Stupid Woman/people

[RedJ]

So if he had said stupid man to someone that would be fine?

Yes.

[drfchound]

So if he had said stupid man to someone that would be fine?

If he had said stupid boy to someone.............that would be Pike.

[albie]

Remember the Prescott punch?

Media types and the political elite thought it was well out of order, a political disaster.

Many normal folk saw it as a justified response.
Fat lad with a mullet gets above himself, throws an egg at close range, and gets a smack for his trouble.

I reckon you have to set aside your own biases to get a good handle on how it is seen in the wider world.

[BillyStubbsTears]

There's an interesting take Albie.

You reckon Corbyn is riding both horses?

Insist he'd never be a misogynist to placate the Islington set. But hint to the Northern Neanderthals that he's a straight talking man's man?

[Mr1Croft]

Agreed HA

But the problem is, we're in a very small minority.

And I'm very thankfull that you are..We can argue both sides of our politics all day long and as poor as this Government have been, even in the tough position they were in,Jeremy Corbyn couldn't run a bath..

  Frankly it takes a special kind of opposition incompetence for Labour after all that's happened since the last election to still find themselves in the weak position that they are...

Depends on which way you look at it. To those outside of the political bubble, there is a clear lack of direction on Brexit from Labour and considering that has been portrayed as the single biggest issue in politics in the last two years, he/Labour have been doing something right to still be around 36-38% of the polls.

Then there is the weight of the polls as well, it's well known Yougov still weight their respondents answers on likeliness to vote (which was one of the reasons they got it so wrong in 2017). They have amended the weighting since the last election but still weighted nonetheless, whereas those that don't have Labour consistently 2/3 points above.

What I will say however is we can't take the polls too seriously either, we all know Corbyn is a better campaigner than a diplomat and he revels in an election campaign. Last year and his two leadership elections before that showed this. So I wouldn't write him off just yet.

[The Red Baron]

They all behave like toddlers in the Commons. It's embarrassing. We elect these people to run the country and they spend all their time shouting at each other and playing "It's not my fault, it's theirs!". Jokers the lot of 'em.

And so the HOC Christmas pantomime continues; f*cking useless, all 650 of them.

OH YES THEY ARE!

Not any longer it doesn't. They have f*cked off for Christmas leaving the Brexit situation deadlocked.

Whether any of them undergo a Damascene conversion over Christmas we'll have to see.

[BillyStubbsTears]

MrCroft
Aye. I remember Corbyn's passionate, elegant and persuasive campaigning during the 2016 referendum.

I'm quite sure his performance was decisive.

I was particularly struck by his closing address, to rally waivering voters. Where, the night before the vote, he went on a webcast run by some obscure American left wing organisation to explain why he was supporting Remain, even though it is an article of faith among his milleu that EU=Bad. And he made a passionate defence of the EU, on the basis that, if you drop a plastic bag off the coast of Colombia, it ends up in Japan. (1)

The number of Labour Leave voters that performance will have swayed is incalculable.

He finished that historic performance by saying he was going to finish off the night before the vote by having supper at a Muslim community centre in Islington. I'm sure that gave the Leave voters in Denaby pause to stop and ponder their choice.

(1)
I know, I know. It sounds too f**king daft for The Thick of It. Unfortunately, it is the truth.

[Mr1Croft]

C'mon Billy. That's a lazy argument and as lazy as Theresa May justifying austerity because Labour bankrupted the economy in 08-10.

We know that as soon as Cameron/Osbourne became figure heads of the Remain camp and Johnson/Gove of Leave, it became nigh on impossible for Corbyn to make any sort of impact as the media focused purely on personalities over politics. Next to a power struggle at the heart of the Conservative Party between Cameron and Johnson, Corbyn wasn't really that interesting.

A study from Loughborough University shows the media coverage intensified over the battle 'for number 10'. https://blog.lboro.ac.uk/crcc/eu-referendum/uk-news-coverage-2016-eu-referendum-report-5-6-may-22-june-2016/

I do somewhat agree with your comments about the webcast and how strange it was. But I do also have to admit I'm struggling to visualise Labour leave voters in Denaby deciding to watch a webcast in the hope that Corbyn could change their mind.

[BillyStubbsTears]

MrCroft

That last sentence. Well yeah.

[BillyStubbsTears]

But in other news. Good to see the Tories' being consistent in their approach to people saying stupid offensive shit, eh?

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-46641106

[drfchound]

Agreed HA

But the problem is, we're in a very small minority.

And I'm very thankfull that you are..We can argue both sides of our politics all day long and as poor as this Government have been, even in the tough position they were in,Jeremy Corbyn couldn't run a bath..

  Frankly it takes a special kind of opposition incompetence for Labour after all that's happened since the last election to still find themselves in the weak position that they are...

Depends on which way you look at it. To those outside of the political bubble, there is a clear lack of direction on Brexit from Labour and considering that has been portrayed as the single biggest issue in politics in the last two years, he/Labour have been doing something right to still be around 36-38% of the polls.

Then there is the weight of the polls as well, it's well known Yougov still weight their respondents answers on likeliness to vote (which was one of the reasons they got it so wrong in 2017). They have amended the weighting since the last election but still weighted nonetheless, whereas those that don't have Labour consistently 2/3 points above.

What I will say however is we can't take the polls too seriously either, we all know Corbyn is a better campaigner than a diplomat and he revels in an election campaign. Last year and his two leadership elections before that showed this. So I wouldn't write him off just yet.

It was quite easy for Corbin to be a good campaigner at the last election.
He was making lots of promises that would have been very difficult to deliver on had he somehow managed to win.
To be fair, it was never going to happen and he knew it.

[albie]

But in other news. Good to see the Tories' being consistent in their approach to people saying stupid offensive shit, eh?

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-46641106

You can't beat a spot of self-regulation, can you?

I expect the media pack will be all over this for weeks on end. Much introspection and baring of the soul from the party faithful.

We might need to remember this when the toerag throws his hat in the ring to replace the hopeless bot.

[ravenrover]

Agreed HA

But the problem is, we're in a very small minority.

And I'm very thankfull that you are..We can argue both sides of our politics all day long and as poor as this Government have been, even in the tough position they were in,Jeremy Corbyn couldn't run a bath..

  Frankly it takes a special kind of opposition incompetence for Labour after all that's happened since the last election to still find themselves in the weak position that they are...

Depends on which way you look at it. To those outside of the political bubble, there is a clear lack of direction on Brexit from Labour and considering that has been portrayed as the single biggest issue in politics in the last two years, he/Labour have been doing something right to still be around 36-38% of the polls.

Then there is the weight of the polls as well, it's well known Yougov still weight their respondents answers on likeliness to vote (which was one of the reasons they got it so wrong in 2017). They have amended the weighting since the last election but still weighted nonetheless, whereas those that don't have Labour consistently 2/3 points above.

What I will say however is we can't take the polls too seriously either, we all know Corbyn is a better campaigner than a diplomat and he revels in an election campaign. Last year and his two leadership elections before that showed this. So I wouldn't write him off just yet.

Jesus H Christ you should have been at Glastonbury listening to what he was going to do, no idea where the money was coming from to pay for it all though




It was quite easy for Corbin to be a good campaigner at the last election.
He was making lots of promises that would have been very difficult to deliver on had he somehow managed to win.
To be fair, it was never going to happen and he knew it.

[RedJ]

Good thing he knew where the money was going to come from then. He had a fully costed manifesto. People seem to want to ignore that and spout the "magic money tree" b*llocks.

[Bentley Bullet]

https://www.independent.co.uk/voices/jeremy-corbyn-labour-2017-election-campaign-nhs-spending-plans-a8555621.html



https://www.channel4.com/news/factcheck/factcheck-the-labour-manifesto

[RedJ]

Fair enough.

For the record I didn't read the article as I don't care enough to look. 

[BillyStubbsTears]

Have you actually read that article BB? I mean, gone beyond the headline and the summary sentence and into the detail?

[Bentley Bullet]

No Billy lad, dead thick me.

What I do know though is that you will oppose anything I say irrespective of whether you really agree or not. Your predictability is quite boring.

[BillyStubbsTears]

Well, I did wonder what point you were trying to make.

[Bentley Bullet]

I was making the point that Corbyn Knew he had no chance of winning the election so could offer the earth in promises. I bet he nearly shat himself when it turned out closer than expected.

[BillyStubbsTears]

But that's not what that article says.

[Bentley Bullet]

No, that's what I said, keep up. The article says the manifesto didn't add up.

[BillyStubbsTears]

No. It doesn't.

The article quotes unnamed sources and one named source (Seamus Milne, who has zero economics experience) as saying that in their opinion, the numbers didn't stack up.

There's a world of difference between that detail and the wild headline (by an avowedly and aggressively anti-Corbyn journalist).

That's why I asked if you had read past the headline.

The article is fully of opinion and inference with nothing solid whatsoever to back it up. The headline is a ridiculous over-claim.

[Bentley Bullet]

I don't care what qualifications the writer has, I haven't any economic experience either, but that doesn't mean I lack the sense to realise when someone is talking b*llocks, especially someone with a history of it.

[BillyStubbsTears]

I don't doubt your opinion of your sense BB. Although it doesn't seem to extend as far as making you healthily skeptical of people pushing unsupported opinion as fact.

And THAT is how you end up with Brexit and Trump.

Maybe if a few more folk engaged with facts and accepted that their gut opinions are unlikely to be good guides to a sensible outcome, we'd be a bit less f**ked.

[Bentley Bullet]

So what about your own opinion of Corbyn? Weren't you skeptical of his 'fully costed' plans?

[BillyStubbsTears]

Firstly, they weren't Corbyn's plans. They were McDonnell's.

Secondly, they were prepared in collaboration with several leading economists. Ones who had a pretty much flawless track record on predicting the effect of expansion and contraction of Govt spending on the economy. Their take was that the increase in Govt spending under a Corbyn Govt would boost the economy to the extent required to make the numbers stack up.

It doesn't surprise me that Seamus Milne disagreed. He's an out and out hard-line Marxist who doesn't see how Capitalism can work efficiently.

So no, overall, I wasn't skeptical of the plans. Because I looked into the detail of how they had been developed. And I didn't just trust my gut instinct.

[Bentley Bullet]

Good for you. I thought, with you being Corbyn's biggest critic on this forum you would be skeptical of the plans. I was.

[BillyStubbsTears]

You've not been paying attention then.

I've said for three years that McDonnell is the only leading politician who properly understands the economic policy that the country needs.

It's Corbyn's foreign policy that I think is absolute f**king idiocy.

[idler]

How do you two manage to spell sceptics in the US form?