Is it fair

[since-1969]

With only 9 months into his job David Moyes is being scrutinised by the media and fans as to his suitability as a manager . 

[IDM]

Yes and no.

Yes, because the side that were champions last year are under achieving with very much the same squad.  No because Moyes was successful in that Everton probably succeeded expectations under his control so he is a proven good manager in the premiership, and also Ferguson went 4 years before winning anything.

[mrfrostsdad]

I think it is reasonable, because it's not just the results, it's the performances as well.
My guess is, and it's only an opinion obviously, is that all is not well at Old Trafford and maybe the players don't like Moyes, or his methods, and don't want to play for him.
If that's the case, there will be only one winner. And it won't be David Moyes

[GazLaz]

Moyes never struck me as a managerial genius. He came across as someone who could ster up moderate players to over achieve, bit like Woy. Look what happened when he went to Liverpool. How they overlooked Jose in favour of Gollum is one of life's great mysteries.

[The Red Baron]

and also Ferguson went 4 years before winning anything.

That was then, this is now. No manager coming into a club of United's stature would now be allowed to go 4 years without winning anything. Wenger gets away with it because of his previous track record of success.

When Fergie went to United they hadn't won the League Championship for the best part of 20 years. As a result he was given time. If Moyes doesn't at least qualify for the Champions League this season (and how likely is that?) he'll be toast- 6 year contract notwithstanding.

[wing commander]

Theres only one genius here and that's Sir Alex...He has spent his career at United building his teams up and when they tipped over the peak rebuild them again..He knew that squad was ageing and needed a rebuild..And he also knew that the Glaziers didn't have the cash to do it..He made one last effort aided by teams with better squads who were inconsistent and went......Im not Moyes biggest fan but im not naïve enough to think that anybody would be doing much better.....

[NickDRFC]

Agree with the The Red Baron - comparisons to Fergie and his start are irrelevant. Fergie took over a side that hadn't won the league for several years, Moyes took over a side that haven't finished outside of the top 3 for 20 years. Apples and pears.

Gaz - my guess with mourinho is that man utd like to have "legacy" managers who will be there for years, given mourinho's recent tendency to get bored and move on after 3 years or so I think that's what counted against him.

[Curious Orange]

Moyes needs a bit of time. This seems to be a transitional season to identify some of the dead wood. Liverpool gave Rodgers a season's grace because of what he had achieved at a smaller club. Admittedly they finished 7th having come 8th the previous season rather than being champions but it still goes to show that success is not instant - even if you throw £100mil at it (Spurs) - or constant.

Between the need for the sports media to generate discussion, the schadenfreude of other fans and the fact that a lot of United fans have never known anything other than success, there are going to be plenty of voices clamouring for a sacking.

However, I can only see it getting tougher for United to get back to the top of the tree: if Chelsea get a goalscorer, if Arsenal do likewise, if City keep Aguero fit, if Liverpool keep improving. (A lot of "ifs" I know.)

[IDM]

My point of comparing with Fergie was related to how Man Utd have gone about their business.

Mind you, they had quite a few managerial changes before Fergie came along.

IMHO Moyes should get one more season.

[hoolahoop]

Theres only one genius here and that's Sir Alex...He has spent his career at United building his teams up and when they tipped over the peak rebuild them again..He knew that squad was ageing and needed a rebuild..And he also knew that the Glaziers didn't have the cash to do it..He made one last effort aided by teams with better squads who were inconsistent and went......Im not Moyes biggest fan but im not naïve enough to think that anybody would be doing much better.....

I'm with the wing commander on this one. His assessment of the situation at OT seems to be very fair Moyes must be given more time surely .........?

[GazLaz]

Jose has already been round the big leagues. I think he would have happily had 5+ years at United.

[hoolahoop]

Jose has already been round the big leagues. I think he would have happily had 5+ years at United.

I think he would Gaz but I think they are looking more long term and also Mourinho likes to pull the strings. Quite simply no new manager going into that environment will be offered that amount of space/say.

[grayx]

It also looks to me like the players have no faith in Moyes, either his tactics, team selections or training methods. Its one bad performance after another, the team can barely put two passes together. Van Persie looks totally pissed off to me.
Its gonna take a massive injection of cash to rebuild that squad, will they trust Moyes' judgement in the transfer market if Fellaini's signing is anything to go by?.   I bloody wouldn't.

[RedJ]

However, I can only see it getting tougher for United to get back to the top of the tree: if Chelsea get a goalscorer, if Arsenal do likewise, if City keep Aguero fit, if Liverpool keep improving. (A lot of "ifs" I know.)

Might be a lot of ifs but none of them are anywhere close to beyond the realms of possibility.

United could be left for dust fairly easily - which would have been unthinkable with Ferguson about.

[The Red Baron]

Moyes never struck me as a managerial genius. He came across as someone who could ster up moderate players to over achieve, bit like Woy. Look what happened when he went to Liverpool. How they overlooked Jose in favour of Gollum is one of life's great mysteries.

I think timing had a lot to do with it. It was obvious from mid-way through last season that Mourinho was keen to come back to Chelsea and the feeling was mutual. Fergie didn't announce his departure from United until shortly before the season ended. It would have been very hard for United to entice Jose to Old Trafford, even had they wanted to.

In the current circumstances Mourinho would have been good for United because he's able to get the extra 10% out of players, something Moyes seems unable to do. Though I doubt Mourinho regrets his decision to go back to the Bridge.

[Filo]

Rumours on twitter that Ryan Giggs has had a bust up with Moyes calling him clueless, I reckon the writing is on the wall for Moyes

[The Red Baron]

Rumours on twitter that Ryan Giggs has had a bust up with Moyes calling him clueless, I reckon the writing is on the wall for Moyes

Mmm... it's noticeable that Giggs has been sidelined recently, even though he still remains one of their more effective midfielders.

[bobbymax]

Given United's recent performances, wouldn't this be more relevant in a non-football off topic section?

[Filo]

Rumours on twitter that Ryan Giggs has had a bust up with Moyes calling him clueless, I reckon the writing is on the wall for Moyes

Mmm... it's noticeable that Giggs has been sidelined recently, even though he still remains one of their more effective midfielders.

There's something obviously wrong there, RVP doesn't look interested, Vidic's mind is already in Milan, Fellaini doesn't look the player he was at Everton. I'm not sure the players are happy with Moyes

[roversdude]

The scouse humour with the banner proclaiming Moyes as a football genius was class

[BobG]

I have a sneaky feeling that somebody has been really, really clever. following a legend is always, always, always an impossible task.  Nothing works. Those left behind hate the new bloke - simply because he's not the old bloke. Just look to Leeds for an example of that. The new bloke wants to get rid of the old lags because they're pissed off with him and too set in their ways.That's even happened at Utd before. So the race is on between who gets it first: the old guard? or the new bloke? The clever bit is who might have recognised all this and decided to wait a little while. The glory is usually reaped by the one after the new bloke....

BobG

[RedJ]

I have a sneaky feeling that somebody has been really, really clever. following a legend is always, always, always an impossible task.  Nothing works. Those left behind hate the new bloke - simply because he's not the old bloke. Just look to Leeds for an example of that. The new bloke wants to get rid of the old lags because they're pissed off with him and too set in their ways.That's even happened at Utd before. So the race is on between who gets it first: the old guard? or the new bloke? The clever bit is who might have recognised all this and decided to wait a little while. The glory is usually reaped by the one after the new bloke....

BobG

At the risk of invoking Godwin's law, something like that happened in the 1930s on the continent...

[BobG]

ha ha ha ha!!!

Belting Red!

BobG

PS Who was Godwin?

[RedJ]

American attorney and author, Mike Godwin - according to the bastion of credibility that is wikipedia at least.

[BillyStubbsTears]

Had I been Moyes, on Day One, I'd have had all the players round to Ryan Giggs's basement cinema and showed them The Damned United.

I'd have had a reight good f***ing giggle about it. About how stupid the players and the manager were. About how everything could be pissed away because of egos and misunderstandings.

Then, I'd have sacked the f***ing lot of em and signed James Coppinger and Billy Sharp.

[Sammy Chung was King]

Had I been Moyes, on Day One, I'd have had all the players round to Rusn Giggs's basement cinema and showed them The Damned United.

I'd have had a reight good f***ing giggle about it. About how stupid the players and the manager were. About how everything could be pissed away because of egos and misunderstandings.

Then, I'd have sacked the f***ing lot of em and signed James Coppinger and Billy Sharp.

And have got relegated Billy ,Ferguson was very shrewd,like a previous poster said,the Glazers don't want to spend the cash needed to up the quality,they are not just short of one or two,the whole defence needs investment,plus one or two in midfield,and a striker,but the thing he hasn't achieved is improving what he already has,Van Persie is playing the typical Dutch role,of when things are going bad,they disappear,Rooney doesn't know which role he's playing,he's trying to cover for everybody,you've got to be looking 250/300 million,admittedly they've just signed the biggest sponsorship deal in history,but the Glazers,no way will they spend that,they will allow him to sign four or five players maximum,which won't be enough,i'm not sure i'd give Moyes ''A Penny whistle'' he'd probably choke on the pea,never mind give him money.

[BigColSutherland]

I understand that as a man-manager he is superb, however tactically Moyes hasn't got it right. RVP gave an insight into this the other week when he said other players are now standing in the spaces he would normally run into. So either RVP needs to change his game, or the other players are stood in the wrong place. Either way, this is a tactical issue for Moyes to sort out, and one he should have sorted out by now. Their goal scoring record at home is appalling.