The \"exciting times ahead\"

[DonnyNoel]

I think what I'm trying to say is that if you take emotion out of SODs demise, it's actually pretty straight forward and transparent.

Thats exactly what I'm trying to say too.  Just not sure it warrants all the extras that both sides seem fascinated with.

[drfcsteve]

Silent Majority you are talking out of your arse with these comments. I'll add to the list of poor loan players Neil Sullivan, Martis, Joe Mills not to mention reviving Jon Osters career, Richie Wellens on a free, Dumbuya from no where, George Friend (regarded as the best defender at the club), Brian Stock, James Hayter and Jimmy O'Conner for next to nothing compared with what some players go for, same with Bennett who will be a star of the future, and of course already mentioned Matt Mills who recently went for 5 million and will most likely be playing in the premiership next season, and of course Billy Sharp, possibly the best striker we've seen at the club and one we will definitely make a profit on when he goes on January.

And yet you say he wasn't shrewd?

Nice one Steve.

I never said he wasn't shrewd, nor did I say he didn't bring decent players into the club, in fact I wasn't doing an appraisal on Seans' transfer record at all, what I was doing was answering the original question. Read that again and then read my answer, it does make more sense to read what I actually wrote and not what you thought I wrote.

Sorry you didn't say he wasn't shrewd, you said \"SO'D wasn't quite the astute manager everybody thinks he is\".

My issue is that you seem to have had your meeting with JR and all of a sudden you've gone on a propaganda mission on this forum with the intention of tarring Seans name so sacking him doesn't look as bad.

You seemed perfectly happy with Sean after the fans forum less than a couple of weeks ago - \"He just seems to get better and better, much more comfortable and confident every time I see him.\"

Now all of a sudden you say - \"no more psycho doubletalk from SO'D and back to playing proper football\".

Seems like a pretty big U-turn, we're used to that now though.

[The Red Baron]

Silent Majority you are talking out of your arse with these comments. I'll add to the list of poor loan players Neil Sullivan, Martis, Joe Mills not to mention reviving Jon Osters career, Richie Wellens on a free, Dumbuya from no where, George Friend (regarded as the best defender at the club), Brian Stock, James Hayter and Jimmy O'Conner for next to nothing compared with what some players go for, same with Bennett who will be a star of the future, and of course already mentioned Matt Mills who recently went for 5 million and will most likely be playing in the premiership next season, and of course Billy Sharp, possibly the best striker we've seen at the club and one we will definitely make a profit on when he goes on January.

And yet you say he wasn't shrewd?

Nice one Steve.

I never said he wasn't shrewd, nor did I say he didn't bring decent players into the club, in fact I wasn't doing an appraisal on Seans' transfer record at all, what I was doing was answering the original question. Read that again and then read my answer, it does make more sense to read what I actually wrote and not what you thought I wrote.

Sorry you didn't say he wasn't shrewd, you said \"SO'D wasn't quite the astute manager everybody thinks he is\".

My issue is that you seem to have had your meeting with JR and all of a sudden you've gone on a propaganda mission on this forum with the intention of tarring Seans name so sacking him doesn't look as bad.

You seemed perfectly happy with Sean after the fans forum less than a couple of weeks ago - \"He just seems to get better and better, much more comfortable and confident every time I see him.\"

Now all of a sudden you say - \"no more psycho doubletalk from SO'D and back to playing proper football\".

Seems like a pretty big U-turn, we're used to that now though.

Spot-on Steve. I can accept the line that football is a results business and that SO'D  had to go because he wasn't getting results. Thing is, it begs the question as to why he wasn't removed earlier and why the chairman went out of his way to defend him hours before sacking him? The attempts to trash his reputation and make him out to be a poor manager are below the belt, and if the VSC Executive are being used to peddle this line then they should be ashamed of themselves.

[benaldo]

Silent Majority you are talking out of your arse with these comments. I'll add to the list of poor loan players Neil Sullivan, Martis, Joe Mills not to mention reviving Jon Osters career, Richie Wellens on a free, Dumbuya from no where, George Friend (regarded as the best defender at the club), Brian Stock, James Hayter and Jimmy O'Conner for next to nothing compared with what some players go for, same with Bennett who will be a star of the future, and of course already mentioned Matt Mills who recently went for 5 million and will most likely be playing in the premiership next season, and of course Billy Sharp, possibly the best striker we've seen at the club and one we will definitely make a profit on when he goes on January.

And yet you say he wasn't shrewd?

Nice one Steve.

I never said he wasn't shrewd, nor did I say he didn't bring decent players into the club, in fact I wasn't doing an appraisal on Seans' transfer record at all, what I was doing was answering the original question. Read that again and then read my answer, it does make more sense to read what I actually wrote and not what you thought I wrote.

Sorry you didn't say he wasn't shrewd, you said \"SO'D wasn't quite the astute manager everybody thinks he is\".

My issue is that you seem to have had your meeting with JR and all of a sudden you've gone on a propaganda mission on this forum with the intention of tarring Seans name so sacking him doesn't look as bad.

You seemed perfectly happy with Sean after the fans forum less than a couple of weeks ago - \"He just seems to get better and better, much more comfortable and confident every time I see him.\"

Now all of a sudden you say - \"no more psycho doubletalk from SO'D and back to playing proper football\".

Seems like a pretty big U-turn, we're used to that now though.

There's nothing wrong with a \"U turn\" is there if you're heading in the wrong direction and realise it? It's stupid to criticise people for changing their mind, just because they've changed their mind...! You hear it all the time when politicians talk rubbish, slagging each other off for \"U turns\". Well I'd rather someone realised they were making a mistake and changed their mind than blindly continued onwards because they were frightened of changing their mind because someone was going to take them to task and trot out the \"u turn\" phrase because they are too stupid to think of anything else to say!

Having said that, it seems like SOD was scared of doing a u turn. But I do find it amusing to read all the SOD worshippers filling in his grave at the moment when a couple of weeks ago (a la Silent majority and others) lots of people were threatening world war if anyone even slightly suggested SOD wasn't up to the task.

[CusworthRovers]

The short answer is no. There is a long answer which might not make a lot of sense so I'm not going to attempt it.

However, SO'D was a controlling type of manager, one who would make all the decisions on who played, who didn't who we signed etc. His promotion of the academy was non-existent, his loan players were pretty poor, in the end no one to blame but himself. DS is a believer in using other peoples abilities and qualities, if you can help I'll listen to you is his motto.

You're clearly very much a football academic SM, but as pointed out by many a diverse poster, that's not right IMO. I only post this reply (as you've had many already), as it's more a surprise it's come under your name.
The first bit is down to opinion on how you like your managers to be (and I think Seans approach was bang on and worked to be fair).
The 2nd bit is wrong and again his record/success in this field proves that.

[silent majority]

Cussy,

This thread has turned into something that it wasn't meant to be, every time I post something that is intended to get it back on track people are using that to reinforce their standpoint. It was about the future under DS, not about the history of SO'D, and as certain people have pointed out I was a very big SO'D fan. It was a big shock to me too, but what I've failed to appreciate in this thread is that whatever observations are made about Sean nobody will accept that without it hurting, for that I apologise. I wasn't attempting to blacken anybody's reputation, just to promote the idea that things can be even better with the new manager.

Steve

I certainly haven't done a U turn. What I posted last week was about Sean's ability as a public speaker and how every time I saw him he got better and better in handling questions and dealing with Mr Joe Public. My critique of some of his loan signings was about his ability as a football manager, being good at one doesn't necessarily translate to the other. Appreciating his talents at one aspect and then offering a different perspective on the other does not constitute a U turn.

[Red wizard]

Silent Majority you are talking out of your arse with these comments. I'll add to the list of poor loan players Neil Sullivan, Martis, Joe Mills not to mention reviving Jon Osters career, Richie Wellens on a free, Dumbuya from no where, George Friend (regarded as the best defender at the club), Brian Stock, James Hayter and Jimmy O'Conner for next to nothing compared with what some players go for, same with Bennett who will be a star of the future, and of course already mentioned Matt Mills who recently went for 5 million and will most likely be playing in the premiership next season, and of course Billy Sharp, possibly the best striker we've seen at the club and one we will definitely make a profit on when he goes on January.

And yet you say he wasn't shrewd?

Wellens was a star before he came so you can knock that one off. Thats not to say Sean never made him better though.

[Wellred]

I am not going to enter the debate on SOD and making or refusing to make a U turn but there was one person some years ago who \"wasn't for turning\" and just look how she made a mess of the country and we are now seeing the results of the me me me culture she created.

[CusworthRovers]

Cussy,

This thread has turned into something that it wasn't meant to be, every time I post something that is intended to get it back on track people are using that to reinforce their standpoint. It was about the future under DS, not about the history of SO'D, and as certain people have pointed out I was a very big SO'D fan. It was a big shock to me too, but what I've failed to appreciate in this thread is that whatever observations are made about Sean nobody will accept that without it hurting, for that I apologise. I wasn't attempting to blacken anybody's reputation, just to promote the idea that things can be even better with the new manager.

I certainly haven't done a U turn. What I posted last week was about Sean's ability as a public speaker and how every time I saw him he got better and better in handling questions and dealing with Mr Joe Public. My critique of some of his loan signings was about his ability as a football manager, being good at one doesn't necessarily translate to the other. Appreciating his talents at one aspect and then offering a different perspective on the other does not constitute a U turn.

No probs chief, as said just a bit of a surprise and seemed out of character.... and I'll trust the 'U Turn' comment was a reply to all as I'd never level that accusation against you

[Sheepskin Stu]

[wilts rover]

Cussy,

This thread has turned into something that it wasn't meant to be, every time I post something that is intended to get it back on track people are using that to reinforce their standpoint. It was about the future under DS, not about the history of SO'D, and as certain people have pointed out I was a very big SO'D fan. It was a big shock to me too, but what I've failed to appreciate in this thread is that whatever observations are made about Sean nobody will accept that without it hurting, for that I apologise. I wasn't attempting to blacken anybody's reputation, just to promote the idea that things can be even better with the new manager.

Steve

I certainly haven't done a U turn. What I posted last week was about Sean's ability as a public speaker and how every time I saw him he got better and better in handling questions and dealing with Mr Joe Public. My critique of some of his loan signings was about his ability as a football manager, being good at one doesn't necessarily translate to the other. Appreciating his talents at one aspect and then offering a different perspective on the other does not constitute a U turn.

I think S-M that reading the responses in this thread the old proverb, when you have got to the bottom of the hole, stop digging, comes to mind.

I look forward to whatever exciting times lie ahead. Although going by our past reputation on 'mouthwatering signings', 'destination championship' and the like, I will reserve judgement on the accuracy of our slogans after I see the results not when JR/Gartom and yourself trot them out in the latest PR stunt.

I do think though that asserting Saunders is going to be better in the transfer/loan market than O'Driscoll was, without seeing any results or evidence of that is just being pompous. In fact the evidence so far is against him, another thread points out that he has had 100 players in 3 years at Wrexham, so he does he really know what players he wants? Does slagging off O'Driscoll make Saunders a better manager, i think not.

Unless of course you are going to provide some evidence for the contrary?

[RobTheRover]

Didnt you fail your driving test, Stu?

;-)

[RobTheRover]

Cussy,

This thread has turned into something that it wasn't meant to be, every time I post something that is intended to get it back on track people are using that to reinforce their standpoint. It was about the future under DS, not about the history of SO'D, and as certain people have pointed out I was a very big SO'D fan. It was a big shock to me too, but what I've failed to appreciate in this thread is that whatever observations are made about Sean nobody will accept that without it hurting, for that I apologise. I wasn't attempting to blacken anybody's reputation, just to promote the idea that things can be even better with the new manager.

Steve

I certainly haven't done a U turn. What I posted last week was about Sean's ability as a public speaker and how every time I saw him he got better and better in handling questions and dealing with Mr Joe Public. My critique of some of his loan signings was about his ability as a football manager, being good at one doesn't necessarily translate to the other. Appreciating his talents at one aspect and then offering a different perspective on the other does not constitute a U turn.

I think S-M that reading the responses in this thread the old proverb, when you have got to the bottom of the hole, stop digging, comes to mind.

I look forward to whatever exciting times lie ahead. Although going by our past reputation on 'mouthwatering signings', 'destination championship' and the like, I will reserve judgement on the accuracy of our slogans after I see the results not when JR/Gartom and yourself trot them out in the latest PR stunt.

I do think though that asserting Saunders is going to be better in the transfer/loan market than O'Driscoll was, without seeing any results or evidence of that is just being pompous. In fact the evidence so far is against him, another thread points out that he has had 100 players in 3 years at Wrexham, so he does he really know what players he wants? Does slagging off O'Driscoll make Saunders a better manager, i think not.

Unless of course you are going to provide some evidence for the contrary?

No one is slagging off Sean.  I dare say most on here (on balance) have enjoyed his tenure immensely, and the progress from where he took over to where he left us is there for all to see.  I'm still gutted he's gone, but I now know some of the reasons and processes behind the board coming to this tough decision - it wasnt an easy call for them either, you know.

The important thing is now to focus on the next chapter, not the one we have just closed.  DS is a young manager and will no doubt have to learn quickly about how things are at this level.  On evidence from Saturday, that process has already started.

[DearneValleyRover]

Cussy,

This thread has turned into something that it wasn't meant to be, every time I post something that is intended to get it back on track people are using that to reinforce their standpoint. It was about the future under DS, not about the history of SO'D, and as certain people have pointed out I was a very big SO'D fan. It was a big shock to me too, but what I've failed to appreciate in this thread is that whatever observations are made about Sean nobody will accept that without it hurting, for that I apologise. I wasn't attempting to blacken anybody's reputation, just to promote the idea that things can be even better with the new manager.

Steve

I certainly haven't done a U turn. What I posted last week was about Sean's ability as a public speaker and how every time I saw him he got better and better in handling questions and dealing with Mr Joe Public. My critique of some of his loan signings was about his ability as a football manager, being good at one doesn't necessarily translate to the other. Appreciating his talents at one aspect and then offering a different perspective on the other does not constitute a U turn.

I think S-M that reading the responses in this thread the old proverb, when you have got to the bottom of the hole, stop digging, comes to mind.

I look forward to whatever exciting times lie ahead. Although going by our past reputation on 'mouthwatering signings', 'destination championship' and the like, I will reserve judgement on the accuracy of our slogans after I see the results not when JR/Gartom and yourself trot them out in the latest PR stunt.

I do think though that asserting Saunders is going to be better in the transfer/loan market than O'Driscoll was, without seeing any results or evidence of that is just being pompous. In fact the evidence so far is against him, another thread points out that he has had 100 players in 3 years at Wrexham, so he does he really know what players he wants? Does slagging off O'Driscoll make Saunders a better manager, i think not.

Unless of course you are going to provide some evidence for the contrary?

To be fair Saunders was learning his trade and openly admitted he got things wrong at the start, Wrexham's form improved has DS improved and most of the signings were early on. I suppose only time will tell if the lessons learned can help us move onwards and upwards.

The whole saga has left a very sour taste in the mouth, SO'D is and always will be a Rovers Legend and what ever his management style, loan signings etc. is there any need to allude to them at all.

I was very much pro SO'D but I'm Rovers through and through, Dean Saunders is our Manager now and will receive my support 100%, I only hope he can provide the success his predecessor did

[jonnydog]

I take it you're Erectile Dysfunctional problem has disappeared then?

[wilts rover]

No one is slagging off Sean.  I dare say most on here (on balance) have enjoyed his tenure immensely, and the progress from where he took over to where he left us is there for all to see.  I'm still gutted he's gone, but I now know some of the reasons and processes behind the board coming to this tough decision - it wasnt an easy call for them either, you know.

Oh really? I refer the honourable gentleman to the reply posted earlier -

The short answer is no. There is a long answer which might not make a lot of sense so I'm not going to attempt it.

However, SO'D was a controlling type of manager, one who would make all the decisions on who played, who didn't who we signed etc. His promotion of the academy was non-existent, his loan players were pretty poor, in the end no one to blame but himself. DS is a believer in using other peoples abilities and qualities, if you can help I'll listen to you is his motto.

The important thing is now to focus on the next chapter, not the one we have just closed.  DS is a young manager and will no doubt have to learn quickly about how things are at this level.  On evidence from Saturday, that process has already started.

Agreed, for better or worse Sean O'Driscoll's time at Rovers is now in the history books - lets support Dean Saunders to write his own new chapter by himself rather than referencing the past and how he compares to Sean.

[DonnyBazR0ver]

A few more snippetts in Sanders' pre-Hull interview.

Says brought in an element of 'fun competition' between the players. He bought a set of golf clubs and a TV and the player's MOM took home the TV. Also brought in a player's vote for the worst player.

Also in Stock's interview he said the gaffer did tell them to get the ball in behind the opposition but they took it too literally. He wants them to play more of a pressing game whilst still passing the ball, \"which pleases the players\" he said.

Saunders says he wants to get better quality balls up to the front men but doesn't want them to lump it. Says he doesn't want the strikers running side to side and getting nowhere. As a striker that pisses you off.

All good stuff. Wondered how Stock would re-act with his father figure now gone but he seems very positive.

[Bristol Red Rover]

.....I do think though that asserting Saunders is going to be better in the transfer/loan market than O'Driscoll was, without seeing any results or evidence of that is just being pompous. In fact the evidence so far is against him, another thread points out that he has had 100 players in 3 years at Wrexham, so he does he really know what players he wants? ....

I don't know for sure what the reasons were for the 100 in 3 years but the uncertainty and financial sitaution at Wrexham didn't help.

I'm guessing getting rid of the deadwood was the first factor, then taking risks on low wage players on short term contracts would be another, and DS getting to know what kind of player is needed for that level being another chunk of the mix.

Looking at his first signing in Mal Purchase I can guess at another reason why some players didn't make the grade at Wrexham.

[benaldo]

A few more snippetts in Sanders' pre-Hull interview.

Says brought in an element of 'fun competition' between the players. He bought a set of golf clubs and a TV and the player's MOM took home the TV. Also brought in a player's vote for the worst player. Also in Stock's interview he said the gaffer did tell them to get the ball in behind the opposition but they took it too literally. He wants them to play more of a pressing game whilst still passing the ball, \"which pleases the players\" he said.

Saunders says he wants to get better quality balls up to the front men but doesn't want them to lump it. Says he doesn't want the strikers running side to side and getting nowhere. As a striker that pisses you off.

All good stuff. Wondered how Stock would re-act with his father figure now gone but he seems very positive.

What if Sam Hird Doesn't like Golf??! Mind you, give him a couple of months and he'll be able to open a golf shop under these new and exciting rules. See, for every negative, there's a positive.

[GM-MarkB]

Just got in from work so I couldn't post earlier. Just to defend SM a little through what I posted last night, didn't everyone assume that because Kilgallon was such a flop he couldn't have been chosen by O'Driscoll and so he must have foisted upon him by Ryan et al....which now it seems clearly wasn't the case.

With all the GOOD signings he made, he seemed to have made some equally bizarre ones. But you can't be right all the time can you ?

[benaldo]

Has anyone bothered to do a fairly comprehensive \"SODs Loans\" list yet and put it up for rating?

From my recent memory -

Kilgallon - No
Sharp - Yes
Shackell - Yes
Mills, jr - Yes
Healey - No
Brown - No
Lalkovic - Yes
Ward - Yes
 SO it's about 50/50. I guess that's better odds than sticking a pin in a list of available players?

[The Red Baron]

A few more snippetts in Sanders' pre-Hull interview.

Says brought in an element of 'fun competition' between the players. He bought a set of golf clubs and a TV and the player's MOM took home the TV. Also brought in a player's vote for the worst player. Also in Stock's interview he said the gaffer did tell them to get the ball in behind the opposition but they took it too literally. He wants them to play more of a pressing game whilst still passing the ball, \"which pleases the players\" he said.

Saunders says he wants to get better quality balls up to the front men but doesn't want them to lump it. Says he doesn't want the strikers running side to side and getting nowhere. As a striker that pisses you off.

All good stuff. Wondered how Stock would re-act with his father figure now gone but he seems very positive.

What if Sam Hird Doesn't like Golf??! Mind you, give him a couple of months and he'll be able to open a golf shop under these new and exciting rules. See, for every negative, there's a positive.

Saunders clearly thought Sam Hird was good enough to be in the squad of 16.

[wilts rover]

He also thought George Friend was good enough to play left-back - its a wonder Benaldo isn't going apolectic and getting the Saunders Out banners made already!

[RobTheRover]

No one is slagging off Sean.  I dare say most on here (on balance) have enjoyed his tenure immensely, and the progress from where he took over to where he left us is there for all to see.  I'm still gutted he's gone, but I now know some of the reasons and processes behind the board coming to this tough decision - it wasnt an easy call for them either, you know.

Oh really? I refer the honourable gentleman to the reply posted earlier -

The short answer is no. There is a long answer which might not make a lot of sense so I'm not going to attempt it.

However, SO'D was a controlling type of manager, one who would make all the decisions on who played, who didn't who we signed etc. His promotion of the academy was non-existent, his loan players were pretty poor, in the end no one to blame but himself. DS is a believer in using other peoples abilities and qualities, if you can help I'll listen to you is his motto.

The important thing is now to focus on the next chapter, not the one we have just closed.  DS is a young manager and will no doubt have to learn quickly about how things are at this level.  On evidence from Saturday, that process has already started.

Agreed, for better or worse Sean O'Driscoll's time at Rovers is now in the history books - lets support Dean Saunders to write his own new chapter by himself rather than referencing the past and how he compares to Sean.

See, I never saw that as \"slagging off\", mate.  More like stating an honest opinion.

Glad we agree on the last point.  Time to start writing new history books, not rewriting old ones.

[benaldo]

He also thought George Friend was good enough to play left-back - its a wonder Benaldo isn't going apolectic and getting the Saunders Out banners made already!

I like Saunders at the moment. I don't like Friend at left back (I don't think Saunders does either, but there isn't anyone else at the moment is there), and I positively dislike Hird at any position. He was possbily included because, hmm lets see, there wasn't another defender fit! If he was that good then why didn't he start?