England

[roversdude]

Anyone else amazed at the team selection
How can some of these even get in the squad
Joe Harts career has gone backwards, Danny Wellbeck is a reserve player at Arsenal, likewise wilshire
Hope he plays the uncapped players

I’m afraid I am so bored with England instead of as usual building up excitement for our week in the World Cup


Sorry rant over

[DonnyNoel]

I like it. Decent blend of experience and youth. Not a fan of Hart and wouldn't be my #1 but it would be very hard to go to a WC with three keepers with probably less than 15 caps between them? He knows he can't fail in the group stage but is also looking to 2022 and this squad reflects that IMO. It certainly seems to be the case that he's involving more uncapped/younger/unfashionable players earlier in their careers than previous managers have. (Could be proved wrong on that though!)

Wouldn't call Wilshere a reserve footballer either, he seems to be in the best shape he's been in for a long time and started the League Cup final and the North London derby.

Plus he's dropped Cahill and Smalling so it's moving away from just players at big clubs in favour of in form players at "lesser" clubs (Mawson, Maguire, Tarchowski). There'll always be an element of debating who is in form and who isn't but there's also an argument as to who is a better player overall - someone who plays 180 minutes in two games nearer the bottom of the league or someone (like maybe Welbeck) who plays 120 out of 180 for a better team.

[BillyStubbsTears]

DN

Hang on. After 2014, we were told to look to 2018. Now we’re looking to 2022?

Mind, after 2010, we started looking to 2014. And after 2006, we were looking to 2010. At least this time we’re looking 4 years ahead BEFORE the quadrennial embarrassment.

[roversdude]

Wiltshire’s temperament is suspect- he has impressed enough to win a new contract

[sedwardsdrfc]

Go to be better players than Livermore to put in the squad! and how does Gomez get in when Trent-Arnold is keeping him out the team at Liverpool?

I get picking Hart just hope one of the others gets some form before the tournament to get in ahead of him and then actually keeps their nerves...

 

[Cantley Rover]

Who cares we will be home soon enough anyway.

[DearneValleyRover]

It’s a friendly the perfect time to try new players to see if they are good enough. I’m enjoying the lack of hype and build up. Less pressure might help us play at our best. We aren’t going to win it but we might just make it enjoyable for once

[roversdude]

Listening to Southgate though DVR Hart has already got a shirt
Pity both Butland and Heaton got injured when they did, they are both better keepers as is Pope. Not sure about Pickford yet

[RoversAlias]

I like it. Decent blend of experience and youth. Not a fan of Hart and wouldn't be my #1 but it would be very hard to go to a WC with three keepers with probably less than 15 caps between them? He knows he can't fail in the group stage but is also looking to 2022 and this squad reflects that IMO. It certainly seems to be the case that he's involving more uncapped/younger/unfashionable players earlier in their careers than previous managers have. (Could be proved wrong on that though!)

Wouldn't call Wilshere a reserve footballer either, he seems to be in the best shape he's been in for a long time and started the League Cup final and the North London derby.

Plus he's dropped Cahill and Smalling so it's moving away from just players at big clubs in favour of in form players at "lesser" clubs (Mawson, Maguire, Tarchowski). There'll always be an element of debating who is in form and who isn't but there's also an argument as to who is a better player overall - someone who plays 180 minutes in two games nearer the bottom of the league or someone (like maybe Welbeck) who plays 120 out of 180 for a better team.

Great post and I'm in agreement with everything you've said.

[DonnyNoel]

DN

Hang on. After 2014, we were told to look to 2018. Now we’re looking to 2022?

Mind, after 2010, we started looking to 2014. And after 2006, we were looking to 2010. At least this time we’re looking 4 years ahead BEFORE the quadrennial embarrassment.

It's tiresome I know because it highlights the fact that we always have a solid group of prospects that never quite make it but I personally feel this group of players, coupled with the u20 and u17 success is more promising than others, possibly due to the fact that GS has been around a few of them at u21 level and seems comfortable integrating them (seemingly IMO) erlier than other managers have. Also some of the better players (Kane, Alli, Stones, Dier) still have years to improve.

I realise there was an element of sarcasm in your post and I absolutely subscribe to your overall posts re the England team and the fact we're a second tier nation based on tournament performance but for all the "meh" around GS appointment, I do feel he's got a bit of long term strategy about him.

[roversdude]

DN I agree with your thoughts about the young uns and I really enjoyed watching them playing with passion
I want to get excited (oooo err) and I hope Southgate goes with youth/form rather than names

[BillyStubbsTears]

DN. I know, I know.

When we didn’t qualify for USA94, I remember saying to a mate, “Time to start re-building for the future. Give the likes of Julian Joachim a run in the England side”...

[Campsall rover]

DN. I know, I know.

When we didn’t qualify for USA94, I remember saying to a mate, “Time to start re-building for the future. Give the likes of Julian Joachim a run in the England side”...

Well I gave up on England a long time ago. I just expect failure now and then the disappointment is much easier to take.

[DonnyNoel]

DN. I know, I know.

When we didn’t qualify for USA94, I remember saying to a mate, “Time to start re-building for the future. Give the likes of Julian Joachim a run in the England side”...

He’d have had a bag full with Phil Stamp in the hole and Carlton Palmer sweeping up behind him.

[phil old leake]

Obviously still fancies Hart.  Otherwise why pick 4 keepers.  Same old sxxt from England.  I'm glad that some of the uncapped players have come in on form.  But why welbeck. He hardly plays.  I'm assuming that Southgate is playing a bit of lip service to the media and public.  The World Cup squad will be full of the same old players who have failed before.  Couldn't consider Wilshire earlier in the season because he wasn't playing. Something I agree with.  The mans a hypocrite picking Joe hart who got a game last week and made another Fxxk up

[NickDRFC]

It’s a brave selection to some extent but I don’t like the hypocrisy with Southgate. Players have to be playing regularly, so why pick Hart, Rose Welbeck? I’m sure if pressed he would cite the need for Hart’s experience, so why then no room for Cahill when the centre backs in the squad have less than 30 caps between them, with most of those from the non-playing John Stones?

[drfchound]

Welbeck did ok last night.

[NickDRFC]

I quite like Welbeck, and he’s always done a good job for England, but that’s beside the point I was making. He was only playing last night because Aubameyang is ineligible and Lacazette injured; Wilshere has been more involved in the first team picture this season at Arsenal this year but Southgate publicly named him as someone who needs to be playing more to get in his squad.

[sedwardsdrfc]

To be fair other nations will pick the same core of players if they play or not at club level, does a player been on the bench at a club like Man City make them not as good as a player playing every week and losing at a club like Everton? I think we're the only nation who think like this in such an extreme way.

And it does just lead to a massive turnover of players where other countries on the whole play the same players who started the qualification campaign England 11s generally seem to change massively over the course of a season based on who is getting the best media hype at the time! no wonder we turn up at tournaments and look like strangers 

[CrippyCooke]

DN

Hang on. After 2014, we were told to look to 2018. Now we’re looking to 2022?

Mind, after 2010, we started looking to 2014. And after 2006, we were looking to 2010. At least this time we’re looking 4 years ahead BEFORE the quadrennial embarrassment.

I'd probably write off 2022 while we're at it.

I can't remember England's youth sides being anywhere near as successful as they have been in past year or so. There's enough talent in the youth sides to reasonably expect some improvement in the next 10 years.

[scawsby steve]

The question is, will we be going to the World Cup? Thoughts anyone?

[roversdude]

Can’t see us not going Steve

[drfchound]

The question is, will we be going to the World Cup? Thoughts anyone?

I too have doubts about whether we should take part.
It would be good if a number of European teams pulled out in support of us, causing the tournament to be cancelled.
Maybe even get the tournament rescheduled for next year?

[godlike1]

The problem for me is that no matter who plays for England, young or old, the football is turgid and not exciting at all.

If we enjoyed watching England play I think we’d have a more optimistic outlook on the future. A little bit like rovers 🥂

[scawsby steve]

The question is, will we be going to the World Cup? Thoughts anyone?

I too have doubts about whether we should take part.
It would be good if a number of European teams pulled out in support of us, causing the tournament to be cancelled.
Maybe even get the tournament rescheduled for next year?

That would be a good idea Hound, and when you consider the fact that England were one of the main bidders for this year's World Cup, we could easily be awarded it for next year.

[selby]

  Hound, they don't buy the Daily Mail abroad, if we or any other European team don't take part in Russia, we will gladly be replaced by Asian,  African, South American teams, and would not put it past Italy to go instead.
    And we would have to forget the next tournaments as well, as we would have to get over any ban they would impose for pulling out.
  The other continents would just love more teams in the finals instead of European sides, they think we have too many anyway.

[drfchound]

I think that if England were to pull out that it would be reported in much more than the Daily Mail.
Also, sanctions etc imposed by the UK on Russia would probably have some effect on some of our European cousins son some unity between us could go a long way should England decide to withdraw.
In reality as well, would it really matter that much if we were banned from taking part in the next World Cup as well.
Reading through the posts on this thread alone not many people are bothered about watching us play and no one thinks we have a chance of winning the tournament.
None of our dignitaries are going and to be honest, any of our fans who are looking to make the trip need their heads examining.

[silent majority]

I think that if England were to pull out that it would be reported in much more than the Daily Mail.
Also, sanctions etc imposed by the UK on Russia would probably have some effect on some of our European cousins son some unity between us could go a long way should England decide to withdraw.
In reality as well, would it really matter that much if we were banned from taking part in the next World Cup as well.
Reading through the posts on this thread alone not many people are bothered about watching us play and no one thinks we have a chance of winning the tournament.
None of our dignitaries are going and to be honest, any of our fans who are looking to make the trip need their heads examining.

Why is that then Hound?

[Alickismyhero]

SM,

I am not in a position to go to the World Cup but if I were I would not go because of the organised violence of Russian thugs.

I am in support of England not going and expecting other countries to support our action.

I don't like politics coming in to sport but it did help destroy apartheid in South Africa and this Russian situation is very worrying.

[roversdude]

I don’t think we would get the support of other countries if we decided not to go