak, then replace him if/when conditions improve so that they have a shiny new PM for the next election.
I'd like to think there are enough Tory MPs with moral standards and a backbone to do the right thing. But I'm not convinced.
Who organised these parties?
Because that’s a ten grand fine.
The problem is ten grand means nothing to these idiots
My prediction.for what it’s worth.
He will ride the political storm.
But no way will he be leading the tories into the next GE.
Step forward Ms Patel.
The line some tory MPs are taking is they can't sack the PM in the middle of the Ukraine war.
Well, we did change PM during WWII.
Previously, we have seen the resignation of sitting PMs during:
WWII
WWI
The Crimean War
The Napoleonic War (x4 plus another one assassinated)
The American War of Independence (x2 plus another one who died in office)
In addition, Churchill was voted out as PM while WWII was still ongoing.
Anthony Eden was effectively replaced during the Suez Crisis due to a nervous breakdown.
It is absolute horseshit to say Johnson cannot be removed because of Ukraine. Those saying it have one of two motives.
1) They are paid-up Johnson supporters.
2) They know that this year is going to be horrific for people's living standards, and they know that whoever is PM is going to take a massive popularity hit. Better to leave Johnson to take the flak, then replace him if/when conditions improve so that they have a shiny new PM for the next election.
I'd like to think there are enough Tory MPs with moral standards and a backbone to do the right thing. But I'm not convinced.
The line some tory MPs are taking is they can't sack the PM in the middle of the Ukraine war.
Well, we did change PM during WWII.
Previously, we have seen the resignation of sitting PMs during:
WWII
WWI
The Crimean War
The Napoleonic War (x4 plus another one assassinated)
The American War of Independence (x2 plus another one who died in office)
In addition, Churchill was voted out as PM while WWII was still ongoing.
Anthony Eden was effectively replaced during the Suez Crisis due to a nervous breakdown.
It is absolute horseshit to say Johnson cannot be removed because of Ukraine. Those saying it have one of two motives.
1) They are paid-up Johnson supporters.
2) They know that this year is going to be horrific for people's living standards, and they know that whoever is PM is going to take a massive popularity hit. Better to leave Johnson to take the flak, then replace him if/when conditions improve so that they have a shiny new PM for the next election.
I'd like to think there are enough Tory MPs with moral standards and a backbone to do the right thing. But I'm not convinced.
Iraq - Saddam invaded Kuwait on 2nd August - Thatcher announced her resignation on 22nd November and Major took over on 28th November
Here's another Tory MP sacrificing his dignity for Johnson. That other ridiculously coiffured blonde, Michael Fabricant.
"I don’t think that at any time [Johnson] thought that he was breaking the law. I think that at the time he thought, just like many teachers and nurses who after a very, very long shift would tend to go back to the staff room and have a quiet drink - which is more or less what he has done - but I don’t think he thought he was breaking the law."
You can see the concept. They've lied to the public for years and treated ordinary voters as if they are too thick to realise. And STILL 35% of voters say they support them. Why not go all-in?
This is astonishing.
https://yougov.co.uk/topics/politics/survey-results/daily/2022/04/12/c5ce0/3
After all this shit show, 45% of Tory voters are not prepared to say that Johnson lied about the parties.
37% of Leave voters similar.
39% of pensioners similar.
https://yougov.co.uk/topics/politics/survey-results/daily/2022/04/1j2/c5ce0/1
Only 25% of Tory voters, 35% of Leave voters and 42% of pensioners think Johnson should resign.
What the hell would it take to breakfasts that spell?
Here's another Tory MP sacrificing his dignity for Johnson. That other ridiculously coiffured blonde, Michael Fabricant.At my daughter's school in Bradford teachers were told that under no circumstances were they to socialise with each other outside school because it would leave the the school vulnerable if a lot caught Covid at once.
"I don’t think that at any time [Johnson] thought that he was breaking the law. I think that at the time he thought, just like many teachers and nurses who after a very, very long shift would tend to go back to the staff room and have a quiet drink - which is more or less what he has done - but I don’t think he thought he was breaking the law."
You can see the concept. They've lied to the public for years and treated ordinary voters as if they are too thick to realise. And STILL 35% of voters say they support them. Why not go all-in?
Quote from: BillyStubbsTears linking=topic=283810.msg1152200#msg1152200 date=1649781587This is astonishing.
https://yougov.co.uk/topics/politics/survey-results/daily/2022/04/12/c5ce0/3
After all this shit show, 45% of Tory voters are not prepared to say that Johnson lied about the parties.
37% of Leave voters similar.
39% of pensioners similar.
https://yougov.co.uk/topics/politics/survey-results/daily/2022/04/1j2/c5ce0/1
Only 25% of Tory voters, 35% of Leave voters and 42% of pensioners think Johnson should resign.
What the hell would it take to breakfasts that spell?
Clearly, there can only be one explanation for being so far divorced from reality. A covert Tory campaign to ensure their future in government by giving pre frontal lobotomies to their supporters.
BobG
Quote from: BillyStubbsTears linking=topic=283810.msg1152200#msg1152200 date=1649781587This is astonishing.
https://yougov.co.uk/topics/politics/survey-results/daily/2022/04/12/c5ce0/3
After all this shit show, 45% of Tory voters are not prepared to say that Johnson lied about the parties.
37% of Leave voters similar.
39% of pensioners similar.
https://yougov.co.uk/topics/politics/survey-results/daily/2022/04/1j2/c5ce0/1
Only 25% of Tory voters, 35% of Leave voters and 42% of pensioners think Johnson should resign.
What the hell would it take to breakfasts that spell?
Clearly, there can only be one explanation for being so far divorced from reality. A covert Tory campaign to ensure their future in government by giving pre frontal lobotomies to their supporters.
BobG
I think you should take another look at those polling stats, it does not make good reading for anyone who has illusions of power when they show that the over 55's, who are the most ardent voting faction have as much trust and belief in the Labour leader than they do in this most incompetent and distrustful PM.
So basically Johnson can make a proper pigs ear of everything he touches and says but a large proportion of the voting public still trust him as much as they can bear to trust Keith. Does this say more about the UK population or the incompetents we have who wish to lead?
For the record, i believe that this PM, who should of resigned many a moon ago is a disgrace and one of the worst things that could happen to this country, but the Uk public could still not bring itself to vote for the alternative and in all probability will still hold its nose and vote for this slime-ball or his successor.
What does that say for the caliber of opposition we have standing for high office in this country?
Here's another Tory MP sacrificing his dignity for Johnson. That other ridiculously coiffured blonde, Michael Fabricant.
"I don’t think that at any time [Johnson] thought that he was breaking the law. I think that at the time he thought, just like many teachers and nurses who after a very, very long shift would tend to go back to the staff room and have a quiet drink - which is more or less what he has done - but I don’t think he thought he was breaking the law."
You can see the concept. They've lied to the public for years and treated ordinary voters as if they are too thick to realise. And STILL 35% of voters say they support them. Why not go all-in?
Teachers and nurses having a quiet one at work????
Complete f**kwit - clearly he hasn’t been in a hospital or school for decades.
Quote from: BillyStubbsTears linking=topic=283810.msg1152200#msg1152200 date=1649781587This is astonishing.
https://yougov.co.uk/topics/politics/survey-results/daily/2022/04/12/c5ce0/3
After all this shit show, 45% of Tory voters are not prepared to say that Johnson lied about the parties.
37% of Leave voters similar.
39% of pensioners similar.
https://yougov.co.uk/topics/politics/survey-results/daily/2022/04/1j2/c5ce0/1
Only 25% of Tory voters, 35% of Leave voters and 42% of pensioners think Johnson should resign.
What the hell would it take to breakfasts that spell?
Clearly, there can only be one explanation for being so far divorced from reality. A covert Tory campaign to ensure their future in government by giving pre frontal lobotomies to their supporters.
BobG
I think you should take another look at those polling stats, it does not make good reading for anyone who has illusions of power when they show that the over 55's, who are the most ardent voting faction have as much trust and belief in the Labour leader than they do in this most incompetent and distrustful PM.
So basically Johnson can make a proper pigs ear of everything he touches and says but a large proportion of the voting public still trust him as much as they can bear to trust Keith. Does this say more about the UK population or the incompetents we have who wish to lead?
For the record, i believe that this PM, who should of resigned many a moon ago is a disgrace and one of the worst things that could happen to this country, but the Uk public could still not bring itself to vote for the alternative and in all probability will still hold its nose and vote for this slime-ball or his successor.
What does that say for the caliber of opposition we have standing for high office in this country?
Whilst I don't think Starmer is exactly all that by any means your analysis fails to acknowledge a number of things .
The people who have absolutely no interest in politics .
The people who are totally disenfranchised from the two main political party's .
The FPTP voting system , Labour won 150 seats on just over 30% of the vote , second Blair win I believe , could be wrong mind .
Sorry just to clarify that was aimed at Bono
Sorry just to clarify that was aimed at Bono
A bit close to the edge there.
Oh that's all right then.
BobG
Alternatively, what does it say about over-55s?Quote from: BillyStubbsTears linking=topic=283810.msg1152200#msg1152200 date=1649781587This is astonishing.
https://yougov.co.uk/topics/politics/survey-results/daily/2022/04/12/c5ce0/3
After all this shit show, 45% of Tory voters are not prepared to say that Johnson lied about the parties.
37% of Leave voters similar.
39% of pensioners similar.
https://yougov.co.uk/topics/politics/survey-results/daily/2022/04/1j2/c5ce0/1
Only 25% of Tory voters, 35% of Leave voters and 42% of pensioners think Johnson should resign.
What the hell would it take to breakfasts that spell?
Clearly, there can only be one explanation for being so far divorced from reality. A covert Tory campaign to ensure their future in government by giving pre frontal lobotomies to their supporters.
BobG
I think you should take another look at those polling stats, it does not make good reading for anyone who has illusions of power when they show that the over 55's, who are the most ardent voting faction have as much trust and belief in the Labour leader than they do in this most incompetent and distrustful PM.
So basically Johnson can make a proper pigs ear of everything he touches and says but a large proportion of the voting public still trust him as much as they can bear to trust Keith. Does this say more about the UK population or the incompetents we have who wish to lead?
For the record, i believe that this PM, who should of resigned many a moon ago is a disgrace and one of the worst things that could happen to this country, but the Uk public could still not bring itself to vote for the alternative and in all probability will still hold its nose and vote for this slime-ball or his successor.
What does that say for the caliber of opposition we have standing for high office in this country?
Alternatively, what does it say about over-55s?Quote from: BillyStubbsTears linking=topic=283810.msg1152200#msg1152200 date=1649781587This is astonishing.
https://yougov.co.uk/topics/politics/survey-results/daily/2022/04/12/c5ce0/3
After all this shit show, 45% of Tory voters are not prepared to say that Johnson lied about the parties.
37% of Leave voters similar.
39% of pensioners similar.
https://yougov.co.uk/topics/politics/survey-results/daily/2022/04/1j2/c5ce0/1
Only 25% of Tory voters, 35% of Leave voters and 42% of pensioners think Johnson should resign.
What the hell would it take to breakfasts that spell?
Clearly, there can only be one explanation for being so far divorced from reality. A covert Tory campaign to ensure their future in government by giving pre frontal lobotomies to their supporters.
BobG
I think you should take another look at those polling stats, it does not make good reading for anyone who has illusions of power when they show that the over 55's, who are the most ardent voting faction have as much trust and belief in the Labour leader than they do in this most incompetent and distrustful PM.
So basically Johnson can make a proper pigs ear of everything he touches and says but a large proportion of the voting public still trust him as much as they can bear to trust Keith. Does this say more about the UK population or the incompetents we have who wish to lead?
For the record, i believe that this PM, who should of resigned many a moon ago is a disgrace and one of the worst things that could happen to this country, but the Uk public could still not bring itself to vote for the alternative and in all probability will still hold its nose and vote for this slime-ball or his successor.
What does that say for the caliber of opposition we have standing for high office in this country?
Oh that's all right then.
BobG
I'm not saying that. My previous posts make it clear I think they should resign.
My point was about whether Sunak would break rank and resign, however that clearly won't be happening in the immediate future.
Alternatively, what does it say about over-55s?Quote from: BillyStubbsTears linking=topic=283810.msg1152200#msg1152200 date=1649781587This is astonishing.
https://yougov.co.uk/topics/politics/survey-results/daily/2022/04/12/c5ce0/3
After all this shit show, 45% of Tory voters are not prepared to say that Johnson lied about the parties.
37% of Leave voters similar.
39% of pensioners similar.
https://yougov.co.uk/topics/politics/survey-results/daily/2022/04/1j2/c5ce0/1
Only 25% of Tory voters, 35% of Leave voters and 42% of pensioners think Johnson should resign.
What the hell would it take to breakfasts that spell?
Clearly, there can only be one explanation for being so far divorced from reality. A covert Tory campaign to ensure their future in government by giving pre frontal lobotomies to their supporters.
BobG
I think you should take another look at those polling stats, it does not make good reading for anyone who has illusions of power when they show that the over 55's, who are the most ardent voting faction have as much trust and belief in the Labour leader than they do in this most incompetent and distrustful PM.
So basically Johnson can make a proper pigs ear of everything he touches and says but a large proportion of the voting public still trust him as much as they can bear to trust Keith. Does this say more about the UK population or the incompetents we have who wish to lead?
For the record, i believe that this PM, who should of resigned many a moon ago is a disgrace and one of the worst things that could happen to this country, but the Uk public could still not bring itself to vote for the alternative and in all probability will still hold its nose and vote for this slime-ball or his successor.
What does that say for the caliber of opposition we have standing for high office in this country?
I don’t know, why don’t you ask them, they are after all the ones who bother to vote so they tend to get their wishes.
I think they will only be moving on to the next one.
The police appear to be rolling out these fines on an event-by-event basis. Last week's fines were for a leaving do, today's for Johnson's birthday party. How many were they looking into in total 12-18 something like that? Only one way this wont be in the news for a while yet.
I think they will only be moving on to the next one.
The police appear to be rolling out these fines on an event-by-event basis. Last week's fines were for a leaving do, today's for Johnson's birthday party. How many were they looking into in total 12-18 something like that? Only one way this wont be in the news for a while yet.
Attending more than one party should mean more than one fine?
You can't take a bunch of fines and decide just to pay one of them.
Labour has to be all over this day after day after day embarrass every one of the entitled t**ts on the Government bench
Word of the day is 'maw-worm' (19th century): one who insists that they have done nothing wrong, despite evidence to the contrary.
Are we going to have to suffer johnson weaselling until the next sitting of the HoC just to hear him lie his head off that he didn't deliberately mislead parliament?
Maybe the only hope is that Sunak resigns and drags him down along with him.
Good to see the regular deflectors are out instead of commenting on the topic
Ah, you mean like your only contribution to a topic is to directly attack Boris Johnson or the Tory party in general? Does this mean you don't even respect yourself?
Well, Boris isn’t the first PM to get a fine is he
Ah, you mean like your only contribution to a topic is to directly attack Boris Johnson or the Tory party in general? Does this mean you don't even respect yourself?
If you think that refusing to criticise the only PM in history who set a law, repeatedly exhorted us to follow it, broke it repeatedly in the middle of a national emergency, lied about it repeatedly then was found guilty is something to be proud of, then you are one of the reasons why our political system is so f**ked.
Of course you DO think Johnson was wrong to do all those things. I get that. But you can't bring yourself to say it, so you have a go at people who do instead. Which is a very good example of why you don't deserve to be respected.
I was right wasn't I....
BobG
Ah, you mean like your only contribution to a topic is to directly attack Boris Johnson or the Tory party in general? Does this mean you don't even respect yourself?
If you think that refusing to criticise the only PM in history who set a law, repeatedly exhorted us to follow it, broke it repeatedly in the middle of a national emergency, lied about it repeatedly then was found guilty is something to be proud of, then you are one of the reasons why our political system is so f**ked.
Of course you DO think Johnson was wrong to do all those things. I get that. But you can't bring yourself to say it, so you have a go at people who do instead. Which is a very good example of why you don't deserve to be respected.
Of course, Johnson was wrong. He himself has admitted he was. The problem I have with it is people who, like you, go on and on and on and on and on and on about it because you have got absolutely f**k all other ways to support your beloved Labour party other than to say how bad the Tories are.
Don't you think your beloved Labour party has done worse things in the past than have illegal parties? No? Then THAT'S why our political system is f**ked.
You were Bob. Some people are simply beyond reasoning with. With some it's always "Whatabout...?" With some it's always "You support the other side so I won't accept your analysis."Less of the psychoanalysis and more answers, please.
It's the very, very most tribal of people refusing to engage in discussion about issues because they assume everyone else is as impervious to reasoned argument as they are.
Ah, you mean like your only contribution to a topic is to directly attack Boris Johnson or the Tory party in general? Does this mean you don't even respect yourself?
If you think that refusing to criticise the only PM in history who set a law, repeatedly exhorted us to follow it, broke it repeatedly in the middle of a national emergency, lied about it repeatedly then was found guilty is something to be proud of, then you are one of the reasons why our political system is so f**ked.
Of course you DO think Johnson was wrong to do all those things. I get that. But you can't bring yourself to say it, so you have a go at people who do instead. Which is a very good example of why you don't deserve to be respected.
Of course, Johnson was wrong. He himself has admitted he was. The problem I have with it is people who, like you, go on and on and on and on and on and on about it because you have got absolutely f**k all other ways to support your beloved Labour party other than to say how bad the Tories are.
Don't you think your beloved Labour party has done worse things in the past than have illegal parties? No? Then THAT'S why our political system is f**ked.
Simple, direct question.
When a PM is found to have broken a law that he himself brought in, a law that was designed to limit the effect of an epidemic that was killing 1250 people a day at its worst, should he resign?
Yes or no?
Was that a yes or a no BB?I know you're not one for answering questions, Billy lad, but from now on I will insist you do, then we'll move on.
BBAnswer the f**king question man!
Why on earth would you come on this thread throwing complaints about what other people think, but not be prepared to state what you think?
Oh yeah! Sorry, I remember. You're not interested in discussion. You only ever want an argument.
Dead simple question. Do you think he should resign?
Well, Boris isn’t the first PM to get a fine is he
And here's a perfect example of someone scratting around to try to provide faux-balance. Quite sad to observe really.
I don't think any senior Labour Cabinet Minister has ever been found guilty of breaking a law.Thanks. That answers my question that a Labour party PM has done far FAR worse deeds than attending an illegal party.
I think there are other things done by Labour leaders that demanded their resignation. That's why I left the Labour party and refused to vote for them while Blair was PM after the Iraq invasion.
But that was a policy issue. The point about Johnson is different and unique. He has unarguably broken a law. He's unarguably and repeatedly lied about it in Parliament.
I ask one last time. Do you think he should resign?
Ah, you mean like your only contribution to a topic is to directly attack Boris Johnson or the Tory party in general? Does this mean you don't even respect yourself?
If you think that refusing to criticise the only PM in history who set a law, repeatedly exhorted us to follow it, broke it repeatedly in the middle of a national emergency, lied about it repeatedly then was found guilty is something to be proud of, then you are one of the reasons why our political system is so f**ked.
Of course you DO think Johnson was wrong to do all those things. I get that. But you can't bring yourself to say it, so you have a go at people who do instead. Which is a very good example of why you don't deserve to be respected.
Of course, Johnson was wrong. He himself has admitted he was. The problem I have with it is people who, like you, go on and on and on and on and on and on about it because you have got absolutely f**k all other ways to support your beloved Labour party other than to say how bad the Tories are.
Don't you think your beloved Labour party has done worse things in the past than have illegal parties? No? Then THAT'S why our political system is f**ked.
Simple, direct question.
When a PM is found to have broken a law that he himself brought in, a law that was designed to limit the effect of an epidemic that was killing 1250 people a day at its worst, should he resign?
Yes or no?
Saw this on Twitter and it sums up many a thread on this forum and this one in particular
Every single one of us is more lenient and willing to overlook foibles and transgressions of our own political 'side' than the other. Am surprised anyone thinks otherwise to be honest
For what my opinion is worth, I think he should not resign.
So, boozing in full view of the public through a window during restrictions was not even a quarter of receiving a cake on your birthday?Saw this on Twitter and it sums up many a thread on this forum and this one in particular
Every single one of us is more lenient and willing to overlook foibles and transgressions of our own political 'side' than the other. Am surprised anyone thinks otherwise to be honest
And THIS is precisely what I was saying earlier. This is the normalisation of previously unacceptable behaviour by the line "well the other side wouldn't be any better."
There's a massive elephant in the room for anyone who subscribes to that opinion. The other side HASN'T done anything remotely like this. No PM of any party in our entire history has ever passed a law aimed at protecting lives in a medical crisis, then broken that law, then repeatedly lied about breaking that law, then been found guilty of breaking the law, and accepted that guilty verdict and not resigned.
If a Labour PM had ever done a quarter of that, I would be screaming for them to resign.
For what my opinion is worth, I think he should not resign.
Well that took some wringing out of you. But at least we have it on record that a PM can break the law and lie to Parliament about breaking the law and you still think he should be PM. Thanks. I'll keep that in mind if you ever contribute on related issues in future.
Saw this on Twitter and it sums up many a thread on this forum and this one in particular
Every single one of us is more lenient and willing to overlook foibles and transgressions of our own political 'side' than the other. Am surprised anyone thinks otherwise to be honest
Saw this on Twitter and it sums up many a thread on this forum and this one in particular
Every single one of us is more lenient and willing to overlook foibles and transgressions of our own political 'side' than the other. Am surprised anyone thinks otherwise to be honest
Not true at all. There are several prominent Tory's on here who have no problem in criticising criminal actions by their own leader - and fair play to all of them.
The radio is full of people who say they have voted Tory all their life - and never will again - or at least as long as Johnson is leader.
Some of their more prominent critics of Starmer are Labour supporters. Just as those of Corbyn were too.
Johnson is a different kind of leader - a man with no principles, political or otherwise, who wants power purely for the sake of having power and will do whatever it takes to hang onto it. He attracts likeminded disciples. As you can see on this thread.
when I worked in lockdown at a restaurant the police and council COVID wardens were always around checking up on what was going on ,The police stand outside number 10 ,what did they think they were doing when someone turns up with snacks and beer ,doing a tombola,There could be more fines on the way for the borisAh, you mean like your only contribution to a topic is to directly attack Boris Johnson or the Tory party in general? Does this mean you don't even respect yourself?
If you think that refusing to criticise the only PM in history who set a law, repeatedly exhorted us to follow it, broke it repeatedly in the middle of a national emergency, lied about it repeatedly then was found guilty is something to be proud of, then you are one of the reasons why our political system is so f**ked.
Of course you DO think Johnson was wrong to do all those things. I get that. But you can't bring yourself to say it, so you have a go at people who do instead. Which is a very good example of why you don't deserve to be respected.
Of course, Johnson was wrong. He himself has admitted he was. The problem I have with it is people who, like you, go on and on and on and on and on and on about it because you have got absolutely f**k all other ways to support your beloved Labour party other than to say how bad the Tories are.
Don't you think your beloved Labour party has done worse things in the past than have illegal parties? No? Then THAT'S why our political system is f**ked.
Simple, direct question.
When a PM is found to have broken a law that he himself brought in, a law that was designed to limit the effect of an epidemic that was killing 1250 people a day at its worst, should he resign?
Yes or no?
He should resign because of the whole of the party stuff, that's obvious. Ironically though the one he's been fined for (so far) probably is negligible because it is true that many did things like that in their workplaces at times and it's pretty minor. The other stuff, absolutely not and I hope they pull him up on it.
As for your point on Ukraine, he's led well on that imo, but that doesn't excuse the things that went on around his property and the lies that followed.
You're wasting your time RD. He's beyond talking to. He's obsessed with the idea that, because Starmer once slipped up in an angry exchange in the House, said something wrong and corrected it shortly after, he's a liar just like Johnson is.
Actually,vi suspect he doesn't really believe that, but he needs to claim he does just so he can make his point in here. Either way, he's beyond reasoning with. One day I'll stop biting.
You're wasting your time RD. He's beyond talking to. He's obsessed with the idea that, because Starmer once slipped up in an angry exchange in the House, said something wrong and corrected it shortly after, he's a liar just like Johnson is.
Actually,vi suspect he doesn't really believe that, but he needs to claim he does just so he can make his point in here. Either way, he's beyond reasoning with. One day I'll stop biting.
I think personally there are much better and worse people on all sides of politics than Johnson.
You're wasting your time RD. He's beyond talking to. He's obsessed with the idea that, because Starmer once slipped up in an angry exchange in the House, said something wrong and corrected it shortly after, he's a liar just like Johnson is.
Actually,vi suspect he doesn't really believe that, but he needs to claim he does just so he can make his point in here. Either way, he's beyond reasoning with. One day I'll stop biting.
Saw this on Twitter and it sums up many a thread on this forum and this one in particular
Every single one of us is more lenient and willing to overlook foibles and transgressions of our own political 'side' than the other. Am surprised anyone thinks otherwise to be honest
Not true at all. There are several prominent Tory's on here who have no problem in criticising criminal actions by their own leader - and fair play to all of them.
The radio is full of people who say they have voted Tory all their life - and never will again - or at least as long as Johnson is leader.
Some of their more prominent critics of Starmer are Labour supporters. Just as those of Corbyn were too.
Johnson is a different kind of leader - a man with no principles, political or otherwise, who wants power purely for the sake of having power and will do whatever it takes to hang onto it. He attracts likeminded disciples. As you can see on this thread.
Hi wilts.
I am curious about who you see as prominent Tory’s on the forum.
You're wasting your time RD. He's beyond talking to. He's obsessed with the idea that, because Starmer once slipped up in an angry exchange in the House, said something wrong and corrected it shortly after, he's a liar just like Johnson is.
Actually,vi suspect he doesn't really believe that, but he needs to claim he does just so he can make his point in here. Either way, he's beyond reasoning with. One day I'll stop biting.
https://novaramedia.com/2021/09/29/keir-starmer-is-just-as-dishonest-as-boris-johnson/
You're wasting your time RD. He's beyond talking to. He's obsessed with the idea that, because Starmer once slipped up in an angry exchange in the House, said something wrong and corrected it shortly after, he's a liar just like Johnson is.
Actually,vi suspect he doesn't really believe that, but he needs to claim he does just so he can make his point in here. Either way, he's beyond reasoning with. One day I'll stop biting.
https://novaramedia.com/2021/09/29/keir-starmer-is-just-as-dishonest-as-boris-johnson/
Well the Justice Minister has resigned.
That says a lot about what he thinks of Bojo.
Well the Justice Minister has resigned.
That says a lot about what he thinks of Bojo.
Ooofff, he's the second justice minister to walk. That's a blow.
I wonder if things might start unraveling now.
Well the Justice Minister has resigned.
That says a lot about what he thinks of Bojo.
Ooofff, he's the second justice minister to walk. That's a blow.
I wonder if things might start unraveling now.
How many false dawns like this has there been? It all just washes of Johnson because he doesn't have a principled bone in his body.
You're wasting your time RD. He's beyond talking to. He's obsessed with the idea that, because Starmer once slipped up in an angry exchange in the House, said something wrong and corrected it shortly after, he's a liar just like Johnson is.
Actually,vi suspect he doesn't really believe that, but he needs to claim he does just so he can make his point in here. Either way, he's beyond reasoning with. One day I'll stop biting.
https://novaramedia.com/2021/09/29/keir-starmer-is-just-as-dishonest-as-boris-johnson/
You haven't actually read that have you? And I assume you've no idea how much of a vendetta Aaron Bastani has for Starmer, Bastani being Corbyn's young Twitter attack dog.
You are truly making yourself look stupid here BB by suggesting, as Bastani wants you to believe, that there's some kind of equality between lying on matters of objective truth, and changing policies in a way that certain groups of people don't like.
If you genuinely don't get how dangerous Johnson's abuse if objective truth is, and how unique it is in our politics, you really should be ashamed of yourself.
To confirm another point discussed:
https://twitter.com/Greg_Callus/status/1513912694226788358?s=20&t=UI9EzE6MFvoCMfeF2-S0gw
BobG
You talk about honesty when you want a Labour government to get into power by the only means it can with right-wing policies and then move to the left when it achieves it?Thread alert.
Is that what you call honest?
If a political party publishes a manifesto and sticks to it, then the public knows roughly what it is getting when they vote.
The public generally knows the Labour Party pushes things to the left and the Conservative party pushes right.
It gets difficult when they start breaking manifesto pledges.
If labour win the next election there's an awful lot of labour supporters who will likely have to criticise them when they make the same changes or mistakes the conservatives have. Neither side can ever possibly get it right every time.
If labour win the next election there's an awful lot of labour supporters who will likely have to criticise them when they make the same changes or mistakes the conservatives have. Neither side can ever possibly get it right every time.
I think you mean an awful lot of very vocal recent and never-before members might criticise them.
Sorry if I misinterpreted BR. I agree 100% with that.
Russian born holder of joint Russian-British citizenship.
He qualifies for UK citizenship because he moved to the UK when his father's job as a KGB spy chief took him to the Russian Embassy in London. But he never renounced his Russian citizenship.
Billy
No I wasn't saying that at all. I'm disgusted that Tory MPs (bar a minority) haven't moved to remove Johnson already.
However they will surely move if the results of the local elections show him not to be the electoral superstar they believe he his (based on historic records) anymore. Of course this doesn't cast them in a very good light.
Those that DO want him out will be waiting on the election results giving their cause the extra momentum to succeed before making a move. I'd expect this minority to hand letters in post election regardless.
The Ukraine excuse is just being used as a cover by all Tory MPs whether Johnson supporters, detractors or waiverers.
I'll rephrase, as you imply, Johnson's future is in the hands of Tory voters in the local elections. I hope and expect many will simply abstain in disgust at his behaviour. This would then inevitably seal his downfall.
Russian born holder of joint Russian-British citizenship.
He qualifies for UK citizenship because he moved to the UK when his father's job as a KGB spy chief took him to the Russian Embassy in London. But he never renounced his Russian citizenship.
And nor should he, it's perfectly acceptable to be Russian and British in my view. I find this fear of him bizarre and just a convenient political story.
Russian born holder of joint Russian-British citizenship.
He qualifies for UK citizenship because he moved to the UK when his father's job as a KGB spy chief took him to the Russian Embassy in London. But he never renounced his Russian citizenship.
And nor should he, it's perfectly acceptable to be Russian and British in my view. I find this fear of him bizarre and just a convenient political story.
By definition the Leader of The Opposition has at all times to robotically call on The Prime Minister to resign whilst the Opposition members must make "funny noises"Tell me CLH what he has done that the Deputy PM couldn't do even though it is Raabid? We are not involved in any actual conflict we are supying weaponry. Is The Clown such a big player on the world stage that he couldn't be easily replaced?
Starmer has performed that duty but does he really think it is a good idea at this moment in time
But you have to ask yourself now, when we have world war 2.5 (which could tend to world war 3) is it in the interest of the alleged "freeworld" to replace him and the country to be effectively leaderless for over a month.
One unlikely solution is for our "Teflon PM" to say i will stand down in say one year from now. But it won't happen
The Falklands War saved Thatchers political career and it looks like it's deja vu time -- we have one very lucky boy ( who still behaves like a juvenile)
''MPs will probably get a vote on Thursday on holding an inquiry into whether Boris Johnson lied to MPs about Partygate, the Mirror’s Pippa Crerar reports''
And then a vote to decide if the pope is a catholic ................
Just watching Starmer giving the speech of his life in the Commons absolutely flaying Johnson's lies.
He contrasts Johnson's behaviour against that of a constituent of that t**t Michael Fabricant (the one who said he knew about teachers and nurses having drinks in their staff rooms). The constituent met with Starmer to tell him how he followed the rules and couldn't be with his wife as she was dying.
The camera panned to Fabricant. He was f**king grinning, before he realised and wiped it off his face.
Don't anyone ever tell me that Kitsons like that actually care about ordinary folk.
.... just imagine what this or any other Govt might achieve IF they didnt spend a massive amount of time defending justifying nullifying and reacting (and loads of other 'ings] to crises that they have overseen and have mainly been avoidable
Cummings to name one. He put Barnard Castle on the map and then they spent lets say "lots of time" doing the above when they could have done lots more useful things with their time
I feel this Rwanda thing is the same { a distraction ] on which thousands of Parliament hours will be spent before it is allowed to fizzle out at a huge cost to Taxpayers in monetary terms and Govt in time
... im sure legislations , committees of Fishing Clubs & Sports & Social Clubs through to Village and Town Councils do exactly the same and Govts of every colour in lots of Countries
.... just imagine what this or any other Govt might achieve IF they didnt spend a massive amount of time defending justifying nullifying and reacting (and loads of other 'ings] to crises that they have overseen and have mainly been avoidable
Cummings to name one. He put Barnard Castle on the map and then they spent lets say "lots of time" doing the above when they could have done lots more useful things with their time
I feel this Rwanda thing is the same { a distraction ] on which thousands of Parliament hours will be spent before it is allowed to fizzle out at a huge cost to Taxpayers in monetary terms and Govt in time
... im sure legislations , committees of Fishing Clubs & Sports & Social Clubs through to Village and Town Councils do exactly the same and Govts of every colour in lots of Countries
Fishing and social clubs don't normally lie to each other, encourage others to lie and poison the water for everyone else though wolfie.
Boris Johnson has plenty to talk about other than Partygate whereas Keir Starmer has nothing to offer regarding other subjects.
Boris Johnson is saved by the piss poor, embarrassing opposition.
If Keir Starmer was Donny Rovers owner he'd be constantly talking about how shit Rotherham United are.
If the leader of the country is proven to be dishonest, there really is nothing else to talk about. How can we move forward with anything, if we can't trust the man at the top?
.....Come to think of it, Labour's most partisan fans on this forum are no different to their leader.Boris Johnson has plenty to talk about other than Partygate whereas Keir Starmer has nothing to offer regarding other subjects.
Boris Johnson is saved by the piss poor, embarrassing opposition.
If Keir Starmer was Donny Rovers owner he'd be constantly talking about how shit Rotherham United are.
And in rolls the most partisan poster in this forum, trotting out unfiltered precisely the line that our criminal PM used yesterday.
If the leader of the country is proven to be dishonest, there really is nothing else to talk about. How can we move forward with anything, if we can't trust the man at the top?
If the leader of the country is proven to be dishonest, there really is nothing else to talk about. How can we move forward with anything, if we can't trust the man at the top?
And what about the dishonesty of the man at the top of the Labour party?
If I was Labour I'd be wanting to find a way to drag it out and keep the PM from leaving. 2 years is a long time and 2 years for a successor to rid the Covid parties puts the focus elsewhere and that's less comfortable for Labour. There best shot of getting power is keeping the opposition down.
If the leader of the country is proven to be dishonest, there really is nothing else to talk about. How can we move forward with anything, if we can't trust the man at the top?
And what about the dishonesty of the man at the top of the Labour party?
All at the expense of a Labour party leader who ignores the democracy of the British people including members of his own party.
The pile of evidence grows steadily that the russians under putin have bought their way into UK politics and funded the man and party they wanted in government.
The pile of evidence grows steadily that the russians under putin have bought their way into UK politics and funded the man and party they wanted in government.
The same man they have just banned from entering their country? For being hostile? And liz truss, and Ben Wallace?
It’s actually quite a high bar that the committee of privileges will have to consider. I mean I think it is ... not debated that the house was misled. I think even the prime minister effectively admits that the house was misled.
It was said that rules weren’t broken, and it is self-evident that rules were broken. So the house was misled. It got a false impression. The question is whether that was intentional.
Chris Bryant MP in the debate
It’s actually quite a high bar that the committee of privileges will have to consider. I mean I think it is ... not debated that the house was misled. I think even the prime minister effectively admits that the house was misled.
It was said that rules weren’t broken, and it is self-evident that rules were broken. So the house was misled. It got a false impression. The question is whether that was intentional.
Chris Bryant MP in the debate
Johnson's line now is: I accept I broke my own law but I didn't think I was breaking it when I broke it, so I didn't intentionally mislead the House.
Which of course means he is admitting he was too f**king thick to undert his own law. But we should still keep him as Leader in the most dangerous international conflict in half a century.
You'd think blind, dyed in the wool tory voters would have plenty to say about their beloved leader instead trying to deflect away to Starmer who is a better man all round with a honours relating to his previous career, whereas johnson is still under investigation regarding his former job and will most likely be under investigation regarding this one too.
Martin Kettle gives a good breakdown of the current situation
https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2022/apr/20/boris-johnson-vote-partygate-cost-of-living-crisis-prime-minister
So the Met will not be issuing anymore Partygate fines until after the local Elections. Because to do so might affect people's voting.
Is that how democracy works then? You vote in ignorance of the facts that someone on high decides you shouldn't have?
So the Met will not be issuing anymore Partygate fines until after the local Elections. Because to do so might affect people's voting.
Is that how democracy works then? You vote in ignorance of the facts that someone on high decides you shouldn't have?
BST,
I am not sure that this is correct.
The Met are not giving out any details on fines issued, but it seems the whole process has not been suspended.
https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2022/apr/21/met-police-delay-updates-on-partygate-fines-until-after-may-local-elections
I have no idea what "the restrictions" the Met refer to actually are.
The idea that investigation and progress reports on criminal acts should be shelved because of local council elections is completely bizarre.
Does anyone know of any precedent for this type of action taken previously by the police?
I think the general populous are in no doubt about Partygate.
One fine or a hundred?
Does it make any difference?
One pint of petrol on the fire, or a gallon?
I think the general populous are in no doubt about Partygate.
One fine or a hundred?
Does it make any difference?
One pint of petrol on the fire, or a gallon?
I think the general populous are in no doubt about Partygate.
One fine or a hundred?
Does it make any difference?
One pint of petrol on the fire, or a gallon?
would this be your view on all offences NR?
There is a argument for him to be charged with more serious offences surely, and under normal circumstance unless a person asks for other offences to be taken into consideration then a greater sentence or fine can be given.
Imagine the police dealing with 12 instances of breaking the same law in a single household for an ordinary citizen?
The point is NR, Johnson's defence against the birthday cake fine is that he was only there for 9 mins and the "party" only included workmates he was already working with. Of course that implies that his missus's home designer was a key work colleague because she was there as well. But no matter. We've seen from responses in here that some people have so little ability to see through bullshit like this that they are prepared to swallow that line.You mention the interior designer, but what about Carrie Antoinette, is she authorised to wander round the offices in No10 during the working day?
It is a different matter altogether if the Met concludes that he was complicit in the BYOB knees up. I struggle to see how even Johnson could concoct an excuse to that one that anyone could honestly buy into.
The point is NR, Johnson's defence against the birthday cake fine is that he was only there for 9 mins and the "party" only included workmates he was already working with. Of course that implies that his missus's home designer was a key work colleague because she was there as well. But no matter. We've seen from responses in here that some people have so little ability to see through bullshit like this that they are prepared to swallow that line.You mention the interior designer, but what about Carrie Antoinette, is she authorised to wander round the offices in No10 during the working day?
It is a different matter altogether if the Met concludes that he was complicit in the BYOB knees up. I struggle to see how even Johnson could concoct an excuse to that one that anyone could honestly buy into.
Tory party whips telling Backbenchers not to be 'spooked' if Johnson gets a £10k fine for the party held after Cummings resigned.
https://news.sky.com/story/angela-rayner-condemns-sexist-and-misogynistic-mail-on-sunday-article-claiming-tory-mps-accuse-her-of-basic-instinct-ploy-to-distract-pm-12597729
How desperate are the Tories to deflect/distract ??
Has anybody said it's just the Tory MPs?
Rachel Reeves on tv this morning saying that sexism is rife in Parliament.
She didn’t say it was just from one side so by definition it appears to be a generalisation.
Not just the Tory MPs then.
Has anybody said it's just the Tory MPs?
Well, possibly Angela Raynor.
"But it is the PM who is dragging the Conservative Party into the sewer - and the anonymous Tory MPs doing his bidding are complicit. He and his cheerleaders clearly have a big problem with women in public life. They should be ashamed of themselves.”
Has anybody said it's just the Tory MPs?
Well, possibly Angela Raynor.
"But it is the PM who is dragging the Conservative Party into the sewer - and the anonymous Tory MPs doing his bidding are complicit. He and his cheerleaders clearly have a big problem with women in public life. They should be ashamed of themselves.”
It was the MOS who said they were Tory MPs they were reporting on, not Angela Raynor.
That's if you believe there were any 'anonymous' Tory MPs involved in the first place, of course, and not just the MOS making up them up to create a story.
Has anybody said it's just the Tory MPs?
Well, possibly Angela Raynor.
"But it is the PM who is dragging the Conservative Party into the sewer - and the anonymous Tory MPs doing his bidding are complicit. He and his cheerleaders clearly have a big problem with women in public life. They should be ashamed of themselves.”
It was the MOS who said they were Tory MPs they were reporting on, not Angela Raynor.
That's if you believe there were any 'anonymous' Tory MPs involved in the first place, of course, and not just the MOS making up them up to create a story.
The words I quoted were from Raynor.
Rachel Reeves on tv this morning saying that sexism is rife in Parliament.
She didn’t say it was just from one side so by definition it appears to be a generalisation.
Not just the Tory MPs then.
''More than 100 fines have now been issued over partygate, say Met police – UK politics live''
''More than 100 fines have now been issued over partygate, say Met police – UK politics live''
But surprisingly nothing in the post for Johnson?
I'm imagining quite a few lefty's Throwing strops today.
Rachel Reeves on tv this morning saying that sexism is rife in Parliament.
She didn’t say it was just from one side so by definition it appears to be a generalisation.
Not just the Tory MPs then.
I'm not sure how she would know this, because it would have to be a very dark night for someone to "bump"into her.
Just not sure about her, sitting there in the commons with her grans old undies on her face, she just has something about he i can't quite put my finger on it, is she related to Michael Howard the ex Tory mp.
There's defiantly "something of the the night" about her!
There's a very odd comment from the Met. The Acting Deputy Commissioner said that whether an event took place in someone's home was taken into account in deciding whether or not to impose a fine. I fail to see why that should be a factor - surely you either broke the law or you didn't, regardless of where (the daughter of a friend was a student during the first lockdown and was fined for having friends round to her house).
As BFYP says, it'll be interesting to see the detail in the Sue Gray report.
And
''The conclusion of the Met investigation into Partygate does not just mean that the Sue Gray report into the lockdown-busting events will be published imminently; it also triggers the launch of the privileges committee inquiry into claims that Boris Johnson deliberately misled MPs when he said the rules were followed at all times.
The Commons voted for this investigation to go ahead last month, but the motion passed by MPs said the committee would “not begin substantive consideration of the matter” until the Met inquiry was over''
It's never ends
Turns out that the Met only looked at some of the alleged breaches, not all of them;
https://www.mirror.co.uk/news/politics/partygate-police-probed-just-two-27013954
So how can they be satisfied that no further actionable breaches took place?
Turns out that the Met only looked at some of the alleged breaches, not all of them;
https://www.mirror.co.uk/news/politics/partygate-police-probed-just-two-27013954
So how can they be satisfied that no further actionable breaches took place?
Turns out that the Met only looked at some of the alleged breaches, not all of them;
https://www.mirror.co.uk/news/politics/partygate-police-probed-just-two-27013954
So how can they be satisfied that no further actionable breaches took place?
So let's get this right. He attended 4 social events at his place of work, where people who shouldn't have been there were invited and have been fined for breaking the law. And it never dawned on him to stop the social events in his office? And that's all hunky dory?
This is worth watching:
https://twitter.com/williamnhutton/status/1527226028799688704?s=20&t=UuzH1NpKLBGfD1kVo1llUA
BobG
And all the relatives and friends that missed seeing their loved ones a critical times
And all the relatives and friends that missed seeing their loved ones a critical times
The law is reason free from passion. Leave your emotional arguments at the door
I would Syd yes, I would also say my personal opinion is that as soon as emotive subject matter is brought into a debate then the debate loses focus. Feelings are the problem of the individual, not society. Party gate is as simple as person breaks law, person gets punished. As much as I hate the hypocrisy and the people involved, being equal under the law brings it down to that. Feelings are irrelevant
Have I missed this Sajid Javids brother is Deputy Commisioner at the Met.!!! Is Dick still in charge or is this chap acting as boss at the mo? Obvioualy no conspiracy theories can come from this?
Emotive b*llocks, emotion should never drive law. Reason does
Don’t hate Syd, it’s only one point
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.mirror.co.uk/news/politics/met-police-stitch-up-claim-26102172.amp
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.mirror.co.uk/news/politics/met-police-stitch-up-claim-26102172.amp
I struggle to believe that the government and the police has allowed this to happen, but then again. Maybe there was more than Dick looking after things.
I would Syd yes, I would also say my personal opinion is that as soon as emotive subject matter is brought into a debate then the debate loses focus. Feelings are the problem of the individual, not society. Party gate is as simple as person breaks law, person gets punished. As much as I hate the hypocrisy and the people involved, being equal under the law brings it down to that. Feelings are irrelevant
Until recent years that's always been true LDR. It always used to be said that 'Hard cases make bad law'. But we've seen several instances of public emotion driving political action more lately. I'm not making any political point here either. It's true of all major parties. But reactive legislation, clearly driven by public emotion and the seeking after votes is unlikely to lead to happy long term outcomes.
BobG
So has Carrie Antoinette been fined £10k for organising the cake do in Downing St?See post #885
Only fair because others were fined for organising events and gatherings at the time.
Anyone smelling a rat with this Met enquiry yet?
Perhaps the other 48% will try to overturn that.
I wonder what percentage of the country will trust The Durham Constabulary when they don't give Keir Starmer a fixed penalty fine?
Of course he isn't, and he knows it. He's used it to come over all decent and moral and honest but the only people he's convinced are those who didn't need convincing in the first place. Put it this way, supposing (hypothetically speaking because it won't happen) he was told he had broken the law but was not going to be fined. Why won't he be decent and moral enough to resign then?I wonder what percentage of the country will trust The Durham Constabulary when they don't give Keir Starmer a fixed penalty fine?
There is no way Starmer is getting fined. His resignation would put the heat back on Johnson.
Of course he isn't, and he knows it. He's used it to come over all decent and moral and honest but the only people he's convinced are those who didn't need convincing in the first place. Put it this way, supposing (hypothetically speaking because it won't happen) he was told he had broken the law but was not going to be fined. Why won't he be decent and moral enough to resign then?I wonder what percentage of the country will trust The Durham Constabulary when they don't give Keir Starmer a fixed penalty fine?
There is no way Starmer is getting fined. His resignation would put the heat back on Johnson.
According to a Yougov poll, 52% of the public don't trust The Met investigation.
A bloke who has built his entire reputation on upholding the law can't hold on if he's broken the law.https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2022/05/10/sir-keir-starmer-will-not-resign-beergate-broke-rules-isnt-fined/
As I understand it, unless he is issued with a fine then he hasn't broken the law.
Have I missed this Sajid Javids brother is Deputy assistant Commisioner at the Met.!!! Is Dick still in charge or is this chap acting as boss at the mo? Obvioualy no conspiracy theories can come from this?
A bloke who has built his entire reputation on upholding the law can't hold on if he's broken the law.https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2022/05/10/sir-keir-starmer-will-not-resign-beergate-broke-rules-isnt-fined/
As I understand it, unless he is issued with a fine then he hasn't broken the law.
So you're not classing breaking the rules and breaking the law as the same thing?
I wonder what percentage of the country will trust The Durham Constabulary when they don't give Keir Starmer a fixed penalty fine?
There is no way Starmer is getting fined. His resignation would put the heat back on Johnson.
Sue Gray and Boris Johnson had private meeting to discuss handling of partygate report, Sky News understands:
https://twitter.com/SkyNews/status/1527726289527898113
'impartial investigation'
Murdoch's top political journalist confirms this is correct:
Everyone in Britain still acts as if this was a normal government. Instead it is a project of deliberate destruction, of laws, of institutions, of anything that stands in the way of a PM who just doesn’t want to be held to account
https://twitter.com/ShippersUnbound/status/1527729072398278657
But Keir Starmer had a beer with his dinner.
Sue Gray and Boris Johnson had private meeting to discuss handling of partygate report, Sky News understands:
https://twitter.com/SkyNews/status/1527726289527898113
'impartial investigation'
I thought the report was mostly finished ages ago? Reviewing the outcome seems entirely appropriate to me, as long as the full report is published.
Sue Gray and Boris Johnson had private meeting to discuss handling of partygate report, Sky News understands:
https://twitter.com/SkyNews/status/1527726289527898113
'impartial investigation'
I thought the report was mostly finished ages ago? Reviewing the outcome seems entirely appropriate to me, as long as the full report is published.
Now they are disputing who initiated this meeting. Gray is furious Johnson is claiming it was her. Who to believe?
It seems to be every little thing is a bit dodgy.
Murdoch's top political journalist confirms this is correct:
Everyone in Britain still acts as if this was a normal government. Instead it is a project of deliberate destruction, of laws, of institutions, of anything that stands in the way of a PM who just doesn’t want to be held to account
https://twitter.com/ShippersUnbound/status/1527729072398278657
But Keir Starmer had a beer with his dinner.
Mmm, not quite the whole scenario there wilts.
Was it an illegal gathering, he denied at first that his deputy leader was present then suddenly realised there was evidence to prove she was there so he “remembered” that she was.
She is hardly difficult to miss is she.
Wilts, from The Northern Echo.
Labour made a “genuine mistake” in denying Angela Rayner was at a campaign event in Durham where Sir Keir Starmer was photographed drinking beer.
That was admission of the party leader when questioned about the issue on Sky News on Sunday today.
Murdoch's top political journalist confirms this is correct:
Everyone in Britain still acts as if this was a normal government. Instead it is a project of deliberate destruction, of laws, of institutions, of anything that stands in the way of a PM who just doesn’t want to be held to account
https://twitter.com/ShippersUnbound/status/1527729072398278657
But Keir Starmer had a beer with his dinner.
Mmm, not quite the whole scenario there wilts.
Was it an illegal gathering, he denied at first that his deputy leader was present then suddenly realised there was evidence to prove she was there so he “remembered” that she was.
She is hardly difficult to miss is she.
Wilts, from The Northern Echo.
Labour made a “genuine mistake” in denying Angela Rayner was at a campaign event in Durham where Sir Keir Starmer was photographed drinking beer.
That was admission of the party leader when questioned about the issue on Sky News on Sunday today.
But that's not what you said hound:Murdoch's top political journalist confirms this is correct:
Everyone in Britain still acts as if this was a normal government. Instead it is a project of deliberate destruction, of laws, of institutions, of anything that stands in the way of a PM who just doesn’t want to be held to account
https://twitter.com/ShippersUnbound/status/1527729072398278657
But Keir Starmer had a beer with his dinner.
Mmm, not quite the whole scenario there wilts.
Was it an illegal gathering, he denied at first that his deputy leader was present then suddenly realised there was evidence to prove she was there so he “remembered” that she was.
She is hardly difficult to miss is she.
'he denied at first'
Looks like it is easy for people to make mistakes and get things wrong. Even when they know what actually happened as they saw a tv interview about it.
That doesn't make them liars.
Being present at an event then giving a false account of that event - that's a liar.
Hound said something to me that wasn't true. I don't believe hound lied here - he just got it wrong.
Wilts, from The Northern Echo.
Labour made a “genuine mistake” in denying Angela Rayner was at a campaign event in Durham where Sir Keir Starmer was photographed drinking beer.
That was admission of the party leader when questioned about the issue on Sky News on Sunday today.
But that's not what you said hound:Murdoch's top political journalist confirms this is correct:
Everyone in Britain still acts as if this was a normal government. Instead it is a project of deliberate destruction, of laws, of institutions, of anything that stands in the way of a PM who just doesn’t want to be held to account
https://twitter.com/ShippersUnbound/status/1527729072398278657
But Keir Starmer had a beer with his dinner.
Mmm, not quite the whole scenario there wilts.
Was it an illegal gathering, he denied at first that his deputy leader was present then suddenly realised there was evidence to prove she was there so he “remembered” that she was.
She is hardly difficult to miss is she.
'he denied at first'
Looks like it is easy for people to make mistakes and get things wrong. Even when they know what actually happened as they saw a tv interview about it.
That doesn't make them liars.
Being present at an event then giving a false account of that event - that's a liar.
Hound said something to me that wasn't true. I don't believe hound lied here - he just got it wrong.
Wilts, is it possible that Starmer didn’t know anything about the Raynor question given that Labour were denying for three months that she was at the beer gate gathering? Could it really be possible that he knew nothing about it.
Wilts, from The Northern Echo.
Labour made a “genuine mistake” in denying Angela Rayner was at a campaign event in Durham where Sir Keir Starmer was photographed drinking beer.
That was admission of the party leader when questioned about the issue on Sky News on Sunday today.
But that's not what you said hound:Murdoch's top political journalist confirms this is correct:
Everyone in Britain still acts as if this was a normal government. Instead it is a project of deliberate destruction, of laws, of institutions, of anything that stands in the way of a PM who just doesn’t want to be held to account
https://twitter.com/ShippersUnbound/status/1527729072398278657
But Keir Starmer had a beer with his dinner.
Mmm, not quite the whole scenario there wilts.
Was it an illegal gathering, he denied at first that his deputy leader was present then suddenly realised there was evidence to prove she was there so he “remembered” that she was.
She is hardly difficult to miss is she.
'he denied at first'
Looks like it is easy for people to make mistakes and get things wrong. Even when they know what actually happened as they saw a tv interview about it.
That doesn't make them liars.
Being present at an event then giving a false account of that event - that's a liar.
Hound said something to me that wasn't true. I don't believe hound lied here - he just got it wrong.
Wilts, is it possible that Starmer didn’t know anything about the Raynor question given that Labour were denying for three months that she was at the beer gate gathering? Could it really be possible that he knew nothing about it.
I have no idea hound. Because he was never asked about it (until very recently).
Did the person who said she wasn't there know? The event was in April 2021 - they were quizzed in January 2022. They might not even have been working for the Labour Party then? Were they on the trip? Were they briefed before talking to the press? Until you know the answers to these questions then you can't say they lied - or they got the answer wrong?
It was poor of the journalists to let them get away with it that's for sure. Because she was quite clearly in Durham with Starmer, so where else would she have been eating?
And again. The insistence on convincing oneself that Starmer is lyingWilts, from The Northern Echo.
Labour made a “genuine mistake” in denying Angela Rayner was at a campaign event in Durham where Sir Keir Starmer was photographed drinking beer.
That was admission of the party leader when questioned about the issue on Sky News on Sunday today.
But that's not what you said hound:Murdoch's top political journalist confirms this is correct:
Everyone in Britain still acts as if this was a normal government. Instead it is a project of deliberate destruction, of laws, of institutions, of anything that stands in the way of a PM who just doesn’t want to be held to account
https://twitter.com/ShippersUnbound/status/1527729072398278657
But Keir Starmer had a beer with his dinner.
Mmm, not quite the whole scenario there wilts.
Was it an illegal gathering, he denied at first that his deputy leader was present then suddenly realised there was evidence to prove she was there so he “remembered” that she was.
She is hardly difficult to miss is she.
'he denied at first'
Looks like it is easy for people to make mistakes and get things wrong. Even when they know what actually happened as they saw a tv interview about it.
That doesn't make them liars.
Being present at an event then giving a false account of that event - that's a liar.
Hound said something to me that wasn't true. I don't believe hound lied here - he just got it wrong.
Wilts, is it possible that Starmer didn’t know anything about the Raynor question given that Labour were denying for three months that she was at the beer gate gathering? Could it really be possible that he knew nothing about it.
I have no idea hound. Because he was never asked about it (until very recently).
Did the person who said she wasn't there know? The event was in April 2021 - they were quizzed in January 2022. They might not even have been working for the Labour Party then? Were they on the trip? Were they briefed before talking to the press? Until you know the answers to these questions then you can't say they lied - or they got the answer wrong?
It was poor of the journalists to let them get away with it that's for sure. Because she was quite clearly in Durham with Starmer, so where else would she have been eating?
Sue Gray and Boris Johnson had private meeting to discuss handling of partygate report, Sky News understands:
https://twitter.com/SkyNews/status/1527726289527898113
'impartial investigation'
I thought the report was mostly finished ages ago? Reviewing the outcome seems entirely appropriate to me, as long as the full report is published.
What is there to review if the full report is to be published?
Clearly the only reason for them to have a meeting is to decide what part of it is NOT going to be published (allegedly the photos that showed Johnson, with beer/wine, at events for which he has not been fined).
Sue Gray and Boris Johnson had private meeting to discuss handling of partygate report, Sky News understands:
https://twitter.com/SkyNews/status/1527726289527898113
'impartial investigation'
I thought the report was mostly finished ages ago? Reviewing the outcome seems entirely appropriate to me, as long as the full report is published.
What is there to review if the full report is to be published?
Clearly the only reason for them to have a meeting is to decide what part of it is NOT going to be published (allegedly the photos that showed Johnson, with beer/wine, at events for which he has not been fined).
Not at all. It may reference him, his staff etc etc. All of these people are still subject to the same employment rules and regulations as the rest of us, hence sue gray writing to those involved in advance of publication. Its the right thing to do.
Sue Gray and Boris Johnson had private meeting to discuss handling of partygate report, Sky News understands:
https://twitter.com/SkyNews/status/1527726289527898113
'impartial investigation'
I thought the report was mostly finished ages ago? Reviewing the outcome seems entirely appropriate to me, as long as the full report is published.
What is there to review if the full report is to be published?
Clearly the only reason for them to have a meeting is to decide what part of it is NOT going to be published (allegedly the photos that showed Johnson, with beer/wine, at events for which he has not been fined).
Not at all. It may reference him, his staff etc etc. All of these people are still subject to the same employment rules and regulations as the rest of us, hence sue gray writing to those involved in advance of publication. Its the right thing to do.
which 'rest of us' are you talking about pud?
I may have missed this, apologies if has been posted before.
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-10843173/Boris-Johnson-hating-Barrister-continued-role-Partygate-probe-despite-slew-tweets.html
BST. If Starmer's not a liar, why do you want him to get in power?
Sue Gray and Boris Johnson had private meeting to discuss handling of partygate report, Sky News understands:
https://twitter.com/SkyNews/status/1527726289527898113
'impartial investigation'
I thought the report was mostly finished ages ago? Reviewing the outcome seems entirely appropriate to me, as long as the full report is published.
What is there to review if the full report is to be published?
Clearly the only reason for them to have a meeting is to decide what part of it is NOT going to be published (allegedly the photos that showed Johnson, with beer/wine, at events for which he has not been fined).
Not at all. It may reference him, his staff etc etc. All of these people are still subject to the same employment rules and regulations as the rest of us, hence sue gray writing to those involved in advance of publication. Its the right thing to do.
which 'rest of us' are you talking about pud?
People in the UK.
Simon Clarke: ''He said the “extraordinary pressure” that No 10 staff were under during the pandemic helped to explain why the Partygate lockdown breaches happened''
It's a good job that health care workers didn't respond to the long hours, pressure, extreme danger and loss of their friends colleagues in the same way.
Michael Rosen has just replied
''Dear Simon Clarke
Heard your int. on radio. Your point about the No 10 parties happening because of the extreme pressure we were under is well made. Compared to us politicos, all the nurses, doctors or families who lost relatives don't know what pressure is.
Vino glorioso
Boris
Yep, I agree that a minion might have told the press about her not being there and you are right that it was unlikely that Raynor would have eaten elsewhere and I know that you don’t know the answers.
But as leader, I find it hard to believe that no one told him (Starmer) over a three month period that there was something going on.
He would have had the opportunity much earlier to clear it all up but probably chose not to in the hope that it would all blow over.
Billy sometimes colluding with people to keep their mouth shut, or selective memories are just as devious and truth denying as lying.
Barristers and the labour Party leadership in conjunction with the Durham constabulary are very good at both it seems.
Anyway it looks as if its suited your narrative and you have fallen for it hook line and sinker anyway.
You and your like have pinned your hopes on a quisling willing to try and overturn the result of a referendum by the whole of the United Kingdom electorate. how can you ever trust a shithouse like that ever again?
Is Carrie Antoinette now on the No10 payroll?
Que?
I am confounded....
BobG
If she is then that has been kept quietIs Carrie Antoinette now on the No10 payroll?
Probably she's worked in politics as an adviser for years it's how she met her husband.
Boris Johnson pictured drinking at No 10 lockdown event https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-61557064
Oh dear. Probably Cummings leaking, as I seem to remember him saying there were more photos to come.
Boris Johnson pictured drinking at No 10 lockdown event https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-61557064
Oh dear. Probably Cummings leaking, as I seem to remember him saying there were more photos to come.
The man who took the pictures was on the itv evening news tonight.
Interesting isn’t it that Cummings was condemned as being a liar by Labour supporters when he worked at number ten but now is seen to be a purveyor of truth by them.You just couldn't make it up!
Boris Johnson pictured drinking at No 10 lockdown event https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-61557064
Oh dear. Probably Cummings leaking, as I seem to remember him saying there were more photos to come.
Except he's NOT doing the same thing Filo.
Johnson is photographed drinking at a party to celebrate one of his staff leaving. A party where many of the other attendees have been fined by the police. In other words, the party itself was illegal. And Johnson was there. Drinking.
To date, there is still zero evidence that Starmer was doing anything other than eating and drinking while working.
because it was probably arranged as a work event, so any that should be there will be ok ones that were not meant to be at work will get finedBoris Johnson pictured drinking at No 10 lockdown event https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-61557064
Oh dear. Probably Cummings leaking, as I seem to remember him saying there were more photos to come.
Why were some of the people at that event fined but not Johnson? It's either an illegal gathering contravening covid laws or its not?
Interesting isn’t it that those calling for Starmer being pictured with a beer in his hand to resign are not calling for Johnson to resign after being pictured doing the same thing
because it was probably arranged as a work event, so any that should be there will be ok ones that were not meant to be at work will get finedBoris Johnson pictured drinking at No 10 lockdown event https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-61557064
Oh dear. Probably Cummings leaking, as I seem to remember him saying there were more photos to come.
Why were some of the people at that event fined but not Johnson? It's either an illegal gathering contravening covid laws or its not?
Which unlucky Toryboy is due to be wheeled out tomorrow for the morning interviews to take the flak for the photos?
But but the PM is the right man for the job he got Brexit done, he led the vaccine rollout, we now have the lowest rate of unemployment , he is leading the fight in the support of Ukraine..... all the greatest hits and then to try and defend him do you get the feeling it wont be a Minister for ...... but some poor underling?
it's fine anyway they had a long day at work before the event so are they not entitled to a beer and a piece of cake or 2?because it was probably arranged as a work event, so any that should be there will be ok ones that were not meant to be at work will get finedBoris Johnson pictured drinking at No 10 lockdown event https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-61557064
Oh dear. Probably Cummings leaking, as I seem to remember him saying there were more photos to come.
Why were some of the people at that event fined but not Johnson? It's either an illegal gathering contravening covid laws or its not?
It was a leaving do for a member of staff. Why do you assume it was a work event?
And since it happened in Johnson's office, if there were people there who shouldn't have been there, surely he should have told them the get out?
it's fine anyway they had a long day at work before the event so are they not entitled to a beer and a piece of cake or 2?because it was probably arranged as a work event, so any that should be there will be ok ones that were not meant to be at work will get finedBoris Johnson pictured drinking at No 10 lockdown event https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-61557064
Oh dear. Probably Cummings leaking, as I seem to remember him saying there were more photos to come.
Why were some of the people at that event fined but not Johnson? It's either an illegal gathering contravening covid laws or its not?
It was a leaving do for a member of staff. Why do you assume it was a work event?
And since it happened in Johnson's office, if there were people there who shouldn't have been there, surely he should have told them the get out?
they should all resign simple as that anyone who is at work drinking beer is bending the rules at very best and should just resign but unfortunately very few if any will
so because kier stood with his beer and only moved it to his mouth it's different, so if kier has raised his glass to anyone at his work place you think he should resign?it's fine anyway they had a long day at work before the event so are they not entitled to a beer and a piece of cake or 2?because it was probably arranged as a work event, so any that should be there will be ok ones that were not meant to be at work will get finedBoris Johnson pictured drinking at No 10 lockdown event https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-61557064
Oh dear. Probably Cummings leaking, as I seem to remember him saying there were more photos to come.
Why were some of the people at that event fined but not Johnson? It's either an illegal gathering contravening covid laws or its not?
It was a leaving do for a member of staff. Why do you assume it was a work event?
And since it happened in Johnson's office, if there were people there who shouldn't have been there, surely he should have told them the get out?
Clearly it wasn't alright. The Met issued fines to many of the people there. So it's a matter of record that there was illegality at the event where Johnson has been filmed raising his glass to the attendees.
none he should resign like i have always said, so not sure who your arguing with lolthey should all resign simple as that anyone who is at work drinking beer is bending the rules at very best and should just resign but unfortunately very few if any will
Err no. Anyone at work who is drinking beer is at work.
Anyone who has stopped work for an unspecified time to have a drinks event with other people to celebrate someone leaving is not at work. They have stopped work for a social event. What work is being done in the Johnson photo?
Interesting isn’t it that those calling for Starmer being pictured with a beer in his hand to resign are not calling for Johnson to resign after being pictured doing the same thingStarmer should resign because he's a hypocrite if he doesn't practise what he preached.
so because kier stood with his beer and only moved it to his mouth it's different, so if kier has raised his glass to anyone at his work place you think he should resign?it's fine anyway they had a long day at work before the event so are they not entitled to a beer and a piece of cake or 2?because it was probably arranged as a work event, so any that should be there will be ok ones that were not meant to be at work will get finedBoris Johnson pictured drinking at No 10 lockdown event https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-61557064
Oh dear. Probably Cummings leaking, as I seem to remember him saying there were more photos to come.
Why were some of the people at that event fined but not Johnson? It's either an illegal gathering contravening covid laws or its not?
It was a leaving do for a member of staff. Why do you assume it was a work event?
And since it happened in Johnson's office, if there were people there who shouldn't have been there, surely he should have told them the get out?
Clearly it wasn't alright. The Met issued fines to many of the people there. So it's a matter of record that there was illegality at the event where Johnson has been filmed raising his glass to the attendees.
Interesting isn’t it that those calling for Starmer being pictured with a beer in his hand to resign are not calling for Johnson to resign after being pictured doing the same thingStarmer should resign because he's a hypocrite if he doesn't practise what he preached.
Is Carrie Antoinette now on the No10 payroll?
Probably she's worked in politics as an adviser for years it's how she met her husband.
The problem is he really doesn't believe/think it was a party which now makes the claim he lied to Parliament very debatable.
Poor old Grant Schnaps drawing the short straw for this mornings interviews or maybe it's because he is very good at keeping a straight face when telling the chanels it was a work event, the red boxes were there the PM was working, it wasn't a party etc
The problem is he really doesn't believe/think it was a party which now makes the claim he lied to Parliament very debatable.Like I said a while back, there was not much point in having a police investigation regarding any sort of accepted resolution because some people found Johnson guilty before the police got involved and they weren't gonna accept any other result.
Poor old Grant Schnaps drawing the short straw for this mornings interviews or maybe it's because he is very good at keeping a straight face when telling the chanels it was a work event, the red boxes were there the PM was working, it wasn't a party etc
This is the latest headline in the Express.
Cummings highlights glaring flaw in Boris photo defence and calls those backing PM 'thick'
Heh.
Is a leaving do a work event? In my experience, no. It's a social after work, usually involving drinks.is standing in your office like starmer stood up chatting having a beer a work event or is it just chilling being social after a long day at work?
What we seem to have here is a photo of a social event involving drinks. Some of those pictured have been fined for attending a social event. And there is a photo of Mr Johnson socialising too, so why no fine?
Is a leaving do a work event? In my experience, no. It's a social after work, usually involving drinks.is standing in your office like starmer stood up chatting having a beer a work event or is it just chilling being social after a long day at work?
What we seem to have here is a photo of a social event involving drinks. Some of those pictured have been fined for attending a social event. And there is a photo of Mr Johnson socialising too, so why no fine?
i have said johnson should go anyone of them that we're drinking at work while everyone else couldn't see loved ones should go, starmer is one of them people so of course they are linkedIs a leaving do a work event? In my experience, no. It's a social after work, usually involving drinks.is standing in your office like starmer stood up chatting having a beer a work event or is it just chilling being social after a long day at work?
What we seem to have here is a photo of a social event involving drinks. Some of those pictured have been fined for attending a social event. And there is a photo of Mr Johnson socialising too, so why no fine?
Whatever Starmer was doing does not change or effect what johnson was doing so I'm not sure why you continue to conflate the the two, unless you are making a poor attempt to muddy the waters.
Deal with johnson as the separate issue for that it is and what the evidence to date dictates. And yes I have seen that you say he should go, but noone has seen evidence that Starmer should go, but it will be investigated, just because you want him to be guilty doesn't make it so.
I see Grant Schnaps is now saying that Johnson wasn't partying as "he'd lost his Mother" which means he couldn't find her because she died some 10months after the photos were taken. Maybe he was looking for her and just stumbled across this leaving do which an insider says he , Johnson, actually instigated, encouraged people to continue drinking and stayed chatting to people for 20mins or so. No10 dispute this......... obviously
Bpool.yes it's different and that's why everyone there should resign or be sacked, on the link i posted above when boris went riding on his bike you and many others said he should go, how can you say that when starmer is walking round his office chatting away with a beer in hand, after sitting down to a nice curry, do you not find that worse?
Take out personalities for a moment.
Do you HONESTLY not see the difference between a gathering in the office with food and drink where the whole purpose is to give a colleague a send off (what the world calls a "leaving do") and the partaking of food and drink while working after a day when you've been out pounding the streets campaigning 200 miles from home and there's work to catch up on (commonly known as a working dinner).
I'm not saying that latter one is categorically what Starmer did - we'll see when the police report. But just tell me if you see a difference between the two as a hypothetical issue.
starmer himself has said he couldn't go and see his family, so why on earth just because he is at work can he have beer and a curry! just because he didn't raise his glass and say cheers does not make it morally right
Is a leaving do a work event? In my experience, no. It's a social after work, usually involving drinks.is standing in your office like starmer stood up chatting having a beer a work event or is it just chilling being social after a long day at work?
What we seem to have here is a photo of a social event involving drinks. Some of those pictured have been fined for attending a social event. And there is a photo of Mr Johnson socialising too, so why no fine?
starmer himself has said he couldn't go and see his family, so why on earth just because he is at work can he have beer and a curry! just because he didn't raise his glass and say cheers does not make it morally rightIf he was at work and NOT eating and drinking, would that have been OK?
johnson should be sacked or resign simple as, but do you think it's ok to have curry and beer and walk around your office with it? i have made it clear so many times my take on johnson but none of you are prepared to say that it is bending the rules at best having beer and curry at work lol, maybe we should all have gone round to our friends house for a curry and beer and just said we were workingIs a leaving do a work event? In my experience, no. It's a social after work, usually involving drinks.is standing in your office like starmer stood up chatting having a beer a work event or is it just chilling being social after a long day at work?
What we seem to have here is a photo of a social event involving drinks. Some of those pictured have been fined for attending a social event. And there is a photo of Mr Johnson socialising too, so why no fine?
Was Starmer standing in the office of the MP for Durham talking to people, part of his work during the campaign for the Hartlepol By-election (and local elections in the North-East)?
Was Johnson holding a wine glass in the air in a room with a table covered in wine bottles and party snacks, part of his work in tackling the Covid pandemic (which is what he supposed to be doing at the time)?
I dont know the answer to either of these questions - but I can make a good guess.
Well this ups the ante rather.it does not make it right no matter what bst, how many times on the corona virus thread have you gone on about morals, it seems you don't have many yourself when it comes to politics
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-61566410
But yeah. Curry.
starmer himself has said he couldn't go and see his family, so why on earth just because he is at work can he have beer and a curry! just because he didn't raise his glass and say cheers does not make it morally rightIf he was at work and NOT eating and drinking, would that have been OK?
What about if he'd been at work and eating a sandwich and drinking coffee?
What about if he'd been at work and popped outside for a fag, while continuing to talk with a colleague about the work issues he was addressing?
Well this ups the ante rather.it does not make it right no matter what bst, how many times on the corona virus thread have you gone on about morals, it seems you don't have many yourself when it comes to politics
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-61566410
But yeah. Curry.
And why would johnson lie about it if he had nothing to worry about? it wasn't a party apparently
There’s not a cat in hells chance Starmer will be fined let’s be right about it. At worst case it’s an honest mistake. Incidentally durhams police and crime commissioner is Labour, sure this won’t influence anything mind………
There’s not a cat in hells chance Starmer will be fined let’s be right about it. At worst case it’s an honest mistake. Incidentally durhams police and crime commissioner is Labour, sure this won’t influence anything mind………
I'm sure the Durham police crime commissioner will put as much effort into the Starmer investigation as he did with the cummings one.
Is a leaving do a work event? In my experience, no. It's a social after work, usually involving drinks.is standing in your office like starmer stood up chatting having a beer a work event or is it just chilling being social after a long day at work?
What we seem to have here is a photo of a social event involving drinks. Some of those pictured have been fined for attending a social event. And there is a photo of Mr Johnson socialising too, so why no fine?
I seem to recollect that BST has said Starmer must resign if fined, what more can he say?Well this ups the ante rather.it does not make it right no matter what bst, how many times on the corona virus thread have you gone on about morals, it seems you don't have many yourself when it comes to politics
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-61566410
But yeah. Curry.
Well this ups the ante rather.it does not make it right no matter what bst, how many times on the corona virus thread have you gone on about morals, it seems you don't have many yourself when it comes to politics
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-61566410
But yeah. Curry.
I seem to recollect that BST has said Starmer must resign if fined, what more can he say?Well this ups the ante rather.it does not make it right no matter what bst, how many times on the corona virus thread have you gone on about morals, it seems you don't have many yourself when it comes to politics
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-61566410
But yeah. Curry.
You know, I just think Cummings has connections within Downing St.
There will be a lot of staff feeling hard done by after being thrown under the bus to protect Johnsons skin.
Over 300 photos submitted to the Met Police with regards to partying in No.10. (Three Hundred!!!).
1 photo of Starmer drinking a beer after a day when we know he had been working.
Do you think the guy who took the Starmer photo took just one pic and did a runner?
Or do you think he sat there all night and that was the best ‘evidence’ of law breaking he could come up with?
(Maybe he’s keeping back the pic of Starmer doing the Okey Cokey with Rayner, till the price is right)?
I doth my cap to the person(s) that took all these photos. Genuinely. I wonder if they were taking knowing full well the damage they would cause.
And then disclosed them at the relevant times.
They do seem to be trickling out to cause the most damage possible.
I wonder if anyone is getting paid for them? They would appear to be very, very valuable.
I suppose it would not be hard to work out who took them if you were there.
The press don’t seem to keen to disclose who the photographers are though ?
Never reveal your source I suppose?
Are you sure that might not happen in view of events elsewhere?I seem to recollect that BST has said Starmer must resign if fined, what more can he say?Well this ups the ante rather.it does not make it right no matter what bst, how many times on the corona virus thread have you gone on about morals, it seems you don't have many yourself when it comes to politics
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-61566410
But yeah. Curry.
Could that be because bst knows that Durham police have already said they won’t issue fines retrospectively?
Just saying like.
Are you sure that might not happen in view of events elsewhere?I seem to recollect that BST has said Starmer must resign if fined, what more can he say?Well this ups the ante rather.it does not make it right no matter what bst, how many times on the corona virus thread have you gone on about morals, it seems you don't have many yourself when it comes to politics
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-61566410
But yeah. Curry.
Could that be because bst knows that Durham police have already said they won’t issue fines retrospectively?
Just saying like.
Regarding the Panorama investigation, I take it that some of you on here will be dropping your agenda against Laura Kuenssberg, now that she's obviously not pandering to the Tory Party, which you've accused her of in the past.
Over 300 photos submitted to the Met Police with regards to partying in No.10. (Three Hundred!!!).
1 photo of Starmer drinking a beer after a day when we know he had been working.
Do you think the guy who took the Starmer photo took just one pic and did a runner?
Or do you think he sat there all night and that was the best ‘evidence’ of law breaking he could come up with?
(Maybe he’s keeping back the pic of Starmer doing the Okey Cokey with Rayner, till the price is right)?
Regarding the Panorama investigation, I take it that some of you on here will be dropping your agenda against Laura Kuenssberg, now that she's obviously not pandering to the Tory Party, which you've accused her of in the past.
So if it was a video perhaps the claim that whoever made it was there for forty odd minutes is true.
So if it was a video perhaps the claim that whoever made it was there for forty odd minutes is true.
I know its a video because I have seen some short clips. How long the whole thing is, sorry dont know.
On that agenda that came out a couple of weeks ago they were due to be in the hall for an hour and half - working with their meal maybe?
So if it was a video perhaps the claim that whoever made it was there for forty odd minutes is true.
I know its a video because I have seen some short clips. How long the whole thing is, sorry dont know.
On that agenda that came out a couple of weeks ago they were due to be in the hall for an hour and half - working with their meal maybe?
Yeah, quite possible.
It’s just that someone said that the student who took the picture(video) CLAIMED to have been there for 45 minutes.
So if it was a video perhaps the claim that whoever made it was there for forty odd minutes is true.
I know its a video because I have seen some short clips. How long the whole thing is, sorry dont know.
On that agenda that came out a couple of weeks ago they were due to be in the hall for an hour and half - working with their meal maybe?
Yeah, quite possible.
It’s just that someone said that the student who took the picture(video) CLAIMED to have been there for 45 minutes.
I dunno, maybe, it wasn't me. All I know it is a video and was taken by a student at an illegal party in the halls across the way.
I would guess that if there was really damning evidence of Starmer doing something illegal, the Daily Heil/S*n would pay anything for it and have it up on their website in a shot.
And why would johnson lie about it if he had nothing to worry about? it wasn't a party apparently
You and your mates, sorry, Labour supporting co posters, had demanded the PM resign as soon as the news broke. Before an investigation began. Before the police got involved.
But, but but, that was ok wasn’t it.
Boris Johnson is going to apologise. Again. In a 'day of contrition'.
How many official apologies is this now?
It's just words, sorry iis the easiest.
Boris Johnson is going to apologise. Again. In a 'day of contrition'.
How many official apologies is this now?
It's just words, sorry iis the easiest.
Boris Johnson is going to apologise. Again. In a 'day of contrition'.
How many official apologies is this now?
It's just words, sorry iis the easiest.
I fail to see how
1. He hasn't yet resigned.
2. His fellow conservatives haven't ditched him yet.
He should have been gone months ago today should just confirm it.
He'll be fine today. The line will be:
He really didn't think he was at any parties.
He's appalled at what happened.
He takes fully responsibility.
Now let's move on.
And about 30% of the electorate will be perfectly happy with that and accept that we have, for the first time in history, a PM that has broken the law and lied to Parliament. And that's how these things just get normalised and the foundations of democracy get undermined.
Boris Johnson is going to apologise. Again. In a 'day of contrition'.
How many official apologies is this now?
It's just words, sorry iis the easiest.
I fail to see how
1. He hasn't yet resigned.
2. His fellow conservatives haven't ditched him yet.
He should have been gone months ago today should just confirm it.
And why would johnson lie about it if he had nothing to worry about? it wasn't a party apparently
You and your mates, sorry, Labour supporting co posters, had demanded the PM resign as soon as the news broke. Before an investigation began. Before the police got involved.
But, but but, that was ok wasn’t it.
post #6 this thread bp
''Has to resign simple as that''
post #7 this thread hound
Has to resign simple as that
:that:
you're welcome :)
The met police are going to investigate the parties held at number 10 over the last 2 years this has to be the final nail in his coffin
Not too sure about that. Watch out for PMQ's tomorrow - 'Sue Grays report publication will have to wait until the result of the police enquiry'!
IMO 'Dame Dick' knows exactly what she's doing - protect Big Dog!
This is corruption beyond belief.
The Met have categorically said all the way through this that their policy is not to investigate retrospective COVID breaches.
The Gray Report is just about to be released, and would almost certainly mean the end of Johnson's career.
Suddenly the Met are investigating and as a result, the Gray Report has been shelved.
Which means Johnson's safe for the meantime. He's kicked the can down the road and will hope that something else comes up to save him.
At what point do we wake up and realise what this Kitson and his entourage are doing to our democracy?
Sue Gray stopped investigating to let the police investigate which meant that neither of them investigated the party in the flat. What sort of logic is this?
It smells of collusion.
And why would johnson lie about it if he had nothing to worry about? it wasn't a party apparently
You and your mates, sorry, Labour supporting co posters, had demanded the PM resign as soon as the news broke. Before an investigation began. Before the police got involved.
But, but but, that was ok wasn’t it.
post #6 this thread bp
''Has to resign simple as that''
post #7 this thread hound
Has to resign simple as that
:that:
you're welcome :)
Sue Gray stopped investigating to let the police investigate which meant that neither of them investigated the party in the flat. What sort of logic is this?
It smells of collusion.
Sounds like a committee
Sue Gray stopped investigating to let the police investigate which meant that neither of them investigated the party in the flat. What sort of logic is this?
It smells of collusion.
Sounds like a committee
Investigations into beer starmer: 2
Investigations into party flat: 0
He'll be fine today. The line will be:
He really didn't think he was at any parties.
He's appalled at what happened.
He takes fully responsibility.
Now let's move on.
And about 30% of the electorate will be perfectly happy with that and accept that we have, for the first time in history, a PM that has broken the law and lied to Parliament. And that's how these things just get normalised and the foundations of democracy get undermined.
I've got a ton on Starmer getting a 6 month suspended sentence.
The report isn't particularly damning of the pm directly overall. Even the famed so called garden party has been found to have been a genuine work meeting which I think we can all believe as we could with Keir Starmer assuming the rumoured partying is untrue.
But the real problem is not that, it's that he allowed the other staff to partake in these things. He should have had control of his whole office and he did not. Taking responsibility would be to resign not say sorry. I totally get that he feels like he didn't directly do much wrong as he probably didn't. But he's the leader in that place and should have control and then lied about it. He has no dignity.
I've got a ton on Starmer getting a 6 month suspended sentence.
I’ve got a ton of rubble on my front drive I’d like to put on Starmer. Literally.
Another bad day at the office lads?
In that case, if Johnson retains power in the next election, we should never accept it because those who didn't vote for him think he shouldn't lead the country.Another bad day at the office lads?
You don't get it do you, you smug unpleasant man.
Johnson staying in No10 is THE best outcome for Labour. He's now forever tainted by this.
I want him gone, not for party advantage, but because we should never, evser accept and normalise having a morally bankrupt pathological liar leading the country.
We are quickly approaching the point of Britain being a nation of liars aren't we?Was it ever really different?
We tell lies when we sign treaties
We tell lies in the House of Commons
We tell lies, by omission at least, when we report on current events
We tell lies when we seek to vilify someone
We tell lies every time the press goes to print
We tell lies by misusing 96% of statistics....
We tell lies to ourselves every single day by pretending to a world role that we do not and cannot have
We tell lies by pretending we care about the mentally ill, the deprived, refugees and the North
We tell lies about the impact that Brexit will have
We tell lies about the flow of money, where it comes from and where it goes
This country is fundamentally dishonest.
BobG
I'm sure it's been said before but the line up of potential replacements for Johnson is as dark as it gets. That's not to say Johnson shouldn't go. As BST said, it's a line that has been crossed, and then there's his history confirming that this is not a one of gaff, not that it was one off. He's persistently taking the piss. This is what Tory voters and MPs are content with.And none is as dark as Keir Starmer.
Word of the day is 'misken' (15th century): to refuse to recognise something by pretending it's not happening.
Starmer is far from my favourite, but not in the same league of perversity as the Tories. You'd prefer Sunak and his ability to understand the ordinary person, his sharing of his vast vast wealth, his denial of his wife's hoarding as being relevant even if not invested in off shore pirate states? Or Truss and her cheesy lines? Or Mogg's Victorian capitalism? Or...?I'm sure it's been said before but the line up of potential replacements for Johnson is as dark as it gets. That's not to say Johnson shouldn't go. As BST said, it's a line that has been crossed, and then there's his history confirming that this is not a one of gaff, not that it was one off. He's persistently taking the piss. This is what Tory voters and MPs are content with.And none is as dark as Keir Starmer.
Yes.Starmer is far from my favourite, but not in the same league of perversity as the Tories. You'd prefer Sunak and his ability to understand the ordinary person, his sharing of his vast vast wealth, his denial of his wife's hoarding as being relevant even if not invested in off shore pirate states? Or Truss and her cheesy lines? Or Mogg's Victorian capitalism? Or...?I'm sure it's been said before but the line up of potential replacements for Johnson is as dark as it gets. That's not to say Johnson shouldn't go. As BST said, it's a line that has been crossed, and then there's his history confirming that this is not a one of gaff, not that it was one off. He's persistently taking the piss. This is what Tory voters and MPs are content with.And none is as dark as Keir Starmer.
There's still the Parliamentary investigation into him misleading the Commons to go yet.
He hasn't really got away with anything has he?It's more the fools that put him in office, they must have thought despite evidence that somehow he could change that somehow the tory party would put the country before their self interest.
He's shown to be a liar and untrustworthy. He can't deny it.
It's the tory MPs who are choosing not to do anything about the situation. Somehow I don't think leaving him in power will prove to be a wise decision but we'll see.
It's not really a question of him getting away with it. It's the damage it does to our system of Government.You talk about lies and principles yet you want the Labour party to gain power in the only way it can, by means of right-wing policies and then conning the electorate by changing to left-wing policies.
Starmer doesn't always get the tone right in Parliament, but he was bang on today when he said our Constitution us fragile. It depends on political leaders at core being honest, and knowing that if they are not, and they get caught, that's curtains for them.
Our system gives the PM effectively unlimited power if Parliament doesn't control him or her. Once you establish the principle that a PM can lie baldly to Parliament and not be held to account, the system is smashed.
I really don't give a f**k what happens to that moral vacuum, Johnson. But I care very much about the damage he is inflicting on our Government, and I worry a lot about the standard he is setting for future politicians.
How many people think Starmer's a liar?
How many people think Starmer's a liar?
It's not really a question of him getting away with it. It's the damage it does to our system of Government.You talk about lies and principles yet you want the Labour party to gain power in the only way it can, by means of right-wing policies and then conning the electorate by changing to left-wing policies.
Starmer doesn't always get the tone right in Parliament, but he was bang on today when he said our Constitution us fragile. It depends on political leaders at core being honest, and knowing that if they are not, and they get caught, that's curtains for them.
Our system gives the PM effectively unlimited power if Parliament doesn't control him or her. Once you establish the principle that a PM can lie baldly to Parliament and not be held to account, the system is smashed.
I really don't give a f**k what happens to that moral vacuum, Johnson. But I care very much about the damage he is inflicting on our Government, and I worry a lot about the standard he is setting for future politicians.
the labour party will save quite a bit on the next election as the report has prewritten much of the the material, and the photos, especially the photos.
busadvertising
'sick on the carpet, wine on the walls, brawls in the halls'
vote tory
we promise to do our best
the labour party will save quite a bit on the next election as the report has prewritten much of the the material, and the photos, especially the photos.
busadvertising
'sick on the carpet, wine on the walls, brawls in the halls'
vote tory
we promise to do our best
Do you think that will work? What's more powerful, criticism of cheese and wine or pledges to make the country more wealthy with higher standards of living?
There's still the Parliamentary investigation into him misleading the Commons to go yet.
Which will have a Tory majority, if they want to keep Boris they will.
He hasn't got away with it though, some votes won't forget potentially enough to massively harm him.
I don't think that's right Hound
Just over half (51%) of those who still intend to vote conservative think he's a liar
It's quite concerning that so many will still vote for a liar.
61% of those who voted Conservative last time think he's a liar.
I think you replied to the wrong comment pud
How many people think Starmer's a liar?
You and hound, maybe you could scape enough together for a game of brag
I suppose political views are driven by something akin to religious faith , but when the human manifestation of on side’s particular creed is Boris Johnson, it is immensely courageous.
Mr Sunak has assured us in the strongest of terms that his recent announcement is not intended to “make smoke”. Presumably his occupancy of the Number 10 flat did not give him any inkling of the alleged rule breaking throughout the same property. (“I say Boris there was a heck of a lot of noise again downstairs last night. What was all that about?)
How many people think Starmer's a liar?
You and hound, maybe you could scape enough together for a game of brag
They wouldn't want to play Brag, Sydney. For a start neither of them have owt to brag about and it's probably above their level. They'd probably opt for Snap or Fish... forever making feeble attempts at equivalence or fishing for a reaction.
I think you replied to the wrong comment pud
Nope, it was a fair question. I want to vote for a party that's actually going to make things better for us. Labour are close to that bracket now, they will win if they are positive on what they can offer. Go in on a 'we aren't them' angle and I can't see it.
There are tories made of the right stuff you just have to wait long enough for the letters to mount up. By the time the 1922 committee has the right number of letters johnson will have changed the rule to reward errand MPs.
Corruption.
It's a slippery slope we're starting down.
At the end of the day, the human condition is all about self-survival. When people get into the voting booths, they ask themselves which Party is likely to make them better off.
Partygate will be forgotten in the 2024 GE, because the only thing on peoples' minds will be the cost of living crisis, how the Tory Government are dealing with it, and what the Labour alternatives are.
That's what will decide who wins in 2024.
I reckon it all boils down to whether the Conservative Party think they can win the next GE with Johnson as leader.
Our MP is a Tory backbencher. I feel like complaining to him about this watering down of the codes of conduct.
But he's already got his letter of no confidence into the 1922 committee.
Most people I talk to think Johnson has done OK under the circumstances and Starmer wouldn't have done any better, if not worse than him.
Everyone should take into account the difficulties he's encountered since he became PM.
Personally, I admire his resolve and determination and think he could become a very popular PM in future if he rides the current storm of disapproval.
I only tend to do that when I'm on here. It's the only way I can guarantee an intelligent conversation.Most people I talk to think Johnson has done OK under the circumstances and Starmer wouldn't have done any better, if not worse than him.
Everyone should take into account the difficulties he's encountered since he became PM.
Personally, I admire his resolve and determination and think he could become a very popular PM in future if he rides the current storm of disapproval.
Talking to yoursef doesn’t count
I reckon it all boils down to whether the Conservative Party think they can win the next GE with Johnson as leader.
Well, at the retirement flats where my Mum lives 95% of them are staunch Tories. All of them in their 80s and 90s. All of them take the Daily Mail. They all think Johnson is doing a great job.
Whether the cost of living will start to be noticed, I don't know.
The trouble is a lot of them aren't living in the real world. I mentioned to one old dear it's £3 for a cup of coffee now. She didn't believe me, saying that's an outrage £1 is enough! But she never goes out, so she doesn't know.
I think they do represent a huge demographic, with that base I'd say there is still a decent chance of Johnson being reelected, no matter what he does.
Most people I talk to think Johnson has done OK under the circumstances and Starmer wouldn't have done any better, if not worse than him.
Everyone should take into account the difficulties he's encountered since he became PM.
Personally, I admire his resolve and determination and think he could become a very popular PM in future if he rides the current storm of disapproval.
Most people I talk to think Johnson has done OK under the circumstances and Starmer wouldn't have done any better, if not worse than him.
Everyone should take into account the difficulties he's encountered since he became PM.
Personally, I admire his resolve and determination and think he could become a very popular PM in future if he rides the current storm of disapproval.
I guess it depends on how far the Covid Inquiry will have got onto by then?
Will the fact he was late to impose a lock-down thus costing 10'000's of uneccessary deaths and long-term illness, then imposed ruless on all the public that he felt able to ignore, be back into public conciousness?
His current unpopularity is not down to the circumstances but his judgment on them: (Brexit, NI Border, Covid lockdown, Covid loans, MP's second jobs, Paterson, lying to Parliament, the Russia Report & Russian donors, energy & food price rises etc). And there will be more to come - there always are.
If his followers think he has dealt with these situations well - and autocratic, corrupt leaders always have their followers, Putin, Trump, Mugabe etc - good luck to them because he wont change. He will try and find more divise cultural issues to keep them onside - because thats what he has done all his career.
He also talked about the need to have a good guy with a gun in order to be able to stop the bad guy with a gun.
In the USA it would be political suicide for anyone who backed a ban the gun policy.
Most people I talk to think Johnson has done OK under the circumstances and Starmer wouldn't have done any better, if not worse than him.
Everyone should take into account the difficulties he's encountered since he became PM.
Personally, I admire his resolve and determination and think he could become a very popular PM in future if he rides the current storm of disapproval.
It would be interesting to see that chart with stay the same and less strict combined to give an overall pro gun total.
Billy, the alternatives to Johnson are a Quisling Traitor who visibly worked to undermine the referendum result of the people, and a load of nobodies intent on costing the rest of the country money they have not got on a crusade to save the world, most of them complete nut jobs.
Take your pick.
Look Wilts, it's all 'priced in'. I don't know what the problem is.
And as for your references to lefty rag newspapers like The Times you're getting worse than Syd and his Guardian obsession!
Jim Davidson ©1978.
An irritating bloke I once knew went to live overseas but continued to message me among others offering his unwanted views on England. I said to him once, "why are you so interested in a country that you wanted to leave?" He said: "I've left England but I'm still a country member."
I said, "Yes, I remember."
Raaab must like humiliation
Fascinating that my old mucker Tobias Ellwood is increasingly seen as the intellectual voice of sanity in the Tory party.
He was as thick as a bucket of monkey spunk when we are jousting over politics at university.
Johnson booed going into St Pauls, the people doing the booing are ardent Royalists, the very people that would vote Tory!
Johnson and the queen, never the twain shall meet.
Johnson and the queen, never the twain shall meet.
Becoming a bit of a theme isn't it?
So you genuinely think it was a crowd consisting only of royalists and not a single anti-government protester there simply using the occasion to pour scorn on Johnson?
I don't believe that either. Starmer and co have offered nothing regarding opposition apart from constantly wanting Johnson to resign.
The SNP will be much more important than the Lib Dems after the next election.
The SNP will be much more important than the Lib Dems after the next election.
Agreed, but wouldn't a coalition between Labour and the SNP be thwarted by the issue of Scottish independence?
The SNP will be much more important than the Lib Dems after the next election.
Agreed, but wouldn't a coalition between Labour and the SNP be thwarted by the issue of Scottish independence?
An offer of the SNP being in charge of all central government Scottish policy might be attractive to them.
Johnson received a mixture of boos and cheers, but, of course, the cheers don't count to those who are about as right-wing as Michael McIndoe.
ON the other hand, Starmer and his supporters must be delighted and well heartened by the crowd's blistering show of silence on his arrival.
I suspect that is a bit of wishful thinking on your part. I don't doubt it at all.
Thoughts and prayers with BB x
Maybe the Labour party should also take heed of the silence Starmer received today, along with their poor by-election results.
Maybe the Labour party should also take heed of the silence Starmer received today, along with their poor by-election results.
Silence from Middle England Royalists is a good result considering they booed their own man, good try Nadine
I take it all back. Boris is doing a great job - for Labour.
Wakefield By-election polling:
LAB: 48% (+8)
CON: 28% (-19)
GRN: 8% (New)
LDM: 7% (+3)
RFM: 3% (-3)
Under half of the people who voted Tory in 2019 say they will this time. When asked their reasons why they said:
1. Boris Johnson tried to cover up partygate, and lied to the public (+40)
2. Boris Johnson is not in touch with working-class people (+39)
https://twitter.com/jamesjohnson252/status/1533147549187641344
Fascinating that my old mucker Tobias Ellwood is increasingly seen as the intellectual voice of sanity in the Tory party.
He was as thick as a bucket of monkey spunk when we are jousting over politics at university.
Heckled again in a trendy eatery.
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/tvshowbiz/article-10884699/Boris-Johnson-heckled-fellow-diners-trendy-East-London-restaurant.html
It must be leftwing, stop the war, eco-nutters following him around.
Fascinating that my old mucker Tobias Ellwood is increasingly seen as the intellectual voice of sanity in the Tory party.
He was as thick as a bucket of monkey spunk when we are jousting over politics at university.
This snippet was in the Telegraph this morning.
“We couldn’t ask for a better critic than Ellwood,” a Johnson loyalist told me on Friday. “Other MPs see him as long-winded, over-ambitious and thick – never a great combination”.
But clearly all that dissatisfaction is the result of left wing agitators Wilts/Glyn! We've been told. The PM is simply perfect. None of this mud that's being flung around is real. It's all a nasty left wing conspiracy....
BobG
But clearly all that dissatisfaction is the result of left wing agitators Wilts/Glyn! We've been told. The PM is simply perfect. None of this mud that's being flung around is real. It's all a nasty left wing conspiracy....
BobG
I can't remember anyone on here, or anywhere else, talking about a nasty left wing conspiracy.
For what it's worth, I think Johnson will be toast after the two by-election results.
But clearly all that dissatisfaction is the result of left wing agitators Wilts/Glyn! We've been told. The PM is simply perfect. None of this mud that's being flung around is real. It's all a nasty left wing conspiracy....
BobG
I can't remember anyone on here, or anywhere else, talking about a nasty left wing conspiracy.
For what it's worth, I think Johnson will be toast after the two by-election results.
Precisely my point.
He can be a liar, an incompetent, a cheat, amoral and that's all fine.
But the real crime for Tory MPs is to be a liability.
It might trigger a revote. :chair:
But clearly all that dissatisfaction is the result of left wing agitators Wilts/Glyn! We've been told. The PM is simply perfect. None of this mud that's being flung around is real. It's all a nasty left wing conspiracy....
BobG
I can't remember anyone on here, or anywhere else, talking about a nasty left wing conspiracy.
For what it's worth, I think Johnson will be toast after the two by-election results.
Precisely my point.
He can be a liar, an incompetent, a cheat, amoral and that's all fine.
But the real crime for Tory MPs is to be a liability.
But isn’t all politics based on that.
What were Labour doing when they lost with Corbyn in charge.
But clearly all that dissatisfaction is the result of left wing agitators Wilts/Glyn! We've been told. The PM is simply perfect. None of this mud that's being flung around is real. It's all a nasty left wing conspiracy....
BobG
I can't remember anyone on here, or anywhere else, talking about a nasty left wing conspiracy.
For what it's worth, I think Johnson will be toast after the two by-election results.
Precisely my point.
He can be a liar, an incompetent, a cheat, amoral and that's all fine.
But the real crime for Tory MPs is to be a liability.
But isn’t all politics based on that.
What were Labour doing when they lost with Corbyn in charge.
Ha ha ha Hound!! Bit of a quick change there! Lol.
BobG
It might trigger a revote. :chair:
I'd be up for that . After all it would be democratic if :
Labour & Lib Dems form a Coalition if either are the biggest Party but no overall majority
The minor party of the 2 joins on condition that PR is put to the people.
The people accept PR after a Referendum
Following GE the Parties are Elected via PR and then if a Party gets 15% of the Vote they get 15% of the Seats which would mean 40% of Votes would give 40% of the Seats
A lot of people ( I hope ) are then more inclined to vote as every vote counts under that system
If then the discussion comes round to B****t and the people ask for another Referendum then who could deny them it. By then in another 5 years we will be in a position to vote again having (most of us anyway) lived in the EU and "on our own" and could make an informed decision
There we are then. Vote tonight:
https://twitter.com/LOS_Fisher/status/1533708593836457984
There we are then. Vote tonight:
https://twitter.com/LOS_Fisher/status/1533708593836457984
He’ll win the vote, resulting in massive defeats in both by elections and the Tory party will crash and burn over the next 12 months
There we are then. Vote tonight:
https://twitter.com/LOS_Fisher/status/1533708593836457984
He’ll win the vote, resulting in massive defeats in both by elections and the Tory party will crash and burn over the next 12 months
There we are then. Vote tonight:
https://twitter.com/LOS_Fisher/status/1533708593836457984
He’ll win the vote, resulting in massive defeats in both by elections and the Tory party will crash and burn over the next 12 months
If he wins they'll get behind him. Politicians have survived much worse.
I hope he loses but doubt it and expect he'll win.
The noises coming out of no 10 suggests they want this vote to draw a line under it and move on.
But it's not going to draw a line under it. There are by elections, there is the standards commitee. If he gets through this tonight, it's going to keep coming back.
The only way to draw a line under it, is to replace him.
Be interesting to see if any Cabinet Ministers/ Junior ministers actually come out against him, rather than keeping silent.
The noises coming out of no 10 suggests they want this vote to draw a line under it and move on.
But it's not going to draw a line under it. There are by elections, there is the standards commitee. If he gets through this tonight, it's going to keep coming back.
The only way to draw a line under it, is to replace him.
But he'll be safe from another confidence vote for twelve months. Plenty of time to really screw the Tory party. And I wouldn't put it past Boris to cling on regardless of how close any vote might be.
The noises coming out of no 10 suggests they want this vote to draw a line under it and move on.
But it's not going to draw a line under it. There are by elections, there is the standards commitee. If he gets through this tonight, it's going to keep coming back.
The only way to draw a line under it, is to replace him.
But he'll be safe from another confidence vote for twelve months. Plenty of time to really screw the Tory party. And I wouldn't put it past Boris to cling on regardless of how close any vote might be.
Why do you think they are changing the rules, so they can have another vote of no confidence in just 3 months?
If he loses the vote can anyone see him hanging around being an everyday MP? As we know he doesn't do detail or hard work which I think he would regard as drudgery.
The noises coming out of no 10 suggests they want this vote to draw a line under it and move on.
But it's not going to draw a line under it. There are by elections, there is the standards commitee. If he gets through this tonight, it's going to keep coming back.
The only way to draw a line under it, is to replace him.
But he'll be safe from another confidence vote for twelve months. Plenty of time to really screw the Tory party. And I wouldn't put it past Boris to cling on regardless of how close any vote might be.
Why do you think they are changing the rules, so they can have another vote of no confidence in just 3 months?
There's been talk of changing the rules but I haven't seen anything definite at all.
The noises coming out of no 10 suggests they want this vote to draw a line under it and move on.
But it's not going to draw a line under it. There are by elections, there is the standards commitee. If he gets through this tonight, it's going to keep coming back.
The only way to draw a line under it, is to replace him.
But he'll be safe from another confidence vote for twelve months. Plenty of time to really screw the Tory party. And I wouldn't put it past Boris to cling on regardless of how close any vote might be.
Why do you think they are changing the rules, so they can have another vote of no confidence in just 3 months?
There's been talk of changing the rules but I haven't seen anything definite at all.
They haven't done anything yet but once they lose these two by elections, they'll find a way to get rid.
If he loses the vote can anyone see him hanging around being an everyday MP? As we know he doesn't do detail or hard work which I think he would regard as drudgery.
But if he left the Commons he'd have to do some real work for his money. As it is, he can pick up an MPs salary and do as little work as he wants. Probably whilst earning money doing something else at the same time anyway.
If he loses the vote can anyone see him hanging around being an everyday MP? As we know he doesn't do detail or hard work which I think he would regard as drudgery.
But if he left the Commons he'd have to do some real work for his money. As it is, he can pick up an MPs salary and do as little work as he wants. Probably whilst earning money doing something else at the same time anyway.
If he loses the vote can anyone see him hanging around being an everyday MP? As we know he doesn't do detail or hard work which I think he would regard as drudgery.
But if he left the Commons he'd have to do some real work for his money. As it is, he can pick up an MPs salary and do as little work as he wants. Probably whilst earning money doing something else at the same time anyway.
The money is irrelevant. Realistically MPs aren't massively paid, he could earn more than that just for attending dinners. Sad but true.
This is the briefing doc circulated yesterday against johnson
https://twitter.com/adampayne26/status/1533476836860170250/photo/1
The reason he's clinging on as long as possible is that the longer he's PM, the more money he'll get for doing the College circuit in the USA, articles for the papers, presenting HIGNFY etc.If he loses the vote can anyone see him hanging around being an everyday MP? As we know he doesn't do detail or hard work which I think he would regard as drudgery.
But if he left the Commons he'd have to do some real work for his money. As it is, he can pick up an MPs salary and do as little work as he wants. Probably whilst earning money doing something else at the same time anyway.
The money is irrelevant. Realistically MPs aren't massively paid, he could earn more than that just for attending dinners. Sad but true.
The reason he's clinging on as long as possible is that the longer he's PM, the more money he'll get for doing the College circuit in the USA, articles for the papers, presenting HIGNFY etc.If he loses the vote can anyone see him hanging around being an everyday MP? As we know he doesn't do detail or hard work which I think he would regard as drudgery.
But if he left the Commons he'd have to do some real work for his money. As it is, he can pick up an MPs salary and do as little work as he wants. Probably whilst earning money doing something else at the same time anyway.
The money is irrelevant. Realistically MPs aren't massively paid, he could earn more than that just for attending dinners. Sad but true.
He's always coveted the £100k (+ exes)
that Blair got per lecture.
(Oh the exes I refer to are expenses, not ex girlfriends/mothers of his legion of children)
It's hardly been a secret....
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FUjTGuSX0AAhrX8?format=jpg&name=small
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FUjTGuRXoAUycDS?format=jpg&name=large
BobG
This is the briefing doc circulated yesterday against johnson
https://twitter.com/adampayne26/status/1533476836860170250/photo/1
As I was saying.
The Tory leader can be a disorganised, lying, cheating, amoral narcissist, and that's fine.
But once he's an electoral liability...
This is the briefing doc circulated yesterday against johnson
https://twitter.com/adampayne26/status/1533476836860170250/photo/1
As I was saying.
The Tory leader can be a disorganised, lying, cheating, amoral narcissist, and that's fine.
But once he's an electoral liability...
Much harder to declare these things etc etc.
Of course if Boris wins the vote tonight one of the other parties (if they really want him out) could call a vonc in parliament and test the Tory MPs who vote against him.
This is the briefing doc circulated yesterday against johnson
https://twitter.com/adampayne26/status/1533476836860170250/photo/1
As I was saying.
The Tory leader can be a disorganised, lying, cheating, amoral narcissist, and that's fine.
But once he's an electoral liability...
It must be the first time in history two successive PMs have faced confidence votes?
This is the briefing doc circulated yesterday against johnson
https://twitter.com/adampayne26/status/1533476836860170250/photo/1
As I was saying.
The Tory leader can be a disorganised, lying, cheating, amoral narcissist, and that's fine.
But once he's an electoral liability...
It must be the first time in history two successive PMs have faced confidence votes?
Thatcher - Major?
You might find this article by the well known lefty Max Hastings illustrative, indeed somewhat frightening, too.Written 3 years ago when Johnson had just taken over from May, what an incredibly prescient piece by Hastings.
https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2019/jun/24/boris-johnson-prime-minister-tory-party-britain
BobG
Here's Nadine who, in her full throated defence of the clown against Jeremy Hunt, admits the Tories failed to prepare for the pandemic and caused thousands of unnecessary deaths.
https://twitter.com/NadineDorries/status/1533763409627566080?t=JzQIotlhXa0CjsvLIM0Usg&s=19
You literally can't read that any other way can you?
This is the briefing doc circulated yesterday against johnson
https://twitter.com/adampayne26/status/1533476836860170250/photo/1
As I was saying.
The Tory leader can be a disorganised, lying, cheating, amoral narcissist, and that's fine.
But once he's an electoral liability...
It must be the first time in history two successive PMs have faced confidence votes?
Thatcher - Major?
Not motions of confidence, direct leadership elections. And Major triggered his himself.
Just listen to yourself. You think you come across as all intellectual yet you come out with childish, unoriginal, corny, imbecilic schoolboy insults like calling the Prime Minister Greasy Piglet.
It's people like you who lose Labour supporters simply because they don't want to be on the same side as you.
And yet, don't you think there's an element of well-observed clarity in that nickname? Given Johnson's track record of escaping unharmed from situations that would have eneded the career of other politicians?This just about sums things up.
From lying to his bosses, through a series of barely hidden affairs, refusing to acknowledge how many kids he's fathered, leaving his cancer-ridden wife, having his mistress accompany him to Australia on public funding, aiding and abetting intended GBH, lying to Parliament, lying to his own standards advisor and blithely ignoring advice from the nations' security services about threats from Russia.
Even you BB, with your Dorries-like affection for Johnson, must admit that there haven't been many politicians who could run up a rap sheet like that and sail on unencumbered.
Sometimes a nickname can be both childish AND very illuminating.
And yet, don't you think there's an element of well-observed clarity in that nickname? Given Johnson's track record of escaping unharmed from situations that would have eneded the career of other politicians?
From lying to his bosses, through a series of barely hidden affairs, refusing to acknowledge how many kids he's fathered, leaving his cancer-ridden wife, having his mistress accompany him to Australia on public funding, aiding and abetting intended GBH, lying to Parliament, lying to his own standards advisor and blithely ignoring advice from the nations' security services about threats from Russia.
Even you BB, with your Dorries-like affection for Johnson, must admit that there haven't been many politicians who could run up a rap sheet like that and sail on unencumbered.
Sometimes a nickname can be both childish AND very illuminating.
And yet, don't you think there's an element of well-observed clarity in that nickname? Given Johnson's track record of escaping unharmed from situations that would have eneded the career of other politicians?
From lying to his bosses, through a series of barely hidden affairs, refusing to acknowledge how many kids he's fathered, leaving his cancer-ridden wife, having his mistress accompany him to Australia on public funding, aiding and abetting intended GBH, lying to Parliament, lying to his own standards advisor and blithely ignoring advice from the nations' security services about threats from Russia.
Even you BB, with your Dorries-like affection for Johnson, must admit that there haven't been many politicians who could run up a rap sheet like that and sail on unencumbered.
Sometimes a nickname can be both childish AND very illuminating.
Give over, you've picked up on every negative story concerning Johnson you could find over the last couple of decades or more in order to find a valid reason why we should all support your beloved, albeit impotent Labour party. The fact that your party and its supporters can only try to gain popularity by unpopularizing the opposition is a testament to its ability.
Like I've said several times, we have become a country of bad losers. You are a prime example of it on this forum. It didn't start with Johnson, Theresa May got crucified by the media and it goes right back to the slaying of Thatcher.
I wonder how Churchill would have gone on today with being in the eye of the media 24/7?
So we need a nickname that is more original and less childish?
How about The Culprit?
That's not childish, just factual.
Or to be a little more contemporary The Perp?
He's promised if they keep him on, he will make tax cuts.
He's not really in control anymore, he's just doing whatever it takes to appease the right of the Tory party.
I'd rather be poor than silly, BG.
I'd rather be poor than silly, BG.
Here's a thought. You could start off by being consistent. Today you've laid into Bob G for using an insulting nickname for a politician. You called it a childish, unoriginal, corny, imbecillic schoolboy insult.
Have you ever met the BB who was chucking round the "Beer Korma" line a couple of weeks back?
No, I can't say I have. Have you?I'd rather be poor than silly, BG.
Here's a thought. You could start off by being consistent. Today you've laid into Bob G for using an insulting nickname for a politician. You called it a childish, unoriginal, corny, imbecillic schoolboy insult.
Have you ever met the BB who was chucking round the "Beer Korma" line a couple of weeks back?
Yes!!!! I won.Wow, well done BG. How much did you win off yourself?
When I posted 1365 I bet myself that BB would come back with something completely and utterly irrelevant. And he did. Predictable as the sun rising tomorrow. Whenever BB changes the subject you just know he's got no answer at all.
Thanks BB. :):)
BobG
He's f**ked. Probably not tonight, but that is a massive thumbs down. Worse than May's performance 6 months before she resigned.He is a dead man walking cannot see him lasting till Christmas
He's toast.
41.2% of Tory MPs want him gone.
A significant number of his backbenchers want him gone - probably around 2/3rds.
A person of principle would take stock and resign tomorrow in his shoes.
He's toast.
41.2% of Tory MPs want him gone.
A significant number of his backbenchers want him gone - probably around 2/3rds.
A person of principle would take stock and resign tomorrow in his shoes.
"Person of principle" ha, this is Boris were talking about he doesn't have any principles.
It would be a good result for Labour if he was going to last....but he isn't.
His best case is dragging on for another year, but if Tiverton is a wipeout, the Tories will change the rules to allow an earlier challenge.
No way are they going to allow him to blunder on to oblivion.
They need a new leader in place in time to let him (or her) gain traction with the public before 2024.
It would be a good result for Labour if he was going to last....but he isn't.
His best case is dragging on for another year, but if Tiverton is a wipeout, the Tories will change the rules to allow an earlier challenge.
No way are they going to allow him to blunder on to oblivion.
They need a new leader in place in time to let him (or her) gain traction with the public before 2024.
I wonder if "Beer Korma" (Cheers BST) would survive a confidence vote?Come on intellects, where are you?
I wonder if "Beer Korma" (Cheers BST) would survive a confidence vote?Come on intellects, where are you?
Talk tonight of a potential Labour /SNP coalition or some kind of support for each other at the next election
Can you imagine this county of our (The UK) being run by any party where the SNP have any influence
There’s also the issue of a potential leadership change in the Labour Party I’d KS and AR have to resign if they have been found to have breached the rules
There’s too many yet to happen factors before the next election.
The ma
Big winners may yet be the Lib Dems. Disenfranchised true tories won’t vote Labour but they might vote Lib Dems
It could be a very interesting few months with lots of twists and turns. Nothing is a shoe in at this stage
Danum I’m not supporting the Lib Dems I’m just suggesting that some Tory voters could defect to them that won’t vote Labour under any circumstances
Billy will that be enough to carry them through.
Let’s not forget there is still a lot of sympathy and support for the J Corbyns of the party
Danum I’m not supporting the Lib Dems I’m just suggesting that some Tory voters could defect to them that won’t vote Labour under any circumstances
Danum I’m not supporting the Lib Dems I’m just suggesting that some Tory voters could defect to them that won’t vote Labour under any circumstances
Phil, no worries i was just pointing out that the Lib Dems have been found out by the other parties that in a coalition situation they stifle any sort of agenda and progression that the larger party wanted to implement, the Tories found out in 2010, Labour had their fill in the 70's with Callaghan's gov being dropped in the sh*t by them.
I think any party would be thinking very carefully about entering into any arrangement with these shysters, i just cant see a Labour party in this day and age agreeing to any coalition with minor parties as they would be completely held to ransom by them having to agree to unpalatable policies.
Danum I’m not supporting the Lib Dems I’m just suggesting that some Tory voters could defect to them that won’t vote Labour under any circumstances
Phil, no worries i was just pointing out that the Lib Dems have been found out by the other parties that in a coalition situation they stifle any sort of agenda and progression that the larger party wanted to implement, the Tories found out in 2010, Labour had their fill in the 70's with Callaghan's gov being dropped in the sh*t by them.
I think any party would be thinking very carefully about entering into any arrangement with these shysters, i just cant see a Labour party in this day and age agreeing to any coalition with minor parties as they would be completely held to ransom by them having to agree to unpalatable policies.
Talk tonight of a potential Labour /SNP coalition or some kind of support for each other at the next election
Can you imagine this county of our (The UK) being run by any party where the SNP have any influence
There’s also the issue of a potential leadership change in the Labour Party I’d KS and AR have to resign if they have been found to have breached the rules
There’s too many yet to happen factors before the next election.
The ma
Big winners may yet be the Lib Dems. Disenfranchised true tories won’t vote Labour but they might vote Lib Dems
It could be a very interesting few months with lots of twists and turns. Nothing is a shoe in at this stage
This sums up the response from leading Tories.
https://mobile.twitter.com/t0nyyates/status/1534084940278779904
I hope they have taken all sharp instruments away from the cabinet
Labour had a confidence and supply arrangement with the Libs during Callaghan's reign, so not strictly in coalition but in all intents and purpose it led to the same outcomes.
Labour had a confidence and supply arrangement with the Libs during Callaghan's reign, so not strictly in coalition but in all intents and purpose it led to the same outcomes.
A coalition would have had Liberal members of the Cabinet and they wouldn't have voted against a Government they were part of.
Labour had a confidence and supply arrangement with the Libs during Callaghan's reign, so not strictly in coalition but in all intents and purpose it led to the same outcomes.
A coalition would have had Liberal members of the Cabinet and they wouldn't have voted against a Government they were part of.
The Liberals did what they should have done in 2010, they should of supported where they agreed and abstained or voted against where they disagreed, If these people keep harping on about PR then that was the exact time to force the issue, rather than go into coalition and have a complete damp squib of a PR referendum, they should of just offered the tories a confidence and supply arrangement, this would of allowed them to pick and choose their support on any policy that the biggest party suggested.
The fact that Clegg decided that he wanted all the trimmings of being deputy leader meant that instead of doing what was best for the country and forcing another election they enabled a period of austerity that did the vast majority no good whatsoever. Typical Liberals, stand for nothing, carp from the sidelines and hope to get a sniff of power off the coattails of someone else.
|How anyone can vote for these professional agitators who stand for nothing and if able to would ride roughshod over democratic principles. Disgraceful people. Don't even get me started of the current leader, who i'm sure certain individuals on here would not be very complementary to his handling of the energy and climate change gig when in power.looks like a good proportion of the current issues could be laid down at the door of this quisling.
Well the blonde buffoon survives till the day he hmmm doesn't I suppose .
Which in reality plays out that the Tory Party will eat itself and virtually hand the next GE to a coalition government made up of Labour , SNP and possibly the Dems .
A word of warning though .
So much as hint at a return to the EU in any shape or form either pre election or post from any potential Government coalition and I can guarantee you'll put the Tories back in the game and once back in the game you can pretty much work out how that plays out at the ballot box .
So I'd respectively suggest to the active remainers , kindly shut the feck up .
Well the blonde buffoon survives till the day he hmmm doesn't I suppose .
Which in reality plays out that the Tory Party will eat itself and virtually hand the next GE to a coalition government made up of Labour , SNP and possibly the Dems .
A word of warning though .
So much as hint at a return to the EU in any shape or form either pre election or post from any potential Government coalition and I can guarantee you'll put the Tories back in the game and once back in the game you can pretty much work out how that plays out at the ballot box .
So I'd respectively suggest to the active remainers , kindly shut the feck up .
It would be a good result for Labour if he was going to last....but he isn't.
His best case is dragging on for another year, but if Tiverton is a wipeout, the Tories will change the rules to allow an earlier challenge.
No way are they going to allow him to blunder on to oblivion.
They need a new leader in place in time to let him (or her) gain traction with the public before 2024.
1) The time left for a replacement is now going to be much less than it would have been if they'd done Johnson in tonight.
2) Whoever the replacement is, it will be someone who voted for Johnson tonight. Gold dust for a Labour campaign.
3) The run up to the next election is going to be one of continued economic difficulty. Not brilliant for a new leader.
4) The Tory coalition now requires a leader to win support in Sevenoakes and Sunderland. That was Johnson's genius. It's a tough act to follow.
5) The state of the potential replacements...
Well the blonde buffoon survives till the day he hmmm doesn't I suppose .
Which in reality plays out that the Tory Party will eat itself and virtually hand the next GE to a coalition government made up of Labour , SNP and possibly the Dems .
A word of warning though .
So much as hint at a return to the EU in any shape or form either pre election or post from any potential Government coalition and I can guarantee you'll put the Tories back in the game and once back in the game you can pretty much work out how that plays out at the ballot box .
So I'd respectively suggest to the active remainers , kindly shut the feck up .
I thought it was significant when arch Tory Brexiteer, Daniel Hannon wrote in the weekends Telegraph that leaving the single market may not have been the best idea.
I think the government has an enormous headache over Northern Ireland, there is no clear route forward, Brexit is stalled. The obvious way to unjam and retain the integrity of the U.K. would be to give way and remain in the single market. It would also solve problems at Dover.
If Boris wants to get Brexit done quickly then, I wonder if Hannon wasn't flagging the way?
Well the blonde buffoon survives till the day he hmmm doesn't I suppose .
Which in reality plays out that the Tory Party will eat itself and virtually hand the next GE to a coalition government made up of Labour , SNP and possibly the Dems .
A word of warning though .
So much as hint at a return to the EU in any shape or form either pre election or post from any potential Government coalition and I can guarantee you'll put the Tories back in the game and once back in the game you can pretty much work out how that plays out at the ballot box .
So I'd respectively suggest to the active remainers , kindly shut the feck up .
Tyke, I have seen one poster on here say that he would be happy for Labour to put forward a manifesto to gain power then change to other policies afterwards.
It would be a good result for Labour if he was going to last....but he isn't.
His best case is dragging on for another year, but if Tiverton is a wipeout, the Tories will change the rules to allow an earlier challenge.
No way are they going to allow him to blunder on to oblivion.
They need a new leader in place in time to let him (or her) gain traction with the public before 2024.
1) The time left for a replacement is now going to be much less than it would have been if they'd done Johnson in tonight.
2) Whoever the replacement is, it will be someone who voted for Johnson tonight. Gold dust for a Labour campaign.
3) The run up to the next election is going to be one of continued economic difficulty. Not brilliant for a new leader.
4) The Tory coalition now requires a leader to win support in Sevenoakes and Sunderland. That was Johnson's genius. It's a tough act to follow.
5) The state of the potential replacements...
I disagree with 2), BST. Jeremy Hunt was quite emphatic that he'd be voting against Johnson.
He's my tip for the next leader, and I think he could give Starmer trouble. JMHO.
Well the blonde buffoon survives till the day he hmmm doesn't I suppose .
Which in reality plays out that the Tory Party will eat itself and virtually hand the next GE to a coalition government made up of Labour , SNP and possibly the Dems .
A word of warning though .
So much as hint at a return to the EU in any shape or form either pre election or post from any potential Government coalition and I can guarantee you'll put the Tories back in the game and once back in the game you can pretty much work out how that plays out at the ballot box .
So I'd respectively suggest to the active remainers , kindly shut the feck up .
Tyke, I have seen one poster on here say that he would be happy for Labour to put forward a manifesto to gain power then change to other policies afterwards.
No wonder Hound given the current Labour Leader didn't deliver on one of his leadership election pledges .
I wouldn't trust Starmer to deliver on a single promise .
He'd have torn up the 2016 referendum result and put it in the bin without even thinking about it .
An attempt from someone that helped this absolute scandal ridden government into power to not want anyone to refer to a reversal of possibly the dumbest political decision ever made this side of ww2. Thank you for the advice, not. Having said that, has anyone heard anyone at all talk of a reversal? It's difficult not to discuss the consequences as it is evidenced on a daily basis across the news, ask anyone that's been near an airport recently. I would respectfully suggest that anyone that voted for brexit automatically disqualifies themselves from taking up a political advisory roll.
An attempt from someone that helped this absolute scandal ridden government into power to not want anyone to refer to a reversal of possibly the dumbest political decision ever made this side of ww2. Thank you for the advice, not. Having said that, has anyone heard anyone at all talk of a reversal? It's difficult not to discuss the consequences as it is evidenced on a daily basis across the news, ask anyone that's been near an airport recently. I would respectfully suggest that anyone that voted for brexit automatically disqualifies themselves from taking up a political advisory roll.
That's fine Syd .
Reverse Brexit , however put that in an election manifesto and let the electorate decide .
Now I know the Labour Party has a real distaste for democracy but it seems fair enough to me .
You weren't thinking of pushing this through were you in coalition with the SNP and the Dems without a mandate from the electorate were you ?
An attempt from someone that helped this absolute scandal ridden government into power to not want anyone to refer to a reversal of possibly the dumbest political decision ever made this side of ww2. Thank you for the advice, not. Having said that, has anyone heard anyone at all talk of a reversal? It's difficult not to discuss the consequences as it is evidenced on a daily basis across the news, ask anyone that's been near an airport recently. I would respectfully suggest that anyone that voted for brexit automatically disqualifies themselves from taking up a political advisory roll.
You would think that this far into the electoral cycle the opposition should be showing some sort of ground gained, its not as if Johnson's government hasn't given every opportunity to be exposed. To me Labour have not gained enough leverage from these last two years of none government. It should have been the biggest of own goals for any opposition to lay waste to the countless disasters Johnson has befallen on the Tories.
I'd say in two years time you should be looking at a totally different leadership with some semblance of competence to back up a GE campaign. I wonder if Labour will have some sort of policies in place that can be scrutinized for the obvious shortfall that will be on display, i don't think the electorate will fall for them trying on the Tories clothes.
More than all still to play for.
Only a couple of weeks to the next battleground and hand to hand fighting in cabinet. There's talk already of the rebels positioning themselves for concessions on legislation, I doubt johnson and the johnson's will have time to organise themselves into a government and offer changes that will benefit the country. After that it will be skirmishes all the way until the tory party put the liar out of his misery, they just have to wait for the x-rays.
the Guardian
''One Conservative MP, Bob Seely, who supported Johnson in the confidence vote, said the point on tax cuts was about the “narrative” for the party, rather than specifically which taxes should be cut.
“The issue is [on tax cuts] – and I’m a big fan of David Frost – is that it is about an agenda and a narrative. We need to take people with us, saying this where we are going and what we are doing. A lack of direction is a serious thing … We need an agenda and we need to deliver the government that we said we were going to deliver.”''
Not about where or why tax cuts should be made just that they should be made because the tories want a mantra.
Of course we are a long way from the next election. But things have changed markedly from previous decades. Big percentages of the electorate used to swing directly from Lab to Con and back again on a year by year basis. Now we are far more tribal. Far fewer people swing between the main parties.
The reduction in Con support since the last election is mainly due to 2019 Con voters now saying Don't Know or Won't Vote. Some of them might go back for sure. But how many?
Similarly, about 10% of those who voted Lab in 2019 now say they will vote Green. But how many of them will stick to that when faced with effectively wasting their vote and letting the Tories back in come 2024?
Works both ways.
And there's another 12 months at least of grinding reduction in living standards to come, followed by, at best, a weak recovery.
Very much all still to play for, but the Tories just made it significantly harder for themselves last night.
'' tend to think his point initially is spot on. Set the strategy, work on it, then formalise the detail''
Maybe you can tell me what the strategy is pud?
I remember someone who accused me of something terrible on this forum and refused to do answers when confronted about it.
'' tend to think his point initially is spot on. Set the strategy, work on it, then formalise the detail''
Maybe you can tell me what the strategy is pud?
I'm not an MP so I've no need to. All planned out in my own workplace though.
PMQs
''Johnson claims he has alienated 148 of his Tory MPs because his government has done 'big, remarkable things'''
I remember someone who accused me of something terrible on this forum and refused to do answers when confronted about it.
I vaguely remember that too Glyn and what you are saying isn’t strictly true.
It's a good article Albie, Rafael Behr calls him ''biddable'' I been saying it for a long time. the link between big donors and politicians needs to be broken
An attempt from someone that helped this absolute scandal ridden government into power to not want anyone to refer to a reversal of possibly the dumbest political decision ever made this side of ww2. Thank you for the advice, not. Having said that, has anyone heard anyone at all talk of a reversal? It's difficult not to discuss the consequences as it is evidenced on a daily basis across the news, ask anyone that's been near an airport recently. I would respectfully suggest that anyone that voted for brexit automatically disqualifies themselves from taking up a political advisory roll.
That's fine Syd .
Reverse Brexit , however put that in an election manifesto and let the electorate decide .
Now I know the Labour Party has a real distaste for democracy but it seems fair enough to me .
You weren't thinking of pushing this through were you in coalition with the SNP and the Dems without a mandate from the electorate were you ?
Comprehension tyke, you need to work on it, that's not what I wrote.
It's a good article Albie, Rafael Behr calls him ''biddable'' I been saying it for a long time. the link between big donors and politicians needs to be broken
Assume that means unions too?
'' tend to think his point initially is spot on. Set the strategy, work on it, then formalise the detail''
Maybe you can tell me what the strategy is pud?
I'm not an MP so I've no need to. All planned out in my own workplace though.
Just blindly following what any tory MP spouts then pud? wouldn't you want to see a strategy to improve efficiencies to help get inflation under control, tax cuts by themselves could prove to be a sugar hit and push it higher.
I think they've got to cut taxes. The UK is the only major nation going into this with a rising tax burden.
If I were king, I think I'd make a hefty cut to fuel duty. They must be making plenty from it now, so I imagine there must be scope for a cut.
I think they've got to cut taxes. The UK is the only major nation going into this with a rising tax burden.
If I were king, I think I'd make a hefty cut to fuel duty. They must be making plenty from it now, so I imagine there must be scope for a cut.
I think they've got to cut taxes. The UK is the only major nation going into this with a rising tax burden.
If I were king, I think I'd make a hefty cut to fuel duty. They must be making plenty from it now, so I imagine there must be scope for a cut.
How do you make that out? If anything the Fuel Duty revenue will have fallen due to higher prices.
I think they've got to cut taxes. The UK is the only major nation going into this with a rising tax burden.
If I were king, I think I'd make a hefty cut to fuel duty. They must be making plenty from it now, so I imagine there must be scope for a cut.
How do you make that out? If anything the Fuel Duty revenue will have fallen due to higher prices.
I doubt fuel demand had fallen away much yet. I still see a lot of traffic on the roads.
I suppose anything that subsidises fuel will ultimately be inflationary anyway.
It's already happening
''Fuel sales have fallen as drivers cut back on the number of journeys they make due to higher pump prices, a petrol station operator has said.
Ascona Group, which owns 60 UK petrol stations, said the amount of fuel it sold had dropped by 200,000 litres a week compared to pre-pandemic levels.
Managing director Darren Briggs said customers were making £20 to £30 fuel purchases "last a little bit longer".
https://www.bbc.com/news/business-61433722
It's already happening
''Fuel sales have fallen as drivers cut back on the number of journeys they make due to higher pump prices, a petrol station operator has said.
Ascona Group, which owns 60 UK petrol stations, said the amount of fuel it sold had dropped by 200,000 litres a week compared to pre-pandemic levels.
Managing director Darren Briggs said customers were making £20 to £30 fuel purchases "last a little bit longer".
https://www.bbc.com/news/business-61433722
Loads of other elements to it not just the price. Much more electric driving and much less commuting for starters.
It's already happening
''Fuel sales have fallen as drivers cut back on the number of journeys they make due to higher pump prices, a petrol station operator has said.
Ascona Group, which owns 60 UK petrol stations, said the amount of fuel it sold had dropped by 200,000 litres a week compared to pre-pandemic levels.
Managing director Darren Briggs said customers were making £20 to £30 fuel purchases "last a little bit longer".
https://www.bbc.com/news/business-61433722
Loads of other elements to it not just the price. Much more electric driving and much less commuting for starters.
It's already happening
''Fuel sales have fallen as drivers cut back on the number of journeys they make due to higher pump prices, a petrol station operator has said.
Ascona Group, which owns 60 UK petrol stations, said the amount of fuel it sold had dropped by 200,000 litres a week compared to pre-pandemic levels.
Managing director Darren Briggs said customers were making £20 to £30 fuel purchases "last a little bit longer".
https://www.bbc.com/news/business-61433722
Loads of other elements to it not just the price. Much more electric driving and much less commuting for starters.
Yep, agreed bfyp. There will inevitably be a little less driving due to price, but people working from home post pandemic and the rise of electric car use will undoubtedly have had an effect.
The use of petrol and diesel will probably continue to decrease in the coming years.
Yep, agreed bfyp. There will inevitably be a little less driving due to price, but people working from home post pandemic and the rise of electric car use will undoubtedly have had an effect.
The use of petrol and diesel will probably continue to decrease in the coming years.
Completely lost me there, Glyn.
No-one in their right mind is going to be generating electricity by burning oil.
The low cost route to electricity generation is solar and wind, with reserve storage from batteries.
Anyone looking to use oil will be bankrupt in next to no time.
So much for zero carbon, Kwarteng now asking coal fired power stations to stay online longer to protect our energy supply
Read my post aboveSo much for zero carbon, Kwarteng now asking coal fired power stations to stay online longer to protect our energy supply
Imagine if we had our own supply of coal eh?
Completely lost me there, Glyn.
No-one in their right mind is going to be generating electricity by burning oil.
The low cost route to electricity generation is solar and wind, with reserve storage from batteries.
Anyone looking to use oil will be bankrupt in next to no time.
Renewable energy is nowhere near fulfilling the county's electricity needs now - how do you think the extra electricity to power cars is going to be generated?
Completely lost me there, Glyn.
No-one in their right mind is going to be generating electricity by burning oil.
The low cost route to electricity generation is solar and wind, with reserve storage from batteries.
Anyone looking to use oil will be bankrupt in next to no time.
Renewable energy is nowhere near fulfilling the county's electricity needs now - how do you think the extra electricity to power cars is going to be generated?
Glyn,
You said oil was going to be the energy source for electricity generation...it isn't, not a chance.
I don't know where you get this idea from.
As far as renewables go, an increasing % of electricity will be from this source:
https://www.independent.co.uk/climate-change/news/renewable-energy-uk-electricity-2030-b2015499.html
The uptake of renewables within the energy economy is influenced by government policy, so if subsidy is directed towards expensive solutions like nuclear, it will affect the pace of change.
johnson should stop with all the pretence and appoint Philip Green or someone similar.
And still Labour are only two points ahead of Johnson , I'll not use the word Conservative Party .
Something not reight somewhere .
It’s going to be a walk over in the next GE isn’t it.
And still Labour are only two points ahead of Johnson , I'll not use the word Conservative Party .
Something not reight somewhere .
Aye, you.
The latest poll of polls I've just looked at has Labour 6% ahead.
https://www.politico.eu/europe-poll-of-polls/united-kingdom/
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Opinion_polling_for_the_next_United_Kingdom_general_election#2022
Of course it won't be a walkover. Anything could happen yet. And 30% of the population are now so wedded to Project Johnson that he could rape a sheep in the doorway of No10 and they'd find a reason to excuse him.
Couple of old dears from Tiverton on R4 news this lunchtime. "Yes he might have had a few drinks, but why did everybody go on so much about it. Boris has had so much on his plate. He had to deal with COVID. And all the problems with Brexit."
God help us...
Fee fi fo fum. I smell the blood of a Tarn Tory.
Of course it won't be a walkover. Anything could happen yet. And 30% of the population are now so wedded to Project Johnson that he could rape a sheep in the doorway of No10 and they'd find a reason to excuse him.
Couple of old dears from Tiverton on R4 news this lunchtime. "Yes he might have had a few drinks, but why did everybody go on so much about it. Boris has had so much on his plate. He had to deal with COVID. And all the problems with Brexit."
God help us...
Terrible innit William , democracy and all that .
Fee fi fo fum. I smell the blood of a Tarn Tory.
To tell the truth William if both the major party's were cars you'd have taken them to the scrap yard decades ago .
I find both in varying degrees absolutely grotesque .
They both survive because of tribalism and our voting system , that's the only thing that keeps them alive .
And still Labour are only two points ahead of Johnson , I'll not use the word Conservative Party .
Something not reight somewhere .
Aye, you.
The latest poll of polls I've just looked at has Labour 6% ahead.
https://www.politico.eu/europe-poll-of-polls/united-kingdom/
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Opinion_polling_for_the_next_United_Kingdom_general_election#2022
I stand corrected , 6% wow !!!
Fee fi fo fum. I smell the blood of a Tarn Tory.
To tell the truth William if both the major party's were cars you'd have taken them to the scrap yard decades ago .
I find both in varying degrees absolutely grotesque .
They both survive because of tribalism and our voting system , that's the only thing that keeps them alive .
The very best of luck getting the country that you want then.
In our FPTP system, politics isn't about you saying "give me exactly what I demand or I'm not playing." It's about growing up, gritting your teeth and getting the least bad outcome on offer.
If you don't engage with that, and as a result, Johnson gets back in power, you can wave your conscience from the highest flagpole in Barnsley. But it won't change the fact. YOU will have chosen to put Johnson back in No10.
Your call.
And still Labour are only two points ahead of Johnson , I'll not use the word Conservative Party .
Something not reight somewhere .
Aye, you.
The latest poll of polls I've just looked at has Labour 6% ahead.
https://www.politico.eu/europe-poll-of-polls/united-kingdom/
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Opinion_polling_for_the_next_United_Kingdom_general_election#2022
I stand corrected , 6% wow !!!
He stands corrected, wow!!!
Fee fi fo fum. I smell the blood of a Tarn Tory.
To tell the truth William if both the major party's were cars you'd have taken them to the scrap yard decades ago .
I find both in varying degrees absolutely grotesque .
They both survive because of tribalism and our voting system , that's the only thing that keeps them alive .
The very best of luck getting the country that you want then.
In our FPTP system, politics isn't about you saying "give me exactly what I demand or I'm not playing." It's about growing up, gritting your teeth and getting the least bad outcome on offer.
If you don't engage with that, and as a result, Johnson gets back in power, you can wave your conscience from the highest flagpole in Barnsley. But it won't change the fact. YOU will have chosen to put Johnson back in No10.
Your call.
So what happens if Johnson gets replaced as Tory leader? You won't have this theory to fall back on.
Maybe if Keith would start suggesting some credible alternative policies, instead of looking just as useless as the rest of them, then people might consider taking the trouble to turn out and vote.
And still Labour are only two points ahead of Johnson , I'll not use the word Conservative Party .
Something not reight somewhere .
Aye, you.
The latest poll of polls I've just looked at has Labour 6% ahead.
https://www.politico.eu/europe-poll-of-polls/united-kingdom/
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Opinion_polling_for_the_next_United_Kingdom_general_election#2022
I stand corrected , 6% wow !!!
He stands corrected, wow!!!
Come on, Glyn. You know as much as the rest of us that a 6% lead against an unpopular government in mid-term is absolutely w*nk.
If the LP looked in any way credible, they would be 20% up by now.
Fee fi fo fum. I smell the blood of a Tarn Tory.
To tell the truth William if both the major party's were cars you'd have taken them to the scrap yard decades ago .
I find both in varying degrees absolutely grotesque .
They both survive because of tribalism and our voting system , that's the only thing that keeps them alive .
The very best of luck getting the country that you want then.
In our FPTP system, politics isn't about you saying "give me exactly what I demand or I'm not playing." It's about growing up, gritting your teeth and getting the least bad outcome on offer.
If you don't engage with that, and as a result, Johnson gets back in power, you can wave your conscience from the highest flagpole in Barnsley. But it won't change the fact. YOU will have chosen to put Johnson back in No10.
Your call.
Of course it won't be a walkover. Anything could happen yet. And 30% of the population are now so wedded to Project Johnson that he could rape a sheep in the doorway of No10 and they'd find a reason to excuse him.
Couple of old dears from Tiverton on R4 news this lunchtime. "Yes he might have had a few drinks, but why did everybody go on so much about it. Boris has had so much on his plate. He had to deal with COVID. And all the problems with Brexit."
God help us...
Terrible innit William , democracy and all that .
Of course it won't be a walkover. Anything could happen yet. And 30% of the population are now so wedded to Project Johnson that he could rape a sheep in the doorway of No10 and they'd find a reason to excuse him.
Couple of old dears from Tiverton on R4 news this lunchtime. "Yes he might have had a few drinks, but why did everybody go on so much about it. Boris has had so much on his plate. He had to deal with COVID. And all the problems with Brexit."
God help us...
Terrible innit William , democracy and all that .
Are you someone who feels we have something close to democracy in this country? Most elections and votes are decided by who or what the media supports, ie the media who are owned by the establishment. The media campaigns are done during election periods as well as every single day outside of that. People are lied to on every level. That is almost as much a democracy as a flat out dictatorship is.
Sometimes Tyke you have to be careful what you wish for, The French have had to learn the hard way that when you disagree with whats on offer some bright spark comes up with a a party like Macrons En Marche (changed their name to Renaissance)
With this being a complete middle of the road, all things to all men party they now realise that this plonker promised plenty and delivered very little. With a good chance of his presidential tenure becoming a lame duck with the voting this weekend it could become a very long 5 years for this pumped up bantam.
The gist of my post is if we are not careful we too could end up with an awful hash of a LibLab love in, with the dire prospect of some of our current worst issues being dragged up and regurgitated until the pips squeak. How this is supposed to help us recover from this worsening economic climate, nobody knows, but what i do know is it would result in the worst 5 years most people alive today would have had to witness.
Of course it won't be a walkover. Anything could happen yet. And 30% of the population are now so wedded to Project Johnson that he could rape a sheep in the doorway of No10 and they'd find a reason to excuse him.
Couple of old dears from Tiverton on R4 news this lunchtime. "Yes he might have had a few drinks, but why did everybody go on so much about it. Boris has had so much on his plate. He had to deal with COVID. And all the problems with Brexit."
God help us...
Terrible innit William , democracy and all that .
Are you someone who feels we have something close to democracy in this country? Most elections and votes are decided by who or what the media supports, ie the media who are owned by the establishment. The media campaigns are done during election periods as well as every single day outside of that. People are lied to on every level. That is almost as much a democracy as a flat out dictatorship is.
As far as I know you are free to tick any box on a ballot paper and so long as you don't spoil it then it will be counted .
That's as free as it's possible to be .
I don't buy in to the bias media coverage because generally people will read what connects to them rather than they are influenced by it .
It's extremely rare they will read what they don't politically agree with , Sydney is a classic example with his Guardian links and Billy clear follows people on twitter with views he agrees with .
I'm always going to push hard against anybody telling me how I should vote and I have good reason to think like that because it's never left me how I lost everything in a strike we possibly couldn't win and if my union had put a democratic procedure in place things may well have worked out differently .
I swore then nobody but nobody would ever influence me , I am my own person with my own life with things going on that are probably way different to someone else .
The biggest threat to democracy is the current way we elect governments and a system endorsed by the Conservative Party and Labour .
Which is why basically you get two choices and why both parties are not fit for purpose anyone .
A genuine bit of competition would totally transform our system .
Clearly they are frightened of it .
Surely if it is a close run thing you vote for either the party you want to get in and failing that the the party that will beat your least favourite party. Usually Labour or Conservative.
I would hate to vote for my party and come a distant third or fourth and then see my least favourite party win by a narrow margin.
Surely that's how it works hound?
Apparently he's gone to Kyiv instead!!
Says summat when he feels safer flying into a War Zone than driving to Donny!!
He truly is a Lionheart lol!!!
I always vote Lib Dem hound knowing that over the last two elections Labour will still get in irrespective of my vote. The Torys will come third normally.
I deliver leaflets for the Lib Dems at local and general elections. It is a straight fight between them and Labour. The Conservatives are a distant third meaning it is their vote that is wasted.
The Lib Dems send leaflets on a regular basis. A stark contrast to the others who only appear when an election is near.
I always vote Lib Dem hound knowing that over the last two elections Labour will still get in irrespective of my vote. The Torys will come third normally.
I deliver leaflets for the Lib Dems at local and general elections. It is a straight fight between them and Labour. The Conservatives are a distant third meaning it is their vote that is wasted.
The Lib Dems send leaflets on a regular basis. A stark contrast to the others who only appear when an election is near.
I have great difficulty with wasted votes and always think of those that fought to give us the privilege idler
Sydney, I felt that I couldn’t vote for Labour under Corbin and didn’t want a Tory MP.I always vote Lib Dem hound knowing that over the last two elections Labour will still get in irrespective of my vote. The Torys will come third normally.
I deliver leaflets for the Lib Dems at local and general elections. It is a straight fight between them and Labour. The Conservatives are a distant third meaning it is their vote that is wasted.
The Lib Dems send leaflets on a regular basis. A stark contrast to the others who only appear when an election is near.
I have great difficulty with wasted votes and always think of those that fought to give us the privilege idler
Sydney, I felt that I couldn’t vote for Labour under Corbin and didn’t want a Tory MP.I always vote Lib Dem hound knowing that over the last two elections Labour will still get in irrespective of my vote. The Torys will come third normally.
I deliver leaflets for the Lib Dems at local and general elections. It is a straight fight between them and Labour. The Conservatives are a distant third meaning it is their vote that is wasted.
The Lib Dems send leaflets on a regular basis. A stark contrast to the others who only appear when an election is near.
I have great difficulty with wasted votes and always think of those that fought to give us the privilege idler
We had also recently had a Liberal MP in our constituency.
I vote in every election as we have postal votes in case we are on holiday.
I would have felt more like I had wasted my vote if it had been cast for a party I didn’t believe in or my vote allowed a party I didn’t want to get in.
Sydney, I felt that I couldn’t vote for Labour under Corbin and didn’t want a Tory MP.I always vote Lib Dem hound knowing that over the last two elections Labour will still get in irrespective of my vote. The Torys will come third normally.
I deliver leaflets for the Lib Dems at local and general elections. It is a straight fight between them and Labour. The Conservatives are a distant third meaning it is their vote that is wasted.
The Lib Dems send leaflets on a regular basis. A stark contrast to the others who only appear when an election is near.
I have great difficulty with wasted votes and always think of those that fought to give us the privilege idler
We had also recently had a Liberal MP in our constituency.
I vote in every election as we have postal votes in case we are on holiday.
I would have felt more like I had wasted my vote if it had been cast for a party I didn’t believe in or my vote allowed a party I didn’t want to get in.
And that's the problem with FPTP.
Idler. I'd say your vote was "symbolic" as it registered for the party you voted for, but "wasted" in that it had zero influence on the result.
Under FPTP, many people are faced with this dilemma of practically wasting their vote, or calculating how to vote for someone they don't want to, in order to get a least bad outcome.
No-one should ever have to do that in a democracy.
Oh Hound please. . Thinking in headlines never did do anybody any good.
BobG
I always vote Lib Dem hound knowing that over the last two elections Labour will still get in irrespective of my vote. The Torys will come third normally.
I deliver leaflets for the Lib Dems at local and general elections. It is a straight fight between them and Labour. The Conservatives are a distant third meaning it is their vote that is wasted.
The Lib Dems send leaflets on a regular basis. A stark contrast to the others who only appear when an election is near.
I have great difficulty with wasted votes and always think of those that fought to give us the privilege idler
Yep Steve people fought and died to not vote
Yep Steve people fought and died to not vote
Not read today's Guardian yet Syd ?
Anything on there you might want to link tonight matey ?
If you are busy looking for anti Tory stuff on there and missed it then fair enough .
I could give you a clue but I'm not , let's see if you find it .
Yep Steve people fought and died to not vote
Not read today's Guardian yet Syd ?
Anything on there you might want to link tonight matey ?
If you are busy looking for anti Tory stuff on there and missed it then fair enough .
I could give you a clue but I'm not , let's see if you find it .
even to an idiot you must appear silly a lot of the time tyke, your scribblings all about the injustice mainly reflect upon the party you help to put in power, go figure, oh and let's not forget the other half of your complaints relate to party you won't vote for.
Yep Steve people fought and died to not vote
Not read today's Guardian yet Syd ?
Anything on there you might want to link tonight matey ?
If you are busy looking for anti Tory stuff on there and missed it then fair enough .
I could give you a clue but I'm not , let's see if you find it .
even to an idiot you must appear silly a lot of the time tyke, your scribblings all about the injustice mainly reflect upon the party you help to put in power, go figure, oh and let's not forget the other half of your complaints relate to party you won't vote for.
I was hoping you'd be getting warmer Syd .
Clearly not .
Oh well .
Yep Steve people fought and died to not vote
Not read today's Guardian yet Syd ?
Anything on there you might want to link tonight matey ?
If you are busy looking for anti Tory stuff on there and missed it then fair enough .
I could give you a clue but I'm not , let's see if you find it .
even to an idiot you must appear silly a lot of the time tyke, your scribblings all about the injustice mainly reflect upon the party you help to put in power, go figure, oh and let's not forget the other half of your complaints relate to party you won't vote for.
I was hoping you'd be getting warmer Syd .
Clearly not .
Oh well .
People fought and died to not vote - it was the aniversary of Jo Cox's death last week -is that what you are referencing tyke?
Tho don't think that is prominent on the Guardian website at the moment - maybe its: Byelections will hasten Boris Johnson's political end?
Yep Steve people fought and died to not vote
Not read today's Guardian yet Syd ?
Anything on there you might want to link tonight matey ?
If you are busy looking for anti Tory stuff on there and missed it then fair enough .
I could give you a clue but I'm not , let's see if you find it .
even to an idiot you must appear silly a lot of the time tyke, your scribblings all about the injustice mainly reflect upon the party you help to put in power, go figure, oh and let's not forget the other half of your complaints relate to party you won't vote for.
I was hoping you'd be getting warmer Syd .
Clearly not .
Oh well .
People fought and died to not vote - it was the aniversary of Jo Cox's death last week -is that what you are referencing tyke?
Tho don't think that is prominent on the Guardian website at the moment - maybe its: Byelections will hasten Boris Johnson's political end?
Yep Steve people fought and died to not vote
Not read today's Guardian yet Syd ?
Anything on there you might want to link tonight matey ?
If you are busy looking for anti Tory stuff on there and missed it then fair enough .
I could give you a clue but I'm not , let's see if you find it .
even to an idiot you must appear silly a lot of the time tyke, your scribblings all about the injustice mainly reflect upon the party you help to put in power, go figure, oh and let's not forget the other half of your complaints relate to party you won't vote for.
I was hoping you'd be getting warmer Syd .
Clearly not .
Oh well .
People fought and died to not vote - it was the aniversary of Jo Cox's death last week -is that what you are referencing tyke?
Tho don't think that is prominent on the Guardian website at the moment - maybe its: Byelections will hasten Boris Johnson's political end?
Wilts, it was Syd who wrote the fought and died line, not tyke.
Yep Steve people fought and died to not vote
Not read today's Guardian yet Syd ?
Anything on there you might want to link tonight matey ?
If you are busy looking for anti Tory stuff on there and missed it then fair enough .
I could give you a clue but I'm not , let's see if you find it .
even to an idiot you must appear silly a lot of the time tyke, your scribblings all about the injustice mainly reflect upon the party you help to put in power, go figure, oh and let's not forget the other half of your complaints relate to party you won't vote for.
I was hoping you'd be getting warmer Syd .
Clearly not .
Oh well .
People fought and died to not vote - it was the aniversary of Jo Cox's death last week -is that what you are referencing tyke?
Tho don't think that is prominent on the Guardian website at the moment - maybe its: Byelections will hasten Boris Johnson's political end?
Wilts, it was Syd who wrote the fought and died line, not tyke.
And then tyke challenged him about something in todays Guardian relating to it and to say what it was.
I was attempting to guess what it was tyke was refering to?
Glad to hear you got through it pud, De Mulder was called in to dispose of waste cut from johnson's nose.
Common but unpleasant. Had septorhinoplasty myself, 2 weeks off work I had to have. Very frustrating.
Both, the unions want too much and the government are not getting involved enough to sort it.
Interesting they've just confirmed pensions will rise with inflation again this year. So workers can't get a decent raise because it'll drive inflation, but pensioners can...
In a completely unrelated question, which demographic is most likely to vote Tory again?
Interesting they've just confirmed pensions will rise with inflation again this year. So workers can't get a decent raise because it'll drive inflation, but pensioners can...
In a completely unrelated question, which demographic is most likely to vote Tory again?
Pensioners aren't going to get a proper rise either. The CPI is about 10%. Fuel costs have gone up much more than that - over 100% for me.
My disability has gone up about £10 a month in the last year. My domestic energy bills have gone up £140 a month in less than a year. Pensioners will be in the same boat.
Interesting they've just confirmed pensions will rise with inflation again this year. So workers can't get a decent raise because it'll drive inflation, but pensioners can...
In a completely unrelated question, which demographic is most likely to vote Tory again?
Pensioners aren't going to get a proper rise either. The CPI is about 10%. Fuel costs have gone up much more than that - over 100% for me.
My disability has gone up about £10 a month in the last year. My domestic energy bills have gone up £140 a month in less than a year. Pensioners will be in the same boat.
Crikey Glyn do you live in a mansion? That's nearly all my bills combined.
I live in a 2 bed semi anemone went up £110 a month it's crazy ,by switching everything off and watching tv in the conservatory were it is warm Im down to paying £130 from £190 ,in February I was paying £80 a monthInteresting they've just confirmed pensions will rise with inflation again this year. So workers can't get a decent raise because it'll drive inflation, but pensioners can...
In a completely unrelated question, which demographic is most likely to vote Tory again?
Pensioners aren't going to get a proper rise either. The CPI is about 10%. Fuel costs have gone up much more than that - over 100% for me.
My disability has gone up about £10 a month in the last year. My domestic energy bills have gone up £140 a month in less than a year. Pensioners will be in the same boat.
Crikey Glyn do you live in a mansion? That's nearly all my bills combined.
Nope, just a two bed terraced house.
Interesting they've just confirmed pensions will rise with inflation again this year. So workers can't get a decent raise because it'll drive inflation, but pensioners can...
In a completely unrelated question, which demographic is most likely to vote Tory again?
Pensioners aren't going to get a proper rise either. The CPI is about 10%. Fuel costs have gone up much more than that - over 100% for me.
My disability has gone up about £10 a month in the last year. My domestic energy bills have gone up £140 a month in less than a year. Pensioners will be in the same boat.
So no denial that Carriejobgate happened, ducked the question completely. It would seem that he tried it again as PM. She must be on No10 payrole in some capacity, no?
Inflation is now higher then when Thatcher became PM.
Inflation is now higher then when Thatcher became PM.
So we need Thatcherism back?
Inflation is now higher then when Thatcher became PM.
So we need Thatcherism back?
Inflation is now higher then when Thatcher became PM.
So we need Thatcherism back?
As inflation was just the same when she left office (so much for the 'Thatcher beat inflation' myth) after 10 years I don't think she'd be the answer, do you?
And where's Wally today?
Rwanda
Happy Brexit Vote Anniversary Syd, just think the most important day of your life, the day and result that turned you and a few others into the men you are.
So no denial that Carriejobgate happened, ducked the question completely. It would seem that he tried it again as PM. She must be on No10 payrole in some capacity, no?
Is it true that Johnson has ...
1 ... been trying to get Carrie Antoinette a job somewhere in Royal Court or circle for ages ?
2 ... just replaced Dowdy Dowden {Tory Party Chairman} with "Queen" Camillas nephew ?
Well now let me think what might happen next ?
Edit Number 2 not 100% true in that he has been Co Chair since 2019
Happy Brexit Vote Anniversary Syd, just think the most important day of your life, the day and result that turned you and a few others into the men you are.
Looks like David Frost mows his own grass too!
me wonders how he got to the shopAnd where's Wally today?
Refrigerator shopping?
So I see the Met has been put into special measures, mmmm!
Tom Tugendhat has never been a government MP.
He's an MP.
You really ought to know the difference between the Legislature and the Executive.
Excellent, thanks for that bsb, all my reading so far not led to enlightenment so I have written to Tom to thanks him for his work on cleaning up Londongrad and asked him.
That's the same Tom Tugendhat who was screaming 2 months back that we should expel all (ALL) Russians from the UK? So he would boot out my friend (HERE WE GO AGAIN A FRIEND FOR EVERY ARGUMENT) and ex-colleague who has lived here for 25 years, worked and paid taxes, lectured me about the danger of Putin married a Ukrainian woman and brought up two kids.
And you want that Kitson to be PM?
You want his number CLH? I was talking to him yesterday.
according to Dan Hodges we are entering the endgame for Boris
mind you he's none too optimistic about the other bloke
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/debate/article-10930359/DAN-HODGES-Keir-Starmers-big-problem-trust-single-thing-says.html
"DAN HODGES: It's not being boring that is Keir Starmer's big problem...it's that nobody can trust a single thing he says"
I'd say he is desperate to get to an election so he can spread any blame across the party.
I'd say he is desperate to get to an election so he can spread any blame across the party.
Inadvertently wouldn't that be a damming verdict on the merits of the opposition Sydney ?
Any Tory PM given the nature of Johnson's record as PM at this time would surely be dreading any election they had to face right now never mind offering one up two years in advance .
I'd say he is desperate to get to an election so he can spread any blame across the party.
Inadvertently wouldn't that be a damming verdict on the merits of the opposition Sydney ?
Any Tory PM given the nature of Johnson's record as PM at this time would surely be dreading any election they had to face right now never mind offering one up two years in advance .
read it again, I didn't mention the opposition tyke
https://mixedarticle.com/boris-johnson-got-his-hairdresser-pregnant
The internet is full of this story, but as yet,no mainstream media is reporting it.
https://mixedarticle.com/boris-johnson-got-his-hairdresser-pregnant
The internet is full of this story, but as yet,no mainstream media is reporting it.
I’m sure the shocking news is he has a hairdresser, the other bit is normal behaviour for him
I'd say he is desperate to get to an election so he can spread any blame across the party.
Inadvertently wouldn't that be a damming verdict on the merits of the opposition Sydney ?
Any Tory PM given the nature of Johnson's record as PM at this time would surely be dreading any election they had to face right now never mind offering one up two years in advance .
read it again, I didn't mention the opposition tyke
Your very good at answering your own questions Syd .
Nobody mentions the opposition and clearly if the rumours are right Johnson doesn't fear them either .
Would you have envisaged John Major calling an early one in 95 or 96
When he was clinging on for dear life ?
Johnson maybe deluded but he ain't that deluded he'd call an early election just to hand Keith the keys to number 10 that much I do know .
The thing is under Major there was less going on , the economy wasn't actually too bad and yet Blair was 20 points in front of the Tories .
Keith's slender lead could be wiped out in an hour .
Saying that from what's coming out of the Labour Party Keith may not even be around to contest the GE , the knives are out and here's the thing it ain't the left who are sharpening them either .
I'd say he is desperate to get to an election so he can spread any blame across the party.
Inadvertently wouldn't that be a damming verdict on the merits of the opposition Sydney ?
Any Tory PM given the nature of Johnson's record as PM at this time would surely be dreading any election they had to face right now never mind offering one up two years in advance .
read it again, I didn't mention the opposition tyke
Your very good at answering your own questions Syd .
Nobody mentions the opposition and clearly if the rumours are right Johnson doesn't fear them either .
Would you have envisaged John Major calling an early one in 95 or 96
When he was clinging on for dear life ?
Johnson maybe deluded but he ain't that deluded he'd call an early election just to hand Keith the keys to number 10 that much I do know .
The thing is under Major there was less going on , the economy wasn't actually too bad and yet Blair was 20 points in front of the Tories .
Keith's slender lead could be wiped out in an hour .
Saying that from what's coming out of the Labour Party Keith may not even be around to contest the GE , the knives are out and here's the thing it ain't the left who are sharpening them either .
It's more than clear that noone from the current crop would be a suitable pick for your ballot paper and I have been waiting for you to name your choice of leader and most likely new team to run the country. Although it should be obvious, please ensure that you name someone that more than you and your dog would vote for.
Then maybe you could tell me what you are doing on the political front about getting your team, any team elected, or what you are doing with your union to champion the rights of workers. Otherwise I may start to think you're a whining do nothing.
Wilts, that is a good post sir, and it is interesting that you still see the Tories as winners if a GE is called soon.
Others seem to think that Labour, being so far ahead in recent polls and popularity, would now more likely be the winners.
Wilts, that is a good post sir, and it is interesting that you still see the Tories as winners if a GE is called soon.
Others seem to think that Labour, being so far ahead in recent polls and popularity, would now more likely be the winners.
I am afraid I agree with the polls hound. If Johnson can't win in North Shropshire or Tiverton, seats the Tories have never lost, then they wont win a GE anytime soon.
But I doubt Johnson does, he is that arrogant. And more pertinately he knows his most immediate threat is being thrown out by the Tory Party so he will deal with them first. If that means calling a GE, thats what he will do. He's still in power - and thats what he cares about.
There's no long term plan, it's one day a time. That's how he has been all his life.
Just another day in which Johnson lies in a way that would have ended the career of every single previous PM.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-62047883
So, so damaging to our politics, this normalisation of lying without consequences.
It looks like Raab could be toast as well after him saying that Johnson being briefed about Pinscher was 'news to him'.
It means that either Raab knew too and is lying himself, or that Raab is being lied to as well as the rest of us which still doesn't look good for him.
It looks like Raab could be toast as well after him saying that Johnson being briefed about Pinscher was 'news to him'.
It means that either Raab knew too and is lying himself, or that Raab is being lied to as well as the rest of us which still doesn't look good for him.
Most likely the latter. This is far far more serious than the birthday cake issue. It's not at all something you forget. If it was one of my team they'd be out the door no questions asked and I certainly wouldn't appoint someone with that background.
Javid resigns now too, hopefully not the last.
Bozo looking to hold on until the summer recess, to gain some breathing space.
Expect more unavailability, due to jaunts here, there and everywhere.
As he will not resign, it is down to the 1922 to cull him.
New elections to the 1922 coming up, which could cook his oven ready goose!
On the subject of electoral pacts, I would think a Tory/LibDem pact more likely than any other combination in the event of a hung parliament.
Sunak now
Trying to save their sorry arses!
Please God, ask Dorries what she thinks of all this disloyalty to the love of her life
Best price you can currently get on him getting hoyed out this year is 1/12.no its 1.2 now 5/1 on to last the year well it was
Apparently the favourite to be next PM is....
Mark Harper!
Nope. Me neither.
Sweet f**king Jesus. Tobias Ellwood is favourite now.
according to Dan Hodges we are entering the endgame for Boris
mind you he's none too optimistic about the other bloke
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/debate/article-10930359/DAN-HODGES-Keir-Starmers-big-problem-trust-single-thing-says.html
"DAN HODGES: It's not being boring that is Keir Starmer's big problem...it's that nobody can trust a single thing he says"
I hereby anoint SS as the forum peddant
I hereby anoint SS as the forum peddant
No, just a grammatical intellectual.
By the way, "pedant" only has one "d".
See what I mean?
Now Sunak's favourite.
It's like that The Thick of It special where the PM resigns and the advisers are up all night trying to think of someone to replace him who doesn't have a drink or gambling problem.
At one point they chuck a name out and the secretary says "Is that her with the red hair? Oh she's lovely."
Now Sunak's favourite.
It's like that The Thick of It special where the PM resigns and the advisers are up all night trying to think of someone to replace him who doesn't have a drink or gambling problem.
At one point they chuck a name out and the secretary says "Is that her with the red hair? Oh she's lovely."
Now Sunak's favourite.
It's like that The Thick of It special where the PM resigns and the advisers are up all night trying to think of someone to replace him who doesn't have a drink or gambling problem.
At one point they chuck a name out and the secretary says "Is that her with the red hair? Oh she's lovely."
Sunak? Doesn't that worry you slightly, regarding the next GE?
Now Sunak's favourite.
It's like that The Thick of It special where the PM resigns and the advisers are up all night trying to think of someone to replace him who doesn't have a drink or gambling problem.
At one point they chuck a name out and the secretary says "Is that her with the red hair? Oh she's lovely."
Sunak? Doesn't that worry you slightly, regarding the next GE?
Have you been living in a barrel for the past 6 months SS?
Now Sunak's favourite.
It's like that The Thick of It special where the PM resigns and the advisers are up all night trying to think of someone to replace him who doesn't have a drink or gambling problem.
At one point they chuck a name out and the secretary says "Is that her with the red hair? Oh she's lovely."
Sunak? Doesn't that worry you slightly, regarding the next GE?
Now Sunak's favourite.
It's like that The Thick of It special where the PM resigns and the advisers are up all night trying to think of someone to replace him who doesn't have a drink or gambling problem.
At one point they chuck a name out and the secretary says "Is that her with the red hair? Oh she's lovely."
Sunak? Doesn't that worry you slightly, regarding the next GE?
The bloke who lost the country £11 billion by failing to insure against interest rate hikes, £5 billion in fraudulant covid loans and then hiked taxes (to the rest of us to pay for his losses) in a cost of living crises whilst he and his family have their money in tax havens:
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-10903181/Rishi-Sunak-lost-UK-11BILLION-failing-insure-huge-debt-stocks.html
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2022/jan/29/how-the-uk-government-lost-49bn-to-covid-loan
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/rishi-sunak-akshata-murty-tax-haven-b2054179.html
And that doesn't worry you? Yikes!
Now Sunak's favourite.
It's like that The Thick of It special where the PM resigns and the advisers are up all night trying to think of someone to replace him who doesn't have a drink or gambling problem.
At one point they chuck a name out and the secretary says "Is that her with the red hair? Oh she's lovely."
Sunak? Doesn't that worry you slightly, regarding the next GE?
The bloke who lost the country £11 billion by failing to insure against interest rate hikes, £5 billion in fraudulant covid loans and then hiked taxes (to the rest of us to pay for his losses) in a cost of living crises whilst he and his family have their money in tax havens:
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-10903181/Rishi-Sunak-lost-UK-11BILLION-failing-insure-huge-debt-stocks.html
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2022/jan/29/how-the-uk-government-lost-49bn-to-covid-loan
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/rishi-sunak-akshata-murty-tax-haven-b2054179.html
And that doesn't worry you? Yikes!
You're completely missing my point, which is who'll have the best chance of beating Labour at the next GE, between Johnson and Sunak.
Now Sunak's favourite.
It's like that The Thick of It special where the PM resigns and the advisers are up all night trying to think of someone to replace him who doesn't have a drink or gambling problem.
At one point they chuck a name out and the secretary says "Is that her with the red hair? Oh she's lovely."
Sunak? Doesn't that worry you slightly, regarding the next GE?
Have you been living in a barrel for the past 6 months SS?
No, I'm well aware of his failings over the last 6 months.
I'm also aware of Keith's performance during the same period. If Johnson does get the boot, let's see what difference that makes to the polls.
Now Sunak's favourite.
It's like that The Thick of It special where the PM resigns and the advisers are up all night trying to think of someone to replace him who doesn't have a drink or gambling problem.
At one point they chuck a name out and the secretary says "Is that her with the red hair? Oh she's lovely."
Sunak? Doesn't that worry you slightly, regarding the next GE?
Have you been living in a barrel for the past 6 months SS?
No, I'm well aware of his failings over the last 6 months.
I'm also aware of Keith's performance during the same period. If Johnson does get the boot, let's see what difference that makes to the polls.
Wilts,
Why would Tory backbenchers support a vote of no confidence proposed in the HoC?
A GE with Bozo in post would result in them losing their seats.
Much more likely that they will change the 1922 rules, then unseat him in due course with an internal vote of Tory Mp's.
New leader then elected, and game on for the run in to the next GE.
He is going to go, but failing a resignation he can drag it out for a few more weeks.
No probs Albie - but I was thinking the same as you with the caveat if Johnson thinks they will do that then he will call a GE to stop them.
With those 10 resignations presumably now ready to vote against Johnson in a VONC, that's already shifted the numbers from 59-41 last time to 56-44 now.
Would only take another 22 to flip in order for him to be out.
Thing to watch now is the vote for the Executive of the 1922 committee. If that gets taken over by anti-Johnson MPs, they'll change the rules to allow another VONC and he'll be out by the end of next week.
There's talk of not waiting and a delegation going to johnson saying 'if you don't go we will change the rules and make you go'
Guardian
An opposition vote of no confidence should be tabled today, see how many of those resigning have principles and how many are offering lip service
We must surely be nearly at the point where no MP will take any of the jobs now vacant..?
Rumour is that the 1922 Committee are thinking of changing their rules to allow an immediate VONC even before the more vociferous Johnson critics get elected to their executive.
We must surely be nearly at the point where no MP will take any of the jobs now vacant..?
I just can't believe, as much as I want and it should happen, that he will resign. What other options are there to get rid of him?A big fat cheque from a Tory donor should do the trick!
Tory snakes everywhere, they have all backed him in every scandal until now, and now when they realise they might lose their jobs they are sticking the knife in, they are tainted already!
I just can't believe, as much as I want and it should happen, that he will resign. What other options are there to get rid of him?
He's told cabinet he's not quitting. Genuine question what happens if he can't fill a cabinet and still doesn't resign?
He's told cabinet he's not quitting. Genuine question what happens if he can't fill a cabinet and still doesn't resign?
Is there a scenario where he just refuses to leave if the 1922 committee votes no confidence? I mean, that's just Tory party convention isn't it, not a legally binding thing. Then the cabinet would be in the position of choosing between supporting him or completely paralysing the government.
That's what you call leveling up,can he really not see that he is single Handley destroying the conservative party and giving them zero chance of winning the next election.
Any suggestion there's a procession of cabinet ministers telling Johnson to go "is not true", the source claims, adding: "He's called their bluff."
It's truly impossible to imagine the man-child's state of mind now.I reckon you’ve actually had several w**ks tonight.
He's gone by mid next week because the new 1922 Committee executive will 100% change the rules to allow a VONC. And he'll lose that at least 60-40. So what on earth does he gain by staying put now? Is his personality really that f**ked up that he can't face taking the responsibility himself for the decision?
He’s in good company lol!
Billy. I don’t think w**king is classed as personal abuse anymore.It's truly impossible to imagine the man-child's state of mind now.I reckon you’ve actually had several w**ks tonight.
He's gone by mid next week because the new 1922 Committee executive will 100% change the rules to allow a VONC. And he'll lose that at least 60-40. So what on earth does he gain by staying put now? Is his personality really that f**ked up that he can't face taking the responsibility himself for the decision?
He’s in good company lol!
Great to see Belton adding something of value to the discussion as usual. I wonder if he's ever met that Belton who used to crusade against bringing personal abuse into threads in here?
Billy. I don’t think w**king is classed as personal abuse anymore.It's truly impossible to imagine the man-child's state of mind now.I reckon you’ve actually had several w**ks tonight.
He's gone by mid next week because the new 1922 Committee executive will 100% change the rules to allow a VONC. And he'll lose that at least 60-40. So what on earth does he gain by staying put now? Is his personality really that f**ked up that he can't face taking the responsibility himself for the decision?
He’s in good company lol!
Great to see Belton adding something of value to the discussion as usual. I wonder if he's ever met that Belton who used to crusade against bringing personal abuse into threads in here?
Back on topic. I'm struggling to think of a situation remotely like this in the last 200 years of Parliamentary history. Pretty much the core of Government hollowed out, and a PM refusing to go. He will be flayed alive by historians in future centuries.At least you won’t be around to comment on it.
It's truly impossible to imagine the man-child's state of mind now.Talking heads on sky news theorising he wants to beat Theresa May's time in office. He's a few days short. I believe it.
He's gone by mid next week because the new 1922 Committee executive will 100% change the rules to allow a VONC. And he'll lose that at least 60-40. So what on earth does he gain by staying put now? Is his personality really that f**ked up that he can't face taking the responsibility himself for the decision?
Wouldn't someone have to give the queen authority, where could that come from if the need arises?
True Glyn. But if that happens, it'll be the first time since the Abdication Crisis that the Monarch has been directly involved in a major political decision. That opens up a massive can of worms.
It's truly impossible to imagine the man-child's state of mind now.Talking heads on sky news theorising he wants to beat Theresa May's time in office. He's a few days short. I believe it.
He's gone by mid next week because the new 1922 Committee executive will 100% change the rules to allow a VONC. And he'll lose that at least 60-40. So what on earth does he gain by staying put now? Is his personality really that f**ked up that he can't face taking the responsibility himself for the decision?
I can't see how he can possibly stay in place. The story in the Mail about May being brought in as a caretaker PM has the ring of truth about it.
Wow I did not realise that every minister that resigned is entitled to 450k in compensation,so did they quit because of Boris or the fear of losing their jobs and no money ,and who is going to pay for this ,My guess is us the public
thought it said each my mistake,still alot if most people quit a job you would naff allWow I did not realise that every minister that resigned is entitled to 450k in compensation,so did they quit because of Boris or the fear of losing their jobs and no money ,and who is going to pay for this ,My guess is us the public
Not each mate, that’s the total so far
Surely Johnson is now the lamest of lame ducks EVER ?
Surely he won't be able to suggest anything , or meet overseas leaders or speak as PM or award Honours etc etc
Surely they will tell him to keep out of sight keep off tv and stop speaking for them ?
World class lame duck Surely?
Ex-No10 chief Dominic Cummings wrote on Twitter: 'Evict TODAY or he'll cause CARNAGE, even now he's playing for time & will try to stay.
There's a whole string of twitter comments on the Guardian live feed from a load of different journo's in reaction to his speech
This thread is starting to sound like a division 4 witches coven, some sound like they are starting to hyperventilate in their excitement !
He's gone, not before time, we need the men in grey suits to have another word and get this imbecile out of the building, drag someone safe and mildly competent to sit in the seat until the new leader is selected. I'm hoping that after a very short familiarisation period is completed we go to a general election, we cant have none elected PM.s in situ, its not the right thing to do, a new government needs a mandate. I'm still not sure that after all this chaos for the last 3 years that a suitable alternative exist, Starmer's Labour party is still conference level and i'm not sure he or the current labour party would stand up to an election campaign.
After all this the country is still divided and at this time rudderless, we need people of substance to step up from somewhere, do either side have the minerals?
We need a full reset, who's going to provide it ?
Timeline of the folk on the Right in here.
2016-2020. Johnson's absolutely bang on! He tells it like it is.
2020. Ok, so he lies occasionally, but they're all the same.
2021. OK, so he lies more than any politician in history, but why do you go on about it so much?
Winter 2022. OK, so maybe you're right that he's a moral black hole, but I'd have seen that sooner if you hadn't made such a song and dance about it.
Spring 2022. Actually I knew that we was an amoral pathological liar all along.
Today. Yeah but Starmer.
The fact he unilaterally, it seems, to have decided to form a new cabinet minutes before he resigned, then declared he'll be staying put till Autumn, astounds me.
The removal van should be outside No.11 by 5pm.
Timeline of the folk on the Right in here.
2016-2020. Johnson's absolutely bang on! He tells it like it is.
2020. Ok, so he lies occasionally, but they're all the same.
2021. OK, so he lies more than any politician in history, but why do you go on about it so much?
Winter 2022. OK, so maybe you're right that he's a moral black hole, but I'd have seen that sooner if you hadn't made such a song and dance about it.
Spring 2022. Actually I knew that we was an amoral pathological liar all along.
Today. Yeah but Starmer.
Another 5 mins of your life that could of been better spent doing something useful. get the Mr's to wipe the froth away, people will start to talk!
Totally pointless.
The fact he unilaterally, it seems, to have decided to form a new cabinet minutes before he resigned, then declared he'll be staying put till Autumn, astounds me.
The removal van should be outside No.11 by 5pm.
I wonder how long Johnson will remain a backbencher for. After all, he said he couldn't manage on the PM's salary, so a backbenchers won't go very far.
Maybe Carrie will have to get a job on the tills at Asda to help out?
I wonder how long Johnson will remain a backbencher for. After all, he said he couldn't manage on the PM's salary, so a backbenchers won't go very far.
Maybe Carrie will have to get a job on the tills at Asda to help out?
I wonder how long Johnson will remain a backbencher for. After all, he said he couldn't manage on the PM's salary, so a backbenchers won't go very far.
Maybe Carrie will have to get a job on the tills at Asda to help out?
What are the odds on the year of his next divorce?
She had a taste for luxury and power.
He was a track record of dealing with dismissal by dropping his kecks.
I don't have them marked down as Mr and Mrs material in 20 years time.
Timeline of the folk on the Right in here.
2016-2020. Johnson's absolutely bang on! He tells it like it is.
2020. Ok, so he lies occasionally, but they're all the same.
2021. OK, so he lies more than any politician in history, but why do you go on about it so much?
Winter 2022. OK, so maybe you're right that he's a moral black hole, but I'd have seen that sooner if you hadn't made such a song and dance about it.
Spring 2022. Actually I knew that we was an amoral pathological liar all along.
Today. Yeah but Starmer.
Another 5 mins of your life that could of been better spent doing something useful. get the Mr's to wipe the froth away, people will start to talk!
Totally pointless.
Point is DD, it matters.
We've had years now of folk idly saying "they're all the same." When they AREN'T all the same.
Lazily doing this bothsides thing just opens to door for a true pathological liar like Johnson to walk in and shit all over the place. Because too many people have been prepared to excuse him on the grounds that he's no different from any other politician in his principles.
This time it's only resulted in the danger of renewed conflict in Ireland, a totally botched approach to a pandemic, a stunted economy and the possibility of the PM being compromised by the FSB.
Next time, if we don't start growing up on this theme, it could be REALLY serious.
BST, imagine you're in construction, a house builder or JCB and peace in Ukraine has been brokered one way or another, assuming Russia hasn't taken over completely.
Send Boris over there to press the flesh, he's going to win contracts, he'll still have the connections in both governments. Can't fail.
The connections Johnson has in the rightwing media shouldn't be overlooked either. He will be a star opinion former/columnist if he wants to be. He has lots of wealthy friends.
It's been reported for a longtime, that Johnson intends to make a packet when he leaves government. It's come sooner than he wanted but now it's bound to be his objective.
He’s still a f**king Kitson though..
He still can’t see that it’s not what the government has achieved whatever our views on that may be, it’s about his very flawed character. He’s not fit to govern and has finally been found out by his nearest and dearest..
He’s still a f**king Kitson though..
He still can’t see that it’s not what the government has achieved whatever our views on that may be, it’s about his very flawed character. He’s not fit to govern and has finally been found out by his nearest and dearest..
Oh, I agree. But there will be those learning from this episode.
He’s still a f**king Kitson though..
He still can’t see that it’s not what the government has achieved whatever our views on that may be, it’s about his very flawed character. He’s not fit to govern and has finally been found out by his nearest and dearest..
Oh, I agree. But there will be those learning from this episode.
Case in point? Who in the Tory party or the right wing press has picked up on his Bunga Bunga party admission yesterday?
I think when historians look back, they will see Johnson as an extraordinary character. Maybe a template for future politicians. What he's done that is extraordinary was to make himself a celebrity. He embraced the media and doesn't mind feeding it with scandal. It's the life blood of the press.
The deeply negative aspect of Johnson is that it's so self centred. All about the pursuit of power.
Johnson will be more significant than Major, Cameron or May.
One thing is clear to me, we need a written constitution, we can not carry on like we are now every unwritten rule has been trashed
Johnson said something earlier today that I didn't get the point of earlier today but it's just struck me.
He said there'll be no major decisions on fiscal policy while he stays in No10.
This from the BBC:
At a cabinet meeting earlier, Mr Johnson told ministers he would not seek to implement "major changes of direction" or take "major fiscal decisions".
Just dawned on me what that means. It means no more Govt support for people being hammered by energy prices. Zahawi was lining up some big relief package, but Johnson appears to be vetoing that.
That would fit with Johnson. A final "f**k you" to the country and to his party's popularity.
The ones who didn't prop up said megalomaniac?
DD.
Where have you been this last few years?
The 1 Nation Tories were drummed out of the party. The middle of the road Tory party you speak of simply doesn't exist!
Look at the ones who were kicked out.
Ken Clarke
Phillip Hammond
Justine Greening
Dominic Grieve
David Gauke
Or sidelined
Jeremy Hunt
Damian Green
The entire party has been taken over by a right wing cabal. Even under Thatcher, you'd never have had someone as extreme as Patel at the top of Govt. Or someone like Raab and Truss who are on record as calling the British workers "among the worst idlers in the world". Those are the people in control of today's Tory party. The sensible ones have all gone!
Are you still claiming to be politically neutral by the way?
Christ DD, Sunak is MILES to the right of Clarke.
The ones who didn't prop up said megalomaniac?
True, and there are a great many who would choose someone else if given the option.
Its a bit like when Corbyn was in charge, how many of the labour back benches and disposed right wing element went along with him for party harmony, if they had the option at the time they would of chosen someone else but they didn't.
Remember saint Keith was Corbyns lieutenant and went along with his left wing nonsense, if he had been elected all the right wing who are now on the front bench would of sang to his tune until the opportunity came to stab him in the back. Its just politics.
Christ DD, Sunak is MILES to the right of Clarke.
The bookies favourite is Ben Wallace, who is nothing like the far right loonies that some of you are on about.
The bookies favourite is Ben Wallace, who is nothing like the far right loonies that some of you are on about.
Any thoughts:
Any thoughts:
The bookies favourite is Ben Wallace, who is nothing like the far right loonies that some of you are on about.
I think that is a fair comment. Wallace is more to the left than most (all) of the other declared contenders. He, like Johnson, believes in state spending - although as a former director of QinetiQ and a current advocate of giving contracts to QineticQ - he wants much more on defence than Johnson did.
Any thoughts:
What Nick Lowe said:
Do you remember Rick Astley?
He had a big fat hit that was ghastly
He said I'm never gonna give you up or let you down
Well I'm here to tell ya that dick's a clown
Though he was just a boy when he made that vow
I'd bet it all that he knows by now
All men (all men)
All men are liars their words ain't worth no more than worn out tires
Hey girls (girls) bring rusty pliers to pull this tooth
All men are liars and that's the truth
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m6hzkBihaew
The bookies favourite is Ben Wallace, who is nothing like the far right loonies that some of you are on about.Ben Wallace’s voting record suggests he is a homophobe. I’m sure that some on here would take that as a positive thing.
Any thoughts:
What Nick Lowe said:
Do you remember Rick Astley?
He had a big fat hit that was ghastly
He said I'm never gonna give you up or let you down
Well I'm here to tell ya that dick's a clown
Though he was just a boy when he made that vow
I'd bet it all that he knows by now
All men (all men)
All men are liars their words ain't worth no more than worn out tires
Hey girls (girls) bring rusty pliers to pull this tooth
All men are liars and that's the truth
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m6hzkBihaew
Any thoughts:
What Nick Lowe said:
Do you remember Rick Astley?
He had a big fat hit that was ghastly
He said I'm never gonna give you up or let you down
Well I'm here to tell ya that dick's a clown
Though he was just a boy when he made that vow
I'd bet it all that he knows by now
All men (all men)
All men are liars their words ain't worth no more than worn out tires
Hey girls (girls) bring rusty pliers to pull this tooth
All men are liars and that's the truth
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m6hzkBihaew
I have a very good friend, a very long standing friend, who has, in the past, been a Conservative Parliamentary candidate and a leading Conservative councillor in a vibrant, modern city. For decades he has suggested to me that he really doesn't mind which party is in power as long as that party governs for at least a decade. he believes that only then will the results of relative Party philosophies and capabilities become readily apparent.
I am looking forward to meeting up with him next week.
BobG
Back on topicYou know what, it’d be interesting to know if this person voted for Johnson in 2019.
.............. ''As the summer arrives, I will live Johnson’s legacy. I’m a full-time unpaid carer to my 13-year-old son. We live on universal credit, and have only got poorer under Johnson’s levelling up agenda. There’ll be no summer holiday for us; the idea is almost laughable. There’ll be no nice new clothes for my boy, or treats to while away a summer afternoon. As I carry out the mental gymnastics of making our paltry universal credit payment stretch, any extras like food vouchers or donations get sucked into bills that I have been unable to save for, just so we can live. I am moved to tears as I write this, knowing Johnson will never be forced to face up to the damage that he has done to millions of families like mine.
He has patronised us incessantly, telling us soaring energy prices are an unavoidable result of war – that doesn’t help me when our gas and energy prices have already doubled. He has boasted how he “got Brexit done”. Brexit might have been pushed through, but to whose benefit? What he cobbled together has only made life harder for those living on a fixed income at the most frightening time of our lives. The extra £20 “uplift” in universal credit payments we received during the pandemic, just about the only good thing he oversaw, was snatched away when we needed it most.
And while Boris was partying in May 2020, my sister died, alone, in agony. I spoke to her for the last time the day before, but there were no goodbyes, no last hugs. The morally corrupt man leading the country didn’t even have enough self-respect to come clean about his lies. I will never be able to reconcile that in my heart'' ...............
https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2022/jul/08/boris-johnson-life-miserable-families-suffering-legacy
I'm looking forward to Sunak winning.
Then maybe we'll get to the bottom of why he broke the law by being an MP while he was a US resident.
Get the popcorn in.
Next time you hear a Tory saying they understand the cost of living crisis, just remember who they supported while he spent this.
https://mobile.twitter.com/SholaMos1/status/1545326117808119808
Wallace announces he's not running. Oh dear.
Actually the taxpayer didn't pay for themSo it all belongs to the Tories?
They were paid for by a Tory donor.
We got to the bottom of that fact after Johnson lied about it to his Ethics Adviser.
Two take homes from that.
1) Johnson's strained relationship with the truth extended across his entire lifestyle.
2) The Tories don't really understand what it's like making a tight budget have to string out. Because they can always ask a rich friend to pay for it.
I'm looking forward to Sunak winning.
Then maybe we'll get to the bottom of why he broke the law by being an MP while he was a US resident.
Get the popcorn in.
I'm looking forward to Sunak winning.
Then maybe we'll get to the bottom of why he broke the law by being an MP while he was a US resident.
Get the popcorn in.
Most of the backbench MPs I've seen interviewed about what they want from the new PM have parroted 'tax cuts, tax cuts'. I'm not sure that many of them will think they'll get that out of Sunak as his turn as Chancellor.
Well now. Johnson's ex-mistress and well connected journalist:
'A source at Number 10 tells me that Boris Johnson intends to stand down as Prime Minister on Monday, in order to run for the Tory leadership.'
https://twitter.com/PetronellaWyatt/status/1545755462292971520
Well now. Johnson's ex-mistress and well connected journalist:
'A source at Number 10 tells me that Boris Johnson intends to stand down as Prime Minister on Monday, in order to run for the Tory leadership.'
https://twitter.com/PetronellaWyatt/status/1545755462292971520
Of course the fact that Wyatts dad was a former Labour politician wouldn’t have influenced her to make up something like that.
Well now. Johnson's ex-mistress and well connected journalist:
'A source at Number 10 tells me that Boris Johnson intends to stand down as Prime Minister on Monday, in order to run for the Tory leadership.'
https://twitter.com/PetronellaWyatt/status/1545755462292971520
Of course the fact that Wyatts dad was a former Labour politician wouldn’t have influenced her to make up something like that.
You think who her father is has more effect on what she would say than her current job, Deputy Editor of The Spectator or who the father of her aborted child is? Interesting.
Well now. Johnson's ex-mistress and well connected journalist:
'A source at Number 10 tells me that Boris Johnson intends to stand down as Prime Minister on Monday, in order to run for the Tory leadership.'
https://twitter.com/PetronellaWyatt/status/1545755462292971520
Of course the fact that Wyatts dad was a former Labour politician wouldn’t have influenced her to make up something like that.
You think who her father is has more effect on what she would say than her current job, Deputy Editor of The Spectator or who the father of her aborted child is? Interesting.
I never mentioned her job or private life wilts so you are making a big assumption there.
Well now. Johnson's ex-mistress and well connected journalist:
'A source at Number 10 tells me that Boris Johnson intends to stand down as Prime Minister on Monday, in order to run for the Tory leadership.'
https://twitter.com/PetronellaWyatt/status/1545755462292971520
Of course the fact that Wyatts dad was a former Labour politician wouldn’t have influenced her to make up something like that.
You think who her father is has more effect on what she would say than her current job, Deputy Editor of The Spectator or who the father of her aborted child is? Interesting.
I never mentioned her job or private life wilts so you are making a big assumption there.
I know hound. That's why I did. Only you know why you didn't - the rest of us will have to 'assume'.
I notice she is now saying the person from No.10 who told her this has got back in touch and said it was a joke.
Well now. Johnson's ex-mistress and well connected journalist:
'A source at Number 10 tells me that Boris Johnson intends to stand down as Prime Minister on Monday, in order to run for the Tory leadership.'
https://twitter.com/PetronellaWyatt/status/1545755462292971520
Of course the fact that Wyatts dad was a former Labour politician wouldn’t have influenced her to make up something like that.
Well now. Johnson's ex-mistress and well connected journalist:
'A source at Number 10 tells me that Boris Johnson intends to stand down as Prime Minister on Monday, in order to run for the Tory leadership.'
https://twitter.com/PetronellaWyatt/status/1545755462292971520
Of course the fact that Wyatts dad was a former Labour politician wouldn’t have influenced her to make up something like that.
Presumably him being one of Thatcher's closest advisers would have influenced her.
Well now. Johnson's ex-mistress and well connected journalist:
'A source at Number 10 tells me that Boris Johnson intends to stand down as Prime Minister on Monday, in order to run for the Tory leadership.'
https://twitter.com/PetronellaWyatt/status/1545755462292971520
Of course the fact that Wyatts dad was a former Labour politician wouldn’t have influenced her to make up something like that.
Presumably him being one of Thatcher's closest advisers would have influenced her.
I dont know.
He was an active LP member and MP for much longer than he was Maggies advisor.
but but but ''I am not particularly interested in politics''
Well now. Johnson's ex-mistress and well connected journalist:
'A source at Number 10 tells me that Boris Johnson intends to stand down as Prime Minister on Monday, in order to run for the Tory leadership.'
https://twitter.com/PetronellaWyatt/status/1545755462292971520
Of course the fact that Wyatts dad was a former Labour politician wouldn’t have influenced her to make up something like that.
Presumably him being one of Thatcher's closest advisers would have influenced her.
I dont know.
He was an active LP member and MP for much longer than he was Maggies advisor.
Yes, but which was he after Petronella was born and would have grown up experiencing?
but but but ''I am not particularly interested in politics''
#hooklineandsinker.
To be honest, I wasn’t particularly interested in politics until a few years ago but having read so much on this forum I got to thinking about it in a small way.
I have realised what a shitty job is must be to do and that everyone, including political supporters of all persuasions, put their spin onto anything that they can to sway things their way.
The hard liners search persistently, to the point of it dominating their lives it seems, for stuff to write about the “other lot”.
At least we have something in common though Syd because, judging by your noticeable lack of posts on the viking chat part of this forum, you are not particularly interested in football.
Well now. Johnson's ex-mistress and well connected journalist:
'A source at Number 10 tells me that Boris Johnson intends to stand down as Prime Minister on Monday, in order to run for the Tory leadership.'
https://twitter.com/PetronellaWyatt/status/1545755462292971520
Of course the fact that Wyatts dad was a former Labour politician wouldn’t have influenced her to make up something like that.
Presumably him being one of Thatcher's closest advisers would have influenced her.
I dont know.
He was an active LP member and MP for much longer than he was Maggies advisor.
Yes, but which was he after Petronella was born and would have grown up experiencing?
Again, I don’t know, how could I know?
Leopards and spots spring to mind.u
Well now. Johnson's ex-mistress and well connected journalist:
'A source at Number 10 tells me that Boris Johnson intends to stand down as Prime Minister on Monday, in order to run for the Tory leadership.'
https://twitter.com/PetronellaWyatt/status/1545755462292971520
Of course the fact that Wyatts dad was a former Labour politician wouldn’t have influenced her to make up something like that.
Presumably him being one of Thatcher's closest advisers would have influenced her.
I dont know.
He was an active LP member and MP for much longer than he was Maggies advisor.
Yes, but which was he after Petronella was born and would have grown up experiencing?
Again, I don’t know, how could I know?
Leopards and spots spring to mind.u
So, you don't know but it didn't stop you from talking about him. Perhaps you ought to have found out first. I didn't have to look him up, I already knew about him. Then again, I'm surprised how someone who claims that've only just got interested in politics would know anything about someone who stopped being an MP in 1970!
Well now. Johnson's ex-mistress and well connected journalist:
'A source at Number 10 tells me that Boris Johnson intends to stand down as Prime Minister on Monday, in order to run for the Tory leadership.'
https://twitter.com/PetronellaWyatt/status/1545755462292971520
Of course the fact that Wyatts dad was a former Labour politician wouldn’t have influenced her to make up something like that.
Presumably him being one of Thatcher's closest advisers would have influenced her.
I dont know.
He was an active LP member and MP for much longer than he was Maggies advisor.
Yes, but which was he after Petronella was born and would have grown up experiencing?
Again, I don’t know, how could I know?
Leopards and spots spring to mind.u
So, you don't know but it didn't stop you from talking about him. Perhaps you ought to have found out first. I didn't have to look him up, I already knew about him. Then again, I'm surprised how someone who claims that've only just got interested in politics would know anything about someone who stopped being an MP in 1970!
I admit that I looked him up, I had never heard of him.
A quick google search told me he was a former Labour MP.
Not having such a vast knowledge of all things known to man, as you appear to have, I based my response on that.
Happy ?
I am curious though how you know that he would have indoctrinated little Petronella with Tory propaganda.
I was going to write that he could have been a Labour Party spy but from the gist of most of your posts you wouldn’t see the funny side if it, so I won’t bother.
I see that Petronella Wyatt is suggesting that the Piglet is plotting a manoeuver to put himself forward as a candidate in the new leader election. The rules say that a leader who resigns is not allowed to stand for re-election note his choice of words he will stand down he has not resigned is there an attempted coup happening in front of our eyes?
Well now. Johnson's ex-mistress and well connected journalist:
'A source at Number 10 tells me that Boris Johnson intends to stand down as Prime Minister on Monday, in order to run for the Tory leadership.'
https://twitter.com/PetronellaWyatt/status/1545755462292971520
Of course the fact that Wyatts dad was a former Labour politician wouldn’t have influenced her to make up something like that.
You think who her father is has more effect on what she would say than her current job, Deputy Editor of The Spectator or who the father of her aborted child is? Interesting.
I never mentioned her job or private life wilts so you are making a big assumption there.
Well now. Johnson's ex-mistress and well connected journalist:
'A source at Number 10 tells me that Boris Johnson intends to stand down as Prime Minister on Monday, in order to run for the Tory leadership.'
https://twitter.com/PetronellaWyatt/status/1545755462292971520
Of course the fact that Wyatts dad was a former Labour politician wouldn’t have influenced her to make up something like that.
You think who her father is has more effect on what she would say than her current job, Deputy Editor of The Spectator or who the father of her aborted child is? Interesting.
I never mentioned her job or private life wilts so you are making a big assumption there.
You brought her father into the conversation. So... a person's parents are not part of their private life? What a strange fellow you are.
Well now. Johnson's ex-mistress and well connected journalist:
'A source at Number 10 tells me that Boris Johnson intends to stand down as Prime Minister on Monday, in order to run for the Tory leadership.'
https://twitter.com/PetronellaWyatt/status/1545755462292971520
Of course the fact that Wyatts dad was a former Labour politician wouldn’t have influenced her to make up something like that.
You think who her father is has more effect on what she would say than her current job, Deputy Editor of The Spectator or who the father of her aborted child is? Interesting.
I never mentioned her job or private life wilts so you are making a big assumption there.
You brought her father into the conversation. So... a person's parents are not part of their private life? What a strange fellow you are.
I was talking about who was the father of her aborted child, and you know it.
Unless of course you think I was saying her own father was the father of her aborted child and that would make YOU the strange fellow.
Of course the fact that Wyatts dad was a former Labour politician wouldn’t have influenced her to make up something like that.
Not at all, that highlighted piece was relevant further up the thread.
Just selective by Glyn.
I made it clear pies what I was talking about.
Perhaps a case for VAR.
Not at all, that highlighted piece was relevant further up the thread.
Just selective by Glyn.
I made it clear pies what I was talking about.
Perhaps a case for VAR.
Not that it particularly bothers me, but in post 2005, (your reply to me), you specifically say you have never mentioned her private life.
However as others have pointed out, you specifically mentioned her father's political career as a motivation for posting that tweet. In fact you seem to intimate that her father's political career is a motivation for making things up.
You're a crap liar, hound. Wilts mentioned the father of her aborted child, not you. And straight after he did, you denied talking about her private life!
You're a crap liar, hound. Wilts mentioned the father of her aborted child, not you. And straight after he did, you denied talking about her private life!
Let’s get this straight Wiggerly.
Yes, I know wilts mentioned the father of her unborn aborted child first.
I had no idea that that had happened so I couldn’t have mentioned it first.
My reference to her private life was about the aborted child which I considered to be literally that.
Pies has already quizzed me about it and I fully explained what I was referring to.
Read the thread again properly and you can see that.
I have had plenty of conversations on here with wilts and although we haven’t agreed on some things the chats have always been conducted in a civilised manner whereas whenever you get involved with one of my posts you come along with your high and mighty attitude and make any chance of a decent debate unlikely.
Feel free to come back and argue further about this if you like but I won’t be biting on your bait.
In all honesty I don’t give a flying f**k whether you believe me or not with regards to this.
Lot of similarities with Sri Lanka, opulent palace, PM past master at hiding, economy in tatters .....
25465 I'm not not particularly interested in politics, i just like to talk about it forever ..........If anyone wants to talk on here, there is little choice.
25465 I'm not not particularly interested in politics, i just like to talk about it forever ..........If anyone wants to talk on here, there is little choice.
Hopefully that won’t last forever; someone might internally combust.
I absolutely agree with that, Hound.25465 I'm not not particularly interested in politics, i just like to talk about it forever ..........If anyone wants to talk on here, there is little choice.
Hopefully that won’t last forever; someone might internally combust.
The politics in general is very secondary to me.
I find it fascinating how biased certain people are to their preferred Party and how indoctrinated they seem to be, to the point that they would vote for anyone who represented their lot.
You're a crap liar, hound. Wilts mentioned the father of her aborted child, not you. And straight after he did, you denied talking about her private life!
Let’s get this straight Wiggerly.
Yes, I know wilts mentioned the father of her unborn aborted child first.
I had no idea that that had happened so I couldn’t have mentioned it first.
My reference to her private life was about the aborted child which I considered to be literally that.
Pies has already quizzed me about it and I fully explained what I was referring to.
Read the thread again properly and you can see that.
I have had plenty of conversations on here with wilts and although we haven’t agreed on some things the chats have always been conducted in a civilised manner whereas whenever you get involved with one of my posts you come along with your high and mighty attitude and make any chance of a decent debate unlikely.
Feel free to come back and argue further about this if you like but I won’t be biting on your bait.
In all honesty I don’t give a flying f**k whether you believe me or not with regards to this.
25465 I'm not not particularly interested in politics, i just like to talk about it forever ..........If anyone wants to talk on here, there is little choice.
Hopefully that won’t last forever; someone might internally combust.
The politics in general is very secondary to me.
I find it fascinating how biased certain people are to their preferred Party and how indoctrinated they seem to be, to the point that they would vote for anyone who represented their lot.
25465 I'm not not particularly interested in politics, i just like to talk about it forever ..........If anyone wants to talk on here, there is little choice.
Hopefully that won’t last forever; someone might internally combust.
The politics in general is very secondary to me.
I find it fascinating how biased certain people are to their preferred Party and how indoctrinated they seem to be, to the point that they would vote for anyone who represented their lot.
I would have thought your mind and hands were full as it is each day hound watching your dog/s take a shit and cleaning up, hehe
Houndy hound, you don't like banter? you've got to admit that you set the bar pretty low though aye? but thinking about it unlikely to admit to anything.
Houndy hound, you don't like banter? you've got to admit that you set the bar pretty low though aye? but thinking about it unlikely to admit to anything.
Keep digging your hole.
A truly horrible man.
Houndy hound, you don't like banter? you've got to admit that you set the bar pretty low though aye? but thinking about it unlikely to admit to anything.
Keep digging your hole.
A truly horrible man.
houndy you silly billy, you don't like my politics, the way I present my politics, where I live, where I comment, what I comment on, the list is endless
Hound is innocent ............. free hound
At least you have stopped being a peddant
25465 I'm not not particularly interested in politics, i just like to talk about it forever ..........If anyone wants to talk on here, there is little choice.
Hopefully that won’t last forever; someone might internally combust.
The politics in general is very secondary to me.
I find it fascinating how biased certain people are to their preferred Party and how indoctrinated they seem to be, to the point that they would vote for anyone who represented their lot.
I would have thought your mind and hands were full as it is each day hound watching your dog/s take a shit and cleaning up, hehe
''Boris Johnson has told MPs that no government business was discussed “as far as I am aware” when he met the former KGB agent Alexander Lebedev at an Italian palazzo without officials present when he was foreign secretary.
The prime minister admitted this month that he met the businessman in April 2018 after making a trip to a restored castle in Perugia owned by Evgeny Lebedev, Alexander’s son, for a weekend-long party after attending a Nato foreign ministers’ meeting in Brussels that discussed the security situation with Russia''
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2022/jul/26/boris-johnson-says-2018-lebedev-visit-was-in-line-with-security-protocols
It makes one wonder why he didn't say all this earlier if there was nothing innit, aye?
Johnson chucking cash at Ukrainians whilst ignoring his own people. At least he's had a good 2/3 months off.
25465 I'm not not particularly interested in politics, i just like to talk about it forever ..........If anyone wants to talk on here, there is little choice.
Hopefully that won’t last forever; someone might internally combust.
The politics in general is very secondary to me.
I find it fascinating how biased certain people are to their preferred Party and how indoctrinated they seem to be, to the point that they would vote for anyone who represented their lot.
I see he's even getting headlines now talking about about his future on the Talks and book circuits
Every ex PM coins it in after being in that office. It’s the main reason all MPs aspire to that position. Because it’s the financial golden ticket.
Every ex PM coins it in after being in that office. It’s the main reason all MPs aspire to that position. Because it’s the financial golden ticket.
That is absolute nonsense. Criticise PMs as much as you like but absolutely none of them want to be PM because it could make them rich.
Every ex PM coins it in after being in that office. It’s the main reason all MPs aspire to that position. Because it’s the financial golden ticket.
That is absolute nonsense. Criticise PMs as much as you like but absolutely none of them want to be PM because it could make them rich.
Ask Blair. He was reported to have netted millions in the five years after office. Do you honestly think they do it for all the grief and £150k a year? No. They do it because of the kudos it attracts post office. To have been the PM in this country opens very big social, business and financial doors.
With perhaps the exception of whopper Truss.
Every ex PM coins it in after being in that office. It’s the main reason all MPs aspire to that position. Because it’s the financial golden ticket.
That is absolute nonsense. Criticise PMs as much as you like but absolutely none of them want to be PM because it could make them rich.
Ask Blair. He was reported to have netted millions in the five years after office. Do you honestly think they do it for all the grief and £150k a year? No. They do it because of the kudos it attracts post office. To have been the PM in this country opens very big social, business and financial doors.
With perhaps the exception of whopper Truss.
With respect NR, you're getting cause and effect mixed up.
SOME PMs may make a lot of money after being PM (although Brown stands out as a counter example). NONE go into the job for that reason.