Another Brexit benefit

[drfchound]

New ONS data on local income distribution.

And Selby wants more money in London & The City!!

The greedy capitalists conned you then - and they are still conning you.

https://twitter.com/TorstenBell/status/1712029150205096437

https://www.ons.gov.uk/peoplepopulationandcommunity/personalandhouseholdfinances/incomeandwealth/bulletins/smallareamodelbasedincomeestimates/financialyearending2020

The North/South divide has always been with us. Remember the recessions of the early 80’s and 90’s? Barely touched us in London. There was still money floating around easily enough. The Tories will always look after the South East. To be fair it should be called the London/everywhere else divide.

Herbert, just wondering whether there was any difference in circumstances between London (and southeast) and the North between 1997 and 2010.

Course there was Hound and I know exactly what you’re getting at. I did say that the divide has always been with us. However, the recessions of the early 80’s and 90’s were under the Tories and they (particularly the 80’s) were when the disparities were most evident to my untrained eyes. The whole reason that I left Donny in 1982 was because I’d been made redundant twice in a year and there seemed to be very little prospect of things getting better quickly. I moved to London and I was naming my own price for work on the building sites.

I remember reading one of your posts a while ago telling everyone about your move to London.   Well done with that and I’m glad you are doing well.
What I was getting at is that things are possibly no worse now with the North / South divide than it has been under previous governments.

Fair point Hound. Although I’m irrelevant to this, my own perception is that the North/South divide is worse than ever. For example, transport connections in London are light years ahead of the North now. This wasn’t always necessarily the case. I’m happy to be proven wrong on this (and I hope that I am) but my sense is that the gaps widened significantly over the past 10 years.

Agreed that London transport is better, significantly better because of the tube system.

[wilts rover]

What I was getting at is that things are possibly no worse now with the North / South divide than it has been under previous governments.

It's about 4 times worse now (& growing) than in 1979. Mostly down to the closure of manufacturing jobs in the north & midlands and the concentration of financial service jobs in London & the south east. Which was Thatcher's intention.

https://www.resolutionfoundation.org/comment/election-2019-how-britains-north-south-divide-is-changing/

[Hounslowrover]

Drfchound,  it's not only the tube, I can get a bus to local Tesco,,its quicker with a 10 minute walk , we have so many choices how to get around

[drfchound]

What I was getting at is that things are possibly no worse now with the North / South divide than it has been under previous governments.

It's about 4 times worse now (& growing) than in 1979. Mostly down to the closure of manufacturing jobs in the north & midlands and the concentration of financial service jobs in London & the south east. Which was Thatcher's intention.

https://www.resolutionfoundation.org/comment/election-2019-how-britains-north-south-divide-is-changing/

Wilts, my original question was about the period 1997 to 2010.
I’m genuinely interested to know.

[wilts rover]

What I was getting at is that things are possibly no worse now with the North / South divide than it has been under previous governments.

It's about 4 times worse now (& growing) than in 1979. Mostly down to the closure of manufacturing jobs in the north & midlands and the concentration of financial service jobs in London & the south east. Which was Thatcher's intention.

https://www.resolutionfoundation.org/comment/election-2019-how-britains-north-south-divide-is-changing/

Wilts, my original question was about the period 1997 to 2010.
I’m genuinely interested to know.

I don't know exactly hound but if you look at the graphs in the article then you will see the trend from 1979 continue through 1997 - 2010. And continue to climb through to 2019.

And of course there are massive differences within regions too.

Johnson was correct in identifying this as a major problem to concentrate on in the 2019 election. Although how serious he really was about actually 'levelling up' rather than it just being a slogan - knowing he lied about most everything else - I guess we will need to wait for the history books to tell us.

[drfchound]

What I was getting at is that things are possibly no worse now with the North / South divide than it has been under previous governments.

It's about 4 times worse now (& growing) than in 1979. Mostly down to the closure of manufacturing jobs in the north & midlands and the concentration of financial service jobs in London & the south east. Which was Thatcher's intention.

https://www.resolutionfoundation.org/comment/election-2019-how-britains-north-south-divide-is-changing/

Wilts, my original question was about the period 1997 to 2010.
I’m genuinely interested to know.

I don't know exactly hound but if you look at the graphs in the article then you will see the trend from 1979 continue through 1997 - 2010. And continue to climb through to 2019.

And of course there are massive differences within regions too.

Johnson was correct in identifying this as a major problem to concentrate on in the 2019 election. Although how serious he really was about actually 'levelling up' rather than it just being a slogan - knowing he lied about most everything else - I guess we will need to wait for the history books to tell us.

Agreed wilts, as with most things, hindsight tells us most of the answers.
I think it is fair then to say that the 13 year period with Labour in the hot seats didn’t correct the issue of the growing north/ south divide.
This isn’t point scoring by the way (before one of the usual suspects piles in) but just suggesting that it isn’t all down to the post 2010 government.

[wilts rover]

What I was getting at is that things are possibly no worse now with the North / South divide than it has been under previous governments.

It's about 4 times worse now (& growing) than in 1979. Mostly down to the closure of manufacturing jobs in the north & midlands and the concentration of financial service jobs in London & the south east. Which was Thatcher's intention.

https://www.resolutionfoundation.org/comment/election-2019-how-britains-north-south-divide-is-changing/

Wilts, my original question was about the period 1997 to 2010.
I’m genuinely interested to know.

I don't know exactly hound but if you look at the graphs in the article then you will see the trend from 1979 continue through 1997 - 2010. And continue to climb through to 2019.

And of course there are massive differences within regions too.

Johnson was correct in identifying this as a major problem to concentrate on in the 2019 election. Although how serious he really was about actually 'levelling up' rather than it just being a slogan - knowing he lied about most everything else - I guess we will need to wait for the history books to tell us.

Agreed wilts, as with most things, hindsight tells us most of the answers.
I think it is fair then to say that the 13 year period with Labour in the hot seats didn’t correct the issue of the growing north/ south divide.
This isn’t point scoring by the way (before one of the usual suspects piles in) but just suggesting that it isn’t all down to the post 2010 government.

Hindsight may tell us answers hound - but history books tell us what happened in times past.

You also stated that things were no worse in 2010 then they are now. Which is incorrect - the north/south divide is bigger now than it was in 2010.

Your assertion that Labour in power did nothing to correct this needs explaining as to whether or not they actually set out to address it in the first place. Saying they should have done - that's hindsight. My memory is that they attempted to address inequality within regions rather than between them.

The Johnson government certainly said that 'levelling up' was an objective.

If you want something to 'put it down to' then that would be the 1980's Thatcher government. Making the south richer and the north poorer was a specific aim of Thatcher. Reversing that damage in a 21st century world is a lot easier said than done. As Johnson found out.

[drfchound]

What I was getting at is that things are possibly no worse now with the North / South divide than it has been under previous governments.

It's about 4 times worse now (& growing) than in 1979. Mostly down to the closure of manufacturing jobs in the north & midlands and the concentration of financial service jobs in London & the south east. Which was Thatcher's intention.

https://www.resolutionfoundation.org/comment/election-2019-how-britains-north-south-divide-is-changing/

Wilts, my original question was about the period 1997 to 2010.
I’m genuinely interested to know.

I don't know exactly hound but if you look at the graphs in the article then you will see the trend from 1979 continue through 1997 - 2010. And continue to climb through to 2019.

And of course there are massive differences within regions too.

Johnson was correct in identifying this as a major problem to concentrate on in the 2019 election. Although how serious he really was about actually 'levelling up' rather than it just being a slogan - knowing he lied about most everything else - I guess we will need to wait for the history books to tell us.

Agreed wilts, as with most things, hindsight tells us most of the answers.
I think it is fair then to say that the 13 year period with Labour in the hot seats didn’t correct the issue of the growing north/ south divide.
This isn’t point scoring by the way (before one of the usual suspects piles in) but just suggesting that it isn’t all down to the post 2010 government.

Hindsight may tell us answers hound - but history books tell us what happened in times past.

You also stated that things were no worse in 2010 then they are now. Which is incorrect - the north/south divide is bigger now than it was in 2010.

Your assertion that Labour in power did nothing to correct this needs explaining as to whether or not they actually set out to address it in the first place. Saying they should have done - that's hindsight. My memory is that they attempted to address inequality within regions rather than between them.

The Johnson government certainly said that 'levelling up' was an objective.

If you want something to 'put it down to' then that would be the 1980's Thatcher government. Making the south richer and the north poorer was a specific aim of Thatcher. Reversing that damage in a 21st century world is a lot easier said than done. As Johnson found out.

I did not say that things were no worse in 2010 than they are now.
Neither did I say that Labour in power did nothing to address the difference.
You are misrepresenting me.

[danumdon]

What I was getting at is that things are possibly no worse now with the North / South divide than it has been under previous governments.

It's about 4 times worse now (& growing) than in 1979. Mostly down to the closure of manufacturing jobs in the north & midlands and the concentration of financial service jobs in London & the south east. Which was Thatcher's intention.

https://www.resolutionfoundation.org/comment/election-2019-how-britains-north-south-divide-is-changing/

Wilts, my original question was about the period 1997 to 2010.
I’m genuinely interested to know.

I don't know exactly hound but if you look at the graphs in the article then you will see the trend from 1979 continue through 1997 - 2010. And continue to climb through to 2019.

And of course there are massive differences within regions too.

Johnson was correct in identifying this as a major problem to concentrate on in the 2019 election. Although how serious he really was about actually 'levelling up' rather than it just being a slogan - knowing he lied about most everything else - I guess we will need to wait for the history books to tell us.

Agreed wilts, as with most things, hindsight tells us most of the answers.
I think it is fair then to say that the 13 year period with Labour in the hot seats didn’t correct the issue of the growing north/ south divide.
This isn’t point scoring by the way (before one of the usual suspects piles in) but just suggesting that it isn’t all down to the post 2010 government.

Hindsight may tell us answers hound - but history books tell us what happened in times past.

You also stated that things were no worse in 2010 then they are now. Which is incorrect - the north/south divide is bigger now than it was in 2010.

Your assertion that Labour in power did nothing to correct this needs explaining as to whether or not they actually set out to address it in the first place. Saying they should have done - that's hindsight. My memory is that they attempted to address inequality within regions rather than between them.

The Johnson government certainly said that 'levelling up' was an objective.

If you want something to 'put it down to' then that would be the 1980's Thatcher government. Making the south richer and the north poorer was a specific aim of Thatcher. Reversing that damage in a 21st century world is a lot easier said than done. As Johnson found out.

You got some facts to back up that allegation or does objective truth only work in the other direction.

[Sprotyrover]

What I was getting at is that things are possibly no worse now with the North / South divide than it has been under previous governments.

It's about 4 times worse now (& growing) than in 1979. Mostly down to the closure of manufacturing jobs in the north & midlands and the concentration of financial service jobs in London & the south east. Which was Thatcher's intention.

https://www.resolutionfoundation.org/comment/election-2019-how-britains-north-south-divide-is-changing/

Wilts, my original question was about the period 1997 to 2010.
I’m genuinely interested to know.

I don't know exactly hound but if you look at the graphs in the article then you will see the trend from 1979 continue through 1997 - 2010. And continue to climb through to 2019.

And of course there are massive differences within regions too.

Johnson was correct in identifying this as a major problem to concentrate on in the 2019 election. Although how serious he really was about actually 'levelling up' rather than it just being a slogan - knowing he lied about most everything else - I guess we will need to wait for the history books to tell us.

Agreed wilts, as with most things, hindsight tells us most of the answers.
I think it is fair then to say that the 13 year period with Labour in the hot seats didn’t correct the issue of the growing north/ south divide.
This isn’t point scoring by the way (before one of the usual suspects piles in) but just suggesting that it isn’t all down to the post 2010 government.

Hindsight may tell us answers hound - but history books tell us what happened in times past.

You also stated that things were no worse in 2010 then they are now. Which is incorrect - the north/south divide is bigger now than it was in 2010.

Your assertion that Labour in power did nothing to correct this needs explaining as to whether or not they actually set out to address it in the first place. Saying they should have done - that's hindsight. My memory is that they attempted to address inequality within regions rather than between them.

The Johnson government certainly said that 'levelling up' was an objective.

If you want something to 'put it down to' then that would be the 1980's Thatcher government. Making the south richer and the north poorer was a specific aim of Thatcher. Reversing that damage in a 21st century world is a lot easier said than done. As Johnson found out.

I recollect visiting my cousin in Cambridge several times between 2005 and 2010 and all she did was moan about the complete lack of funding in the South and Labour pumping vast amounts of money in to the North!
I kept stumpth as I was on a nice little earner at Yorks and Humber regional Office!
When the coalition got in the first thing they did was shut down GO London and all of the other non job doms they had setup !, there were a lot of folks running around like Rabbits caught in a Cars headlights, losing their 50k a year non Jobs, having to weigh in their Chelsea Tractors, take the kids out of private schools and cancel the Skying holiday and summer Disney world hol as well,’one colleague asked for a dumbed down CV so they could apply for a check out job at WHSmith.
There were thousands of people in Government non jobs taking the pish, I think there were 7 neighbourhood managers in the Borough all on £100k and they all used to get an annual bonus
Of 24 k for ‘Reducing Crime!’ It was laughable, as I was seconded I merely changed roles! I recollect having a fall out with the idiot in Doncaster town centre as he couldn’t even sort out piss alley between Hallgate and Wood street!

[SydneyRover]

That's AI for you I guess

[Sprotyrover]

https://news.sky.com/story/gdp-uk-overtakes-france-and-germany-as-economic-growth-bigger-than-expected-after-covid-12972101

[roverstillidie91]

Small businesses have said thing have been worse in terms of trade since leaving the EU and specifically the single market.

Personally I don't think people knew what they were voting for but more so thinking that we would be able to leave and do as we want which doesn't always work out like that.

I do believe that people need to better understand the impacts of Brexit, more negative than positive.

[Not Now Kato]

Small businesses have said thing have been worse in terms of trade since leaving the EU and specifically the single market.

Personally I don't think people knew what they were voting for but more so thinking that we would be able to leave and do as we want which doesn't always work out like that.

I do believe that people need to better understand the impacts of Brexit, more negative than positive.

You mean there have been positives?

[Sprotyrover]

Small businesses have said thing have been worse in terms of trade since leaving the EU and specifically the single market.

Personally I don't think people knew what they were voting for but more so thinking that we would be able to leave and do as we want which doesn't always work out like that.

I do believe that people need to better understand the impacts of Brexit, more negative than positive.

You mean there have been positives?

Looks like we will soon be joined by the Netherlands,they are currently the third largest contributor after the Germans 25 € billions French 12 € billions, then they wade in with 6.9 € billions
Followed by Italy with 3 € billions, good grief Belgium skimming away €3 billions (no wonder Brussels was not happy when we went) looks like the French will have to increase the Retirement age again!

[Glyn_Wigley]

Small businesses have said thing have been worse in terms of trade since leaving the EU and specifically the single market.

Personally I don't think people knew what they were voting for but more so thinking that we would be able to leave and do as we want which doesn't always work out like that.

I do believe that people need to better understand the impacts of Brexit, more negative than positive.

You mean there have been positives?

Looks like we will soon be joined by the Netherlands,they are currently the third largest contributor after the Germans 25 € billions French 12 € billions, then they wade in with 6.9 € billions
Followed by Italy with 3 € billions, good grief Belgium skimming away €3 billions (no wonder Brussels was not happy when we went) looks like the French will have to increase the Retirement age again!

Wilders is going to have to do a hell of a lot better than the 23.6% of the vote he's just got if he want to win a Nexit referendum.

[Colin C No.3]

That's AI for you I guess

With all due respect Sydney, what would you know about the complexities of driving up or down the A1 when you just have to navigate the road through ‘Wannabeck Creek’?

[SydneyRover]

That's AI for you I guess

With all due respect Sydney, what would you know about the complexities of driving up or down the A1 when you just have to navigate the road through ‘Wannabeck Creek’?

flattered with all the attention C3po, the best I could do would be to forward some used y-fronts, at a price of course