Parliament to be prorogued

[albie]

I'm with you on the FTPA Albie, but your and my wish to see it gone are irrelevant to the matter in hand.

Billy,

Get your thinking cap on, Lad.
Glyn is right, Labour do not need a GE with No Deal option still on the table.

Explained on Ch 4 News by Prof John Curtice (2mins in);
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HIOXzZJythU

The 2/3 majority clause is a bind both ways, is it not?

[BillyStubbsTears]

Albie.

I'm at a loss to see your point. Curtice is saying precisely what I said. Labour has the choice not to support calling an Election. It'd be good to get a clear statement on whether Corbyn WOULD refuse to support an Election in those circumstances. I ASSUME they would, but I've assumed a lot about Corbyn's approach towards Brexit over the past 12 months, and regularly been disappointed.

[albie]

BST,

I've had more enjoyable visits to the Dentist than making sense of you!

You were saying Cummings will call a GE on Thursday.
This is only possible with 2/3 HoC support.

Where is that 2/3 going to come from?

The easiest way is to reduce the requirement to a simple majority....in which case what is the point of the FTPAct?
To say it "is irrelevant to the matter in hand" is just nuts.

Another fly in the ointment is whether Farrago will stand GE candidates.
A GE before October 31 would mean Johnson has to stand on a specific "No Deal" platform, and stop playing the negotiation card.
Farrago would need to oppose him if not.

Which bounces us back to the calculation of whether the next GE will be a 4 way split, or revert to a more normal distribution.

We don't know yet!

[BillyStubbsTears]

Albie.

My apologies. I wasn't clear earlier. I meant Cummings will MOVE to call a GE.

I said earlier that changing the FTPA is irrelevant to this debate because it won't happened in the next few weeks.

[Donnywolf]

Gove backed Johnson for PM (when May won) but then pulled the plug on him as he was not the man for the job

Gove in this latest PM race said to prorogue Parliament would be undemocratic

Gove then has sat in Cabinet that gave prorogue the go ahead

Gove said the suspension of Parliament has NOTHING to do with trying to get Leave over the line

The rest of Parliament (hopefully the majority) says they will push a Bill this week to put make No Deal  impossible in law.

Gove will not say whether the Government will actually allow / honour that to become law

Probably Gove speak for no we will not

Odious little sly weasel - and I never thought I would say this but I think I would prefer a night on the town with Barton AND Kitson rather that just 10 minutes in the company of Gove

[Donnywolf]

Can you turn GOVE into WEASEL by changing just one letter each time. Have a try (There are three changes needed)

GOVE
...
...
...
WEASEL

[Donnywolf]

Sorry it was a cheap joke. The answer would have been though for anyone remotely interested

GOVE
SLIMY
DUPLICITOUS
F*****G
WEASEL

[BillyStubbsTears]

Wolf.

I've said before but it bears repeating. An unnamed Cabinet minister earlier this year said of Gove, "His lifelong wrestling match with his conscience is the longest unbeaten run in history."

Brilliant.

Sums up the mendacious little prig perfectly.

[wilts rover]

Albie.

I'm at a loss to see your point. Curtice is saying precisely what I said. Labour has the choice not to support calling an Election. It'd be good to get a clear statement on whether Corbyn WOULD refuse to support an Election in those circumstances. I ASSUME they would, but I've assumed a lot about Corbyn's approach towards Brexit over the past 12 months, and regularly been disappointed.

Did you miss my last post about the amendment?

Because it fits in exactly with what we do know about what Corbyn wants. He said the other week he wants to extend Article 50 and then have an election - and thats what he would do if the other parties would support him to be PM after a vote of confidence. He gets the same with an amendment to a call for a GE.

[BillyStubbsTears]

Wilts.

I didn't see that but it's clearly irrelevant now anyway. The boat that had the idea as a first step of having a VONC leading to Corbyn becoming temporary PM has sailed with no Tory rebel MPs on it.

There's one opportunity to stop No Deal now, which is MPs taking control of the order paper this week and passing legislation instructing Johnson to ask for an extension to A50.

The issue is, what does Corbyn then do if Cummings ignores that and moves for a GE? There's no way a 2/3rds majority would back a GE conditional on A50 extension. So I assume Corbyn has to whip Labour to vote down the move for a GE, otherwise that's No Deal signed and sealed.

[Bentley Bullet]

SS

A long, long time ago, this place used to be full of robust humour. Given and taken. No grudges.

It's changed out of all recognition over the past few years. Seems to be full of snowflakes these days.

Yes, I get your drift.

[Glyn_Wigley]

If Corbyn votes FOR a GE without stipulating that Brexit is postponed, then that's Parliament shut down immediately and No Deal definitely goes through anyway. So if No Deal goes ahead and he really wants to win the next GE, he's got to allow time to let all the Brexit shit fall on Boris's head before the GE.

[hoolahoop]

I’m not on about multiple votes, just give the people the chance to vote on something which is clear what the outcomes mean..

That doesn’t mean I don’t accept the referendum result, but the government and Parliament cannot allow the disaster of no deal..

People bang on about the 17.4 million who voted leave, but what about the 16 odd million who voted remain and the 10 million or so who didn’t vote, plus the new eligible voters.?

Nobody knows what the outcome of leaving will be. We haven't left yet!

Sunny uplands and unicorns for you still as a Remoaner then Bentley ?
Hell's teeth  what does it take for you to get concerned - the badging up of immigrants that were once our friends and neighbours perhaps  on top of a creeping dictatorial disposition from our great leader Cummings/Johnson.

 It will never happen here they said now look at what's happening to European nationals. Patel, Raab and Cummings have yet to get their acts together.....l

[Glyn_Wigley]

Nobody knows what the outcome of walking across the A1 blindfold will be. Until they try it. And BB'a just the person to show us how safe it really is.

[Bentley Bullet]

Hoola. Have no fear about me having no fear, I certainly have fear. I have fear for our country because I doubt we'll ever have democracy as we've known it again.

[Bentley Bullet]

Nobody knows what the outcome of walking across the A1 blindfold will be. Until they try it. And BB'a just the person to show us how safe it really is.

If you're smart enough you'd use one of the scores of bridges, Mr Wiggerley, but I can see why you didn't think of that.

[Glyn_Wigley]

Nobody knows what the outcome of walking across the A1 blindfold will be. Until they try it. And BB'a just the person to show us how safe it really is.

If you're smart enough you'd use one of the scores of bridges, Mr Wiggerley, but I can see why you didn't think of that.

Good luck finding one whilst wearing a blindfold! And avoiding the cars on it as well.

[Bentley Bullet]

Now you're trying to make the task more difficult Mr Wiggerley! You didn't say I had to wear a blindfold until I started to walk across now, did you? And you didn't say it couldn't be a footbridge, now did you? And if it was a road bridge, you didn't say I couldn't hold onto the rail, now did you?

It seems to me you're adding obstacles in a determined attempt to stop my success in crossing the A1 by any means, aren't you, Mr Wiggerley!

Not an uncommon tactic of yours is it!

[Filo]

Now you're trying to make the task more difficult Mr Wiggerley! You didn't say I had to wear a blindfold until I started to walk across now, did you? And you didn't say it couldn't be a footbridge, now did you? And if it was a road bridge, you didn't say I couldn't hold onto the rail, now did you?

It seems to me you're adding obstacles in a determined attempt to stop my success in crossing the A1 by any means, aren't you, Mr Wiggerley!

Not an uncommon tactic of yours is it!

Now that sounds like what Boris is doing

[Bentley Bullet]

You are having a laugh, aren't you!

[BillyStubbsTears]

Of course he isn't joking.

It's a matter of established fact that if Johnson and the ERG hadn't voted against May's deal, we'd be out now.

[Bentley Bullet]

https://youtu.be/9w1y-kMPNcM

[Glyn_Wigley]

Now you're trying to make the task more difficult Mr Wiggerley! You didn't say I had to wear a blindfold until I started to walk across now, did you? And you didn't say it couldn't be a footbridge, now did you? And if it was a road bridge, you didn't say I couldn't hold onto the rail, now did you?

It seems to me you're adding obstacles in a determined attempt to stop my success in crossing the A1 by any means, aren't you, Mr Wiggerley!

Not an uncommon tactic of yours is it!

I never said the exact point where you start from, what your route has to be, or where your end destination is. You don't get to choose any of these for yourself once the task has been decided. All you get told is what you have to do while leaving every other decision to people you don't get to choose either. Exactly like what you maintain about the referendum, in fact.

[wilts rover]

Now you're trying to make the task more difficult Mr Wiggerley! You didn't say I had to wear a blindfold until I started to walk across now, did you? And you didn't say it couldn't be a footbridge, now did you? And if it was a road bridge, you didn't say I couldn't hold onto the rail, now did you?

It seems to me you're adding obstacles in a determined attempt to stop my success in crossing the A1 by any means, aren't you, Mr Wiggerley!

Not an uncommon tactic of yours is it!

I never said the exact point where you start from, what your route has to be, or where your end destination is. You don't get to choose any of these for yourself once the task has been decided. All you get told is what you have to do while leaving every other decision to people you don't get to choose either. Exactly like what you maintain about the referendum, in fact.

Don't forget that first request was a non-binding vote. Would you like to have a binding one in which to re-consider?

[Glyn_Wigley]

Now you're trying to make the task more difficult Mr Wiggerley! You didn't say I had to wear a blindfold until I started to walk across now, did you? And you didn't say it couldn't be a footbridge, now did you? And if it was a road bridge, you didn't say I couldn't hold onto the rail, now did you?

It seems to me you're adding obstacles in a determined attempt to stop my success in crossing the A1 by any means, aren't you, Mr Wiggerley!

Not an uncommon tactic of yours is it!

I never said the exact point where you start from, what your route has to be, or where your end destination is. You don't get to choose any of these for yourself once the task has been decided. All you get told is what you have to do while leaving every other decision to people you don't get to choose either. Exactly like what you maintain about the referendum, in fact.

Don't forget that first request was a non-binding vote. Would you like to have a binding one in which to re-consider?

You'd better ask BB that, he's the one happy to be taking the walk into the unknown.

[Bentley Bullet]

Now stop wiggling Mr Wiggerley! You are in no position to say what or where anybody chooses to use their initiative to show how feeble you are.

[Glyn_Wigley]

Now stop wiggling Mr Wiggerley! You are in no position to say what or where anybody chooses to use their initiative to show how feeble you are.

That's what happens when the person who said how easy it was going to be turns out to have lied to you and moves the goalposts. But you've still got to do it they way you get told how to do it because not to would be undemocratic and go against the will of the people. Just like the referendum. Suck it up!

[Bentley Bullet]

No Mr Wiggerley, this is what happens when you make yourself look a fool and try to wiggle out of it.

[albie]

Blackmail now:
https://www.politicshome.com/news/uk/political-parties/conservative-party/news/106203/rebel-tory-mps-told-they-will-be-deselected

Maybe Labour should play hardball with the likes of Mann and Flint now!

[Glyn_Wigley]

No Mr Wiggerley, this is what happens when you make yourself look a fool and try to wiggle out of it.

The ending about being lied to was the end point from the start because I knew you'd wriggle as furiously as you have done to try and look clever - and you've fallen for it good and proper. Even I thought you wouldn't be stupid enough to do so so easily. Well done!