It's all gone quiet over where?

[Dutch Uncle]

I might add I haven't posted on here for a very long time

Excellent original post and welcome back Jonathan  - you have been missed

For what it is worth I am a little more patiently trusting or gullibly naive depending on your point of view. I am prepared to wait until 17 July, but I share your concerns and certainly wish we could be told a bit more, but there may be good reasons for that. 

I keep clinging on to the fact that JR and Louis are true fans, but unfortunately that does not make them infallible.

[wing commander]

And like I said earlier the amount of people who have gone to the effort of liking the op post...Gives a pretty accurate view of peoples thinking...

[bobjimwilly]

A genuine question for debate would be: Do football fans really have any power over the English game anymore?

Pompey, Wimbledon, Wycombe & Exeter  fans would argue yes, and to a less extent so would Swansea fans.

[River Don]

TB

How is anyone bothering?

... Some VSC members give their time to help with initiatives like IRWT, the new heritage installations on the concourse, help improve the catering and campaign for value for money for supporters and all the rest of it.

Isn't that clear evidence of community involvement with the club?

[Wellred]

If you have been to the pre season friendlies each year you would have noticed that there are many players who come and go, some we might sign some we never see again.
I am sure this pre season will be no different.
Be patient. I have every confidence come the 8th August we will have a more than adequate squad.

[River Don]

A genuine question for debate would be: Do football fans really have any power over the English game anymore?

Pompey, Wimbledon, Wycombe & Exeter  fans would argue yes, and to a less extent so would Swansea fans.

Overall, English football fans probably have a greater involvement with the running of their clubs now than at anytime since the war.

[silent majority]

A genuine question for debate would be: Do football fans really have any power over the English game anymore?

Pompey, Wimbledon, Wycombe & Exeter  fans would argue yes, and to a less extent so would Swansea fans.

Overall, English football fans probably have a greater involvement with the running of their clubs now than at anytime since the war.

That's very true RD. None of the major political parties would construct a manifesto without consulting with the supporters groups first, they know full well that football fans make up a large and influential part of the electorate.

To that end the dialogue between supporter and the FA, FL and PL is at an all time high. We even have a supporter sit on the FA national council. Times are changing.

[graingrover]

I do wonder whether the fall out JR had with certain of our reps is not at play here though . In a big  professional organisation personality clashes are rendered secondary to the importance of respecting official functions and positions and communication flows continue. We have never been a big org but communication has improved a lot under the current régime .Could we not have a joint JR TB statement .. or is that personality clash more important than the Club's community of fans ?   

[albie]

Is it not possible that TB/DW just got tired of all the sniping from the usual suspects, and when JR came back in with Louis in tow, they thought lets see if he can make the deal stack up.

Is the product endorsement of a pop star enough to raise the capital to run the club?

I think the businessmen know it is not, so JR must go early to Plan B to secure the deal on July 17. It is what is in Plan B, and who might be involved, that people need to know.

JR/LT need to flesh out the business plan for after July 17, without one this proposal is a busted flush.

No-one can do due diligence on Plan B and those involved while DRFC keep schtum. Sunlight is a good disinfectant.

[Bentley Bullet]

I don't think anyone could argue with Jonathan's post, whatever their opinion of the LT/JR Take-over. I also don't think anyone is lacking concern about it, unless you compare those accused of being so with the extremist negative brigade, some of whom claim to reluctantly support the take-over, but at the same time ridicule it.

At the very least it is with honesty that I can say I hope I'm right in my judgement of the take-over being the best way forward. I wonder how many of the 'negatives' really,  GENUINELY hope they're wrong?

[bpoolrover]

Anyone who is thinking for themselves has had similar thoughts to you Jonathan, I'm worried where we'll be in 5 years time. The problem is we can't have a sensible debate on here because some posters are just willing to blindly defend supreme leader Ryan no matter what the facts are.

what are the facts steve?

[Wellred]

Is it not possible that TB/DW just got tired of all the sniping from the usual suspects, and when JR came back in with Louis in tow, they thought lets see if he can make the deal stack up.

Is the product endorsement of a pop star enough to raise the capital to run the club?

I think the businessmen know it is not, so JR must go early to Plan B to secure the deal on July 17. It is what is in Plan B, and who might be involved, that people need to know.

JR/LT need to flesh out the business plan for after July 17, without one this proposal is a busted flush.

No-one can do due diligence on Plan B and those involved while DRFC keep schtum. Sunlight is a good disinfectant.

Can I ask what your position in all this is Albie?
I am intrigued to know why those involved should be sending you a business plan.

[bobjimwilly]

At the very least it is with honesty that I can say I hope I'm right in my judgement of the take-over being the best way forward.

I've still to understand what exactly was wrong with the previous regime under TB, DW & JR, which could then explain how the take-over is the best way forward

[Wellred]

And like I said earlier the amount of people who have gone to the effort of liking the op post...Gives a pretty accurate view of peoples thinking...

Sorry to be pedantic WC and not taking sides but that amounts approx 0.2% of our last seasons average attendance.
If you take all the away fans out of that it still be probably less than 1% of our fans.
Hardly a representative view of peoples thinking is it?

[Dagenham Rover]

And like I said earlier the amount of people who have gone to the effort of liking the op post...Gives a pretty accurate view of peoples thinking...

Sorry to be pedantic WC and not taking sides but that amounts approx 0.2% of our last seasons average attendance.
If you take all the away fans out of that it still be probably less than 1% of our fans.
Hardly a representative view of peoples thinking is it?

Its 31 at the moment out of say 200 regular forum users, take away say 50 of them that don't know the like button exists or can't be bothered gives 150  31out of 150 equates to about 20% of regular forum users, so 20% of regular forum users agree with the op
I  suspect that if you could survey all home fans  the % would be a bit higher.
Amazing how stats can be changed

[BillyStubbsTears]

Agreed Wellred. Best post I've seem on here in an age and even though I have a lot more faith in what's happening than Johnathan he highlights a lot of areas still to be revealed in terms of our future.
Either way it's nice to see someone raise their concerns without sly digs or personal jibes.

I wonder if you could have made your point without having a sly dig?

[Bentley Bullet]

At the very least it is with honesty that I can say I hope I'm right in my judgement of the take-over being the best way forward.

I've still to understand what exactly was wrong with the previous regime under TB, DW & JR, which could then explain how the take-over is the best way forward

You would have to ask them that, but I suspect JR had more ambition to take the team forward whereas TB and DW had a more frugal attitude. Didn't JR want to personally fund the signing of Sharp, but was stopped by TB and DW from doing so?

It seems that the take-over is favoured by all three of them.

[BobG]

Is it not possible that TB/DW just got tired of all the sniping from the usual suspects, and when JR came back in with Louis in tow, they thought lets see if he can make the deal stack up.

Is the product endorsement of a pop star enough to raise the capital to run the club?

I think the businessmen know it is not, so JR must go early to Plan B to secure the deal on July 17. It is what is in Plan B, and who might be involved, that people need to know.

JR/LT need to flesh out the business plan for after July 17, without one this proposal is a busted flush.

No-one can do due diligence on Plan B and those involved while DRFC keep schtum. Sunlight is a good disinfectant.

Interesting thoughts Albie. I have absolutely no inside info. I have not spoken to anaybody at all in weeks now about Rovers. so my personal curiosity about just how this bid is going to work matches yours. On currently avaialble information, it isn't. Which leads one down the road of speculation: it's been mentioned a few times on here, but surely as the only credibble plan (that I can see anyway!) there should be more attention given to the JR/LT buying the club and then rapaidly selling on a significant chunk of it to some bugger else to get the funding.

I hope that isn't the plan. But if it's not, just what do those two think is going to happen?

BobG

[hoolahoop]

Is it not possible that TB/DW just got tired of all the sniping from the usual suspects, and when JR came back in with Louis in tow, they thought lets see if he can make the deal stack up.

Is the product endorsement of a pop star enough to raise the capital to run the club?

I think the businessmen know it is not, so JR must go early to Plan B to secure the deal on July 17. It is what is in Plan B, and who might be involved, that people need to know.

JR/LT need to flesh out the business plan for after July 17, without one this proposal is a busted flush.

No-one can do due diligence on Plan B and those involved while DRFC keep schtum. Sunlight is a good disinfectant.

Interesting thoughts Albie. I have absolutely no inside info. I have not spoken to anaybody at all in weeks now about Rovers. so my personal curiosity about just how this bid is going to work matches yours. On currently avaialble information, it isn't. Which leads one down the road of speculation: it's been mentioned a few times on here, but surely as the only credibble plan (that I can see anyway!) there should be more attention given to the JR/LT buying the club and then rapaidly selling on a significant chunk of it to some bugger else to get the funding.

I hope that isn't the plan. But if it's not, just what do those two think is going to happen?

BobG

The whole thing has no direction (sorry that was unintentional) and the OP by Jonathan just highlights the weaknesses in the whole TO bid.
I was going to post more but quite frankly I've lost patience and the love for the whole DRFC experience is slowly ebbing away.

Why are this lot at the top table messing around with my club and team year on year ? Yes I mean all of them including the lifelong supporter. ((

[hoolahoop]

Agreed Wellred. Best post I've seem on here in an age and even though I have a lot more faith in what's happening than Johnathan he highlights a lot of areas still to be revealed in terms of our future.
Either way it's nice to see someone raise their concerns without sly digs or personal jibes.

I wonder if you could have made your point without having a sly dig?

Shame that Jonathan spent all that time preparing a brilliant OP just for that to happen

[BobG]

Im seconding your last post Hools. I'm hardly interested now. This visiting the VSC site is just the dying days of a years old habit. The habit is broken.  I'm sick to death of JR and his petulant, attention seeking, self glorification through wild and completely untenable 'ambitions'. I'm sick to death of people f**king around with the Rovers. I'm sick to death of the endemic corporate mismanagement we've had to endure throughout JR's reign. I thought we'd got rid of that under the KM2. But it's back again and he hasn't even formally taken over yet!

BobG

[wesisback]

Agreed Wellred. Best post I've seem on here in an age and even though I have a lot more faith in what's happening than Johnathan he highlights a lot of areas still to be revealed in terms of our future.
Either way it's nice to see someone raise their concerns without sly digs or personal jibes.

I wonder if you could have made your point without having a sly dig?

I never named anyone or any side. There's no sly dig there. Both sides are at it and it is boring everyone, myself included. The DRSG interim commitee  are meeting this week. I believe the next stage from there should be to meet the VSC as well as the club. Someone has to offer the olive branch or its gurantee we will both lose.

[Filo]

Agreed Wellred. Best post I've seem on here in an age and even though I have a lot more faith in what's happening than Johnathan he highlights a lot of areas still to be revealed in terms of our future.
Either way it's nice to see someone raise their concerns without sly digs or personal jibes.

I wonder if you could have made your point without having a sly dig?

I never named anyone or any side. There's no sly dig there. Both sides are at it and it is boring everyone, myself included. The DRSG interim commitee  are meeting this week. I believe the next stage from there should be to meet the VSC as well as the club. Someone has to offer the olive branch or its gurantee we will both lose.

A good start would be to cut out the points scoring, can the committee members manage to do that?

[wesisback]

I believe it needs to be done both ways but I'm confident it can be done for the benefit of both parties.

[Dagenham Rover]

Agreed Wellred. Best post I've seem on here in an age and even though I have a lot more faith in what's happening than Johnathan he highlights a lot of areas still to be revealed in terms of our future.
Either way it's nice to see someone raise their concerns without sly digs or personal jibes.

I wonder if you could have made your point without having a sly dig?

I never named anyone or any side. There's no sly dig there. Both sides are at it and it is boring everyone, myself included. The DRSG interim commitee  are meeting this week. I believe the next stage from there should be to meet the VSC as well as the club. Someone has to offer the olive branch or its gurantee we will both lose.

Now get the lot of you sat round the table in a locked room  till you sort your differences out (vsc and drsg) then the two groups go forward together to meet the club either that or stay in the locked room till you have all knocked seven bales of shit out of each other cos I amongst a lot of others have had enough of all this crap

[hoolahoop]

Im seconding your last post Hools. I'm hardly interested now. This visiting the VSC site is just the dying days of a years old habit. The habit is broken.  I'm sick to death of JR and his petulant, attention seeking, self glorification through wild and completely untenable 'ambitions'. I'm sick to death of people f***ing around with the Rovers. I'm sick to death of the endemic corporate mismanagement we've had to endure throughout JR's reign. I thought we'd got rid of that under the KM2. But it's back again and he hasn't even formally taken over yet!

BobG

That about covers it for me too cheers Bob. How can anyone that purports to be a lifelong fan do so much to hurt the club that he "personally" saved all on his own ?  ((

[RTID75]

Im seconding your last post Hools. I'm hardly interested now. This visiting the VSC site is just the dying days of a years old habit. The habit is broken.  I'm sick to death of JR and his petulant, attention seeking, self glorification through wild and completely untenable 'ambitions'. I'm sick to death of people f***ing around with the Rovers. I'm sick to death of the endemic corporate mismanagement we've had to endure throughout JR's reign. I thought we'd got rid of that under the KM2. But it's back again and he hasn't even formally taken over yet!

BobG

One season of dodgy football but ultimately glory aside, it's been a depressing, thankless task being a Rovers fan since the start of the decline under S'OD.

I used to think JR was God, but he's made more than a few awful mistakes and decisions since then and as much as I will forever love the bloke for what he's done for us historically, I've been sad to witness some of his recent stunts.

I'm unconvinced at best about this takeover. For me JR has a lot to do to make me feel convinced about where we are and where we're going under a man and a lucky kid with a few quid (but clearly nowhere near enough money between them to sustain Championship football, let alone anything more ambitious) and a painful, failing money grabbing campaign (that no one really knows what the hell is for!) aimed squarely at young 1D fans.

In the mean time we look set to have to rebuild the team from near scratch again, hoping there's still a few decent players left at the club, and also left available to buy at a magical date late in July that no one truly understands either.

What the bloody hell is going on??

As a result, in the mean time, I too am getting more and more disenfranchised with the club. I've been a fan since I was in short trousers, and a proper supporter since I got my first car in mid 90's (enabling me to come much more than once or twice a season from 90 miles south), but all this is slowly ruining it for me. Is this our club, or a plaything for the rich and privileged? I don't know any more. Let's all be told what is going on so we can all make our own minds up.

[hoolahoop]

Agreed Wellred. Best post I've seem on here in an age and even though I have a lot more faith in what's happening than Johnathan he highlights a lot of areas still to be revealed in terms of our future.
Either way it's nice to see someone raise their concerns without sly digs or personal jibes.

I wonder if you could have made your point without having a sly dig?

I never named anyone or any side. There's no sly dig there. Both sides are at it and it is boring everyone, myself included. The DRSG interim commitee  are meeting this week. I believe the next stage from there should be to meet the VSC as well as the club. Someone has to offer the olive branch or its gurantee we will both lose.

Now get the lot of you sat round the table in a locked room  till you sort your differences out (vsc and drsg) then the two groups go forward together to meet the club either that or stay in the locked room till you have all knocked seven bales of shit out of each other cos I amongst a lot of others have had enough of all this crap

Me too but how can an agreement be reached when you have a group of "johnny come latelys" ( apt expression BTW) who hang on to every word of their boss meeting up with a group whose sole interest as a "Trust" is to ensure that the future of DRFC is assured.
One party thinks it's not a priority to ask questions as to the future governance of the club whereas the other party (namely the VSC) think that the club should come before ANY owner's ambition/behaviour.

Where can there possibly be a meeting of minds ?

[wesisback]

Agreed Wellred. Best post I've seem on here in an age and even though I have a lot more faith in what's happening than Johnathan he highlights a lot of areas still to be revealed in terms of our future.
Either way it's nice to see someone raise their concerns without sly digs or personal jibes.

I wonder if you could have made your point without having a sly dig?

I never named anyone or any side. There's no sly dig there. Both sides are at it and it is boring everyone, myself included. The DRSG interim commitee  are meeting this week. I believe the next stage from there should be to meet the VSC as well as the club. Someone has to offer the olive branch or its gurantee we will both lose.

Now get the lot of you sat round the table in a locked room  till you sort your differences out (vsc and drsg) then the two groups go forward together to meet the club either that or stay in the locked room till you have all knocked seven bales of shit out of each other cos I amongst a lot of others have had enough of all this crap

I don't think it would come to that. Luckily we all share the same common interest and all want the club to succeed. I'm sure both parties can be of a benefit to the other. Fans are always going to have differing opinions and neither of us will ever engage every fan without being impartial on everything (I.e. The Supporters Club).
It may shock you all that I find it just as boring to come on here and read the drivel most threads descend into but it is absolutely both sides who are letting it be lowered to that standard. As much as I may challenge Filos opinion that differs from mine I think he and Nath have had two summers of goof moderation at a time when our fans have been at each others throats.

[Glyn_Wigley]

I believe it needs to be done both ways but I'm confident it can be done for the benefit of both parties.

Both ways? Has anybody from the VSC board gone to your site and made denigrating personal remarks like your committee members do over here? Looks one way to me.