New Rules on Home-grown Players

[Alan Southstand]

In the 'six figure fee' thread, Jonathan wrote:

I see we may decide against bringing in a keeper due to yet rules on homegrown players. That should free up some funds for other priorities that can strengthen the first eleven.

Personally, I think this deserves a thread all of its own.

First of all, according to GM, last season, all teams had to field 1 player that had come through the u19 level. The statto's will know more than me, but did we comply with this rule last season and, furthermore, how do we know that every other team did?

Secondly, apparently this season it may be 2 players. And this is the reason that, suddenly, there has been a change of priority with the goalkeeper situation, as Jones is now being thought of as our No2 (when the manager, previously, had said Jones was going to be the u23 keeper this season and we would get in a Marosi replacement). From what I have read, this rule may not even come into force and even if it does, what is the punishment if we don't comply with it?

I wondered if we are putting ourselves at a disadvantage to the rest of the league, right from the kick off? Or is it the funds will not stretch to having an experienced keeper in?

[vaya]

In the 'six figure fee' thread, Jonathan wrote:

I see we may decide against bringing in a keeper due to yet rules on homegrown players. That should free up some funds for other priorities that can strengthen the first eleven.

Personally, I think this deserves a thread all of its own.

First of all, according to GM, last season, all teams had to field 1 player that had come through the u19 level. The statto's will know more than me, but did we comply with this rule last season and, furthermore, how do we know that every other team did?

Secondly, apparently this season it may be 2 players. And this is the reason that, suddenly, there has been a change of priority with the goalkeeper situation, as Jones is now being thought of as our No2 (when the manager, previously, had said Jones was going to be the u23 keeper this season and we would get in a Marosi replacement). From what I have read, this rule may not even come into force and even if it does, what is the punishment if we don't comply with it?

I wondered if we are putting ourselves at a disadvantage to the rest of the league, right from the kick off? Or is it the funds will not stretch to having an experienced keeper in?

I think you're just looking for something to worry about Alan, given that the outputs from this analysis are the perennial favourites of a) the budget and b) predicting the teams going to do badly before a ball's been kicked.

[Alan Southstand]

So you don't know, either, then?

[since-1969]

Why should this rule have an effects on having 2 quality keepers .

[jackthelad]

Why should this rule have an effects on having 2 quality keepers .

Because it then means your going to have to drag another outfield player out of the under 18s/youth team to sit on the bench and of course we would be a senior outfield player down not on the bench too.

[Alan Southstand]

There are several rule amendments and changes to take effect this season but I can't find any references to the 1 homegrown player rule!

Genuinely interested.

Why should we put ourselves at a disadvantage?

[IDM]

Also GM rates Jones, so as he fits the criteria for a homegrown player then it makes sense for him to be in the squad..

The issue GM has a concern over, according to the DFP, is then not sending Jones out on loan to get more playing time.  Then it says at the moment he is competing with Lawlor for the shirt anyway.

This does not mean we can’t afford to sign another first team keeper, more that there is no point..

[IDM]

There are several rule amendments and changes to take effect this season but I can't find any references to the 1 homegrown player rule!

Genuinely interested.

Why should we put ourselves at a disadvantage?

What disadvantage is that.?

I would reckon meany clubs, especially in leagues 1 and 2, would have a younger and unproven keeper on the bench whether homegrown or not.

And if the homegrown players are good enough, what’s the problem.?

[steve@dcfd]

Having two players who before or at U19 were developed for 12 months could be the change to the match day squad. Therefore 2 out of the 18 players should have to fit that criteria. So by having Jones as one then all you need is one more. So that’s why it could affect another experience keeper. Rule 33.11 is for one player which might change according to GM.

[IDM]

Yes that’s how I read it, but also that Jones is considered good enough for the squad anyway.

As long as we can use the emergency goalkeeper loan system in case of injuries we would be ok..

[Adwick Rover]

I think the development of an U23's squad over the last 2 seasons covers this point.

The average age of this team will be 19-20 year olds and the majority are capable of sitting on the bench and can come on for 15 mins or so and do a job for the team.

Fielding youth team players/u18s should not come into the equation any more in my opinion.

GM has stated on many occasions that developing home grown talent is high on his agenda with the focus on playing first team football for our club.

[Belle Vue Boy]

As GM said in his interview , theres no point bringing in an experienced keeper to sit on the bench and lose a potential better substitution option of an outfield player when louis ticks 2 boxes he's homegrown and a keeper. If he thinks hes ready thats good enough for me 

[steve@dcfd]

Having googled the rule I can not see where it is going to change?
GM said Jones would be the U23 keeper this season therefore going out on loan would prevent this. What has changed at the club for this U turn.

[RoversAlias]

I'm usually positive but I agree with Alan here, it seems a bit odd. I definitely feel our GK options have weakened if we don't replace Marosi as well, Lawlor is not the finished article and Jones is completely unproven.

It's alright saying "we still have the emergency loan system" but in that scenario, the pickings are very slim. You're having to borrow third choice goalies from clubs at the Championship or even League One level, usually players who haven't had a game in months, and throw them straight into our first team.

[steve@dcfd]

The thing for me is we have lost the services of 6 first team players 3 loans and 3 of our own all or at least 5 of them would have cost in wages. We have lost at least another 7 off the wage bill, 2 of which were loans. We will have replace Masons wages in some part with Halliday. So surely signing a goal keeper can’t be about money?

[Retdon1]

I'm usually positive but I agree with Alan here, it seems a bit odd. I definitely feel our GK options have weakened if we don't replace Marosi as well, Lawlor is not the finished article and Jones is completely unproven.

It's alright saying "we still have the emergency loan system" but in that scenario, the pickings are very slim. You're having to borrow third choice goalies from clubs at the Championship or even League One level, usually players who haven't had a game in months, and throw them straight into our first team.

Are you not allowed to bring an emergency loan in from the premier league ??

[RoversAlias]

I'm usually positive but I agree with Alan here, it seems a bit odd. I definitely feel our GK options have weakened if we don't replace Marosi as well, Lawlor is not the finished article and Jones is completely unproven.

It's alright saying "we still have the emergency loan system" but in that scenario, the pickings are very slim. You're having to borrow third choice goalies from clubs at the Championship or even League One level, usually players who haven't had a game in months, and throw them straight into our first team.

Are you not allowed to bring an emergency loan in from the premier league ??

Yes but that isn't my point. It's about the quality of what's available. PL clubs at that stage would only be able to offer unproven kids, so we might as well go with Jones in that scenario. Hence it tends to be older keepers who have dropped to third choice at EFL clubs, like when we signed Chris Neal from Port Vale on an emergency loan a few seasons ago.

[Retdon1]

I'm usually positive but I agree with Alan here, it seems a bit odd. I definitely feel our GK options have weakened if we don't replace Marosi as well, Lawlor is not the finished article and Jones is completely unproven.

It's alright saying "we still have the emergency loan system" but in that scenario, the pickings are very slim. You're having to borrow third choice goalies from clubs at the Championship or even League One level, usually players who haven't had a game in months, and throw them straight into our first team.

Are you not allowed to bring an emergency loan in from the premier league ??

Yes but that isn't my point. It's about the quality of what's available. PL clubs at that stage would only be able to offer unproven kids, so we might as well go with Jones in that scenario. Hence it tends to be older keepers who have dropped to third choice at EFL clubs, like when we signed Chris Neal from Port Vale on an emergency loan a few seasons ago.

Most premier league teams carry 3 senior goal keepers so would have a chance to sign the 3rd choice on a short term loan. Most premier league under 23 keepers will be good quality. I think Southend and Wycombe both signed David Stockdale from Birmingham on an emergency loan last season and he’s not half bad... I wouldn’t worry too much about not being able to sign a half decent replacement.

[RoversAlias]

Stockdale came to mind earlier today, but he did feel like a real one off. I'm not saying you can't get a good player in that way, but I think it is tremendously naive to think that having two goalkeepers, one an academy graduate who has never played, is enough for a season purely because "there's always emergency loans".

As I said, I am not someone who usually jumps to the negative conclusion and I am loathe to question the budget, because I think it will be one of the top 6-8 in the league, but this piece of news is the first thing that's come out this summer from the club or McCann that I'm not too pleased with.

[Retdon1]

Stockdale came to mind earlier today, but he did feel like a real one off. I'm not saying you can't get a good player in that way, but I think it is tremendously naive to think that having two goalkeepers, one an academy graduate who has never played, is enough for a season purely because "there's always emergency loans".

As I said, I am not someone who usually jumps to the negative conclusion and I am loathe to question the budget, because I think it will be one of the top 6-8 in the league, but this piece of news is the first thing that's come out this summer from the club or McCann that I'm not too pleased with.

Before yesterday I would have thought it was a big mistake by McCan to only go with Lawlor and Jones but with this new home grown rule, I can see his thinking. The main problem for me is if Lawlor suffers with a major dip in form or confidence.

[Alan Southstand]

McCann said earlier this year that Jones was going to be u23’s keeper this season and then challenge IL for the keepers jersey. Now, he is deemed ‘good enough’. Fair enough, and whether me or anyone else thinks Jones is ready, the manager has decided.

Having had time to think about it, the only thing I can come up with is that the new rule may come in next year, not this. And any new keeper wanting to sign now will want (probably) a 2 year deal, minm, thus giving us a problem next season.

Roll on some positive news.

[vaya]

McCann said earlier this year that Jones was going to be u23’s keeper this season and then challenge IL for the keepers jersey. Now, he is deemed ‘good enough’. Fair enough, and whether me or anyone else thinks Jones is ready, the manager has decided.

Having had time to think about it, the only thing I can come up with is that the new rule may come in next year, not this. And any new keeper wanting to sign now will want (probably) a 2 year deal, minm, thus giving us a problem next season.

Roll on some positive news.

Now something to worry about for next season Alan.

Nice to see you getting things done early.

[Alan Southstand]

I think I may have a stalker!

[vaya]

I think I may have a stalker!

No need to worry Alan. Really.