Why is the NHS in crisis?

[i_ateallthepies]

Spot on BJW.

[drfchound]

What's so bad about having private care?

I think the fact people are having to make the choice shows just how bad the situation; we shouldn't need to make a choice! Why shouldn't/can't the NHS function just as well as private health care? The fact that over the years people are starting to believe Tory propaganda, that a fully-functional NHS is a pipedream, shows just how close they are to realising their dream of dismantling the NHS altogether.

One of the biggest contributors to NHS struggles is the fact that people are living longer and therefore are a big drain on resources.
Not the fault of the government of course but I suppose euthanasia could be introduced.

[i_ateallthepies]

What's so bad about having private care?

I think the fact people are having to make the choice shows just how bad the situation; we shouldn't need to make a choice! Why shouldn't/can't the NHS function just as well as private health care? The fact that over the years people are starting to believe Tory propaganda, that a fully-functional NHS is a pipedream, shows just how close they are to realising their dream of dismantling the NHS altogether.

One of the biggest contributors to NHS struggles is the fact that people are living longer and therefore are a big drain on resources.
Not the fault of the government of course but I suppose euthanasia could be introduced.

YEY!! shall we have a poll to see where we start?

[drfchound]

That depends on how old you are I guess

[Bentley Bullet]

Euthanasia? Over my dead body. 

[wilts rover]

Oh and this is a list of MP's with links to private NHS firms. Your suspicions were correct in that there are several Liberals on there with 60 or so Tories.

http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/selling-nhs-profit-full-list-4646154

A list from 2014.
However, I have never heard of most of them so have no idea which party they represent.
It is hard to believe that no Labour MPs are BUPA members though.
As a self confessed non political expert I was genuinely asking you if you knew the answer to the question I asked.
Oh and I don’t do Twitter, Instagram or Facebook.

Sorry hound, missed your post. Yes it's a list from 2014 as thats when the coalition were debating whether or not to let private companies (like the ones mentioned) take over NHS contracts. Which they did. The information in is taken from the MP's lists of interests and an updated one should have been published before last years election but somehow wasn't.

I am not a member of BUPA (or any other private medical provider) so I have no idea what type of information they ask for. I would be surprised if it includes party affiliation and even more surprised if they do they would publish it.

Would the Tory government be making different choices on funding and running the NHS if they used it instead of private healthcare? Your guess is as good as mine but probably a different answer.

[wilts rover]

What's so bad about having private care?

Has anyone said it's bad?

What's bad is not providing proper healthcare for those who can't afford it. Which is the debate they are having in the US at the moment and the reason the NHS came into being.

Take for example the situation with dental treatment. If you are able to pay for private treatment there is no problem finding a dentist. If you cant you might have to travel up to 60 miles - or do what these people did:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-41113507

If it can happen with dentists, why not GP's or hospitals? Can't pay, we'll take it away....

[Dagenham Rover]

Ohh I love it!   I have private cover for me and the better half (me through work and I pay for her through the work policy) the better half has been in hospital for 4 months the private cover doesn't want to know! and won't do the problems she has! however they will pay us x amount of £'s per night for so many days  while she is in a nhs  bed  but nowhere near 4 months  to put it bluntly if my wife had to rely on private health care she would be dead simple as and believe me I have a very good level of cover

[Muttley]

How many Tories use the NHS anyway, BUPA has 3 million members in the UK?

I would imagine that the vast majority of those 3 million have their membership paid for by their employer and would never dream of actually shelling out on health cover for themselves when the NHS does such a fantastic job.

[Ldr]

The age issue is correct. The post war baby boom has hit old age. If you look at a population pyramid this current age strain will be around for around the next decade then will ease

[Sprotyrover]

Ohh I love it!   I have private cover for me and the better half (me through work and I pay for her through the work policy) the better half has been in hospital for 4 months the private cover doesn't want to know! and won't do the problems she has! however they will pay us x amount of £'s per night for so many days  while she is in a nhs  bed  but nowhere near 4 months  to put it bluntly if my wife had to rely on private health care she would be dead simple as and believe me I have a very good level of cover

I'm in a similar situation as are most peeps with private cover, it is merely a means of queue jumping. Due to other halfs health while ever I can afford it I will continue to have it.

Oh made a trip to A&E Saturday, you will be pleased to know it was packed and there were oldies in cots in corridors,two very nasty individuals came in either pissed or off their heads on drugs,one needed the help of 2 Police Officers and three security guards to leave, after 2 hours of being an utter prat and terrifying half the folks in the waiting area. Then I decided to use the loo, I was sat looking at the door for 15 mins before I went and nobody came out or went in, When I got in one of the cubicles was occupied and the place smelled like a dead corpse was in there I had my number one and returned to my seat, watching the door, after a further 15 mins a person walked out they were about 6 feet tall and 10 stone in weight they wore grey baggy tacky bottoms, a Grey hoody the hood over their head and a black face mask so all you could see were their eyes they strutted out of A&E with a mobile in their hands blasting out 'house music' later I heard a Doctorspend 30 minutes tell an old lady that there was nothing wrong with her and that no she couldn't have a bed and that she had been to A&E 4 times since November basically being a nuisance, it then took three staff 30 minutes to sort an Ambulance for her.an hour later I used the loo again and it still stunk from hoodies visit who had left a disgusting mess in the cubicle and blocked the toilet.

[Donny Dub]

Bad management and wasteful practices?

[wing commander]

   I have a friend who is a porter at a hospital down south and we've had this discussion..Of course every area is different but his opinion is the amount of waste in administration is criminal..There are lots of administrative offices in his hospital with 20 people in that do the work 0f 3 people.Some of them spend there days walking around each others offices moving files from one end of the hospital to another enjoying endless cups of tea half hour chats,drop a file and then on to the next office and do it all again..They call it the "Trolly holly"
    He then says you then go up to the ward to find 4 nurses running around like blue arse fly's trying to look after 30 sick people and its bedlam..These people finish there shift shattered...
    Apparently nobody ever leaves there job in admin..The salary,pension and perks are brilliant and wouldn't be found in the private sector for half the money and 3 times the work...
    Like I said every hospital and trust will be different but I suspect that's its not just a case of throwing money at it but a mixture of increased saving and dam good waste management reviews that would turn this around.....

[The Red Baron]

I've worked in the NHS in non-medical roles. My experience is similar to the poster above. Also everything seems to cost a lot more than it should due to poor procurement practices.

[Sprotyrover]

I did a lot of work with RDASH up to 4 years ago, the management wiring structure diagrams were massive, a mate who is still with them says they made a load of management redundant but didn't have anybody shadowing then prior to them leaving, they then had to have a load back on consultancies!

[BillyStubbsTears]

What made me chuckle yesterday.

https://mobile.twitter.com/rafaelbehr/status/955714755968294914

[Dutch Uncle]

What made me chuckle yesterday.

https://mobile.twitter.com/rafaelbehr/status/955714755968294914

In there I see a reference to that brilliant brilliant book 'Goedel, Escher, Bach' by Douglas Hofstadter. Also not bad for insomnia.....