Good for the game? Really?

[Orlandokarla]

http://ballsybanter.com/2013/07/05/the-doncaster-belles-demoted-bad-for-the-team-but-good-for-the-womens-game/?

[scaley back rover]

not even gonna read it good for the game not on your life its good for their coffers

[Orlandokarla]

not even gonna read it good for the game not on your life its good for their coffers

I found it interesting to see another perspective on the issue, as blinkered and misguided as it clearly is.

Besides, I thought a few might appreciate the opportunity to set a patronising Citteh fan straight. 

[BobG]

It was quite well written as well as seeking to justify its conclusions. Not a bad effort no matter what you think of the conclusions it reached.

BobG

[hoolahoop]

It was a load of condescending nonsense Bob, it's a while since I have read such a load of bollox................FUMING HERE NOT COMPLIMENTARY  TO THE NUMPTY WHO WROTE THAT SHITE. 

[DadsleyRover]

Condescending in a pitiful way. The Belles did more for the modern womens game and should be respected for the way they are carrying on in a difficult financial climate.
The FA should respect the rules and Manchester City should earn their position in the top league.

[scaley back rover]

i tell you why i wont read it . Its because the whole shirad of demoting the belles (or any other side ) like this is a joke . sport should be about merit and fair play the fact is if the The belles finished bottom and they where relegated properly on a regular season you would see no complaint from anyone . However it now dosnt matter if they were to finish champions they would still be relegated . This is all abouti money and if your the FA money talks the FA dont rule or look after the game the rich clubs do and the FA bow down to them as they are scared of getting kicked off the gravy train. I love seeing both sides of most arguments but when its morally wrong i have no intrest in my eyes the FA can f*** right off the greedy b*****ds

ps orlando i wasnt having a go at you putting up the link to encourage debate or anything like that. But as you can see in my post i think its a disgrace the way the belles have been treated mate

[BobG]

I don't think there's anybody on the planet - except the FA - who could ever disagree with this being a disgrace. I certainly don't. I've been attacked often enough over the years for my refusal to support the England team as a consequence of the appalling FA. But just because you don't agree with somebody, or something, doesn't blind me to the virtues of decent writing, or to the arguments put forward by the other side. So what if it's condescending? You can't argue the point sensibly and rationally if you refuse to read their point of view like some on this thread. You can't argue the point sensibly and rationally if you let your emotions drive your responses like others on this thread. Arguments are won by using your brains. Not your blinkers.

BobG

[hoolahoop]

I don't think there's anybody on the planet - except the FA - who could ever disagree with this being a disgrace. I certainly don't. I've been attacked often enough over the years for my refusal to support the England team as a consequence of the appalling FA. But just because you don't agree with somebody, or something, doesn't blind me to the virtues of decent writing, or to the arguments put forward by the other side. So what if it's condescending? You can't argue the point sensibly and rationally if you refuse to read their point of view like some on this thread. You can't argue the point sensibly and rationally if you let your emotions drive your responses like others on this thread. Arguments are won by using your brains. Not your blinkers.

BobG

It was condescending Bob, the ONLY point that the author made was that our local club has been wrongfully demoted for the 'good' of the Women's game. We have been shafted or rather one of the club's in our town have been shafted.
The whole thing stinks.......

[scaley back rover]

bob i agree it most senses with what your saying , however this is a joke mate this is not fair play or proper sportsmanship at all and i hate to say it but the belles have lost this one because the FA have no sense of whats fair and proper and they are in charge in a similar way to a dictatorship and until they are replaced by an authority that are the whole of the english game from the bottom up mens and womens are screwed until a competant authority are found. i for one am not blinkered into any other way of thinking other than one that is morally right for anyone

[BobG]

I agree. It IS a joke. A very bad one. But it's there. It's happened. No one will ever be able to contribute to the argument unless they understand the opposition point of view. That's why reading stuff like this is so important. It allows you to demonstrate their inadequacies, to take the agenda onwards. It's no good saying 'the FA have no sense of what's fair and proper'. we all know that already. Everybody in this country knows that.  And it hasn't changed their decision has it? So what are you, I and everyone else going to do about it?

You have to understand their argument and deal with it. Show it to be false. Prove they have based their decision on the wrong criteria. That's why emotional responses are so sodding pathetic. They allow the other side to win the argument - because they are the ones who can point to rules, procedures, precedents and no emotional bugger is ever going to prove they are false. So, they win. Simple.

Look at what Glenn's done. He might be mighty hacked off, but he's used his brains. He knows he can't change the FA's mind for them, but he also knows he can get to people who might just, together, be able to exert enough pressure to make them do so. He's not emotional about it. He might be seething inside, but he's keeping that under control and dealing with the argument the best way that he can. And that's what we should all be doing. Not bleating on about how unfair it all is.

[scaley back rover]

ok bob if i was man city i would be feeling embarresd . i may not have read this paticular piece i dont need to . The rules the very same that the FA started at the beginning of the belles season have been changed . They just do what they like its no point telling me to read bits and pieces of the other side of the arguement when the FA clearly havnt bothered they will get away with it they always do and until and i say again a competant authority are in control they always will do . Bob i dont want to argue with a fellow rovers fan who also agrees that what has happened is unjust but please dont assume the way i do and say things is the wrong way in regards to the way i feel about it . I am just fed up with the way that these clowns just get away with what they want and how they want just look at the way they deal with racism they are no good for the game full stop

[scaley back rover]

ok have read it and my thoughts and what i already knew are in there my view still stands as it did before

[Muttley]

If you took the trouble to read the piece you might appreciate the issue that has got lost in all the emotion - the Belles entered a process 2 years ago that allowed them to enter into a "closed shop" with no promotion / relegation (from which it could be said they have benefitted as they have finished 2nd to bottom).

They then signed up to another tendering process that said the FA had complete discretion over how they came to their decision and that clubs had no right of appeal against the FA's decision.

Now I don't agree with the process but the Belles went into it with their eyes open (at least I hope they did) and they obviously felt that their tender was strong enough - if they didn't like the process they were perfectly entitled not to take part.

I fear protracted whinging will do them more harm than good in the long run.

[scaley back rover]

your probably right mutley as the FA wont like anyone voicing their disconsent do they . This could have been done easily before the start of the season stating that the team bottom would go down . That way everyone knew where they stood and would have created a level starting block creating no dramas , that would have made clear sense . We are where we are but its not right and all the other clubs in the league agree its wrong . I wonder what would happen if this was tried in the mens premier league but it wont because money talks

[Muttley]

This WILL happen in the men's game - this is the thin end of the wedge.

But everyone will go along with the process because the rewards are so great if your application is successful.

It's great that the Belles are making a stand but I'm not sure they've got the funds to take it as far as it needs to go.

[DonnyBazR0ver]

The really sad thing is, what they are trying to do to raise the profile of women's is not sustainable.

Already I think the BBC are beginning to regret their commitment. The TV games are stage managed with all the razzmataz and punditry and it's still a poor product.

In 2 seasons time there won't be a WSL and whatever's left of the ashes they will be begging the Belle's to keep a league going.

     

[RobTheRover]

The part that still sticks in my throat is that the FA refused to recognise history or previous contribution to the women's game (claiming that the tender process effectively starts everyone at day zero), and yet they trumpet from the highest tower about how they celebrate their 150 years of running the game in England.

Hypocrites, the lot of them.

That they actually should have done was have a 5th scoring category in their tender process.  the "Contribution to the Women's game" classification.  Each team could then list their commitment to the womens game not in monetary terms or promises of future growth, but in indisputable fact.  If this goes against some clubs who are "new" to all this, then they have chance to put a portfolio of achievements in place before the chance to bid comes around again.