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Author Topic: Coronavirus  (Read 426010 times)

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River Don

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Re: Coronavirus
« Reply #14100 on October 21, 2021, 07:06:06 pm by River Don »
On 14 September, Patrick Vallance said that his advice was that we should act fast and act hard if cases started rising seriously.

Clearly we are no longer following the scientific advice.

Javid said: “I’m a minister and I’m entitled not to listen to them.” When talking about Sage.

He also said there would be no going back after the last lockdown ended.

So, I think we know what to expect.



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BillyStubbsTears

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Re: Coronavirus
« Reply #14101 on October 21, 2021, 07:28:11 pm by BillyStubbsTears »
If the government had locked down in July when it was last demanded by many to do so, that lockdown would have been considered a success and people would have said that the figures were reduced because of it, and it proved to be the necessary thing to do.

It is only in hindsight that we can now say that not going into lockdown then was the right thing to do.

You BB cannot even see sense with hindsight.

Case numbers dropped only for 11 days in late July. After that, they increased pretty much every day for the next 40 days. We've had 13,000 COVID deaths since late July.

In what world would that be considered a successful lockdown?

Bentley Bullet

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Re: Coronavirus
« Reply #14102 on October 21, 2021, 07:48:50 pm by Bentley Bullet »
What is a successful lockdown?

Bentley Bullet

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Re: Coronavirus
« Reply #14103 on October 21, 2021, 08:30:14 pm by Bentley Bullet »
If the government had locked down in July when it was last demanded by many to do so, that lockdown would have been considered a success and people would have said that the figures were reduced because of it, and it proved to be the necessary thing to do.

It is only in hindsight that we can now say that not going into lockdown then was the right thing to do.

You BB cannot even see sense with hindsight.

Case numbers dropped only for 11 days in late July. After that, they increased pretty much every day for the next 40 days. We've had 13,000 COVID deaths since late July.

In what world would that be considered a successful lockdown?

On the 18th July there were just under 53,000 cases.
On the 28th August (40 days later) there were just over 32,000 cases.

BillyStubbsTears

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Re: Coronavirus
« Reply #14104 on October 21, 2021, 09:40:06 pm by BillyStubbsTears »
Look at how deaths went between those dates.

On 18 July the 7 day average of deaths was 40. On 28 August it was 112. It's been above 100 for every one of the past 62 days.

In what world would that have been a successful lockdown?

Bentley Bullet

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Re: Coronavirus
« Reply #14105 on October 21, 2021, 09:42:20 pm by Bentley Bullet »
 You were talking about cases.

drfchound

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Re: Coronavirus
« Reply #14106 on October 21, 2021, 09:51:31 pm by drfchound »
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/uk-parliament-masks-afghanistan-debate-b1904463.html?amp I'm sure he wears it all the time now to look the part!




About a third of the Tories in that picture are wearing a mask so to say none of them do is bullshit.

Also, do all the Labour MPs wear masks when in Parliament.
« Last Edit: October 21, 2021, 09:55:07 pm by drfchound »

bpoolrover

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Re: Coronavirus
« Reply #14107 on October 21, 2021, 09:53:09 pm by bpoolrover »
Does anyone have the figures for how many were unvaccinated out of choice between them dates please

BillyStubbsTears

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Re: Coronavirus
« Reply #14108 on October 21, 2021, 10:04:44 pm by BillyStubbsTears »
You were talking about cases.

Alright. You're in one of those moods again.

In a properly successful lockdown, cases come down for a long period.

In the winter, in the 40 days after that lockdown, new daily cases came down from 59700 to 11600. In the middle of winter.

You don't half pick some stupid points to defend when you are spoiling for a fight.

Bentley Bullet

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Re: Coronavirus
« Reply #14109 on October 21, 2021, 10:11:14 pm by Bentley Bullet »
Nay lad, it was your stupid (and wrong) point you used to defend your case!


no eyed deer

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Re: Coronavirus
« Reply #14110 on October 21, 2021, 10:33:36 pm by no eyed deer »
If the government had locked down in July when it was last demanded by many to do so, that lockdown would have been considered a success and people would have said that the figures were reduced because of it, and it proved to be the necessary thing to do.

It is only in hindsight that we can now say that not going into lockdown then was the right thing to do.

You BB cannot even see sense with hindsight.

Case numbers dropped only for 11 days in late July. After that, they increased pretty much every day for the next 40 days. We've had 13,000 COVID deaths since late July.

In what world would that be considered a successful lockdown?
You were talking about cases.

Alright. You're in one of those moods again.

In a properly successful lockdown, cases come down for a long period.

In the winter, in the 40 days after that lockdown, new daily cases came down from 59700 to 11600. In the middle of winter.

You don't half pick some stupid points to defend when you are spoiling for a fight.

Not long ago you was talking about how brexit was damaging the economy and now you want another lockdown?





 

Nudga

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Re: Coronavirus
« Reply #14111 on October 21, 2021, 10:54:38 pm by Nudga »
Another right wing, Trump supporting, David Icke, anti mask, granny killing bas**rd.

https://twitter.com/drraghibali/status/1451166919915094022?t=hOO3tUQNwtuLJJrtltTbUg&s=19

River Don

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Re: Coronavirus
« Reply #14112 on October 21, 2021, 11:44:02 pm by River Don »
At this point NED nobody is wanting another lockdown.

The hope is that reintroducing simple restrictions like mask wearing will make any lockdown unnecessary. That the numbers getting sick might fall.

Javid, I suspect is already calculating that hospital admissions will not grow sufficiently to force a lockdown.

In the meantime he doesn't care if thousands become sick, always risking the emergence of new varients. Or God knows how many suffer the debilitating effects of long Covid. Or if a thousand odd die each week. He's just about ensuring business as usual prevails, even if the restrictions proposed will not have any economic impacts.

It's just blinkered libertarian ideology. "We've got to live with it." He's out to make sure we do and he doesn't care about the human cost.
« Last Edit: October 22, 2021, 12:01:16 am by River Don »

BillyStubbsTears

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Re: Coronavirus
« Reply #14113 on October 22, 2021, 12:16:52 am by BillyStubbsTears »
Another right wing, Trump supporting, David Icke, anti mask, granny killing bas**rd.

https://twitter.com/drraghibali/status/1451166919915094022?t=hOO3tUQNwtuLJJrtltTbUg&s=19

Seen the people who Twitter's algorithms suggest to you after reading that tweet Nudga?

Grimes
Hartley-Brewer
Melville
Sikora
Rees-Mogg

Good company you're keeping there.

The thread itself is risible. Half truths dressed up as scientific evidence. Just ridiculous the way some folk peddle the line and some folk swallow it.

BillyStubbsTears

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Re: Coronavirus
« Reply #14114 on October 22, 2021, 12:19:56 am by BillyStubbsTears »
At this point NED nobody is wanting another lockdown.

The hope is that reintroducing simple restrictions like mask wearing will make any lockdown unnecessary. That the numbers getting sick might fall.

Javid, I suspect is already calculating that hospital admissions will not grow sufficiently to force a lockdown.

In the meantime he doesn't care if thousands become sick, always risking the emergence of new varients. Or God knows how many suffer the debilitating effects of long Covid. Or if a thousand odd die each week. He's just about ensuring business as usual prevails, even if the restrictions proposed will not have any economic impacts.

It's just blinkered libertarian ideology. "We've got to live with it." He's out to make sure we do and he doesn't care about the human cost.

Here's the bit people still don't get. The economic damage doesn't come from lockdowns. It comes from letting the virus get out of control so that we can't carry on with things as normal.
Lockdowns come because we let the f**ker get out of control. The longer we leave it out of control, the worse the economic damage ends up being when we finally do have to take action.


River Don

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Re: Coronavirus
« Reply #14115 on October 22, 2021, 12:29:28 am by River Don »
As Javid sees it things are carrying on normally.

I think the only thing that concerns him is whether not the hospitals can cope and he thinks they can. And he's probably right, unless an even more infectious varient emerges.

Unfortunately, all the talk of a strong recovery look well misplaced now, thanks to this energy crunch.

It looks like we're in for a grim winter.


bpoolrover

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Re: Coronavirus
« Reply #14116 on October 22, 2021, 02:09:31 am by bpoolrover »
At this point NED nobody is wanting another lockdown.

The hope is that reintroducing simple restrictions like mask wearing will make any lockdown unnecessary. That the numbers getting sick might fall.

Javid, I suspect is already calculating that hospital admissions will not grow sufficiently to force a lockdown.

In the meantime he doesn't care if thousands become sick, always risking the emergence of new varients. Or God knows how many suffer the debilitating effects of long Covid. Or if a thousand odd die each week. He's just about ensuring business as usual prevails, even if the restrictions proposed will not have any economic impacts.

It's just blinkered libertarian ideology. "We've got to live with it." He's out to make sure we do and he doesn't care about the human cost.
could you explain why simple mask wearing is not working in Wales? Yet you think it will stop lockdown in England?

Nudga

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Re: Coronavirus
« Reply #14117 on October 22, 2021, 04:27:39 am by Nudga »
Another right wing, Trump supporting, David Icke, anti mask, granny killing bas**rd.

https://twitter.com/drraghibali/status/1451166919915094022?t=hOO3tUQNwtuLJJrtltTbUg&s=19

Seen the people who Twitter's algorithms suggest to you after reading that tweet Nudga?

Grimes
Hartley-Brewer
Melville
Sikora
Rees-Mogg

Good company you're keeping there.

The thread itself is risible. Half truths dressed up as scientific evidence. Just ridiculous the way some folk peddle the line and some folk swallow it.


(In your opinion)

I post a link from a Dr who is a Senior Clinical Research Associate at the MRC Epidemiology Unit at the University of Cambridge and the Director and Principal Investigator of the Public Health Research Center and Associate Research Professor at New York University, and that is the best response you've got.

Like I said before, you're a troll. A troll with a vested interest.

« Last Edit: October 22, 2021, 04:41:19 am by Nudga »

Nudga

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Re: Coronavirus
« Reply #14118 on October 22, 2021, 06:51:57 am by Nudga »
Was in A&E last night with my wife, she's had quite a serious injury to her hand.
1 hour to get seen by triage nurse.
1 hour to be seen by Doctor.
45 minutes for xray.
Another hour to be seen by a specialist doctor.
Confusion over pain relief which she didn't get until the 4th hour.

Meanwhile I have to sit there with her watching chav after chav getting seen first for sprained ankles and minor cuts while she's visibly shaking from pain and shock.

The first doctor was a joke. All laughing and joking and roughly taking off a temporary gauze that was holding bits of skin and bone together.
He totally lost his composure when he saw the extent of the injury.
I seriously wanted to belt the Kitson and throw him out into the car park.

Hopefully her surgery today goes a bit smoother.

I think what I'm trying to get across is all this protect the NHS waffle and they can't even prioritise patients properly and efficiently.
Most of those scruffy Kitsons in there should have been sent packing with a paracetamol and a plaster
« Last Edit: October 22, 2021, 06:56:19 am by Nudga »

Axholme Lion

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Re: Coronavirus
« Reply #14119 on October 22, 2021, 08:33:46 am by Axholme Lion »
Was in A&E last night with my wife, she's had quite a serious injury to her hand.
1 hour to get seen by triage nurse.
1 hour to be seen by Doctor.
45 minutes for xray.
Another hour to be seen by a specialist doctor.
Confusion over pain relief which she didn't get until the 4th hour.

Meanwhile I have to sit there with her watching chav after chav getting seen first for sprained ankles and minor cuts while she's visibly shaking from pain and shock.

The first doctor was a joke. All laughing and joking and roughly taking off a temporary gauze that was holding bits of skin and bone together.
He totally lost his composure when he saw the extent of the injury.
I seriously wanted to belt the Kitson and throw him out into the car park.

Hopefully her surgery today goes a bit smoother.

I think what I'm trying to get across is all this protect the NHS waffle and they can't even prioritise patients properly and efficiently.
Most of those scruffy Kitsons in there should have been sent packing with a paracetamol and a plaster

Hope your wife gets well. My dad used to work on the Ambulances and he said most of there time was taken up regulars. Alcoholics and druggies taking up their time while proper ill people have to wait.

KeithMyath

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Re: Coronavirus
« Reply #14120 on October 22, 2021, 08:38:29 am by KeithMyath »
That sounds terrible Nudga, that must be the case for everyone who arrives at A&E. The sooner we privatise the whole NHS the better, let’s make it so those chavs can’t afford to visit a hospital via. Extortionate Health insurance. That way those of us who can afford it can happily be seen 20 mins earlier.

When I lived in Donny, every time I went to A&E I had to wait 3/4 hours to be seen. I assumed that was the norm, limited doctors and nurses out of hours who probably have very sick patients in the hospital to look after as well. My sister worked for a year in A&E said it was the horrific, nobody wants that gig, and the problem won’t have got any better during a pandemic. Which we are still in, even if certain elected officials prefer to think it’s not.

SydneyRover

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Re: Coronavirus
« Reply #14121 on October 22, 2021, 09:06:19 am by SydneyRover »
Sounds awful, I hope your wife has a full recovery Nudga, all the best.

River Don

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Re: Coronavirus
« Reply #14122 on October 22, 2021, 09:12:25 am by River Don »
At this point NED nobody is wanting another lockdown.

The hope is that reintroducing simple restrictions like mask wearing will make any lockdown unnecessary. That the numbers getting sick might fall.

Javid, I suspect is already calculating that hospital admissions will not grow sufficiently to force a lockdown.

In the meantime he doesn't care if thousands become sick, always risking the emergence of new varients. Or God knows how many suffer the debilitating effects of long Covid. Or if a thousand odd die each week. He's just about ensuring business as usual prevails, even if the restrictions proposed will not have any economic impacts.

It's just blinkered libertarian ideology. "We've got to live with it." He's out to make sure we do and he doesn't care about the human cost.
could you explain why simple mask wearing is not working in Wales? Yet you think it will stop lockdown in England?

I don't know what's going on in Wales, they seem to have had a more difficult time of it despite taking a more cautious approach.

In France, continued strictly enforced measures are pushing their Covid rates a lot lower than the UK.

Getting away from the whatabouttery, I don't think there is any serious dispute that widespread mask wearing will slow down the spread of respiratory diseases.

River Don

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Re: Coronavirus
« Reply #14123 on October 22, 2021, 09:16:50 am by River Don »
Nudge,

I'm sorry to read this. These problems at A&E are a longstanding problem. I experienced it before the pandemic when I had to take my Dad in with chronic pain related to cancer, late one Friday.

The place was full of minor cases and the victims of a Friday night on the lash. I could see there were 3 cases, including my Dad who obviously needed more urgent attention. But we were all forced to wait in line for hours.

Filo

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Re: Coronavirus
« Reply #14124 on October 22, 2021, 09:23:11 am by Filo »
That sounds terrible Nudga, that must be the case for everyone who arrives at A&E. The sooner we privatise the whole NHS the better, let’s make it so those chavs can’t afford to visit a hospital via. Extortionate Health insurance. That way those of us who can afford it can happily be seen 20 mins earlier.

When I lived in Donny, every time I went to A&E I had to wait 3/4 hours to be seen. I assumed that was the norm, limited doctors and nurses out of hours who probably have very sick patients in the hospital to look after as well. My sister worked for a year in A&E said it was the horrific, nobody wants that gig, and the problem won’t have got any better during a pandemic. Which we are still in, even if certain elected officials prefer to think it’s not.

So what about those that are n’t chavs, but are on low income and can’t afford private health insurance, where do they fit in, in your grand master plan? Are they expendable because they are poor? Your comments are an insult to everyone on minimum wage and zero hour contracts, typical selfish attitude

Bentley Bullet

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Re: Coronavirus
« Reply #14125 on October 22, 2021, 09:27:47 am by Bentley Bullet »
Me thinks he was being sarcastic.

big fat yorkshire pudding

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Re: Coronavirus
« Reply #14126 on October 22, 2021, 09:27:54 am by big fat yorkshire pudding »
That sounds terrible Nudga, that must be the case for everyone who arrives at A&E. The sooner we privatise the whole NHS the better, let’s make it so those chavs can’t afford to visit a hospital via. Extortionate Health insurance. That way those of us who can afford it can happily be seen 20 mins earlier.

When I lived in Donny, every time I went to A&E I had to wait 3/4 hours to be seen. I assumed that was the norm, limited doctors and nurses out of hours who probably have very sick patients in the hospital to look after as well. My sister worked for a year in A&E said it was the horrific, nobody wants that gig, and the problem won’t have got any better during a pandemic. Which we are still in, even if certain elected officials prefer to think it’s not.

So what about those that are n’t chavs, but are on low income and can’t afford private health insurance, where do they fit in, in your grand master plan? Are they expendable because they are poor? Your comments are an insult to everyone on minimum wage and zero hour contracts, typical selfish attitude

I think Keith was being sarcastic to be fair.

There is a valid question as to why private healthcare can work so well but the NHS cannot.  Perhaps there is merit in an element of private health care being more widely available.  For example we could perhaps mandate businesses of a certain size to provide it for all of their staff?

River Don

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Re: Coronavirus
« Reply #14127 on October 22, 2021, 09:32:34 am by River Don »
Private healthcare doesn't work very well when it comes to A&E.

It's not a service they can easily provide.

KeithMyath

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Re: Coronavirus
« Reply #14128 on October 22, 2021, 10:03:31 am by KeithMyath »
That sounds terrible Nudga, that must be the case for everyone who arrives at A&E. The sooner we privatise the whole NHS the better, let’s make it so those chavs can’t afford to visit a hospital via. Extortionate Health insurance. That way those of us who can afford it can happily be seen 20 mins earlier.

When I lived in Donny, every time I went to A&E I had to wait 3/4 hours to be seen. I assumed that was the norm, limited doctors and nurses out of hours who probably have very sick patients in the hospital to look after as well. My sister worked for a year in A&E said it was the horrific, nobody wants that gig, and the problem won’t have got any better during a pandemic. Which we are still in, even if certain elected officials prefer to think it’s not.

So what about those that are n’t chavs, but are on low income and can’t afford private health insurance, where do they fit in, in your grand master plan? Are they expendable because they are poor? Your comments are an insult to everyone on minimum wage and zero hour contracts, typical selfish attitude

Apologies, my sarcasm was slightly veiled. I’m not a proponent of privatising health care. Anything but, we still have one of the best health care systems in the world, but granted there is always room for improvement, providing adequate funding would be a start I’d guess.

SydneyRover

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Re: Coronavirus
« Reply #14129 on October 22, 2021, 10:07:09 am by SydneyRover »
Private healthcare doesn't work very well when it comes to A&E.

It's not a service they can easily provide.

Yep that's the thing about private healthcare, they want young people to sign up that don't really need it and do the easy stuff. If the NHS had been properly funded for the past 11 years ...................

 

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