Gavin Baldwin in DFP interview Thursday 17th

[steve@dcfd]

Quote
I still have trust in the management of the club and faith in DM that he will maximise the potential we have. I'm pretty sure from January onwards he'll do what he can to address the balance of the squad in terms of loans v permanent and look to strengthen up front or wherever else he thinks fit.

I have every faith in DM to get the best out of the players we have whether they are our players or loans. He will do his best to identify the players we want to make us better. Let’s hope we can get those players signed or loaned before the window closes.

[DonnyBazR0ver]

It’s all about opinions, DBR, but I disagree with you on Rowe, as we havn’t replaced either his quality, leadership, experience and, most importantly, goals.

You forgot to mention the lad who had the most influence on our performances last season, Kane, but he wasn’t ours either.

What we lost in the summer was that spine of the team, with only Whiteman retained, and the level of experience in the squad that McCann inherited. What did DM inherit, by comparison?

I know we respectfully disagree, Rowe was one player we could debate, so I don't get why folk keep going back to the conspiracy theory that we deliberately had a cull on wages that made us worse off with losing players plural . That simply isn't the case.

You and I, and most sensible folk understand we have our limits on wages and would not be able to compete with the wages some other bigger clubs are prepared to pay.  That won't change anytime soon and it's likely one of the main reasons DM couldn't get those deals over the line.

[Alan Southstand]

That’s fine DBR and I don’t have a problem with the idea that we can’t compete, financially, with some of our competitors in league 1. But, it wasn’t you or me that set the goal of going for top 6 again, even before DM was appointed.

The only other thing I’d pick you up on is - it wasn’t DM who was responsible for getting deals over the line. It’s Darren’s job to identify the players he thinks will get us to where we (as a Club) want to be.

[Campsall rover]

That’s fine DBR and I don’t have a problem with the idea that we can’t compete, financially, with some of our competitors in league 1. But, it wasn’t you or me that set the goal of going for top 6 again, even before DM was appointed.

The only other thing I’d pick you up on is - it wasn’t DM who was responsible for getting deals over the line. It’s Darren’s job to identify the players he thinks will get us to where we (as a Club) want to be.

I am sure the goal of top 6 is still the objective Alan. Even with the squad we have i still think it’s achievable.
If we can get a couple more in January then i would think will definitely achieve top 6 ( even top 3 ) which is what i predicted before a ball was kicked.
Yes many on here will think i am delusional but no one we have played yet suggests we are inferior as a team in this league. On the contrary in fact as we have been the better team in 9 of the 11 we have played.
Only Oxford and Coventry were better on the day. Coventry didn’t look a goal threat though and imo we just had a bad day at the office last Saturday.

The next 9 games before the festive season will be crucial. If we can get a minimum of 16 points ( i predicted 18 ) then we will be well placed to achieve our season objective.

[the vicar]

Quote
I still have trust in the management of the club and faith in DM that he will maximise the potential we have. I'm pretty sure from January onwards he'll do what he can to address the balance of the squad in terms of loans v permanent and look to strengthen up front or wherever else he thinks fit.

I have every faith in DM to get the best out of the players we have whether they are our players or loans. He will do his best to identify the players we want to make us better. Let’s hope we can get those players signed or loaned before the window closes.

I am the same, we have to trust them and get behind all of them, give DM and the whole team all the support and wall of noise in every game even against the Man U game, as if we get to the final and win it we will land in excess of a million pounds for next season. That is how important that cup is

[DonnyBazR0ver]

Dbr-ifyou don’t think we miss Wilks then then you must be a lot dummer than the Forum admin!

Watch your language! Yes of course we miss Wilks goal contribution but he was not our player! We were talking about contracts.

[DRNaith]

Dbr-ifyou don’t think we miss Wilks then then you must be a lot dummer than the Forum admin!

Knockers, help me with some context for what you say. Where do level the intelligence of Forum Admin?

[DonnyBazR0ver]

We could have bought him

No we couldn't. Unrealistic unless we had achieved promotion!

More realistic was the acquisition of Downing which we offered terms but he chose more lucrative terms at Portsmouth.

[godlike1]

Quote
I still have trust in the management of the club and faith in DM that he will maximise the potential we have. I'm pretty sure from January onwards he'll do what he can to address the balance of the squad in terms of loans v permanent and look to strengthen up front or wherever else he thinks fit.

I have every faith in DM to get the best out of the players we have whether they are our players or loans. He will do his best to identify the players we want to make us better. Let’s hope we can get those players signed or loaned before the window closes.

Is that a quote from the article that I've missed?

I agree with it but also wonder if his hands will be tied by club finances and our low attendances and season ticket numbers.

[DonnyBazR0ver]

Every club is 'limited' by finances. That's the point of having a budget.

[DonnyBazR0ver]

That’s fine DBR and I don’t have a problem with the idea that we can’t compete, financially, with some of our competitors in league 1. But, it wasn’t you or me that set the goal of going for top 6 again, even before DM was appointed.

The only other thing I’d pick you up on is - it wasn’t DM who was responsible for getting deals over the line. It’s Darren’s job to identify the players he thinks will get us to where we (as a Club) want to be.

I don't think it's that simple Alan. Yes, DM will identify players and maybe make the initial approaches to clubs etc, and from there he and GB will agree in principle about offers etc. No doubt GB will then deal with players representatives re terms. If the player wants wages higher than we offer, GB will look at other contract benefits. If the player wants way more than we can offer outside what was agreed in principle then GB will go back to DM to determine whether DM still wants us to peruse a deal or move on to other targets taking into account what would be left of the budget. I have no doubt DM and GB will be in constant dialogue right way through the process.

[Alan Southstand]

Is that how it is, or just how you think it is?

[DonnyBazR0ver]

Is that how it is, or just how you think it is?

I have spoken with SO'D in the past and GB who both gave an insight into transfer dealings. Some managers are more hands on than others but the same principles apply. You don't think that DM, or any manager, has no influence beyond the identification stage and the spending of his budget do you?

[silent majority]

Is that how it is, or just how you think it is?

That's exactly how it is. It's called negotiation.

[Pancho Regan]

Is that how it is, or just how you think it is?

You don't think that DM, or any manager, has no influence beyond the identification stage and the spending of his budget do you?

Daniel Stendel might disagree with you there DBR......

[ian1980]

Is that how it is, or just how you think it is?

That's exactly how it is. It's called negotiation.

And also called common sense. Sounds exactly how it should be done.

[Alan Southstand]

SM, I’m well aware of what negotiation is and how it works! I only replied (to DBR, by the way) as it’s not how it’s been described to me before. And, I’m sure it was you who explained it! You may well have forgot to mention the bit about ongoing dialogue, but anyway, that’s where I was coming from.

Nobody’s trying to be clever, here, just in case you thought I was.

Better news about talks commencing with contracted players and extending loans.

[silent majority]

SM, I’m well aware of what negotiation is and how it works! I only replied (to DBR, by the way) as it’s not how it’s been described to me before. And, I’m sure it was you who explained it! You may well have forgot to mention the bit about ongoing dialogue, but anyway, that’s where I was coming from.

Nobody’s trying to be clever, here, just in case you thought I was.

Better news about talks commencing with contracted players and extending loans.

Alan,

I can't remember going into any great depth, on here, about how the club negotiates transfer dealings and signing up new players. I will have said that GB and DB are responsible for finalising the deals, that's a given, and DM would be responsible for identifying his various choices and the 'slots' he needs to fill.

As a rule, each position would have 3 candidates named, and negotiations would start with sometimes just one, but it could well be all 3. Depending on how those talks go then there's always going to be a little backwards and forwards between the manager and the board. With previous managers it could well be they change their mind during that time period and present to the board a different list of names!

The club also have some very sensible structures and limits in place, not least that they resent paying extortionate agents fees, and they refuse to engage with some agents for that reason.

[redarmy82]

Apparently some of the Marquis money is still available, but some has been used on the players thus far.

I would have hated to see what players we would have signed if we hadn't have sold Marquis if that is the case.

[IDM]

Probably the same ones..

[roversdude]

Don’t you perhaps think more will become available as we get it

[Campsall rover]

Apparently some of the Marquis money is still available, but some has been used on the players thus far.

I would have hated to see what players we would have signed if we hadn't have sold Marquis if that is the case.

Oh dear, oh dear, oh dear. We would have signed most of the same ones i suspect.
Who should we have signed redarmy? You are obviously not happy with the ones we have signed.
But i rather think if we had signed Messi and Ronaldo you would be moaning that they too old & are past it.

[steve@dcfd]

Sarcasm again from certain posters having read the article the player or players DM wants appear to be on deals over 2 years. Some of the money was used to sign or secure loans in the summer that is what GB as said. We may have been able to sign or secure the same players but we don’t know. There may be a few on this board who know ?

[since-1969]

Apparently some of the Marquis money is still available, but some has been used on the players thus far.

I would have hated to see what players we would have signed if we hadn't have sold Marquis if that is the case.

Our contracted players have been depleted to the point where there not replaced. Temporary loans  are drafted in to bolster the squad . This finger in the dike approach to plugging the holes in the squad is now the new norm of keeping the clubs liabilities low where the accounts are concerned . If this financial method of recruitment is successful no one will complain. As the board will not return to paying big wages for players on long contracts Darren Moore has bought into the idea of loans and own grown talent .  Marquis was successful at Rovers having failed every where else so letting him move for a substantial fee was a no brainier but signing his replacement will not be easy but the loan market offers a better chance of funding his replacement without paying too much before hand .

[silent majority]

You've obviously missed the bit where the board are still funding the club an additional £2m a year.

[Donny Exile in York]

I just dont get this Marquis failed everyone else malarkey, he scored 8 goals in 21 games at league one level for mediocre Gillingham on loan, 6 in 15 at Northampton on loan to help their push for the league two title and as a youngster at Millwall scored some important goals including a goal against Villa in the FA cup and played in the Championship.. so he never failed anywhere.. he just hadnt had a proper longer term opportunity playing regularly at a permanent club til he joined Rovers

[steve@dcfd]

You've obviously missed the bit where the board are still funding the club an additional £2m a year.

I don’t think any body on this board as missed that the directors and owners of Club Doncaster subsidise the club of 2m a year they are reminded regularly.
Before we signed DM the CEO said we will be going for promotion again. We have been told that we have a budget of 6th to 8th place team. Therefore the club wanted the the supporters to believe they are aiming for the playoffs.
It appears even with last season budget of a similar figure we had to subsidise it by using some of the FA cup money to bring in Downing in January. He was a additional player to cover injury, yet we only had three centre halves at the time and one of those being injured. Yet GM had said he always wanted four but had gone with three initially. It was also said the budget had not been spent last summer and money was there if players were required in January.

This summer some of JM transfer fee was used to get our and loan players over the line. GB as also said DM is still looking for the right player or players on long term contracts and that could happen in January.

So even with the 2m that the owners put in via Club Doncaster the club are still talking about improving the playing staff and aiming for the playoffs. Therefore that amount will have been taking into consideration when the budget was set to achieve aiming for the playoffs by the club. JM transfer fee would have been additional money although only paid in instalments. Having offered JM a contract before he left then that should have been included in this season budget. So even with the owners paying the 2m we were still prepared for John to stay and therefore his wages for this year could be used on his replacement and his fee on top.

[godlike1]

You've obviously missed the bit where the board are still funding the club an additional £2m a year.

I don’t think any body on this board as missed that the directors and owners of Club Doncaster subsidise the club of 2m a year they are reminded regularly.
Before we signed DM the CEO said we will be going for promotion again. We have been told that we have a budget of 6th to 8th place team. Therefore the club wanted the the supporters to believe they are aiming for the playoffs.
It appears even with last season budget of a similar figure we had to subsidise it by using some of the FA cup money to bring in Downing in January. He was a additional player to cover injury, yet we only had three centre halves at the time and one of those being injured. Yet GM had said he always wanted four but had gone with three initially. It was also said the budget had not been spent last summer and money was there if players were required in January.

This summer some of JM transfer fee was used to get our and loan players over the line. GB as also said DM is still looking for the right player or players on long term contracts and that could happen in January.

So even with the 2m that the owners put in via Club Doncaster the club are still talking about improving the playing staff and aiming for the playoffs. Therefore that amount will have been taking into consideration when the budget was set to achieve aiming for the playoffs by the club. JM transfer fee would have been additional money although only paid in instalments. Having offered JM a contract before he left then that should have been included in this season budget. So even with the owners paying the 2m we were still prepared for John to stay and therefore his wages for this year could be used on his replacement and his fee on top.

Just to add to some of what you have put. the article also says that some of the money from JM has been spent on bringing in the players that DM has this season already. Given that we already have a paper thin squad primarily made up of loans and youngsters and a lot of high earners leaving in the summer it just does not add up to a budget anything like a top 6 - 8.

Everyone is very greatful for the additional money the owners put in and with the CEO being open and discussing openly how the budget is being used. There are very few clubs where that level of information would be forthcoming.

In someways being open does lead to be a no-win situation as it leads to people over analysing what has been said and coming to the conclusion that we are being fed nothing but lies.

I don't believe this, I do believe that we are an ambitious club and are doing everything that we can to be sustainable by trying to hold onto our players and sign the right new players on long term contracts but ………….. with our fan base and income we are no more than a top 10 club in league 1 realistically. Unless a new benefactor came in and splashed the cash (in a sustainable manner) I think we need to accept this and that it is down to the manager to get a squad together to over achieve and become a top 6 team.

The risk with that is that a manager who can do that will be cherry picked from bigger clubs above.

DM has said he is here for the long term apparently, (2 - 3 seasons?) I hope that's right and that if he does get us in the Champ that he is given the support to keep the team there. 

[vaya]

You've obviously missed the bit where the board are still funding the club an additional £2m a year.

I don’t think any body on this board as missed that the directors and owners of Club Doncaster subsidise the club of 2m a year they are reminded regularly.
Before we signed DM the CEO said we will be going for promotion again. We have been told that we have a budget of 6th to 8th place team. Therefore the club wanted the the supporters to believe they are aiming for the playoffs.
It appears even with last season budget of a similar figure we had to subsidise it by using some of the FA cup money to bring in Downing in January. He was a additional player to cover injury, yet we only had three centre halves at the time and one of those being injured. Yet GM had said he always wanted four but had gone with three initially. It was also said the budget had not been spent last summer and money was there if players were required in January.

This summer some of JM transfer fee was used to get our and loan players over the line. GB as also said DM is still looking for the right player or players on long term contracts and that could happen in January.

So even with the 2m that the owners put in via Club Doncaster the club are still talking about improving the playing staff and aiming for the playoffs. Therefore that amount will have been taking into consideration when the budget was set to achieve aiming for the playoffs by the club. JM transfer fee would have been additional money although only paid in instalments. Having offered JM a contract before he left then that should have been included in this season budget. So even with the owners paying the 2m we were still prepared for John to stay and therefore his wages for this year could be used on his replacement and his fee on top.

Steve, GB stated in the interview 'some' money had been used for Downing. 'Some' by nature is an unquantifiable amount, may have been £200k, may have been £2.00.

Also, as has been pointed out earlier in the thread Downing was signed part-way through the Cup run, before a lot of this income would have hit. Also in previous seasons the club has been able to purchase Whiteman and afford the loan signings of two centre backs (one of who we subsequently signed) part-way through the season. You're effectively arguing despite finishing in the top six, we didn't have a top six budget. I'm not sure you can have it both ways.

As a general point though, budget isn't spend, they're two entirely different things. Also trying to piece together some idea of a budget from a series quotes from interviews, soundbites from managers and other bits and bobs is financially speaking a non-starter.

[vaya]

You've obviously missed the bit where the board are still funding the club an additional £2m a year.

I don’t think any body on this board as missed that the directors and owners of Club Doncaster subsidise the club of 2m a year they are reminded regularly.
Before we signed DM the CEO said we will be going for promotion again. We have been told that we have a budget of 6th to 8th place team. Therefore the club wanted the the supporters to believe they are aiming for the playoffs.
It appears even with last season budget of a similar figure we had to subsidise it by using some of the FA cup money to bring in Downing in January. He was a additional player to cover injury, yet we only had three centre halves at the time and one of those being injured. Yet GM had said he always wanted four but had gone with three initially. It was also said the budget had not been spent last summer and money was there if players were required in January.

This summer some of JM transfer fee was used to get our and loan players over the line. GB as also said DM is still looking for the right player or players on long term contracts and that could happen in January.

So even with the 2m that the owners put in via Club Doncaster the club are still talking about improving the playing staff and aiming for the playoffs. Therefore that amount will have been taking into consideration when the budget was set to achieve aiming for the playoffs by the club. JM transfer fee would have been additional money although only paid in instalments. Having offered JM a contract before he left then that should have been included in this season budget. So even with the owners paying the 2m we were still prepared for John to stay and therefore his wages for this year could be used on his replacement and his fee on top.

Just to add to some of what you have put. the article also says that some of the money from JM has been spent on bringing in the players that DM has this season already. Given that we already have a paper thin squad primarily made up of loans and youngsters and a lot of high earners leaving in the summer it just does not add up to a budget anything like a top 6 - 8.

Everyone is very greatful for the additional money the owners put in and with the CEO being open and discussing openly how the budget is being used. There are very few clubs where that level of information would be forthcoming.

In someways being open does lead to be a no-win situation as it leads to people over analysing what has been said and coming to the conclusion that we are being fed nothing but lies.

I don't believe this, I do believe that we are an ambitious club and are doing everything that we can to be sustainable by trying to hold onto our players and sign the right new players on long term contracts but ………….. with our fan base and income we are no more than a top 10 club in league 1 realistically. Unless a new benefactor came in and splashed the cash (in a sustainable manner) I think we need to accept this and that it is down to the manager to get a squad together to over achieve and become a top 6 team.

The risk with that is that a manager who can do that will be cherry picked from bigger clubs above.

DM has said he is here for the long term apparently, (2 - 3 seasons?) I hope that's right and that if he does get us in the Champ that he is given the support to keep the team there. 

Personally speaking, I wouldn't be going into as much detail as the club has. I'd definitely be a bit reticent about entering into a competitive transfer market having said we've some income remaining from a sale in the summer and risk driving prices up as a result.
Admittedly not my choice to make though.