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Author Topic: Coronavirus  (Read 538963 times)

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ColinDouglasHandshake

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Re: Coronavirus
« Reply #14520 on November 26, 2021, 07:53:13 pm by ColinDouglasHandshake »
It is best for you to follow the precautionary principle but not for many others who simply do not wish to, and this should be respected.

This has been a major factor all the way through. The Government forcing people to do what they don't want to do, do not agree with and that often makes no logical sense to them. You can't force people to do what you want them to do. It is called freedom.

I see Chris Whitty has at last developed some awareness of how the public are thinking. He claims that many people won't go along with any further 'muscular' interventions for any new variants. How right he is.

I would actually just love to see another lockdown or mask mandate just to marvel at how many people have regained their faculties from nearly 2 years of incessant propaganda. IMO.

« Last Edit: November 26, 2021, 07:58:59 pm by ColinDouglasHandshake »



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River Don

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Re: Coronavirus
« Reply #14521 on November 26, 2021, 07:58:40 pm by River Don »
Alternatively it might be more transmissible and more deadly.

In which case lockdowns would be unavoidable, based on Dominic Cummings previous analysis.

ColinDouglasHandshake

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Re: Coronavirus
« Reply #14522 on November 26, 2021, 08:12:59 pm by ColinDouglasHandshake »
Many people won't adhere to anymore lockdowns IMO. No doubt more bullying tactics and threats by the Tories will be to come in order to try and get the refuseniks to comply if another lockdown was ordered.

Which won't make any difference. Lots of people have had enough and they won't be frightened of relentless scare stories about how the virus is more deadlier. Until it becomes like Ebola, i'm free from all restrictions.

It is all a bit like the boy who cried wolf with these scientists and 'experts'.

If Covid became like Ebola then i'd never leave my house. It isn't. It is like flu.
« Last Edit: November 26, 2021, 08:17:28 pm by ColinDouglasHandshake »

River Don

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Re: Coronavirus
« Reply #14523 on November 26, 2021, 08:16:05 pm by River Don »
If the health service were to become overwhelmed and people could not access health care, then 'free thinkers' would soon find themselves dealing with the police.

ColinDouglasHandshake

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Re: Coronavirus
« Reply #14524 on November 26, 2021, 08:18:41 pm by ColinDouglasHandshake »
If the health service were to become overwhelmed and people could not access health care, then 'free thinkers' would soon find themselves dealing with the police.

So we turn into a dictatorship then and punish people for demanding what is rightfully theirs, their freedom, just because our health service is f**king useless? Nice.

Not sure where the police would put everyone. Given prison space is at a premium as it is. I could literally go out tonight and ransack some poor old dears house and be at home the next day with a caution. Not that i would do this of course but you get the idea.

Our justice system is an embarrassment. Get fined and don't pay the fine. Nothing they can do if everyone does it.
« Last Edit: November 26, 2021, 08:21:36 pm by ColinDouglasHandshake »

River Don

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Re: Coronavirus
« Reply #14525 on November 26, 2021, 08:21:52 pm by River Don »
If the health service were to become overwhelmed and people could not access health care, then 'free thinkers' would soon find themselves dealing with the police.

So we turn into a dictatorship then and punish people for demanding what is rightfully theirs, their freedom, just because our health service is f**king useless? Nice.

However you want to paint it. If the public did not cooperate then yes, I could forsee curfews.

I don't think it would come to that.

Hopefully nothing like this will ever come to fruition.

ColinDouglasHandshake

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Re: Coronavirus
« Reply #14526 on November 26, 2021, 08:24:35 pm by ColinDouglasHandshake »
If the health service were to become overwhelmed and people could not access health care, then 'free thinkers' would soon find themselves dealing with the police.

So we turn into a dictatorship then and punish people for demanding what is rightfully theirs, their freedom, just because our health service is f**king useless? Nice.

However you want to paint it. If the public did not cooperate then yes, I could forsee curfews.

I don't think it would come to that.

Hopefully nothing like this will ever come to fruition.

I can certainly concur with you on that.

Credit to you River Don. I find you remarkably calm and tolerant in response to some of my barbed and hostile opinions and i appreciate that.

River Don

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Re: Coronavirus
« Reply #14527 on November 26, 2021, 08:28:16 pm by River Don »
I don't want an argument for arguments sake CDH

Genuinely, I'd like it if I could help you see that getting a booster jab might not be a bad idea.

wilts rover

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Re: Coronavirus
« Reply #14528 on November 26, 2021, 08:28:57 pm by wilts rover »
Stupid is as stupid does. It's not flu

BillyStubbsTears

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Re: Coronavirus
« Reply #14529 on November 26, 2021, 09:17:13 pm by BillyStubbsTears »
Stupid is as stupid does. It's not flu

Some context.

If you plotted out our weekly deaths per million people, twice (April 2020, March 2021) they would have topped out at over 100. The rises then stopped because we had lockdowns.

In the one place in the world where they didn't have any mitigation of a COVID outbreak, in Bergamo in March/April 2020, their spike topped out at about 1500.

That's not a misprint.

1500.

Look at that graph again. Increase the Vertical axis by a factor of 40. Then the Bergamo death toll would just fit on.

"Just like flu". f**k me...
« Last Edit: November 26, 2021, 09:21:10 pm by BillyStubbsTears »

ColinDouglasHandshake

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Re: Coronavirus
« Reply #14530 on November 26, 2021, 09:21:42 pm by ColinDouglasHandshake »
I don't want an argument for arguments sake CDH

Genuinely, I'd like it if I could help you see that getting a booster jab might not be a bad idea.

Yes thanks RD. I have a longstanding distrust of the medical profession and pharma going back well before Covid for various personal reasons and personal experience of my own illnesses so that does cloud my judgement somewhat and this may come back to haunt me. However, i have taken towards a more holistic approach to addressing mental and physical health concerns, one reason being that all western medicine wants to do is push medicines on you and not actually get to the root cause of problems. Doctors literally just order tests, refer to hospitals and dish out medications. They barely listen anymore and this creates distrust. I don't feel that i am a patient anymore, merely a number. A statistic.

I also have asperger's syndrome which is a form of autism, and a problem with this is extreme caution about taking any new medications. Even an anti biotic being prescribed would often see me not take it, therefore you can see the anxiety around taking a hastily distributed vaccine for a new virus.

There has been nobody to discuss vaccine concerns with. Nobody is interested. They just want you to book, get down the vaccine centre, roll your sleeves up and get jabbed. Again, just treated like a procedure. Like cattle. Lots of questions and reassurance needed but none given. Creating even more resistance.

For my first jab, it was done at a local theatre and it was literally like a cattle market. Queue of people, sit down in front of the queue of people to be jabbed. No privacy which is not good when anxiety kicks in. I just found the whole process of getting a vaccine dehumanising and i won't go through that again.

Then came the news soon after my jab that the AZ was being stopped for the under 40's due to the blood clot link. You can imagine what that felt like to deal with for someone with an anxiety disorder. I literally could not function for about a month actually tuning in for signs that i could have a blood clot. Truly awful experience and i decided then not to have any more jabs as i simply cannot deal with the worry and there is nobody to talk to about it. The NHS don't give a shit. All they want you to do is get the jab.

In addition, there is the Government endlessly badgering to get the jab and to 'do the right thing' and all this lot. It literally nearly caused me a breakdown. I am the type of person resistant to authority, whether that be in employment or whatever and the worst way to get me to comply is by force and blackmail. Again, i find the Government, who are so adept at social and psychological nudging and manipulation have managed to overlook this most basic of facts. That many people become averse to doing what they are told because they keep on being told what they should be doing. Nobody in the Government seems to have worked this out yet and that vaccine hesitancy is in fact being caused by the way in which they have approached the whole roll out in terms of how they deal with and communicate with people.

I cannot have a booster as i am not fully vaccinated. I had AZ back in March and refused the second so i only have 1 jab and that is the way i will stay. I will rather take my chances with the virus but believe me, it is not all down to me the reason why i won't have any more jabs. There is literally no support or empathy for people who are just simply really really anxious about the uncertainty of the vaccine and all they hear is that they are anti vaxxers and they need to get jabbed otherwise they won't be able to go on holiday, the pub etc etc. It has all been truly abhorrent IMO the way in which vulnerable people genuinely worried about the vaccine have been thrown in with the anti vaxx mob as selfish and stupid. Again, just creates more resistance to having the vaccine.

So i'm a lost cause. I will never have any more vaccines for Covid. Even if that means i have to stay at home forever and be denied medical treatment. If life comes to that then i'd rather be dead anyway. But it is not always down to people being ignorant and selfish as to why they don't want the vaccine. Maybe the NHS and Government who are pushing it need to start taking a long look at how they interact and engage with people before condemning them?

BillyStubbsTears

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Re: Coronavirus
« Reply #14531 on November 26, 2021, 09:25:42 pm by BillyStubbsTears »
CDH.
I have a close family member with Asperger's. You have my deep sympathy. And I apologise for the blunter comments I've made in response to your posts.

I still think you are profoundly wrong and potentially dangerous in your opinions. But I can see the context of where they come from.

ColinDouglasHandshake

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Re: Coronavirus
« Reply #14532 on November 26, 2021, 09:41:35 pm by ColinDouglasHandshake »
CDH.
I have a close family member with Asperger's. You have my deep sympathy. And I apologise for the blunter comments I've made in response to your posts.

I still think you are profoundly wrong and potentially dangerous in your opinions. But I can see the context of where they come from.

Hi Billy. Sympathy isn't needed but appreciated all the same. My Asperger's isn't an illness, it is a difference in thinking and a difference in the way i view and respond to the world around me but i know what you mean. I am fortunate in the sense that i have managed to mask my difficulties from people throughout life to fit in and adhere to all the social norms expected of me, but this has come at a cost to my health. It is very tiring and draining having to think about every single interaction with someone but as i've gotten older i've become less bothered about that but on the flipside have become less tolerant of others and more defiant i guess.

With Covid for example, you will know that autistic people have an almost driven requirement for certainty, structure, routine and consistency, and what the response to Covid has been by the Government has been anything but. This has caused untold distress and so the easiest way to keep on a straight course and sanity is by following one rule in the face of rules that keep on changing. My rule would be, refuse everything. As long as i refused all Covid measures then it was consistent and allowed me to keep some stability in my emotions and my life. Again, there is no help and support out there for people with Asperger's Syndrome. We were just expected to deal with it.

I am lucky in the fact that i have a neurotypical partner and we have a 12 year old daughter who also is neurotypical and they keep my feet on the ground but the black and white dichotomous thinking patterns are just so entrenched with people with Asperger's and this causes frequent extremes of views and behaviours, as i am sure you are aware.

Like me saying on the Joey Barton thread that i hope he dies and he is a piece of shit if he is found guilty of knocking his wife about. I stand by that. It is an example of what most would consider an extreme view but for someone like myself with Asperger's, physical violence against women is unforgiveable and i judge the person capable of such a cowardly and vicious act to be not worthy of life. Again, it is an extreme view. I accept that but it is what i think and therefore i am being true to what i think by saying that. It is the blunt and often brutal honesty that you will often get with people with Asperger's. It often gets us into trouble too as people simply don't understand the context of where we are coming from. As you have very eloquently put it Billy.

Low frustration tolerance can soon build and the only response is to be volatile, hostile and difficult as a way of exercising some control over emotional regulation. A kind of 'meltdown' if you like. Anyway, it's all good fun and there is very little i can do about it but work on changing my viewpoints, which isn't easy as they are maladaptive schema and also a difference in neurology, both of which are barriers to living a life with balance.

I admire your passion for the way in which you think Billy, despite it being the polar opposite of my views.
« Last Edit: November 26, 2021, 09:57:36 pm by ColinDouglasHandshake »

River Don

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Re: Coronavirus
« Reply #14533 on November 26, 2021, 10:03:13 pm by River Don »
CDH,

Mental health problems. You are not alone, there is a lot of it about, my Mum was so overtaken with grief when my Dad died she tried to do something very silly. I know a fella who is autistic, to be honest he's not a bloke I like but his condition explains some of his actions. I could go on but I won't.

In all honesty every vacinnation I have had for Covid has involved long queues and I hate jabs. Everytime I felt like walking out.

Is there anyone who could go with you?

My other thought is, my Mum has mobility problems and is registered as such, she was visited In her home by a vaccination team. I wonder if you spoke to a GP about your issues, if something similar couldn't be arranged for you?

Edit. This is on the NHS website. I'm sure help is available to you if you persist or get someone else to sort it for you.

If you have contact with a mental health team, they will be able to support you if needed: when attending appointments or talking to your mental health team, feel free to ask questions about the vaccination and how to access it.

When you book your vaccination, you should let the member of staff know if you need any reasonable adjustments to ensure you can attend your appointment. This could be:

a longer appointment time or one later in the day;
somewhere quiet to sit while you wait for your appointment;
support/ additional reassurance if you are afraid of needles;
asking if a carer/friend/ your peer support worker could accompany you to your vaccination appointment;
a home visit if you are housebound and not able to travel to a place that is providing vaccinations or;
a BSL sign-language service.

I'm sure there is a way around your problem.
« Last Edit: November 26, 2021, 10:42:03 pm by River Don »

Nudga

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Re: Coronavirus
« Reply #14534 on November 26, 2021, 11:27:53 pm by Nudga »
BREAKING NEWS

Belgium, has in the last hr confirmed it’s first case of b 1.1.529.
A traveller that has come in from Egypt.
It is coming people.

The traveller returned on 11 nov. First symptoms 22 nov.
So he won’t be the only one with it.


Pfizer./bio tech have announced it will be two weeks before they have fully assessed if current vaccines are any good against b1.1.529.

South Africa has less than 30% of the population vaccinated. The lady in Belgium identified with it is unvacinated.

So far it's looking like it's spreading quickly through the unvacinated. Fingers crossed the vacinnes will still offer a reasonable level of protection against it.

I'm sorry, I can't stand by and let misinformation muddy this forum.


https://twitter.com/BWGovernment/status/1463874240130785280?t=9s3pDBJws6db8BlAvc1hZQ&s=19

SydneyRover

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Re: Coronavirus
« Reply #14535 on November 26, 2021, 11:37:47 pm by SydneyRover »
And for the record:

''The Technical Advisory Group on SARS-CoV-2 Virus Evolution (TAG-VE) is an independent group of experts that periodically monitors and evaluates the evolution of SARS-CoV-2 and assesses if specific mutations and combinations of mutations alter the behaviour of the virus. The TAG-VE was convened on 26 November 2021 to assess the SARS-CoV-2 variant: B.1.1.529.

The B.1.1.529 variant was first reported to WHO from South Africa on 24 November 2021. The epidemiological situation in South Africa has been characterized by three distinct peaks in reported cases, the latest of which was predominantly the Delta variant. In recent weeks, infections have increased steeply, coinciding with the detection of B.1.1.529 variant. The first known confirmed B.1.1.529 infection was from a specimen collected on 9 November 2021.

https://www.who.int/news/item/26-11-2021-classification-of-omicron-(b.1.1.529)-sars-cov-2-variant-of-concern

BillyStubbsTears

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Re: Coronavirus
« Reply #14536 on November 26, 2021, 11:44:48 pm by BillyStubbsTears »
You might not have been paying much attention these past 20 months Nudga, while you've been gobbling up b*llocks across Twitter, then moving onto the next b*llocks when the old b*llocks turned out to be b*llocks.

But here's the thing.

All the waves start off with small numbers. It's the rate those numbers grow at that you need to keep your eye on.

If you start off with 4 cases and they double every week, you've got 30,000 after two months and 8 million after 4 months.

Been played out now for nearly 2 years, wave after wave. And every time a new wave starts, the deniers say, "But, but, but...small numbers!"

And they never seem to learn.

Nudga

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Re: Coronavirus
« Reply #14537 on November 26, 2021, 11:49:15 pm by Nudga »
What b*llocks is that then? You moved on pretty f**kin sharpish when I've posted about the ons f**kin about and the NHS Kitson lying.

And the tin foil hatters called this exact scenario months ago.

Now run along and queue for your 15th poison injection.

wilts rover

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Re: Coronavirus
« Reply #14538 on November 27, 2021, 09:06:55 am by wilts rover »
Sorry to read of your problems ColinDH. No-one wants restrictions or to have vaccines, but thats the situation we are in across the world to keep vulnerable people safe and health services functioning.

It will go eventually, all these things do, hopefully we can get as many people as possible through it.

All the best to you and your family.

wilts rover

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Re: Coronavirus
« Reply #14539 on November 27, 2021, 09:11:12 am by wilts rover »
What b*llocks is that then? You moved on pretty f**kin sharpish when I've posted about the ons f**kin about and the NHS Kitson lying.

And the tin foil hatters called this exact scenario months ago.

Now run along and queue for your 15th poison injection.


So to did the WHO and the people who said we should aim for zero covid, keep rates down and send vaccines to poorer countries rather than hording them. No-one is safe until everyone is safe.

The more covid there is across the world - the more chance of a new variant appearing. You dont need to be a genius to work that out.

ColinDouglasHandshake

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Re: Coronavirus
« Reply #14540 on November 27, 2021, 09:18:37 am by ColinDouglasHandshake »
CDH,

Mental health problems. You are not alone, there is a lot of it about, my Mum was so overtaken with grief when my Dad died she tried to do something very silly. I know a fella who is autistic, to be honest he's not a bloke I like but his condition explains some of his actions. I could go on but I won't.

In all honesty every vacinnation I have had for Covid has involved long queues and I hate jabs. Everytime I felt like walking out.

Is there anyone who could go with you?

My other thought is, my Mum has mobility problems and is registered as such, she was visited In her home by a vaccination team. I wonder if you spoke to a GP about your issues, if something similar couldn't be arranged for you?

Edit. This is on the NHS website. I'm sure help is available to you if you persist or get someone else to sort it for you.

If you have contact with a mental health team, they will be able to support you if needed: when attending appointments or talking to your mental health team, feel free to ask questions about the vaccination and how to access it.

When you book your vaccination, you should let the member of staff know if you need any reasonable adjustments to ensure you can attend your appointment. This could be:

a longer appointment time or one later in the day;
somewhere quiet to sit while you wait for your appointment;
support/ additional reassurance if you are afraid of needles;
asking if a carer/friend/ your peer support worker could accompany you to your vaccination appointment;
a home visit if you are housebound and not able to travel to a place that is providing vaccinations or;
a BSL sign-language service.

I'm sure there is a way around your problem.

Thanks for the advice RD.

I already have a reasonable adjustments protocol in place when accessing medical appointments but sadly most of the time these adjustments are not met and the staff involved have no idea about them. This is the basis of 2 letters of claim i have with seperate NHS hospitals and is a bit of crusade of mine.

First of all i had to find out for myself that i was entitled to reasonable adjustments as nobody within the health service, including GP's ever thinks to tell you. Then i had to fight with my GP to actually get the adjustments letter formulated and signed off. Then the practice manager at my surgery promised me that the practice would send a copy of the adjustments letter along with every future referral to other medical providers which they have not done on two occasions. They also do not provide me with the reasonable adjustments at my own GP surgery! Despite the fact that we had agreed and that the practice manager signed off! I also have a letter of claim in against my GP practice for failure to provide the reasonable adjustments required by law under the Equality Act 2010.

My practice manager, when challenged just apologizes and promises it won't happen again yet it keeps happening and therefore my patience has run out and so i will commence litigation if needed. I cannot trust someone who continually promises something and then fails to deliver it.

It is that bad now that every time i need to have a hospital appointment for example, because i cannot rely on, or trust my GP surgery to send the letter of reasonable adjustments to the hospital department along with the referral as promised, i do it myself. I send a copy to the hospital department by recorded delivery and then i ask for email confirmation that they have received it. I did this last month when i had to visit an eye hospital in the North West and when i arrived, they did not give me the adjustments i had asked for and they had no knowledge of it, despite me having email confirmation that they had recieved it and would put them into place for me!

Again, a letter of claim has also gone into them for failing to provide the reasonable adjustments asked for.

The way that people with hidden disabilities and mental illness are treated by the health service is disgusting and it needs to change right now. Every time a service provider does not provide me with the adjustments i have asked for, and i have proof that they received the letter, then i will issue a pre action letter reminding them of their duties and legal obligations.

Hopefully this might focus their minds and make them realize that they have a legal duty to adhere to these adjustments.

Again. All this hassle and lack of support and lack of willingness to adhere to what is essentially the law just creates more resentment and bitterness towards the NHS and GP's. As i have said before, often this attitude is borne from a result of persistent poor and negative experiences and this is certainly what i have experienced within the NHS as a person with hidden disabilities. If i was in a wheelchair or had a leg missing, i'd be helped.

So the more the NHS tell me to get jabbed, the more i just tell them to f**k off. It is all they seem bothered about these days. I won't be getting any more jabs regardless.

Oh and my community mental health team also have a letter of claim against them. They have refused treatment twice now and the reasons given are not clever. I have evidence that they are failing and i intend to show that proof in a court of law.

Thanks anyway RD and enjoy the game today if you are going.
« Last Edit: November 27, 2021, 09:26:43 am by ColinDouglasHandshake »

River Don

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Re: Coronavirus
« Reply #14541 on November 27, 2021, 09:51:16 am by River Don »
I'm sorry to read this CDH, it appears you are having to take an awful lot on just to get the service you need. It must be particularly difficult to keep chasing this up when you have doubts about it in the first place.

My first thought is you need some support, someone to sort this out for you. Where you might find that support, I don't know. Is there someone you know who could take this up on your behalf?

Otherwise what about a charity like Mind? Could it be worth contacting them?

https://www.doncastermind.org.uk


ColinDouglasHandshake

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Re: Coronavirus
« Reply #14542 on November 27, 2021, 10:15:50 am by ColinDouglasHandshake »
I'm sorry to read this CDH, it appears you are having to take an awful lot on just to get the service you need. It must be particularly difficult to keep chasing this up when you have doubts about it in the first place.

My first thought is you need some support, someone to sort this out for you. Where you might find that support, I don't know. Is there someone you know who could take this up on your behalf?

Otherwise what about a charity like Mind? Could it be worth contacting them?

https://www.doncastermind.org.uk

Hey thanks RD. Your concern and help is appreciated.

I know that MIND have an advocacy service where they can provide someone to help when dealing with NHS issues / complaints but i have never used them. I usually sort things out myself but of course, this does add to the burden of stress. I am quite stubborn though and have spent so many years fighting against the systemic failures within organizations that pose a barrier to progress, and will continue to do so.

Believe me, there is no help or support other than the Samaritans. In a way this hardens resolve and makes me even more determined to fight for what i believe is right, but it does help foster anger, resentment and cynicism when it comes to the NHS.

I moved away from Donny in 2000 but there are MIND centres nearer to me. In fact, the provision for people where i live for mental health isn't the worst but is generally provided by charities, not the NHS - which says it all really. The issues are that they generally only offer basic courses run by IAPT and the like such as CBT (Cognitive Behavioural Therapy) and for someone with my specific mental health requirements, the CBT approach simply is not effective. More in depth, specific support has to be delivered through the CMHT (Community Mental Health Team) and they refuse to help.

I am asking my GP for a referral to another CMHT from out of my area next week as under the NHS Constitution, a patient in England is entitled to be referred to any NHS provider in the country and therefore i may get accepted at a CMHT in a different area. If that fails then i will just keep asking my GP for referrals to various CMHT across the country until i get accepted at one. Again, a battle full of stress just to try and access help but that is the way of it currently. The risks the NHS are posing to already vulnerable people suffering from various mental health conditions simply by the lack of provision or the way in which they engage and communicate (or lack of generally) with people already struggling is actually a national scandal. However, it isn't Black Lives Matter so nobody seems interested.

I am fortunate as i am able to find the resilience to keep going and fighting for change, but many tragically just give up and that has catastrophic consequences.

I'll get sorted in the end RD. Just got to keep plodding along and i realise that there are many folk out there struggling at the moment, not just myself and it important to just keep going and don't do anything daft, because one day things might change for you. Even if you cannot see it right now. It does, it can and it will. One foot in front of the other.

River Don

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Re: Coronavirus
« Reply #14543 on November 27, 2021, 10:23:47 am by River Don »
CDH your last paragraph is right, just take it one thing at a time.

You are obviously knowledgeable about the services available to you, obviously you've been contending with this a longtime.

If you haven't tried MIND then perhaps now is the time time to try. From all you've written here it seems to me an advocacy service is just what you need. I'd encourage you to try that.

Good luck with it all mate.

ColinDouglasHandshake

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Re: Coronavirus
« Reply #14544 on November 27, 2021, 10:31:33 am by ColinDouglasHandshake »
CDH your last paragraph is right, just take it one thing at a time.

You are obviously knowledgeable about the services available to you, obviously you've been contending with this a longtime.

If you haven't tried MIND then perhaps now is the time time to try. From all you've written here it seems to me an advocacy service is just what you need. I'd encourage you to try that.

Good luck with it all mate.

Cheers RD. Have a good day man.  :scarf:

BillyStubbsTears

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Re: Coronavirus
« Reply #14545 on November 27, 2021, 11:02:50 am by BillyStubbsTears »
Piece on the radio this morning about 2 flights from Johannesburg and Cape Town to Schiphol yesterday. 600 passengers. All of them given PCR tests on arrival. 85 positive.

14% positive test ratio. In people coming from a country where last week the daily number of positive tests in the whole country was under 1000.

Filo

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Re: Coronavirus
« Reply #14546 on November 27, 2021, 11:15:39 am by Filo »
Piece on the radio this morning about 2 flights from Johannesburg and Cape Town to Schiphol yesterday. 600 passengers. All of them given PCR tests on arrival. 85 positive.

14% positive test ratio. In people coming from a country where last week the daily number of positive tests in the whole country was under 1000.

And all the other passengers and crew have been in an air tight cabin with recycled air with them, most will be infected now

tommy toes

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Re: Coronavirus
« Reply #14547 on November 27, 2021, 11:16:15 am by tommy toes »
With regard to Mental Health services.
Some of you may recall I worked as a mental health nurse for nigh on 30 years and am proud of some of the help I gave to people, especially as a CPN when freed from the constraints of working in a hospital.

I also have 34 year old son  (a life long Rovers fan who you may have seen, home and away, he's 6'7' you can't miss him)
Since he was 15 he's suffered from paranoid schizophrenia.

For a long time he's been reasonably well but in Dec 19 he decided to stop taking his medication and since then it's been a f***ing nightmare.

In September he was back in hospital on a Section 3 for treatment. He was admitted before he became really ill and we expected he would be treated before he became more unwell, which would have happened 20 years ago, whether the patient felt he needed it or not.

But he wasn't.

They pussyfooted around until he became completely psychotic, hallucinated and violent.

He was allowed to become dirty, smelly and unkempt.
We asked the staff to get him in the shower, help him clean his teeth etc but we're told they couldn't force people to do these things.
Ridiculous, there are ways and means.

Eventually, about two weeks ago, after we kicked up a right stink, they began to treat him more appropriately and he's picking up a bit.

My point is that due to human rights
and the current climate around these issues, including litigation, things seem to have slipped regarding what can be done and when.

Yet Section 3 of the MHA should override these concerns, but apparently not.
I suppose I'm posting this to maybe partly explain/support the issues that CDH so eloquently portrays

tommy toes

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Re: Coronavirus
« Reply #14548 on November 27, 2021, 11:39:07 am by tommy toes »
Just an addendum to partly explain the problems with services.
When I was a CPN I could see 5 or 6 patients a day, no problem. Nip back to the office, write a few notes, with a pen and, when they were discharged send a letter to the GP.
Now due to the amount of paperwork, computer work, back covering and safeguarding, they're lucky if they get to see 2 a day.

ColinDouglasHandshake

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  • Posts: 2353
Re: Coronavirus
« Reply #14549 on November 27, 2021, 12:09:05 pm by ColinDouglasHandshake »
Thanks for your contribution Tommy. It was very interesting, yet sad reading and i hope things are improving for you and your lad.

I also have Borderline Personality Disorder and fortunately i have been lucky in the sense that i have been able to keep myself out of hospital and crisis care which has been no mean feat.

Many mental health teams in my experience do not have the staff resources nor in many cases, the staff experience in dealing with patients with significant impairments in functioning or conditions that are extremely challenging, as both PS and BPD have the potential to become.

In addition, patients presenting with persistent and pervasive challenging conditions take longer to treat, longer to recover and thus use up more resources - and even then there is no guarantee of recovery.

Therefore i have found in my experience that the CMHT's that i have been involved with actively refuse referrals for treatment and do not wish to get involved with patients such as myself because of this but what i find despicable is that they then try and deflect and turn things around and put the onus on the patient and effectively blame them for the reason why they aren't recovering.

I can't remember which poster it was on another thread, he was a lecturer in mental health or something IIRC but he was highlighting the fact that some people with conditions like Borderline do end up blaming the NHS and mental health teams for their illness when in fact if we began looking inward and working on things ourselves then we would help purselves a lot more instead of constantly moaning about the NHS. Which i do take on board and i accept that with one of my conditions (BPD) we do generally look to have a go at others and overlook that there are some problems that we need to work harder on ourselves.

However, with that point in my case, the treatments for BPD in particular according to the NHS and NICE are extensive psychotherapy to last no shorter than a year. Dialectical Behavioural Therapy and also Mentalisation Based Therapy.

My legal argument with my local CMHT highlights that these are the recommended treatments for someone with my condition and yet they offer CBT for 8 weeks duration. When this doesn't work, they refer you to a different service and you get offered CBT with 8 weeks duration.

Then when the treatment doesn't work, they turn the blame onto the patient and claim it is the patients reluctance and inability to change that is the reason and thus this makes it easier to refuse treatment for more intensive forms of therapy when the patient inevitably requests it.

It is like going to A&E with a broken leg and being sent home with painkillers and then 6 months later when your leg has set incorrectly and you can't walk properly, they blame you and it is your fault.

If they give you the treatment that is recommended and specific for the individual condition and it STILL doesn't work, THEN they have a right to turn round and lay the blame on the individual for being resistant to treatment, but offering simple mental health treatments such as CBT over and over again for complex conditions will not work and is not recommended by the NHS but they do this on a regular basis!

It honestly is a shit show.

If the NHS give me DBT for a year, which is the recommended treatment for one of my conditions - and it doesn't work. Then i accept that and i can do no more. But they don't. They give you a basic course of therapy not suited to the condition you have and then blame you for it not working.

It would be laughable if it wasn't actually killing people.

I'm not saying that all NHS mental health staff are rubbish. Obviously this is not true and there are some really committed and dedicated people out there simply wanting to do the best for people but they are hamstrung by the system.

On the flipside, there are some real chancers and sociopaths working within mental health teams, usually management and senior clinical psychiatrists, and these people need bringing to book. This is my goal.


 

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