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Author Topic: Coronavirus  (Read 586950 times)

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bpoolrover

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Re: Coronavirus
« Reply #13890 on October 12, 2021, 05:26:20 pm by bpoolrover »
There were many differing views on this forum and in the media at the start, there were very few calls to lockdown before March 16th in fact I think only river don was the only one, a lot of the others thought the economic cost of it would result in as bad a loss as the virus might, most followed just like the government did at the start what vallance and witty were saying and let's be fair they couldn't do much else

You are correct bpool - there were many different views and some of us certainly said they could do things very differently. Like tell the truth.

And you think they got the second and third lockdowns right - when they knew exactly how deadly it was? Really?

They were prepared to sacrifice hundreds of thousands of people to their mad herd immunity.

I agree I never understood the herd immunity way but you have to put that down to sage really as the scientists they should have known better, I agree that there were many opinions on how things could be done but so many people including myself changed there tune numerous time there were only 1 or 2 that said the same all the way throughout



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SydneyRover

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Re: Coronavirus
« Reply #13891 on October 12, 2021, 05:28:12 pm by SydneyRover »
And yet the 12th of March the government was warned of the possibility of 250000 deaths.

bpoolrover

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Re: Coronavirus
« Reply #13892 on October 12, 2021, 05:36:47 pm by bpoolrover »
The problem is who is right to believe the guy who got the government to change there mind also said it would be horrendous when we dropped restrictions and has admitted he was wrong on that occasion

bpoolrover

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Re: Coronavirus
« Reply #13893 on October 12, 2021, 05:40:17 pm by bpoolrover »
Good news and bad news in this assessment of the current cases by age group.

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/E_7JAa-VQAQZmpU?format=jpg&name=medium

Clearly there has been a sharp drop in cases in most age groups since the start of September. As such we should probably expect an equally sharp fall in daily deaths over the next fortnight, hopefully down to below 100 per day which is where they have been now for a month. That all ties in with the sharp drop in daily hospitalisations over the last week or two. That is all very welcome news.

Concerning thing is that it looks like cases in schoolkids have rocketed again after the start of term. I heard the other day that 1 in  8 kids are currently off school with COVID. And that graph suggests that, as previously, those cases are now spreading out into a rise in cases among other age groups. So that would imply that hospital cases would likely start rising again around the end of the month, and deaths around mid-October. Question now is how long this increase in cases goes on for. If it carries on through October, and increases with University students going back to college, the hospital cases and deaths are likely to be rising sharply through November, just as we go into the flu season.

Pretty much exactly what has happened.

Daily deaths did drop sharply, from about 140 per day to under 110. But that fall ran out of steam last week and it looks like daily death numbers are rising again.

Which is a concern, because over the past three weeks, case numbers have been consistently rising and are now back around 40,000 new positives per day. And hospital admissions which fell quickly at the end of last month are also starting to rise again. All of which means it looks baked in that the daily deaths are going to be back up around 140-150 per day, and new hospitalisations back up pushing 1000 per day by early November. Just as the flu season gets going.

I get a feeling this is going to be another bloody rough winter for the NHS.
with more and more 12-15 year olds getting jabbed you would also hope that will play a factor and keep numbers from rising as sharply

BillyStubbsTears

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Re: Coronavirus
« Reply #13894 on October 12, 2021, 05:42:08 pm by BillyStubbsTears »
On the 16th of March, the PM said “now is the time for everyone to stop non-essential contact and travel.” So, although it wasn't an official start to lockdown on that date it was a message that strongly advised caution.

And we left schools open.
And Universities
And workplaces.

We were happy to let people carry on getting the bus and the train.

Maybe you think it was people's fault for not figuring out for themselves what "essential" contact and travel was?

SydneyRover

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Re: Coronavirus
« Reply #13895 on October 12, 2021, 05:46:50 pm by SydneyRover »
''It’s also been decided that 12- to 15-year-olds will be offered COVID-19 vaccines as well. This, though, isn’t actually part of the government’s winter plan''

https://theconversation.com/uk-covid-plan-how-will-the-pandemic-play-out-this-winter-167866

SydneyRover

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Re: Coronavirus
« Reply #13896 on October 12, 2021, 05:59:46 pm by SydneyRover »
I wonder why it wasn't part of the winter plan to vaccinate under 16s when the decision was made to open up early to avoid an overload of the hospitals, especially as schools were going back.

It will be good to have a full inquiry with full powers as this inquiry has led to many more questions.

drfchound

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Re: Coronavirus
« Reply #13897 on October 12, 2021, 06:02:46 pm by drfchound »
I’ve lost count of the number of people who said it isn’t necessary to vaccinate kids.

Bentley Bullet

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Re: Coronavirus
« Reply #13898 on October 12, 2021, 06:05:32 pm by Bentley Bullet »
On the 16th of March, the PM said “now is the time for everyone to stop non-essential contact and travel.” So, although it wasn't an official start to lockdown on that date it was a message that strongly advised caution.

And we left schools open.
And Universities
And workplaces.

We were happy to let people carry on getting the bus and the train.

Maybe you think it was people's fault for not figuring out for themselves what "essential" contact and travel was?

Schools, Uni's and Workplaces were essential. Going to the supermarket to panic buy bog rolls wasn't.


SydneyRover

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Re: Coronavirus
« Reply #13899 on October 12, 2021, 06:06:24 pm by SydneyRover »
pubs were open too, I guess that's what you get with a leader that thought it was a popularity contest.

BillyStubbsTears

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Re: Coronavirus
« Reply #13900 on October 12, 2021, 06:18:00 pm by BillyStubbsTears »
On the 16th of March, the PM said “now is the time for everyone to stop non-essential contact and travel.” So, although it wasn't an official start to lockdown on that date it was a message that strongly advised caution.

And we left schools open.
And Universities
And workplaces.

We were happy to let people carry on getting the bus and the train.

Maybe you think it was people's fault for not figuring out for themselves what "essential" contact and travel was?

Schools, Uni's and Workplaces were essential. Going to the supermarket to panic buy bog rolls wasn't.


And what about visiting your mum on Mother's Day? Was that essential?

Only our joker in chief was sniggering his way through a question about that at the daily briefing 4 days later. There was a simple answer when he was asked whether he'd be visiting his Mum. "No, if course I won't. What a ridiculous question. We are in a national emergency and for this year I urge everyone to keep apart especially from elderly people."

That's what a serious politician would have said.

What did Johnson say?

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/boris-johnson-mum-coronavirus-mothers-day-self-isolate-tv-address-today-a9415496.html%3famp

We needed a PM who set an example. Instead we got Johnson. He's there grinning his way through his puerile response instead of leading the nation. And on that very day, about 100,000 people caught the virus with about 1000 of them not seeing the end of April.

BillyStubbsTears

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Re: Coronavirus
« Reply #13901 on October 12, 2021, 06:20:46 pm by BillyStubbsTears »
On the 16th of March, the PM said “now is the time for everyone to stop non-essential contact and travel.” So, although it wasn't an official start to lockdown on that date it was a message that strongly advised caution.

And we left schools open.
And Universities
And workplaces.

We were happy to let people carry on getting the bus and the train.

Maybe you think it was people's fault for not figuring out for themselves what "essential" contact and travel was?

Schools, Uni's and Workplaces were essential. Going to the supermarket to panic buy bog rolls wasn't.



And in any case, you are really missing the whole point.

Schools, Universities and many workplaces were NOT essential. Within 8 days they were all closed down. The point is, why were they not closed down the week before? When decisive, firm action could have saved 20,000 lives and two months and £100bn off the cost of lockdown?

big fat yorkshire pudding

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Re: Coronavirus
« Reply #13902 on October 12, 2021, 08:52:33 pm by big fat yorkshire pudding »
Jonathon Ashworth, shadow health minister asked in the Commons on 11 March 2020, said that some scientists suggested we are not following the epidemiology and placing too much emphasis on behavioural science, therefore when should we move into the so-called delay stage and adopt more stringent social distancing rules. He asked the Health Secretary why UK thinking appears to differ from other European nations. So questions about lockdown were being asked.

Why did his party not implement it in Wales?

See it's easy to push for something when you aren't responsible for it.  Lockdown felt like a disaster. It largely wasn't because the government's did s pretty good job to maintain the economy. It could have been much worse.

I don't see how anyone could have got through it without mistakes.

ravenrover

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Re: Coronavirus
« Reply #13903 on October 12, 2021, 09:29:13 pm by ravenrover »
Did they stop people coming into the country then BB?

BillyStubbsTears

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Re: Coronavirus
« Reply #13904 on October 12, 2021, 09:33:23 pm by BillyStubbsTears »
BFYP
Of course mistakes were going to be made. But that doesn't mean you give those who made them a free pass.

big fat yorkshire pudding

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Re: Coronavirus
« Reply #13905 on October 12, 2021, 09:34:58 pm by big fat yorkshire pudding »
BFYP
Of course mistakes were going to be made. But that doesn't mean you give those who made them a free pass.

So just to confirm, we criticise them all from all parties then?

BillyStubbsTears

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Re: Coronavirus
« Reply #13906 on October 12, 2021, 10:04:59 pm by BillyStubbsTears »
BFYP
Of course mistakes were going to be made. But that doesn't mean you give those who made them a free pass.

So just to confirm, we criticise them all from all parties then?
How was the Welsh Assembly supposed to manage a lockdown in advance of England, when it didn't have the fiscal powers to pay for a furlough scheme?

Bentley Bullet

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Re: Coronavirus
« Reply #13907 on October 12, 2021, 10:31:30 pm by Bentley Bullet »
On the 16th of March, the PM said “now is the time for everyone to stop non-essential contact and travel.” So, although it wasn't an official start to lockdown on that date it was a message that strongly advised caution.

And we left schools open.
And Universities
And workplaces.

We were happy to let people carry on getting the bus and the train.

Maybe you think it was people's fault for not figuring out for themselves what "essential" contact and travel was?

Schools, Uni's and Workplaces were essential. Going to the supermarket to panic buy bog rolls wasn't.


And what about visiting your mum on Mother's Day? Was that essential?

Only our joker in chief was sniggering his way through a question about that at the daily briefing 4 days later. There was a simple answer when he was asked whether he'd be visiting his Mum. "No, if course I won't. What a ridiculous question. We are in a national emergency and for this year I urge everyone to keep apart especially from elderly people."

That's what a serious politician would have said.

What did Johnson say?

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/boris-johnson-mum-coronavirus-mothers-day-self-isolate-tv-address-today-a9415496.html%3famp

We needed a PM who set an example. Instead we got Johnson. He's there grinning his way through his puerile response instead of leading the nation. And on that very day, about 100,000 people caught the virus with about 1000 of them not seeing the end of April.

I blame YOU. Instead of being an expert without responsibility on a third division off-topic football forum, YOU should have taken over the country and used your expertise and foresight to lead us out of the pandemic.

Oh, and by the way, I did manage to visit my mum, in Rose Hill cemetery.

SydneyRover

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Re: Coronavirus
« Reply #13908 on October 12, 2021, 11:00:43 pm by SydneyRover »
Of course this inquiry only covers the first stage of the way the response to covid was handled.

''The failure to prevent tens of thousands of deaths during Britain’s brutal second wave of Covid infections was a more serious error than the timing of the first lockdown, senior scientists have told the Guardian''

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2021/oct/12/the-real-problem-is-the-repetition-of-mistakes-scientists-react-to-covid-enquiry


bpoolrover

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Re: Coronavirus
« Reply #13909 on October 12, 2021, 11:30:44 pm by bpoolrover »
I wonder why it wasn't part of the winter plan to vaccinate under 16s when the decision was made to open up early to avoid an overload of the hospitals, especially as schools were going back.

It will be good to have a full inquiry with full powers as this inquiry has led to many more questions.

the government needed the jcvi to give there thoughts before making any such decision

SydneyRover

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Re: Coronavirus
« Reply #13910 on October 12, 2021, 11:36:24 pm by SydneyRover »
I wonder why it wasn't part of the winter plan to vaccinate under 16s when the decision was made to open up early to avoid an overload of the hospitals, especially as schools were going back.

It will be good to have a full inquiry with full powers as this inquiry has led to many more questions.

the government needed the jcvi to give there thoughts before making any such decision

And they couldn't ask them because ........................

BillyStubbsTears

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Re: Coronavirus
« Reply #13911 on October 13, 2021, 12:26:29 am by BillyStubbsTears »
Genuinely sorry to hear about your mother BB. I've no problem with anyone visiting cemeteries when they were open.

Many of us have had to deal with personal issues during this crisis. I couldn't visit my mum when she was in hospital last year after a heart attack. It's been a bloody hard 18 months. And a lot more people have lost loved ones than should have done.

bpoolrover

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Re: Coronavirus
« Reply #13912 on October 13, 2021, 12:47:02 am by bpoolrover »
I wonder why it wasn't part of the winter plan to vaccinate under 16s when the decision was made to open up early to avoid an overload of the hospitals, especially as schools were going back.

It will be good to have a full inquiry with full powers as this inquiry has led to many more questions.

the government needed the jcvi to give there thoughts before making any such decision

And they couldn't ask them because ........................
thought you were going to stop being a knob that lasted long

BillyStubbsTears

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Re: Coronavirus
« Reply #13913 on October 13, 2021, 01:40:53 am by BillyStubbsTears »
It's a perfectly fair question BP.

JCVI's brief was only to consider the effect on vaccination of under 16s on under 16s themselves.

We still don't know why there was no consideration throughout the Summer on the effect there would be on the whole population.
« Last Edit: October 13, 2021, 01:52:02 am by BillyStubbsTears »

SydneyRover

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Re: Coronavirus
« Reply #13914 on October 13, 2021, 01:43:04 am by SydneyRover »
I wonder why it wasn't part of the winter plan to vaccinate under 16s when the decision was made to open up early to avoid an overload of the hospitals, especially as schools were going back.

It will be good to have a full inquiry with full powers as this inquiry has led to many more questions.

the government needed the jcvi to give there thoughts before making any such decision

And they couldn't ask them because ........................
thought you were going to stop being a knob that lasted long

serious question, look who's questioning a bipartisan report headed by the government with dumbass replies oh we don't know that my aunt fanny couldn't have done better, you're a self admitted WUM bp, true?

SydneyRover

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Re: Coronavirus
« Reply #13915 on October 13, 2021, 02:44:07 am by SydneyRover »
I wonder why it wasn't part of the winter plan to vaccinate under 16s when the decision was made to open up early to avoid an overload of the hospitals, especially as schools were going back.

It will be good to have a full inquiry with full powers as this inquiry has led to many more questions.

the government needed the jcvi to give there thoughts before making any such decision

And they couldn't ask them because ........................
thought you were going to stop being a knob that lasted long

I suppose this reply was because you didn't predict the most obvious of questions. You are a difficult person to understand bp, you live in an area which due to the policies of the government has delivered to you, a male the lowest life expectancy in the country and by their incompetence put your partner at serious risk of injury or death and yet you continue with your craven support. Do you ever think that you may have made a mistake giving them this blind support?

big fat yorkshire pudding

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Re: Coronavirus
« Reply #13916 on October 13, 2021, 12:28:54 pm by big fat yorkshire pudding »
BFYP
Of course mistakes were going to be made. But that doesn't mean you give those who made them a free pass.

So just to confirm, we criticise them all from all parties then?
How was the Welsh Assembly supposed to manage a lockdown in advance of England, when it didn't have the fiscal powers to pay for a furlough scheme?

It's not just that though is it?  Did they publicly call for it?  As I recall most parties were fairly well joined up most of the time on the polices enacted.  Indeed Ed Milliband said this morning all parts of politics should apologise not just one.

Hounslowrover

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Re: Coronavirus
« Reply #13917 on October 13, 2021, 01:05:17 pm by Hounslowrover »
In March 2020, Corbyn  was still the leader of the opposition, probably explains your query BFYP.  Starmer became leader in April.

big fat yorkshire pudding

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Re: Coronavirus
« Reply #13918 on October 13, 2021, 04:31:02 pm by big fat yorkshire pudding »
In March 2020, Corbyn  was still the leader of the opposition, probably explains your query BFYP.  Starmer became leader in April.

Nothing to do with Starmer to be fair. I've no idea what he said about it.

bpoolrover

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Re: Coronavirus
« Reply #13919 on October 13, 2021, 05:40:31 pm by bpoolrover »
I wonder why it wasn't part of the winter plan to vaccinate under 16s when the decision was made to open up early to avoid an overload of the hospitals, especially as schools were going back.

It will be good to have a full inquiry with full powers as this inquiry has led to many more questions.

the government needed the jcvi to give there thoughts before making any such decision

And they couldn't ask them because ........................
thought you were going to stop being a knob that lasted long

I suppose this reply was because you didn't predict the most obvious of questions. You are a difficult person to understand bp, you live in an area which due to the policies of the government has delivered to you, a male the lowest life expectancy in the country and by their incompetence put your partner at serious risk of injury or death and yet you continue with your craven support. Do you ever think that you may have made a mistake giving them this blind support?
the poorest areas in Blackpool are normally held by Labour and have been going downhill for many years hence why they gave there vote for the tories but don't let that stop you posting rubbish

 

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